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Latronis
2009-12-09, 06:50 AM
More opinions on the crunchiness thanks to sweeping changes across the board would be much appreciated :smallbiggrin:

Some general points:

1) I don't like dead levels for non spellcasters.

b) As awesome as some ranger spells can be move i want to move it away from spellcasting altogether. Skilled, Wilderness and Stealth based Warrior.

splunge) Bare Bones Fluff: The people are all intrinsically connected to the world in a physical and spiritual manner, the Earth Mother births and provides for all her children. Rangers are individuals who have learnt to tap into this connection to their home not, in the manner of shamans with their shapechanging and spellcraft instead they learn how to draw upon their own predatory natures, often using a particular style of combat focused on a specific type of foe.

as always additional info without interfering overly with the writeup\format can be found in spoiler tags.

RANGER
{table=head]Level|Base Attack Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Special

1st|
+1|
+2|
+2|
+0|Animal Companion, Favored Enemy, Track, Wild Empathy.

2nd|
+2|
+3|
+3|
+0|Nature Sense, Uncanny Dodge(?).

3rd|
+3|
+3|
+3|
+1|Combat Style.

4th|
+4|
+4|
+4|
+1|Predatory Focus.

5th|
+5|
+4|
+4|
+1|Favored Enemy, Improved Uncanny Dodge(?).

6th|
+6/+1|
+5|
+5|
+2|Trackless Step, Woodland Stride.

7th|
+7/+2|
+5|
+5|
+2|Swift Stalker.

8th|
+8/+3|
+6|
+6|
+2|Improved Combat Style.

9th|
+9/+4|
+6|
+6|
+3|Swift Tracker.

10th|
+10/+5|
+7|
+7|
+3|Favored Enemy.

11th|
+11/+6/+1|
+7|
+7|
+3|Heightened Predatory Focus.

12th|
+12/+7/+2|
+8|
+8|
+4|Camouflage.

13th|
+13/+8/+3|
+8|
+8|
+4|Greater Combat Style.

14th|
+14/+9/+4|
+9|
+9|
+4|???

15th|
+15/+10/+5|
+9|
+9|
+5|Favored Enemy.

16th|
+16/+11/+6/+1|
+10|
+10|
+5|Hide In Plain Sight.

17th|
+17/+12/+7/+2|
+10|
+10|
+5|Tireless Predator.

18th|
+18/+13/+8/+3|
+11|
+11|
+6|Combat Style Mastery.

19th|
+19/+14/+9/+4|
+11|
+11|
+6|Apex Predator.

20th|
+20/+15/+10/+5|
+12|
+12|
+6|Favored Enemy, Bane Of Enemies.[/table]

It seems while i was writing out the first draft(table came later) I completely neglected 14th level and now i'm not sure how to remedy that. Perhaps some kind of can use in medium armours ability?

Hit Die
d8.

Class Skills
The rangerís class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Climb (Str), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Handle Animal (Cha), Heal (Wis), Hide (Dex), Jump (Str), Knowledge (dungeoneering) (Int), Knowledge (geography) (Int), Knowledge (nature) (Int), Listen (Wis), Move Silently (Dex), Profession (Wis), Ride (Dex), Search (Int), Spot (Wis), Survival (Wis), Swim (Str), and Use Rope (Dex).

Skill Points at 1st Level
(6 + Int modifier) ◊4.

Skill Points at Each Additional Level
6 + Int modifier.

Class Features
All of the following are class features of the ranger.

Weapon and Armor Proficiency
A ranger is proficient with all simple and martial weapons, and with light armor and shields (except tower shields).

Favored Enemy (Ex)
At 1st level, a ranger may select a type of creature from among those given on Table: Ranger Favored Enemies. The ranger gains a +2 bonus on Bluff, Listen, Intimidate, Sense Motive, Spot, and Survival checks when using these skills against creatures of this type. Likewise, he gets a +2 bonus on weapon damage rolls against such creatures.

At 5th level and every five levels thereafter (10th, 15th, and 20th level), the ranger may select an additional favored enemy from those given on the table. In addition, at each such interval, the bonus against all selected favored enemies increase by 1.

If desired instead of selecting a new favored enemy the ranger can choose to increase the bonus against any one favored enemy by 2.

If the ranger chooses humanoids or outsiders as a favoured enemy, he must also choose an associated subtype, as indicated on the table. If a specific creature falls into more than one category of favored enemy, the rangerís bonuses do not stack; he simply uses whichever bonus is higher.

