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View Full Version : Dawn of War II: Beta is out now!



Myatar_Panwar
2009-01-21, 01:20 AM
Ouch

http://thqinc.cachefly.net/dow2/screenshots/enlarged_view/0020_carnifex_sync_01.jpg?height=600&width=800


The beta is out now, and never playing the first one, I decided I'd give it a shot. To get into the beta you need to buy Soul Storm. This is only 7.99 on steam right now. Preordering the game will also get you in (thank you Ranis). Beta becomes assessable to everyone next week., Relic must have lowered the price because they knew it would make them OMG amounts of money with the beta so close. If you already have SS, download the beta already!

I was one of the guys supporting relics theory.

Never played the previous DoW, and having very little experience with RTS', I played for a few hours tonight, and had so much fun despite my suck.

For everyone on the fence, just think about that 8 bucks as a pre-order cost. :smallwink:

The beta comes with all four races and 5 multiplayer maps, no single player except for bot matches.

Discuss!

Revanmal
2009-01-21, 01:50 AM
Y'know, I really do love Dawn of War... but not enough to buy that crappy expansion just to get a Beta. I'll keep my $7.99, thank you very much.


BTW, is that a Tyranid? Or just some big bug monster? I really want mah 'Nid fix, man! >.O

Ganurath
2009-01-21, 02:04 AM
It's a Tyranid. Carnifex, if I'm not mistaken.

I've already had Soulstorm for a while now. How do I actually get the Beta?

Myatar_Panwar
2009-01-21, 02:18 AM
It's a Tyranid. Carnifex, if I'm not mistaken.

I've already had Soulstorm for a while now. How do I actually get the Beta?

I'm not sure how you do it for those who have owned SS for awhile, but when I bought it today, "DoW 2: Beta" appeared in My Games under Not Installed (all on steam of course). If you don't see it there, visiting their website couldn't hurt. I think I saw a "how to get in beta" link somewhere on there...

Ganurath
2009-01-21, 02:53 AM
I'm not sure how you do it for those who have owned SS for awhile, but when I bought it today, "DoW 2: Beta" appeared in My Games under Not Installed (all on steam of course). If you don't see it there, visiting their website couldn't hurt. I think I saw a "how to get in beta" link somewhere on there...The Dawn of War site will tell you to go to Steam, which is the only place you can download it. I'll give everyone a review tomorrow, as it'll be done downloading around the time the forum's doing the 3am backup.

Fun Fact: I get violent crazy when I can't find a much desired CD key after my mom has recently cleaned my room, which mostly entails "throwing out junk I won't be using."

SolkaTruesilver
2009-01-21, 03:16 AM
Fun Fact: I get violent crazy when I can't find a much desired CD key after my mom has recently cleaned my room, which mostly entails "throwing out junk I won't be using."

Oh, I solve that problem in a very simple way: Court Order.

Ganurath
2009-01-21, 03:40 AM
Oh, I solve that problem in a very simple way: Court Order.Well, not interpersonal violent, more like manic flailing with the CD key under glass root beer bottle collection violent.

SolkaTruesilver
2009-01-21, 04:33 AM
Well, not interpersonal violent, more like manic flailing with the CD key under glass root beer bottle collection violent.

No, I meant a court order to restrain the presence of your mother in your room to Clothes-grabbing/washing only, on pain of prison (and forced labor: clothe washing). Works everytime.

Ganurath
2009-01-21, 04:38 AM
Huh.

Anywho, turns out it needs xlive, which I downloaded, but had to reinstall because I didn't have xlive at the time. *string of profanities in English, German, Japanese, Drow, and Dwarven*

Lord Herman
2009-01-21, 04:39 AM
Downloading now. Hooray, DoW2!

By the way, the beta will be open to everyone next week; Soulstorm owners just got it a week early. So unless you're really desperate to try DoW2, I'd suggest waiting a week rather than buying Soulstorm.

Dragor
2009-01-21, 04:49 AM
This. Just. Made. My. Month.

*downloads immediately*

Nids, here I come!

Ganurath
2009-01-21, 05:21 AM
This. Just. Made. My. Month.

*downloads immediately*

Nids, here I come!Everyone's caught up on the Tyranids. I'm going to play three games before my review:

1. Eldar vs Orks: Get used to the differences between I and II.
2. Eldar vs Tyranids: Scout out the new race, see how the AI plays them.
3. Tyranids vs Space Marines: Really, who isn't going to run 'Nids at some point on this Beta?

Or... I'll get the same error. I'll wait for someone else's review.

Mc. Lovin'
2009-01-21, 07:37 AM
Awww man, I wanna play the beta, but not that much ... When does it come out for us mere mortals, who don't own a frankly terrible game?

Lord Herman
2009-01-21, 10:02 AM
Yay, I haz beta! And it's very, very nifty.

If anyone's interested in arranging a match, my LIVE handle is Javie Swiftbow.

Illiterate Scribe
2009-01-21, 10:17 AM
I have a question - is the voice acting as good as it was in the previous Dawn of War games? This may determine whether or not I get it.

