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Ceaon
2009-05-09, 12:47 PM
Hey all!
I'm making a Warden with the specific goal of having as much HP and temp HP as possible, with only PH and PH2 as available books (one exception: the DM has agreed to let me play a Warforged and use the Dragon article because I made such an awesome backstory).
I've posted this thread on the wizard boards also, but for now they haven't really helped me out at all, so my hope lies with you guys.

Now, my priorities, in order of importance are:
1. Get as much HP as possible.
1a. Getting as much temporary HP as possible.
2. Be able to punish enemies for ignoring me.
3. Getting my defenses high(er).
4. Being able to deal damage (multiclass Barbarian?)

My stats, taking into account the priorities, will be:
Str 16 [14+2], Con 20 [18+2], Dex 11, Int 8, Wis 10, Cha 10
As you can see, his attack bonus and Ref and Will suffer because of the focus on constitution, so I'll have to 'fix' that somehow.

I have some questions I'd like your opinions on (thanks in advance).
1. After Toughness at level 1, which feats would you recommend for this Warden? Sudden Roots, Spiked Chain Proficiency, Warforged Tactics, Improved Warforged Resolve, Immutability, Berserker's Fury (MC Barbarian)... or something else?
2. Which weapon would you use? Should I go twohanded w/reach or longsword + shield? Axe or hammer even though my attack bonus is low already?
3. Which Paragon Path would you choose? Again, I only have PH+PH2+Warforged Dragon Article, so no Juggernaught for this character.
4. Which at-wills would you choose? Earth Shield Strike is kinda meh, but the other three all seem very useful and/or right for this character.

Of course, if you have other ideas, feel free to post them!

Thajocoth
2009-05-09, 01:11 PM
Starting gear:
Longsword, or other +3 prof 1h weapon
Heavy Shield
Hide Armor

Possible mundane level 4 purchases:
Orb
Holy Symbol

Feats:
1 - Toughness, as you said (+5hp)
2 - Improved Warforged Resolve (+5 temphp to Resolve)
4 - Component Modification (+up to con mod temphp to Resolve)
6 - Warforged Tactics (+to-hit with ally's help)
8 - Weapon Expertise (+1 to-hit)

Why a sword AND shield? You'll want as many components as you can get for Component Modification. Specifically, you want, at minimum, as many components as your con mod.

Why heavy shield? Warforged proficient in heavy shields, which Wardens are, can treat them as light shields for the purposes of holding things in that hand

Why longsword? It's 1-handed with +3 proficiency. A warforged CAN attach a 2-h weapon and use it like a 1-h weapon, but they lose a certain amount of to-hit, which you desperately need.

Orb? Holy symbol? What the heck? Component modification works up to your con mod. You'll want 5 components by level 4 when you take the feat. 6 at level 8, 7 at level 14, 8 at level 21 and 9 at level 28. If you haven't gotten magical gear for enough slots, get mundane stuff and attach it. Warforged can specifically embed orbs into their chest, and holy symbols can be attached anywhere.

Tengu_temp
2009-05-09, 05:18 PM
Orb? Holy symbol? What the heck? Component modification works up to your con mod. You'll want 5 components by level 4 when you take the feat. 6 at level 8, 7 at level 14, 8 at level 21 and 9 at level 28. If you haven't gotten magical gear for enough slots, get mundane stuff and attach it. Warforged can specifically embed orbs into their chest, and holy symbols can be attached anywhere.

You lost me.

Asbestos
2009-05-09, 06:47 PM
You lost me.

They are referring to this feat...

Component Modification [Warforged]
Prerequisite: Warforged
Benefit: Your body takes better advantage of warforged components. For each component you have, your warforged resolve racial power grants you 1 temporary hit point, up to a maximum bonus equal to your Constitution modifier.

Hoggmaster
2009-05-09, 07:20 PM
Level 1 Wardenforged
====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&DI Character Builder ======
Wardenforged, level 1
Warforged, Warden
Guardian Might: Earthstrength

FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 16, Con 20, Dex 11, Int 8, Wis 10, Cha 10.

STARTING ABILITY SCORES
Str 14, Con 18, Dex 11, Int 8, Wis 10, Cha 10.


AC: 20 Fort: 16 Reflex: 12 Will: 12
HP: 42 Surges: 14 Surge Value: 10

TRAINED SKILLS
Nature +5, Intimidate +7, Athletics +5, Endurance +9

UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics -3, Arcana -1, Bluff, Diplomacy, Dungeoneering, Heal, History -1, Insight, Perception, Religion -1, Stealth -3, Streetwise, Thievery -3

FEATS
Level 1: Toughness

POWERS
Warden at-will 1: Strength of Stone
Warden at-will 1: Earth Shield Strike
Warden encounter 1: Thunder Ram Assault
Warden daily 1: Form of the Fearsome Ram

ITEMS
Adventurer's Kit, Hide Armor, Heavy Shield, Longsword
====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&DI Character Builder ======


At level 10
====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&DI Character Builder ======
Wardenforged, level 10
Warforged, Warden
Guardian Might: Earthstrength

FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 16, Con 22, Dex 11, Int 8, Wis 12, Cha 10.