At 1st level, a ranger may select a type of creature from among those given on Table: Ranger Favored Enemies. The ranger gains a +2 bonus on Bluff, Listen, Intimidate, Sense Motive, Spot, and Survival checks when using these skills against creatures of this type. Likewise, he gets a +2 bonus on weapon damage rolls against such creatures.

At 5th level and every five levels thereafter (10th, 15th, and 20th level), the ranger may select an additional favored enemy from those given on the table. In addition, at each such interval, the bonus against all existing favored enemies increase by 2.

If the ranger chooses humanoids or outsiders as a favoured enemy, he must also choose an associated subtype, as indicated on the table. If a specific creature falls into more than one category of favored enemy, the rangerís bonuses do not stack; he simply uses whichever bonus is higher.

Track (Ex)
A ranger gains Track as a bonus feat.

Wild Empathy (Ex)
A ranger can improve the attitude of an animal. This ability functions just like a Diplomacy check to improve the attitude of a person. The ranger rolls 1d20 and adds his ranger level and his charisma modifier to determine the wild empathy check result. The typical domestic animal has a starting attitude of indifferent, while wild animals are usually unfriendly.

To use wild empathy, the ranger and the animal must be able to study each other, which means that they must be within 30 feet of one another under normal visibility conditions. Generally, influencing an animal in this way takes 1 minute, but, as with influencing people, it might take more or less time.

The ranger can also use this ability to influence a magical beast with an Intelligence score of 1 or 2, but he takes a -4 penalty on the check.

Nature Sense (Ex)
A ranger gains a +2 bonus on Knowledge (nature) and Survival checks.

Uncanny Dodge (Ex)
At 2nd level, a ranger retains his Dexterity bonus to AC (if any) even if he is caught flat-footed or struck by an invisible attacker. However, he still loses his Dexterity bonus to AC if immobilized. If a ranger already has uncanny dodge from a different class, he automatically gains improved uncanny dodge instead.

Not sure about this one, it just seemed a better thematic fit than evasion

Combat Style (Ex)(under construction)
At 3rd level, a ranger must select a combat style to pursue. This choice affects the characterís class features but does not restrict his selection of feats or special abilities in any way.

The combat styles are peerless archery, two-weapon fighting, marksmanship, great weaponry, single-weapon style and tooth-and-nail.*

In addition to the bonus feat the ranger may also choose a specific type of weapon suitable for his combat style and may experience the benefits of the Weapon Focus feat with that weapon.

The benefits of the rangerís chosen style apply only when he wears light or no armor. He loses all benefits of his combat style when wearing medium or heavy armor.

*- Only available to rangers with Natural Attacks.

More options.. No real reason why a ranger should be restricted to only archery or dual-wielding. Actual bonus feats yet to be determined

Predatory Focus (Ex)
At 4th level and beyond a ranger can enter a state of predatory focus. In such a state, a ranger temporarily gains a +4 bonus to Dexterity and Wisdom. He is also treated as having a +4 bonus to Charisma but only for Intimidate checks, and Charisma based skill checks against his favoured enemies. For the duration of the focus the Ranger is treated as having the Endurance feat. If he already has the Endurance feat the ranger receives an additional +2 to checks made with the Endurance feat. A ranger can voluntarily end this state but becomes fatigued for the duration of the current encounter.

A ranger can enter a predatory focus only once per encounter but can stay in a focused state for a number of rounds per day equal to his Constitution modifier x 1/4 of his ranger level(minimum 1 round). They do not need to be all used at once. Entering the state takes no time itself, but a ranger can only do it only during his action, not in response to someone else's action.

Out of Combat Predatory Focus lasts for a number of minutes equal to the number of rounds of it's duration in combat.

Improved Uncanny Dodge (Ex)
At 5th level and higher, a ranger can no longer be flanked. This defense denies a rogue the ability to sneak attack the ranger by flanking him, unless the attacker has at least four more rogue levels than the target has ranger levels. If a character already has uncanny dodge from a second class, the character automatically gains improved uncanny dodge instead, and the levels from the classes that grant uncanny dodge stack to determine the minimum level a rogue must be to flank the character.

see uncanny dodge

Trackless Step (Ex)
Starting at 6th level, a ranger leaves practically no trail in natural surroundings and cannot be tracked, except by a ranger that has at least 4 more levels. He may choose to leave a trail if so desired.
Classes that grant trackless step stack to determine the minimum level a ranger must be in order to track the individual.

