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Erts
2009-06-26, 01:10 AM
Right, the old thread was closed down, due to a variety of jokes and insults.
I asked to put up this thread, and was allowed to. However, before I go on, I shall say DO NOT SAY ANYTHING INSULTING. PLEASE. Even if you do not feel it is offensive to Mr. Jackson himself. This thread is for, well, mourning in a sense, not joke telling. If it deals with other topics, say, Beatles song rights, scheduled concerts, feel free to talk about it. But please, no insults, no matter your feelings on it.

To those who have not heard yet, performer, musician, dancer, and entertainer Michael Jackson was pronounced dead at 2:26 June 25th, 2009, at UCLA medical center.

Rutskarn
2009-06-26, 01:12 AM
You know, while I can't say that I feel much at his passing, I can appreciate that this guy had a tremendously, uniformly, needlessly tragic life.

I don't think he deserved, or did anything to deserve, much of the ridicule he courted later in life.

Serpentine
2009-06-26, 01:13 AM
Tragic passing of a tragic figure...

Oregano
2009-06-26, 01:32 AM
I think the worst thing is that he had to die now. He'd had his life destroyed by the media and was ridiculed and tormented for things he hadn't done(if the case was correct) so then in 2009 when he's deciding to get back on his feet and carry on he plans a comeback concert and plans for a new videogame and that's when he goes.:smallfrown:

Yarram
2009-06-26, 01:36 AM
His music was hella good... :smallfrown:

Killer Angel
2009-06-26, 01:49 AM
I've never liked too much his music, but he was a giant

Rockphed
2009-06-26, 02:01 AM
I've never liked too much his music, but he was a giant

I found that I either loved his music or hated it. The love or hate was on a piece by piece basis. I hope he is experiencing less torment at the hands of journalists in the hereafter.

J.B. Ganning
2009-06-26, 02:07 AM
You know, while I can't say that I feel much at his passing, I can appreciate that this guy had a tremendously, uniformly, needlessly tragic life.

I don't think he deserved, or did anything to deserve, much of the ridicule he courted later in life.

This just about sums up my thoughts on the matter.

I enjoyed his earlier pieces, including one or two of his songs from his time in the Jackson Five. The fact that he's spent his entire life on a stage, and it being the only thing he could really connect with sorta makes you feel bad.

The man was a legend. Now, I prefer the "celebration of life" fashion of mourning, so why should be be all down and out of it, man? He was a great man! His life, though lonely, was full of wonder and excitement! I'd be ashamed of any person who could unjustly hate Michael! Sure, he was a bit eccentric, and his plastic surgeries went bad after the accident onstage, but that didn't really stop him, now did it? He was dedicated to his craft. Even after years of ridicule, hatred, and even being chased out of his home country, he wanted to start again! I'm sorry to say he didn't get that wish. But now we can rest assured that he's found Neverland, and there he'll never be lonely again.

cnsvnc
2009-06-26, 02:12 AM
He was awesome back in his day. I care nothing what's happened since then, he'll always be the King of Pop.

skywalker
2009-06-26, 02:24 AM
You know, while I can't say that I feel much at his passing, I can appreciate that this guy had a tremendously, uniformly, needlessly tragic life.

These were my thoughts exactly, however:


I don't think he deserved, or did anything to deserve, much of the ridicule he courted later in life.

I don't understand how you can say he courted something, but did not deserve it?


I hope he is experiencing less torment at the hands of journalists in the hereafter.


But now we can rest assured that he's found Neverland, and there he'll never be lonely again.

No-one's passing has ever made me more curious about the hereafter, and what it brings. Some people, I hear about them dying, and I can imagine exactly the afterlife I think they deserve. Not so with this man. I can't even begin to contemplate it.

J.B. Ganning
2009-06-26, 02:27 AM
No-one's passing has ever made me more curious about the hereafter, and what it brings. Some people, I hear about them dying, and I can imagine exactly the afterlife I think they deserve. Not so with this man. I can't even begin to contemplate it.

Take what you want from it. I'm not a religious man, but I feel he deserves an afterlife.

banjo1985
2009-06-26, 03:11 AM
RIP Michael Jackson. You will be missed for your music back in your peak if nothing else.

bloodlover
2009-06-26, 03:41 AM
RIP MJ . Your music will live forever QQ

Avilan the Grey
2009-06-26, 03:57 AM
RIP.