Myatar_Panwar
2009-01-21, 10:26 AM
Ah, I thought next week was only available for pre-orders, but if its available for everyone, you might as well wait. But I can testify that it has indeed been worth my 8 dollars so far. And I've heard mixed reviews of soul storm, some like it some don't. I'll try it today and see if it was worth 8 dollars by itself.


And yes, you need a live account. This is a Games for Windows game. Its free to sign up.

Here are some highlights:

Cover is very much needed to keep units alive for long, as many unit types have surpression abilities
Once you get to high end T2 and T3, cover becomes less important than keeping mobile, as tanks and large units (such as walkers) can break through it.
There doesn't seem to be a way to jump to the latest action on the field. I hear this is a bad thing.
Also kind of hard to cycle between units all grouped together, no tabing.


Just some minor complaints, loving this game.

@Scribe: I didn't play the original, but the voice acting seems great to me.

Oslecamo
2009-01-21, 01:30 PM
Here are some highlights:
[LIST]
Cover is very much needed to keep units alive for long, as many unit types have surpression abilities

So it seems like indeed is more CoH in space than Warhammer 40K. Units are suposed to run away when being shot at damnit! And Space marines in particular are suposed to laugh at bullets, not having to hide behind some petty cover!

Thus, I think I'll wait that week to get the free beta thank you very much.

Ranis
2009-01-21, 05:02 PM
You can also pre-order Dawn of War 2 on Steam and it will give you early access to the beta.

Erloas
2009-01-21, 05:33 PM
So it seems like indeed is more CoH in space than Warhammer 40K. Units are suposed to run away when being shot at damnit! And Space marines in particular are suposed to laugh at bullets, not having to hide behind some petty cover!

Thus, I think I'll wait that week to get the free beta thank you very much.

In the TT game cover is very important too. Space Marines die to fire just like everyone else too, it just generally takes a bit more of it. SMs are far from the invincible force some people act like they are.

I bought the whole DOW set on Steam last month, so I'll see about downloading the demo tonight.

AgentPaper
2009-01-21, 05:33 PM
Well, I got the beta, but I can't start the game. It tries to start, from steam, then instantly crashes before the game can even start to load. :smallfurious:

Do I need this xlive thing? What the hell is that and where do I get it? :smallconfused:

Oslecamo
2009-01-21, 07:02 PM
In the TT game cover is very important too. Space Marines die to fire just like everyone else too, it just generally takes a bit more of it. SMs are far from the invincible force some people act like they are.


Just like everybody else? You're joking right? Marines in TT have awesome 3+ armor save, meaning only 1/3 of shots get trough, and most weapons can't penetrate it instantly. They're not indestructible, yes, but you'll need a lot of massed fire to take them down.

Guardsmen on the other hand have only 5+, and orks have pathetic 6+. And most weapons will simply pierce trough the armor, meaning guard and orks die by the rows when they're shot at. Eldar basic infantry has 4+ armor, wich is decent, but not spectacular as 3+.

Cover is usefull...Untill someone starts shooting template weapons at your head, wich are quite cheap and pass right trough cover.

Also, only a few weapons in TT have the pinning(supresing) ability. with everything else, squads are suposed to to run away back to their base, not stay there and get shot at.

Myatar_Panwar
2009-01-21, 07:09 PM
I'm not sure why you would not support a system where you utilize cover rather than not utilize cover.

@ Agent Paper: Games for Windows live. (http://www.gamesforwindows.com/en-US/Live/Pages/AboutLive.aspx)

The full instructions on getting into the beta and playing the game. (http://community.dawnofwar2.com/viewtopic.php?f=43&t=3649)

Edit: Also, you forget that in TT cover is still useful to marines when they are being assaulted by weapons which would normally ignore their armor save. Cover has always been useful.

Erloas
2009-01-21, 07:53 PM
Just like everybody else? You're joking right? Marines in TT have awesome 3+ armor save, meaning only 1/3 of shots get trough, and most weapons can't penetrate it instantly. They're not indestructible, yes, but you'll need a lot of massed fire to take them down.

Guardsmen on the other hand have only 5+, and orks have pathetic 6+. And most weapons will simply pierce trough the armor, meaning guard and orks die by the rows when they're shot at. Eldar basic infantry has 4+ armor, wich is decent, but not spectacular as 3+.

Cover is usefull...Untill someone starts shooting template weapons at your head, wich are quite cheap and pass right trough cover.

Also, only a few weapons in TT have the pinning(supresing) ability. with everything else, squads are suposed to to run away back to their base, not stay there and get shot at.


Everyone needs to take advantage of cover to have a chance of winning in the TT game. While SM troops do have a 3+AS there are quite a few weapons around that negate that armor, and thats when cover comes in. Most Necrons also have a 3+ save, and tau have 3+ saves for much of their heavy infantry as well. A good portion of Eldar also happen to have a 3+ save (7 units with 3+ 4 units with 4+ and 2 units with 5+, not counting HQ which is 2+, 3+, or 4+ invul or a combination there of), and with farseers around with nifty abitites like Fortune they are much more survivable then a space marine in those cases. Even a 4+ (cover or armor) with fortune is more powerful then a SMs armor. (75% chance of living vs 66%)
Their vehicles also die just as easily as everyone elses too, and thats another area where cover comes in incredibly useful.