Woodland Stride (Ex)
Starting at 6th level, a ranger may move through any sort of undergrowth (such as natural thorns, briars, overgrown areas, and similar terrain) at his normal speed and without taking damage or suffering any other impairment. However, thorns, briars, and overgrown areas that have been magically manipulated to impede motion still affect him.

Swift Stalker (Ex)
From 7th level, while in a state of predatory focus a ranger's land speed is faster than the norm for his race by +10 feet. This benefit applies only when he is wearing no armor, light armor, or medium armor and not carrying a heavy load. Apply this bonus before modifying the rangerís speed because of any load carried or armor worn.

Improved Combat Style (Ex)(under construction)
At 8th level, a rangerís aptitude in his chosen combat style improves.

In addition the ranger may choose another weapon type suitable for his chosen weapon style to apply the Weapon Focus feat too, or may take either: Greater Weapon Focus or Weapon Specialization in the weapon he initially chose for Weapon Focus with his combat style.

As before, the benefits of the rangerís chosen style apply only when he wears light or no armor. He loses all benefits of his combat style when wearing medium or heavy armor.

Swift Tracker (Ex)
Beginning at 9th level, a ranger can move at his normal speed while following tracks without taking the normal -5 penalty. He takes only a -10 penalty (instead of the normal -20) when moving at up to twice normal speed while tracking.

Heightened Predatory Focus (Ex)
At 11th level, a rangerís bonuses to Dexterity, Wisdom and conditional Charisma bonus each increase to +6 while in a state of predatory focus.

In addition the duration of his predatory focused if quadrupled out of combat.

Camouflage (Ex)
A ranger of 12th level or higher can use the Hide skill in any sort of natural terrain, even if the terrain doesnít grant cover or concealment.

Greater Combat Style (Ex)(under construction)
At 13th level, a rangerís aptitude in his chosen combat style improves again.

In addition the ranger may choose another weapon type suitable for his chosen weapon style to apply the Weapon Focus feat too, or may take either: Greater Weapon Focus or Weapon Specialization in a weapon type he chose for weapon focus with his combat style.

As before, the benefits of the rangerís chosen style apply only when he wears light or no armor. He loses all benefits of his combat style when wearing medium or heavy armor.

Hide in Plain Sight (Ex)
While in any sort of natural terrain, a ranger of 16th level or higher can use the Hide skill even while being observed.

Tireless Predator (Ex)
At 17th level and higher, a ranger no longer becomes fatigued when coming down from his predatory focus and can maintain the state out of combat for a number of hours equal to his constitution modifier.

Combat Style Mastery (Ex)(under construction)
At 18th level, a rangerís aptitude in his chosen combat style reaches it's peak.

In addition the ranger may choose another weapon type suitable for his chosen combat style to apply the Weapon Focus feat too, or may take either: Greater Weapon Focus or Weapon Specialization in a weapon type he chose for weapon focus with his combat style. If the ranger has Weapon Focus, Greater Weapon Focus and Weapon Specialization in the same weapon type all from the combat style he may instead receive the benefits of Greater Weapon Specialization with the chosen weapon.

Apex Predator (Ex)
At 19th level, a rangerís bonuses to Dexterity, Wisdom and conditional Charisma bonus each increase to +8 while in a state of predatory focus.

EDIT(added): In addition while in a state of Predatory Focus the ranger is treated as having the Diehard feat even if he doesn't meet the prerequisites.

Bane Of Enemies (Ex)

Any weapon you wield as part of your chosen combat style is treated as a bane weapon against your favored enemy or enemies.

Animal Companion (Ex)
A ranger may begin play with an animal companion. This animal is a loyal companion that accompanies the ranger on his adventures as appropriate for its kind.

A 1st-level rangerís companion is completely typical for its kind except as noted below. As a ranger advances in level, the animalís power increases as shown on the table. If a ranger releases his companion from service, he may gain a new one by spending 24 uninterrupted hours with an appropiate animal(Usually after using Wild Empathy). A ranger can also replace an animal companion that has perished in this way.

A rangerís animal companion is different from a normal animal of its kind in many ways. A rangerís animal companion is superior to a normal animal of its kind and has special powers, as described below.

Animal Companion Basics
Use the base statistics for a creature of the companionís kind, but make the following changes.

