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Overlord
2006-07-03, 02:11 PM
UNARMORED FIGHTER (Marshal)

This class variant is mostly unspecific, but it does have a class ability called Marshal’s Skills. This is because the class was designed for use as a class for undercover police forces. I didn’t want to name it Marshal, however, seeing as how that name was taken, so I gave it a general name. The skill bonuses are optional, and the bonus feats can be replaced with class abilities as well. (I just couldn’t think of any) Any input that you all can provide would be appreciated.

Alignment: Any. (I might change this to any non-chaotic)
Hit Die: d10.
Bab: As Fighter. (Full)
Saves: As Fighter. (Fort. good, Ref. and Will bad)


Class Skills
The fighter’s class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Bluff (Cha), Climb (Str), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Disguise (Cha), Forgery (Int), Gather Information (Cha), Handle Animal (Cha), Hide (Dex), Intimidate (Cha), Jump (Str), Knowledge (local) (Int), Ride (Dex), Sense Motive (Wis), Sleight of Hand (Dex), and Swim (Str).
Skill Points at First Level: (4+ Int modifier) x4
Skill Points at Each Additional Level: 4 + Int modifier.

Table: The Unarmored Fighter
Level * * * * * *Special
1st * * * * * * * Unarmored defense
2nd * * * * * Uncanny dodge
3rd * * * * * * * Non-Lethal attack
4th * * * * * Marshal’s Skills +1
5th * * * * * Dodge Bonus +1
6th * * * * * Improved uncanny dodge
7th *
8th * * * * * Bonus feat , Marshal’s Skills +2
9th *
10th * * Dodge Bonus +2
11th * * Non-Lethal Sneak Attack +1d6
12th * * Marshal’s Skills +3
13th *
14th * * Non-Lethal Sneak Attack +2d6
15th * * Dodge Bonus +3
16th * * Marshal’s Skills +4
17th * * Non-Lethal Sneak Attack +3d6
18th * * Intuition
19th *
20th * *Non-Lethal Sneak Attack +4d6, Dodge Bonus +4, Marshal’s Skills +5

Class Features
All of the following are class features of the unarmored fighter.
Weapon and Armor Proficiency: An unarmored fighter is proficient with all simple and martial weapons but with no armor and no shields.

Unarmored Defense (Ex): When not wearing armor or using a shield, an unarmored fighter adds his Intelligence bonus (if any) to her Dexterity bonus to modify Armor Class while wielding a melee weapon. If an unarmored fighter is caught flat-footed or otherwise denied her Dexterity bonus, she also loses this bonus. *This ability does not stack with any other ability that gives an intelligence bonus to Armor Class.

Uncanny Dodge (Ex): At 2nd level, an unarmored fighter retains his Dexterity bonus to AC (if any) even if he is caught flat-footed or struck by an invisible attacker. However, he still loses his Dexterity bonus to AC if immobilized. If an unarmored fighter already has uncanny dodge from a different class, he automatically gains improved uncanny dodge (see below) instead.

Non-Lethal attack (Ex): At third level, the unarmored fighter gains the ability to deal non-lethal damage with a weapon without the normal -4 penalty. This ability is identical to the Justicar’s ability.

Marshal’s Skills (Ex): At fourth level, the unarmored fighter gains a plus one bonus to certain uses of skills. He gain the bonus when using disguise or bluff to conceal his identity, and to gather information checks to obtain information about criminals. This bonus improves by one every four levels afterwards. *

Dodge Bonus (Ex): At 5th level, the unarmored fighter gains access to the dodge bonus class feature of the swashbuckler. This feature improves at the same levels as the swashbuckler’s class feature. Alternately, the unarmored fighter can take the shield of blades alternate class feature from the PHBII. Once the unarmored fighter has chosen between the two abilities, he can never reverse his decision. *

Improved Uncanny Dodge (Ex): At 6th level and higher, an unarmored fighter can no longer be flanked. This defense denies a rogue the ability to sneak attack the unarmored fighter by flanking him, unless the attacker has at least four more rogue levels than the target has unarmored fighter levels. If a character already has uncanny dodge (see above) from a second class, the character automatically gains improved uncanny dodge instead, and the levels from the classes that grant uncanny dodge stack to determine the minimum level a rogue must be to flank the character.

