View Full Version : Confusing Saving Throw

2010-06-16, 02:32 PM
My brother and i are confused about this type of saving throw, It says it is a reflex save, but the sentence after that says the save is based on Constitution. I have seen this for will and fortitude as well.
Here is an example from PF Bestiary.
"Shocker lizards can deliver an electrical shock
to a single opponent within 5 feet. This attack deals 1d8
points of nonlethal electricity damage to living
opponents (Reflex DC 12 half ). This save DC
is Constitution-based. Additionally, if
two or more shocker lizards are within
20 feet of each other, they can work
together to create a lethal shock once
every 1d4 rounds. This effect has a
radius of 20 feet, centered on any
one contributing lizard. All creatures
within that radius take 2d8 points
of lethal electricity damage for each
lizard contributing to the shock, to
a maximum of 12d8. A Reflex save
(DC 10 + the number of lizards
contributing) halves the damage."

Could someone explain this to me?

2010-06-16, 02:35 PM
It means the DC is based on the creatures Con modifier.

2010-06-16, 02:36 PM
Wow i can't believe it's that simple, thanks :D

2010-06-16, 02:38 PM
Yah. It's a Reflex save to avoid the shock. But that DC 12 target is calculated using the formula 10 + 1/2 critter's hit dice + critters Con bonus.

So, for example, slap a bear's endurance spell on that shocker level and the save DC will increase to 14.

2010-06-16, 02:43 PM
That confused me at first, when I started seeing it appear in books. The point, of course, is if you're modifying the creature in some what which would adjust its ability scores - advancement/modifying stats, applying magical buffs/equipment, getting a bonus from say being Animal Companion, or if the creature is a Player Character.