I am one of those who, although not born when he started, prefer the younger "version", the super talent. Basically, to me, Thriller was both his peak, the end of his career and the end of my personal interest in him.

That said he influenced a lot of people and deserve a dignified sendoff.

Again, RIP.

marquiz
2009-06-26, 04:47 AM
I will miss his music and dance. No matter what, he was one of the better influences on my younger days musical entertainment.

Kobold-Bard
2009-06-26, 07:05 AM
All other things aside, he was a musical icon and will remain the inspiration for musicians for years to come.

Agreed that it's a shame that this happened at a time when he was showing signs of recovering.

I'm going to go listen to Dirty Diana, my personal favourite song of his.

R.I.P Michael Jackson.

Fastmover
2009-06-26, 07:31 AM
Man when I found out I fought back tears for nearly a half hour...

Winterwind
2009-06-26, 07:40 AM
Back in my childhood, he was one of the biggest stars there were. As in, not just slightly more famous, but a really shining figure that stood out in front of all the others. And his music was great, too.

It's truly tragic how the rest of his life turned out.

At least he will have his peace now. :smallfrown:

Zeta Kai
2009-06-26, 07:48 AM
I find it interesting that MJ is getting much more respect & admiration in the hours after his passing than he did in the last (read: worst) 15 years of his life. Where was all this sentiment & support when he really needed it?

Dihan
2009-06-26, 07:49 AM
I had to do a double-take when I first found out. He's one of those people who have so much fame that I can't imagine them being dead (unless they were dead before my time).

My mum described it as the latest "Elvis Presley" death.

I'm not necessarily a fan of him but I appreciate that others are. RIP Michael Jackson.

I do find it ironic that he had just announced that he was selling more tickets for concerts in the UK.

Oregano
2009-06-26, 07:55 AM
I find it interesting that MJ is getting much more respect & admiration in the hours after his passing than he did in the last (read: worst) 15 years of his life. Where was all this sentiment & support when he really needed it?

It's the way the media works, I've never been a fan of his really but I always felt sorry for him the way everyone ridiculed him and what he was accused of. Poor guy.:smallfrown:

The_Firenail
2009-06-26, 08:38 AM
His music was phenominal. But not only has music was teriffic, but his music videos were incredible. Especially Thriller, it's practically one of the best, if not the best. According to Guinness World Records, there were over 100 million sales of Thriller, making the biggest-selling album ever, and hopefully still will be.

So long, Michael, you will be missed. Hopefully this afternoon's autopsy will clear things up about your condition.

Erts
2009-06-26, 09:15 AM
It's the way the media works, I've never been a fan of his really but I always felt sorry for him the way everyone ridiculed him and what he was accused of. Poor guy.:smallfrown:

I actually did not like his later stuff, even if it was what I grew up with. Thats why I prefer to remember, right now, his best parts.

Agamid
2009-06-26, 09:32 AM
RIP you amazing, amazing artist.

V'icternus
2009-06-26, 09:33 AM
He was one of those people you never thought would die...

Like Steve Irwin. We all knew that was a dangerous business, but I never really accepted that he could die, because he was the Crocodile Hunter...

And now, M.J. himself is gone, and the world of music is a little darker already...

...I'm gonna go have a night of listening to his greatest hits according to me now... just to remember how great he was, and how much he deserved that comeback tour...

The Blackbird
2009-06-26, 09:47 AM
He was awesome back in his day. I care nothing what's happened since then, he'll always be the King of Pop.

I like this, thats pretty much how I feel.

Llama231
2009-06-26, 09:59 AM
I find it interesting that MJ is getting much more respect & admiration in the hours after his passing than he did in the last (read: worst) 15 years of his life. Where was all this sentiment & support when he really needed it?

That's the way life works. You die, people like you. Lincoln, Kennedy, King, that one Joker guy practically made the movie famous. I had a theory that MJ would die and people would like him, and that Bush would be assassinated, and he would be considered the best president.

Anyway, to say something good, that guy had his stuff sell the most (Thriler). And I don't even listen to music.

factotum
2009-06-26, 10:40 AM
Kind of sad that he never really had a proper life. Yes, he spent 50 years on this earth, but did he live for any of it? One wonders if he could have put his life back together and really lived for a change, but guess we'll never know now.

