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View Full Version : Base Class to Enter Chameleon PrC



EdroGrimshell
2010-04-01, 05:27 PM
I am planning on playing a chameleon in an upcoming campaign, however, i am not sure what base class to go with.

Currently, i have my character as a changeling with able learner, but that's it. we're starting at 3rd level, are allowed one flaw and one trait, and my character is going to be an infiltrator for an intrigue/espionage-style game.

Factotum is not allowed

Irreverent Fool
2010-04-01, 05:29 PM
Soon as I saw the topic, I wanted to hop in and say "play a factotum". Almost missed your last line, too.

For your role as an infiltrator, rogue is a pretty sure bet. I think Beguiler can make the prereqs, too, and out-of-the-box comes with skills and abilities specifically tailored to that sort of interaction.

obnoxious
sig

deuxhero
2010-04-01, 05:43 PM
Warlock is fairly good, but it's more of a class that likes to dip into Chameleon(as the floating feat is quite good for them).

Lyndworm
2010-04-01, 05:45 PM
Rogue, and pick up the Changeling Rogue substitution levels. Trade some of your trap-related abilities for 10 skill points a level and the ability to take 10 on social skills.

Devils_Blind
2010-04-01, 05:51 PM
Binder with City-Slicker, though that would require a flaw.

Eldariel
2010-04-01, 05:54 PM
In addition to the mentioned (particularly Binder & Rogue), Martial Rogue is an excellent basis getting you lots of versatile abilities over the levels feeding you into Chameleon nicely. Scout can also work nicely.

ShneekeyTheLost
2010-04-01, 05:56 PM
Rogue, and pick up the Changeling Rogue substitution levels. Trade some of your trap-related abilities for 10 skill points a level and the ability to take 10 on social skills.

This. Then pick up the racial feat to be able to fool Divination effects

nargbop
2010-04-01, 06:03 PM
Artificer. Floating feat = you don't have to take any Craft feats at all.

Jack_Simth
2010-04-01, 06:05 PM
I am planning on playing a chameleon in an upcoming campaign, however, i am not sure what base class to go with.

Currently, i have my character as a changeling with able learner, but that's it. we're starting at 3rd level, are allowed one flaw and one trait, and my character is going to be an infiltrator for an intrigue/espionage-style game.

Factotum is not allowed
Depends on what you want to do with him.

If you want to be able to craft items, you need a spellcasting entry (Bard or Beguiler, usually, although a Cloistered Cleric can do well too), as you have to qualify for whatever you use on the flexible feat, and you can't use your focus to qualify for things - which means unless you've got actual caster levels, you'll never be able to Craft anything. A Beguiler-5/Chameleon X, taking Practiced Spellcaster (Beguiler) at 6th, and maybe Craft Rod at 9th is remarkably flexible. Use Practiced Spellcaster to qualify for Craft Rod, and your flexible feat to snatch whatever metamagic effect you like... and use Craft Rod to make a Metamagic rod of it. You can also, of course, take Scribe Scroll and make spells, Craft Wondrous Item and make trinkets, Craft Magic Arms and Armor and make weapons and armor. You can fake being an Artificer that way (plus you get cheaper items during downtime ... although you miss out on Forge Ring and Craft Staff, as they need a higher caster level than 9).

Otherwise, you want a skill-based entry. Rogue, as many have mentioned, is a good one. A mixed Rogue/Martial class can also be useful.


Artificer. Floating feat = you don't have to take any Craft feats at all.
You will want Craft Rod, though.

Gaiwecoor
2010-04-01, 06:22 PM
I'm currently playing a changeling Spellthief heading toward Chameleon. It's making for a fun character.

Gnaeus
2010-04-01, 06:33 PM
I love my cloistered cleric 1, Swordsage 4, Chameleon X.

Good skill points throughout. You get wisdom to your AC and your martial strikes. Take divine focus for wisdom based spells at least until you reach chameleon 5 and just crank that wisdom as high as you can. Take Trickery domain for the required skills and pick a devotion to power with your turn attempts.

FMArthur
2010-04-01, 07:04 PM
If only someone were to homebrew the Chameleon into a base class so that a character concept concieved with only Chameleon in mind doesn't have to waste time being something else...

<_<

...

>_>

JaronK
2010-04-01, 07:08 PM
If only someone were to homebrew the Chameleon into a base class so that a character concept concieved with only Chameleon in mind doesn't have to waste time being something else...

I believe that's called a Factotum. Or maybe Binder.

JaronK

Draz74
2010-04-01, 07:13 PM
Full Chameleon, or just a 2-level dip?

If just a 2-level dip, does your DM allow building up a large amount of Soulmelds by "floating" to a different Shape Soulmeld feat each day? If so, go incarnum, or psionic with the Psycarnum Infusion feat. :smallamused:

Even without soulmeld shenanigans, I like Psion 18/Chameleon 2 even if it's not exactly optimal. Psion will have to be Telepath if you want to enter Chameleon at an early level.

I also recently had a cool idea for a Bard/Chameleon, but I can't remember what made it cool. Probably a Factotum dip ... :smalltongue:

Last Laugh
2010-04-01, 07:15 PM
I believe that's called a Factotum. Or maybe Binder.

JaronK
This, this is a joke right? Considering the source of the base class Chameleon comment...

FMArthur
2010-04-01, 07:16 PM
I believe that's called a Factotum. Or maybe Binder.