Basically an Animal Companion always struck me as something a Ranger would have rather than a druid, it hasn't changed overly much except now it uses the ranger's level instead of an effective druid level and changed slightly due to lack of spellcasting

Animal Companion
{table=head]Ranger Level|Bonus HD|Natural Arm. Adj.|Str\Dex Adj.|Bonus Tricks|Special

1st-2nd|
+0HD|
+0|
+0|
1|Link.

3rd-5th|
+2HD|
+2|
+1|
2|Evasion.

6th-8th|
+4HD|
+4|
+2|
3|Communal Focus.

9th-11th|
+6HD|
+6|
+3|
4|Devotion.

12th-14th|
+8HD|
+8|
+4|
5|Multiattack.

15th-17th|
+10HD|
+10|
+5|
6|Improved Evasion.

18th-20th|
+12HD|
+12|
+6|
7|Improved Multiattack.[/table]

Link (Ex)
A ranger can handle his animal companion as a free action, or push it as a move action, even if he doesnít have any ranks in the Handle Animal skill. The ranger gains a +4 circumstance bonus on all wild empathy checks and Handle Animal checks made regarding an animal companion.

Evasion (Ex)
If an animal companion is subjected to an attack that normally allows a Reflex saving throw for half damage, it takes no damage if it makes a successful saving throw.

Communal Focus (Ex)
At the rangerís option, whenever he enter's a state of predatory focus he may have any animal companions also enter such a state. The animal companion must be within 5 feet of him at the time of entering the predatory focus to receive the benefit. If the animal companion moves farther than 30 feet away from the ranger the focused state will end for that companion at the end of the round, and will not affect the animal again, even if it returns to the ranger before the duration expires. (Although a ranger can re-enter a focused state to again share it with his companion)

Devotion (Ex)
An animal companion gains a +4 morale bonus on Will saves against enchantment spells and effects.

Multiattack
An animal companion gains Multiattack as a bonus feat if it has three or more natural attacks and does not already have that feat. If it does not have the requisite three or more natural attacks, the animal companion instead gains a second attack with its primary natural weapon, albeit at a -5 penalty.

Improved Evasion (Ex)
When subjected to an attack that normally allows a Reflex saving throw for half damage, an animal companion takes no damage if it makes a successful saving throw and only half damage if the saving throw fails.

Improved Multiattack
An animal companion gains Improved Multiattack as a bonus feat if it has three or more natural attacks and does not already have that feat. If it does not have the requisite three or more natural attacks, the animal companion instead makes the second attack with its primary natural weapon at a -2 penalty.(Instead of the normal -5)

Ranger Combat Styles
{table=head]Style Level|
Peerless Archery|
Two-Weapon Combat|
Single-Weapon Style|
Sword and Board|
Great Weaponry|
Marskmanship|
Tooth and Nail

Combat Style|
Rapid Shot|
Two-Weapon Fighting|
X|
Shield Specialization|
X|
Rapid Reload|
Improved Natural Armor

Improved Combat Style|
Manyshot|
Improved Two-Weapon Fighting|
X|
Improved Shield Bash|
X|
Crossbow Sniper|
Multiattack

Greater Combat Style|
Improved Precise Shot|
Greater Two-Weapon Fighting|
X|
Active Shield Defense|
X|
Penetrating Shot|
Versatile Armament

Combat Style Mastery|
Greater Rapid Shot|
True Ambidexterity|
X|
Agile Shield Fighter|
X|
Master Crossbow Sniper|
Improved Natural Attack[/table]

Combat Style
If the ranger selects peerless archery, he is treated as having the Rapid Shot feat, even if he does not have the normal prerequisites for that feat.

If the ranger selects two-weapon combat, he is treated as having the Two-Weapon Fighting feat, even if he does not have the normal prerequisites for that feat.

If the ranger selects sword and board, he is treated as having the shield specialization feat*, with any shield he is proficient with.

If the ranger selects marksmanship, he is treated as having the rapid reload feat with any crossbow he is proficient with.

If the ranger selects tooth-and-nail, he is treated as having the Improved Natural Armor feat for each step he has achieved with his chosen combat style. (+1 Natural Armor at 3rd level upto a maximum of +4 Natural Armor at 18th level)

If the ranger did not have a natural armor rating he is treated as having a natural armor of +0 for the purposes of selecting this feat.


