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View Full Version : Dextrous Parry and Insightful Parry



Goff
2006-03-21, 09:54 PM
Alright, to start with I'd like to say that I'm aware that there is some array of parry feats somewhere out there, however since I had no idea where to find them, I had a crack at my own parry feats.

I originally got this idea from playing Neverwinter Nights, where I liked the idea of having a parry skill, but I thought it was a bit specific to warrant the cost. So I instead decided that a parry feat that could rely upon slight of hand.

Dextrous Parry
Through honing your reflexes, you have trained yourself to defend with your blade and make attacks off your back foot.
Prerequisites: Base attack bonus +3, Dexterity 13, Sleight of Hand 5 ranks.
Benefit: When taking the total defence action, once per round, after an adjacent opponent makes an unsuccessful melee attack on you, you may attempt to riposte the attack. You must first make a slight of hand check DC your opponents last attack, if successful, you may make a single attack at full base attack bonus against that opponant. You may sacrifice your riposte to make a feint attempt on your opponent.
Special: Having 5 ranks in spot provides a +2 synergy bonus on parry checks.

Well at this point a friend of mine suggested that perhaps sense motive would perhaps be just as viable a skill for this feat, so...

Insightful Parry
Through study of your opponants actions, you have trained yourself to pick where his blade will fall, and what openings he will make.
Prerequisites: Base attack bonus +3, Dexterity 13, Sense Motive 5 ranks.
Benefit: When taking the total defence action, once per round, after an adjacent opponent makes an unsuccessful melee attack on you, you may attempt to riposte the attack. You must first make a sense motive check DC your opponents last attack, if successful, you may make a single attack at full attack bonus against that opponant. You may sacrifice your riposte to make a feint attempt on your opponent.
Special: Having 5 ranks in spot provides a +2 synergy bonus on parry checks.

So, the question is; it it balanced? Does it sound like a viable feat?

That Lanky Bugger
2006-03-21, 10:08 PM
I like them. Gives a bit more use for Sleight of Hand and Sense Motive, and it's fairly balanced to boot. I'd even go so far as to maybe allow this to be used as many times as you have Combat Reflexes, just like an Attack of Opportunity.

Goff
2006-03-21, 10:19 PM
That's a good idea, I'll have to work combat reflexes into the wording.

Typo fixed

Catch
2006-03-21, 10:42 PM
Let me make sure I'm getting this right. For Sleight of Hand/Sense Motive check, the DC is equal to your opponent's failed attack roll? Or total attack bonus?

Goff
2006-03-21, 10:46 PM
The failed attack roll was the idea, sorry about that, the wording came out a little awkward.
Edit
That is the total of the failed attack roll, including attack modifiers such as BAB, masterwork/magic weapons etc.

Amotis
2006-03-21, 10:57 PM
I read Party instead of Parry for the title and as I clicked on the link I was thinking...hmmm a party that reacts fast or one that has access to divination and such and doesn't have to...hmmm
Needless to say you made me think on a topic totally not yours. :P

tgva8889
2006-03-22, 02:04 AM
Could you make one of these for other skills? Bluff seems like it might work as well. Not sure about an intelligence-based skill, but Bluff seems good, and I love Bluff anyways. I mean, you bluff your opponent to dodge their attack and smack them in the face.

Otherwise, awesome feats, and awesome feat ideas. An Intelligence-based check seems like it would make sense.

Ing
2006-03-22, 03:01 AM
anyone hear of a feat called agile repose. i coulda sworn for the longest time it was a feat (so many people even had it in the first campaign i was in). basicly it allowed an AoO option if an opponent missed (ou can't excede your allowed AoO of course) any word?

gnownek
2006-03-22, 03:10 AM
A high level rogue on full defense can still make attacks with the Opportunist special ability.

Don't this fit?

hyenahyena
2006-03-22, 03:26 AM
wow, thats gorgeous actually. I especially love insightful parry. Its about time someone made better use of the sense motive check!
Curiously, ive been detailing feats for a new game im designing, one of the new feats involves sense motive in terms of anticipating defence, and reading your oponents stance, movements etc.

A+ : )

Dhavaer
2006-03-22, 03:31 AM
anyone hear of a feat called agile repose. *i coulda sworn for the longest time it was a feat (so many people even had it in the first campaign i was in). *basicly it allowed an AoO option if an opponent missed (ou can't excede your allowed AoO of course) any word?

