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Sesquame
2009-10-21, 08:35 PM
After having read OOTS, i went out and bought a starting box for D&D, and i am planning on starting a group as soon as i can. What/where should i go for more information and tips on how to go about this?

Chrono22
2009-10-21, 08:37 PM
Meetup.com is a good site for organizing DnD group meetups.
I guess, the first thing you should do is advertise a game- create a thread about it. Say what the specifics are (pregenerated or at-table character creation, what edition, what optional rules are included.. perhaps also a brief overview of the campaign and contents).

Kroy
2009-10-21, 08:48 PM
After having read OOTS, i went out and bought a starting box for D&D, and i am planning on starting a group as soon as i can. What/where should i go for more information and tips on how to go about this?

Just curious, what edition? I'm guessing 4th. Keep in mind that there are many editions of D&D, with 4th being the newest and 3.5 being the most popular. OOTS is 3.5, if you didn't already know.

Brendan
2009-10-21, 08:51 PM
I would suggest finding a few of your friends to play the game with, so you can not just play the game, but hang out with them as well. Also, early on, it can be good to farmiliarize yourself with how battles are carried by setting up an encounter with, say, a small group of kobolds, and look for a way to win the battle or fight effectively. that may make you a more effective player.

evil-frosty
2009-10-21, 09:08 PM
If you start a group with your friends who havent played before make sure you understand the rules so you can teach them to your friends more smoothly and not be looking everything up.

ken-do-nim
2009-10-21, 09:34 PM
Just curious, what edition? I'm guessing 4th. Keep in mind that there are many editions of D&D, with 4th being the newest and 3.5 being the most popular. OOTS is 3.5, if you didn't already know.

Start at the beginning, white box D&D baby! (republished as Swords & Wizardry (http://www.lulu.com/content/paperback-book/swords-wizardry-core-rules-%28softcover%29/6372635) - at least check out the cool cover)

Kurald Galain
2009-10-22, 03:18 AM
I suggest you roll 1d4 to pick which edition to play.

oxybe
2009-10-22, 03:59 AM
yer crazy! what next... 3d6 down the line, no rerolls?! madness... this is madness!

Zeta Kai
2009-10-22, 05:01 AM
I suggest you roll 1d4 to pick which edition to play.

Statistically, the average player doing so would end up playing 2.5; an interesting choice, to be sure.

Katana_Geldar
2009-10-22, 05:06 AM
10gp says he's playing 4th, as that's the minibox you can get to play. My suggetsion is run a few adventures and then try and get the core books as they tell you much much more.

The Rose Dragon
2009-10-22, 05:08 AM
Well, you can start by not playing D&D. :smalltongue:

Start by playing AD&D instead. I'm pretty sure you can find the books cheap.

BobVosh
2009-10-22, 05:10 AM
Just curious, what edition? I'm guessing 4th. Keep in mind that there are many editions of D&D, with 4th being the newest and 3.5 being the most popular. OOTS is 3.5, if you didn't already know.

I question 3.5 being the most popular. I will def say they are on this forum though.


Statistically, the average player doing so would end up playing 2.5; an interesting choice, to be sure.

A fun edition. Most certainly a strange one for a starting player though. However I am suspicious of your averages.

Katana_Geldar
2009-10-22, 05:17 AM
Sesquame, this is what you need to do after you've managed to understand the rules yourself

1. Find some friends who are willing to play with you and help them create their characters, or just give them one of the sample ones in the box.
2. Get the tiles and mini tokens and go through a few encounters just so you can get the hang of attack rolls and damage rolls
3. Do not get too hung up on all the rules to begin with, like Attacks of Opportunity, Action Points, Saving Throws. They can come later when you know how to play better, there's no rule that says you have to follow them all. Then bring other rules in gradually.
4. There should be a module in your box. Play it, try not to change it too much as you don't know how yet.
5. If you are going to be the DM longtime, try to have a few sessions where you can play just so you have the experience of sitting on the other side of the screen. It will help you DM.
6. And have fun, it's not meant to be work though it seems like it.

