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The Vorpal Tribble
2010-06-21, 05:18 PM
Welcome to the Giant in the Playground Monster Competition chat thread where you can ask questions, comment, or just in general discuss about the submissions to our monthly monster mash.

This month's contest is...

Achilles Heel
http://www.awesomeoff.com/images/entries/mainview/kryptonite_crystal.jpg (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=10279533#post10279533)


GITP Monster Competition Chat II (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=5578957#post5578957)
GITP Monster Competition Chat: The Original (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=26636)

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Past Competitions

The Hunt (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=10079520#post10079520)
Nightmare Before Christmas (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=9872118#post9872118)
Considered To Be Unnatural II (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=9675841#post9675841)
It's The Great Pumpkin, Playground (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=9461411#post9461411)
Underfoot (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=9269599#post9269599)
Through the Looking Glass (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=9088161#post9088161)
Beings of Legend IV (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=8753768#post8753768)
ACHOO! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=8605702#post8605702)
Plop Plop Fizz Fizz (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=8411813#post8411813)
Gits and Shiggles (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=8196915#post8196915)
Mr. Roboto (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7987650#post7987650)
One Flesh (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7801991#post7801991)
My Immortal (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=137308)
Angels Among Us (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7416099#post7416099)
Grateful Dead (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=130380)
Fear Itself (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=126929)
Way of the Wyrm (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=123468)
A Thing of Beauty (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=120197)
Beings of Legend III (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=115962)
On the Road Again (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=113230)
Faerie Tales (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=110499)
Game Masters (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=108378)
Mayonnaise Mayhem (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=108284)
Animal Kingdom (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=106259)
Paragons of Passion (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=103694)
Tick... Tock... (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=101136)
Banquet of Beasts (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=98205)
Out of This World (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=95678)
Spooks and Spirits (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=5031721#post5031721)
Urban Legends (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=89675)
♫ Sing Along ♫ (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=4631188#post4631188)
We The People (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=84458)
Beings of Legend II (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=82323)
Now You See Me... (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=79570)
Gone Mental (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=76657)
Creepy Crawlies (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=4002755#post4002755)
Of the Rising Sun (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=3871373#post3871373)
Flights of Fancy (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=68335)
Built of Faith (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=3596892#post3596892)
Home and Hearth (http://tinyurl.com/2rsve3)
Gratuitous Gore (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=3274975#post3274975)
Dream A Little Dream (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=55560)
Tiny But Tough! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=52428)
Beings of Legend (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=49319)
Burn, Baby, BURN! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=46007)
Birds and the Bees (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2510824#post2510824)
April Fools (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=39178)
A Wizard Did It (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=36196)
Champions of Good (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=33469)
Fimbulwinter (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1762542)
Holly Jolly (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28603)
Harvest Moon (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1499186)
Fell Beasts (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10212)
Considered To Be Unnatural (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10260)

