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Dragonath
2009-01-03, 02:34 PM
Many people have been complaining about the last 2 comics.

I wonder what these people wanted to see in these 2 comics. Please write it out here what you we're hoping/thinking what was going to happen in these 2latest comics and why it should've been done so.

Also, what should happen in the next 2 comics to prevent another "twist of crazy events" as some describe it.

Discuss !

MickJay
2009-01-03, 02:49 PM
Wanda gets the pliers, attunes, kills off whole coalition, Charlie, gets the dish for Parson, then Maggie makes Stanley designate Hamster as his heir, then Stanley is killed and uncroaked, Parson attunes to both hammer and dish, conquers the world in 3 turns and wakes up in hospital realising it was all a dream.

I'm seriously disappointed it's not happening this way :smallfrown:

Kreistor
2009-01-03, 09:29 PM
The complaint stems from his written rules. Klogs. I'm nor complaining about how things finished, but how they don't seem to match up to his rules.

Airspace cannot attack Courtyard. Only Outer Walls or another Garrison zone can attack courtyard. Ansom is flying. Either he is in Airspace or Outer Walls. To move from Outer Walls to Courtyard, he needs to WIN Outer Walls, and that fight is long from over. He can't move from Airspace to Courtyard. So he is violating either the concepts of gaming, or the rules of the City.

Let's compare what happened to Stanley at the pass. Stanley beats the Caesar stack. He then must face reinforcements, namely Jillian's stack. Further, Stanley couldn't even proceed to Faq despite being veiled... some force made him turn around defeated.

Ansom is on the ground and facing zombies. He gets his carpet. He now BYPASSES all stacks in the zone, and moves to attack Courtyard, as well as pick up an item that is in Courtyard. I don't think Ansom killed 2800 zombies in that short time. So when Ansom turns around, he now needs to fight out of a zone he doesn't own, namely Courtyard, into another zone he doesn't own, namely Outer Walls.

(Another odd thing... where are the other GK units? No attack was possible on Tower, since Charlie's turn was over and all RCC air is in the mountains. There's not tunnels to defend against, so not in the dungeons. They should ALL be in Courtyard guarding against a breach. And yet, Wanda falls on empty terrain. Actually, with Ansom's actions, having units in Courtyard to defend against a breach is now absolutely vital! If Ansom doesn't need to wipe out Outer Walls to penetrate to Courtyard, neither does the rest of the seige. With the Seige gathering at that one spot, the obvious place to put reinforcements is RIGHT THERE at the most probable pentration point.

If Stanley played by Ansom's rules, he should have been allowed to bypass all stacks in the hex because he won a single fight, and move from there to Faq without facing Jillian. He has similar advantages to Ansom's flight with his veil. So here we have one unit allowed to bypas enemy forces to penetrate to hexes he doesn't own, but another with even more reason to do so not permitted.

We have a contradiction. Different characters playing by different rules, and it isn't making a whit of sense.

What should have happened? That depends on where any mistake was made. (Obviously, if no mistake was made, then nothing different should have happened.) If Stanley should have been allowed to pass, then Stanley should be through to Faq. If Ansom shouldn't have been allowed into Courtyard, then the entire conversation with Wanda shouldn't have happened and Parson gets the Pliers. Whatever.

Godskook
2009-01-03, 10:37 PM
Airspace cannot attack Courtyard.

Where is this said? I don't remember it being said in the Klog.

DevilDan
2009-01-03, 10:44 PM
And yet, somehow, I suspect that we'll find out that the rules allow Ansom's moves and the rest of the action we've seen.

Could this be the results of finagling and fine-tuning as the writer goes along? Sure. But I actually tend to believe the writer's claims that this was all written in compliance with a set of rules already in place.

I guess that, at the end of the day, I'm more interested in story than in mechanics anyway.

MickJay
2009-01-03, 11:13 PM
But you're forgetting one thing: computer always cheats ;)

But silliness aside, there is just too much discrepancy between rules/what is strongly suggested in klogs/exposition strips and the action sequences. Almost every plot turn works like this: readers are given some information; plot advances; there is a sudden change in the whole situation which seemed very unlikely and went against most expectations; readers are given (or not) an off-hand explanation about why the sudden change makes perfect sense; the plot advances.

It might be quite frustrating, a bit like learning to play a game, with your teacher telling you about specific rules that would be useful to know for your strategy only after you've made your move.

