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pandapandapie
2006-06-06, 04:34 PM
Okay, so a friend of mine and I were talking about this yesterday. What would happen if Wolverine got injected with "the cure". His adamantium coating on his bones isn't part of his mutant-ness I know, so he wouln't lose that, but what about the claws? Would they dissapear? Would they still be there but he would just lose the abillity to make them go in and out? My friend said that in the comics once, Magneto pulled all the adamantium out of his body and he still had claws made of bone. That would mean that they are part of his mutation but if that's the case, would the bone dissapear and he would just have hollow claws made out of adamantium? Would he still be able to retract those?

I don't know.

AmoDman
2006-06-06, 04:54 PM
As far as the movies are concerned, it's the exact same thing as beast. Yes, his physiology would revert to that of a normal human, aka, no claws. The titanium would most likely still be there, but not attatched to bones he can naturally control anymore...as for the comics, though, I've heard it murmured that both Wolverine and Beast might actually be "real" humans, from tribes of some sort that weren't modified with the X factor. Though I assume "the cure" to which you refer to is the movie version, so there you have it.

percyprune
2006-06-06, 04:54 PM
The comics once had a situation where Wolverine lost his powers. He kept his claws, but lost his ability to regenerate. This meant that whenever he snikt his claws out, he'd start bleeding and would have to heal naturally. Suffice to say he lost a lot of blood each time he got into a fight.

anphorus
2006-06-06, 05:06 PM
Also adamantium is a highly toxic substance, so unless that was removed before he was injected with the cure, the metal inside of him would kill him.

The Vorpal Tribble
2006-06-06, 06:33 PM
The claws are still attached to tendons and the like and would still work, but sure, he'd half bleed to death each time.


Also adamantium is a highly toxic substance
Is it really? Never heard that before, but then again I've never read the comic books.

Vaynor
2006-06-06, 07:30 PM
As far as the movies are concerned, it's the exact same thing as beast. Yes, his physiology would revert to that of a normal human, aka, no claws. The titanium would most likely still be there, but not attatched to bones he can naturally control anymore...as for the comics, though, I've heard it murmured that both Wolverine and Beast might actually be "real" humans, from tribes of some sort that weren't modified with the X factor. Though I assume "the cure" to which you refer to is the movie version, so there you have it.
Actually, Beast's blue fur is a secondary mutation, for the first comics, he had no fur, just unnatural acrobatic abilities. And also, Marvel did a Wolverine history comic series for a few, and he grew up on a farm but left because he couldn't get close to the women he loved. And, I believe Beast grew up in New York... or somewhere close to there.


The claws are still attached to tendons and the like and would *still work, but sure, he'd half bleed to death each time.
Yes, since the bones are from a mutation, they are an actual physical power, thus the ''cure" would only affect his ability to regenerate. *And, though I don't know from first-hand experience, having bones burst through your knuckles would hurt a hell of a lot, and most likely result in your death.

Also, I believe that once in the comics, someone asked Wolverine whether it hurt when they burst through, and he goes "hurts every time" as he *shings* them out. *That may have been in the movie...
Wolverine is not invulnerable to pain, he's just used to it by now.

pandapandapie
2006-06-07, 01:07 AM
As far as the movies are concerned, it's the exact same thing as beast. Yes, his physiology would revert to that of a normal human, aka, no claws. The titanium would most likely still be there, but not attatched to bones he can naturally control anymore...as for the comics, though, I've heard it murmured that both Wolverine and Beast might actually be "real" humans, from tribes of some sort that weren't modified with the X factor. Though I assume "the cure" to which you refer to is the movie version, so there you have it.
The first place I actually heard about "the cure" was in Joss Whedon's series of X-Men comics (I think it was called Astonishing X-Men but I'm not sure about that). I only read the first TPB though and never got the chance to see anything after that (if anything after that has even been written yet).


The comics once had a situation where Wolverine lost his powers. He kept his claws, but lost his ability to regenerate. This meant that whenever he snikt his claws out, he'd start bleeding and would have to heal naturally. Suffice to say he lost a lot of blood each time he got into a fight.
I know that would happen since he'd lose his healing factor but I'm wondering if he could even make them come out still.