Improved Combat Style
If the ranger selected peerless archery at 3rd level, he is treated as having the Manyshot feat, even if he does not have the normal prerequisites for that feat.

If the ranger selected two-weapon combat at 3rd level, he is treated as having the Improved Two-Weapon Fighting feat, even if he does not have the normal prerequisites for that feat.

If the ranger selected sword and board at 3rd level, he is treated as having the Improved Shield Bash feat with any shield he is proficient with.

Crossbow Sniper
If the ranger selected marksmanship at 3rd level, whenever he uses a crossbow you gain a bonus on damage rolls equal to 1/2 your Dexterity bonus. If you have the skirmish or sneak attack ability, the maximum range at which you can make such attacks increases to 60 feet when you are using a crossbow.

If the ranger selected tooth-an-nail. at 3rd level, he is treated as having the Multiattack feat if he has three or more natural attacks. If he does not have the requisite three or more natural attacks, the ranger instead gains a second attack with its primary natural weapon, albeit at a -5 penalty.


Greater Combat Style

If the ranger selected peerless archery at 3rd level, he is treated as having the Improved Precise Shot feat, even if he does not have the normal prerequisites for that feat.

If the ranger selected two-weapon combat at 3rd level, he is treated as having the Greater Two-Weapon Fighting feat, even if he does not have the normal prerequisites for that feat.

If the ranger selected sword and board at 3rd level, he is treated as having the Active Shield Defense feat with any shield he is proficient with.

If the ranger selected marksmanship at 3rd level, he is treated as having the Penetrating Shot feat*, even if he does not have the normal prerequisites for that feat.

Versatile Armament
If the ranger selected tooth-and-nail at 3rd level, any of his natural weapons can adjust to emulate any substance required to overcome damage reduction. Similiar to the Shadow Striking (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20060303a&page=7) weapon special ability.


Combat Style Mastery

If the ranger selected peerless archery at 3rd level, he is treated as having the Greater Rapid Shot feat, even if he does not have the normal prerequisites for that feat.

As rapidshot except you may make 2 additional ranged attacks as a full attack action at your full base attack bonus with a -2 penalty. If you have the Improved Rapid Shot(CWar iirc) feat these extra attacks are made without penalty

True Ambidexterity
If the ranger selected two-weapon combat at 3rd level, any attacks he makes with his offhand weapon as part of his chosen combat style use his full strength modifier for damage.

If the ranger selected sword and board at 3rd level, he is treated as having the Agile Shield Fighter feat with any shield he is proficient with.

If the ranger selected marksmanship at 3rd level, whenever he uses the crossbow sniper feat the bonus to damage rolls is now equal to your full dexterity modifier. And the maximum range for precision based damage attacks increases an additional 30 feet.

If the ranger selected tooth-and-nail at 3rd level, he is treated as having the Improved Natural Attack feat with all of his natural weapons. In addition any natural attacks he makes can now overcome damage reduction as if they were magical weapons.

*- feat from PHBII


So that is what I have so far...be gentle :smalleek:

Temotei
2009-12-09, 06:20 PM
If desired instead of selecting a new favoured enemy the ranger can choose to increase the bonus against any one favored enemy by 2.

Why would anyone ever take this option? They're already getting +1 every level. Another +1 against one group of enemies isn't worth giving up +2 with another group, especially since you get +1 every 5 levels with every group. Also, keep consistent with your "favored" enemy or "favoured" enemy. I imagine "favoured" is the British spelling, so if you want that, keep it uniform throughout.


Uncanny Dodge (Ex)
At 2nd level, a ranger retains his Dexterity bonus to AC (if any) even if he is caught flat-footed or struck by an invisible attacker. However, he still loses his Dexterity bonus to AC if immobilized. If a ranger already has uncanny dodge from a different class, he automatically gains improved uncanny dodge instead.

I think it's fine to keep. Evasion fits too, though.


Combat Style (Ex)(under construction)
At 3rd level, a ranger must select a combat style to pursue. This choice affects the characterís class features but does not restrict his selection of feats or special abilities in any way.

The combat styles are Peerless Archery, Two-Weapon Fighting, Marksmanship, Great Weaponry, Single-Weapon Style and Tooth-and-Nail*

In addition to the bonus feat the ranger may also choose a specific type of weapon suitable for his combat style and may experience the benefits of the Weapon Focus feat with that weapon.

What's going to be the difference between peerless archery and marksmanship? I'm pretty sure you shouldn't capitalize the style names, also. You should also have a period after nail. This should be a nice expansion on the original ability. I'll be happy to see it when it comes up.


