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View Full Version : [4e] Standard Action = Minor+Move Action but Minor+Move Action =I Standard Action ?



Siegel
2008-12-27, 05:45 AM
I can substitute my stadard action for example a additional Move action and a minor action or thre minor actions.

Why can't i loose my move and minor action of the turn to get 2 standard actions ?

Kiero
2008-12-27, 05:56 AM
In SWSE that's a full-round action, basically. And you have to have a means of taking advantage of that (like Double/Triple attack, or a second weapon).

Tsotha-lanti
2008-12-27, 06:01 AM
Because multiple standard actions gets unbalanced real fast. Why do you think extra actions are the one thing 3.X spellcasters wanted? They're still powerful in 4E.

It also discourages the awful, stupid, uninteresting "stand still and lay down the smack" style of combat that ruled 3.X.

GoodbyeSoberDay
2008-12-27, 06:01 AM
You can substitute a standard action for a move action or a minor action, but that doesn't really answer your question. You can't substitute your move action and minor action because that would be wonky and overpowered.

Tsotha-lanti
2008-12-27, 06:15 AM
For instance, you could charge (move + basic attack), then use a melee attack power. Rather than move and then use a melee attack power.

Yep, that got unbalanced real fast.

KKL
2008-12-27, 06:20 AM
Because static damage bonuses get silly when factoring in multiple attacks.

RebelRogue
2008-12-27, 06:27 AM
It's a basic principle in 4e: you can substitute "lesser" actions, never "higher". If you want two standard actions, that's what action points are for.

jcsw
2008-12-27, 06:41 AM
I can substitute my stadard action for example a additional Move action and a minor action or thre minor actions.

Why can't i loose my move and minor action of the turn to get 2 standard actions ?

It's not exactly z=y+x, it's z>y+x.

You can trade more for less but not less for more. Similarly, you can expend the effort of moving and doing something simple in place of doing something like swinging a sword, but you can't swing a sword with the same effort of doing something simple and moving.

Kurald Galain
2008-12-27, 06:44 AM
Why can't i loose my move and minor action of the turn to get 2 standard actions ?
Because it makes ranged characters (who don't generally have to move), much, much better.

Siegel
2008-12-27, 07:50 AM
It's not exactly z=y+x, it's z>y+x.

You can trade more for less but not less for more. Similarly, you can expend the effort of moving and doing something simple in place of doing something like swinging a sword, but you can't swing a sword with the same effort of doing something simple and moving.

Ok thanks, that explains everything thankyou.

Mando Knight
2008-12-27, 11:00 AM
I can substitute my stadard action for example a additional Move action and a minor action or thre minor actions.

What? No, you can't... the trade down is one-to-one, a standard action for a move or a minor, or a move action for a minor. Where are you getting the two for one deal?

Flickerdart
2008-12-27, 11:08 AM
Because it makes ranged characters (who don't generally have to move), much, much better.
Precisely. For example, if you could trade in Move and Minor for a Standard, a 1st level Ranger could make 4 attacks per round with Twin Strike. There's obviously something wrong here.

Reinforcements
2008-12-27, 11:33 AM
What? No, you can't... the trade down is one-to-one, a standard action for a move or a minor, or a move action for a minor. Where are you getting the two for one deal?
I was gonna say...

Inyssius Tor
2008-12-27, 01:41 PM
I can substitute my stadard action for example a additional Move action and a minor action or thre minor actions.

Yeah, as people have said upthread, this is wrong. You start out with a standard, a move, and a minor. You can trade:

a standard action:
for a move action,
or a minor action;

a move action:
for a minor action;

or a minor action:
for nothing.

That's all you can do.

Mark Hall
2008-12-28, 10:22 PM
I can substitute my stadard action for example a additional Move action and a minor action or thre minor actions.

Why can't i loose my move and minor action of the turn to get 2 standard actions ?

Because, IIRC, you can't switch your standard for a move+minor. You can switch it for a move or a minor. You can thus take two moves and a minor, or a move and two minors in a round.

Blackfang108
2008-12-29, 09:39 AM
For instance, you could charge (move + basic attack), then use a melee attack power. Rather than move and then use a melee attack power.


You'd have to reverse the order.

A charge ENDS your turn immediately after, unless you spend an action point.