Also adamantium is a highly toxic substance, so unless that was removed before he was injected with the cure, the metal inside of him would kill him.
Are you talking about the adamantium in the comics? I know that adamantium is a metal used in a lot of fictional writing and I don't remember any mention of it being toxic in the Marvel-verse. Maybe you're thinking of it in something else.


The claws are still attached to tendons and the like and would *still work, but sure, he'd half bleed to death each time.
I don't know if that's true. They are attatched to tendons, but are they normal tendons that everyone has or did he grow special ones for controlling his claws as part of his mutation? I think that it's likely the latter, in which case the tendons wouldn't still be there after he was had "the cure" administered to him. Just like if Angel was injected, all his wing muscles would go away.

SpiderMew
2006-06-07, 02:44 AM
Well the problem is, does the "cure" actualy remove mutantly grown muscle systems, that were there sence birth, or does it only remove the awakend powers of the x facter

Also there was a time in the cartoon were they enterd the savage land, and Mr. Sinister had set up a device that nullified the powers of mutants, so wolverne couldnt heal but he could still pop out his claws, and he didnt die of posining

Though i do wonder how he could stand as he has to have super strength just enough to lift himself but not enough to do anything else with it.

It was shown when he had his adamantem removed by magneto that he was physicaly stronger when his powers started coming back, but he also started turning into that weird beast form, untill he got the metal back. And apprently his healing facter numbs the pain but the first time he poped his claws out after having the metal riped out of him he blead all over and doubled over in pain.

anphorus
2006-06-07, 09:03 AM
Are you talking about the adamantium in the comics? I know that adamantium is a metal used in a lot of fictional writing and I don't remember any mention of it being toxic in the Marvel-verse. Maybe you're thinking of it in something else.

No I'm positive it was in the comics. The reason why Wolverine's regenerative powers (and his senses) became stronger when his adamantium was removed was because his body was constantly healing the adamantium poisoning in his system which was effectively weakening his powers.

Though i do wonder how he could stand as he has to have super strength just enough to lift himself but not enough to do anything else with it.

I don't think his strength is part of his mutation, I think it's just because of the adamantium on his skeleton. Kind of like being under constant weight training, which brings him to the peak of human strength (kind of like Captain America). I could be wrong about this one though.

Ambrogino
2006-06-07, 10:28 AM
Also there was a time in the cartoon were they enterd the savage land, and Mr. Sinister had set up a device that nullified the powers of mutants, so wolverne couldnt heal but he could still pop out his claws, and he didnt die of posining

The problem is, the cartoon was written before the removal of the adamantium occured in the comics - and it was only after that happened that Wolvie was retconned into having the claws being part of his mutation (he ehadn't had the claws in any pre-weapon X program flashback before then). That was one of the reasons it seemed so odd going from what had reguarly been drawn as razor-thin metal blades into finger thick bone ones, taht were obviously vastly larger than previous, when logically they should have been smaller.

Strength part of his mutation - I've always taken it that his strength was due to his mutation due to the fact he can overstretch his muscles under stress repetedly, wheras a normal human could only do it once. Like a grandma being able to lift a car to save a child's life, only all the time since it fixes itself afterwards.

Chris_Chandler
2006-06-07, 11:03 AM
Wolvie doesn't really have a superhuman level of strength. What he has is a. muscles that are constantly rebuilding themselves in a manner to avoid fatigue and damage and b. a skeleton that can support vast pressure and stress. It is skeletal shortfalls, not muscular shortfalls, that prevent RL elite athletes from reaching crazy levels of strength. The muscles themselves (by whatever natural or chemical means) can get bigger, stronger, faster twitching, but the connective tissue and supporting structure will still fail. Adamantium takes care of that issue.

These considerations make Wolvie about as strong as Capt. America, though one is through a magic potion and the other through skeletal strengthening. They both have luxury of ignoring fatigue.

pandapandapie
2006-06-07, 11:24 AM
No I'm positive it was in the comics. The reason why Wolverine's regenerative powers (and his senses) became stronger when his adamantium was removed was because his body was constantly healing the adamantium poisoning in his system which was effectively weakening his powers.
Hmm, I guess I learned something new today then.

Okay, so assuming that he didn't die of radiation, how would his claws work?

According to Wikipedia, he does have super strength but it's unclear how much because the comics contradict themselves on that matter (each author seems to want it different).