STARTING ABILITY SCORES
Str 14, Con 18, Dex 11, Int 8, Wis 10, Cha 10.


AC: 28 Fort: 25 Reflex: 20 Will: 21
HP: 107 Surges: 17 Surge Value: 26

TRAINED SKILLS
Nature +11, Intimidate +12, Athletics +10, Endurance +15

UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics +2, Arcana +4, Bluff +5, Diplomacy +5, Dungeoneering +6, Heal +6, History +4, Insight +6, Perception +6, Religion +4, Stealth +2, Streetwise +5, Thievery +2

FEATS
Level 1: Toughness
Level 2: Improved Warforged Resolve
Level 4: Component Modification
Level 6: Durable
Level 8: Crushing Earthstrength
Level 10: Improved Initiative

POWERS
Warden at-will 1: Strength of Stone
Warden at-will 1: Earth Shield Strike
Warden encounter 1: Thunder Ram Assault
Warden daily 1: Form of the Fearsome Ram
Warden utility 2: Triumphant Vigor
Warden encounter 3: Earthgrasp Strike
Warden daily 5: Storm Strike
Warden utility 6: Bear's Endurance
Warden encounter 7: Earth Gift
Warden daily 9: Form of the Stone Sentinel
Warden utility 10: Returning Strength

ITEMS
Adventurer's Kit, Heavy Shield, Warsoul Longsword +2, Shoulderbow Hand Crossbow +2, Lifeblood Hide Armor +2, Amulet of Protection +3, Delver's Light (heroic tier)
====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&DI Character Builder ======

Hoggmaster
2009-05-09, 07:24 PM
Just some ideas for your warforged Warden (see prior post). He has 3 socketed items (+3 temp hp)

Ceaon
2009-05-10, 08:34 AM
Durable is a feat that I donīt really need. Iīve got HSīs to spare without it, and it really doesn't add much to the whole indestructible/high HP theme, I feel. Also, why Wis+2 instead of Str+2, Hoggmaster?
Thanks for the build ideas though! I completely missed the socketed heavy shield notes. Very interesting!
Are there any recommendations for a Paragon Path? I'm having a very hard time deciding. I've heard Juggernaught gives additional HP, but it's not in the PH or PH2, so it's out. Anything else that increases HP/temp HP by a lot?

Tengu_temp
2009-05-10, 09:18 AM
They are referring to this feat...

Component Modification [Warforged]
Prerequisite: Warforged
Benefit: Your body takes better advantage of warforged components. For each component you have, your warforged resolve racial power grants you 1 temporary hit point, up to a maximum bonus equal to your Constitution modifier.

Aha. And knowledge is half the battle!

Nibelung
2009-05-10, 09:40 AM
Instead of starting con 20, i would prefer start with con 19, and str 18. 1 HP for +1 to hit and damage is a very fair trade, and when your HP hit the hundreds, 1 HP is nothing.

About powers, i think that Rentless Panther is better because he give a +1 "free" bonus to hit, which is nice.

Hoggmaster
2009-05-10, 09:57 AM
+2 to Wis just for the extra pip of will defense. (it will matter less it paragon/epic tiers (paragon defenses or the +4 epic feats)

Ceaon
2009-05-10, 11:23 AM
Instead of starting con 20, i would prefer start with con 19, and str 18. 1 HP for +1 to hit and damage is a very fair trade, and when your HP hit the hundreds, 1 HP is nothing.
I know, and you are right, but the goal of my build is to get maximum HP (PH/PH2) so con starting at 20 isn't really debatable.


About powers, i think that Rentless Panther is better because he give a +1 "free" bonus to hit, which is nice.
Pretty much all the forms of the Warden are awesome...

Thajocoth
2009-05-10, 03:02 PM
Btw... I don't know if the build I gave is the best possible build. The to-hit is quite low... But putting hp & temphp above all else, I think it's the best you can do. Warfoged Tactics almost helps make up for the lack of hitting if you have allies there, but even with it, you'll do a lot of missing. I usually try to have my to-hit stat at 20 to start, and I still take the feats adding to it... And I still miss nearly half the time. Then again, I don't play too many classes that are effective at anything on a miss... Wardens at least get to mark their targets. With all that hp and being able to treat 1-9 as a 10 on any death save means your death is very unlikely, so I suppose it's not that bad of a build. Your death requires hitting -bloodied, and the higher your hp, the further away that is. I'm curious to know how that tactic works out for you.

Ceaon
2009-05-10, 04:24 PM
Thanks everyone!
Any ideas on which Paragon Path I should take?

Asbestos
2009-05-10, 05:43 PM
Well, at a cursory glance you probably want to go with the Storm Sentinel Warden PP.

This is why...

Invigorating Action (11th level): When you
spend an action point to make an attack, you can
spend a healing surge as a free action after the attack.

Undying Wind (16th level): Whenever you
spend a healing surge, you regain additional hit
points equal to your Constitution modifier

... seems like a good way to make sure your high hp stays high.