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Stormthorn
2009-05-15, 12:00 PM
Thermobaric Fireball
Level: Sor/Wiz 7
Components: V, S, M
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Range: Long (400 ft. + 40 ft./level)
Area: 20-ft.-radius spread / 40-ft.-spread radius
Duration: Instantaneous
Saving Throw: Reflex half
Spell Resistance: Yes

This spell functions as the spell Fireball except that it also creates a powerful blast wave as all the air in the 20' radius of the base fireball rapidly expands outward. The blast wave has a radius of 40ft and deals 1d6 points of bludgeoning damage per two levels of the caster (max 10d6). If the save for the fire damage was made then the targets only take 1/2 bludgeoning damage as well. The blast of air also acts as a Gust of Wind originating at the point of detonation.
The vacuum left behind by the explosion prevents speaking and casting spells with verbal components inside the 40' blast area on the round following the blast. Inside an enclosed space smaller than or equal to that 40' the room has all oxygen removed for 3d6 rounds and suffocation is a very real danger.
The bludgeoning damage from this spell ignores the physical damage immunity of swarms and beings with similar makeups.

In addition to the components needed for the fireball spell this spell requires a handfull of titanium dust as a material component. The dust is worth 100gp.

Feel free to comment and, if you like the spell, put it into lists you have or games your running.

DracoDei
2009-05-15, 12:10 PM
Call it Bludgeoning probably, certainly not Force. Force can effect ethereal creatures and is actually a comparatively rare damage type.

Zeta Kai
2009-05-15, 02:21 PM
Call it Bludgeoning probably, certainly not Force. Force can effect ethereal creatures and is actually a comparatively rare damage type.

Agreed. Force is what a magic missile is made of, not any natural phenomena. Forcecage & Tenser's floating disk are implied to utilize non-damaging constructs of magical force. In my games, explosives deal bludgeoning damage due to their natural concussive properties (with the exception of shrapnel-based weapons, which deal slashing damage). D20 Modern separates concussive & bludgeoning damage types, but there's no real need to do so in a standard D&D game; even in Modern, it's fairly irrelevant which type it is.

AzazelSephiroth
2009-05-15, 02:28 PM
I think the force damage is fine so long as the description is changed to explain its existence. This allows the spell to affect incorporeal creatures and gives a bit of power to the spell. I think if the force damage was not caused by the heat but the magic power of the spell (being 6th level) then force is appropriate- if you wanted it to be just heated air then Bludg. is better- your personal choice I think- it gives a lot of power to your caster either way but I have always felt that 6th. level spells were lacking a good damage dealer.

Gorgondantess
2009-05-15, 05:15 PM
I like it with force damage. Force always struck me as essentially magical kinetic energy- like a magical explosion, not some mystical form of damage.

Stycotl
2009-05-15, 11:19 PM
mikey likes it! i'd go with bludgeoning though.

Stormthorn
2009-05-15, 11:31 PM
Heres my problem with bludgeoning damage: It wont hurt a swarm of locusts. This spell should be able to kill somehting made up of tiny parts or mist both by virtue of the fire AND of blasting it into a million seperate pieces.

If you can think of a workaround i would be happy to change it.

Also, keep in mind that its a sixth level spell with a valuable material component so you have to keep track of your castings.

DracoDei
2009-05-15, 11:40 PM
"This bludgeoning damage ignores the resistances and immunities granted by the Swarm subtype."

There you go, easy as that.

Baron Corm
2009-05-16, 12:57 AM
The spell is better than delayed blast fireball, and is a level lower. I don't much like using a material component to grant power creep like this. If you did, you would have to have a much larger material component. I'm more in favor of bumping it up to level 7 or 8, though. If you wanted to keep it at 6, you could lower the damage.

Zeta Kai
2009-05-16, 10:13 AM
The spell is better than delayed blast fireball, and is a level lower. I don't much like using a material component to grant power creep like this. If you did, you would have to have a much larger material component. I'm more in favor of bumping it up to level 7 or 8, though. If you wanted to keep it at 6, you could lower the damage.

Agreed, & quoted for truth.

Stormthorn
2009-05-16, 11:29 PM
The spell is better than delayed blast fireball, and is a level lower. I don't much like using a material component to grant power creep like this. If you did, you would have to have a much larger material component. I'm more in favor of bumping it up to level 7 or 8, though. If you wanted to keep it at 6, you could lower the damage.

Sure thing. And i suppose that means i can keep the force damage? Although i might just add a disclaimer that i deals MAGICAL bludgeoning damage and thus effects things normaly immune to physical attacks.

I didnt plan on granting anything, basing the level on whimsy because i dont have any experiance with a character over level 3. See, i figured that since it cant be thrown around like a DBF it was less useful although it did more damage.

Hmm...level 7 or 8?

Baron Corm
2009-05-17, 04:41 PM
It's a little hard to say, but I would put it at level 7.

At level 8 you have polar ray and sunburst dealing 25d6. Horrid wilting deals 20d8, and greater shout deals 20d6 and stuns and deafens. I don't think that your spell compares with these. It is better than delayed blast fireball in most cases, but I can still see someone taking delayed blast fireball for the timer and lack of material component.

For the damage type, you could have it as sonic. I don't know enough about physics to say that is accurate, but it looks like it suits your purposes.

DrakebloodIV
2009-05-17, 05:23 PM
Call it Bludgeoning probably, certainly not Force. Force can effect ethereal creatures and is actually a comparatively rare damage type.

Agreed


Also, you forgot what happens after a thermobaric weapon is used. You need to throw in fort saves for Con damage from suffocation, and some sort of save against getting your lungs ripped out by the vaccum created by thermobaric weaponry. Also, said vaccum would immediately ground all flying creatures and probably pull nonflying creatures towards its center.

unosarta
2009-05-17, 06:06 PM
Agreed


Also, you forgot what happens after a thermobaric weapon is used. You need to throw in fort saves for Con damage from suffocation, and some sort of save against getting your lungs ripped out by the vaccum created by thermobaric weaponry. Also, said vaccum would immediately ground all flying creatures and probably pull nonflying creatures towards its center.

D&D REALLY needs rules for getting your lungs ripped out :smallbiggrin:

Stormthorn
2009-05-17, 08:10 PM
Agreed


Also, you forgot what happens after a thermobaric weapon is used. You need to throw in fort saves for Con damage from suffocation, and some sort of save against getting your lungs ripped out by the vaccum created by thermobaric weaponry. Also, said vaccum would immediately ground all flying creatures and probably pull nonflying creatures towards its center.

I was aware of the vacuum although i wont make a save for having lungs ripped out. Even briefly coming into contact with the void of space doesnt do that to a person so im writting it off as an urban myth till I find a news article. If anything the force of the blast would collapse your lungs not pull them out.

This particular weapon doesnt eat up enough air to suffocate someone unless they where locked in a small room with the fireball. It isnt a 500 pound bomb in a bunker, its a small bead in any sort of area. STILL, i have included rules for a room losing its oxygen.

DracoDei
2009-05-17, 08:26 PM
Sonic is even more appropriate than bludgeoning I would say. Good thinking.

Stormthorn
2009-05-17, 10:35 PM
Sonic is even more appropriate than bludgeoning I would say. Good thinking.

Im not so sure. Sound waves are just a slow form of shockwave. Thus, sonic damage would be a downgrade of power.