Old_el_Paso
2006-06-07, 11:27 AM
Actually, Beast's blue fur is a secondary mutation, for the first comics, he had no fur. It wasn't a secondary mutation, it was a laboratory accident.

Jibar
2006-06-07, 11:34 AM
he was trying to cure his powers I believe.

Also, I think it was Apocolypse who ripped the adamantium out. Then they found it he had bone claws. All his healing factor went into recovering from all the years of poisoning the adamantium had been giving him, and the fact that he just had a skeletal support ripped out. As such, when the adamantium was put back on, his healing powers had actually got stronger.
And the "every time" comment is X Men 1. Rogue asks him.

WampaX
2006-06-07, 11:50 AM
Also, I think it was Apocolypse who ripped the adamantium out.

Magneto, Deadly Attractions, X-Men #75
Its on the cover,even. ::)

Jibar
2006-06-07, 12:03 PM
Sorry, I got that from wikipeida, where I swear it said Apocolypse...
I'll check later...

LordOfNarf
2006-06-07, 07:53 PM
Sorry, I got that from wikipeida, where I swear it said Apocolypse...
I'll check later...

Take wiki with a large spoonful of salt, its not nessesarily accurate

AmoDman
2006-06-07, 10:17 PM
Actually, Beast's blue fur is a secondary mutation, for the first comics, he had no fur, just unnatural acrobatic abilities. *And also, Marvel did a Wolverine history comic series for a few, and he grew up on a farm but left because he couldn't get close to the women he loved. And, I believe Beast grew up in New York... *or somewhere close to there.

This is the movies, though, not the comics. This, in fact, most likely hold no weight then. Honest truth is we don't know. And, out of curiosity, where did all that come from? I never mentioned anything about Beast's past, jsut that his big, blue mutatedhand turned into a small, normal human hand when it got near that boy.

Also, I'm not entirely sure about the whole tendons still being attatcked to the claws w/o the power, either. I guess they chose to portray it that way, but it doesn't make any sense to me since humans don't normally have muscles to extend and retract claws, which Wolverine did and controlled his adamantium coated claws with. W/o his mutation it seems these particular muscles would no longer exist...

pandapandapie
2006-06-07, 10:32 PM
I'm not entirely sure about the whole tendons still being attatcked to the claws w/o the power, either. I guess they chose to portray it that way, but it doesn't make any sense to me since humans don't normally have muscles to extend and retract claws, which Wolverine did and controlled his adamantium coated claws with. W/o his mutation it seems these particular muscles would no longer exist...

That's what I was thinking.

And for a brief summary of Wolverine's past, go here (http://www.marveldirectory.com/individuals/w/wolverine.htm).

Haneyparadox
2006-06-08, 03:26 PM
Magneto, Deadly Attractions, X-Men #75
Its on the cover,even. ::)

Just to pick a nit, it was Issue #25, otherwise you are correct. I had to run and check my long boxes to be sure. That was when The Prof turned Magneto into a vegetable for awhile as well.

Wolverine has hadhis powers stripped away orsupressed several times over the years and it's never a pretty sight. wethe or not his claws were ever natural has long been a subject of debate, The current cannon says yes, the claws are "natural" and were coated with metal when his bones were. Dont sweat how they are drawn, that has differed with every artist

As a mostly irrelevant aside, i was pleased to see howwell my old comics have held up. They look as good as the day I bought em, or very near. That's darn good for 15 years in storage.

WampaX
2006-06-08, 04:10 PM
Just to pick a nit, it was Issue #25, otherwise you are correct. I had to run and check my long boxes to be sure. That was when The Prof turned Magneto into a vegetable for awhile as well.

Yeah, okay. #75 didn't sound right in my head. It had a hologram on it, didn't it?

Nerull
2006-06-08, 05:52 PM
I don't think that his claws would go away if all that was removed was the mutating catalyst or gene. If I grew a third arm because of a "thrid arm" gene, then "shut off" the 3rd arm gene, it wouldn't reverse the growth process. The physical matter is there and doesn't just crawl back or cease to exist.

If I grow a tumor and then go through chemo, I doubt that the tumor would reverse it's growth.

