View Full Version : [3.5] Eternal Wand of Heroics?

2009-06-12, 03:18 AM
As far as I can tell, this is all legal, just very cheesy. I'd like your opinions.
(If I missed something and it isn't legal, I'd really like to know.)

1) Make a character.
2) Give him at least one level of Swordsage [ToB].
3) Later, give him a level of Assassin/Avenger. (You cast arcane spells now!) (Alternatively, pump up UMD, or take a level of another spellcasting class.)
4) Buy an Eternal Wand [MIC 159] of Heroics [SpC 113] (4'420 gp). With it, you you may gain the benefit for any fighter bonus feat(s) you qualify for, twice per day for 30 minutes.

A fighter can take the feats Martial Stance and Martial Study [ToB] as bonus feats.

You can gain any stance in a discipline you have a maneuver in (that you meet the IL for), and any maneuver in any discipline (again, that you meet the IL for), twice... for 30 minutes... every day.
(Of course, you could also gain from other sweet fighter bonus feats, like Improved Init, Blind-Fight or what-have-you.)

Is... is that right? Does that actually work? If you were DM, would you allow it to work?

I ask because I'm trying to throw together a TWF whisper gnome rogue/swashbuckler/swordsage (mostly for fun; I don't have a gaming group) and this would be sweet. I'd feel a bit bad for exploiting the rules like this, but... ooooooh, the versatility.

EDIT: I should add, I'm not actually looking for character optimization hints. Really. I just want other people's take on the idea of "free fighter feats and martial stances on the fly".

2009-06-12, 03:50 AM
It's legal. I'm pretty sure no decent DM would care, unless he/she doesn't like some cheap device replacing the Fighter's only signature feature. Giving other classes like the Rogue some versatility from ToB's maneuver is fairly reasonable to me. Sidenote, It's one of my fav spells to add into wand form. Though with UMD makes taking a 1st-level caster dip irrelevant with enough ranks & bonuses to it.

2009-06-12, 11:54 AM
Is... is that right? Does that actually work? If you were DM, would you allow it to work?

Yes and yes.

It really won't break anything in the game. Two half hours per day isn't all that much, unless you're only getting in two battles per day. (In which case we need to worry more about how scary spellcasters are when they can freely "go nova."

Besides, IMHO it makes sense fluff-wise to have access to such wands, which bless their targets with some kind of generic "temporarily learn some cool fighting trick" spell.

2009-06-12, 12:18 PM
IIRC, you have to meet the initiator level. And non-martial classes (like the Assassin) only count for half a level. So it's relatively balanced. It just lets you snag maneuvers you would miss from the other disciples (like Devoted Spirit).

2009-06-12, 12:21 PM
Whoops, ninja'd by the OP on the IL. Sorry.

2009-06-12, 02:37 PM
For a similar trick, Chameleon PRC from races of Destiny has a floating feat that can be selected every day. 2 levels of Chameleon on your Swordsage will let you pick strikes or stances for a whole day. (You can still use the wand for another one if you want).

2009-06-13, 09:00 PM
Thanks for the replies. It's comforting to know I'm not the first one to try this.

I have a follow-up question: what are the best Fighter feats to use (specifically for a low-Str TWF sneak-attacker)?

The ones I have so far are Blind Fight, Two-Weapon Pounce, ITWF, Improved Initiative (for when you know something's coming soon but don't know quite when), Martial Stance and Martial Study (obviously), Rapid Reload, Subduing Strike (nonlethal sneak attack? Yes!)... and that's all I got.

Are there any I've missed that you think aren't worth missing?

(I realize that now I am asking for optimization hints. Please disregard my earlier comment. :smallsmile:)