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Anung Un Rama
2009-09-20, 08:55 AM
Sigh. My DM, in all his infinite wisdom has decreed that i am not allowed to play a duskblade because he thinks theyre overpowered. However, I'm set on playing a gish and unless anyone else can think of a decent gish class (i dont like multiclassing) I'm gonna have to make a hexblade. Please help me build a level 1 hexblade that doesnt absolutely blow! thanks

RagnaroksChosen
2009-09-20, 09:06 AM
Sigh. My DM, in all his infinite wisdom has decreed that i am not allowed to play a duskblade because he thinks theyre overpowered. However, I'm set on playing a gish and unless anyone else can think of a decent gish class (i dont like multiclassing) I'm gonna have to make a hexblade. Please help me build a level 1 hexblade that doesnt absolutely blow! thanks

What race?

1.power attack
3.practice spellcaster
4.(alternate class feature for the shadow panther i believe phb2)
6.obtain familar
9.imrpoved familiar (pickup either a humoid looking one(like mephit) or a winter wolf)
every thing after that is what ever you want.
Highly sugest getting hexbands from MIC and trying to get him to use one of the hexblade fixes specificaly the one that allows you to use the curse 3+char times per day.

Also another good one if want to add an element of sneak to your guy throw in 1 level of spell thief and take master spell thief.

Anung Un Rama
2009-09-20, 09:12 AM
ermmm... probably human, for the extra feat, unless you have a better idea

deuxhero
2009-09-20, 09:19 AM
I think calling the Duskblade overpowered calls for a hammergun. I suggest useing a Batman wizard, then pointing out how the Duskblade can't do any of that.

Anung Un Rama
2009-09-20, 09:34 AM
what, pray tell is a batman wizard? ive never heard of one although im sure ill love it as it combines two of my favourite things

RagnaroksChosen
2009-09-20, 09:35 AM
I think calling the Duskblade overpowered calls for a hammergun. I suggest useing a Batman wizard, then pointing out how the Duskblade can't do any of that.

For newer groups that don't fully comprehend BC save or suck or save or die it is overpowered. I remember first seeing the class way back when it first came out and going damn thats over powered. they have some serious dmg output.

Tim:
I ususaly go human as well ... I can't find the hexblade handbook,
But pritty much concentrate on improving your charisma.

What books are allowed?

deuxhero
2009-09-20, 09:38 AM
what, pray tell is a batman wizard? ive never heard of one although im sure ill love it as it combines two of my favourite things

Wizard who uses his large variety of spells to handle any situation. His combat is primarly done by spells that instantly cause major effects (Color spray is a good example, it can make a great deal of foes unable to fight back from when it is gained). Very broken and can be done with only core.

@RagnaroksChosen
So like Psions are overpowered because they can dump all their power points into a single power (when with the RAW, RAI and RAMS they can only use a number equal to manifester level.)

RagnaroksChosen
2009-09-20, 09:53 AM
Wizard who uses his large variety of spells to handle any situation. His combat is primarly done by spells that instantly cause major effects (Color spray is a good example, it can make a great deal of foes unable to fight back from when it is gained). Very broken and can be done with only core.

@RagnaroksChosen
So like Psions are overpowered because they can dump all their power points into a single power (when with the RAW, RAI and RAMS they can only use a number equal to manifester level.)

No thats just people being idiots about the rules.. alot of newer gms don't play with psionics.. I love psionics thats realy a bad comparison to what i had said.

HCL
2009-09-20, 09:53 AM
http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19872086/The_Hexblades_Handbook__2007