Even with blast weapons, 5th edition 40k is won or lost on the ability of a player to take advantage of cover. Templates also only bypass cover when they land within the cover, in a lot of cases you still get cover saves from a decent amount of template weapons.

That 3+ armor save also isn't that impressive when you consider the fact that SMs are expensive enough points wise that they will generally be outnumbered 2-4 to 1 in which case they need that armor because they are taking considerably more fire then anyone else too.


I hope DOWII gets the idea across to players that even SMs die quickly when you leave them out in the open.
The demo will be done downloading for me shortly and then I can give it a try.

Edit: Well I gave the game a try. Only a quick game against a medium bot so far, and well, it took me half the game to figure out exactly what was going on with all of the changes, so I can't say too much yet. It doesn't jump out as being decidedly better or worse.

Neo
2009-01-22, 06:49 AM
yeah, looking forward to some gaming later.

Thankfully you don't have to buy Soulstorm again, you can just bind your cd key.

Oslecamo
2009-01-22, 09:34 AM
That 3+ armor save also isn't that impressive when you consider the fact that SMs are expensive enough points wise that they will generally be outnumbered 2-4 to 1 in which case they need that armor because they are taking considerably more fire then anyone else too.

Ah, see, that's another thing that bugs me to no end from the previews of DoW2. Marines don't really seem that outnumbered. Where is my green ork tide? Where's my endless tyranid wave? Can someone please confirm that the swarmy races are actually swarmy in DoW II?



I hope DOWII gets the idea across to players that even SMs die quickly when you leave them out in the open.
The demo will be done downloading for me shortly and then I can give it a try.

Yes, they die quickly, but everybody else(but necrons) dies even more quickly, since SMs don't only have the +3 AS, but also 4 toughness, compared to the eldars and taus with just 3 toughness in most of their force. Plus the "and they shall know no fear" rule that makes them almost impossible to kill by failed moral tests. However in DoW II it seems more like "and they shall ***** their useless power armor like little girls".

Myatar_Panwar
2009-01-22, 10:28 AM
Ah, see, that's another thing that bugs me to no end from the previews of DoW2. Marines don't really seem that outnumbered. Where is my green ork tide? Where's my endless tyranid wave? Can someone please confirm that the swarmy races are actually swarmy in DoW II?


Yes, I can tell you that Space Marines come in squads of 3 (I think all of their infantry units do anyway), while things like Eldar come in squads of 5, and tyrannids and orks more (don't have the number on hand).

So yes. For every space marines killed in open combat, more of the other race is killed.

And how did you get this idea?

However in DoW II it seems more like "and they shall ***** their useless power armor like little girls".

I shall put it in bold for you: Space Marines are tough. They still have less individuals die because of their smaller more powerful numbers. No they are not OMG OP KILL EVERYTHING BECAUSE I HAVE POWER ARMOR HUR HUR HUR.

SuperMuldoon
2009-01-22, 10:47 AM
I was perusing the official boards last night, and hearing a lot of criticism, though half of it seemed to be people that were super huge into DoW1 and didn't want the game to change at all. I'm actually super excited about the change, because of what i've heard it plays toward what I want to do (no base building management, all squad tactics and capturing objectives). I am interested in hearing the playgrounds impressions of the beta.

I want to get the beta, but I don't read anywhere that if you pre-order it you get in, it says exclusively for soulstorm owners, and I'm not going to buy the game just to get in a week early (though I would pre-order the game, kinda bummed I didn't already). So if anyone has gotten into the beta with a pre-order, please confirm.:smallsmile:

Lord Herman
2009-01-22, 12:10 PM
@SuperMuldoon: You can't get into the beta with just any pre-order. You'll have to pre-order through Steam for early beta access.

SuperMuldoon
2009-01-22, 12:23 PM
@SuperMuldoon: You can't get into the beta with just any pre-order. You'll have to pre-order through Steam for early beta access.

Ah ok. If I do preorder through steam, does that mean that I will only have a digital copy, and no physical disc etc.?

warty goblin
2009-01-22, 12:23 PM
Yes, I can tell you that Space Marines come in squads of 3 (I think all of their infantry units do anyway), while things like Eldar come in squads of 5, and tyrannids and orks more (don't have the number on hand).

So yes. For every space marines killed in open combat, more of the other race is killed.

And how did you get this idea?


I shall put it in bold for you: Space Marines are tough. They still have less individuals die because of their smaller more powerful numbers. No they are not OMG OP KILL EVERYTHING BECAUSE I HAVE POWER ARMOR HUR HUR HUR.

In fact, from what you are saying, it sounds like each SM is individually stronger relative to other units than they were in Dawn of War. This can only be a good thing.

Lord Herman
2009-01-22, 12:29 PM
Ah ok. If I do preorder through steam, does that mean that I will only have a digital copy, and no physical disc etc.?

I think so. As far as I know, Steam only sells digital downloads, no physical discs.