KataraAltinaII
2009-06-26, 11:02 AM
That's the way life works. You die, people like you. Lincoln, Kennedy, King, that one Joker guy practically made the movie famous. I had a theory that MJ would die and people would like him, and that Bush would be assassinated, and he would be considered the best president.

Anyway, to say something good, that guy had his stuff sell the most (Thriler). And I don't even listen to music.

that's exactly how life works. Heck, even Smash Bros nerds were like that when they learned their favorite characters didn't make it into Brawl, but that's beside the point.

it's the same analogy as the guy who hates his mom, and the next day his mom dies, and then he's all sad and realizes everything she did for him.

"people never quite appreciate things until they're gone".

me personally, there's a few things I could say, but this ain't the place. All in all, he had a little bit of good music, which I might hear when I go into work today if the radio is on like it should be.

But when it all boils down, to me, he was just like the next guy. A person is a person, regardless of how people choose to glorify or demean them. Random Shmuck off the streets #59 to me is equivalent to Barack Obama. if either one died, I'd be all "oh. alright."

why? because of one crucial factor--I've never met either in real life.
Heath Ledger and Steve Irwin were two of my "heroes", but even at their passings, I pretty much just shrugged and moved on with life. it's jsut the way I am.

So yeh. there's a few things I liked about him, but all in all, this is not really going to affect me in the slightest, other than I might sometimes randomly think "hey, Michael Jackson is dead."

skywalker
2009-06-26, 12:25 PM
It's the way the media works, I've never been a fan of his really but I always felt sorry for him the way everyone ridiculed him and what he was accused of. Poor guy.:smallfrown:

I find it sad how broken he was. I never realized that before, or how absolutely sleazy the people accusing him of wrongdoing were. I felt very sad for him indeed when I dug a little bit.

He's probably thru suffering, tho. That's a positive indeed.

Fredthefighter
2009-06-26, 12:29 PM
RIP Michael Jackson. You will be missed for your music back in your peak if nothing else.

My thoughts exactly.

Rutskarn
2009-06-26, 12:30 PM
I don't understand how you can say he courted something, but did not deserve it?


I didn't say he courted anything.

Fifty-Eyed Fred
2009-06-26, 01:37 PM
What a thoroughly ironic death. Just about to do his big comeback tour in the UK and he goes and pops his clogs. Shame, really, I'd wanted to see him.

He's having an autopsy? Maybe they'll reveal what the hell happened to turn him white...

EvilDMMk3
2009-06-26, 02:55 PM
1) He is having one and
2) He has said, time and again and again and again and again that he suffers from Vitiligo (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitiligo)

Seraph
2009-06-26, 03:09 PM
He's having an autopsy? Maybe they'll reveal what the hell happened to turn him white...

It's been public knowledge and documented medical fact for over a decade that MJ suffered from a combination of Vitiligo and Lupus. Anyone who denied that isn't merely spreading rumours, they're denying reality in favor of scandal.

Linkavitch
2009-06-26, 03:37 PM
I don't really care about his music, but I mean, WOW! For the past twenty-four hours, nobody on the news has been talking about anything else, and one report said his music and paraphernalia is suddenly getting something like a 700,000% to 700,000,000% percent increase in purchases, downloads, ect. I don't think Elvis made that much when he died.

Erloas
2009-06-26, 03:48 PM
So how long does everyone think we have until we get a new album from him? I give it 2 months at the most. All those "lost" songs that no one ever knows about until the artist dies, that sort of thing.

EvilDMMk3
2009-06-26, 03:55 PM
I did find it annoying that the 6 o'clock news on the BBC devoted 18 or its 30 minutes to the death however. First 15 minutes at the start and then the last 3 minutes at the end.

Guru
2009-06-26, 03:55 PM
Grrr, another MJ thread.

Yes, his music will be missed.

Zeta Kai
2009-06-26, 04:24 PM
Yeah, the 80's station in town has been doing a marathon of MJ songs all day. Good stuff.

JonestheSpy
2009-06-26, 04:43 PM
What a thoroughly ironic death. Just about to do his big comeback tour in the UK and he goes and pops his clogs. Shame, really, I'd wanted to see him.



You might not have anyway. Apparently he was not showing up for rehearsals and behaving really erratically in general.