Zeta Kai
2009-10-22, 05:19 AM
However I am suspicious of your averages.

Suspect all you wish, but 1d4 works out to 2.5 average. Roll it yourself, if you like. An easier way of figuring it out, though, is to add up all the possible outcomes of the die (1, 2, 3, & 4, sum 10), & divide by the number of possible outcomes (total 4). In this case, you get 2.5; this assumes that every outcome is equally likely, which the platonic ideal of a die should have. This can be done for any die: d6 gives an average of 3.5, d8 gives an average of 4.5, d10 gives an average of 5.5, d12 gives an average of 6.5, d20 gives an average of 10.5, etc.

BobVosh
2009-10-22, 05:23 AM
Suspect all you wish, but 1d4 works out to 2.5 average. Roll it yourself, if you like. An easier way of figuring it out, though, is to add up all the possible outcomes of the die (1, 2, 3, & 4, sum 10), & divide by the number of possible outcomes (total 4). In this case, you get 2.5; this assumes that every outcome is equally likely, which the platonic ideal of a die should have. This can be done for any die: d6 gives an average of 3.5, d8 gives an average of 4.5, d10 gives an average of 5.5, d12 gives an average of 6.5, d20 gives an average of 10.5, etc.

The average player however could never play it. I'm well aware that given an average of a die is 1/2 the size of the die +.5 .

I'm just going off of what is a moderately funny joke thoughts on mathematicians. It just don't work that way.
http://www.jokesaboutgraduation.com/physicist-biologist-mathematician.html

Kurald Galain
2009-10-22, 05:27 AM
I question 3.5 being the most popular. I will def say they are on this forum though.

I question 4E being the newest, because Pathfinder is newer than that...

BobVosh
2009-10-22, 05:40 AM
I question 4E being the newest, because Pathfinder is newer than that...

That depends if you count release date or the start of alpha. Either way, touche.
Ok, that was a huge stretch. I'm sorry!

Tyndmyr
2009-10-22, 07:20 AM
I question 3.5 being the most popular. I will def say they are on this forum though.


From the players I know and have seen at local gaming shops, 3.5 is still more popular by a significant margin. 4E does seem to be gaining, though, since it's what's sold everywhere. Finding the official books for 3.5 has gotten a bit harder.

4E will probably catch up in popularity eventually, though.

pasko77
2009-10-22, 07:46 AM
Statistically, the average player doing so would end up playing 2.5; an interesting choice, to be sure.

Sure, the problem is, the "average" player does not exist :)

Tiki Snakes
2009-10-22, 07:56 AM
I question 4E being the newest, because Pathfinder is newer than that...

I would compare pathfinder to a 'GOTYE' repackage of an existing classic computer game, myself. Just because someone's put the mods in the same box and is selling it again doesn't make it a new game.

Alternatively, they are releasing a new patch for Diablo 2 in a month or two. Does that make it newer than Fable 2? :smallwink:

Optimystik
2009-10-22, 08:09 AM
Statistically, the average player doing so would end up playing 2.5; an interesting choice, to be sure.

Baldur's Gate was 2.5 IIRC. (2nd edition, with sorcerers and monks.)

ken-do-nim
2009-10-22, 12:35 PM
I suggest you roll 1d4 to pick which edition to play.

There's WAY more than 4 editions of D&D out there. I have a few minutes to kill, I'll make a quick d20 chart to roll on:

1 - OD&D from 1974
2 - OD&D with supplements (Greyhawk, Blackmoor, Eldritch Wizardry) 1975-76
3 - Basic 1978
4 - AD&D 1E 1979
5 - Basic/Expert 1981
6 - Basic/Expert/Companion/Masters/Immortals 1983-5
7 - AD&D 1E with supplements (Unearthed Arcana, Survival Guides) 1985-87
8 - AD&D 2E 1989
9 - Rules Cyclopedia 1991
10 - AD&D 2E with supplements (skills & powers, spells & magic) 1996
11 - D&D 3.0 2000
12 - Hackmaster (~2001)
13 - D&D 3.5 2002
14 - Castles & Crusades (~2004)
15 - OSRIC (~2007)
16 - Basic Fantasy Role-Playing Game (~2007)
17 - Labyrinth Lord (~2008)
18 - D&D 4.0 2008
19 - Swords & Wizardry 2009
20 - Pathfinder 2009

Now there's a good table to roll on! :smile:

Edit: I should probably have a listing for "3.5 with supplements", but gosh it's really endless combinations that do indeed alter the base game significantly.