-=-=-=-=-

Monster Index
(Updated as of 'Plop Plop Fizz Fizz')
* Contest Winners

A Shadow of Spiders (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1238540&postcount=5) by Yahzi
* Aadar Llwach (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5865716&postcount=6) by Stycotl
Ajatarra (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6076419&postcount=8) by strawberryman
Anamnesis (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2039043&postcount=9) by Closet_Skeleton
Angel, Caries (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7540880&postcount=12) by Bisected8
* Angel, Dairymaid (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8290206&postcount=7) by Debihuman
Angel of Sustenance (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5519958&postcount=10) by rtg0922
Angelic Preener (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7430825&postcount=9) by Admiral Squish
Anima Aderendo (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7929812&postcount=9) by NemoUtopia
Ankou (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7055600&postcount=13) by Mulletmanalive
Arcadian Beetle (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4220432&postcount=10) by Belboz
Asherah, Spirit of the Shores (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7749160&postcount=13) by Sir Shadow
Ashling (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3502018&postcount=11) by Mr.Bookworm
Aspect of Leviathan (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7634731&postcount=3) by Schylerwalker
Assimilator Flies (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4060364&postcount=13) by DarkShard
Astarus (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5247523&postcount=3) by Bakkan
Astral Pack-Beast (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4173207&postcount=9) by DracoDei
Astral Shard (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5279219&postcount=6) by vegetalss4
Autumnal Avenger (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7041399&postcount=6) by waterpenguin43
Autumnal Seer (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1513351&postcount=7) by The Demented One
Bad Harvest (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1508157&postcount=3) by Reltzik
Barbed Fleshworm (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4062828&postcount=14) by Reltzik
Bardfly (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4051960&postcount=12) by Cespenar
Bee-Holder (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8239217&postcount=4) by Bhu
Behemoth, Demon Prince of Gluttony (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8413619&postcount=3) by Iamyourking
Belly Serpent (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7881533&postcount=7) by Joxer t' Mighty
Bitterbug (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5403293&postcount=4) by Bisected8
Blight Cow (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1536243&postcount=10) by LordOfNarf
Bloodscarab (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2425764&postcount=8) by Abjurer
* Bloody Handed Jack (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6109266&postcount=9) by Bhu
Blood Ooze (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3278900&postcount=3) by Vaynor
Bone Conductor (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4685417&postcount=14) by adanedhel9
Bornura (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4549797&postcount=9) by Lappy9000
* Bubba the Headless Chicken (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5109496&postcount=14) by Bhu
Burning Bush (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2687147&postcount=9) by OOTS_Rules.
Busker (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4912673&postcount=6) by Vaynor
Butchery Golem (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3381293&postcount=16) by The_Glyphstone
Cab't (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2219642&postcount=18) by NemoUtopia
Cake Golem (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1699134&postcount=17) by Fangthane
Carnivorous Thyme (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5657092&postcount=11) by Bisected8
Caterwaul (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7144100&postcount=23) by Debihuman
Charspawn (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2682266&postcount=3) by Closet_Skeleton
* Chef's Mage™ Brand Fully Automatic Kitchen (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5512106&postcount=7) by Adanedhel9
Chelissadhu (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6062935&postcount=3) by Stormthorn
Child of Flame (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2741688&postcount=17) by Macrovore
Chocolate Truffle (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5514302&postcount=9) by Afroakuma
Christmas Goodies Golem (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1721414&postcount=19) by Purple gelatinous cube o' Doom
Chroneruts (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4145921&postcount=6) by Kellus
Clockwork Weaver (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5656648&postcount=10) by Sir Shadow
Cloud of Strife (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3745708&postcount=4) by Excellence
Coal Elf (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1635649&postcount=6) by Belboz
Coronal Elemental (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2685931&postcount=7) by Icewalker
Corrupted Offshoot of Yggdrasil (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7637774&postcount=4) by Random_person
* Crow Mistress (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6739986&postcount=7) by Sir Shadow
Cruor Skeleton (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3294755&postcount=6) by Bisected8
Cyrocerebellus (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1788588&postcount=5) by Khantalas
* Dadafly (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4079641&postcount=16) by The Demented One
Daemon, Malzalalim (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8529071&postcount=10) by Amiel
Dancing Golem (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4632919&postcount=4) by Bisected8
Dark Seed (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1238900&postcount=7) by Belboz
* Dattar (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2849131&postcount=6) by Poppatomus
Deadly Gaze (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4279172&postcount=4) by Bisected8
* Death (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2830175&postcount=4) by Lyinginbedmon
Deathspore Mushroom (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3054811&postcount=14) by ShneekeyTheLost
Delphine (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7421457&postcount=4) by waterpenguin43
Deus Die (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2990141&postcount=6) by Qube
Devouring Domicile (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3461182&postcount=7) by Kyace
Diatock (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5599580&postcount=6) by Lappy9000
Digit Swarm (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4047163&postcount=8) by rtg0922
Dirgesinger (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4670694&postcount=11) by XenoGeno
* Discernable Anatomy Golem (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2124734&postcount=5) by ArmorArmadillo
Disco Dragon (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6844810&postcount=5) by DracoDei
Dismal Haze (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5095344&postcount=12) by Stormthorn
Disruptor (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3603675&postcount=5) by Lord Tataraus
Divine Brigadier (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5976915&postcount=4)
Divine Spark of Inspiration (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2028721&postcount=7) by Fax_Celestis
Domestic Brownie (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3458084&postcount=6) by Littlechicory
Doomborn Warrior (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=57429&postcount=6) by Carrion_Humanoid
Dopplepunkt (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3449583&postcount=5) by Bisected8
Dracolocust Swarm (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6847626&postcount=7) by Bisected8
Dragon Victim (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6846665&postcount=6) bySlaadLord
Dread Colossus (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7082963&postcount=19) by Holocron Coder
Dringwr (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6067754&postcount=5) by Bisected8
Drome (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3142288&postcount=5) by NakedCelt
Drummer Ghoul (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4632895&postcount=3) by The Demented One
* Dust Bunny (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3502770&postcount=12) by Fax_Celestis
Edible Golem (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5427596&postcount=5) by Bhu
Eggnog Elemental (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5460199&postcount=6) by DragonTounge
Emberwilde (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2728831&postcount=14) by The Demented One
E.M.I.T (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7987650#post8119051) by Bisected8
Empress of Rot (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3339580&postcount=14) by Jaerc
Ender (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7987650#post8024224) by Schylerwalker
Eqach Wuilees (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1630312&postcount=4) by Grey Knight
Ergotine (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1512154&postcount=4) by Belboz
Essence of Fire (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2685414&postcount=5) by Kel
Ethercat (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5133989&postcount=15) by Adanedhel9
Existential Terror (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5313767&postcount=8) by Ghill
Exploding Chicken (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3054669&postcount=13) by Bitzeralisis
* Facsimilix (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2361619&postcount=6) by Maerok
Falling Foam (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1627347&postcount=3) by Shuryougospel
* False God (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6490179&postcount=6) by Bhu
Farceur (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2337978&postcount=4) by PhantomBread
Favored of the Traveler God (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6267620&postcount=8) by DracoDei
Fear Archon (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7054070&postcount=12) by Flarp
* Fergaast (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2031576&postcount=8) by Palcosmo
Fimbulwight (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1857830&postcount=11) by Purple gelatinous cube o' Doom
Finger of Loki (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=57238&postcount=5) by Beldak
Fish In A Barrel (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8293169&postcount=9) by Cog
Flamefly (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2683612&postcount=4) by Onasuma
Flamehaunt Wraith (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1830529&postcount=8) by Athenodorus
Flent (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2148462&postcount=12) by Kuja.girl
Flesh Beast (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1238346&postcount=4) by Beldak
Flying Spaghetti Monster (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3809836&postcount=12) by NakedCelt
Forsaken Blade (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3911969&postcount=8) by Vaynor
Fractal Bear (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8290906&postcount=8) by DracoDei
Free Spirit (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5054063&postcount=7) by DracoDei
Fungal Banshee (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3446717&postcount=3) by Penguinizer
Furnace Shadow (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5054630&postcount=8) by Bisected8
Futureling (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5579581&postcount=3) by Glooble Glistencrist
Fyumyad (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6109841&postcount=10) by Sir Shadow
Galuverant (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1834477&postcount=9) by MechaKingGhidra
* Gamer (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5991609&postcount=5) by sidhe3141
Gastrus (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4304858&postcount=7) by Belboz
Geliefd (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2576772&postcount=7) by Knight9910
Ghostfolk (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4532654&postcount=7) by Silence
Giant Bacillus (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2516681&postcount=3) by Belboz
Gingerbread Giant (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5402617&postcount=3) by RS14
Glass Golem (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4323024&postcount=11) by Duchess_of_Elysian
Glass Spider (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4020061&postcount=4) by Blue_C.
Gluttonous Plague (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1522578&postcount=9) by Khantalas
Golden Flame of Pelor (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1954913&postcount=4) by Glooble Glistencrist
Gorin No Oni (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3881828&postcount=5) by Caracol
Gorshk (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3367826&postcount=15) by Nelphine
Gothad (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7041537&postcount=7) by Sir Shadow
Graveforged (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2143871&postcount=10) by Hyrael
Gray Master (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3448740&postcount=4) by Vrel
Grey Goo (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2887803&postcount=9) by Belboz
Grey Reaper (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7272186&postcount=6) by Schylerwalker
*Gridoll (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4520705&postcount=4) by Guyr Adamantine
Gumwad (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5513967&postcount=8) by Enlong
Guoreeat (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6361493&postcount=3) by Unosarta
Gut Snake (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3295643&postcount=7) by DracoDei
Haint o’ the Crossroads (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6332969&postcount=10) by rtg0922
* Harvester (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8418214&postcount=6) by Deca
Haurla (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7038380&postcount=3) by dentrag2
* Headhunter (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3339393&postcount=13) by Kellus
Headless Dragon (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4142328&postcount=3) by Bisected8
Hearth Protector (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3508353&postcount=15) by Lord Tataraus
Hearthworm (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7932330&postcount=10) by FirebirdFlying
Heliotoad (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3754057&postcount=6) by Lord Tataraus
Helon of the Heaven's Lore (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7424420&postcount=7) by Anonymouswizard
Herald of Winter (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1636365&postcount=7) by MandibleBones
Hidden Flame (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4279492&postcount=5) by hylian chozo
* Hjordis (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6423271&postcount=5) by Bisected8
Hollow Vicegerent (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3940139&postcount=10) by Jaerc
Hordeling (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7154487&postcount=25) by Cespenar
Icicle Beast (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1784065&postcount=4) by Glooble Glistencrist
Idle Chill (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6121576&postcount=11) by TheLogman
Ilthslamael (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2828293&postcount=3) by Closet_Skeleton
Immortal Frawg (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7657364&postcount=6) by Bhu
In-F-able Horror (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8274859&postcount=5) by Zom B
Inaran Fae (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3749942&postcount=5) by RandomFellow
Invisible Giant (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4277970&postcount=3) by Vaynor
Issun-bōshi (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2994985&postcount=8) by Paragon Badger
Jack-o'-Ripper (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7038547&postcount=4) by Jergmo
Janus Golem (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6259219&postcount=6) by Debihuman
Jump-At-A-Body (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7161227&postcount=26) by Joxer t' Mighty
Karnak the Everfrozen (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7654496&postcount=5) by gorknmork
Kawaii Ooze (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2976469&postcount=3) by Goober4473
Ketrakion (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7987650#post8032061) by NakedCelt
* Khrysalathi's Memorandum (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7987650#post7994835) by Joxer t' Mighty
Kindling (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2737264&postcount=16) by Mattarias
* Kiseichuu Yuurei (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7838745&postcount=4) by Bhu
Kittenbush (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2216158&postcount=16) by Shuryougospel
Knight Divine (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1679080&postcount=14) by Peregrine
Lap Dog (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3549180&postcount=16) by Blue_C.
Legendary Crocodile (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5861210&postcount=5) by Bhu
Limb Louse (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4005077&postcount=3) by Bisected8
Living Bard Song (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4751966&postcount=17) by Daedu
Llorrick (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4145571&postcount=5) by Lord Iames Osari
Lord of Rest (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3505010&postcount=13) by DracoDei
Loutae (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6524731&postcount=7) by Nhoj
*Lowfolk (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4906483&postcount=5) by AKA_Bait
Luugu (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7892464&postcount=8) by NakedCelt
Lure Eel (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2332921&postcount=3) by Icewalker
Lusca (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6656934&postcount=5) by strawberryman
Magic Eater Termites (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4065436&postcount=15) by Caracol
Magypsy (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7658293&postcount=7) by waterpenguin43
Maiden of Plumes (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6746060&postcount=9) by SlaadLord
Malicious Slander (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6331439&postcount=9) by Bisected8
ManBearPig (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2209877&postcount=14) by Maerok
Mandrake Oak (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2562460&postcount=5) by The Gilded Duke
Man o’War (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2134260&postcount=8) by Belboz
Marauder of the Flesh (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=58296&postcount=11) by Maerok
Mawstinger (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5854357&postcount=3) by Bisected8
Megadentis (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8488350&postcount=9) by Mulletmanalive
Melodic Dragon (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4713455&postcount=15) by Arkanis
Mepholk (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4520583&postcount=3) by DracoDei
Mherephess (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2881362&postcount=8) by TheEscapist
Mindmite (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=57967&postcount=9) by Fax_Celestis
* Minimus Drone (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2981285&postcount=4) by The Demented One
Mist Maiden (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6712852&postcount=6) by NakedCelt
Monstrous Cicada (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4030147&postcount=5) by Paragon Badger
Monstrous Silk Worm (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3893009&postcount=6) by rtg0922
Mortal Devil (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4532291&postcount=6) by Bisected8
Mother of Shadow (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=56829&postcount=3) by Fangthane
Mourning Dove (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3006090&postcount=10) by Thistle
Mousefolk (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3507477&postcount=14) by Belboz
MS-OBv9 (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7987650#post8065473) by waterpenguin43
* Muliwai (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2569488&postcount=6) by Fax_Celestis
Mynithar Beetle (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4046838&postcount=7) by MattKatt
Nephilim (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7423745&postcount=6) by The Gilded Duke
Nephtyan Rivermaid (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7270662&postcount=5) by waterpenguin43
Nigh (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2863397&postcount=7) by Krimm_Blackleaf
Nightleech (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2981923&postcount=5) by Closet_Skeleton
* Nimbus Golem (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2691996&postcount=11) by Poppatomus
Noble Fir (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1687478&postcount=15) by LordOfNarf
Nobody's Problem (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4313986&postcount=8) by TheLogman
Nog Fairy (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1643839&postcount=8) by Thomar_of_Uointer
Nudibrancha (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2135868&postcount=9) by Levi
Occult Cúcharraige (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8414939&postcount=5) by strawberryman
Oculans (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3605315&postcount=6) by Magnor Criol
* Old Man of the Field (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1521307&postcount=8) by Bearofbadnews
* Oneiroi (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3129988&postcount=3) by AKA_Bait
Oran-Spawn (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2212582&postcount=15) by The Demented One
* Oreichalkos Dragon (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6968841&postcount=9) by Stycotl
Panic Shade (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7043096&postcount=9) by Crafty Cultist
Patchcorners (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6640863&postcount=4) by Bisected8
Peanut Reaper (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5070295&postcount=11) by Lappy9000
Pembunuh (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4544204&postcount=8) by Bhu
Penumbral Stalker (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1489623&postcount=10) by The_Glyphstone
Perfected One (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7422575&postcount=5) by Random_person
Phaighthmeam (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3621104&postcount=7) by NakedCelt
Phobus Beast (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7069973&postcount=18) by SlaadLord
Pituku (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5051309&postcount=6) by flyingpoo22
Poisonskin Crusher (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7987650#post8065914) by Leicontis
Porcelain Doll (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3958533&postcount=11) by Sir Shadow
* Precious Little Thing (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7042651&postcount=8) by strawberryman
Preymaker (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8483841&postcount=8) by Icewalker
Pure Thought (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3600220&postcount=3) by Bisected8
Pyrotechnic Golem (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1672138&postcount=10) by Simius
Pyroworm (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7874431&postcount=5) by Bisected8
* Qliphoth (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5290061&postcount=7) by The Demented One
Quencher (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=58134&postcount=10) by Hyrael
Quiet (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4930071&postcount=8) by Hairb
Quintessence Dragon (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6905686&postcount=8) by NakedCelt
Quintessence Golem (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4143243&postcount=4) by rtg0922
Raenia (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2090076&postcount=12) by Phoenix Talion
Raisuden (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3871888&postcount=3) by Bisected8
Raver Swarm (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4048704&postcount=10) by Stormthorn
Raw Sinusoid (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4645770&postcount=7) by RS14
Raze, the Soul of the Sun (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2731375&postcount=15) by Proven_Paradox
* Reality Shifter (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4154934&postcount=7) by Vaynor
Reanimator (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7987650#post7995741) by Zom B
Relentless Cuckolder (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1494615&postcount=11) by EndlessEnnui
Repenter of Heironeos (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2025339&postcount=6) by Onasuma
Retrospect (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5665925&postcount=12) by Stycotl
Reveler (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7259141&postcount=4) by Admiral Squish
Rider's Angel (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3670024&postcount=11) by Arioch
Rift Demon (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4320100&postcount=10) by Corncracker
Roach (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4050009&postcount=11) by Billwill91
Roc Golem (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3736464&postcount=3) by Bisected8
Rook, The Greymount Fortress (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7703011&postcount=9) by Admiral Squish
Rthuote (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=58726&postcount=14) by SmileyX
Sabretooth (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5861155&postcount=4) by NakedCelt
Sacrificial (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3671034&postcount=12) by Cespenar
Sandalphon, the Hand of God (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7663086&postcount=8) by Iamyourking
Sandblighter (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3044552&postcount=12) by Sir Conkey
Sapphiren (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6128696&postcount=13) by Elrond
Savior of the Forest (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2581756&postcount=8) by Corncracker
* Scaramouche (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2349736&postcount=5) by The Demented One
Scorpell (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2126944&postcount=7) by Ajkkjjk52
Sebal, Power Unbound (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=57615&postcount=7) by SilveryCord
Sentient Tumour (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3284741&postcount=4) by AtomicKitKat
Seraph of the Heavenly Host (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7416384&postcount=3) by Schylerwalker
Serviceforged (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3468955&postcount=8) by Finerty
* She Who Walks Beneath the Ice (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1860080&postcount=12) by Bearofbadnews
Shimmering Ooze (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5255809&postcount=5) by RS14
Sialla Danda (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4958830&postcount=11) by Afroakuma
Silly Frocker (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8212244&postcount=3) by Bisected8
Silver Lionling (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3816743&postcount=13) by rtg0922
* Skratta-sker (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4323624&postcount=12) by Stycotl
Shiny (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6640394&postcount=3) by Owrtho
Shrieking Slicer (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1238142&postcount=3) by McDeath
Singers From Outside (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4671972&postcount=12) by Bhu
Singing Stone (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4636125&postcount=5) by KingGolem
*Singing Tree (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4636696&postcount=6) by Sir Shadow
Skin Spiders (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3290102&postcount=5) by Dove
Sleeper In the Deep (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3215318&postcount=6) by Alveanerle
Slumber Cat (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3132971&postcount=4) by Thistle
Smokey Floater (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4901130&postcount=4) by DracoDei
Snap Dragon (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6840516&postcount=3) by Sir Shadow
Snowball Warrior (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1699323&postcount=18) by The Demented One
Snowy Archon (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1650902&postcount=9) by The_Cowinator
Soil Keeper (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2538201&postcount=4) by The Demented One
Soluminaire Ooze (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2061701&postcount=11) by ShneekeyTheLost
Somesclaustrum (Whining Head) (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7049961&postcount=11) by Bisected8
Somniletum (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7152904&postcount=24) by FlyingWhale
Sonorous Mouther (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4646372&postcount=9) by rtg0922
Sons/Daughters of Silence (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5061794&postcount=9) by Lord_Gareth
Soot Brownie (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1672829&postcount=11) by Thistle
Soul Hound (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3669233&postcount=10) by RandomFellow
Sower of Seasons (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5656605&postcount=9) by adanedhel9
Spartoi (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6841303&postcount=4) by Joxer t' Mighty
Spideer (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2148944&postcount=13) by Fax_Celestis
Spirit Gate (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5035172&postcount=3) by Owrtho
Spirit of Dullness (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4847700&postcount=3) by Bisected8
Spirit of the North Wind (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1772959&postcount=3) by Duke of URL
Spirit of the Woods (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5036391&postcount=4) by Vaynor
Split Second (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4163493&postcount=8) by Titanium Dragon
Spook (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4315369&postcount=9) by RS14
Spriggan (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2994300&postcount=7) by NakedCelt
Starperson (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=58587&postcount=13) by belboz
Star Spore Seedling (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5327881&postcount=10) by Glimworm
Stoic, Shield of Shields (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2891075&postcount=10) by Proven_Paradox
* Storm Serpent (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3779824&postcount=8) by RS14
Stormhaunt (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1239063&postcount=8) by The_Snark
Strangefolk (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1484986&postcount=9) by Fangthane
Sun Devil (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2690371&postcount=10) by Stolenchariot
Sun Sprite (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2697395&postcount=13) by ZeroNumerous
Sun Thief (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2696987&postcount=12) by Haruspex
Sycophantic Specter (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3309304&postcount=10) by Kyace
Taco Fairy (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6067325&postcount=4) by Lappy9000
Talmascalion (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1238725&postcount=6) by Foeofthelance
* Temporal Echo (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5622228&postcount=8) by TheLogman
Thane of the Anvil (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2837649&postcount=5) by Haruspex
The Angel of Death (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7440724&postcount=10) by Bhu
The Benefactors (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7808017&postcount=3) by Schylerwalker
The Black Mask (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4929558&postcount=7) by Bhu
The Colors Purple (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4565215&postcount=10) by The Gilded Duke
* The Eight Brothers (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3901727&postcount=7) by TheEscapist
The Final/First Word (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5604938&postcount=7) by DracoDei
The Grandfather (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5581944&postcount=4) Djinn_In_Tonic
The Gray Man (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6255054&postcount=5) by Jergmo
The Harvest King (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7046421&postcount=10) by Admiral Squish
The Hawk (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1788755&postcount=6) by Headwarpage
The Jester (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8333331&postcount=11) by The Dark Fiddler
The Known World (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6542407&postcount=8) by The Gilded Duke
The Kulreich von Lemminstantrophonees Legacy (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3479238&postcount=10) by CabbageTheif
The Morrígna (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6131642&postcount=14) by Stycotl
The Name and the Soul (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1947760&postcount=3) by Khantalas
The Resurrection Women (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6741111&postcount=8) by Bhu
* The Slender Man (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7707638&postcount=11) by Hyooz
The Terror (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7056517&postcount=14) by Gorgondantess
The Weeping Children (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6148215&postcount=15) by Jkoshe
These Boots (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6231605&postcount=4) by The Gilded Duke
Thoughtleech (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3003641&postcount=9) by Dennetik
Tome of the Worlds (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6368041&postcount=4) by Vaynor
Torell the Nightheart (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2905588&postcount=11) by Kel
Tosurak (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3300943&postcount=8) by Maerok
Träumen (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3219418&postcount=7) by Calver
Tuatha de Danaan (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6068250&postcount=6) by sidhe3141
Turtlehawk (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2117186&postcount=4) by Krimm_Blackleaf
Unbound Elemental Spirit (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7706149&postcount=10) by Bisected8
Unspoken Chorus (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5068883&postcount=10) by Djinn_In_Tonic
Urban Oasis (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4959611&postcount=12) by rtg0922
Vascula (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3301165&postcount=9) by Kai-Palin
* Vastor (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4452768&postcount=6) by NakedCelt
Vazjura (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5322173&postcount=9) by Lord Iames Osari
Veiled Deer (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4292699&postcount=6) by Malachite
Vertigo Swarm (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7063945&postcount=16) by Ertier
Vetala (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3873599&postcount=4) by Lord Tataraus
Vilapi (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3766335&postcount=7) by Hyrael
Violence (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3316102&postcount=12) by Runeir
Voice of Divinity (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3633375&postcount=8) by Blue_C.
Voracious Lemming (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8420671&postcount=7) by Bhu
* Votive Guardian (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3600963&postcount=4) by Thistle
* Wanderwish (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6206859&postcount=3) by SlaadLord
Watchdog (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5585500&postcount=5) by Debihuman
*Watcher (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4443603&postcount=4) by Paragon Badger
Weirded Way (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4952674&postcount=10) by Adanedhel9
Whimsycap Toadstool (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6124916&postcount=12) by Djinn_In_Tonic
Whisperlings (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4730921&postcount=16) by Daverick
Windsider (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2047219&postcount=10) by Thomar_of_Uointer
Wing Dragon (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3788332&postcount=9) by DracoDei
Wingbane Glider (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3808635&postcount=11) by Cespenar
* Winterchilde (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1631301&postcount=5) by Bearofbadnews
Witch-Begotten Stalker (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2126532&postcount=6) by Closet_Skeleton
Wonup (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5960055&postcount=3) by Bisected8
Woodsman (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6073678&postcount=7) by The Gilded Duke
Woror (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5042334&postcount=5) by Kyace
Woruldoomwere (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4436823&postcount=3) by Bisected8
Wrath (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=57794&postcount=8) by Krimm_Blackleaf
Wupperhin (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2117013&postcount=3) by The Great Skenardo
Xintri (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4521736&postcount=5) by Sir Shadow
Yersinia (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=58446&postcount=12) by Lucid_Archon
Yule Pig (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1694928&postcount=16) by Total_Viking_Power
Zodiacal Hydra (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2216664&postcount=17) by Calver
Zuni Warrior Fetish Doll (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7755171&postcount=14) Debihuman

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-06-21, 05:24 PM
Ok, old thread is dead, and the third has risen. Though I started July's competition early, June's contest still needs votes!

Click here to vote in ACHOO! (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=157071)

DracoDei
2010-06-21, 05:52 PM
Hmmm... you probably foreshadowed this in Chat-Thred version II, but this comes as quite a surprise for me...
Will have to think of what to do with it... almost certainly DO want to do something with it, if only because both components of the theme (template, and Epic) have a certain appeal to me.

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-06-21, 05:54 PM
Hmmm... you probably foreshadowed this in Chat-Thred version II, but this comes as quite a surprise for me...
Template contest or that it's epic-levels?

Bisected8
2010-06-21, 06:28 PM
That time of year already, is it?

Oh well, I've been wanting an excuse to create some sort of insanely complex template (one which has a great deal of different outcomes based on the base creature, instead of simply adding a few abilities and subtypes).

DracoDei
2010-06-21, 06:32 PM
Template contest or that it's epic-levels?

For me the surprise was both that you finally decided to go ahead and do a Template contest (we knew you were going to do one one of these days, but it didn't seem like it was likely to be soon), and that you decided on Epic for the theme of the first such outing.


P.S. I am FINALLY remembering to mention that the example creature block in the NORMAL contests has completely the wrong formatting to be Quoting friendly for newbies.

P.P.S. I assume that multiple input creatures (such as occurs with the Tauric template) are acceptable? Also, that randomly makes me ponder the idea of a dual OUTPUT creature...

Mulletmanalive
2010-06-21, 07:08 PM
Well, that sucks. A chance to writesome nifty text in a different prose for and have it compared to the work of others and the theme is thatthe requirement is epic levels...

Ah well, maybe next time.

Edit: Is it possible to enter only half of the competition? More precisely, could I enter a creature/template of too low power and have it invalidated from voting and still have the connected legend considered for that part?

It's either that or i'll just have to make an "elder evil" template, leaving the actual creature still, strictly, a threat for non-epic levels...

Debihuman
2010-06-22, 01:17 PM
M-Man, there's nothing that says you can't enter and then be disqualified, but I don't think that's what you really wanted to hear.

Epic Templates are hard. I have an idea for one but I'm not sure I'm going to have the time to write it out.

