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View Full Version : Recruiting for a large scale 3.5 Fighter remake.



Doc Roc
2009-08-07, 12:05 PM
So you probably never expected to see me all the way over here. I've been working, though, on a serious remake of fighter with the unusual goal of placing it at tier 2/1.5. This means that outside of the Tome series, this particular fighter fix will be one of the most powerful and versatile fixes for fighter laid down. After all, the goal is to place the class roughly on par with the sorcerer without introducing a large scale alternative casting system. Our solution is fairly intricate, and still in process, but involves a large and wide-ranging selection of possible passive buff packages ranging from (EX) Flight to (EX) Deflection, all the way up to at high levels the ability to target incoming spells with sunder attempts.

Currently working with:
InnaBinder, Rouge Iz Tarp!, Pharaoh's Fist, and Rouge Iz Tarp!

Obviously, I can't do this alone. I already have two or three collaborators, but I'd like to pick up two external perspectives.

Qualifications:
Strong grasp of high level play.
Understanding of the issues with fighter, such as lack of an orthogonal role.
Understanding of the Tier system.
Willingness to do extremely heavy-duty testing.
Understanding of the Test of Spite ban list (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6219927&postcount=2), and the reasoning behind its policy of minimal change.

Djinn_in_Tonic
2009-08-07, 12:13 PM
Strong grasp of high level play: I've done my share of it, but know the theory better than the practice. Still familiar with it though.
Understanding of the issues with fighter, such as lack of an orthogonal role: Indeed.
Understanding of the Tier system: Very much so.
Willingness to do extremely heavy-duty testing: As much as I'm able to, yes.
Understanding of the Test of Spite ban list, and the reasoning behind its policy of minimal change: This I don't know. A link or an explanation would be appreciated.

Other Qualifications: Fairly extensive homebrew, usually considered creative and well balanced. A good number of years of 3.5 play (PC and DM alike) and homebrew. A decent eye for balance, and good at coming up with new abilities.

peacenlove
2009-08-07, 12:19 PM
Just dropping in to say "good luck" with your project :smallredface: As a person who tried to bring a class up in flexibility I like seeing "weak" classes see the light of attention and any viable revamp gets my applaud. :smallbiggrin:

Gnomo
2009-08-07, 12:30 PM
Well, this is going to be worth to see, I might be interested but first I would like to know your position onto this questions:

Do you think the fighter need class features that foil certain spell effects?
Do you think the fighter need class features that simulate some spell effects?
Do you think the fighter is a template more than a specific class concept?
Do you think the fighter need more bonus feats?
Do you think the fighter needs a boost on the basic class features such as saves, class skills and skill points?
Do you believe that the fighter can be fixed adding or improving feats?

AstralFire
2009-08-07, 12:32 PM
I don't trust my knowledge of effective play at those tiers sufficiently to nominate myself. But best of luck!

Doc Roc
2009-08-07, 12:48 PM
Do you think the fighter need class features that foil certain spell effects?
&&
Do you think the fighter need class features that simulate some spell effects?
After a fashion. Life without freedom of movement, or (EX) flight, for example... is rough. I'm also interested in trying to do what psionics did, and cover new and interesting ground. Again, the concept of an orthogonal role.

Do you think the fighter is a template more than a specific class concept?
No, I actually don't. I think that Fighter still needs a central concept, even if that concept is I Haz A Fighting Style.

Do you think the fighter need more bonus feats?
Oh lord no. Why would you need more of a weak option? In fact, it's likely that I'll switch to the psy-warrior feat progression.

Do you think the fighter needs a boost on the basic class features such as saves, class skills and skill points?
Hahahahhahahahahahahhaha ooooh, that's a good one. Of course they do. But for the most part, other than skills, that's just pitching good money after bad.

Do you believe that the fighter can be fixed adding or improving feats?
Not really, because warblades can get fighter-only feats, RAW. And warblades are Just Better as it stands right now.

Gnomo
2009-08-07, 07:54 PM
Then I'm clearly not the one for the job, we think too differently about the class, anyway, best of luck with the remake.

I have one final question though, why don't you just replace the Fighter with a more proficient Warblade?

Doc Roc
2009-08-07, 08:05 PM
Because I'm interested in laying out a pattern of passives that will help supplement the existing problems with the warblade.

PairO'Dice Lost
2009-08-07, 08:17 PM
Count me in.

Strong grasp of high level play. I run all my campaigns 1-20, so I'd say I have a good grasp.
Understanding of the issues with fighter, such as lack of an orthogonal role. I'm sure if you gave me a few concepts you want for the fighter's role, I could pick the, ahem, right angle. :smallwink:
Understanding of the Tier system. Indeed.
Willingness to do extremely heavy-duty testing. Oh, definitely. I live for playtests of new and wacky stuff.
Understanding of the Test of Spite ban list, and the reasoning behind its policy of minimal change. Understanding of, if not complete agreement with. (You banned the Far Realms but left Saint in!? Madness!)

Other qualifications: Extensive homebrewer (though not too much recent stuff, so it's mostly on WotC) currently doing my own 3e rewrite (like pretty much everyone else here, huh?). DMing since the tail end of 2e.

Origomar
2009-08-07, 08:51 PM
Why not fix some of the other classes that are worse than fighter?

Doc Roc
2009-08-07, 08:56 PM
Because those are, for the most part, not OGL classes, or they already have solid fixes running around that I can crib for 3.52. Further, fixing fighter the way I plan to will hopefully obsolete some of the really awful classes in their current forms entirely, opening up their design space for more interesting endeavors. :)

Also, Imperial Spectre, Fax, Tippy, Trollman&K, and many others have produced excellent fixes covering much of the lower tiers. No one has produced a fighter fix I am remotely satisfied with.

Dienekes
2009-08-07, 08:58 PM
While I would have loved to help, I'm far too new of a homebrewer to be of any real assistance.

Still good luck with the project, can't wait to see how it turns out.