I was never a huge fan, but I certainly recognized that he had a lot of talent, and it showed early. I've seen a lot of people blaming the media, but really, he physically and mentally abused (and possibly sexually) by his father and others throughout his childhood, and it's pretty obvious he was messed the hell up from the get go. He produced some work that totally changed pop music despite these burdens, but clearly just couldn't stay sane. I'm sure the media didn't help, but lots of people have dealt with such situations without retreating into some twisted fantasy of "Neverland"" to retreat into, y'know?

This is one of those times when the wish "Rest In Peace" is especially appropriate.

EvilDMMk3
2009-06-26, 05:59 PM
And now they can't find his doctor apparently.

This is looking worrying.

bladedSmoke
2009-06-26, 06:09 PM
And now they can't find his doctor apparently.

This is looking worrying.

...Wait, what? You have just sparked off a billion conspiracy theories in my head. What do you mean, they can't find his doctor? :smalleek:

EvilDMMk3
2009-06-26, 06:24 PM
...Wait, what? You have just sparked off a billion conspiracy theories in my head. What do you mean, they can't find his doctor? :smalleek:I mean that, according to unconfirmed reports the BBC has picked up on, the police can not contact Michel Jackson's personal physician.

bladedSmoke
2009-06-26, 06:27 PM
...Ominous.

Arachu
2009-06-27, 11:44 AM
You know... I, like many people, have thought for the longest time that Michael was a monster.

Until yesterday. An alarm had tripped in my mind, and I scoured the 'net on everything that man was accused of.

That scandal he was accused of (which shall not be named by me) was chronologically impossible. He and the accuser were never in the same room alone. Or ever, were they alone without the lad's parents.

That, and his wan skin was not cosmetic; it was an actual skin condition (which I've actually seen before).

After learning these things (and his childhood, which nicely explains why he cared about children so much), I felt like a complete jackass for all the things I had said about him. I will for the rest of my days, when I think of what I thought.

I do not hope that that man will rest in peace; I hope that he'll finally get to see the true adoration of his fans, in whatever afterlife there is.

To further exhaust a saying that is used without end; as far as I'm concerned, Michael never died. And he never will.

Serpentine
2009-06-27, 12:09 PM
It's been public knowledge and documented medical fact for over a decade that MJ suffered from a combination of Vitiligo and Lupus. Anyone who denied that isn't merely spreading rumours, they're denying reality in favor of scandal.Maybe - probably, even - but that doesn't explain everything else he did to himself. Mere skin colour change can't change a whole face shape.

I find it interesting that MJ is getting much more respect & admiration in the hours after his passing than he did in the last (read: worst) 15 years of his life. Where was all this sentiment & support when he really needed it?The view I expressed before is exactly the same as it was before he died: He's a tragic figure. Maybe he did bad things, maybe he didn't. I can't know, and it was absurd for people to state that they knew one way or the other. Either way, he's tragic, and has been the whole time.

Like Steve Irwin. We all knew that was a dangerous business, but I never really accepted that he could die, because he was the Crocodile Hunter...For me, it wasn't that he died. It was that he was killed by a frickin' freak accident by a normally practically-harmless animal, as opposed to having his leg torn off by a crocodile!

Arachu
2009-06-27, 12:30 PM
No, Vitiligo cannot change one's face shape. Severe burns that call for plastic surgery, however, go a long way. (http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/january/27/newsid_4046000/4046605.stm)

Besides, I could actually picture why he might have his nose operated on until destruction on account of how his father would beat him-for having a broad nose.

Maybe he got surgery, maybe he didn't. If he did, I must admit that I cannot picture why he did it that way (assuming it was intentional (which is unlikely)). I will also admit that while his face was quite ghoulish, that doesn't have anything to do with who he really was.

Serpentine
2009-06-27, 12:43 PM
As far as I can tell from a quick glance at wikipedia, the fire just meant treatment for burns and rhinoplasty. The rest came later in the 80s.
Maybe he had bad taste in plastic surgeons? 'course, all this just adds to the tragedy, doesn't make him bad or anything.

Oregano
2009-06-27, 12:48 PM
As far as I can tell from a quick glance at wikipedia, the fire just meant treatment for burns and rhinoplasty. The rest came later in the 80s.
Maybe he had bad taste in plastic surgeons? 'course, all this just adds to the tragedy, doesn't make him bad or anything.

Well it might not actually be the surgery that caused him to go so ghoulish, if his health was detoriating and he was getting older it might have gone weird. Like how Courtney Love's nose is a weird shape.