Debby

Mulletmanalive
2010-06-22, 04:20 PM
Not quite what i was asking really. I hated epic play on both occasions i forayed into it so i have no experience with it. I guess i coul just make a +1 or +0 CR template for epic creatures only and just focus on the writing

Edit: ignore me, i can still [i dunno if this was the intention but i'm all about the maleable spirit] fill this without issue by simple dint of the 20HD+ option. I can still keep my numbers managable! Wee!

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-06-23, 08:40 AM
For me the surprise was both that you finally decided to go ahead and do a Template contest (we knew you were going to do one one of these days, but it didn't seem like it was likely to be soon), and that you decided on Epic for the theme of the first such outing.
Do epic this time every year :smallwink:



P.S. I am FINALLY remembering to mention that the example creature block in the NORMAL contests has completely the wrong formatting to be Quoting friendly for newbies.
In what way?


P.P.S. I assume that multiple input creatures (such as occurs with the Tauric template) are acceptable? Also, that randomly makes me ponder the idea of a dual OUTPUT creature...
Sure. It's not the sample creatures we're voting on but the template. The Epic can be about the template or the sample creature, either way.




Re: GITP Monster Competition Chat Thread III
Well, that sucks. A chance to writesome nifty text in a different prose for and have it compared to the work of others and the theme is that the requirement is epic levels...

Ah well, maybe next time.

Edit: Is it possible to enter only half of the competition? More precisely, could I enter a creature/template of too low power and have it invalidated from voting and still have the connected legend considered for that part?
Sorry, all or nuthin'.


Epic Templates are hard. I have an idea for one but I'm not sure I'm going to have the time to write it out.
Aww, that's why I gave y'all a full month this time.


Not quite what i was asking really. I hated epic play on both occasions i forayed into it so i have no experience with it. I guess i coul just make a +1 or +0 CR template for epic creatures only and just focus on the writing
Well, I've never really played an epic campaign (that lasted more than a week anyways) but just make it worthy of a CR over 20 and you'll be fine.

MythMage
2010-06-23, 12:26 PM
Not quite what i was asking really. I hated epic play on both occasions i forayed into it so i have no experience with it.
I should point out that epic monsters technically include CR 21 dudes who are probably not even strong enough to be a good boss monster at level 20. An epic monster doesn't have to be for epic characters to fight; they might just be for 19-20th-level characters' boss fights. Like most of the Monster Manual's epic dragons are and (for an evil game) a solar might be.

Mulletmanalive
2010-06-23, 12:42 PM
I came up with a good idea and i'm goint to make a full elder evil template for a cyclic arrising.

I ended up Homebrewing all nine of the Dukes of Hell for the request thread so i may as well use them: Binder gone hideously wrong and turned harmful harbinger of horribleness, anyone?

FlyingWhale
2010-06-23, 01:31 PM
I had a thought about using common ideas, such as; greed, strife, pestilence, fear, death, war, etc etc and making them into a "job" like template. Just, something that you acquire.

MY entry, if it will work out, is the DEATH template... The creature with said template actually takes up the position of DEATH INCARNATE, or what have you.

Quick example, Morin, a 2nd level Warrior 1st level Rogue is in a skirmish just outside of town when a stray arrow hits him in the neck. As he lays bleeding in the grass, a shadow slowly approaches from behind, it reaches a long scythe blade to him but pauses momentarily. Morin isn't dead, yet, the figure seems to check an hourglass, pulling back the cowl of his cloak revealing a alabaster skull. Morin reaches for his sword, then thrusts it into the skull, splitting in half. Skip ahead a few odds and ends I will reserve for fluff and such, Morin has usurped Death and is now the deliverer of souls.

So, my big question, has this been done? I know we have Gods(esses) of death and such, but has there been an exact depiction of "The Grim Reaper" or "Death" who single-handedly guides all souls to their appointed place? I am sure I have seen Valkries and the like, but this Death I am making actually cuts the tether of life from said soul and body... Any help GITP??? I googled a bit and checked with some older dudes of lore and they dont seem to recall anything too similar to my idea at all.

Bisected8
2010-06-23, 02:15 PM
I'd make it something more along the lines of "death chooses people to become his subcontractors". The idea that a 3rd level character can kill the personification of death feels like a bit of a stretch to me...

Debihuman
2010-06-23, 02:27 PM
Grim Reaper is a monster in the Ravenloft line that collects the souls of the dying if that's what you mean. It appears in Denizens of Dread page 107.

Charon also fills that role see: The Tome of Horrors Revised pg.78 for DAEMON: CHARON (BOATMAN OF THE LOWER PLANES).

Debby

FlyingWhale
2010-06-23, 02:42 PM
Ah, thanks Debihuman and Bisected8!!!! I will go with the subcontractor... Though after flipping through, I still don't see the same idea, just the same name and basic legend/lore n such. Thanks again! wish me luck :smallwink:

Edit: The killing Death in one hit by a lowly guy was an idea that even in the worst of circumstances, there's still a .0162% of rolling 3 20's... Even Death loses his edge after a few millenniums :smallbiggrin:

Debihuman
2010-06-23, 02:45 PM
I'm not crazy about this contest.

According to the rules: "All entries this month must be a template that either A. increases a creature's CR by 20 or higher or B. Can only be applied to a creature with 20 or more HD. The sample creature need not be original or unique, only the template must."

I just have one comment: creating a template that only increases CR but not HD ends up being a badly designed template. They tend to have significant weaknesses not accounted for that the PCs will exploit. For example, it may be hard to kill due to SR, Damage Reduction, etc. but the PCs will find a way to push it off a cliff so it dies from falling damage. Yes, these things are fun to make, but they are terrible for actual play. See my Paragon Cat of Legend as an example of how bad this can get: http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6650340&postcount=97.

Debby

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-06-23, 02:59 PM
I just have one comment: creating a template that only increases CR but not HD ends up being a badly designed template.
Then have the template add HD.

For example my Pollen Mother (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=107241) template.


The purpose of this contest is to make balanced, CR appropriate creations. If most epic templates are badly done then make sure yours isn't :smallcool:

Glimbur
2010-06-23, 05:28 PM
I'm not exactly sure what CR to put on this thing. Ideas?

Debihuman
2010-06-23, 07:45 PM
One more thing: these creatures will be epic and everyone will be citing to feats that aren't in the PH, DMG and MM. If you use a feat that isn't in one of these books please cite to it. All you have to do is note which book the feat came from. It saves me a lot of time to not have to Google search every feat to figure out which book it came from so I figure out if the numbers for the statblock are right. You can also link from the Online SRD here: www.D20srd.org.

It also helps to have a Creation Notes section. There's a lot you can put in there that keeps me from losing my mind when I critique these. This is also good if you use house rules to identify them so I don't think something you did on purpose is a mistake.

VT, perhaps you should note in the contests that you've asked me to critique the monsters on this thread.

Debby

Debihuman
2010-06-23, 09:36 PM
Taking a look at our first contestant: Gloopy.

First, Size and Type are missing. It looks like it should be Gargantuan Ooze (Augmented Magical Beast).

Normally, if the HD are unchanged, the creature gains the Augmented subtype.



Augmented Subtype

A creature receives this subtype whenever something happens to change its original type. Some creatures (those with an inherited template) are born with this subtype; others acquire it when they take on an acquired template. The augmented subtype is always paired with the creature’s original type. A creature with the augmented subtype usually has the traits of its current type, but the features of its original type.

Rough CR estimation using Vorpal Tribble’s Handy-Dandy CR estimator

#1. Divide creature's average HP by 4.5 to 6.5.
4.5 for 5 HD or lower, 5 for 6-10 HD, 5.5 for 11-15 HD, 6 for 16-20 HD., 6.5 for 20-25 HD.

#2. Add 1 for each five points above 10 its AC is, subtracting 1 for every 5 below.

#3. Add 1 for each special attack (+2 to +5 or more if it has a decent number of spells in its spell-like abilities).

#4. Add 1 for each quality unless you deem it worthy of more. Add 1 for each resistance and 10 points of DR it has, and 2 for each immunity. Subtract 1 for each vulnerability.

#5. Add 1 for every two bonus feats it has.

#6. Divide total by 3. This should be its rough CR.

390 divided by 6.5 = 60 plus 4 for AC (so close to 5 but it's still only 4) = 64 plus 5 special attacks = 69 plus 11 special qualities = 80 divided by 3 = 26.666.... CR = 26 unless my math is wrong. [And it was initially because I am math impaired].

A 20 HD creature with CR 26 might not be as much as a challenge as you'd hope.

Another thing, you changed all the feats from the initial creature's list of feats. Nowhere in the Template does it state that the creature gains and loses feats. You have some 'splaining to do on this one. A normal Kraken has these feats: Alertness, Blind-Fight, Combat Expertise, Improved Critical (tentacle), Improved Initiative, Improved Trip, Iron Will.

Did you recalculate the skills for the loss of 2 to Spot and Listen from Alertness?

Debby

Glimbur
2010-06-24, 12:05 AM
Thanks for the catch on not actually listing Gloopy's type.

I'm not terribly excited about adding hit dice with Chosen of Juiblex because it would make the most sense to make them Ooze hit dice and the possibility of two different kinds of racial hit dice is... worrisome at best. It's probably a better idea to drop the damage on the acid and the constrict and reduce the stat boosts so the CR is more in line with its HD.

Honestly, I changed the feats on the kraken because the listed feats are not very good. It wasn't intended to be part of the template, just DM fiat to make the monster more interesting. Martial Studies generally only come up once an encounter (so once in the monster's life) but they spice up the fight. I wanted to give it Combat Reflexes to really work that prodigious reach but it doesn't have the Dex for it.

I hadn't taken two off of the spot and listen for the lack of alertness, thanks for that too.

By VT's CR guidelines, the stock Kraken is about CR 18, and that's not including its seven possible attacks a round. By the book a Kraken is only CR 12. I guesstimated the template at about a +5, without a rational basis, which makes it 20 HD at CR 17 which is still low. But it has huge Con and Str and is rather frightening in melee which it can do at a large range.

Debihuman
2010-06-24, 01:31 AM
Thanks for the catch on not actually listing Gloopy's type.

Just doing my job here :-)



I'm not terribly excited about adding hit dice with Chosen of Juiblex because it would make the most sense to make them Ooze hit dice and the possibility of two different kinds of racial hit dice is... worrisome at best. It's probably a better idea to drop the damage on the acid and the constrict and reduce the stat boosts so the CR is more in line with its HD.

You'd never have 2 sets of racial hit dice. Magical Beast or Ooze, the choice is yours. You just have to state it up front as part of the template.


Honestly, I changed the feats on the kraken because the listed feats are not very good. It wasn't intended to be part of the template, just DM fiat to make the monster more interesting. Martial Studies generally only come up once an encounter (so once in the monster's life) but they spice up the fight. I wanted to give it Combat Reflexes to really work that prodigious reach but it doesn't have the Dex for it.

For what it is worth, don't think the feats that a Kraken has are somehow substandard. The design of a Template is to show case a "standard" representative not a ramped up star of a monster. I understand your concern, but unless you are designing a variant Kraken and then adding the feats, you should stick to the standard monster. You didn't say this was a variant Kraken and I rightly called you out for it.

This is part of what good design is all about. You should be able to take the Template and use on an existing monster without changing the monster first.

You didn't showcase the template, you showcased a new uber Kraken and then added the Template without saying that's what you were doing. I simply called you out on this.


I hadn't taken two off of the spot and listen for the lack of alertness, thanks for that too.

No problem. But now you know why I hate epic creatures so much. They're a pain to critique.


By VT's CR guidelines, the stock Kraken is about CR 18, and that's not including its seven possible attacks a round. By the book a Kraken is only CR 12. I guesstimated the template at about a +5, without a rational basis, which makes it 20 HD at CR 17 which is still low. But it has huge Con and Str and is rather frightening in melee which it can do at a large range.

That's why it is an estimator and not a precise calculation. Some special abilities are worth more than others. I probably should have added more points for more powerful abilities. It didn't take into account your more powerful feats either.

You have a decent template and the purpose of the contest is to showcase it, not the souped-up version of a kaken that you then added the template too almost like an aside. You are missing the primary focus.

Here is my recommendation: Take the standard kraken and apply the template normally. See where it needs adjusting. You can alway add a bonus feat if you like or even two. Adding more than two bonus feats means that the creature should probably have additional HD. If the creature doesn't qualify for a feat and you want to hand it out -- give it as a bonus feat. Bonus feats don't have to meet the prerequisites like normal feats do.

Let the Template do the work for you.

Debby

DracoDei
2010-06-24, 01:41 AM
Hmmm... maybe a fractal template, based on my fractal bears, that can only be applied to creatures above a certain size... I would have to expand on the history of the wizards who were responsible for their creation, and then...

Anyway, does this sound like an idea I should go with? Is it original enough to qualify? Would people vote for it? Someone did say they might have voted for the fractal bears if it weren't for the fact that they were so dangerous they didn't seem funny (which was the theme of that contest...).

Debihuman
2010-06-24, 03:39 PM
Draco, I applaud you if you want to make Fractal Template. At the same time, I'm fairly sure that I'm not really up to critiquing it. I think I have brain damage from the first one.

VT, I think this competition may be more than I can handle for PEACHING. Could you lend a hand with some especially the Challenge Ratings. That's my weakest skill. I don't want to steer any of our contestants wrong.

Also, I'll be off line for a few days as I'll be on the road. I should be back by next Wednesday.

Debby

Hyooz
2010-06-24, 03:56 PM
Yeah... I may be making a template to cover the three big Omni's (present, potent, scient) so in-depth PEACHing might get rough...

un_known
2010-06-24, 08:36 PM
I've got a poem but I have no idea how to do 3.5 Epic Templates. Since I've only been working 4E and played some 3E.

What do I do?

DracoDei
2010-06-25, 03:27 AM
My method preferred method is to forget about the rules to start with (at least mostly) and just imagine what the thing IS and/or what it DOES... then build mechanics around that.

Many templates change the type of the creature.

Also, try reading the linked threads in the sticky thread at the top of the homebrew forums.

Debihuman
2010-06-25, 08:15 AM
Hyooz, you've done exactly what I said not to do. A template that adds CR 25 to a 1 HD monster without a commensurate increase in HD is not a good idea (more on that later but let's get to the meat of this template)

Your Medium Humanoid is missing its subtype (Human, Elf, etc.). I'd guess Human but it is missing a feat in that case. It is also missing its hit points. It should have 6. Also where did the +2 bonus hit points come from? It has a Con of 10. It also has the wrong attack if it owns a longbow. The longbow is missing from its attacks. Unarmed attack or Longbow. It is also missing Omniscient from its Special Qualities.

Your sample creature shows a CR of 20 but the CR listed in your template is +25, so I'm not sure what you were trying to do. It looks like you meant to say that the Challenge Rating: You add +25 to the base creature's existing CR (but that isn't what you did in the sample creature as it's CR is only 20 and it should be 25).

Where do the increase in Str and Dex come from? You state that it can change its Dex and Str scores but there should be a mechanic that goes with it. Can it swap Dex and Str or does it just pick it? If it is picked then there should be a way to keep it from being an excess for its CR rating, otherwise you are making a monster that has the potential to have ludicrous numbers for its CR. 70 Str for CR 25 is fine. 20,000,000 Str for CR 25 is stupid and yet that's what will be done with this template.

You neglected to say what the AC bonus was and what it is based on. Again if you give it any number freely you are going to exceed the CR and that isn't fair to the players. Put a cap on it to match CR, otherwise it might have a million bonus AC and that's just stupid. It looks to me like it gains a +25 armor bonus but you should state it outright.