JaronK

They're not really the same. They play completely differently.

A Factotum is 15% of a wizard, 60% of a fighter, and 110% of a rogue at all times. A Chameleon is about 70-80% of one at a time. It seems like a huge generalist because of all the things on its list of abilities, but Chameleons are still specialists like other classes; their specialization changes, that's all. Binders are closer to that concept, but not to the same degree.

JaronK
2010-04-01, 07:19 PM
This, this is a joke right? Considering the source of the base class Chameleon comment...

More like snark. Two base classes basically do the Chameleon thing already. It's not identical, but it's close enough, much like the Palemaster -> Dread Necromancer.

JaronK

DementedFellow
2010-04-01, 07:33 PM
Artificer. Floating feat = you don't have to take any Craft feats at all.

The artificer gets his own fair share of crafting feats for free. Unless you're talking about the ones that cut down on the time and XP and money it takes.

Eldonauran
2010-04-01, 07:38 PM
I am planning on playing a chameleon in an upcoming campaign, however, i am not sure what base class to go with.

Currently, i have my character as a changeling with able learner, but that's it. we're starting at 3rd level, are allowed one flaw and one trait, and my character is going to be an infiltrator for an intrigue/espionage-style game.

I've had some fun times with a Duskblade that takes levels in Prestige Bard (one or two levels) and then goes Chameleon. Its really MAD but if you've got the stats to pull it off, the Duskblade sure can benefit from all the touch spells from which you can access.

Lycanthromancer
2010-04-01, 07:53 PM
I'd suggest martial rogue as well, although you could do some interesting things with martial rogue 4 (take the changeling ACFs)/dungeoncrasher fighter 6/chameleon 10.

Person_Man
2010-04-01, 07:59 PM
The best trick in the Chameleon's bag is their flexibility.

I suggest a psionic, Tome of Battle, or Incarnum build. That way you can use your floating feat to pick a new power, maneuver, stance, or soulmeld every morning to suit your current needs (via Expanded Knowledge, Martial Stance, Martial Study, or Shape Soulmeld). You can get another floating Fighter feat with the Heroics spell (Spell Compendium).

If you go Warblade, I would also take Exotic Weapon Proficiency feat, and learn what it can do (www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=5266526). You can swap this out to be any exotic weapon each morning using the Warblade's Weapon Aptitude ability. Or you can swap out Warblade for one level of Master of Masks (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20070105a&page=3), as it gives you access to every Exotic Weapon.

Put this all together with the ability to choose new spells off of any list every morning (hint: take a look at 3rd and 4th level Blackguard, Paladin, Ranger, and Assassin spells. Some of them are quite powerful for the ECL that a Chameleon can get them at) and you're set.

EdroGrimshell
2010-04-01, 08:02 PM
I am planning on taking full chameleon

I've been toying with three classes so far, bard, rogue or spellthief. The character is part of a three man party with a human female hexblade/binder that essentially is a witch, and an azurin incarnate that acts as the closest thing to the party healer

As you can tell, the party is more about role-playing than optimization

I'll consider master of masks

Lycanthromancer
2010-04-01, 08:05 PM
If you're going for pure flexibility, shaper is a great way to go. It has poor BAB, but it's actually somewhat of a NAD class (Non Attribute Dependent), since, yes, it does require some Int to manifest, but its signature abilities rarely require saving throws, and are extremely power point-efficient. If you don't need any powers above 4th or 5th level, you could go shaper 10/chameleon 10 and creative use of your lower-level abilities won't make you feel like you're giving up much at all.

PhoenixRivers
2010-04-01, 08:59 PM
I like ninja. Makes for an unusual blend.

JerichoPenumbra
2010-04-01, 10:40 PM
I actually have a character who is in an identical situation as in starting at lvl 3 Changeling w/ Able learner, aiming for chameleon,...has a flaw... and is the infiltrator of the group... creepy. The thing is he's using racial substitution for rogue, so with his 18 Int he started out with 84 skill points... at third level. If you're aiming for flexibility of infiltration/impersonation the character can do then I recommend racial substitution for rogue for the sheer amount of skills you have access to. Before you even enter the PrC you can "be" anyone already by virtue of being a skill-monkey and levels in the class only broaden and augment your capabilities. If you're going for a more focused effort, I'd still recommend rogue for all the skills you can have max ranks in.

Everyman
2010-04-02, 09:20 AM
I'm found of rogue 4 / fighter 1. Its gives you a few extra die of sneak attack, evasion, uncanny dodge, proficiency with all weapons and armor, and a bonus feat. Helps lay the groundwork to literally be anything.

Likewise, full rogue is always good (especially if you do take your racial sub. levels).

Mark Hall
2010-04-02, 09:31 AM
As someone else mentioned, I like Warlock if you're going as a dip into Chameleon; it allows you to switch out one of your Invocations a day, or use many of the Craft feats when you get to that level.

Of course, Rogue or Bard are also good, core, options. Bards have a similar advantage to Warlocks in that they can just ride the "bonus spell known" feat (or bonus spell per day, for that matter) until they need something specific. Also, with the floating feat, skill focus feats become more viable as short-term investments (i.e. "I am going to spend today learning spells for my wizardy stuff. I am going to make my floating feat Skill Focus: Spellcraft so I have a better chance at it). Another fun floating feat: Open Minded. Have 5 skill points that you can shuffle around each day.