Or like reading a detective story which gives you mostly false or irrelevant clues and in the grand exposition the detective brings up some crucial piece of evidence that was never mentioned before.

I really enjoyed this comic for the first hundred strips or so, but stuff like this has been happening too often recently; I still like Erfworlf, and I think the main storyline is interesting enough without the need to resort to dubious storytelling tricks. If the authors are reading the forums they might be working on the assumption that going against readers' expectations is going to make the story more interesting, but that does not always work well, especially if the surprising elements don't make much sense from the perspective of previous events.

SteveMB
2009-01-04, 01:54 AM
Ansom is on the ground and facing zombies. He gets his carpet. He now BYPASSES all stacks in the zone, and moves to attack Courtyard, as well as pick up an item that is in Courtyard.

The Courtyard is the area inside the square inner walls (the "garrison walls" (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/erf0109.html) that an enemy must breach in order to attack the Garrison after taking the Outer Walls). None of the action in the last few pages has been anywhere near it.

TamLin
2009-01-04, 02:10 AM
This is a great example of why writers of this sort of stuff would be well-advised not to publically codify the rules. Notice how Rich Burlew refuses to tell us in no uncertain terms what level all of the OoTS characters are?

TigerHunter
2009-01-04, 02:58 AM
The complaint stems from his written rules. Klogs. I'm nor complaining about how things finished, but how they don't seem to match up to his rules.

Airspace cannot attack Courtyard. Only Outer Walls or another Garrison zone can attack courtyard. Ansom is flying. Either he is in Airspace or Outer Walls. To move from Outer Walls to Courtyard, he needs to WIN Outer Walls, and that fight is long from over. He can't move from Airspace to Courtyard. So he is violating either the concepts of gaming, or the rules of the City.
They're not in the courtyard, they're in the area between the Outer Walls and the Garrison walls. The last sentence in Garrison's entry (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/erf0109.html) implies that said area is part of Outer Walls. Ansom can pass between the two zones freely as long as he has the Move to do so.


Let's compare what happened to Stanley at the pass. Stanley beats the Caesar stack. He then must face reinforcements, namely Jillian's stack. Further, Stanley couldn't even proceed to Faq despite being veiled... some force made him turn around defeated.

Ansom is on the ground and facing zombies. He gets his carpet. He now BYPASSES all stacks in the zone, and moves to attack Courtyard, as well as pick up an item that is in Courtyard. I don't think Ansom killed 2800 zombies in that short time. So when Ansom turns around, he now needs to fight out of a zone he doesn't own, namely Courtyard, into another zone he doesn't own, namely Outer Walls

*snip*

If Stanley played by Ansom's rules, he should have been allowed to bypass all stacks in the hex because he won a single fight, and move from there to Faq without facing Jillian. He has similar advantages to Ansom's flight with his veil. So here we have one unit allowed to bypas enemy forces to penetrate to hexes he doesn't own, but another with even more reason to do so not permitted.

Apples to oranges. Stanley and Jillian were both in the air, while Ansom is a flying unit facing a horde of ground units who don't appear to have ranged attacks. The game rules, presumably, do not force air units to defeat enemy ground units in order to pass through a zone, because that would make no sense at all.



I'm not seeing any contradiction, unless you assume the addition of rules that would make absolutely no sense and we have no indication exist.

Capt'n Ironbrow
2009-01-04, 09:05 AM
remember, if we play a boardgame, our chits/pieces do not speak, swing their weapons or walk about in the hexes we put them in... what we see is the "effect of dice rolls" and the private interaction of the chits/pieces which each other. If it was all game, there wouldn't be a story. in addition, any combatscene we witness as readers takes place in a single hex.

but still, I'm also a bit dissapointed with Ansom's plot-shield. he had the time to scroll down and skim* the the text of a new alliance agremeent, agree, have the Archon blast Wanda's aircav in a time-span that was too short for the GK units to reach and finish him and/or grab the pliers.
what should have happened in my opinion is: His cry for help was just a bit late, he got incapacitated and Wanda grabbed the pliers.

of course, GK just can't get a break...




* I doubt he read it thorougly, he new the first draft and just frantically scrolled down to "i accept" to save his boop. he was however, looking at the contract, so he might have skimmed the contents and found one or two outrageous new onditions here and there, probaly right at the bottom.