Saves: What is the sacred bonus? It needs a mechanic here to go with it. This creature doesn't have an alignment requirement so why a sacred bonus? Evil creatures should get a profane bonus or there should be an alignment restriction. See your sample creature's alignment.


A sacred bonus (or penalty) stems from the power of good. Multiple sacred bonuses on the same character or object do not stack. Only the highest sacred bonus applies.

Omnipotence: You need to list exactly what abilities are affected and that it affects spellcasting because it is too vague. He doesn't roll for initiative, attack, damage, saving throws etc.? He just gets to pick a number out of thin air? That's just asking for abuse. Why not just create the TPK and be done instead of bothering to apply this template. And how do you expect it to be CR 20? That's CR far more than 25 or 100. Unlimited power is unlimited abuse. Bad, bad idea. Again, a cap on this would be useful. The only truly omnipotent beings should be deities and this creature doesn't have a Divine Rank. Actually if this Template added a Divine Rank of 1 that would make a lot more sense but it doesn't. See SRD for more on Divine Rank.

Now, I did say that low HD was going to be its downfall. I have just one spell for you: magic missile. No save. It just does 1d4+1 damage at first level. At 9th level, it does 1d4+5 points of damage. Your creature has 6 hit points. A hit from magic missile does at least 6 points of damage (no save) and odds are that it will do 2 or more points. At 0 hit points, you can still heal yourself, but if it does 2 point of damage your sample creature is at -1 HP becomes unconscious and is dying. It can't heal itself because it is unconscious. So all the PCs need to do is stand around and wait for it to lose 1 hit point each round until it is dead. One spell and a low-level one at that will kill your omnipotent child. Of course, Power Word Kill does the same (it's not a critical hit and has no save) but why waste that when magic missile is just as effective?

Debby

Hyooz
2010-06-25, 06:15 PM
Debi, thanks for the critique.

Looks like I missed a lot of stuff in the mess of text the template/monster ended up being. I'll clean up the inconsistencies and wrong-ness in places. That's what I get for working on it so sporadically. Thoughts get lost here and there >.<

A lot of your concerns I had in mind as I was making the template, and I might need to make a *Special Note* or something for CR, because while stuff like 20,000,000 Str is silly powerful, that's kind of the idea. I mean, yes, it's ludicrously powerful, and the template is stupidly abusable, but it's omnipotence. A DM who abuses the template is going to abuse his power anyway, and a DM who lets a player take it in a normal game is clearly out of his mind.

And yes, I know the HD concern is there, and it looks really stupid on paper, but I did it for a reason. A creature with all the power the -potence part of the triad gives it should only die if it lacks the intelligence and wisdom to use it properly. As written, magic missile wins outright, but a creature that can cast every arcane and divine spell at will, more than likely, have protections up. More than defense, but temporary HP and such out the wazoo. A smart creature/DM/player behind the wheel of this thing will make it effectively invincible. I agree it can be wholly ridiculous on its own, but I think it can also be a useful tool in the DM's arsenal.

That's not reflected on the sample creature because I honestly wasn't sure what to do with it. Several of its stats are wholly arbitrary (by design) and a lot of the other changes are going to come from spells, and aside from scouring the PHB and the SpC for every spell it might have active at any given moment, there's no good way to demonstrate what might be possible.

This isn't to say your concerns aren't legitimate. I had (and have) a lot of the same ones, but when I set out to make a template to make a creature omnipotent (or omniscient... or omnipresent... which might be its own separate issue) well... some aspects of typical good design were going to take a hit.

I'm grateful for the critique, don't get me wrong. I knew this would be rough >.<

Debihuman
2010-06-25, 07:34 PM
I've got a poem but I have no idea how to do 3.5 Epic Templates. Since I've only been working 4E and played some 3E.

What do I do?

RTFM. Seriously read the books -- learn the rules. You can get a good idea from the online SRD but it doesn't have everything. I recommend that you wait until you have at least a fair knowledge of how the rules work. The rules for Monster creation are all over the place. New rules supersede older ones so you need to check the FAQ and Errata for changes unless you have the Rules Compendium.

You can ask for help here but I can't guarantee I have enough time to give much advice. I'll be leaving on vacation on Friday so you won't see much of me for 4 or 5 days.

Debby

Bhu
2010-06-25, 09:20 PM
Can I do an Epic Monster Template? People have assumed there is one forever now.

Glimbur
2010-06-27, 07:46 PM
Knock yourself out. That's a really broad concept though, I'd be interested to see how you handle it. Remember that you also need a story to go with it, but you could tell almost any story with a scary monster in it and have it count if I understand you correctly, so...

FlyingWhale
2010-06-28, 02:50 PM
I decided to enter this one with a joke/serious entry... It is a serious template but it will be set on something silly :smallbiggrin: Hope you guys enjoy it! I'll post by tomorrow afternoon. Adios!

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-06-30, 10:55 AM
Ok, finally getting time to look through everything.

Btw, Hyzooz, your sig could do with an update :smallwink:


Can I do an Epic Monster Template? People have assumed there is one forever now.
Eh?

Bisected8
2010-06-30, 12:37 PM
I think he means a template which is specifically designed to make an existing creature an epic version of that creature.

FlyingWhale
2010-06-30, 01:14 PM
After like, 3 different tries at making a new template, I give up. I now officially hate epic levels. Before, I disliked it, now? I hate it.:smallannoyed:

At least it's just once eh? On to next month :smallsigh:

Hyooz
2010-06-30, 04:04 PM
Btw, Hyzooz, your sig could do with an update :smallwink:


Hoy paloy you're right. Just got so used to seeing it I didn't even think about it >.>

Bhu
2010-06-30, 05:52 PM
I think he means a template which is specifically designed to make an existing creature an epic version of that creature.
yup
thats it

DracoDei
2010-07-02, 02:38 PM
I am not far enough along with my thinking to post an entry complete enough for the main thread, but if I don't start writing things down I am never going to get there, and my location in meat-space may be subject to sudden changes this month. For this reason I am going to do my preliminary work here. If people object (enough of my peer posters, or Vorpal Tribble, or any mod in an official capacity) I will find some place else to put this and delete this post after that.

PEACH welcome on whatever parts I have actually typed up at any given time...

Fractal

- Origins, descriptions and general fluff of the template -
Fractal bears were created when two overly-daring magicians decided to collaborate on their work. The first, Megur the Canny, was a bender of space and time, an expert in geometries both strange and mundane. The other was Fitzsimons Rangi, a shaper of creatures. The first project they attempted was an experiment to impose Order on a small part of the Far Realms. Megur went there and cast the spell, while Fitzsimons stayed behind to rescue him if anything went wrong. Megur's life-line to Fitzsimons was a telepathic linking spell capable of working across planes. The Order-imposing spell reacted badly with the nature of the plane and fractured Megur into an infinite number of copies, while retaining his original total size between them and temporarily created a similar structure in the fabric of space around him. Fitzsimons broke the link, but not before the link broke him. Megurs' (sic) fate(s) are unknown. Fitzsimons created the fractal bears shortly afterward. Unusually for such cases, none of them escaped. In fact, Fitzsimons' son, Ignatz persuaded him to retire to an insane asylum shortly after a stable breeding population of fractal bears were created, in part by praising them as the crowing work of Fitzsimons, after which, anything less could only be a disappointment. Unfortunately Fitzsimons took this TOO much to heart, and insisted on running a lucrative business from his padded room via various proxies. Those he sold the fractal bears to as visual amusements did not prove so dutiful in their attempts to contain the beasts, and now several locations throughout the world have infestations.


Creating A Fractal Creature
“Fractal” is an inherited (or, rarely, acquired) template that can be added to any creature of at least Diminutive size with a consistent external shape (referred to hereafter as the “base creature”). A fractal creature uses all the base creature’s statistics and special abilities except as noted here.

Sample Fractal Creatures

Fractal Ancient ??? Dragon <Augmented Dragon, ???>
Hit Dice:
Initiative:
Speed: (# squares)
Armor Class: (), touch, flat-footed
Base Attack/Grapple:
Attack:
Full Attack:
Space/Reach:
Special Attacks: Multiple Breathweapons,
Special Qualities:
Saves: Fort +, Ref +, Will +
Abilities: Str , Dex , Con , Int , Wis , Cha
Skills:
Feats:
Environment:
Organization:
Challenge Rating:
Treasure:
Alignment:
Advancement:
Level Adjustment:

Description/background/characteristics

Combat

Ability descriptions
Int. Mod divided by HD for Chromatic Dragons

Fractal Xill
Medium Aberration(Augmented Outsider)>
Hit Dice:
Initiative:
Speed: (# squares)
Armor Class: (), touch, flat-footed
Base Attack/Grapple:
Attack:
Full Attack:
Space/Reach:
Special Attacks:
Special Qualities:
Saves: Fort +, Ref +, Will +
Abilities: Str , Dex , Con , Int , Wis , Cha
Skills:
Feats:
Environment:
Organization:
Challenge Rating:
Treasure:
Alignment:
Advancement:
Level Adjustment:

Description/background/characteristics

Combat

Ability descriptions

Fractal 12 Headed Superior Awakened (see below) Cyrohydra
Huge Aberration(Augmented Magical Beast) Warrior 6
Hit Dice:21d10+6d8+140
Initiative:
Speed: (# squares)
Armor Class: (), touch, flat-footed
Base Attack/Grapple:+27/
Attack: Bite Group +36 melee (248,832 points of damage, dealt as 248,832 separate attacks of 1d2-3 points of damage each for purposes of DR, some strength effects, and critical hits)
Full Attack: 12 Bite Groups +36 melee (248,832 points of damage, dealt as 248,832 separate attacks of 1d2-4 points of damage each for purposes of DR, some strength effects, and critical hits)
Space/Reach:
Special Attacks: Multiple Breathweapons,
Special Qualities: Darkvision 60 ft., fast healing 22, low-light vision, scent
Saves: Fort +21(Epic progression for the 6 fighter levels, right?), Ref +, Will +14
Abilities: Str 29(23)/21(15)/13(7)/9(3)/5(0)/3(0)/3(0), Dex 13, Con 25, Int 11, Wis 12, Cha 12
Skills:
Feats: Alertness, Blind-Fight, Combat ReflexesB, Epic Will, Improved Natural Attack (bite), Iron Will, Toughness, Weapon Focus (bite), (2 non-epic free picks and 1 more Epic constrained pick to go)
Environment:
Organization:
Challenge Rating:
Treasure: Gauntlets of Strength +6, Belt of Magic Fang, Greater, Adamintine Full-Plate +1
Alignment: Chaotic Neutral
Advancement: By Class
Level Adjustment: +A LOT

Description/background/characteristics

Combat

Ability descriptions



Size and Type: Size is unchanged. If not already an abberation then type changes to Aberration and gains the Augmented subtype for its previous type. Reach changes to that for a Tall creature of its size, unless it is already greater.
Hit Dice: Racial hit-dice increase to d8's if originally d6, otherwise unchanged. Do not re-roll previous hit-points unless at least 1 hit-die changes size. After this operation, increase racial hit-dice by 50%. These hit-dice grant hit-points, with constitution bonus, and skill-points as usual, however they have unusual effects on saves, special abilities whose effects are derived from HD, and feats. See appropriate sections below.
Attack: (See Nom-Nom-Nom and Diminishing Attacks below.)
Special Attacks: A fractal creature retains all of its normal special attacks and gains the following:
- Nom-Nom-Nom(Ex): When a fractal creature deals damage with a successful grapple check that is made with all of its limbs it deals damage as if it had hit will all of its natural weapons, instead of the normal amount of grappling damage.

Special Qualities: A fractal creature retains all of its normal special qualities and gains the following:
-Diminishing Attacks (Ex): Each attack uses its full strength bonus for to-hit and damage, however that strength is reduced for the smaller mouths (see the "abilities" section for details). For damage purposes the smaller mouths also use the damage dice of a smaller creature. Note that this causes strength bonuses and penalties to act a bit oddly.
All the attacks on a given sub-limb below a certain level (usually the secondary level) require the largest damage dealing portion on that sub-limb (such as a mouth, set of claws, hoof, etc) to hit to give themselves an opportunity, but given such an opportunity are certain to hit, with the largest damage dealing portion holding the victim still (or at least providing a near-perfect frame of reference to the fractal creature's Kinesthetic/proprioceptive (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proprioception) sense)for the split second need to curl its limbs around and strike with the smaller mouths associated with it. Thus only one attack roll is used. For purposes of damage reduction and strength effects however, these are a large number* separate attacks, each dealing its own allotment of damage.
Note that this means that DR of that is not overcome by the fractal creature can completely negate the need to roll certain of the dice(except in the case of stone skin or similar spells and effects).
*up to 12^6=2,985,984 for the Fractal 12 Headed Superior Awakened (see below) Cyrohydra I provided as an example and similiar 12 headed hydra based creatures.

-Hybrid Vigor (Ex): For their racial hit-dice, fractal creatures use good fortitude and will saves regardless of base creature type. The former is due to their multiple vital organs grant them superior resilience, and the latter is due to their aberration nature combined with the difficulty of affecting their multiple brains. A fractal creature use the same reflex save progression for its racial hit-dice as the base creature.

-Specialized Uncanny Dodge (Ex): A fractal creature that gains heads as a result of this template retains its Dexterity bonus to AC (if any) even if he is caught flat-footed BUT NOT IF STRUCK BY AN INVISIBLE ATTACKER. Also, it still loses its dexterity bonus to AC if immobilized. A fractal bear can not be flanked. This defense denies a rogue the ability to sneak attack the fractal bear by flanking it, unless the attacker has at least four more rogue levels than the target has hit-dice.

- Optional -
Vorpal Weapons, Hydras etc:
On a successful head-removing attack against a fractal creature, roll on the following chart to determine which head(s) are removed. This deals no damage, but does remove the associated bite attacks from the attack routine. Reduce their attacks (if it was a primary or secondary head) and damage accordingly. Fractal creatures can not regrow lost heads without the aid of magic unless the base creature could regrow heads or other limbs.
{TABLE=head]d% Result|Head Type removed
01-37|1d3 Sexternary
38-69|Sexternary
70-85|Quinternary
86-93|Quaternary
94-97|Tertiary
98-99|Secondary
100|Primary[/Table]

Saves: A fractal creature's fortitude and will saves are always Good for racial hit-dice. (See Hybrid Vigor above).

Abilities: A fractal creature gains a special modification to strength (see below), and gains +4 Con (due to redundant anatomy) a creature that gains heads due to this template also gains +2 Wis and +2 Charisma.
The main-level attacks of a fractal creature use its full strength score, At each level reduce the effective strength as if the fractal creature were one size category smaller. for MECHANICAL purposes stop the division at the at Fine size or at the interation before the effective strength would be reduced to 0 or less). Note that increases and decrements to primary-level strength may alter this. A table is provided below for your convenience.
{TABLE=head]Overall size|Strength
Diminutive|Full/Full
Tiny|Full/Full-2/Full-2
Small|Full/Full-4/Full-6/Full-6
Medium|Full/Full-4/Full-8/Full-10/Full-10
Large|Full/Full-8/Full-12/Full-16/Full-18/Full-18
Huge|Full/Full-8/Full-16/Full-20/Full-24/Full-26/Full-26
Gigantic|Full/Full-8/Full-16/Full-24/Full-28/Full-32/Full-34/Full-34
Colossal|Full/Full-8/Full-16/Full-24/Full-32/Full-36/Full-40/Full-42/Full-42
[/Table]
Thus, for example the strength score for a large creature with a 27 base strength would be 27/19/15/11/9/9.