JMobius
2009-01-22, 12:30 PM
Having been one of those people heavily into DoW1, I was appalled when I first played the beta. My games were against computers, just to learn things, but gameplay seemed incredibly tedious. With the inability to actually fortify anything you take, the game felt like a dull back-and-forth. There was no sense of accomplishment in anything you managed to take, because the enemy could take it back just as easily. Similarly, there's no sweating bullets when your opponent makes an offensive and takes most of the map, because it is not hard to push them back and reverse the situation. This lack of any sort of decisiveness I greatly disliked.

Having now played with some friends, I have to say the game is growing on me. Human players have a much more 'organic' feel to their tactics than the CPU, and the game feels much more tactical as a result. A very different sort of tactical than the original, but one I'm learning to appreciate for its own merits. The game still feels like it needs a lot of polish (which is a pity, because its already gold), but with some patches, DLC, and expansions, I feel like it could be at least as great as the original. Just, completely different.

Jimp
2009-01-22, 12:34 PM
I'm a big fan of DoW1 and so are my friends. While I haven't gotten a chance to try the beta yet, my friends are all for it. So far so good.

Ranis
2009-01-22, 01:35 PM
The more I play the beta, the more it grows on me. I spent about 10 minutes in my first game looking for my builder unit, wondering why my allies were so close to each other, obviously confused.

Going into the game with the whole "You don't make buildings anymore" mentality was difficult at first, but I grew into the new intricacies of making the best out of the units you have and trying to figure out how in the world Tyranids can use cover. I enjoy seeing my mini tyranid-lings zerging over cover to maul some eldar.

Conversely where the space marines were almost the only race I could use effectively in DoW, in DoW2 I'm almost completely incapable of using the space marines because the Force Commander thinks he's a one-man army, the apocethary is too squishy, and the techno-turret builder guy is too finicky. I really enjoy all of the tyranid commanders and the Eldar warp-spider commander, though.

My windows live Gamertag is RanisTheDemon, anyone want to get something organized for come comp stomping?

AgentPaper
2009-01-22, 01:54 PM
Is it just me, or has the game been dumbed down? Seems like you don't build structures anymore, you just make units and send them off to die at various locations, and teching up is just a click and build time away. Am I missing something?

Lord Herman
2009-01-22, 02:18 PM
<snip>send them off to die</snip>

There's your problem. Keeping your units alive is very important in DoW2, just like it was in Company of Heroes. The gameplay isn't in the resource gathering or base building; it's in clever tactics and map control.

warty goblin
2009-01-22, 02:34 PM
Is it just me, or has the game been dumbed down? Seems like you don't build structures anymore, you just make units and send them off to die at various locations, and teching up is just a click and build time away. Am I missing something?

Buildings smuildings. I've not played the beta, but from my extensive reading across the internet, it sounds like they simplified the economy to up-play the tactical and strategic elements. And when has teching up not been a click and build time away?

Remember the following definitions, and what comes after them will make more sense:

Tactics: How you use what you bring to a fight.

Strategy: What you bring to a fight, and where you fight.

Logistics: How you get what you want to the fight to the fight.

To my way of thinking, the economic side of an RTS serves only one purpose- to make the tactics and strategy meaningful. If it costs nothing to replace a unit, nothing I do really matters*. All that really matters is that replacing losses has an opportunity cost and similarly inflicting losses on the enemy makes them pay their own opportunity cost- ex since I killed those dudes you must either replace them or tech up, but you can no longer afford to do both.

There are several ways to make combat meaningful in an RTS**- the standard harvest resources model, or some variant thereof, or simply start both sides out with semi-balanced forces and make replacing losses impossible or else extremely limited. For the former option the economy is usually either related directly or indirectly to controlling areas of the map, since this makes combat even more punchy and adds some new trade offs. Is it worth taking more causalities than the enemy to deny them this resource area? Things like that.

All of this stuff is pretty much strategic in nature, with tactics informing the strategy as to what outcomes are plausible. For example maybe I really want to oust my enemy from some resource point, but lack the forces in the area to do so, and am afraid that if I pull units from other areas of the map I will be unable to repel attacks in those areas. The tactical reality is informing my strategic decision, but the motivator of the debate is still fundamentally strategic. Logistics in RTS games is pretty much limited to unit movement speeds and occasionally screwing around with transports, which given the usually limited scope of RTS battles is fairly appropriate.

Now removing buildings may at first seem to neccessarily dumb down the game, but this is not the case. More stuff does not neccessarily equate to more meaningful decision making. An RTS with buildings is not strategically isomorphic*** to a game without buildings, but it may be strategically homomorphic****. That is to say if the numbers and types of strategic decisions remain, the game has been simplified, but not actually dumbed down. In fact given that the Space Marines at least retain the ability to build turrets and fortifications, but must make a significant trade-off in order to do so (namely not get a Force Commander or Apothecary) one could argue that this is an increase in strategic depth.

Plus in my opinion the physical gameplay enabled by the Essence Engine and cover adds an absolutel whackton of tactics that are simply not present in other RTSs.

*This is known as the World in Conflict system, or How Not to Build an RTS economy.

**I'm only talking about a single map/battle in isolation (essentially a skirmish), not something like Total War where half the point is to make sure you never fight an RTS battle with balanced forces.