Anung Un Rama
2009-09-20, 09:56 AM
RC; Most books, but no psionics. But yeah, a well thought out wizard might be good, then ill show him what overpowered really is... but seriously, I'm only set on a duskblade because i think it would be a great character to roleplay, I'm not looking to make a combat monster and I think the DM has just seen one of the threads where people have over-abused the duskblades spell-channeling abilities in order to do ridicuous damage, and i wouldnt do that

oh and awesome, thanks HCL

Amphetryon
2009-09-20, 10:19 AM
Use the Dark Companion Variant Hexblade (PHB II).
At 1st level I'd use Combat Expertise and Improved Trip with a reach weapon like a Glaive.
At 3rd, Daunting Presence follows up your curse well.
At 5th, grab Combat Casting for your bonus Feat.
6th level, you'll want Obtain Familiar (Complete Arcane), followed by Improved Familiar (Complete Warrior) at 9th level for a Winter Wolf.
Spell Focus (Enchantment) is a good investment at 10th.
Practiced Spellcaster (Complete Arcane) is highly recommended by 12th level.
Elusive Target (Complete Warrior) works in concert with your reach weapon and various debuffs to make you harder to damage at 15th, along with your bonus feat of Greater Spell Focus (Enchantment).
You can pick up Minor Shapeshift (Complete Mage) at 18th, with Spell Penetration as your capstone bonus feat.

Mark Hall
2009-09-20, 10:32 AM
Hexblade combines very well with Dragon Disciple. It's a more punchy gish, but the strength bonuses overcome the BAB deficit.

woodenbandman
2009-09-20, 10:34 AM
What race?

1.power attack
3.practice spellcaster
4.(alternate class feature for the shadow panther i believe phb2)
6.obtain familar
9.imrpoved familiar (pickup either a humoid looking one(like mephit) or a winter wolf)
every thing after that is what ever you want.
Highly sugest getting hexbands from MIC and trying to get him to use one of the hexblade fixes specificaly the one that allows you to use the curse 3+char times per day.

Also another good one if want to add an element of sneak to your guy throw in 1 level of spell thief and take master spell thief.


#3 should can wait until level 9 when you take Master Spellthief, because that gives you a caster level = your Hexblade +SPellthief levels. If anything, ask to retrain it, but some DMs see it as a bit cheesy.

Anung Un Rama
2009-09-20, 10:38 AM
hmmm... looks pretty good and dragons are incredibly cool, if a bit overused thanks for all the advice

Eldariel
2009-09-20, 10:41 AM
I strongly suggest a Fighter/Wizard at this point. Hexblade just isn't much of a caster; mostly a debuffer to be honest. Though if that's the role you want, go for it, but I feel if Duskblade isn't allowed, Wizard/Fighter is by FAR your best option.

Talya
2009-09-20, 10:55 AM
I strongly suggest a Fighter/Wizard at this point. Hexblade just isn't much of a caster; mostly a debuffer to be honest. Though if that's the role you want, go for it, but I feel if Duskblade isn't allowed, Wizard/Fighter is by FAR your best option.


Bah. Skip the levels of fighter. There are so many great "gish" builds that don't require duskblade or hexblade...but I think you're on the right track by including a primary arcane spellcaster, so long as you use PrCs to minimize caster levels lost.

Great gish PrCs (not necessarily to be used together)
Abjurant Champion (Absolutely incredible), Swiftblade, Knight Phantom, Eldritch Knight (sortof), Jade Phoenix Mage (if you have TOB), Sacred Exorcist, Spellsword (one level dip only).

Eldariel
2009-09-20, 01:33 PM
Bah. Skip the levels of fighter. There are so many great "gish" builds that don't require duskblade or hexblade...but I think you're on the right track by including a primary arcane spellcaster, so long as you use PrCs to minimize caster levels lost.

Fighter 1 really helps with qualifying for things though (Spellsword, Eldritch Knight, Knight Phantom, etc.). Although if you want to play a "pure" Gish, you can try:
Wizard 6/Swiftblade (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/prc/20070327) 9-10/Abjurant Champion 5

This has no base class levels in classes outside Wizard. You need some source of Martial Weapon Proficiency (such as being an Elf or taking the feat), but other than that, you're fine.

Pyron
2009-09-20, 02:11 PM
Wizard 6/Swiftblade (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/prc/20070327) 9-10/Abjurant Champion 5

This has no base class levels in classes outside Wizard. You need some source of Martial Weapon Proficiency (such as being an Elf or taking the feat), but other than that, you're fine.

There's an alternative class feature in Complete Champion that allows Wizards to trade their 5th level bonus feat for access to a domain power. Pick War Domain, and you should be set.