Feats/Epic Feats: If the base creaturegains natural attacks with the addition of this template then the resulting fractal creature gains the Multi-attack and Improved Multi-attack feats as bonus feats. If the base creature is proficient with at least one manufactured weapon and gains manipulatory appendages with the addition of this template then it gains the Multi-weapon Fighting and Improved Multi-weapon fighting feats as bonus feats.
Any feats(including Epic Feats) gained from bonus racial hitdice must come from the following pool unless the creature has already taken all feats on the list it qualifies for:
Alertness, Endurance, Epic Fortitude, Epic Will, Great Fortitude, Iron Will, Improved Toughness

Epic Feats: (See Above)

Environment: As per base creature plus The Far Realms

Challenge Rating: (Should vary based on number of attacks gained, and multi-casting abilities gained).

Alignment: Chaotic creatures and creatures with intelligence of 3 or less (including mindless creatures) do not change alignment as a result of acquiring this template . Other creatures' alignments are either unchanged, or move one step towards chaotic at the option of the GM (or player in the case of a PC).
Advancement: ((Based on exponent base... IE dragons get less added attacks than a hydra. Also factor in regarding multi-casting.))
Level Adjustment: ((Based on exponent base... IE dragons get less added attacks than a hydra. Also factor in regarding multi-casting.))

Peregrine
2010-07-08, 02:48 PM
Well, it's my first competition entry in a looong time, and the first time I've really dabbled in epic at all... but here goes. The Adamantine Beast template is up now. Mechanics all more or less present, fluff to follow.

All feedback (good, bad and ugly) is appreciated. :smallsmile:

Debihuman
2010-07-08, 03:57 PM
Just a note on my looking at this month's entries.

Chose of Juiblex Kraken becomes an Ooze and gains the Augmented subtype in the statblock but you didn't put it in the Template.

I admit I don't quite get all the changes that Omni gets. Why isn't the creature called Medium Omnipotent Humanoid (Human)? If it is human, it should be listed with 2 feats not just one. If it isn't Human, you need to explain what the base creature was.

Your sample creature doesn't even follow the rules of the template. It is missing Climb, Burrow and Fly speeds (and maneuverability). CR is +25 and you have it at only +20 (should be +25 at least). If it knows everything why doesn't it have any Knowledge skills? 3+HD plus modifiers. I'm sure there is more that's missing but that's it for now. I recommend you go through the template line by line and make sure you've applied the various changes correctly. Since it can choose it's Str & Dex the sample creature should probably have base numbers to start with. It can choose to have more but it doesn't have to and the statblock should reflect only changes that the Template specifically adds.

Peregrine, Animals and Constructs generally don't amass treasure. None is perfectly fine to put in the treasure line. I recommend using VT's CR estimator for figuring out the CR. VT perhaps you can help with this one.

Also, magical weapons cannot have an enhancement bonus greater than +5.
Magic weapons have enhancement bonuses ranging from +1 to +5. They apply these bonuses to both attack and damage rolls when used in combat. All magic weapons are also masterwork weapons, but their masterwork bonus on attack rolls does not stack with their enhancement bonus on attack rolls.

Okay, I'm done with the critiquing. Please can we not have any more epic stuff. My brain hurts.

FYI, I'd make a motion for a contest based on aquatic theme on next month's monsters (tying into a couple of threads I'm on) if that were allow.

Vacation starts for me tomorrow so I won't be available to do any more critiquing.

Also, I realize I'm being a bit abrupt here and curt with my answers and I honestly am not trying to be harsh. Most mistakes are easy corrections. VT can you please (pretty please) go over some the statblocks and offer some advice.

Debby

Glimbur
2010-07-08, 05:07 PM
To my eye, the Adamantine Beast lacks... focus. It can get a breath weapon, or an Epic weapon, or an alternate form, or flight, or displacement, or... none of these things seem adamantine to me.

I would give bonus hit dice, DR lots/adamantine or lots/-, increase damage on natural attacks, throw on a slam attack, add lots of natural armor, and call it a day. Ability bonuses are whatever seems good, and it is helpful that you included a list of recommended feats. The increase to Int seems strange, and you aren't following the normal rules for skills because you state exactly how many skill points the HD grant instead of it being determined by them being Construct hit dice plus its intelligence score. I would stick with either animal intelligence or make them mindless. Then you would need to include a list of common reactions they have to things: do they attack anything that moves, defend an area, pretend to be a normal creature of the type the base creature is, or something even weirder.

MythMage
2010-07-09, 01:47 AM
Also, magical weapons cannot have an enhancement bonus greater than +5.
Actually, they can. You need a minimum +6 to penetrate /epic damage reduction. The core rules just don't cover epic bonuses because those require a goofy price hike which isn't covered outside the epic rules. See the epic SRD for details.

Debihuman
2010-07-09, 07:42 AM
Actually, they can. You need a minimum +6 to penetrate /epic damage reduction. The core rules just don't cover epic bonuses because those require a goofy price hike which isn't covered outside the epic rules. See the epic SRD for details.

Darn it. I hate it when rules don't cross reference. THIS is why I loath critiquing epic creatures, too many things that can be missed. [Pardon me while I bang my head against the desk for a while].

Okay, I'm better now.

A few more things: The adamantine lion should have a flight speed of 50 ft. not 80 ft. per the template unless there was something there that added 30 more feet.

It also seems to have more than the 3 from its choices of special abilities and attacks. It has alternate form, epic weapon, flight and unearthly speed. According to the template it should only have 3 of those things. A lion can't really wield a weapon so it needs to have alternate form. Therefore, it needs to lose either unearthly speed or or flight. I recommend for it losing unearthly speed since it has the Epic Speed feat.That was easy!

Now, I'm handing the critiquing off to the rest of you fine folks as starting today, I'm on vacation!

Debby

Peregrine
2010-07-09, 11:26 AM
First, thanks for the feedback. Second, epic fail (ha ha ha) on my part: alternate form is not one of the optional special qualities; all adamantine beasts should have it. I really need to clarify that Special Qualities section.


To my eye, the Adamantine Beast lacks... focus. It can get a breath weapon, or an Epic weapon, or an alternate form, or flight, or displacement, or... none of these things seem adamantine to me.

Hopefully the fluff will clear things up a bit. I don't want its flavour to be "it's a big adamantine construct"; the adamantine golem has that category pretty well sewn up. (I'm also trying to avoid turning it into Beast Wars, but that's kind of the direction it's headed!)


I would give bonus hit dice, DR lots/adamantine or lots/-, increase damage on natural attacks, throw on a slam attack, add lots of natural armor, and call it a day.

Check, check, check, check (kind of) and check. Do you mean "leave it at that" or "do more of these"?


The increase to Int seems strange...

I don't want them to be mindless or even animal intelligence. Again, hopefully the fluff will better support my decision here.


...and you aren't following the normal rules for skills because you state exactly how many skill points the HD grant instead of it being determined by them being Construct hit dice plus its intelligence score.

Actually, feel free to check my maths on this, but I have stuck to the normal rules. I've just done the calculations for you, in the hopes of making the template easier to apply. This may have backfired; I worry that the explanation may be too complex.

The idea is, all animals have 2+Int mod skill points per level... and they all have Int 1 or 2, which is Int mod -5 or -4, which means all animals really only get 1 skill point per level. In fact, they'd have to get their Int all the way to 10 to ever have more skill points.

The Int boost of the template isn't enough to do this, and construct HD also give only 2+Int mod skill points. So all adamantine beasts will still only have one skill point per HD, and since they all have 24 bonus HD, that's exactly 24 skill points more than the base creature... unless you apply some of those six ability score boosts to Int.

That's the kind of calculation I was trying to take off the reader's mind.


Darn it. I hate it when rules don't cross reference. THIS is why I loath critiquing epic creatures, too many things that can be missed. [Pardon me while I bang my head against the desk for a while].

Epic's a bit like that, isn't it? :smallyuk: Not normally my thing, and if this competition has taught me nothing else, it's that I'll be aiming to end the campaign I'm currently running at 20th level, no higher!


A few more things: The adamantine lion should have a flight speed of 50 ft. not 80 ft. per the template unless there was something there that added 30 more feet.

Yes, the Epic Speed (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/feats#epicSpeed) feat.


It also seems to have more than the 3 from its choices of special abilities and attacks. It has alternate form, epic weapon, flight and unearthly speed. According to the template it should only have 3 of those things.

Yeah, alternate form isn't meant to be optional. (Unearthly speed and Epic Speed are meant to complement each other in this case, which is why it has both.)

Thanks for the critiques, both of you!

Darwin
2010-07-19, 06:11 AM
There, just finished my first submission to a homebrew contest ever. Would someone be kind enough to give it a read and let me know of the spelling errors and mistakes i haven't found myself? :smallbiggrin: Feedback is also very, very welcome.

Debihuman
2010-07-19, 10:21 AM
Darwin: Your cat would have CR 20 (you round down after full numbers).

While I applaud your efforts, I have a feeling that the Template is underpowered because it doesn't grant additional HD or even hit points. Furthermore, it is a little too similar to the Paragon Creature Template for comfort for me. See here: http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/monsters/paragonCreature.htm

Yes, your cat is powerful, but it's dead very quickly because you don't have to kill it outright. You only have to knock it unconscious and then coup de grace it or suffocate it. It only takes 5 points of damage to knock it out. Hard to do but at level 20, not impossible.

Of course, doing this 9 times makes for a long battle and significantly reduces a parties resources for no gain and probably not much fun either. There's nothing to be gained from this encounter other than the party wasting their resources and time. Granted, these creatures are fun to make but under no circumstances would I recommend this template for use in game.

The worse example of this is my own creation. Fluffy the Doomkitty, a Paragon Cat of Legend here: http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6650340&postcount=97%22. Note that Fluffy is CR 17 but he can easily take your cat. Whiskers won't even hurt Fluffy with a bite or claw.

As you can see, I'm not a fan of any of these sort of templates as they tend to be too unbalancing at least when the base animal is only a cat.

Debby

Darwin
2010-07-19, 11:51 AM
Darwin: Your cat would have CR 20 (you round down after full numbers).

Thank you, I'll fix it in a sec :smallbiggrin:


While I applaud your efforts, I have a feeling that the Template is underpowered because it doesn't grant additional HD or even hit points. Furthermore, it is a little too similar to the Paragon Creature Template for comfort for me. See here: http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/monsters/paragonCreature.htm

I can in no way justify adding addition hp to a template where I've already given the creature 9 times it's own hp. While this might not be terrifying on a cat, it gets much, much worse as we progress up the CR ladder. Multiplication is a complicated thing in D&D. And I'm nearly willing to call it impossible to balance at all stages of the game.


Yes, your cat is powerful, but it's dead very quickly because you don't have to kill it outright. You only have to knock it unconscious and then coup de grace it or suffocate it. It only takes 5 points of damage to knock it out. Hard to do but at level 20, not impossible.

It is supposed to be hard, not impossible. This is a good thing :smallconfused:


Of course, doing this 9 times makes for a long battle and significantly reduces a parties resources for no gain and probably not much fun either. There's nothing to be gained from this encounter other than the party wasting their resources and time. Granted, these creatures are fun to make but under no circumstances would I recommend this template for use in game.

No gain? Gain is a relative term and is controlled by the DM. If the DM decides to place Whiskers in front of a huge pile of treasure then there'd be just as much gain from it as fighting the Tarrasque or a great gold wyrm. If Whiskers can expend resources from the party, then he's doing exactly what he's supposed to as a monster.


The worse example of this is my own creation. Fluffy the Doomkitty, a Paragon Cat of Legend here: http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6650340&postcount=97%22. Note that Fluffy is CR 17 but he can easily take your cat. Whiskers won't even hurt Fluffy with a bite or claw.


Thank god they aren't designed to fight each other then :smalltongue:.


As you can see, I'm not a fan of any of these sort of templates as they tend to be too unbalancing at least when the base animal is only a cat.


Templates by nature are horribly unbalanced once they go past +1 or +2. Doing a +20 template is silly and I have a hard time imagining it seeing real play. I took this as an opportunity to create something fun rather than focusing on balance since it would be wasted effort anyway. Seeing how parties have such a wide gap in power level, from truenamer to the batman wizard how is one ever supposed to balance a monster against all of them?

Thanks for the input though. It put a few things in perspective, and it's always fun to have a good argument :smallbiggrin:

Bhu
2010-07-19, 03:28 PM
I really wanted to give this a shot, but with all the squabling going on between my doctors, I'm going to bow out this time. I may need to focus on other things, and I'm too shot to really concentrate.

Bisected8
2010-07-19, 05:31 PM
Unless I can drum something up tommorow it looks like I'll being missing this one as well. Oh well.

Debihuman
2010-07-20, 12:09 PM
No gain? Gain is a relative term and is controlled by the DM. If the DM decides to place Whiskers in front of a huge pile of treasure then there'd be just as much gain from it as fighting the Tarrasque or a great gold wyrm. If Whiskers can expend resources from the party, then he's doing exactly what he's supposed to as a monster.

Generally, killing monsters isn't the only goal in an encounter nor is taking a pile of gold. Unfortunately, whiskers has no way to impart any information to the party. Dragons can talk. The Tarrasque gives the party a chance to save a world generally but Whiskers isn't a world-threatening monster. It's just a cat with a brutal attack. Yes, the DM controls what gain is available to party but Whiskers is quite limited in that respect. It's only real use is a TPK. It has no treasure, it has no wisdom to impart, it's death won't won't have an effect on anyone other than the combatants.

Actually I mis-wrote earlier. At CR 20, Whiskers is EASILY defeated.
In a a party with one wizard, it takes 4 magic missile spells, 4 finger of death spells and 2 power word kill spells to kill Whiskers. A CR 18 wizard can do this on his own as none of those spells require a saving throw. If the magic missiles don't outright kill Whiskers, it will definitely leave him unconscious.

Since you only have to do 5 points of damage to Whiskers, a 7th level wizard could cast magic missile (4 missiles each doing 1d4+1 for a minimum of 8 points of damage).

You didn't mention whether this was possible or not so I'm tossing this out now as a possibility. Is it possible to cast reincarnate on Whiskers after he is dead but before he comes back to life? It's a timing issue more than anything else. Obviously, the party would have to have some idea of what to do (this is where lore checks are really nice). It's a kinda cheesy way around the template as you can see. DC for a timing check wouldn't be out of line but the DC is 10 [10 +1/2 Whisker's HD + Whisker's Con modifier and I'm using Con because it's the most relevant stat]. Even adding +2 for stress to make it a DC 12 is still an easy check for a 20th level party member.

If reincarnation isn't an option, the players could simply attack with weapons -- the cat's AC is 39 so beating that is the next thing to tackle.

Actually I may have been wrong about the difficulty of a fighter at 20th level versus Whiskers. It depends on the feats taken [anything that adds a bonus to attack is useful] spells used [haste, invisibility] and Strength bonus and whether or not a weapon has an attack bonus too. A tanked out fighter could easily beat whiskers in a fight.

Shouldn't Whiskers have both Mettle and Improved Mettle? Ditto for Evasion and Improved Evasion. Since Evasion and Improved Evasion only work on attacks that deal half damage it's not going to be a factor against a weapon hit. Aren't there several version of Mettle? You should cite to which one you are using. [Complete Warrior see page X for example].

Debby

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-07-22, 03:00 PM
Sorry all for the delay and lack of much talk during this contest, but the Voting thread for Beings of Legend IV (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=161235) is open. Good luck!