Non-Lethal Sneak Attack: The unarmored fighter gains the ability to deal nonlethal sneak attack damage at 8th level, and every three levels thereafter. Otherwise, the ability is identical to the Justicar class feature.

Intuition (Ex): At level 18, the unarmored fighter gains the ability to locate criminals, as the Justicar ability.

Abd al-Azrad
2006-07-03, 02:50 PM
Isn't this character class just a mix of the Swashbuckler and Duelist classes with none of their high-level abilities? I'd suggest giving this class some serious boosts to either offensive or defensive ability beyond a few bonus feats, otherwise it's somewhat redundant of those classes and their abilities. It has some pretty solid, versatile abilities so far, but I think you just need to take it further.

Also, the name Marshal is taken (Miniatures handbook, a base class that uses Charisma based abilities to give bonuses to allies).

Overlord
2006-07-03, 03:30 PM
Yes, I am aware that the name Marshal is taken, that's exactly why I didn't want to name it that. As I stated at the beginning of the post, I kept the class general even though I wanted to give the class an undercover police feel. The main reason I made this class is because the Swashbuckler is a light armor wearing class, while I wanted to make the class into an unarmored class. Plus, many of the acrobatic abilities didn't fit my flavor.

I'm not sure about high level abilities. I can see that it needs them, I just can't think of any that would fit the idea of an undercover warrior working for his government, nation, or lord. I would appreciate any ideas for abilities, though.

Abd al-Azrad
2006-07-03, 03:36 PM
Hmm... Do you have access to UA? Urban Tracking is a must for a plainclothes cop, and I'd almost consider giving him some form of Sneak Attack- or at least a subduing strike that acts as a subdual Sneak Attack.

Needs Hide and Move Silently as class skills.

Perhaps some form of Undetectable Alignment ability would work well with this sort of class- a Detect Law or Good could really screw up an infiltration mission.

Overlord
2006-07-03, 03:42 PM
I don't have UA, but I beleive that most of that is in the d20srd.org site.

I considered a Subdual Sneak Attack, but I wasn't sure if that would be such a good idea for balance...

I'll add hide and move silently as class skills, and increase the skills to 6 per level, then.

*edit* --- Okay then, fixed the skills... I'll lok into sneak attack and undetectable alignment.

Meat Shield
2006-07-03, 03:43 PM
I'm not sure about high level abilities. I can see that it needs them, I just can't think of any that would fit the idea of an undercover warrior working for his government, nation, or lord. I would appreciate any ideas for abilities, though.
OK, ideas for a high-level undercover agent. Sounds like you want James Bond. Maybe call him an Agent instead of Marshall?

Possible ideas:
- Use Magic Device, Knowledge(Nobility) as class skills
- Investigator as a free feat
- Decietful as a free feat
- Persuasive as a free feat
- Nimble Fingers as a free feat
- A low-powered sneak attack at higher levels
- I think there is a feat allowing coup de grace as a standard action instead of a full round action, that would work

Think of the Bond movies, the Bourne Identity movies, etc for ideas.

EDIT: Knowledge(Nobility) would work for me in the sense that many times the infiltration would be in noble houses or powerful organizations in the governments, as well as knowing that Baron von Blood comes from a long line of cruel people...

Overlord
2006-07-03, 03:46 PM
I was thinking that the class would be less of a spy and something more like a modern undercover police officer. He would go on S.W.A.T. style raids, but would also, police the streets while undercover. Does that make more sense?

Meat Shield
2006-07-03, 03:51 PM
Hm. OK.

Investigator stays, same with Persuasive.

Maybe add Toughness or Great Fortitude? Undercover guys need to be tough since they operate solo. Same reasoning for Self-Sufficient.