MickJay
2009-01-04, 09:37 AM
This is a great example of why writers of this sort of stuff would be well-advised not to publically codify the rules. Notice how Rich Burlew refuses to tell us in no uncertain terms what level all of the OoTS characters are?

Erf is supposed to be grounded in specific rules much more strongly than OOTS; in OOTS, minor rules may change for the sake of plot or joke, but the whole idea behind Erf is based on existence of a very specific and detailed setting. You can tell a fantasy story without ever touching any DnD rules, but you can't have Erf without the underlying TBS rules. You can get away with explaining some things after they happened by informing readers of HOW exactly and WHY they happened, but a good storyteller will sneak in a few information prior to the events so that when they finally come to pass there will be a *click* of understanding in readers' minds, not a "huh?" and confusion.

To sum up my rant: Erf needs more klogs :smalltongue:

quindraco
2009-01-04, 11:47 AM
This is a great example of why writers of this sort of stuff would be well-advised not to publically codify the rules. Notice how Rich Burlew refuses to tell us in no uncertain terms what level all of the OoTS characters are?

I disagree; OoTS is studded with jokes which are only funny if you understand the very publically codified DnD rules, which OoTS regularly lampoons. Understanding the rules isn't totally vital to following the comic, but you'll get a LOT more out of it if you understand them. Furthermore, there's a DnD rule allowing the DM to override any in-game rule, so OoTS isn't being inconsistent when it violates DnD rules; "the DM did it" is always inherently consistent.

I think Erfworld would be tremendously improved with a public rules system in the same fashion, and that's one reason I like the Klogs. I realise it's unreasonable to ask the authors to come up with the entire system when all they want to do is tell a story, and I understand that if we're told more about the rules than Parson is it changes the dynamic of the story, but a man can dream!

Capt'n Ironbrow
2009-01-04, 12:21 PM
From a game rules point of view, the "erfworld game" seems simple. there are not a lot of different stats for units, movement is hex based, there are basic rules for leadership (bonus to underlings, choose target/level of aggressiveness), force organisation and terrain. The advanced rules add magic, psychology and siege battles.

Would it be possible that the simple tactical/strategic laws of nature just decide the conditions within a certain hex and the physique and psychology of an erfworld creature. The way all these interact with each other within the hex is far more complex than the grand-tactical rulesset can show a gamer who sees all erfworlders as chits or pieces. With Erfworld, the gamer becomes a reader and now sees how a rulesset would work if it were actual laws of nature (much like order of the stick)... and in this case, it's quite weird because the rulesset is rather basic, it's not much more than the bare necessities for a grand-tactical fantasy board wargame. In addition, we as readers, are still a bit in the blue about how all the rules work exactly. in Order of the Stick, we know that everyone strikes in initiative order, Erfworld doesn't have that stat so combat might very well be simultaneous/ a real-time affair, with defender and attacker both taking actions to oppose each other... in a real-life wargame, the players would be comparing stat values and rolling a dice or two, here we see the creatures perform what would have been die rolls and what would take place in-between... It's the very cool theme of this website, isn't it?

we dive beneath the wargame/rpg laws of nature, the abstract view of a boardgame and see how the "game rules of nature" affect the inhabitants of the universe. In Order of the Stick, an expansive, complex and popular, well-known rulessystem. In erfworld, a simple wargame that the reader does not know and the universe's inhabitants regard as laws of nature... The reader is as much an outsider as the protagonist. Parson has not "through-the-looking-glassed" (Alice in Wonderland), but "gone to Narnia". actually, Erfworld is GitP's chronicles of Narnia to it's Lord of the Rings: Order of the Stick.

Radar
2009-01-04, 04:11 PM
In regard of Ansom's move i would like to remind you all of this (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/erf0068.html). It is possible to punch through a hex without winning a fight (Stanlay wanted to do it too - it was the Foolamancer, who steered him toward GK).

As for lack of troops in the courtyard, i can't say why it is empty.

edit: and there is the case of Wanda not being fast enough to reach pliers in the first place...

Simanos
2009-01-05, 07:11 AM
Where is this said? I don't remember it being said in the Klog.
Will you stop posting the same nonsense in every thread?
The Airspace borders the Tower, the Tunnels border the Dungeon, the Outer Walls border the Courtyard. How much more specific do you want?
Your argument is hurting the cause. The correct argument is that the area where Wanda fell was the inner part of the Outer Walls zone. The Courtyard is the little space inside the smaller square walls (near the tower). Many people missed that, including me.
If you don't believe me why did the Author respond to the people saying Ansom couldn't pick up the Arkenpliers from the Courtyard by saying it wasn't the Courtyard. Why didn't he say Ansom can move to the Courtyard (is allowed by the rules) instead? Clearly you are wrong and you would do well do admit it and get over it.


