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Mauril Everleaf
2009-02-24, 03:42 AM
So I am in the process of building a world and have it largely fleshed out. I have, however, run into one complication. I don't know how to work out the hobgoblin religion that I have built. Essentially they worship a single god, Rindum ("rin-doom"), but this god is not a creator god, a fertility god or an all powerful god. He is just a god of war and honor. How do you create a religion and mythos that cares nothing of its creation or of the other gods that it acknowledges exist? I need help, so any advice offered would be great. Since I don't really know where to really even start, I can't give you a whole lot here, so please ask any questions that you think are relevant and I will try to provide an answer. Thanks in advance!

ErrantX
2009-02-24, 04:46 AM
Well, since they have a war-honor god, perhaps they were created by a different god who they turned away from to worship Rindum due to the original god either being indifferent or just not what they as a race wanted to follow. Or you could have this be the only surviving god from a war within their pantheon.

Another idea is that Rindum eliminated or succeeded their original god to take the place as their primary deity. He wasn't their creator, but he cared for them either way and they worship him because of this.

Just a few thoughts, hope it helps.
-X

paddyfool
2009-02-24, 07:16 AM
Perhaps they felt ill-treated by their creator, and declined to worship him, and/or their creator viewed them as a failure and lost interest in them to go on to build other races with whom he/she's more involved? Or perhaps Rindum did create them or have them created by another deity, with the intention of them being a race of honorable warriors?

Neithan
2009-02-24, 07:56 AM
This isn't actually that much uncommon.

For example, many of the ancient pagan religions of europe did not worship their creator gods.
Zeus was the Grandson of the Creator, who was thrown out of power by his son, who was then overthrown by Zeus.
In old german and scandinavian mythology, Odin was the creator of humans and build the lands of the humans, but he was not a real creator of the world.

Also, it was very common to acknowledge the existance of these surpreme gods, which might be creator-gods or not, but primarily worship a lower god because on liked his religion more.
For example, take any ancient greek priest, who was a priest of a god other than Zeus. They did not claim that Zeus was not the surpreme god, but their service and worship was for Demeter, Athena or whoever.

You hobgoblins probably would have a creator god, but they simply don't care for him. He may have created them, but that was a long time ago. And hobgoblin life is not about creation, but about war. So they abandoned the old god and now worship only a god of war.

sigurd
2009-02-24, 08:17 AM
Gods don't have to be more than what their worshipers need.


Hobgobs might have once been created but they _are_ going to be in battle. Given their racial outlook I think you're on the right track. Look at the klingons in 2nd Gen for inspiration.

- Sigurd

Devils_Advocate
2009-02-27, 02:16 PM
How do you create a religion and mythos that cares nothing of its creation or of the other gods that it acknowledges exist? I need help, so any advice offered would be great.
Well, obviously you exclude creation myths from the religion's dogma.

Rindum is just concerned with his followers' behavior and their success at what they do. My guess would be that "honor", for them, is largely a matter of how many other persons submit to your control, computed recursively (the inferiors of your inferiors are also your inferiors, even if you have no direct contact with them). He's just not about the origin of anything or the nature of reality or anything like that. His followers may have beliefs regarding such things, but they're not a part of the faith (and as such they're likely to not all share the same beliefs).

Basically, I don't see how anything you've mentioned presents a problem. You just design the religion like you would another religion, except you leave certain things out. I don't see this leaving insufficient basis on which to construct teachings and practices. Commandments and rituals don't need to relate to mythic origins; my guess would be that they often don't, though I'm not much of a religious scholar.

Another_Poet
2009-02-27, 02:38 PM
I think you could read about the ancient (real-world) Cult of Mithras and get a lot of great ideas. Google it.

DoomedPaladin
2009-02-27, 03:07 PM
Treat it as less a religion and dogma(like the Big Biblical Three) and more as a spirituality/way of life (like Buddhism).

Their faith is something that isn't separate from daily life. They eat, breathe, fight and die in honor and for it. Worshiping by doing so. Where they came from is a non-issue, they have simply always been.

Other "Gods" are simply forces of nature or powerful individuals, to be respected. They might view elaborate rituals of the rest of the world's religions as unnecessary since they live their worship. Those other religion's peoples would likely take this lack of active praise as them ignoring their Gods.

Mauril Everleaf
2009-02-28, 02:18 AM
I stumbled across the Dragon article on Bane. He seemed to be a nigh perfect fit for what I was wanting Rindum to be like, and how to build an unaligned following for him. However, DoomedPaladin and Devils_Advocate, I think you hit the things I was struggling with. Because creation myths are so important in other real world religions/mythologies, I was having a hard time not having that be an important part of a religion's canon. Thanks to all of you!

Ovaltine Patrol
2009-02-28, 02:22 AM
"All time not measured in shed blood is an illusion."

-Random Hobgoblin theologian in your campaign setting :smallbiggrin:

If they don't care about their creation mythology, it implies that they are very focused on the here and now. It is likely that they have no strong concept of an afterlife.

paddyfool
2009-02-28, 02:41 AM
Because creation myths are so important in other real world religions/mythologies, I was having a hard time not having that be an important part of a religion's canon. Thanks to all of you!

OTOH, in fantasy settings, gods that have nothing to do with the creation of the world are not uncommonly among the most respected (see Krynn, for instance, where Reorx, who made the world as a contract worker fro a High God whom no-one worships, only really got respect from Dwarves and Gnomes).