DracoDei
2010-07-22, 03:34 PM
Well, I am sorry I wasn't able to finish my entry, but I have something that very vaguely resembles a job now and was hoping to repair a washing machine. I don't get paid, and I only come in when I feel like it, but I am trusted not to screw up around dangerous and expensive machinery, and he is a very skilled jeweler (as in they actually make their own stuff using CAD/CAM for sculpting the wax instead of buying from a mass manufacturer).

Besides which, I am not sure the world is ready for multi-million headed hydras.


P.S. The formatting problem for the normal contest example is mostly that you used the minimum number of Bold etc tags, rather than one for each line (or sometimes more) that you have to use to get the formatting actually right when creating a creature... I have a fixed blank creature on each of my hard disks, I suspect any of the regulars could slog through (or write from scratch) it if I had to... just might turn off first-timers.

Bisected8
2010-07-22, 05:54 PM
Having to do resits over the summer hampered my ability to sort out an entry. It would probably have been far too complicated to use in the end (basically the idea was a liche would kidnap some poor level 20+ PC and mutate them with a curse or artifact of some sort into a NE monster with variable effects based on their abilities, alignment, etc in order to use them as a champion in a sort of gladatorial arena against the champions of a devil and a demon).

I'm not joking about the complicated part. I was going to have to draw a frikken' flow diagram to work out the various permutatons.

Debihuman
2010-07-22, 06:47 PM
Bisected -- I could KISS you for not posting a complicated epic template. I quit on epic as of now. It's just way too much work.

Debby

Peregrine
2010-07-23, 12:40 PM
I quit on epic as of now.

Me too.

...

...

Except for one more thing. The terror of all 20-level commoners.

Adamantine Kitty
Size/Type: Tiny Construct
Hit Dice: 25d10 (137 hp)
Initiative: +13
Speed: 60 ft. (12 squares)
Armor Class: 47 (+2 size, +5 Dex, +30 natural), touch 17, flat-footed 42
Base Attack/Grapple: +18/+15
Attack: Claw +25 melee (1d4+5)
Full Attack: 2 claws +25 melee (1d4+5) and bite +25 melee (1d8+2/19-20)
Space/Reach: 2½ ft./0 ft.
Special Attacks: Breath weapon
Special Qualities: Alternate form, concealed nature, construct traits, darkvision 60 ft., immunity to magic, low-light vision, scent
Saves: Fort +8, Ref +13, Will +9
Abilities: Str 21, Dex 21, Con --, Int 8, Wis 12, Cha 11
Skills: Balance +11, Climb +7, Hide +18, Jump +11, Listen +4, Move Silently +12, Spot +4
Feats: Improved Critical (bite), Improved Initiative, Improved Multiattack, Improved Natural Attack (bite), Multiattack, Run, Stealthy
Epic Feats: Dire Charge, Epic Speed, Superior Initiative
Environment: Your house
Organisation: Solitary, household (1 adamantine kitty and 1d6 human slaves) or cabal (2-3 adamantine kitties and 2d6+1 human slaves)
Challenge Rating: 20

Breath weapon (Su): An adamantine kitty has two breath weapons, a 15-ft. cone of exhaustion (Fort DC 22 to reduce condition to fatigued) and a 30-ft. line of adamantine shards (10d8 damage, Ref DC 22 for half damage, Fort DC 22 or blinded permanently).

Debihuman
2010-07-25, 12:32 AM
Your adamantine cat has one epic feat too many.

Organization should be like that of a normal cat. A group of cats is called a "clowder."

What alternate form does the cat take?

Debby

Peregrine
2010-07-25, 06:04 AM
Your adamantine cat has one epic feat too many.

*blink* Oops. How did that happen?


Organization should be like that of a normal cat.

Isn't it? :smallwink:


What alternate form does the cat take?

A bipedal figure (like all adamantine beasts), of Tiny size.

Hyooz
2010-07-25, 10:31 AM
A group of cats is called a "clowder."

Debby

Huh. You learn something everyday.

NakedCelt
2010-08-05, 09:04 PM
So, is there going to be a contest for August?

Bhu
2010-08-05, 09:08 PM
Indeed. I may have free time finally.

Hyooz
2010-08-05, 09:11 PM
Oh, wow, voting ended. I missed that entirely.

Glad I got to flex my prose muscle.

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-08-05, 10:11 PM
Yes, been trying to post it for days. Storms are whacking out my net. Is posted now.

Bhu
2010-08-05, 10:19 PM
Booo storms!

Ooh mirrors...I can have fun with this...

DracoDei
2010-08-05, 11:29 PM
Having been watching a Let's Play of Legend of Zelda: Wind Waker, I just may enter a creature that feeds on defuse sunlight (IE standing in the same room as has a spot of sunlight in it), but which is harmed by more focused sunlight (such as someone standing in that patch of sun and reflecting the light onto it with a mirror).

TheLogman
2010-08-06, 09:05 PM
Huh, 2 weeks off of college, an open contest. Might enter again.

TheAmishPirate
2010-08-06, 11:23 PM
I'm thinking of making a Dragon native to the Mirror Plane. Is it okay to base it off of the True Dragon statistics, or do you want more differentiation?

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-08-06, 11:39 PM
I'm thinking of making a Dragon native to the Mirror Plane. Is it okay to base it off of the True Dragon statistics, or do you want more differentiation?
However you want to do it is fine. Draconimicon has true dragons from each plane, though none from the Plane of Mirrors, so please feel free.

Demons_eye
2010-08-07, 01:23 AM
With a theme of Through the Looking Glass I am really tempted to enter a Alice in wonderland themed monster.

BladeofOblivion
2010-08-07, 04:01 AM
I'm thinking of making a Dragon native to the Mirror Plane. Is it okay to base it off of the True Dragon statistics, or do you want more differentiation?


With a theme of Through the Looking Glass I am really tempted to enter a Alice in wonderland themed monster.

Twas' Brillig in the slithy toves
Did gyre and gimble in the wabe...

The Jabberwock!!

Debihuman
2010-08-07, 07:49 AM
VT, do you still want me to Edit and Critique each entry? I don't mind doing so but you should state it in the contest that this will be done as per your request.

Debby

DracoDei
2010-08-07, 11:58 AM
Is my idea about a creature vulnerable to having light reflected onto it a good one or not?

Glimbur
2010-08-07, 05:01 PM
Is my idea about a creature vulnerable to having light reflected onto it a good one or not?

I'm curious to see how you make the crunch work. Were I to fight such a thing, I would just cast light spells rather than go to the trouble of reflecting light.

TheLogman
2010-08-07, 09:40 PM
Here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9099844&postcount=4) it is.

I'm not quite sure about the CR, calculator puts it at just barely 4 CR, but at least one of his special abilities are more specific versions of the Anamorphic Arrows, and a few others aren't very useful to a monster.

As for LA, I had it at one, but I realized that a lot of the abilities are fairly powerful, so I put it up at two.

Owrtho
2010-08-08, 04:36 AM
Man this is a fun idea for a monster. I plan to make a creature that is the remains of a person who never existed. Sometimes when a person is retroactively unmade, their reflection somehow is overlooked. In these cases the reflections, lacking anything to follow, take on a life of their own. Being fairly annoyed at not having a body, they try to steel those of other reflections, which if successful, makes that reflection into a lesser version. When the being with the replaced reflection dies, the true ones end up stuck again, causing their to be a slowly increasing number of them. The easiest way to stop one is to cover up the mirrors nearby as they can interact with anything that isn't reflected (complete darkness would also work). Not quite sure what the effects of having your reflection replaced would be yet though...

Owrtho

DracoDei
2010-08-08, 09:31 AM
I'm curious to see how you make the crunch work. Were I to fight such a thing, I would just cast light spells rather than go to the trouble of reflecting light.

Same reasons those spells don't have the same effect on a vampire as sunlight.

Owrtho
2010-08-08, 02:44 PM
Same reasons those spells don't have the same effect on a vampire as sunlight.

That makes sense, but would reflected light from a spell work? Or does it need to be natural in origin?

Owrtho

DracoDei
2010-08-08, 03:00 PM
That makes sense, but would reflected light from a spell work? Or does it need to be natural in origin?

Owrtho
Sunlight, reflected or not as long as it is concentrated. The twist is that they require long periods of exposure to DEFUSE sunlight.

In case it helps:

Despite its name, this spell is not the equivalent of daylight for the purposes of creatures that are damaged or destroyed by bright light.
And mere Light would be even less than that of course and the exact wording of Searing Light (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/searingLight.htm) makes it not particularly effective (but I may need to state this in the description for clarity).

Sunbeam (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/sunbeam.htm) and Sunburst (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/sunburst.htm) would do the trick... which means I need to keep its CR down low enough that that would be the highest level spell the cleric or Sorcerer/Wizard could cast, thus making it a significant expenditure of party resources and/or unlikely to be prepared. Since that works out to 14th level, I don't think that will be an onerous constraint, although I probably want to go lower than that so to keep the band in which such creatures can be used (especially in larger numbers) wider.

Debihuman
2010-08-10, 09:34 AM
Creatures that are native to the Plane of Mirrors should have the Extraplanar subtype and Plane of Mirrors should be listed as the Environment.

The Girl in the Mirror should have Extraplanar listed as her subtype and Plane of Mirrors as her environment.

Her hit points are wrong. 5X8 +10 = (5 x 4.5 = 22.5 ) +10 = 32.5 and you always round down so her total hit points are 32, not 35.

Her AC should be noted as follows--
Armor Class: 12 (+2 Dex), Touch 12, Flat-footed 10

A Special Ability is either extraordinary, spell-like, or supernatural in nature. You should designate them.

Poke would be Extraordinary and it should probably do non-lethal damage. It should probably not be "very deadly" as mentioned in the text, just very annoying. Doing one point of damage is hardly deadly.

Unseen is probably Spell-like in nature. It is the Prime Material Plane not martial plane where she exists.

Chill is probably Supernatural in nature. It is a drop in temperature (although "With a drop in temptress" was amusing).

Laugh seems to be Supernatural . If so, it should have a DC 15 to avoid the effect. (10 +1/2 creature's HD + Cha modifier) 10 +2 +3 = 15. How long does the fear effect last? I'd recommend that it be 5 rounds. I'd also recommend that she be able to do this 3/day rather than every 5 minutes. 5 minutes is too long to be useful in combat.

Balloon pop is similar to a death throes effect and should probably be Supernatural in nature.

As a reminder: See the Knowledge Skill for explanation of lore checks. 10 + Creature's HD for a starting base and increase by 10.

For online help this site is fantastic: http://www.d20srd.org/index.htm

If you use material that is NOT open content you should cite to it. Darkstalker feat is not open content and can be found in Lords of Madness.

Debby

DracoDei
2010-08-13, 01:45 AM
Yeah... my life just got REALLY nuts for the next week... almost no chance of an entry now...

Debihuman
2010-08-13, 11:15 AM
VT, I"m not sure the newbies are aware that I am reviewing the entries. Perhaps I should put this on hold until I get some feedback as to whether this is wanted or not.

Debby

TheAmishPirate
2010-08-13, 05:43 PM
@Debihuman: Once I get my entry up, I certainly wouldn't mind the help.

In any case, my summer job just ended, so I should be able to finish up my entry soon.

nanobot_swarm
2010-08-14, 12:03 AM
I'd like a fair critique as well for my entry, you do pretty good evaluations, and I probably messed up the stats again.

Debihuman
2010-08-14, 08:51 AM
Okay, I'll review the entries as I can. Ack. I was editing this post and lost it.

Chiralite

Con modifier is applied to every HD for hit points. It has a Con of 17 so it gets 3 bonus hit points for each HD for a total of +9.

Hit Dice: 3d8+9 (22 hp)

Attack lines are wrong. You forgot size modifier. Only magical bonuses should be the number before the weapon. I assume the numbers are for the ranged and melee attacks. Bows have a Str penalty but not a Str bonus, except composite bows. You also forgot the Size modifier for attacks.

Attack: Small Longbow +7 ranged (1d6-1) or Small Shortsword +3 melee (1d4-1)

The racial bonus to Hide isn't mentioned in any of the Special Abilities and that's where it should be noted.

Debby

Demons_eye
2010-08-14, 09:58 AM
Creatures that are native to the Plane of Mirrors should have the Extraplanar subtype and Plane of Mirrors should be listed as the Environment.

Rules say is just has to have a special link to mirrors. Not native to Plane of Mirrors so not Extraplanar. Nor is it their environment.



The Girl in the Mirror should have Extraplanar listed as her subtype and Plane of Mirrors as her environment.

See above.



Her hit points are wrong. 5X8 +10 = (5 x 4.5 = 22.5 ) +10 = 32.5 and you always round down so her total hit points are 32, not 35.

I gave her max at first beacuse thats how PC's do it. Fixin'



Her AC should be noted as follows--
Armor Class: 12 (+2 Dex), Touch 12, Flat-footed 10

Cool



A Special Ability is either extraordinary, spell-like, or supernatural in nature. You should designate them.

Wasn't done yet so I was getting to it.



Poke would be Extraordinary and it should probably do non-lethal damage. It should probably not be "very deadly" as mentioned in the text, just very annoying. Doing one point of damage is hardly deadly.

If you were a commoner with only 10 HP and can be killed with 20 pokes its deadly.



Unseen is probably Spell-like in nature. It is the Prime Material Plane not martial plane where she exists.

Fixin'



Chill is probably Supernatural in nature. It is a drop in temperature (although "With a drop in temptress" was amusing).

Hating auto checker right about know.



Laugh seems to be Supernatural . If so, it should have a DC 15 to avoid the effect. (10 +1/2 creature's HD + Cha modifier) 10 +2 +3 = 15. How long does the fear effect last? I'd recommend that it be 5 rounds. I'd also recommend that she be able to do this 3/day rather than every 5 minutes. 5 minutes is too long to be useful in combat.

Need to change the time but every five minutes is so its not combat useful.



Balloon pop is similar to a death throes effect and should probably be Supernatural in nature.

Thats the bases of it.



As a reminder: See the Knowledge Skill for explanation of lore checks. 10 + Creature's HD for a starting base and increase by 10.

I know, I just haven't finished it yet.



For online help this site is fantastic: http://www.d20srd.org/index.htm

I know of the site.



If you use material that is NOT open content you should cite to it. Darkstalker feat is not open content and can be found in Lords of Madness.


Citin'



VT, I"m not sure the newbies are aware that I am reviewing the entries. Perhaps I should put this on hold until I get some feedback as to whether this is wanted or not.

Been running around too much to check up on it.

Debihuman
2010-08-14, 10:12 AM
Rules say is just has to have a special link to mirrors. Not native to Plane of Mirrors so not Extraplanar. Nor is it their environment.

First, any Outsider that isn't Native should have the Extraplanar subtype. What plane is your outsider from? That should be its environment. Sure it can be encountered elsewhere, but unless it is Native to the Prime plane, it has the Extraplanar subtype. I didn't say it HAD to be native to the Plane of Mirrors, but your entry suggested it. I thought it was an oversight. If it is native to the prime material plane, it should have the Native subtype.


If you were a commoner with only 10 HP and can be killed with 20 pokes its deadly.

A cat claw can be deadly too, but it generally isn't. Normally, the text should reflect the stat block. Fix poke to reflect the text or vice versa. That's all I'm saying. If the poke is meant to be either lethal or non-lethal then list them both correctly in the attack lines. That was all I was suggesting.

Debby

TheLogman
2010-08-14, 10:52 AM
Okay, I'll review the entries as I can. Ack. I was editing this post and lost it.