This is a great example of why writers of this sort of stuff would be well-advised not to publically codify the rules. Notice how Rich Burlew refuses to tell us in no uncertain terms what level all of the OoTS characters are?
Not at all. In fact a lot more rules (and stats) from OotS are known to us than from Erf, because it's based on a known system. Sure he has house rules, but Erf is nearly all house rules. Why do I even bother saying nearly, it's all house rules. Also notice that OotS has a lot of discussion on rule-breaking too. Did you miss stuff like flanking and AoO threads?
Rich can house-rule anything to make a story work as he wants, but so can Erf writers. After Rich has house-ruled something he can't take it back, same with Erf...
I think the problem with Erf lies elsewhere.


... while Ansom is a flying unit facing a horde of ground units who don't appear to have ranged attacks.
Yes, they do. Notice the arrows sticking in his carpet.


(Another odd thing... where are the other GK units? No attack was possible on Tower, since Charlie's turn was over and all RCC air is in the mountains. There's not tunnels to defend against, so not in the dungeons. They should ALL be in Courtyard guarding against a breach. And yet, Wanda falls on empty terrain. Actually, with Ansom's actions, having units in Courtyard to defend against a breach is now absolutely vital! If Ansom doesn't need to wipe out Outer Walls to penetrate to Courtyard, neither does the rest of the seige. With the Seige gathering at that one spot, the obvious place to put reinforcements is RIGHT THERE at the most probable pentration point.
(Replace Courtyard with inner part of Outer Walls)
That's it. All the other objections (reading contract, Wanda not reaching pliers, etc) can be explained with turn based mechanics. Game is paused. Wanda run out of combat move for the current combat turn (I'm assuming combat is turn based too). Though it's kinda weird that you can make an alliance in the middle of combat (no game I know of does that).
But.
Why was the inner part of the Outer Walls so empty? That particular part behind the breach should be already defended. Sizemore should be there fixing damage on the wall. Troops should be defending him (the sacrificial undead man the Wall to make breaching harder, I think that's Parson abusing some rule there). If a breach happens they can push the enemy back long enough for Sizemore to seal it.
Of course maybe this is all not possible in the TBS Wargame Erf. Still it makes sense in most people's mind's which is why most people wanted Ansom back on the Wall with his carpet and a sword and the Arkenpliers in Sizemore/Wanda's hands down there. Ansom is lucky to even be allowed that since the writers decided Wanda could freeze the Ansom wielded Arkenpliers (maybe she's attuned). He could have stayed knocked out after being hit off his mount and falling hard on the ground and eaten by zombies. But what fun would that be?
Anyway if Ansom's tactic to go up alone seemed suicidal to most of the RCC warlords even at the start, then after all these setbacks (he lost hitpoints and time) he'd better have some trouble in the next strip trying to keep the breach going and keeping the undead horde at bay to let the siege units work relatively unmolested.

SeraphRainy
2009-01-05, 04:14 PM
Everything in the comic has been explained by the rules presented. The author has been clever about this if very blunt with clogs.

Stanley could not punch through a contested hex because he was engaged by other fast units, imagine cavalry being the air units. Similar fast units may counter the selective engagement rules with there own speed.

Ansome was passing over ground units that could not contest his movement in the same hex when he went down to wanda.

A good reason why the zone is empty is that the majority of gks actual unit force was utilized in the tunnels. They have to be at least partialy wounded or scrapped up. And with charlie threatening and they undead holding the wall it makes perfect sense for parson to leave his wounded in the tunnel or dungeons so that they can heal for next turn without providing a target of opportunity for any open attack like what happened to the stacks of wounded dwagons. (And the reason why the courtyard and inner wall area arent nessesarily packed yet is because move is free between those points and most likely parson wouldnt want to make his stand their anyways especialy not with used or wounded units. He wants to fall back to dungeons and hold it there like a chokepoint.)

