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Adumbration
2009-09-12, 02:54 PM
Now, ever since I first saw this class, I've been intrigued by it. This is partially becouse of the hellishly difficult entry requirements: not only you have ones for the 1st level, you also need different qualifications for 4th, 7th and 10th level.

And if you take a good look at them, they're not particularly easy to complete. Page 55 in Planar Handbook. Now, if the requirements had been like on other prestige classes, I would've just passed by, but now I'm the victim of the phenomenon where one desires what one can't have.

Really, the class abilities aren't much to write home about. Sure, there are a few significant perks - all skills class skills, scent, blindsense - and a few extremely interesting abilities, such as Seen it Before and See it Again. The capstone is not too shabby for a certain type of character - a one that dies often, that is. It's also a 9/10 casting class, although I can't imagine how you could use it to get 9th level spells.

But I digress. Does anyone have any good ideas on how to effectively qualify for the class requirements, preferably all of them, by 5th level? Any idea on how to make an effective Ardent Dilettante?

(To recount requirements briefly and without broaching specifics, they include 1st level casting in arcane and divine, many ranks in different skills and proficiency with martial weapons and at least 1 exotic weapon.)

Emong
2009-09-12, 02:58 PM
It's been a while since I've looked at the requirements for it, but I think a level of Divine Bard combined with Able Learner and a feat for Exotic Weapon Proficiency would meet most requirements for an arcane build.

Edit:

In fact Divine Bard 1/ Martial Wizard 9/ Ardent Dilettante 10 gets you 9th level spells.

Olo Demonsbane
2009-09-12, 03:18 PM
Can you post the requirements for those who dont have the book?

Adumbration
2009-09-12, 03:19 PM
It's been a while since I've looked at the requirements for it, but I think a level of Divine Bard combined with Able Learner and a feat for Exotic Weapon Proficiency would meet most requirements for an arcane build.

Edit:

In fact Divine Bard 1/ Martial Wizard 9/ Ardent Dilettante 10 gets you 9th level spells.

Not quite, I think. You're still missing:
- Divine spellcasting, 1st level spells (bards get 1st level spells at 2nd level)
- Enough martial proficiencies (unless you're using literally all your feats on those: you need 4. And you can't use elven proficiencies, since then you can't use Able learner and then you don't qualify for skills.)

EDIT: Writing all of the requirements on a separate post, just a second.

Adumbration
2009-09-12, 03:25 PM
All right, here we go.

1st level:
- Any skill 8 ranks, 1 rank in any other 5 skills
- Fluff requirement

4th level:
- 8 ranks in Perform, any other skill 5 ranks, 1 rank in any other 5 skills.
- Proficiency with at least 2 martial weapons
- Ability to cast 1st level arcane or divine spells.

7th level:
- 8 ranks in Perform, any Strength-based skill 5 ranks, any Dexterity-based skill 5 ranks, 1 rank in any other 3 skills.
- Proficiency with at least 4 martial weapons and 1 exotic weapon
- Ability to cast 1st level arcane and divine spells.
- Fluff requirement (visited 3 other planes)

10th level:
- 8 ranks in Perform, any Strength-based skill 5 ranks, any Dexterity-based skill 5 ranks, any Constitution-based skill 5 ranks, any Intelligence or Wisdom-based skill 5 ranks.
- Proficiency with at least 4 martial weapons and 1 exotic weapon
- Ability to cast 1st level arcane and divine spells.
- 2 Fluff requirements (visited 6 other planes, must've died and brought back)

Emong
2009-09-12, 03:28 PM
Not quite, I think. You're still missing:
- Divine spellcasting, 1st level spells (bards get 1st level spells at 2nd level)
- Enough martial proficiencies (unless you're using literally all your feats on those: you need 4. And you can't use elven proficiencies, since then you can't use Able learner and then you don't qualify for skills.)

EDIT: Writing all of the requirements on a separate post, just a second.

Bard gets proficiency in longsword, rapier, sap, short sword, shortbow, and whip. My bad about spells though, just add in another level of Divine Bard, you should still be able to get 9th level spells.

only1doug
2009-09-12, 03:49 PM
All right, here we go.

1st level:
- Any skill 8 ranks, 1 rank in any other 5 skills
- Fluff requirement

4th level:
- 8 ranks in Perform, any other skill 5 ranks, 1 rank in any other 5 skills.
- Proficiency with at least 2 martial weapons
- Ability to cast 1st level arcane or divine spells.

7th level:
- 8 ranks in Perform, any Strength-based skill 5 ranks, any Dexterity-based skill 5 ranks, 1 rank in any other 3 skills.
- Proficiency with at least 4 martial weapons and 1 exotic weapon
- Ability to cast 1st level arcane and divine spells.
- Fluff requirement (visited 3 other planes)

10th level:
- 8 ranks in Perform, any Strength-based skill 5 ranks, any Dexterity-based skill 5 ranks, any Constitution-based skill 5 ranks, any Intelligence or Wisdom-based skill 5 ranks.
- Proficiency with at least 4 martial weapons and 1 exotic weapon
- Ability to cast 1st level arcane and divine spells.
- 2 Fluff requirements (visited 6 other planes, must've died and brought back)

Skills should be fairly easy with a couple of bard levels

1st level:
concentration 8 ranks
perform
swim (str)
tumble (dex)
spellcraft (int)
knowledge arcana

4th level:
Perform 8 ranks
Concentration 8 ranks
swim (str) 5 ranks
tumble (dex)
spellcraft (int)
knowledge arcana