Zaq
2009-09-20, 02:12 PM
I've always been fond of using a Hexblade to make your opponent make way, way too many saves. Feats like Netherese Battle Curse (Lost Empires of Faerun, but easily divorced from the FR fluff), Brutal Strike (PHB2), Dreadful Wrath (PGtF, I think? Again, easily divorced from FR fluff), Sand Dancer (Sandstorm), and so on can add a lot of nasty effects to your attacks. Combined with the Dark Companion ACF and a lucky hexblade's curse or two, they'll fail at least SOME of the saves. Also, a Sudden Stunning weapon, from DMG2 is generally a good idea for this kind of build, since it's a nice on-hit debuff that's based on your Charisma.

Person_Man
2009-09-20, 06:43 PM
At level 1 the Hexblade is actually quite weak. A stronger but similar options would be Fighter 2/Hexblade 4/Blackguard X or Rogue 2/Hexblade 4/Assassin X or Bard 1/Hexblade 4/Warchanter X.

The Fighter/Hexblade/Blackguard gets ridiculous Saves, Rebuke Undead, divine spells, and a few dice of Sneak Attack. Look into Earth Devotion (http://www.realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Earth_Devotion,all), Travel Devotion (http://www.realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Travel_Devotion,all), Divine Shield (http://www.realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Divine_Shield,all), Shield Ward (http://www.realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Shield_Ward,all), and Staggering Strike (http://www.realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Staggering_Strike,all).

The Rogue/Hexblade/Assassin gets Evasion, Sneak Attack, Death Attack, and arcane spells. If you can debuff your enemy before making a Death Attack, you should be able to knock out the most powerful enemy at the start of each combat (unless they're immune, a major Assassin weakness).

The Bard/Hexblade/Warchanter is basically for access to Bardic Music uses, for Doomspeak (http://www.realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Doomspeak,all) (-10 to one enemy's Save for 1 round) and Snowflake Wardance (http://www.realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Snowflake_Wardance,all).

Other good bits to consider are Frightful Presence (http://www.realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Frightful_Presence,all) or Dreadful Wrath (http://www.realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Dreadful_Wrath,all), Brutal Strike (http://www.realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Brutal_Strike,all), Netherese Battle Curse (http://www.realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Netherese_Battle_Curse,all), and a Spell Storing Weapon (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/magicWeapons.htm#spellStoring).

Just remember that the Hexblade's biggest asset is it's Familiar. The Familiar shares your hit points, BAB, and can Share Spells (like Alter Self and Polymorph). It can also hold the charge of a touch attack spell. So on the first round of combat, he can smack your enemy with a debuff spell, and then you get your full action. Works very well for mounted builds, IMO. In fact, I'm a fan of taking the PHBII variant to get the Dark Companion, and taking the Obtain Familiar (http://www.realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Obtain_Familiar,all) feat to get your tag team partner.

I'd also add that Hexblades work best when you focus on defense and debuffing. Soften up your enemies, and let the casters obliterate them.

Thurbane
2009-09-20, 06:53 PM
I'm surprised no feat exists to allow extra uses of Curse per day...

Extra Music +4/day
Extra Rage +2/day
Extra Smiting +2/day
Extra Stunning +3/day
Extra Turning +4/day
Extra Wild Shape +2/day

...a feat for extra Curses/day should be fine, if your DM approves it.

Diamondeye
2009-09-20, 07:16 PM
A lot of gish PrCs are a pain in the ass to qualify for unfortunately. Abjurant champion, for example, requires +5 BAB. Spellsword requires only +4, but you need level 2 spells as well. Eldritch knight takes level 3 spells.

My personal recommendations : Fighter 1/Wizard 5/Eldritch knight 2/Abjurant Champion 5/Eldritch Knight 8 more, at which pointyou're into epic levels

Alternatively if you want to wear armor instead of using spells for AC:

Fighter 1/Wizard 5/Eldritch Knight 1/Spellsword 3 (or 1)/ Eldritch Knight 9/whatever. Depends on how heavy you want to be able to wear, but with 3 levels you can wear Twighlight Mithril Full Plate with no spell failure.