Now even in realtime ansome had time to do what he did. The WAF was restacking, he had cleared quite a wide birth from the zombies and he knew most of the contract already. He scrolls down skims and hits accept. (Also he is royalty half of a royals job is reading/signing paperwork.) Meanwhile wanda is descending and we saw her diving the long way down to the pliers, but wait she doesnt want to go kersplat on the stones. So she had to have started slowing down to land at some point. Now we saw that the archons had saturaited the entire airspace with their presence and that their specialty is providing just in time combat solutions. So it is reasonable that they shot wanda down before she landed.

Ok next you should consider what erf is. You all (who are complaining) seem to think of erf in terms of tbs games like comp games with clearly defined and unbreakable rules. But remember erfworld is in part based (or suggested that it came a good deal from) Parsons home brew game that he was working on. And it was an in person rp style boardgame. So even if your to dain bamaded to understand/accept the reasons above explaining what happened then the age old rule of "The dm did it" still applies here.

But here is the kicker yall. Your making nitpicks at the rules that dont even exist. And your doing it because your caught up in the story. You think its been unfair for stanley and wanda and parson. This is in part because it has been a ittle but also because you like them better/can sympathise with them.

Don't get me wrong here I want to see Wanda croak Ansome, because I like wanda better, heck Ill admit it, I like parson, dont like charlie, I dislike jillian, and I like ansome but only because I think he is a true villan and will go down in the end when exposed. (Because thats just clever storiness.) But I don't blame the rules or look for an out just because my fav character got pwnd.

Parsons dwagon plan got doomed by jillians true feelings, stanley got stopped by sheer force, and Wanda was just barely denied revenge because of charlie. But I dont think that charlie is overpowered just cause his units are placed effectivly to influence the story, and I dont think Ansome time cheated just because he knew that there was only one way out and took it fast enough.

So stop lovin on your favorite character and sit back till the almighty authors give out the just deserts.

Letifer
2009-01-05, 04:58 PM
The thing I can't reconcile with the rules is how he got his carpet back. If he is on the wall and the angels are in the airspace, you should not be able to transfer anything between zones without using a move. Otherwise, you could have a single unit in a string of hexes and transport unlimited supplies in a single turn without using any movements.

Does this mean Ansom can jump from the wall into airspace?

I think he should have had to fight his way through the zombies to get off the wall.

DevilDan
2009-01-05, 05:36 PM
The thing I can't reconcile with the rules is how he got his carpet back. If he is on the wall and the angels are in the airspace, you should not be able to transfer anything between zones without using a move. Otherwise, you could have a single unit in a string of hexes and transport unlimited supplies in a single turn without using any movements.

The fact that the archons could interact with the carpet suggests that the carpet ended up in the airspace.

And "no move" doesn't mean "instantaneous."

Hatu
2009-01-05, 06:51 PM
The fact that the archons could interact with the carpet suggests that the carpet ended up in the airspace.

And "no move" doesn't mean "instantaneous."

It seems to be pretty fast: otherwise, wouldn't the zillions of Zombies have overwhelmed and killed Ansom before he got his carpet back?

-H

DevilDan
2009-01-05, 07:21 PM
It seems to be pretty fast: otherwise, wouldn't the zillions of Zombies have overwhelmed and killed Ansom before he got his carpet back?

-H

We don't know the speed of the cheapest uncroaked. The time it took Ansom to read the changes in the contract and accept could have been measure in seconds, in addition.

Letifer
2009-01-05, 07:23 PM
The fact that the archons could interact with the carpet suggests that the carpet ended up in the airspace.

I agree, the carpet ended up in airspace. But how did they give it back to Ansom, who is not in airspace?

DevilDan
2009-01-05, 07:40 PM
I agree, the carpet ended up in airspace. But how did they give it back to Ansom, who is not in airspace?

They could just give it a push, I suppose.

We don't know the characteristics of a magic item that is motile, so perhaps they just slipped it into "drive" and aimed it at him?

Scylfing
2009-01-05, 08:55 PM
So stop lovin on your favorite character and sit back till the almighty authors give out the just deserts.

This is a really good point, I agree with it, but you have to admit it's hard to set aside who we're rooting for especially when things keep going against them. I particularly wish Stanley didn't have to save the day now--though I suppose it's fitting for the pointy-haired boss to claim all the credit--but that looks like the only way out of this mess for GK.