Zeta Kai
2009-10-22, 01:27 PM
That's a good list, KDN, & I agree that the "3.5+" option is largely unworkable, due to the countless possible combinations. I will say that Tome of Battle should count as a full version due to the scope of the gameplay changes.

Also, I'll note that the median for that table is still 2.5 AD&D. :smallwink:

oxybe
2009-10-22, 01:34 PM
if free stuff is what thou seek,
check out my sig for tools & utilities... eek?

and that's why i don't put rhyming puzzles in my games.

Radar
2009-10-22, 01:49 PM
Ahh... the smell of off-topic in the evening. Smell like... complete confusion. :smallannoyed:

At any rate, i strongly recommend reading this (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7171888#post7171888) thread. It will give you a lot of usefull hints and pieces of advice.

Apart from that, it would be helpful to go over the rules and make yourself a cheat-sheet of most important mechanics, so you don't get bogged down with reading the rulebooks duing the session.

wormwood
2009-10-22, 01:51 PM
Or you could just start role-playing with a far simpler game system while you work on your PhD in Dungeons and Dragons.

Paulus
2009-10-22, 01:58 PM
Hello and welcome to the exciting world of D&D! First off. Since you wish to play you are going to new a few things, at the very least, the Dungeon Master Guide, Player's Handbook, and a Monster Manual. Then, one bag of dice including at least one of every dice you'll need. Yes I know the Official book says you need this:


Your group needs these items to play D&D.
*The Playerís Handbook, Dungeon Masterís Guide, and Monster Manual
revised core rulebooks. (All players might want to have their own
copies of the books.)
*A copy of the character sheet at the back of this book for each
player.
*A battle grid. The Dungeon Masterís Guide contains one.
*Miniatures to represent each character and the monsters that
challenge them.
*A set of dice for each player. A set of dice includes at least one
four-sided die (d4), four six-sided dice (d6), one eight-sided die
(d8), two ten-sided dice (d10), one twelve-sided die (d12), and one
twenty-sided die (d20).
*Pencils, scrap paper, and graph paper to keep notes and to map
the locations your characters will explore.

But you don't. All you need to buy I already listed. Now, grab a notebook for you and your friends for notes, scrap paper, and maybe a table or so, which you can have some action figures set on. You can use coins, paper circles with character names or symbols on them, or even little army men figures. Whatever you want! It's more about your imagination then any of this official stuff.

Next, read through the DMG so you know the "rules" Combat will be the most difficult for you because there are so many rules about it. Skill Checks, Ability Checks, and such are easier since it's basically the same mechanic and you juts plug in different numbers. Don't be worried that you'll miss something or get something wrong, everyone does, New DM's and even OLD DM's. MY Dm who had DMed for five years before has to look up rules ALL the time hehehe. So keep those books handy.

Now, make sure you also read the PHB so you at least know a bit about the classes and what they do. Your average team will be usually four players, including yourself as the fifth, but it can be less. There is no static number of group you need. you can go with three or even just you and another friend bumbling along to learn the system.

What you will need to do is play the encounters, Npcs, Monsters, Traps etc. Which I suggest following through some of the free modules posted before hand. They are your typical adventures and mean you don't have to spend forever getting your own world set up to learn the system. Save that for later.

Also don't worry if the module seems funny and you don't know how to rule on something if the players don't follow it to the letter, the modules usually take this into account. And I highly doubt the players will give you any guff about it, since they are new too.