Where does the mutation reversal stop? How many "steps"? If it actually changes the established physical characteristics, then wouldn't ALL mutations be reversed...effectively reversing any and all evolutionary processes? What IS the "normal" state of a human being, then, for this reversal to arbitrarily "go back" to, if the assumption is that humans have only reached their current status as organisms through mutation?

If they depicted this in the movie, and it's part of the movies "science", then fine...it's their baby. I'm just saying...

CelestialStick
2006-06-08, 06:21 PM
Hmm, I guess I learned something new today then.

Okay, so assuming that he didn't die of radiation, how would his claws work?

According to Wikipedia, he does have super strength but it's unclear how much because the comics contradict themselves on that matter (each author seems to want it different).
According to the Marvel website, Logan has the strength of a normal human who exercises regularly.

Estella
2006-06-08, 06:33 PM
i seem to remember wolverine naturally having healing abilities and claws of bone untill he got injected

Nerull
2006-06-08, 07:04 PM
i seem to remember wolverine naturally having healing abilities and claws of bone untill he got injected

Injected with what? He never actually lost his claws of bone or healing factor (for any appreciable amount of time), so what do you mean by "until"? (He did get his claws broken off by Cyber, but they grew back.)

He lived the life of a normal person up until his mutant gene activated during his early teens back...well, over a hundred years ago. He first popped his claws by accident after seeing his father get gunned down. (I believe it was Sabertooth's father that shot his dad?) After that, his heightened senses and healing factor started kicking in full force, but before then, he was a sickly, weak child.

Haneyparadox
2006-06-08, 10:25 PM
Yeah, okay. #75 didn't sound right in my head. It had a hologram on it, didn't it?


Yes it did. Marvel was doing LOTS ofthose gimmick covers back then.

pandapandapie
2006-06-09, 12:33 AM
I don't think that his claws would go away if all that was removed was the mutating catalyst or gene. If I grew a third arm because of a "thrid arm" gene, then "shut off" the 3rd arm gene, it wouldn't reverse the growth process. The physical matter is there and doesn't just crawl back or cease to exist.
That's what I thought, but on the movie (which is the biggest source of info on "the cure" so far), Beast lost his fur when he was exposed to it, and Mystique lost her blue skin. It completely reverses it.

CelestialStick
2006-06-09, 12:54 AM
That's what I thought, but on the movie (which is the biggest source of info on "the cure" so far), Beast lost his fur when he was exposed to it, and Mystique lost her blue skin. It completely reverses it.
Speaking of Mystique, I wonder what she will do when she gets her mutant powers back. Will she return to the loyalty she had to Magneto, or will she recall that he betrayed her?

Sophistemon
2006-06-09, 01:13 AM
I don't think that she'll forgive that easily. Or that he'll take her back. Remember that after he abandoned her she betrayed his whereabouts.

Vaynor
2006-06-09, 02:03 AM
*It wasn't a secondary mutation, it was a laboratory accident.

Hmm, must have been in a different series that it was a secondary mutation, it's very hard to argue X-Men because of this.... :P




This is the movies, though, not the comics. This, in fact, most likely hold no weight then. Honest truth is we don't know. And, out of curiosity, where did all that come from? I never mentioned anything about Beast's past, jsut that his big, blue mutatedhand turned into a small, normal human hand when it got near that boy.
You were talking about how maybe Beast + Wolverine may have been from a tribe of people like them, I was saying that wouldn't work because they already have histories, and Beast had his fur as a newer thing, so there wouldn't have been a tribe of big furry beasts. Unless that's not what you meant...

Tomb_Raven
2006-06-09, 08:02 AM
Well the fur disapreared in the movie and beast was reverting back to the standard human template. Maybe it rebuilds the bodies of the thing or regresses them back to the original coding of the genes? In which case the kid is the cure for cancer and all that stuff. Also how could the kid have a gene that cures the gene if the gene is par tof the gene than cures the gene. So if he has the gene then he doesnt have it, but if he doesnt he does ??? a bit too paradoxical for me.

And as to where the matter goes i think the most likely place is a sub dimension which stores colossus' "metal skin". Colossus gains weight from somewhere when he goes metal so maybe thats where all this reverted matter goes :P.

Oh and about the claws... how do they retract? If muscles can only contract then the muscles attached to the tendons than would pull out the claws would have to be on the "palm side" of his lower arm... and then you would need more muscles to pull them back :/ these would have to be big in order to hold the claws in place.

Nerull
2006-06-09, 09:37 AM
Imagine the claws are anchored half-way between a tendon. When he pops his claws, muscles in the wrist area pull the claws up...notice his hands are closed most of the time, giving the impression of a clenched muscle. When he wishes to retract them, muscled near the elbow flex and pulls them back in. This would be considered the "relaxed" state that he doesn't have to consciously think about to maintain. He needs to make the initial effort to snap them back, but not hold them there. Think of a smile...it takes effort and initiative to form one, but takes no effort to be deadpan, or neutral.

Tomb_Raven
2006-06-09, 09:44 AM
if the relaxed state is with them in then he must have his muscles contracted to have the claws out right? So... in order to keep them out and be able to stab things without them retracting the muscles would have to be pretty impressive.

If you had razor blades on ur hands and were fighting would you make a fist? or would ou risk your fingers?

EDIT: the retraction muscles would have to be on the other side of the wrist to where the claws come out as muscles cant push. this meas that the tendons would have to curl around the wrist which would act as a fulcrum to extract the claws. All im saying is he must have mighty forearms. with loads of complex muscles in them. Also wouldnt the claws compromise on his turning movement? As they would prolly get in the way of the radial bones (i think thats what they are called).

his claws arnt like cats where they flex their hands to pull back the skin... so thats out...

Nerull
2006-06-09, 10:15 AM
if the relaxed state is with them in then he must have his muscles contracted to have the claws out right? So... in order to keep them out and be able to stab things without them retracting the muscles would have to be pretty impressive.

Well, yeah...keep in mind that the guy cuts through steel bars. Part of that might be attributed to really sharp blades, but the guy is strong. Besides, if he's stabbing things, I would wager that your flesh would part far way before his muscles would give in, assuming that the blades are anchored in a useful way to his muscles...just as a lions claws are anchored or a bulls horns are anchored to be useful. Sure they might skip off bone going in, but the stabbing part wouldn't be NEAR as stressful on his side I bet.



If you had razor blades on ur hands and were fighting would you make a fist? or would ou risk your fingers?

That entirely depends on where the blades are attached, right? If I were Lady Deathstrike, with razor edged FINGERTIPS, then a fist would be foolish to make. If I were Sabertooth, with claw tipped FINGERS, then again, I would slash with an open hand. If I had a series of knives extending EXACTLY parallel to my arm bone that shoots out from between my knuckles or slightly above my knuckles, then there is no WAY I would keep an open hand. Your fingers would be directly parallel with extremely sharp knives, for goodness sake, and would probably split them like hotdogs. I'd keep my hand out of the way at all times in the form of a fist. But that's just me.

...wouldn't you?

Maybe I didn't understand the question?



EDIT: the retraction muscles would have to be on the other side of the wrist to where the claws come out as muscles cant push. this meas that the tendons would have to curl around the wrist which would act as a fulcrum to extract the claws. All im saying is he must have mighty forearms. with loads of complex muscles in them. Also wouldnt the claws compromise on his turning movement? As they would prolly get in the way of the radial bones (i think thats what they are called).

his claws arnt like cats where they flex their hands to pull back the skin... so thats out...

You're right...muscles can't push, which is why I never said that they could. Let's do an experiment. Let's take an elastic rope and tie an object directly in the middle of it. Now, you stand on one side and I'll stand on the other. Pull the rope. The object comes towards you, right? Now let it go slack and I'll pull my end. The object comes towards me right? Does the fact that the object comes towards me indicate that you pushed it? Not at all.

Imagine 2 muscles. One located near the elbow area, one located in the wrist. The brain, of course, controls these muscles and allows them to work in concert with one another. Wolverine gets attacked. Brain tells wrist muscles to PULL the blades forward and stay there as long as he flexes them, while at the same time telling the elbow muscles to relax and let the blades go. Wolverine get through the fight. Brain tells writs to release so that elbow muscles can PULL the blades back.

No muscle pushing at all.

And again, of course he has a different physical makeup, including the requisite musculature and skeletal system to accomodate his mutation. I can imagine a mutant that might be similar to Wolverine in some instances but in the most important aspects...lack of muscle mass, ineffective skeletal system, no healing factor...he/she is utterly unprepared and is essentially just handicapped as opposed to being a subject of heroic action stories.

Tomb_Raven
2006-06-09, 10:41 AM
That entirely depends on where the blades are attached, right? If I were Lady Deathstrike, with razor edged FINGERTIPS, then a fist would be foolish to make. If I were Sabertooth, with claw tipped FINGERS, then again, I would slash with an open hand. If I had a series of knives extending EXACTLY parallel to my arm bone that shoots out from between my knuckles or slightly above my knuckles, then there is no WAY I would keep an open hand. Your fingers would be directly parallel with extremely sharp knives, for goodness sake, and would probably split them like hotdogs. I'd keep my hand out of the way at all times in the form of a fist. But that's just me.

...wouldn't you?

Maybe I didn't understand the question?

I agree here i was being ironic seeing as you said that he has his fists clenched and it seemed as if that was part of your argument. I merely meant to point out that it was common sense.

About the muscles. Im sure we are saying almost exactly the same things :P Im just trying to show how absurdly ineficient the system would be, which is why it isnt used overly much in nature. Except amongst insects hmmm... im gonna read that up in a moment (like bea stings).

In essence i think we are saying the same thing tho...

Raven

PS: this makes me think of this commic strip...
http://archive.gamespy.com/comics/nodwick/ffn/ffn164.htm

Edit: nope not even stings are retracted as such. The abdomen is pushed up allowing the sting to stick out. (in bees anyway)

Nerull
2006-06-09, 11:12 AM
That's a great link...sums us up pretty well. ;)

Sure, we might not see that kind of stuff in nature, and it may be very inefficient. Consider this, though: Depending on your view of the origins of mankind, might it be considered inefficient to have the bodies we currently have as opposed to being a single celled organism that lives off of the suns rays like algae?

It's inefficient to have a variety of dietary needs, for example, when we could stay at such an elementary state that movement isn't ever required.

Tomb_Raven
2006-06-09, 11:45 AM
Hehe yeah thats true but then... it might also be efficient for a different single cell to engulf the first. And from there we move on to competition which starts evolution ;)

CelestialStick
2006-06-09, 03:26 PM
I don't think that she'll forgive that easily. Or that he'll take her back. Remember that after he abandoned her she betrayed his whereabouts.

WARNING: SPOILER INFORMATION FOLLOWS.


That's right. I wonder if they'll put her in the new movie at all. The thing is that she seems to be evil and have it in for normal humans, which makes her a natural ally for Magneto. If she gets her powers back, won't she revert to her evil, anti-human self? Maybe she will work independently against mankind.

Or maybe Magneto's betrayal of her will change her character so that she becomes a good-guy. Has she ever been good in the comics?

Tomb_Raven
2006-06-09, 06:00 PM
Peronaly i think we should/will have sentinels in the next one if any.

Raven

CelestialStick
2006-06-09, 06:07 PM
Peronaly i think we should/will have sentinels in the next one if any.

Raven

Who or what are sentinels?

Nerull
2006-06-09, 06:10 PM
Sentinels are basically robots programmed to hunt mutants created in response to increased fear of mutants by "normal" people. They stand about 40 feet tall and are armed to the teeth.

CelestialStick
2006-06-09, 06:15 PM
Sentinels are basically robots programmed to hunt mutants created in response to increased fear of mutants by "normal" people. They stand about 40 feet tall and are armed to the teeth.
Hmm. That sounds vaguely familiar. Did they appear in some cartoon series version of X-Men?

Incidentally, how do machines distinguish mutants from regular humans? I mean, only twins have identical DNA.

Godhand
2006-06-09, 06:25 PM
IF anyone has not seen the third X-men movie then skip this post. Thank you and sorry if it's a bit off topic.

Two things about X3.

1. Great movie, but what was the point of Angel or Rogue being there? Crazy new writers...

2. So Mr. Mag gets the cure, but you can't find one to use on Phoenix? Why didn't they just bring the cure kid in and have him give Jean a power draining hug? Or does his inhibition field only stop mutants within it not powers being thrown at him from beyond it? So confusing.

Tomb_Raven
2006-06-09, 06:31 PM
Not sure they prolly can locate the x gene or whatever. Perhaps they can tell and get the info from the same place colossus gets his extra mass when he goes metal.

Imo sentinals ar ethe next logical step cos the humans were on the edge before and now after that whole ruin the bridge and beat the crap out of each other and humies showing how much power and crap tactics they have there should be a majour panic. Which would make the project more plausible.

Also sentinals were cool.

Raven

EDIT: i think the kid would have been incinerated before he got any where near close enough, i mean the human soldiers just went poof and dissapeared. Also the kid would have got lynched by the bad guys if he was any where near there. Angel is important in that... erm.... he ... erm ... was always pointless? ... and then became death as one of the 4 horsemen. bad choice. I mean angel what can he actually do? I think even jubilee with her pretty sparks was more powerfull.

Godhand
2006-06-09, 06:43 PM
Well the kid had to have passed by Phoenix on the way out, she was pretty much in front of the bridge. Unless Shadowcat took the kid swimming in frigid waters he could've had a chance to walk up and stop Phoenix.

Gah! I over analyze this stuff too much. Of course, we all know none of the important characters are really dead, because according to comic book law, no famous character can die and stay dead. I mean look at Magneto, the man just doesn't die and stay dead.

Edit: And where the heck was Gambit? He name was seen in X2 on a computer right above Magneto's (His name is Remy btw). For being one of the most popular characters along with Nightcrawler and Wolverine it was very surpising to leave out the crazy French guy.

Nerull
2006-06-09, 06:51 PM
Hmm. That sounds vaguely familiar. Did they appear in some cartoon series version of X-Men?

Yeah, they did. Big purple guys. I don't know what Marvel comics fixation is on huge purple guys(Galactus, Sentinels) but there you go.


Incidentally, how do machines distinguish mutants from regular humans? I mean, only twins have identical DNA.

I'm not sure how it actually is supposed to function, but I imagine it's based on the detection of radically different DNA from a given "norm". I believe a computer can tell the difference from a gorilla and a human, for example. Now just imagine a mutant being a more evolved form of homo-sapiens...homo-superior I believe Magneto called it. A computer could probably tell the difference.

That's just a guess, though.

Tomb_Raven
2006-06-09, 06:55 PM
And leave out Nightcrawler... he had the coolest scene in the whole x2 movie... Right at the beggiing after that it went downhill... though not too much.

Raven
EDIT: this is in referance to erm... the guys whos avatar i did... hmmm Godhand.

As to purple guys... purple is cool. :P In x3 when they were in the traiing simu i thought it was an actual battle and when logan came with the robotic head i held my breath, i thought there were going to be sentinals in this already. :( but there wernt :(

CelestialStick
2006-06-10, 01:29 AM
Yeah, they did. Big purple guys. I don't know what Marvel comics fixation is on huge purple guys(Galactus, Sentinels) but there you go.


I'm not sure how it actually is supposed to function, but I imagine it's based on the detection of radically different DNA from a given "norm". I believe a computer can tell the difference from a gorilla and a human, for example. Now just imagine a mutant being a more evolved form of homo-sapiens...homo-superior I believe Magneto called it. A computer could probably tell the difference.

That's just a guess, though.

Yeah, I think that's just all mutant propaganda. I think they're humans with slight mutations, like someone with cancer. The sentinels would have to go around killing people with cancer too. :D

AmoDman
2006-06-10, 02:12 AM
You were talking about how maybe Beast + Wolverine may have been from a tribe of people like them, I was saying that wouldn't work because they already have histories, and Beast had his fur as a newer thing, so there wouldn't have been a tribe of big furry beasts. *Unless that's not what you meant...

Not at all, no. I was saying that it has been suggested that both Woverine and Sabretooth might, in fact, not be normal mutants at all, but, rather, descendants of "pure" humans that escaped being affected by the insertion of "X-gene," making them the "natural" evolutionary humans (in the X-men world), rather than "mutants" caused by the X-gene. Also, they are both descended from opposing "tribes" of humans, causing a natural animostiy between them. I saw this idea in some internet character bios, *shrugs*. Don't remember what comic it comes from (obviously, some X-men related one :P).

p.s. Beast was a typo before (probably from having just referred to him), my bad.