***Isomorphism, math term meaning when two mathematical systems appear different, but the elements thereof can be put into a one-to-one and onto relationship which preserves operations. English version- two things that look different but act the same. Think the difference between a car painted green and the same car painted a slightly different shade of green.

****Homomorphism, two things between which an operation preserving mapping can be set up. Essentially you take thing A and simplify it into thing A'. A good example of this in this context would be rock paper scissors. I could create a game called RPS', which has rock, rock', paper, paper', scissors and scissors' with the following rules: Rock and rock' beat scissors and scissor', scissors and scissors' beat paper and paper', and paper, paper' beat rock and rock'. Pretty clearly RPS' is homomorphic to RPS, since I can map rock and rock' to rock (and so on) without changing the fundamental nature of the group.

Lord Herman
2009-01-22, 02:40 PM
My windows live Gamertag is RanisTheDemon, anyone want to get something organized for come comp stomping?

I've sent you a friend request thingie. It wouldn't let me edit the accompanying message, but it's from Javie Swiftbow, which is my gamertag.

SuperMuldoon
2009-01-22, 02:52 PM
I am going to preorder when I get home if it is still available, and jump into beta. Now the live account, would my Xbox live account be the same thing? Just curious as they are both microsoft (and both have the Live name).

Lord Herman
2009-01-22, 03:13 PM
I think so. When I was making my windows live account, some of the fields referred to an xbox live account instead. So I'm guessing they're one and the same.

Erloas
2009-01-22, 03:19 PM
As far as I'm aware the Live gametag is the same for PC and Xbox. When I was signing up for it yesterday they had Xbox related things plastered all over some of the screens.

As for the game itself:
Well I've only got to play one game so far. I haven't had enough time to figure everything out yet though. I just recently bought the first DOW on Steam (I had played it before, just not a lot) so I'm not really versed in the first one.

I don't like that you can't reinforce your units unless you take them back to your base. At least so far I haven't found any other structure that lets you reinforce units.
The no ability what so ever to hold a capture point for more then 10 seconds is really annoying. It basically means you have to plant a unit at every point and leave them there or someone will run in and take it before you even have a chance to do anything.


As for the lack of base building, so far I don't have a problem with it. The main reason is because in virutally every RTS I've played so far (a lot, but by no means all of them) it basically means the first 5-10 minutes of any match is simply building exactly the same buildings in the exact same order as quickly as possible no matter what. You basically just copy-paste the first 10 minutes of every single game you play and never notice the difference.
Expanding bases and moving aspects of bases up to more strategic areas is something different, and at least defensive buildings would be nice for holding the 15 capture points that exist in even the smallest 2p maps.

At 1600x1200 with all settings maxed I averaged about 45FPS (as well as I remember at least) with an E8400 (@3.6GHz), 4GB of RAM, a 4850 and Vista 64.


Not sure if I'm going to be playing a lot against other players. I've never been into RTSs enough to get to that level of playing it to the point where you know every single part of the game without even thinking about it which is required to be competitive in multiplayer RTSs. Of course with the lack of base building and the fact that so much of multiplayer RTS is decided in the first 5 minutes that if you don't build your base perfectly in that time you don't stand a chance of winning. Of course I know that two evenly matched players that get past that perfect 5 minutes then things get much more strategic again. Its just that playing the game 1000s times to figure out exactly the right build order and time is not something I really want to do.

I might give it more of a try with DOWII. My tag is (as always) Erloas.

JMobius
2009-01-22, 03:28 PM
I don't like that you can't reinforce your units unless you take them back to your base. At least so far I haven't found any other structure that lets you reinforce units.

The land transport vehicles for each race allow you to reinforce when near them.

BRC
2009-01-22, 04:16 PM
I havn't played the game, but you can see how Relic experimented throughout the games.

The origional DoW they stuck their toes into squad-based RTS where squads are made of individual units (In most other squad-based RTS's I'd seen each squad was essentially a single unit in terms of how it's health and attacks were calculated, as in, it was mainly squad-based in a graphical sense). Plus, making the economy based around general territory control rather than controlling specific places (Like gold mines or areas with lots of trees from Warcraft) Then, in CoH they built on that with cover and suppression, with only building your base in one zone, generally making things more tactical rather than strategic. From this, it looks like they have continued down that path even further (Though I havn't played the game yet, simply read stuff and seen videos)

AgentPaper
2009-01-22, 05:04 PM
The "dumb down" part was less about not having to make buildings, and more having less options for making your troops stronger, like upgrades, and the different paths you can take to get different units, which has been a staple of pretty much every RTS since starcraft, if not earlier. If they make the tactics you use with those units complex enough, then sure, fine, could be a good, complex game. But from my small glimpse so far (by no means final) it seems that the unit tactics aren't really any more complex than the first game, so the game seems to be dumbed down to me. You can say that there is now more focus on the tactical aspect, but that doesn't make the tactics any more complex in and of itself.

Anyways, I'm gunna play the game some more before I make a final decision on whether I like it or not.

Myatar_Panwar
2009-01-22, 06:39 PM
The no ability what so ever to hold a capture point for more then 10 seconds is really annoying. It basically means you have to plant a unit at every point and leave them there or someone will run in and take it before you even have a chance to do anything.