So, read the DMG, the PHB and find a free module you like. Let your players have a few hours to go through building a character with you so you can help answer questions or look up stuff together.

The typical party is usually, a Melee type, a healer type, a caster type, and a sneak type. The Melee type can be any of your full base attack bonus, full armor guys like Paladin, Fighter, Barbarian, Ranger etc. The Healer type can be a Bard, Cleric, or even the Druid or Paladin. The caster type can be your bard, wizard, sorcerer, etc. and your sneak type can be Rogue, monk, or ranger, etc.

That's right each class can fill a few different roles. And depending on player play style, can even fill one role over others. So don't be worried if you get like, all fighters or so. You can roll with that too. And since you've already read the DMG you'll understand why I say that. Once you have all their characters set up now begins the fun!

You describe -usually by reading the module- what they see, adding in any details you'd like 'smell, feel, temperature. Be as descriptive and referential as you wish! You can describe it like a scene in a movie you've all watched or experienced in real life "Remember how cold it was back in January when we all had to march in that band competition? Yeah it's that cold." Once you have describe the scene, ask the players what they do. AND YOUR OFF!

THUS! make sure and read your DMG, PHB, and find a module you like. Expect to spend a few hours for character creation, and don't be afraid as a DM to say no. The characters will natural want whatever they can get to help them, but if you give them all they want, soon the game will be boring because it lacks challenge, and it is far better to earn what they want.

Whew this is a lot! I'll stop here now that you have a starting point, and feel free to ask any questions you like! I know it may seem overwhelming but trust me, Soooooo worth it! HAVE FUN!

Knaight
2009-10-22, 02:15 PM
And its time for my usual spiel. There are a lot of other games, besides D&D, including a great many free games, which are in many cases easier to run. Examples:

Quick Start
Savage Worlds Quick Start PDF (http://www.peginc.com/Games/Savage%20Worlds/Downloads/SW%20Rev/TestDrive4.pdf)

True 20 Quick Start PDF (http://true20.com/files/True20_quickstart.pdf)

Gurps Lite (http://e23.sjgames.com/item.html?id=SJG31-0004)

Free

Basic Fantasy Full PDF (http://basicfantasy.org/download.cgi/Basic-Fantasy-RPG-Rules-r63.pdf)

Fudge Full PDF (http://www.fudgerpg.com/files/pdf/fudge_1995.pdf)

Fate Full PDF (http://www.faterpg.com/dl/FATE2fe.pdf)

Nemesis (http://web.me.com/drgonzo/Site/Download.html)

I would advise starting with Fudge or Fate, then Savage Worlds, then the core Nemesis engine, then GURPS. A lot of this list is complements one Greytales Nook, which is nice if you like maps.

I was also trying to dig up the QAGS or YAGS quick start, but no luck.

ken-do-nim
2009-10-22, 02:24 PM
And its time for my usual spiel. There are a lot of other games, besides D&D, including a great many free games, which are in many cases easier to run. Examples:

Basic Fantasy Full PDF (http://basicfantasy.org/download.cgi/Basic-Fantasy-RPG-Rules-r63.pdf)


It's a bit false to tell someone to play something other than D&D and point them at BFRPG. BFRPG is Dungeons & Dragons, just not made by TSR/WOTC so it doesn't have the name.

Sesquame
2009-10-22, 05:58 PM
Ty for the advice, it is indeed the 4th edition starter set. I intend to purchase a monster manual and a handbook as soon as I can. Until then, is there a webpage or something for a quick n' dirty guide to character creation? I do not want to be stuck with the 5 premades in the quickstart guide until I get a handbook

couple of noob questions: how does the daily ability and such system work? you can only use that ability once per session? can I only use one of the daily abilities, i.e. can I only use one beacon of hope/Cure light wounds a session or can I use one cure light wounds and one beacon of hope per session.

AslanCross
2009-10-22, 06:03 PM
This is probably the most confusing "new to D&D" thread I've seen in a while. The OP already said he went out and bought a box, but most posts here consist of "No, don't do that; play this instead." :smallannoyed:

OP: I'll echo some of the advice given above---look for a group of friends who are willing to play it. I was able to recruit some from my students; they've been my core playing group for about 3 years now (even if they've graduated from the school I'm affiliated with).