Oh well, now that I've had a chance to step back and re-examine the last couple comics I'm going to take back my previous complaints about the pacing. Charlie's now been set up as the major villain so if this is what it took for that to happen that's fine, it's been foreshadowed long enough and this is the kind of situation where it would happen (and I'm glad it did, he's basically the incarnate of the cheating computer/GM, which is exactly what Parson needs as a primary antagonist).

And on the plus side for our protagonist, both Ansom and Jillian look like fools to their respective sides, and maybe some of the allies will revolt upon hearing what Charlie gets out of the deal (he has to have demanded the 'pliers and Parson+his gear, otherwise he wouldn't have made the deal since he'd get the same thing by staying neutral, just at greater cost). Since the deal cuts them out of such spoils when they've been with the coalition against Stanley from the outset, and it was only made because of Ansom's recklessness, who had previously made a big deal about his fitness to command them, maybe this will be a net gain for the fat man after all.

Kreistor
2009-01-05, 09:26 PM
We know that notes can move hex to hex while not on turn, so the carpet could be treated just like that.

Which does beg the question: can arrows cross a hex border? They are pobjects, and can be fired from one hex towards another.

DevilDan
2009-01-05, 10:04 PM
We know that notes can move hex to hex while not on turn, so the carpet could be treated just like that.

Which does beg the question: can arrows cross a hex border? They are pobjects, and can be fired from one hex towards another.

The author said that he had already figured all this out ahead of time but decided not to reveal some of those details even when providing extraordinary explanations of some rules in the forum.

Could catapults toss bows and arrows into GK's airspace and could the archons use them to rain holy hell onto GK's walls? Unknown.

SeraphRainy
2009-01-06, 03:02 AM
You are absolutly right scyf it is hard to watch but that is tension. And for me that will make it all the sweeter when wanda bashes ansome over the head with his own pliers, takes his girlfriend and rides off into the sunset. (Or smoking remains of GK.)

Parson was looking for a gamlike solution anyways now he HAS to find one so dont count solely on stanley just yet. Also i actualy paint in my mind Ansome as the true villan because he seems to try so hard to be the good guy. (Thats were most villans go wrong, like thinking their doing a service riding the world of superman, the justice league or the vicious fuzzy quala bears, because, "THEY KNOW BETTER THAN ANYONE ELSE AND ARE MORE FIT TO DECIDE!!!" See what I mean:smallwink:)

WHile charlie is in a good position for now it is because he was smart not neccesarily cheating. But Im sure Charlie will get his too if not for being a villan at least for playing dirty pool.

Well we dont know that arrows and projectiles cant and that could be another exploit that people havnt thought of because they have lived with the rules of erfworld for so long. But we do know that sight is limited between hexes and that wold be a serious hinderance to an archer popping off another unit in another hex. Also hexes are pretty big. GK is onw hex itself and an archer firing from the side of one hex into the middle ish of another is a loooong waaaays to shoot. ALso it would be considered engaging a unit to fire upon it or at least taking your hitsies. But erf units have some restriction against engaging outside their hex. Just like parson and evreyone else is still moving during the night but cant MOVE. As for catapults they havnt shown any but it could be true that a catapult siege unit has some natrual magic or ability allowing it to "bombard" the next hex, we dont know but I assume that it would be so if catapults were invented.

Simanos
2009-01-06, 07:38 AM
A good reason why the zone is empty is that the majority of gks actual unit force was utilized in the tunnels. They have to be at least partialy wounded or scrapped up. And with charlie threatening and they undead holding the wall it makes perfect sense for parson to leave his wounded in the tunnel or dungeons so that they can heal for next turn without providing a target of opportunity for any open attack like what happened to the stacks of wounded dwagons. (And the reason why the courtyard and inner wall area arent nessesarily packed yet is because move is free between those points and most likely parson wouldnt want to make his stand their anyways especialy not with used or wounded units. He wants to fall back to dungeons and hold it there like a chokepoint.)
The heal idea is nice, but I doubt all the units are wounded. I'm not saying to flood the area behind the outer walls with units. I'm saying to keep a few fully healed (like the Golems and some ranged units) and Sizemore (they can escape to the tunnels with pass-earth if needed) exactly where the breach is going to happen. Move is free, but as we saw it still takes (combat) time.

Godskook
2009-01-06, 05:59 PM
Will you stop posting the same nonsense in every thread?
The Airspace borders the Tower, the Tunnels border the Dungeon, the Outer Walls border the Courtyard. How much more specific do you want?

Please join me in the thread I made for this:)