7th level:
Perform 8 ranks
Concentration 8 ranks
swim (str) 5 ranks
tumble (dex) 5 ranks
spellcraft (int)
knowledge arcana

10th level:
Perform 8 ranks
Concentration 8 ranks
swim (str) 5 ranks
tumble (dex) 5 ranks
spellcraft (int) 5 ranks
knowledge arcana

only1doug
2009-09-12, 04:07 PM
L1 Divine bard 1 (httphttp://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#bardVariantDivineBard://) (hps and skillpoints)
L2 wizard 1
L3 wizard 2
L4 wizard 3 (maybe xp penalty if GM enforces it, unless racial favoured multiclass is bard or wizard)
L5 Divine Bard 2
L6 Ardent dilettante 1
L7 Ardent dilettante 2
L8 Ardent dilettante 3
L9 Ardent dilettante 4
L10 Ardent dilettante 5
L11 Ardent dilettante 6
L12 Ardent dilettante 7
L13 Ardent dilettante 8
L14 Ardent dilettante 9
L15 Ardent dilettante 10
L16-20 Other PRC of your choice

Edit: alternate route
L1 bard 1 (for skillpoints)
L2 cleric or druid 1
L3 cleric or druid 2
L4 cleric or druid 3 (maybe xp penalty if GM enforces it, unless racial favoured multiclass is bard or wizard)
L5 Bard 2
L6 Ardent dilettante 1
L7 Ardent dilettante 2
L8 Ardent dilettante 3
L9 Ardent dilettante 4
L10 Ardent dilettante 5
L11 Ardent dilettante 6
L12 Ardent dilettante 7
L13 Ardent dilettante 8
L14 Ardent dilettante 9
L15 Ardent dilettante 10
L16-20 Other PRC of your choice

advantage: cast in light armour with no penalty,
disadvantage: less arcane casting, more divine

Skills by level (assuming a minimum of +1 Int bonus).
Feats can be used to purchase weapon proficiencys as required
Bard also meets all the weapon proficiency requirements

Bard gets proficiency in longsword, rapier, sap, short sword, shortbow, and whip. My bad about spells though, just add in another level of Divine Bard, you should still be able to get 9th level spells.
Martial: longsword, rapier, sap, short sword, shortbow
Exotic: whip


L1 skills: 24 + (4xInt) skillpoints
concentration 4 ranks
perform 4 ranks
swim (str) 4 ranks
tumble (dex) 4 ranks
spellcraft (int) 4 ranks
knowledge arcana 4 ranks

L2 skills: (2 + Int) skillpoints
concentration 1 ranks
perform ranks
swim (str) ranks
tumble (dex) ranks
spellcraft (int) 1 ranks
knowledge arcana 1 ranks (assumes a Int Bonus)

L3 skills: (2 + Int) skillpoints
concentration 1 ranks
perform ranks
swim (str) ranks
tumble (dex) ranks
spellcraft (int) 1 ranks
knowledge arcana 1 ranks (assumes a Int Bonus)


L4 skills: (2 + Int) skillpoints
concentration 1 ranks
perform ranks
swim (str) ranks
tumble (dex) ranks
spellcraft (int) 1 ranks
knowledge arcana 1 ranks (assumes a Int Bonus)


L5 skills: (2 + Int) skillpoints
concentration 1 ranks
perform 4 ranks
swim (str) 1 ranks (assumes a Int Bonus)
tumble (dex) 1 ranks
spellcraft (int) 1 ranks
knowledge arcana

L5 total skills:
concentration 8 ranks
perform 8 ranks
swim (str) 5 ranks (assumes a Int Bonus)
tumble (dex) 5 ranks
spellcraft (int) 8 ranks
knowledge arcana 7 (assumes a Int Bonus)


as you can see, this meets the L10 non-fluff Pre-requisites before you even enter the class

gbprime
2010-05-01, 12:28 AM
Now, ever since I first saw this class, I've been intrigued by it. This is partially becouse of the hellishly difficult entry requirements: not only you have ones for the 1st level, you also need different qualifications for 4th, 7th and 10th level.

And if you take a good look at them, they're not particularly easy to complete. Page 55 in Planar Handbook. Now, if the requirements had been like on other prestige classes, I would've just passed by, but now I'm the victim of the phenomenon where one desires what one can't have.

Actually, I was just looking at the class today. You can qualify for it easily if your ref allows you to take another PrC first.

1 - Ranger 1 - all your martial weapons here
2 - Ranger 2 - and tons of skill points
3 - Ranger 3
4 - Ranger 4 - divine spells here
5 - Ranger 5
6 - Knight of the Weave 1 - arcane casting
7 - Knight of the Weave 2 - don't need, but cast in light armor too good to miss
8 - Ardent Dilettante 1 - from here on out, back to ranger at level 18.

You need an exotic weapon proficiency before level 14, that's it. Oh, and you have to die to hit level 10. Knight of the Weave (from Champions of Valor) takes no feats to qualify for, just BAB 5 and 1 rank in several cross class skills. It's casting tops out at 10, so ARdent Dilettante fills that up nicely.

If your GM doesn't allow more than one PrC, then you can skip Knight of the Weave and just take a feat instead. Sword of the Arcane Order (also from Champions of Valor) allows you to memorize and cast Wizard spells as arcane spells using your Ranger spell slots. Not as powerful, but it accomplishes the same prerequisite.

Anyway, necro thread. :smallbiggrin:

Thurbane
2010-05-01, 07:20 PM
The Savant base class (Dragon Compendium) meets nearly all reqs for this PrC: all skills as class skills, arcane and divine casting, proficient with all martial weapons.

oops, just noticed the date on this one. :smallredface: