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Balor01
2010-05-14, 08:09 AM
How much do, in your opinion, these bonuses (Supernatural abilities) increase monsters' CR?

Anti magic field, caster lvl 20 (at will, dismiss as free action) +? CR
Disjunction on self, caster lvl 20 (at will) +? CR
Disjunction on self, caster lvl 20 (once per day) +? CR
Disjunction on target, caster lvl 20 (once per day) +? CR
Constant emanation of poison/acid cloud, offering total concealment, unless blown away by strong winds (Ex, unsupressable by AMF) +? CR

Greenish
2010-05-14, 08:20 AM
Obviously, how much harder those make the monster depends on it's other abilities. That said, Disjunction is just bad taste.

Eldariel
2010-05-14, 08:20 AM
Anti magic field, caster lvl 20 (at will, dismiss as free action) +? CR

Is activating it a free action too? 'cause then it's completely sick; basically, it's able to use magic equipment while people fighting it can't. Easily CR+2 and could be 3. Though depends on the original abilities; if the creature already had 9th level spellcasting, chances are this wouldn't change much.


Disjunction on self, caster lvl 20 (at will) +? CR

Ehh. Depends on the creature's original abilities. This would fall under "Don't" in my books though, simply due to the fact that it punishes martial types and doesn't hurt spellcasters especially (though it does make illusionary defenses and the like uninteresting). If you must, CR +2 or so for lower level stuff, with +Infinite annoyance factor. On higher levels, CR +1 for stuff with 9th level casting (Su abilities are far more potent than spells still since they're uncounterable, undetectable and so on).


Disjunction on self, caster lvl 20 (once per day) +? CR

Almost as bad since most things don't live to use standard action abilities that don't directly destroy opponents more than once in a combat anyways. Same as above, unless it's on the edge of CR anyways.


Disjunction on target, caster lvl 20 (once per day) +? CR

Yeah, no. CR +3 on lower level monsters, CR +1 if it can cast Disjunction anyways. This one is just ass.


Constant emanation of poison/acid cloud, offering total concealment, unless blown away by strong winds (Ex, unsupressable by AMF) +? CR

Depends. It's a huge hindrance for martial types, but pretty minor for casters (True Strike ignores concealment-based miss chances and they don't spend much time near such things). CR +1-2 or so.


I'll repeat though, Supernatural Disjunction is only for real cutthroat games with only classes that don't really need equipment, and even there it's an incredibly powerful, not to mention vexing, ability.

Foryn Gilnith
2010-05-14, 08:27 AM
How much do, in your opinion, these bonuses (Supernatural abilities) increase monsters' CR?

Anti magic field, caster lvl 20 (at will, dismiss as free action) +? CR
Disjunction on self, caster lvl 20 (at will) +? CR
Disjunction on self, caster lvl 20 (once per day) +? CR
Disjunction on target, caster lvl 20 (once per day) +? CR
Constant emanation of poison/acid cloud, offering total concealment, unless blown away by strong winds (Ex, unsupressable by AMF) +? CR

I'm assuming all of these activate as a standard action, save for the last.
For the last one, consider looking at Nightmare's smoke ability for comparison.
Disjunction that has the capability to affect anyone in the party is a bad idea. Does "Disjunction on self" simply means removing all the debuffs affecting it, or does it means a Disjunction effect centered on the monster?

Balor01
2010-05-14, 04:11 PM
It means a Disjunction effect centered on the monster, meaning it can disjunct itself from all spell effects AND force-like thingies.

lsfreak
2010-05-14, 04:25 PM
It means a Disjunction effect centered on the monster, meaning it can disjunct itself from all spell effects AND force-like thingies.

And destroy everyone's gear around it. Yea, no. There's a reason there's the unspoken rule that no one, ever, touches disjunction. If you want it to be a dispel, homebrew a similar spell that does that without wiping out an entire party's 2.5 million gp worth of items.