D20 Modern has it as a feat. The prereq is Dodge, and you can only make the AoO on the opponent you have Dodge against.

gnownek
2006-03-22, 07:49 AM
Try looking for the feat list on www.crystalkeep.d20.
There is something similar but not linked to skills.

Its called defensive strike. You take Total Defense. If he misses, next round you have +4 vs that opponent.

Yuki Akuma
2006-03-22, 07:52 AM
You know, there's a reason Neverwinter Nights has a parry skill... The Aurora Engine doesn't use the Full Defense rules. That's it. You don't need them. Just use Full Defense if you're not gonna attack.

gnownek
2006-03-22, 08:22 AM
Sense Motive - is pretty useful to resist bluff already. Shouldn't make it too Good.

Sleight of Hand is very useless (besides hiding weapons and Quick Draw) and deserves a feat.

Why not add a Fighting Style Feat...

1. Use Sleight Of Hand to Feint in place of your Bluff Skill when using a light weapon. The Feint counts as a move action.

Wih
2006-03-22, 08:39 AM
If you're looking for a parrying feat chain, there's a very nice one already out in the book Ultimate Feats.
I believe the feat 'Parry' requires DEX and INT 13, +3 BAB and Combat Expertise. It lets you hold part of your attacks in a round, and then you can use them to counter other attacks made on you. If you beat their attack roll, the attack misses you.
The feat 'Riposte' makes it so once per round you could make an attack at your highest BAB on one opponent you successfully parried, required +6 BAB, and Parry. (You couldn't get extra attacks off this one, ie from Cleave).
There was also a nasty feat that also required Improved Sunder that made it so all your successful parry attempts counted as sunders against the weapon it strikes...which was nasty when you gave it to a character weilding an adamantium Bastard Sword or a Fullblade.

Goff
2006-03-22, 09:01 AM
tgva8889: I can't think of any INT based skills that would justify parrying off the top of my head. As for bluff, I think that feinting more or less covers that skills use in combat. I do agree though that perhaps an INT based parry could work. Thanks for the encouragement.

gnownek: I don't think that this would apply to the opportunist feat, however, I am rather tired and might give it some proper thought later. Also, the reason I created this feat was because I liked the idea of a skill to help parrying, thanks all the same for the feat link.

Yuki Akuma: I am quite aware of the fact *that the Aurora Engine didn't allow for total defence. However this was simply the inspiration, the whole idea of taking this feat is to attack off of the back foot, not some revival of Neverwinter skills.

Wih: Thanks for the brief on the feat chains available, I'll give them a look. However, I am still quite fond of having a link between parrying and skills.

That Lanky Bugger and hyenahyena: Thanks for the encouragement, I hope somebody outside of my game gets some use of these feats.

Orson_McNichol
2006-03-22, 09:33 AM
I would increase the required DEX score to at least 15. A score of 13 is too easy to come accross, it makes it seem as though these parrys can be done by anyone rather than highly skilled combatants.

Wih
2006-03-23, 08:27 AM
I would increase the required DEX score to at least 15. A score of 13 is too easy to come accross, it makes it seem as though these parrys can be done by anyone rather than highly skilled combatants.

Do remember that a score of 13 is actually a very good score for an average human. I believe 12 is above average, 14 is exception, and 16 is the equivalent of an olympic gold medalist/genius.
Maybe make being able to parry a 13, being able to parry more than once per round a 15, and being able to riposte off a parry a 17, or something similar.

Donsic
2006-03-23, 10:48 AM
Do remember that a score of 13 is actually a very good score for an average human. I believe 12 is above average, 14 is exception, and 16 is the equivalent of an olympic gold medalist/genius.
Maybe make being able to parry a 13, being able to parry more than once per round a 15, and being able to riposte off a parry a 17, or something similar.

I think the feats are good the way they are. Doing that would only make them needlessly complex. I'm seeing it to take advantage of this feat you have to roll slieght of hand/ sense motive againts a failed roll and break their AC and be in total deffense and have AoOs left. The feats are already a little complex and relies on alot of variables. I wouldn't make the feats harder to use.

Macrovore
2006-11-07, 10:31 PM
D20 Modern has it as a feat. The prereq is Dodge, and you can only make the AoO on the opponent you have Dodge against.
the feat, in DND3.5 format is here:
http://realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Agile_Riposte,Dragon