Best Core Spells For a Level 20 Sorcerer

[Lysander]

In your opinion what spells would you pick to have as a level 20 sorcerer? A few are obvious must-haves (teleport, true seeing, etc.) but with a limited number of spells known there are a lot of awesome spells jousting for a spot.

[Pyro_Azer]

If you have access to dragon material there are items called knowstones that will help with your worries of few spells.

Anyway:
Timestop
Glitterdust
Dimension Door
Disintegrate
Maze
Foresight
Haste
Slow
Evard"s Black Tenticles

[Optimystik]

Obligatory Handbook (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=2180.0)

[alisbin]

depends on what your going to use him for, blasting? buffing? worldbreaking?

[Lysander]

depends on what your going to use him for, blasting? buffing? worldbreaking?

Multi-purpose I suppose. Being able to hold his own in a fight is necessary, but too much focus on damage and none on buffs/utility would be a waste. So the spell list should be as general and widely applicable as possible.

[subject42]

Grease.

ALWAYS take grease. Not only is it a useful spell, but the double-entendre and pun uses multiply its utility a thousand fold.

[Lin Bayaseda]

It's funny that you asked, since the archenemy of my PCs, Lin Bayaseda, whose name I bear, is, in fact, a level 20 Sorceress.

So, here's the spell list:
Level 0: Dancing Lights, Ghost Sound, Touch of Fatigue, Acid Splash, Mage Hand, Arcane Mark, Prestidigitation, Open/Close, Message
Level 1: Magic Missile, Alarm, Identify, Shield, Disguise Self
Level 2: Invisibility, Glitterdust, Bear’s Endurance, Cat’s Grace, Detect Thoughts
Level 3: Nondetection, Haste, Lightning Bolt, Clairvoyance
Level 4: Stoneskin, Fire Shield, Hallucinatory Terrain, Animate Dead
Level 5: Cone of Cold, Dominate Person, Persistent Image, Contact Other Plane
Level 6: Greater Dispel Magic, Contingency, Chain Lightning
Level 7: Prismatic Spray, Limited Wish, Reverse Gravity
Level 8: Greater Planar Binding, Demand, Clone
Level 9: Time Stop, Wail of the Banshee, Summon Monster IX

She also can has the following either from magic items or as supernatural or spell-like abilities due her demonic heritage:

Fly, Dimension Door, Fear, Poison, Gate, Suggestion, Detect Magic, Detect Good/Evil/Law/Chaos, Mirror Image, Shatter, Knock, Protection from Good/Evil/Law/Chaos, Spell Turning, True Seeing, Bestow Curse, Remove Curse, Greater Invisibility, Banishment, Simulacrum, Gaseous Form.

(I would definitely put True Seeing and Dimension Door, possibly Fly too, on her spell list if she didn't have them from other sources)

Bear in mind some spells were chosen for effect rather than raw power. It's always nice when the PCs have to run into a previously-vanquished foe again ... in undead form. Finally, she's from third-edition-land, where Cat's Grace and Bear's Endurance last for 1hr/level as opposed to 1min/level, which kind of affects their power.

[Icarus]

This is the list I would use:

1. Shield, Grease, Silent Image, Magic Missile, Mage Armor
2. Shatter, Mirror Image, Gust of Wind, Scorching Ray, Invisibility
3. Magic Circle Against Evil, Phantom Steed, Vampiric Touch, Haste
4. Shadow Conjuration, Dimensional Anchor, Enervation, Black Tentacles
5. Teleport, Wall of Stone, Mirage Arcana, Telekinesis
6. Greater Dispel Magic, Freezing Sphere, Disintegrate
7. Reverse Gravity, Prismatic Spray, Limited Wish
8. Sunburst, Greater Prying Eyes, Irresistible Dance
9. Timestop, Shapechange, Crushing Hand

IMO, there is no "best" list. Every list is dependant on the playstyle and type of campaign the PC will be used in. I chose what I did because you could potentially find multiple uses for every spell every single day.

[Lin Bayaseda]

This is the list I would use:
1. ... Mage Armor
Oh yeah, would've used this one too, if she hadn't a +7 armor bonus from an item.

[Runestar]

1) Ray of enfeeblement, grease, whatever
2) Glitterdust, see invisible, mirror image, whatever
3) Slow, stinking cloud, fly, ray of exhaustion/haste
4) Enervation, solid fog, shadow conjuration,
5) Teleport, feeblemind, ???
6) Greater dispel magic, Repulsion, Flesh to Stone
7) ???, forcecage, limited wish
8) Irresistable dance, maze,
9) Timestop, wish?, shapechange/summon monster 9

Take heighten spell to ensure DCs stay at a respectable lv.
Crap, seems I can't read.

[Gralamin]

In your opinion what spells would you pick to have as a level 20 sorcerer? A few are obvious must-haves (teleport, true seeing, etc.) but with a limited number of spells known there are a lot of awesome spells jousting for a spot.

Don't forget Runestaves for a few extra spells.

[AtopTheMountain]

Imprisonment.

Walk up to the BBEG and with one touch spell (and a failed save) all your problems are gone!

Unless someone finds that location and casts Freedom... then you have a problem. Again.