Chiralite

Con modifier is applied to every HD for hit points. It has a Con of 17 so it gets 3 bonus hit points for each HD for a total of +9.

Hit Dice: 3d8+9 (22 hp)

Attack lines are wrong. You forgot size modifier. Only magical bonuses should be the number before the weapon. I assume the numbers are for the ranged and melee attacks. Bows have a Str penalty but not a Str bonus, except composite bows. You also forgot the Size modifier for attacks.

Attack: Small Longbow +7 ranged (1d6-1) or Small Shortsword +3 melee (1d4-1)

The racial bonus to Hide isn't mentioned in any of the Special Abilities and that's where it should be noted.

Debby

Its Con is 13, not 17, hit points are accurate.

I did forget the size modifiers, I just corrected for those.

The Ranged attack is using Anamorphic Arrows, which are noted for dealing an additional point of slashing damage, which is why the damage is 1d6 and not 1d6-1, I will change that to make it more clear.

The Racial Hide bonus is mentioned in the Hide in Plain Sight Special Ability, but I did forget the size bonus on the Hide Check, I will change that to reflect the +4 bonus for small size.

Debihuman
2010-08-14, 10:57 AM
This is for Nanobot Swarm

My corrections are in red. One thing that really unbalances this is that you list CR as 9 for a 4 HD creature. That's not a good thing. It is overpowered in some areas and underpowered in others making this a really unbalanced monster. It can deal a lot of damage but most likely the targets will make the saves because it has such low stats. This means that it's low hit points make it very easy to kill.

If it cannot grapple, you should state it. I can't tell from the entry if you meant it or not. Even oozes can grapple so there really isn't a reason that this creature cannot grapple.

You gave it Hover but forgot Fly speed

Reflector of the Infinite
Medium Outsider Native or Extraplanar depending on its home plane
Hit Dice: 4d8-12 (6 hp)
Initiative: +2
Speed: 60 ft. (12 squares) [missing fly speed and maneuverability]
Armor Class: 11 (+1 Dexterity), 11 touch, 10 flat-footed
Base Attack/Grapple: +4/-2
Attack: -
Full Attack: -
Space/Reach: 5 ft./ 5 ft.
Special Attacks: Mental Overload, Counter-Laser, Counter-Warp
Special Qualities: Darkvision 60 ft. Spell resistance, Silence
Saves: Fort + 4, Ref + 5, Will +4
Abilities Str 6, Dex 15, Con 5, Int 15, Wis 6, Cha 1
Skills: None
Feats: Hover and 1 more feat
Environment: Home plane should be listed here
Organization: Solitary
Challenge Rating: 4
Treasure: None
Alignment: Neutral
Advancement: 5-6 (Medium)
Level Adjustment: -

Mental Overload (Ex): What is the DC of the Will save? It should be based on one of the creature's abilities. If it is Intelligence based, the DC is 14.

Counter-Laser also needs a DC 10 + 1/2 creature's HD + ability modifier. This is probably too powerful for a 4 HD creature. Save versus death isn't a lot of fun for anyone. I'd recommend that it be 10d10 points of damage with a successful save for half damage. This is probably an Extraordinary ability as well.

Counter-Warp is Spell-like in nature based on Plane Shift but the only plane would be the Plane of Mirrors. The creature's low charisma really hurts it here. The save is 10 + the level of the spell the ability resembles or duplicates + the creature’s Cha modifier. 10 +7 -5 = DC 12.

Debby

nanobot_swarm
2010-08-17, 09:45 PM
You say it would be too weak to be a real challange, how should I increase the stats so that it is more of a challange, but not something unfair.
Also the reason it cannot grapple, is that it has no physical means to do so, as the body is a mirror that the creature possesses and reshapes into a monolith form.

Debihuman
2010-08-17, 11:02 PM
You say it would be too weak to be a real challange, how should I increase the stats so that it is more of a challange, but not something unfair.

Also the reason it cannot grapple, is that it has no physical means to do so, as the body is a mirror that the creature possesses and reshapes into a monolith form.

Let's start with your text because a lot of the monster's weakness begin with what it can't or doesn't do.

1. Your Reflector is randomly roaming about the prime material plane but it has no apparent reason to do so. Why would it leave the plane of mirrors? What will happen if a party encounters one? From your text, not much ocurrs. It doesn't have any treasure that the party would want to take from it and it can't give them any information.

2. "The Reflector of Infinity will never attack first, and generally ignores other living creatures. Lacking any real means of attack, it is reliant on its special abilities for survival. It cannot grapple."

If it isn't interested in the party, then it isn't a useful monster to DM. Mostly this is makes for a boring encounter. The party may be curious about the creature but they won't have a reason to attack it. It's a mirror-like monolith. If they annoy it by touching it, it will probably fly away or move away. Thus ends the encounter.

3. You are still missing manuverabilty for the Fly speed. You are also missing the 2nd feat it should have.

4. What spell resistance does it have? It's only got 4 hit dice so giving a high SR isn't appropriate. A 4 hit dice monster shouldn't have abilities of a 9 HD monster and vice versa.

5. Part of good monster design is balancing it's powers with its vulerabilities. It is made of glass -- can it be shattered? Can it be harmed by sonic attacks?

7. Let's look at it's stats: Str 6, Dex 15, Con 5, Int 15, Wis 6, Cha 1

Why bother with an Int of 15 if it cannot speak or understand any language?. For that it should have Int 6 and Wis 15. Int 15 generally gives it 2 bonus languages.

It has a Con of 5 and Str of 6 making this an easy target for physical attacks. The higher the CR, the easier it will be for the party to defeat this. It doesn't get the bonus hit dice of a construct and it doesn't have any defensive abilities.

Mental Overload is nasty -- 3 days in a vegetative state because of a failed Fort save even at DC 14. 3 days? Are you kidding me? That is beyond punishment. Can this be healed by magic means? 3 days wastes a lot of time for a 4 HD monster. I could see someone being Sickenened for 1d4 hours at best.

Counter Warp is confusing. I think that you mean "anyone in a 45-foot radius must make a Will Save (DC 12) or be teleported to the plane of mirrors." Saves are always ability bases so you should indicate which ability is the one used. Most will make the save but in case they don't, you are leaving some of the party stranded. At 4th level, most PCs don't have means of planar transport. This is an ability that should be left to creatures with higher CR ratings.

Debby

Bhu
2010-08-19, 12:22 AM
Dammit. The new job is working me 7 days a week and i cant catch a break. Ill have to wait till next month

Owrtho
2010-08-19, 12:41 AM
Well, haven't dome much in the way of stats or abilities, but I got up the basic fluff of my entry. My biggest issue though is that I can't think of much by way of negative effects to grant it. Outside stealing control of the character that is. Also not quite sure about what CR would be.

Owrtho

TheAmishPirate
2010-08-20, 12:25 AM
Alright, the Mirror Dragon is up. Better name likely pending.

PEACH at will, and do not be concerned with hurting my feelings. This is honestly my first serious homebrew and I'd like any feedback. If there's any bit that need clarification, just ask. I wrote this when I found out the contest ends this week and not next week, so I fully expect that not everything made it from my head to the post.

TheLogman
2010-08-20, 12:36 AM
Alright, the Mirror Dragon is up. Better name likely pending.

PEACH at will, and do not be concerned with hurting my feelings. This is honestly my first serious homebrew and I'd like any feedback. If there's any bit that need clarification, just ask. I wrote this when I found out the contest ends this week and not next week, so I fully expect that not everything made it from my head to the post.

Seems like it should be LN, but that's just me. Something about their obsession with knowledge, always honoring deals, and having something of a code suggested Law to me.

What are the rules on Legend Lore? It doesn't appear anywhere else in the stat block, how often can he cast it?

Why are the Mirror Dragons so against teaching others anything? It seems like they would be more likely to reflect what they have learned, like a mirror than jealously guard what they know.

What was your motivation behind giving them the Trickery Domain? Did you just want them to have more ways of hiding and such?

Where are their feats? I would imagine that Mirror Dragons would take different feats than other dragons, given they are less combat oriented. I know that the standard entries for dragons just has a blanket suggestion for feats, but as a DM, it's annoying to have to build my dragon from the ground up, so feat suggestions or even assignments for the various HD's would be helpful if you could provide it.

What kind of constructs do they commonly use? It would help if I was designing an encounter to know what kind of constructs to pick to assist in battle.

(Many of my questions serve the purposes of both helping to flesh out your monster (hopefully!) as well as helping me to understand it better. Understand the feeling of it and such. This is mostly because I like to use things from these contests in my games, and it helps when I have more information.)

TheAmishPirate
2010-08-20, 10:42 AM
Seems like it should be LN, but that's just me. Something about their obsession with knowledge, always honoring deals, and having something of a code suggested Law to me.

I gave them neutral on the law-chaos alignment because they would be willing to take more chaotic means of obtaining new books and such. I'll give it some more thought, you make a strong case for LN.


What are the rules on Legend Lore? It doesn't appear anywhere else in the stat block, how often can he cast it?

That was an error. It's supposed to be Greater Arcane Sight.


Why are the Mirror Dragons so against teaching others anything? It seems like they would be more likely to reflect what they have learned, like a mirror than jealously guard what they know.

What was your motivation behind giving them the Trickery Domain? Did you just want them to have more ways of hiding and such?

For the first question, they treat their knowledge as if it was their treasure horde. That's the in-universe reason for not sharing.

Design-wise, I had three properties of mirrors that I wanted to incorporate:

1) Mirrors instantly reflect anything given to them. This was made into the Mirror Dragon's photographic memory.

2) Smoke and Mirrors (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smoke_and_mirrors). This came through with the breath weapon and Trickery Domain.

3) Mirrors reflect what is given to them. This explains both the deal-making and the information hoarding. A mirror only reflects when it is given something to reflect. In a similar way, Mirror Dragons only give information when given information. It's a bit of a stretch, but that's how I thought of it.


Where are their feats? I would imagine that Mirror Dragons would take different feats than other dragons, given they are less combat oriented. I know that the standard entries for dragons just has a blanket suggestion for feats, but as a DM, it's annoying to have to build my dragon from the ground up, so feat suggestions or even assignments for the various HD's would be helpful if you could provide it.

I'll put those up later today. Good catch.


What kind of constructs do they commonly use? It would help if I was designing an encounter to know what kind of constructs to pick to assist in battle.

I'm still a little new to D&D, so I don't know constructs too well. That being said, after looking through the SRD, it looks like they would use basic golems, or anything with a decent amount of Dexterity that was Medium sized. They use these constructs for things like holding books for them (books aren't often made for dragon-size), tending to their lairs while they're out, and general housekeeping. They're made for utility, not combat.

Thanks for the feedback!

Schylerwalker
2010-08-20, 12:24 PM
Ahh, feels good to stretch the homebrew muscles again. Been awhile since I've made a post on the Homebrew Forums, this contest in particular. Feel free to PEACH away! And, I must say, it looks like we have some interesting monsters for the competition so far.

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-08-20, 12:26 PM
Hey Debi, next contest I'll make mention that we reserve the right to critique. Been so busy barely had time to read anything here yet.

Bisected8
2010-08-20, 03:02 PM
Hmm, it's been a while. Does it end on the 21st or at the end of the 21st (i.e. midnight tonight or tommorow night)?

The Dark Fiddler
2010-08-22, 08:25 PM
Question about Girl in the Mirror: I thought entries based off of things from an existing series weren't allowed, such as when whoever it was tried making Kirby and Hyooz almost got disqualified for Slender Man? Or am I missing something/mistaken? :smallconfused:

Edit: Or is Girl in the Mirror far enough divorced from the concept as presented in Doctor Who to not be breaking the rule?

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-08-22, 08:26 PM
Question about Girl in the Mirror: I thought entries based off of things from an existing series weren't allowed, such as when whoever it was tried making Kirby and Hyooz almost got disqualified for Slender Man? Or was I mistaken? :smallconfused:
Where do you find Girl In the Mirror?

Edit: Hmm, I've never watched Dr. Who. I've no clue.

The Dark Fiddler
2010-08-22, 09:01 PM
Actually, I'd like to retract my question. Seems I was mixing up recognizing the picture and recognizing the creature.

Sorry, Demons_eye and VT.

nanobot_swarm
2010-08-23, 08:47 AM
Where do you find Girl In the Mirror?

Edit: Hmm, I've never watched Dr. Who. I've no clue.

It was in the two parter about The Family of Blood, which were creatures that wanted to live forever, and the Doctor would not allow it. The Doctor eventually grants their wish, but as a punishment, the girl was the daughter of the family, and he trapped her in a mirror, every mirror.

Schylerwalker
2010-09-01, 02:18 AM
Woohoo, I won!! My first victory, and it seems I had a pretty solid lead, too! I wonder what I'm going to do for the next contest...aside from dance happily...

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-09-01, 02:38 PM
Well, just posted new competition, so guess you get to figure it out now. These competitions seem to be lacking in participation of late, so please show your support with a banner in your sig! Can find them on the first page of the contest.

Stycotl
2010-09-01, 06:58 PM
Well, just posted new competition, so guess you get to figure it out now. These competitions seem to be lacking in participation of late, so please show your support with a banner in your sig! Can find them on the first page of the contest.

i'll rock the banner!

i might even finish a creature in time for this contest (i have three unfinished creatures that never made it in time for some of the previous contests...).

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-09-02, 12:51 PM
Oh, Debi, went and added the critiquing comment :smallwink:


i'll rock the banner!

i might even finish a creature in time for this contest (i have three unfinished creatures that never made it in time for some of the previous contests...).
Good deal http://www.giantitp.com/forums/images/icons/icon14.gif

unosarta
2010-09-02, 05:41 PM
The Xsoaetsziq has been posted. Sorry for the long and almost incomprehensible name. It is basically pronounced (Ksuaet-szich). Any critiquing would be greatly appreciated.

Also, the reason, if anyone should ask, for them not being lawful is that, they don't follow rules necessarily; they are considered just one mind. They do not necessarily follow the orders of their Queen, but think of her thoughts as their own. As they become more powerful, they start to take on their own thoughts (only slightly, but a lot more than the Workers, or the Water-Bearers).

And the Xsoaetsziq is for the GiantITP Worldbuilding Project (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=138726), as a possible race (or at least, possible fluff. The fluff for the insectoids hasn't really been nailed down yet, but they seemed to fit the contest).

Also, I understand if the CR's are off, I am not that great at calculating CR. :smallsmile:

[Edit]: Also; any ideas for feats for the Queen?

Debihuman
2010-09-04, 03:55 PM
I'll attempt to critique the xsoaetsziq. First, any monster whose name is difficult to pronounce gets demerits from me. This is a contest so everything and anything that you can do to make sure your creation shines is a benefit.

I applaud your effort in making several kinds of xsoaetsziqs but this makes it harder to judge.

Attacks are melee, ranged or touch. I assume that the claws are melee attacks but you should state that in every entry.

Now let's get to the meat of this thing starting with the workers. These have no intelligence. Do they have hivemind? Normally, creatures with no intelligence have no skills and no feats.

The workers are blind but have darkvision? This makes no sense. Darkvision isn't Blindsense or Blindsight. You can see if you have darkvision.



Darkvision is the extraordinary ability to see with no light source at all, out to a range specified for the creature. Darkvision is black and white only (colors cannot be discerned). It does not allow characters to see anything that they could not see otherwise—invisible objects are still invisible, and illusions are still visible as what they seem to be. Likewise, darkvision subjects a creature to gaze attacks normally. The presence of light does not spoil darkvision.