Arachu
2009-06-27, 12:51 PM
Exactly. He did have some surgery (he admitted this himself), but whether this rendered his face completely altered is, frankly, up for debate.

However, this doesn't change who Michael really was.

He was eccentric. He was odd. Maybe he was even weird. But he was no pervert. He really just wanted -at the risk of sounding extremely corny- the love of the people.

And I, for one, don't hate him for that.

dish
2009-06-27, 01:06 PM
It seems he had his first plastic surgery in the 70s to mend a broken nose, and he may have slowly grown addicted to it. I've seen it suggested that he had a severe case of body dysmorphic disorder (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_dysmorphic_disorder) - apparently, when on Oprah, he couldn't even stand to look at pictures of his younger self.

I think the media, and the vast majority of the public always presumed he was trying to "become white", but when you look at his later videos you can see that they always featured black people in major roles. Michael Jackson was much more complex than many of us ever credited him as being.

Also, very, very tragic.

Also, incredibly influential: in music, in culture, in dance. In sheer global recognition alone, he blew the Beatles away completely.

His life, and story, are so sad. I totally agree with the RIP.

rankrath
2009-06-27, 10:01 PM
Is it wrong that I always find the massive publicity that the deaths of famous people get to be incredibly annoying? Ok, great, some guy who had some nice dance moves died. You don't need to spend an entire half-hour world news program eulogizing the guy {Scrubbed}

Jesse Drake
2009-06-27, 10:12 PM
Michael Jackson made music videos what they are. If you don't believe me, check out The Real Thriller Music Video!!! Vincent Price helped make that, and it was a great testament to music videos, it was almost a movie on it's own.

skywalker
2009-06-28, 12:47 AM
I didn't say he courted anything.

I'm sorry, I don't like to argue like an arse, but you did:


I don't think he deserved, or did anything to deserve, much of the ridicule he courted later in life.


I don't really care about his music, but I mean, WOW! For the past twenty-four hours, nobody on the news has been talking about anything else, and one report said his music and paraphernalia is suddenly getting something like a 700,000% to 700,000,000% percent increase in purchases, downloads, ect. I don't think Elvis made that much when he died.

Elvis wasn't on iTunes.


And now they can't find his doctor apparently.

This is looking worrying.

They were wrong. The doctor has been in L.A, in contact with police throughout the entire situation. He rode in the ambulance to the hospital.


It seems he had his first plastic surgery in the 70s to mend a broken nose, and he may have slowly grown addicted to it. I've seen it suggested that he had a severe case of body dysmorphic disorder (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_dysmorphic_disorder) - apparently, when on Oprah, he couldn't even stand to look at pictures of his younger self.

This. While I don't begrudge anyone what they do to their own body, the man got ridiculous, quite frankly. His face changed in major ways on a semi-yearly basis. In particular, a person's nose doesn't do what his did.

It probably wasn't just the surgery or just the aging or just the drugs. It was probably a combination of all 3 that caused his face to do what it did.

The uniformly pale skin came from his use of make-up to "even out" his skin tone in reaction to the lupus and vitiligo. He probably didn't help either of those conditions by doing a ton of drugs.

Ichneumon
2009-06-28, 01:53 AM
I saw an interview/documentary yesterday in which they followed and talked to Michael Jackson a few days and I was astonished by how down to earth, friendly, calm and polite he was.

Innis Cabal
2009-06-28, 02:00 AM
I saw an interview/documentary yesterday in which they followed and talked to Michael Jackson a few days and I was astonished by how down to earth, friendly, calm and polite he was.

He also starred in his own movie and the camera's didn't roll 24 hours.

Anteros
2009-06-28, 03:44 AM
I don't know that I'd classify him as a "poor guy" for the heat he has taken from the media. He's certainly a tragic figure...but he brought much of it upon himself. He self-admittedly invited several children to share his bed at different points in time. I'm not saying that anything bad happened during these times...but any rational person should understand the potential ramifications of such an act. Innocent or not, if you, I, or any other non ultra-popular millionaire were put in a similar circumstance we would almost certainly be jailed.

I will say however, that the riotous mocking and celebration at his passing have been extremely classless. Regardless of your personal feelings towards someone, delighting in the suffering of others is rather sick.

Ichneumon
2009-06-28, 03:56 AM
I don't know that I'd classify him as a "poor guy". He's certainly a tragic figure...but he brought much of it upon himself.