Predatory Focus (Ex)
At 4th level and beyond a ranger can enter a state of predatory focus. In such a state, a ranger temporarily gains a +4 bonus to Dexterity and Wisdom. He is also treated as having a +4 bonus to Charisma but only for Intimidate checks, and Charisma based skill checks againest his favoured enemies. For the duration of the focus the Ranger is treated as having the Endurance feat. If he already has the Endurance feat the ranger receives an additional +2 to checks made with the Endurance feat. A ranger can voluntarily end this state but becomes fatigued for the duration of the current encounter.


A ranger can enter a predatory focus only once per encounter but can stay in a focused state for a number of rounds per day equal to his Constitution modifier x 1/4 of his ranger level. They do not need to be all used at once. Entering the state takes no time itself, but a ranger can only do it only during his action, not in response to someone else's action.

After the formula for rounds per day in a focused state, you should put (minimum 1).


Swift Stalker (Ex)
From 7th level, while in a state of predatory focus a ranger's land speed is faster than the norm for his race by +10 feet. This benefit applies only when he is wearing no armor, light armor, or medium armor and not carrying a heavy load. Apply this bonus before modifying the rangerís speed because of any load carried or armor worn.

Why medium armor? The ranger's not even proficient with medium armor, and even if they were, they lose their other class features from wearing it.

Latronis
2009-12-09, 09:38 PM
Why would anyone ever take this option? They're already getting +1 every level. Another +1 against one group of enemies isn't worth giving up +2 with another group, especially since you get +1 every 5 levels with every group. Also, keep consistent with your "favored" enemy or "favoured" enemy. I imagine "favoured" is the British spelling, so if you want that, keep it uniform throughout.

Basically life-long habit, Though I am trying to keep the spellings of abilities in line with the standard rules. And the online spellcheck red lines annoy me.

I wanted to allow the option of say for example a character whose home was destroyed by fiends to focus more on Outsider(Evil) by neglecting to continue 'learning' about new foes. Letting the player focus on as many or few types as enemies as the ranger levels allow.

You may have a point though.. Any suggestions on how to allow the choice to 'extra specialize' but keeping both options of similar appeal?


I think it's fine to keep. Evasion fits too, though.

Evasion might be more useful, especially since there's a decent chance a ranger might not use uncanny dodge all that often. Also I don't particularly wanna give it out to just anyone who has a decent focus on agility. Although it does seem kind of odd that a ranger likely someone with peak reflexes and awareness doesn't have uncanny dodge, but then that can apply to evasion too. Hmm. I guess I'll take a good look at the favored enemies and see which is more useful more often uncanny dodge or evasion.


What's going to be the difference between peerless archery and marksmanship? I'm pretty sure you shouldn't capitalize the style names, also. You should also have a period after nail. This should be a nice expansion on the original ability. I'll be happy to see it when it comes up.

Archery = Bows
Marksmanship = Crossbows


After the formula for rounds per day in a focused state, you should put (minimum 1).

Indeed I should have.


Why medium armor? The ranger's not even proficient with medium armor, and even if they were, they lose their other class features from wearing it.

Failed copypasta (from the barb) Though I was considering advancing the class features upto medium armour since I competely neglected lv14 when i first wrote it out. Perhaps with a lower Arm. Check penalty. Though that may get a little screwy with certain Heavy armours as medium.

Temotei
2009-12-09, 11:10 PM
"Hello. I'm wearing mithral full plate, but it counts as medium armor, so I can still use my abilities. I win." :smallbiggrin:


You may have a point though.. Any suggestions on how to allow the choice to 'extra specialize' but keeping both options of similar appeal?

Maybe instead of having it just increase an additional +1, you could have it increase another +1, and the ranger can also get another favored enemy, except this one only gives a +1 bonus as well.

erikun
2009-12-09, 11:29 PM
Predatory Focus takes a rather large leap between Heightened > Tireless, jumping from CON modifier x 1/2 Ranger level rounds per day to CON modifier hours per day.

Why not make the Animal Companion one of the Combat Styles? Being a Falconer or Horseman can be just as difficult as swinging two swords around.

Latronis
2009-12-10, 12:43 AM
Predatory Focus takes a rather large leap between Heightened > Tireless, jumping from CON modifier x 1/2 Ranger level rounds per day to CON modifier hours per day.