Hrm? 10 seconds is an pretty exaggerated. There have been plenty of times where I see that little red dot on the minimap, and have time to send units to stop the intruders. I usually keep a fast strike squad around just for that reason (jump infantry such as a marine Assault Squad or Storm Boyz).

If the spot is important enough, such as a victory point or a heavily pimped out Power Station, I will usually set up a mounted gun team to watch it though.

SuperMuldoon
2009-01-22, 07:13 PM
Well I just got the beta, and I'm playing a couple of matches against the computer to figure out just what I'm doing. If anyone wants to play, my tag is SuperMuldoon.

Lord Herman
2009-01-23, 04:54 AM
Let's make a list of gamertags, so new players won't have to seach the whole thread for them:

Ye Aulde Gamertags
Erloas
JavieSwiftbow (Lord Herman)
RanisTheDemon (Ranis)
SuperMuldoon

Just copy the list and add your own gamertag, and your GitP name if it's different from your tag.

Myatar_Panwar
2009-01-23, 10:34 PM
Ye Aulde Gamertags
Eorlas
JavieSwiftbow (Lord Herman)
RanisTheDemon (Ranis)
SuperMuldoon
Foolish Chaos (Myatar_Panwar)

I might play a game tonight, but probably won't play again till sunday.

Lord Herman
2009-01-24, 03:06 AM
Oops, I tpyo'd Erloas' name in the list. Here's the correct list, for further copying:

Ye Aulde Gamertags
Erloas
Foolish Chaos (Myatar_Panwar)
Javie Swiftbow (Lord Herman)
RanisTheDemon (Ranis)
SuperMuldoon

Erloas
2009-01-24, 09:45 PM
One thing about the DOWs... I always hear so much about all the cool animations... but am I the only one there never sees any of them? I mean theres always so much going on that I'm zoomed out a decent distance and always moving around and can't take the time to watch individual fights.

warty goblin
2009-01-25, 12:22 AM
One thing about the DOWs... I always hear so much about all the cool animations... but am I the only one there never sees any of them? I mean theres always so much going on that I'm zoomed out a decent distance and always moving around and can't take the time to watch individual fights.

Just note when and where the coolness is happening, then go to the replay, and set the speed down to .5 (assuming the beta has replays like the original did). It's how I admire all of the real wonderfulness.

Also, I found, at least with the original, that I learned to tell when the situation was sufficiently in hand for me to gawk at the dreadnaught using that ork as a punching bag. Of course I only ever played the AI, which makes things significantly easier as well.

Timarvay
2009-01-25, 07:47 AM
So, I just finished the download and install, and it won't work.

It tells me I need more virtual memory, and my total system paging needs to be at least 1.5 gigabytes. Can anyone Halp me?

king.com
2009-01-25, 08:05 AM
What is your system specs? You need a fairly good computer to run this.

Timarvay
2009-01-25, 08:08 AM
Not sure on the exact specs, since my brother built the machine for me, but as of last July it was pretty much top of the line. New hardrive and videoboard as of Christmas.

Geforce 8800GS for the graphics card. As an estimate, I can run Halflife 2, Warhammer Online, and other such recent games with no problems.

Erloas
2009-01-25, 11:03 PM
Well if you are having a virtual memory problem that has to do with how much RAM you have installed. Last July it was probably common at 2GB but even then people had been moving to 4GB quite often.

If you go to the System Properties in the Control Panel of either Vista or XP (system-> advanced system settings in Vista, direct link in the control panel in XP) then go to the Advanced tab there a Performance section and a settings button. Click the settings button and go to the advanced tab there, and there is a Virtual Memory section and it will say something like "Total Paging file size for all drives" if you hit the change button you can increase that number.

You need to set it to at least 1536MB from what you said, but its probably easiest to just click the check to let Windows control it automatically. Generally speaking Windows sets the virutal memory size to 1.5x the amount of RAM you have installed. At 2-4GB you can probably just have the virtual memory size be the same as the RAM you have.

*This is something someone had to have changed for you already, the virtual memory is always defaulted to Windows control, and if you don't have 1.5GB assigned to virtual memory already that either means someone turned it off or adjusted it down by hand or that you only have 512MB to 1GB of RAM. And I'm going to assume that your brother isn't a complete idiot and has installed at least 2GB of RAM. Also if you are running WAR decently I can pretty much guarentee you have 2GB. So probably your brother assumed you had enough RAM to not have to worry about virtual memory and disabled it. But in practical terms you can't really disable virtual memory without causing issues.

Timarvay
2009-01-26, 06:42 AM
Yeah, he killed virtual memory for me. I have 2 gigs of Ram, changed that, and it now works. Thanks!

AgentPaper
2009-01-26, 09:42 AM
So I'm actually starting to like this game a bunch. Not sure what the guy was talking about above, where you can't fortify. Sure this is probably true if you don't bother fortifying, but try playing as something like a techmarine. Building turrets and healing stations will win you the game a lot of the time, when the enemy just can't take that one point from you, and then you send your forces to take the next point while they get ready for the next assault. Lot's of fun for me, at least.