I think a sneak attack at higher levels is OK, say +1d6 starting at 8th level, increasing every three levels? Same rules as normal sneak attack apply. Good characters only do subdual, evil only real damage, neutral either.

Bob_the_Mighty
2006-07-03, 03:52 PM
Souldn't Canny Defense add 1 point of intelligence bonus per class level, instead of just 1 point?

Also, I think that Forgery is a skill. If it is, it's almost required as a class skill for infiltration. You could also add some class features similar to those of the Spymaster/Vigilante for Song and Silence, like Punish the Guilty.

Overlord
2006-07-03, 03:59 PM
Alright, I replaced the feats with sneak attack. I might want to change them to only do subdual damage later, but I'll leave it as normal sneak attack for now.

As I had said before, these guys are not spys. They won't be doing anything that would require them to forge something. If they're doing undercover work, and need forged papers, their superiors can have experts arrange papers for them.

This canny defense ability is not the same as a duelists; I just decided to give it the same name to discourage the idea of stacking the two bonuses if a character takes levels in both this class and in the duelist prestige class.

Bob_the_Mighty
2006-07-03, 04:06 PM
As I had said before, these guys are not spys. They won't be doing anything that would require them to forge something. If they're doing undercover work, and need forged papers, their superiors can have experts arrange papers for themYes, I saw that, but I was typeing my post and looking for/through Song and Silence. Some of the Spymaster's class features could still be useful, though.


This canny defense ability is not the same as a duelists; I just decided to give it the same name to discourage the idea of stacking the two bonuses if a character takes levels in both this class and in the duelist prestige class.I see, but that seems a little underpowered.

Also, I don't know what the Dodge Bonus class feature of the Swashbucker is, so I geuss I really don't know if the class is underpowered or not.

Abd al-Azrad
2006-07-03, 04:09 PM
This canny defense ability is not the same as a duelists; I just decided to give it the same name to discourage the idea of stacking the two bonuses if a character takes levels in both this class and in the duelist prestige class.

*wince* If the two abilities have the same name, they should be the same ability. This is not Canny Defense. Give these guys a differently named ability that states specifically that it gives a maximum of +1 to AC, like this one, and say that other abilities that mimic it, like Canny Defense and Bladesong Style, overlap this ability.

And as for your plainclothes cop, you're right, they shouldn't have many infiltration skills. I wanted them to have Hide mostly for tracking in crowds (as listed in CAd, I think) and they badly need skills like Spot and Listen for their profession. They don't really need Move Silently, or Tumble, and I'd say they should only get 4 skills/level- after all, they're not skill specialists, they're undercover city guards.

I'm not really sure these guys should be focused on self-sufficiency. Being a good fighter is helpful, but town guards tend to only work really well in large groups, where they can surround, disarm, and beat the crap out of offenders. As such, the Sneak Attack ability works well, as would Improved Trip/Disarm, as would some sort of Improved Flanking/Teamwork ability where they get +3 or +4 for flanking/aiding. Maybe an ability that they gain the bonuses of flanking to their Trip/Disarm attempts?

Overlord
2006-07-03, 04:17 PM
Alright, I took Abd al-Azrad's suggestion and adjusted the skills. I'll rename Canny defense to something else later. How do the other changes look?

By the way, thanks for the advice everyone. It's been very helpful.

Abd al-Azrad
2006-07-03, 04:26 PM
Hmm... I was looking over the current class, and it's working pretty well, but there's a stretch of two levels (18-19) where it gains no abilities. Granted, you get a regular feat at 18th, but I was wondering if it should have an ability at 19th to help tide the class over to 20th. My suggestion was the Bonus Feat: Staggering Strike from CAd (on a successful sneak attack, target makes a Fort save DC=damage dealt or become staggered for a round), or some similar ability.

Overlord
2006-07-03, 04:35 PM
Hmm. A feat... How about Steadfast Determination, from the PHBII? I'd give the feat as a bonus feat without needing the prerequisite, Endurance. Do you think that would be useful and balanced?