Your mileage may vary, of course---I've heard that many groups don't stick together for as long and tend to collapse due to interpersonal relational problems , boredom or real life.

Sesquame
2009-10-22, 06:11 PM
This is probably the most confusing "new to D&D" thread I've seen in a while. The OP already said he went out and bought a box, but most posts here consist of "No, don't do that; play this instead." :smallannoyed:

I blame myself for posting then being unable to continute posting until now. Cue off-topicness festering

Katana_Geldar
2009-10-22, 08:21 PM
Hey, I not only knew what he was talking about, I gave him advice based on the OP. I know what is in that box as my friend has it.

For characters, I suggest you start with the pre-made ones so you can get your head around the mechanics of the game. It's a lot to remember at first what to do, I had to spend a few days playing by myself before I was ready to run a game.

For character creation, Wizards has a demo version of the Character Builder (http://www.wizards.com/dnd/tool.aspx?x=dnd/4new/tool/characterbuilder) which you can download for free and print out the character sheets and power cards from there.

Kurald Galain
2009-10-23, 03:23 AM
There's WAY more than 4 editions of D&D out there. I have a few minutes to kill, I'll make a quick d20 chart to roll on:
It needs an option for "roll twice and use both results" :smallwink:

Kurald Galain
2009-10-23, 03:31 AM
Until then, is there a webpage or something for a quick n' dirty guide to character creation?
There's various long lists of suggestions of what feats/powers to take, yes. Just google for "fighter guide", "cleric guide" and so forth.

Standard tip 1, pick a build and stick with it. For instance, you can have a rogue that works on dex-and-str, or one that works on dex-and-cha. Don't try to build a rogue that is both at the same time.

Standard tip 2, get at least an 18 in your primary attribute, or 16 plus a bonus from your race.

Standard tip 3, it's really okay if one of your four defenses is lower than the others; this does not constitute "weakness".

Standard tip 4, the ranger's careful strike and the fighter's sure strike suck.

Standard tip 5, it's really okay if your party does not exactly have the Four Standard Roles; as long as you have at least one healer you can work with pretty much any combination.

Standard tip 6, when taking feats or powers, don't just look at the damage potential, but also pay attention to other effects.

(disclaimer: these are guidelines that I recommend for beginning players, not strict rules that every character Must Conform To; these are just meant to avoid common pitfalls, like a strength-12 fighter).



couple of noob questions: how does the daily ability and such system work?
A daily ability can be used once per in-character day. That is, your character needs a night's rest to use it again. Frequently, a play session will cover multiple in-character days, or only part of one. Each daily ability can be used once, so if you have five daily abilities (and you will, eventually), you can use each of them every day, not just one of them.

AllisterH
2009-10-23, 04:19 AM
Why not simply use the Testdrive (http://www.wizards.com/dnd/TryDnD.aspx) page?

Before the OP buys anything else, I suggest grabbing the free stuff first.

CorvidMP
2009-10-23, 09:33 AM
couple of noob questions: how does the daily ability and such system work? you can only use that ability once per session? can I only use one of the daily abilities, i.e. can I only use one beacon of hope/Cure light wounds a session or can I use one cure light wounds and one beacon of hope per session.
Jesus you ppl can be unhelpful...

For quick character creation go to the wizards website and download the character creator program. It will only allow you make characters up till level 3 unless you subscribe, but that should hold you till you get your players handbook. Also it does some of the math for you on the character sheets it prints which might help some of your players in first few sessions.

Daily powers can only be used once per day in game, not in real life, and require your character to get 8 hours of rest before you can use it again. Basically if you get a nasty bar fight before heading off to storm the castle and decide to get froggy and blow one or two daily powers, you'll be ok as long as your character can get a good nights rest (again this is in game time not RL, this can all take place during one session if the combats are quick and the session long enough).