Erloas
2009-01-26, 11:14 AM
So I'm actually starting to like this game a bunch. Not sure what the guy was talking about above, where you can't fortify. Sure this is probably true if you don't bother fortifying, but try playing as something like a techmarine. Building turrets and healing stations will win you the game a lot of the time, when the enemy just can't take that one point from you, and then you send your forces to take the next point while they get ready for the next assault. Lot's of fun for me, at least.

Well that works if you play one of the 3 heros that allows you to do that. 2/3s of the heros in the game don't allow you to fortify nodes beyond leaving normal units there, and of course the resource design and number of nodes guarantees that you can't control all of them. Not being able to completely lock down all the points is fine except...

Really I think the only problem with not being able to fortify them is the fact that on all but the smallest maps, unless you have units spread all over the place you will never have enough time to stop a unit from taking your point. You can get there in time to keep them from claiming it themselves, but taking it from you takes almost no time at all. I think the claim time is fine, but I think the time required to remove a point from someone else's control is too fast.

AgentPaper
2009-01-26, 11:48 AM
Well it's true you can't just have all your forces in one big mob running around the field, you need to have them spread out and take different points. If you focus too much in one area, sure you'll beat your enemies, but then he'll have the rest of the map and get more troops and beat you. If it was easier to keep areas and fortify, I think that would detract from the strategy a lot.

Lord Herman
2009-01-28, 02:40 AM
Has anyone managed to play a MP match yet?

I never seem to be on at the same time as you guys. That's what I get for living in Europe, I guess. :smallfrown:

Penguinizer
2009-01-28, 04:25 AM
My gamertag is Penguilibrium, I'd also like to play a game with others from here. Although I haven't played it all that much.

Lord Herman
2009-01-28, 05:26 AM
By the way, the beta should be open to everyone now. Huzzah!

Thanatos 51-50
2009-01-28, 05:54 AM
Open to everyone?

I've been waiting to hear those wonderful words for a long time, Lord Herman!

*Downloads!*

onasuma
2009-01-28, 06:09 AM
I downloaded. Then, I deleted it due to a file error and Im now reinstalling. Huzzah for computers!

SuperMuldoon
2009-01-28, 10:13 AM
Has anyone managed to play a MP match yet?

I never seem to be on at the same time as you guys. That's what I get for living in Europe, I guess. :smallfrown:

Everytime I sign on it seems I've just missed you by an hour or less, except that one time when you were just about to sign off. But being in Europe definitely makes the timing a little more difficult! :smallsmile:

Penguinizer
2009-01-28, 11:06 AM
I had the problem with it not working the first time I downloaded it. I also got it to work on the second time, so I don't really think it's much of a problem.

I have also had some minor issues with fps, but starting a new game fixed it.

Lord Herman
2009-01-28, 12:06 PM
The fine folks at GameReplays.org have already started making DoW2 vidcasts; videos of game replays, with commentaries from skilled players. They're very educational - if you want to get better at the game, I recommend watching a few. Linky! (http://www.gamereplays.org/community/index.php?showforum=2911)


v, Begone, heretic! *smites dallas rather ineffectually with lasgun*

Dallas-Dakota
2009-01-28, 12:14 PM
Ha! Finally caught you!
Now stop hiding here and start another TRAF!:smalltongue:

Don't make me come over there.:smalltongue:

MeklorIlavator
2009-01-28, 08:48 PM
Well, just downloaded the game, and my names MeklorIlavator. So far, seems okay, but I've only played a couple games.

KilltheToy
2009-01-28, 09:56 PM
Of course at this exact moment my hard drive is down :smallfrown::smallmad:.

I really need to get a new graphics card.

Thanatos 51-50
2009-01-28, 10:12 PM
Gamertag is Thanatos Erebus.

Still getting used to the rather staggering differances, but I'm likeing the game.

warty goblin
2009-01-28, 10:17 PM
I'm reserving this space to curse the heavens that my college network hates my gaming desktop with the passion of a thousand fiery suns and hence refuses to grant unto it the sweet gift of bandwidth, thus depriving me of this most fair and virtuous beta. May the Emperor crush utterly your servers!

On another note, how big is this beta? Any chance I could download the file to my laptop and migrate it over to the desktop with only an ethernet cable and a 512mb flash drive? I'm only really interested in the skirmish portion anyways.

MeklorIlavator
2009-01-28, 10:33 PM
Actually, right now I'm having a bit of a problem. The game is kinda laggy even on the lowest settings. Currently I have 5371 virtual memory(what my comp recommends), with all the recommended system requirements except a my video cards, which is a NVIDIA Quadro NVS 135M. Anybody have any idea on what could be wrong?

Myatar_Panwar
2009-01-29, 12:53 AM
On another note, how big is this beta? Any chance I could download the file to my laptop and migrate it over to the desktop with only an ethernet cable and a 512mb flash drive? I'm only really interested in the skirmish portion anyways.

Its 2256 MB. Sooo no :(

BRC
2009-01-30, 09:44 PM
I downloaded the Beta, but it keeps crashing as soon as it gets to the menu. As awsome as the intro video is, I'm getting kind of sick of it. Any Advice?