I will say however, that the riotous mocking and celebration at his passing have been extremely classless. Regardless of your personal feelings towards someone, delighting in the suffering of others is rather sick.

That's quite horrific? Did people actually do this when he died?

Anteros
2009-06-28, 04:00 AM
That's quite horrific? Did people actually do this when he died?


Oh yes. It seems to be the newest fad. At least where I live.

readsaboutd&d
2009-06-28, 05:50 AM
Honestly, there are other people who have been far more miserable than him and his musical career was at an end. However, the current situation annoys me. Every news channel is blocked on Michael Jackson, suddenly there is no doubt that he was innocent once he dies (talk about an 180), he is declared "bigger than Elvis" "a once in a civilisation genius",... A famous musician is dead. That's it. People die.

skywalker
2009-06-28, 01:39 PM
Honestly, there are other people who have been far more miserable than him and his musical career was at an end. However, the current situation annoys me. Every news channel is blocked on Michael Jackson, suddenly there is no doubt that he was innocent once he dies (talk about an 180), he is declared "bigger than Elvis" "a once in a civilisation genius",... A famous musician is dead. That's it. People die.

Have you seen this video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BzRCf5OtFBU)?

That alone might make him a genius. Bigger than Elvis? No. But he is comparable, he's old, past his prime, didn't adapt properly to aging, and he died rather... ignominously.

Arachu
2009-06-28, 02:12 PM
This is true; people die-but he just died. Elvis received an uproar after his death- remembered not as who he became, or how he appeared, but as who he was. People should move on-eventually. Until then, respects are to be paid.

Besides, as I myself am guilty of, one typically reviews the story of another's life, after it has ended.

And yes, he did sleep in the same bed as children, but this does not mean what it was taken to mean. Had I more... Faith... In the minds of people as a whole, I would be disappointed. As it stands, I am merely annoyed.

Odd? Granted. Strange? Perhaps.

But a bad person? Again, no.

Seraph
2009-06-28, 05:33 PM
I don't know that I'd classify him as a "poor guy" for the heat he has taken from the media. He's certainly a tragic figure...but he brought much of it upon himself. He self-admittedly invited several children to share his bed at different points in time. I'm not saying that anything bad happened during these times...but any rational person should understand the potential ramifications of such an act. Innocent or not, if you, I, or any other non ultra-popular millionaire were put in a similar circumstance we would almost certainly be jailed.

I will say however, that the riotous mocking and celebration at his passing have been extremely classless. Regardless of your personal feelings towards someone, delighting in the suffering of others is rather sick.

the problem with this statement being that MJ was, for various reasons, fery far from being rational.

Anteros
2009-06-28, 08:30 PM
the problem with this statement being that MJ was, for various reasons, fery far from being rational.

I agree entirely, but that doesn't excuse him from responsibility for his actions. I don't understand why everyone gives him a free pass though just because he's rich and famous.

At the very least, the man severely damaged several families psychologically, while at the worst...well, that's not the point of this thread, and I should not speak ill of the dead. I'm going to bow out of here and simply say R.I.P. Mr. Jackson.

Roland St. Jude
2009-06-28, 08:55 PM
Speaking ill-of the (recently) deceased is an almost universal social faux pas. And while the internet is all about sticking your thumb in the eye of convention, maybe someone's memorial thread should be the exception. Some people liked this person, respected this person, or just liked and respected his works. Others just see their fellow Playgrounders in mourning and want to lend an ear and comforting word. Maybe these people could have a few kind words about him without having to fight for it.

Sheriff of Moddingham: The last Michael Jackson memorial thread was locked because it was riddled with trolling comments and jokes. Please keep this one free of such things. We can't read what's in your mind as you post, so we have to make a judgment call about what was intended.


Trolling (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/announcement.php?a=1)
Any post that, in the judgment of the Moderators, was made solely or primarily to incite angry responses and/or flames, or attempts to disrupt a thread so that it becomes a flame war, will be edited to remove the offending content and the poster issued an Infraction.

Avilan the Grey
2009-06-29, 01:28 AM
Personally I am one of those who's life he did not affect in any shape, way or form*. Maybe it was because none of my friends were fans of his either, but I can't really recall any time we listened to him. Everyone loved the Thriller video of course - I even had it recorded - it was one of the defining videos that "made" MTV, together with Ah-ha's "Take on me", Twisted Sister's two videos "We're Not Gonna take it" and "I Want to Rock", Peter Gabriel's "Sledhehammer" and a few more. Suddenly you could explain to people why Music was better on TV than the radio...