Good point. Boosted Heightened to ranger level x con. Clarified I expect 1 in combat round to equal 1 minute out of combat.

So you might expect for example a jump from 25 minutes -> 1 hour -> 5 hours given a 20 con at lv20.


Why not make the Animal Companion one of the Combat Styles? Being a Falconer or Horseman can be just as difficult as swinging two swords around.

I can understand where you're coming from.. but I don't think it's worth giving up a combat style for it. There's too much feat investment to become competent yourself in a weapon or weapons if it goes that way. You become pretty much useless in combat if you don't invest your normal feats in combat feats if the companion dies until you can find a new one. And while some people may want to have the animal companion be the focus of the build I think I'd rather offer a section of feats to allow it or a PrC, Instead of punishing someone who wants to play a character who fights alongside the companion. Say having Yogi go up and give someone a hug before you stick an arrow through their neck.



"Hello. I'm wearing mithral full plate, but it counts as medium armor, so I can still use my abilities. I win."

Indeed.


Maybe instead of having it just increase an additional +1, you could have it increase another +1, and the ranger can also get another favored enemy, except this one only gives a +1 bonus as well.

I'm not sure i understand perfectly.

As written it should be

lv1: First Favored enemy +2 to certain skill checks and damage rolls.

lv5: Increase chosen favored enemy by +2 or choose a new favored enemy to receive a +2 to those skill checks and damage rolls.

Then increase all favored enemy bonuses by +1.

So a lv5 ranger could have Outsider(Evil) FE bonus of +5, or Outsider(Evil) +3 and Undead +3

But instead you'd recommend

lv1: Outsider(Evil) FE bonus of +2
lv5: Outsider(Evil) FE bonus becomes +4 and Undead FE bonus of +1

?

Temotei
2009-12-10, 12:51 AM
As written it should be

lv1: First Favored enemy +2 to certain skill checks and damage rolls.

lv5: Increase chosen favored enemy by +2 or choose a new favored enemy to receive a +2 to those skill checks and damage rolls.

Then increase all favored enemy bonuses by +1.

So a lv5 ranger could have Outsider(Evil) FE bonus of +5, or Outsider(Evil) +3 and Undead +3

But instead you'd recommend

lv1: Outsider(Evil) FE bonus of +2
lv5: Outsider(Evil) FE bonus becomes +4 and Undead FE bonus of +1

Ah. I must have either misread your entry on the ability or we're just having a major misunderstanding. What you have is:

Level 1: Outsider (Evil) FE bonus of +2
Level 5: Outsider (Evil) FE bonus of +3/Undead +3

What I meant was:

Level 1: Outsider (Evil) FE bonus of +2
Level 5: Outsider (Evil) FE bonus of +4/Undead +2.

That way, you can still focus more on one group of enemies (as levels increase, the bonuses will start to get more separated), while still having some bonuses in other groups of enemies, so you're not just a specialist on evil outsiders.

Latronis
2009-12-10, 01:09 AM
Ok so All existing favored enemies increase by +2. (from +2 -> +4 -> +6 etc) And the new one just sits on +2.

lv1 Outsider(Evil) +2.
lv5 Outsider(Evil) +4, undead +2.
lv10 Outsider(Evil) +6, undead +4, Monstrous Humanoid +2.
lv15 Outsider(Evil) +8, undead +6, Monstrous Humanoid +4, Dragon +2.
lv20 Outsider(Evil) +10, undead +8, Monstrous Humanoid +6, Dragon +4, Construct +2.


??

Temotei
2009-12-10, 01:11 AM
Ok so All existing favored enemies increase by +2. (from +2 -> +4 -> +6 etc) And the new one just sits on +2.

lv1 Outsider(Evil) +2.
lv5 Outsider(Evil) +4, undead +2.
lv10 Outsider(Evil) +6, undead +4, Monstrous Humanoid +2.
lv15 Outsider(Evil) +8, undead +6, Monstrous Humanoid +4, Dragon +2.
lv20 Outsider(Evil) +10, undead +8, Monstrous Humanoid +6, Dragon +4, Construct +2.


??

Yep. Actually, now that I think about it, I'm pretty sure that's how the original favored enemy worked. :roach:

Latronis
2009-12-10, 01:24 AM
Yep. Actually, now that I think about it, I'm pretty sure that's how the original favored enemy worked. :roach:

Nah the original was only increase 1 of your favored enemies by +2.

so you could have: lv20 Outsider(Evil) +10, undead +2, Monstrous Humanoid +2, Dragon +2, Construct +2.

or: lv20 Outsider(Evil) +4, undead +4, Monstrous Humanoid +4, Dragon +4, Construct +2.