[The Glyphstone]

1) Ray of enfeeblement, grease, whatever
2) Glitterdust, wings of cover, whatever
3) Slow, stinking cloud, fly, ray of dizziness
4) Enervation, wings of flurry, orb of acid, greater mirror image
5) Teleport, feeblemind, ???
6) Greater dispel magic, Repulsion, Flesh to Stone
7) Radiant assault, forcecage, solipsism
8) Irresistable dance, maze, avascular mass
9) Timestop, Maw of chaos, shapechange


Aren't all of these non-core?

[Icarus]

Imprisonment.

Walk up to the BBEG and with one touch spell (and a failed save) all your problems are gone!

Unless someone finds that location and casts Freedom... then you have a problem. Again.

For that matter, Trap the soul does that for you, only without the save. If you know the target's name all you have to do is get them to touch the gem. No save allowed. Its 1000gp per hit die though, so you don't want to be pulling that regularly against dragons or other high HD critters.

[Draz74]

Here's my favorite Core Sorcerer 20.

Note that this is purposely avoiding spells that are "too good": Alter Self, Polymorph, Polymorph Any Object, Shapechange, Gate. Also that there's a Cleric in the same party with the Travel domain; otherwise I would have to fit in Teleport somewhere. (It still wouldn't be a bad idea, actually; but it doesn't fit the character's personality.)

I'm not claiming this guy is optimal, but he's reasonably flexible at least.

0) Resistance, Detect Magic, Detect Poison, Read Magic, Daze, Ghost Sound, Message, Arcane Mark, Prestidigitation
1) Protection from Law, Shield, Grease, Unseen Servant, Ray of Enfeeblement
2) Resist Energy, Glitterdust, Web, Scorching Ray, Mirror Image
3) Phantom Steed, Stinking Cloud, Haste, Slow
4) Solid Fog, Confusion, Greater Invisibility, Enervation
5) Wall of Stone, Telepathic Bond, Persistent Image, Telekinesis
6) Greater Dispel Magic, Mass Suggestion, Disintegrate
7) Spell Turning, Greater Shadow Conjuration, Limited Wish
8) Mind blank, Moment of Prescience, Greater Shadow Evocation
9) Prismatic Sphere, Foresight, Time Stop

[SilverStar]

Anything involving Gate, Time Stop, Maze, PaO, maybe Mental Pinnacle if you consider XPH as core...

Glitterdust, Grease, and an arcane version of Affinity Field would work, too.

[Lifeson]

Magic Missile. No save, instant damage? CASTCASTCASTCASTCASTCAST. :smallwink:


Also, Weird + Soul Bind. Kill, then make sure they don't come back.

Spell Turning, Simulacrum, Chain Lightning, and probably a few others at your discretion.

[Draz74]

Magic Missile. No save, instant damage? CASTCASTCASTCASTCASTCAST.

No. Wand. And you might end up surprised how seldom you get around to using that wand.

[absolmorph]

No. Wand. And you might end up surprised how seldom you get around to using that wand.
The only reason I've been using Magic Missile with my sorcerer is that he's yet to hit level 4 and get Glitter Dust.
And using Ray of Enfeeblement on kobolds just seems pointless when there's at least 20 of them and the paladin got them to pee their pants and run away.

[Draz74]

And using Ray of Enfeeblement on kobolds just seems pointless when there's at least 20 of them and the paladin got them to pee their pants and run away.

Yes, that would be a waste of spell slots for sure. However, wounding/killing two of them per Magic Missile spell arguably is a waste too, since the Paladin will make them pee their pants and run away anyway. Even if they come back.

If you're going to waste spells on such mooks at all (and at this point, plinking away with a crossbow might actually be effective!), at least use a spell that was intended to deal with more than one target. Sleep, Color Spray, heck, even Burning Hands might be better than Magic Missile in this instance.

[Tyndmyr]

If you can get MiC, skip the following spells: Magic Missile, Light, Teleport, and Fireball.

Why? Because there is an inexpensive magic item set that allows you to cast trade spells for them spontaniously.

Also, runestaves, for the same reason.

[Splendor]

Really depends what else is in the party, but here ya go...
0- Prestidigitation, Read Magic, Detect Magic, Mending, Light, Acid Splash, Message, Open/Close, Amanuensis
1- Low Light vision, Shield, Feather Fall, Magic Missile, Ray of Enfeeblement
2- Web, Alter Self, Rope Trick, Scorching Ray, See Invis
3- Dispel Magic, Mage Armor (Greater), Fire Ball
4- Superior Darkvision, Evard's Black Tentacles (no SR), Charm Monster, Celerity (PHB2)
5- Break Enchantment, Cloud Kill (no SR), Teleport, Vitriolic Sphere (No SR)
6- True Seeing, Contingency, Tenser's Transformation
7- Energy Immunity, Limited wish, Reverse gravity (No SR/sometimes no Save)
8- Charm monster (mass), Otto’s Irresistible Dance (no Save), Superior Invisibility
9- Summon Golem (PHB 2), Time Stop, Effulgent Rpuration

Other possibilities: Water breathing, Unseen Servant, Scrying, Orb of Acid (no SR), Greater Dispel Magic, spell engine, Cloak of the sea.