Edit: How about Insightful Reflexes or Dange Sense?

2nd Edit: Okay, While I was changing the name for the Canny defense ability, I realized that I had misworded the ability so that it stated that it only gave a +1 bonus to armor class. It was my intention to give the class the character's entire intelligence bonus to armor class. I changed this to reflect that.

Bob_the_Mighty
2006-07-03, 05:05 PM
2nd Edit: Okay, While I was changing the name for the Canny defense ability, I realized that I had misworded the ability so that it stated that it only gave a +1 bonus to armor class. It was my intention to give the class the character's entire intelligence bonus to armor class. I change this to reflect that.I tried to point that out and said that you should change it to something like that.

Overlord
2006-07-03, 05:23 PM
Ah, I'm sorry then. I thought that you meant 1 point for every class level that he had (20 points to armor class). Thanks, Bob.

Hey, I'm a dwarf now! Woohoo!

*edit*: Alright. I added the intuition ability at level 18. Is this balanced now? If I don't get anymore replies in a few days or so, I'll just assume it's balanced. Thanks to everyone who helped me with the class! ;)

Overlord
2006-07-04, 05:52 PM
Okay, I guess this is finished, since I haven't gotten anymore replies in a while, and this a at the second page. Thanks to everyone who helped!

SlyJohnny
2006-07-04, 06:56 PM
Wow, that's actually pretty good. Potentially extremely useful, but not over-powered, and requires sacrifice of fighter bonus feats, and he'll quite rightly never be as well armored as someone decked out in... y'know... armor.

Kudos!

Overlord
2006-07-04, 07:22 PM
Wow, that's actually pretty good. Potentially extremely useful, but not over-powered, and requires sacrifice of fighter bonus feats, and he'll quite rightly never be as well armored as someone decked out in... y'know... armor.

Kudos!

Thanks! I thought I had unbalanced the class somewhere along the line, but maybe not after all. I'm glad you like it! ;)

Bob_the_Mighty
2006-07-06, 01:49 AM
Ah, I'm sorry then. I thought that you meant 1 point for every class level that he had (20 points to armor class). Thanks, Bob.

Hey, I'm a dwarf now! Woohoo!

*edit*: Alright. I added the intuition ability at level 18. Is this balanced now? If I don't get anymore replies in a few days or so, I'll just assume it's balanced. Thanks to everyone who helped me with the class! *;)Oh, sorry. This is kinda late, but I just meant that he got 1 point from his intelligence modifier per class level added to AC, up to a maximum of his entire intelligence modifier.

Also, this is a nice class. I think I'll have to try it out.

Ikkitosen
2006-07-06, 04:16 AM
I'd agree with giving forgery as a class skill, not because he needs to forge things himself but because being able to spot a forgery would be useful in his line of work.

I also think it's a nice class, very good for an urban campaign.

Overlord
2006-07-06, 03:48 PM
Thanks Bob and Ikkitosen! ;) I'm glad you like the class. I'll add Forgery as a class skill; I forgot that it was used to detect forgerys, not sense motive as I originally thought. Good idea Ikkitosen. :)

Closet_Skeleton
2006-07-06, 05:35 PM
Hmm... I was looking over the current class, and it's working pretty well, but there's a stretch of two levels (18-19) where it gains no abilities.

Look at the fighter, the bard, the cleric, do they need to get an abillity every level? I hated how the Complete book classes are all like "oh look, play as one of us, we get an ability at every level". Bah.

Actually, I can see why you'd think that was a gaping whole in the level chart, but balance and "purely for the chart to look good" are by no means the same thing. I was going to say sneak attack was off but then I read the description at the top. The name is a bit confusing as they make me think of a generic unarmoured fighter when actually you have a very specific concept for this class.

Overlord
2006-07-06, 11:04 PM
Yes, I considered changing the name, but I figured that the dungeon master would decide what the class would be called in his campaign. The name for the profession would also change from nation to nation in a campaign, most likely. Originally I was going to leave this as a general class, but I later adjusted the class to suit the concept.