MeklorIlavator
2009-01-30, 10:09 PM
I downloaded the Beta, but it keeps crashing as soon as it gets to the menu. As awsome as the intro video is, I'm getting kind of sick of it. Any Advice?

Are you using 32-bit Vista? If you are you should check out this thread on the official forum (http://community.dawnofwar2.com/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=3651).

Other than that, what are your specs?

Lord Herman
2009-02-07, 05:35 AM
So, the first big balance patch is out. Is it me, or have they improved the AI a lot? It's still not very good - I can beat it on Expert - but it now uses Tier 3 units a lot more, and it seems to be better at harrassing points too.

Edit: The Orks aren't the only ones who like big shootas. The Egyptians apparently built a Temple of Dakka (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dakka).

Dragonus45
2009-02-11, 12:07 PM
Im neodragonus45, someone add me.

Joran
2009-02-11, 01:18 PM
So, the first big balance patch is out. Is it me, or have they improved the AI a lot? It's still not very good - I can beat it on Expert - but it now uses Tier 3 units a lot more, and it seems to be better at harrassing points too.

Edit: The Orks aren't the only ones who like big shootas. The Egyptians apparently built a Temple of Dakka (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dakka).

I liked pre-patch a lot better than I liked post-patch. The requisition change on 3v3 maps makes the game less of a tactical match of a small number of units to more of a spammy vehicle battle. Also, it introduced a couple of major bugs, that need to be fixed, primarily venom cannons on the Hive Tyrant and the Ork Kommando bomb bug.

Penguinizer
2009-02-12, 10:23 AM
So, I've played it again a bit after taking a small break, and have noticed that I'm not really good at it. For some reason I just fail at taking points, teching up fast enough, or plain managing to kill anything. I don't really know why either.

JMobius
2009-02-12, 11:18 AM
I liked pre-patch a lot better than I liked post-patch. The requisition change on 3v3 maps makes the game less of a tactical match of a small number of units to more of a spammy vehicle battle. Also, it introduced a couple of major bugs, that need to be fixed, primarily venom cannons on the Hive Tyrant and the Ork Kommando bomb bug.

A pretty common sentiment, I haven't played post patch after said rumors turned me off. Fortunately, Relic has acknowledged all of those problems, and are working on a solution.

Lord Herman
2009-02-12, 11:19 AM
If you want to get better, I'd really recommend watching the commentaried replay shoutcasts at GameReplays.org (http://www.gamereplays.org/community/index.php?showforum=2911). TychoCelchuuu's casts are particularly good; they're enteraining and educational!

Oslecamo
2009-02-12, 12:24 PM
I liked pre-patch a lot better than I liked post-patch. The requisition change on 3v3 maps makes the game less of a tactical match of a small number of units to more of a spammy vehicle battle.

It caught me off suprise in the first battle, but I quickly adapted to it, and actually enjoyed the extra resources a lot. A couple of tankbusta squads carefully microed filled the battlefield with destroyed walkers, and finally I saw something resembling a tyranid swarm as the nid player kept sending wave after wave of gaunts of all kinds to try to overwhelm our team.

Penguinizer
2009-02-12, 01:24 PM
Well, after I posted that I wasn't doing well. I played a couple of games as the nids and realized what I was doing wrong. I hadn't realized the importance of synapse. I use the Ravener though, and put the venom cannon on Fexes or Warriors, even though it's supposedly really broken on Tyrants. I tend to use the strangler since the supression is useful with a termagant/hormogaunt squad with the Ravener extra-damage synapse. I tend to do massive swarms, which is fun.

I might try out a Ravener with Extra Damage synapse using a lot of adrenaline gland warriors or venom cannons. It might be fun. Although a Ravener with the extra-damage aura with a lot of venom cannon warriors and carnifexes in T3. It would probably kill just about everything.

Joran
2009-02-12, 02:13 PM
It caught me off suprise in the first battle, but I quickly adapted to it, and actually enjoyed the extra resources a lot. A couple of tankbusta squads carefully microed filled the battlefield with destroyed walkers, and finally I saw something resembling a tyranid swarm as the nid player kept sending wave after wave of gaunts of all kinds to try to overwhelm our team.

I adapted as well. I enjoy watching my plasma devastators completely wreck a swarm of Tyranids, but if my team loses map control, we tend to get completely buried in vehicles. It seemed a little more forgiving to the losing team earlier on.

However, this way, I get to field Terminators almost every game =P

Oslecamo
2009-02-12, 02:55 PM
However, this way, I get to field Terminators almost every game =P

Me as well. In the first beta it was almost impossible to get those end of game very expensive units in a point capture game, but now it's much easier.

Penguinizer
2009-02-17, 09:42 AM
So, I was wondering, should we have a GiantITP 3v3 battle? I think it would be a good bit of fun, playing with other playgrounders.

On another note, do you think they'll keep the beta up until the release, or take it off Steam before that?

Joran
2009-02-17, 02:18 PM
The Beta is ending tomorrow, so tonight is the last time you can legally get Dawn of War 2 goodness without having to pay for it.

I'm wondering if I should buy it straight from Steam or continue my collection of useless discs and cases.