Or something inbetween. Which is great if you really hate something. Not so great if you mix it up.

And i didn't really wanna take the NWN track which results in:

lv20 Outsider(Evil) +10, undead +10, Monstrous Humanoid +10, Dragon +10, Construct +10.

Temotei
2009-12-10, 01:34 AM
Nah the original was only increase 1 of your favored enemies by +2.

so you could have: lv20 Outsider(Evil) +10, undead +2, Monstrous Humanoid +2, Dragon +2, Construct +2.

or: lv20 Outsider(Evil) +4, undead +4, Monstrous Humanoid +4, Dragon +4, Construct +2.

Or something inbetween. Which is great if you really hate something. Not so great if you mix it up.

And i didn't really wanna take the NWN track which results in:

lv20 Outsider(Evil) +10, undead +10, Monstrous Humanoid +10, Dragon +10, Construct +10.

Right. I like my idea then. :smalltongue:

Krazddndfreek
2009-12-10, 02:00 AM
Why didn't you just leave favored enemy as listed? Basically, if you didn't know, every time a ranger gets a new Favored Enemy, the bonuses against the previous ones increase by 2. He can also then choose to apply the new Favored Enemy to the same creature type for an extra plus two against the same creature type.

So, for example: Ranger levels up to fifth level and already has Favored Enemy (Dragon). He now gets a +4 bonus on Bluff, Listen, Sense Motive, Spot, and Survival checks against Dragons, in addition to +4 bonus damage against Dragons. He can now either choose another creature type for his new Favored Enemy this level, or, he can elect to select Favored Enemy (Dragon) to net him a +6 to damage and relevant skill checks made against dragons.

Forgive me if this has already been mentioned.

Latronis
2009-12-10, 02:44 AM
Why didn't you just leave favored enemy as listed? Basically, if you didn't know, every time a ranger gets a new Favored Enemy, the bonuses against the previous ones increase by 2. He can also then choose to apply the new Favored Enemy to the same creature type for an extra plus two against the same creature type.

So, for example: Ranger levels up to fifth level and already has Favored Enemy (Dragon). He now gets a +4 bonus on Bluff, Listen, Sense Motive, Spot, and Survival checks against Dragons, in addition to +4 bonus damage against Dragons. He can now either choose another creature type for his new Favored Enemy this level, or, he can elect to select Favored Enemy (Dragon) to net him a +6 to damage and relevant skill checks made against dragons.

Forgive me if this has already been mentioned.

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/Classes/ranger.htm#favoredEnemy

Favored Enemies don't automatically Increase as you level up, you only get to choose a new favored enemy and then increase one of your favored enemies(including the one just chosen if desired) by 2. So at 5th level if you chose dragon at lv1 and choose plant at lv5 you could have +4 vs dragons, +2 vs Plants. Or +2 vs Dragons, +4 Vs plants.

Also: Added a first draft of some combat styles to bottom of first post

Harperfan7
2009-12-10, 12:24 PM
How about Flawless Stride at 14th?

Latronis
2009-12-10, 12:50 PM
How about Flawless Stride at 14th?

Woodland Stride = Flawless Stride basically.

Though i may rename it just to remove that woodland imagery

Latronis
2009-12-11, 02:06 AM
Favored Enemy adjusted to match Temotei's suggestion. I like the numbers that way. And it's certainly more straightforward.

Considering compressing Humanoids down to less options. I don't think something like an elf is inherently different enough to justify bonuses only againest specific subtypes. Though humanoids of different sizes are probably physically different and vary more socially.

Thinking...

Humanoid(Aquatic)
Large humanoids
Medium humanoids
Small humanoids
Humanoid(Goblin)

Anything that is essentially animal like humanoids like gnolls and lizard folks i'll likely qualify as monstrous humanoids anyway.

Also I might slip evasion in yet at a lower level with a weaker ability and slot cunning evasion in at lv14. (Successful save with evasion allows a 5-foot step as the same action to hide) Links the evasion ability with rangers camouflage and hide in plain sight. Though that still leaves uncanny dodge up in the air on whether it should be in or out.

Opinions on Combat Styles I have down atm appreciated.