As for respect of the dead: I know everyone that even remotely liked him will lift him up on the highest pedestal possible; and those who were die hard fans will make him out to be Jesus... That's only natural. However I am starting to get fed up with the blatant overstatements in the media.

He was not Mozart's equal when it came to composing. Truth is he did not write more than half of his material, probably much less.

He was not the most important artist to bring "black music" to the white masses. That would be... Elvis. That he was the biggest black artist among white people is true however. Not the same thing, though.

He was not the most important popular artist to die to date. Elvis, James Brown, Bob Marley, Janis Joplin, Jimmie Hendrix, John Lennon all were more important to the evolution of popular music than he was.

I do find some truth in the statement from one of the more serious music critics in this country: "He was the Elvis of my generation". I have no problem with that statement other than "does this mean I was one of those loosers who preferred Tommy Steele over Elvis since I never cared for him?
:smalleek::smallbiggrin:"

And again I do think he deserves recognition for what he did. He was an extraordinary artist.

*I listened a lot of things, primarily rock.

skywalker
2009-06-29, 01:08 PM
Personally I am one of those who's life he did not affect in any shape, way or form*. Maybe it was because none of my friends were fans of his either, but I can't really recall any time we listened to him. Everyone loved the Thriller video of course - I even had it recorded - it was one of the defining videos that "made" MTV, together with Ah-ha's "Take on me", Twisted Sister's two videos "We're Not Gonna take it" and "I Want to Rock", Peter Gabriel's "Sledhehammer" and a few more. Suddenly you could explain to people why Music was better on TV than the radio...

As for respect of the dead: I know everyone that even remotely liked him will lift him up on the highest pedestal possible; and those who were die hard fans will make him out to be Jesus... That's only natural. However I am starting to get fed up with the blatant overstatements in the media.

He was not Mozart's equal when it came to composing. Truth is he did not write more than half of his material, probably much less.

He was not the most important artist to bring "black music" to the white masses. That would be... Elvis. That he was the biggest black artist among white people is true however. Not the same thing, though.

He was not the most important popular artist to die to date. Elvis, James Brown, Bob Marley, Janis Joplin, Jimmie Hendrix, John Lennon all were more important to the evolution of popular music than he was.

I do find some truth in the statement from one of the more serious music critics in this country: "He was the Elvis of my generation". I have no problem with that statement other than "does this mean I was one of those loosers who preferred Tommy Steele over Elvis since I never cared for him?
:smalleek::smallbiggrin:"

And again I do think he deserves recognition for what he did. He was an extraordinary artist.

*I listened a lot of things, primarily rock.

All viable statements. Yes, it does make you one of those loosers. If you are this into music, and haven't figured out by now that sometimes you have to be a looser to maintain the integrity of your opinion, then I want to know what you've been listening to.

I also don't think that Jackson was Mozart's equal. But he was certainly comparable to Mozart in the sense that he explored many different styles and genres of composition. Really, I don't think we'll ever see anyone comparable to the old masters because composition is no longer the focus, performance is.

Finally, I think that Jackson deserves to be mentioned in the same breath as the people you mentioned. It's hard to measure a person's impact on music. Those people had an impact on music, but Jackson had a tremendous impact on the business as a whole. MTV, videos in general, and of course, the performance are all huge parts of the business, without necessarily being part of "music." I think you would be hard pressed to find someone who made such a large evolution in the performance area besides MJ.

I think the one fault most fans have is that they conflate his music with his dancing (and performance in general). There are a lot of musicians (especially these days) who are incredible in the studio, hidden behind producers and wizardry. But they suck or are merely "fair" when you see them live. Michael Jackson brought a show.

Top 5 musicians of the century? No. Top 5 performers of the century? Absolutely.

BlueWizard
2009-06-30, 01:29 AM
I'm still sad and in shock.

He was bigger than the Beatles, Elvis, and Sinatra together. Regardless of what his later life troubles brought him.
Who can forget the giant statue of him in New York Harbor? Or when people gathered in mass just to see THRILLER on TV? The modern youth and their musician flavor of the month will never have an artist like Michael Jackson who had such a profound effect on all walks of life, whether they realize it or not. No one is like him, now or ever.