Blindsight And Blindsense

Some creatures have blindsight, the extraordinary ability to use a nonvisual sense (or a combination of such senses) to operate effectively without vision. Such sense may include sensitivity to vibrations, acute scent, keen hearing, or echolocation. This ability makes invisibility and concealment (even magical darkness) irrelevant to the creature (though it still can’t see ethereal creatures and must have line of effect to a creature or object to discern that creature or object). This ability operates out to a range specified in the creature description.

The creature usually does not need to make Spot or Listen checks to notice creatures within range of its blindsight ability. Unless noted otherwise, blindsight is continuous, and the creature need do nothing to use it. Some forms of blindsight, however, must be triggered as a free action. If so, this is noted in the creature’s description. If a creature must trigger its blindsight ability, the creature gains the benefits of blindsight only during its turn.

* Blindsight never allows a creature to distinguish color or visual contrast. A creature cannot read with blindsight.
* Blindsight does not subject a creature to gaze attacks (even though darkvision does).
* Blinding attacks do not penalize creatures using blindsight.
* Deafening attacks thwart blindsight if it relies on hearing.
* Blindsight works underwater but not in a vacuum.
* Blindsight negates displacement and blur effects.

Blindsense

Other creatures have blindsense, a lesser ability that lets the creature notice things it cannot see, but without the precision of blindsight. The creature with blindsense usually does not need to make Spot or Listen checks to notice and locate creatures within range of its blindsense ability, provided that it has line of effect to that creature. Any opponent the creature cannot see has total concealment (50% miss chance) against the creature with blindsense, and the blindsensing creature still has the normal miss chance when attacking foes that have concealment. Visibility still affects the movement of a creature with blindsense. A creature with blindsense is still denied its Dexterity bonus to Armor Class against attacks from creatures it cannot see.


Why do you have secondary listed next to the claw attacks? These are their primary and only weapon. Creatures don't use BAB to determine how many natural attacks they get. That is based on how many appendages they can use.

Next the Sighted. I recommend that these have an Int of 1 or 2 as they are a bit more self-directed and follow commands. This will change their skills [they would have 8 skill points to use and don't forget to add the racial bonuses].

You say they can spring for 40 miles an hour. I recommend that they get the Run feat instead of Improved Initiative so they don't lose their Dex bonus while running. You say that they can use their sprint ability once every 4d4 rounds but neglected to say how long they can sprint. This contradicts the text since you say they can run for long periods of time.

Clawed should probably have a Int score since they use group tactics. Int of 7 should suffice. These definitely should have blindsight.

Fanged are too fast to be "slow and lumbering." I recommend that you give them a land speed of 20 ft. for that. From the name, I was expecting a bite attack.

Water bearers don't have any link to water. Why are these described as "scuttling" with a speed of 10 ft.? To scuttle is to "to run with quick, hasty steps; scurry." I think they should have a speed of 30. These are actually the weakest of all and should probably have a CR of 1/2.

Queen. Speed is 0 ft. (immobile) not --. At 15 HD, she should have 6 feats. Creatures also generally gain a Size when they double in HD. Advancement should be 16-30 Gargantuan, 31-45 Colossal.

Should the Lore be based on the queen's HD?

Debby

unosarta
2010-09-04, 04:16 PM
Thanks so much for critiquing! I really appreciate it.


I'll attempt to critique the xsoaetsziq. First, any monster whose name is difficult to pronounce gets demerits from me. This is a contest so everything and anything that you can do to make sure your creation shines is a benefit.
Actually, Xsoaetsziq is what they call themselves. They are literally unable to pronounce a Human, Gnome or Sharlaq word that would be made for them. I guess I could mention another word that would be used by others who refer to them, but the name actually has to do with their language.


I applaud your effort in making several kinds of xsoaetsziqs but this makes it harder to judge. I'm restating them along. Also, Attacks are melee, ranged or touch. I assume that the claws are melee attacks but you should state that in every entry.
I'm sorry? I didn't think that just one write up, would be enough to show exactly how different the castes are. OK, I will label the Claw attacks as Melee.


Now let's get to the meat of this thing starting with the workers. These have no intelligence. Do they have hivemind? Normally, creatures with no intelligence have no skills and no feats.
OK. Yeah, I meant to add in a Hivemind clause. Is there a pre-existing precedent for Hiveminds? I am fairly sure swarms have it, but I cannot remember. I guess I will check.


The workers are blind but have darkvision? This makes no sense. Darkvision isn't Blindsense or Blindsight. You can see if you have darkvision.
The thing is, all aberrations get Darkvision, for some reason. I can change it to Blindsense, which is what I meant, but then I assumed that people would assume that the Xsoaetsziq had Darkvision anyway.


Why do you have secondary listed next to the claw attacks? These are their primary and only weapon. Creatures don't use BAB to determine how many natural attacks they get. That is based on how many appendages they can use.
I do? Shoot, that was a mistake.


Next the Sighted. I recommend that these have an Int of 1 or 2 as they are a bit more self-directed and follow commands. This will change their skills [they would have 8 skill points to use and don't forget to add the racial bonuses].
OK, I guess. But, then they no longer have the Hivemind, really. It is less independent thought, and more an actual personality, I guess. Oh, I left the racial bonuses out. I guess I can add them to the skills.


You say they can sprint for 40 miles an hour. I recommend that they get the Run feat instead of Improved Initiative so they don't lose their Dex bonus while running. You say that they can use their sprint ability once every 4d4 rounds but neglected to say how long they can sprint. This contradicts the text since you say they can run for long periods of time.
OK. I think I meant to have it be for 2 rounds.
Also, being able to sprint up to forty miles per hour, and being able to run for long periods of time are not the same. "Run" here, is pertaining to the fact that they can move quickly for long periods of time, and they can. Do you think I should make the "cooldown" shorter?


Clawed should probably have a Int score since they use group tactics. Int of 7 should suffice. These definitely should have blindsight.
OK, I guess. Again, I was talking more about personality, rather than independent thought, and I am fairly sure that you can have mindless creatures that are part of one whole mind, and still able to utilize group tactics. In fact, it stands to reason that they would be even better at it. I suppose I could change it.


Fanged are too fast to be "slow and lumbering." I recommend that you give them a land speed of 20 ft. for that. From the name, I was expecting a bite attack.
OK. Fanged was more just a title, but I guess I could add a bite.


Water bearers don't have any link to water. Why are these described as "scuttling" with a speed of 10 ft.? To scuttle is to "to run with quick, hasty steps; scurry." I think they should have a speed of 30. These are actually the weakest of all and should probably have a CR of 1/2.
The act of bearing water for another has nurturing implications, which is the main deal of the Water-Bearers. Again, not really that important, and it is really just a sort of title. Also, they take full penalties from being blind, so they actually have a base speed of 30, but it is halved, because they do not have enough experience using their bodies in the dark, usually spending most of their time procreating with the Queen, and watching her children.

The CR change seems reasonable.


Queen. Speed is 0 ft. (immobile) not --. At 15 HD, she should have 6 feats.
OK. If you had seen my above post, you would see that I in fact was looking for suggestions for feats for her, since I had no idea. :smallwink:


Should the Lore be based on the queen's HD?

Debby
Yes. She is the head mind, after all. I thought it seemed fair. Plus, the only ones who actually spend any time outside of the Hive are the Sighted and the Fanged, who both avoid dangers, which include any human populaces, which means that information about them would be incredibly hard to find.

Thanks for the critique! :smallsmile:

[Edit]: Actually, after reading my wording of the Sighted sprint ability, I do not see the need to have a duration. Honestly, they spend 1 fullround action, and travel at 8*their base land speed. What requires a duration about that?

[Edit2]: All changes have been made, but I realized that none of them can really have intelligence, or else the fluff is contradicted. If they had intelligence, then the ancient races would have been unable to control all of the Xsoaetsziq by controlling their Queen, which is a fairly big part of their fluff. So, unless I can come up with a way around that that actually makes any sense at all, they remain mindless. :smallfrown:

Debihuman
2010-09-04, 10:29 PM
Thanks so much for critiquing! I really appreciate it.
You're welcome :smallbiggrin:



Actually, Xsoaetsziq is what they call themselves. They are literally unable to pronounce a Human, Gnome or Sharlaq word that would be made for them. I guess I could mention another word that would be used by others who refer to them, but the name actually has to do with their language.

BINGO! How are the PCs going to refer to them? Better yet, what are your players going to call them? Players have inventive ways of corrupting hard to pronounce names. With that spelling, (Ksuaet-szich isn't an improvement) "Suet-Sick" is the probably the closest approximation that I can figure out. I shouldn't need a pronunciation guide to use this creature.

What is Sharlaq? How do xsoaetsziqs communicate with other races in the Underdark? The PCs may still not be able to communicate with these creatures, but overly limiting them to a language that doesn't exist in most campaigns gives the impression that these aren't just homebrew but perhaps they should only be used in your personal campaign.

Part of good monster creation is creating a monster that is easy to fit into a standard campaign. In the Underdark, Undercommon is the most common language. Even if your creature can't speak Undercommon, being able to understand it (even if they have only a rudimentary understanding due to their lack of intelligence) gives them a broader base.


I'm sorry? I didn't think that just one write up, would be enough to show exactly how different the castes are. OK, I will label the Claw attacks as Melee. 1. No need to apologize. It just made the critique a bit longer. 2. The statblock should be complete.


OK. Yeah, I meant to add in a Hivemind clause. Is there a pre-existing precedent for Hiveminds? I am fairly sure swarms have it, but I cannot remember. I guess I will check.

Hive mind [two words] can be found in the formorian entry as follows:


Hive Mind (Ex): All formians within 50 miles of their queen are in constant communication. If one is aware of a particular danger, they all are. If one in a group is not flat-footed, none of them are. No formian in a group is considered flanked unless all of them are. I see you've already incorporated some of it.


The thing is, all aberrations get Darkvision, for some reason. I can change it to Blindsense, which is what I meant, but then I assumed that people would assume that the Xsoaetsziq had Darkvision anyway.

Darkvision is a standard trait for aberrations. However, your creature would be an exception to this rule. Part of knowing the rules is also knowing when to make the exception. Since many of your creatures are blind, this would negate the darkvision. You mention that they are blind and could simply add that they do not have darkvision. You'd be substituting either blindsense or blindsight for the darkvision. All you need to do is mention it in the monster's entry.

The cheetah has a Sprint ability and your creature should use a similar mechanic.
Sprint (Ex): Once per hour, a cheetah can move ten times its normal speed (500 feet) when it makes a charge.

It isn't stated but a cheetah can't run like that for a full hour. Obviously the rest of the mechanic is missing. Also, 40 mph is approximately 175 ft.

More to come later.

Debby

unosarta
2010-09-04, 10:55 PM
You're welcome :smallbiggrin:
:smallsmile:


BINGO! How are the PCs going to refer to them? Better yet, what are your players going to call them? Players have inventive ways of corrupting hard to pronounce names. With that spelling, (Ksuaet-szich isn't an improvement) "Suet-Sick" is the probably the closest approximation that I can figure out. I shouldn't need a pronunciation guide to use this creature.
Right now, I have the Blind Ones, which is likely what the other denizens of the Underdark would call them, in a standard D&D campaign.


What is Sharlaq? How do xsoaetsziqs communicate with other races in the Underdark? The PCs may still not be able to communicate with these creatures, but overly limiting them to a language that doesn't exist in most campaigns gives the impression that these aren't just homebrew but perhaps they should only be used in your personal campaign.
Um, sorry, that was setting specific. But it honestly doesn't affect the Xsoaetsziq all that much, as far as I can tell. Oh, no, I was just using that as an example since I already worked a lot on the linguistics of Xsoaetsziq. The thing is, they can't really pronounce any other language. Most often, a creature who wishes to talk to the Hive would probably talk to the Queen, who can do so while they are outside of the birthing chamber. Maybe make the Clawed fluent in Undercommon? Also, as a note- very, very few Xsoaetsziq actually are able to speak their language. Technically they all can, having received the knowledge from their Queen, but I don't think that the Water-Bearers would even have the physical capabilities for speaking, only using their tiny mouths during the Gorge, and workers would rarely have use for it, unless they expand into another creatures domain. Hm. Maybe have the Workers fluent as well?


Part of good monster creation is creating a monster that is easy to fit into a standard campaign. In the Underdark, Undercommon is the most common language. Even if your creature can't speak Undercommon, being able to understand it (even if they have only a rudimentary understanding due to their lack of intelligence) gives them a broader base.
OK. How does one note partial understanding of a language? Especially since languages are not a part of the monster stat block that is used. Simply denote understanding in the description?

Now that I think about it, it doesn't make sense for any of them to not understand, sharing a mind and all, if only one person was to understand. Like, if the Clawed were to understand, because they share a mind, they transfer that knowledge along to the Queen, the Workers, the Sighted, the Fanged and the Water-Bearers. They may not necessarily be able to speak it as well, but they would certainly be able to understand.


1. No need to apologize. It just made the critique a bit longer. 2. The statblock should be complete.
OK. You just sounded a little frustrated by the fact. Are you saying this as in, it should be complete now, or as in it is not complete yet? It is a strangely worded sentence. :smallwink:



Hive mind [two words] can be found in the formorian entry as follows:

I see you've already incorporated some of it.
Yes, and it seemed rather ridiculous that the Formian (and I am fairly sure it's Formian, not Formorian, who are giants from Ireland, and particularly evil in D&D) don't have a definition for "group," when I cannot find it anywhere else.


Darkvision is a standard trait for aberrations. However, your creature would be an exception to this rule. Part of knowing the rules is also knowing when to make the exception. Since many of your creatures are blind, this would negate the darkvision. You mention that they are blind and could simply add that they do not have darkvision. You'd be substituting either blindsense or blindsight for the darkvision. All you need to do is mention it in the monster's entry.
OK, will do. I already got rid of all of the mentions of Darkvision in the individual monster blocks.


The cheetah has a Sprint ability and your creature should use a similar mechanic.

It isn't stated but a cheetah can't run like that for a full hour. Obviously the rest of the mechanic is missing. Also, 40 mph is approximately 175 ft.
I was just saying that having an ability that requires you to use a full round action as an activation, to move at your base speed times eight, for a certain duration, seemed a little bit bad to me. What would you suggest being better? :smallsmile:


More to come later.

Debby
Thanks! I really appreciate the critique!

[Edit]: Updated according to your suggestions.

Debihuman
2010-09-05, 02:50 PM
Hive Mind was in the Formian entry, not Formorian -- the extra "o" was a typo.

I like the way you re-worded the Sprint ability of the Sighted.

Also, the Clawed are Large creatures. They have a size modifier of -1 that should be applied to their Attack and to their Armor Class. They have a +4 to grapple because of their size as well.

The Queen is Huge so the size penalty to Attack and AC is -2; she has a +8 size bonus to grapple as well.

Debby

unosarta
2010-09-05, 02:56 PM
Hive Mind was in the Formian entry, not Formorian -- the extra "o" was a typo.
OK, that is what I thought.


I like the way you re-worded the Sprint ability of the Sighted.
Thanks!


Also, the Clawed are Large creatures. They have a size modifier of -1 that should be applied to their Attack and to their Armor Class. They have a +4 to grapple because of their size as well.
Shoot, I forgot about that. Thanks!


The Queen is Huge so the size penalty to Attack and AC is -2; she has a +8 size bonus to grapple as well.

Debby

OK, I will fix it. Thanks again!

Debihuman
2010-09-06, 10:22 PM
Yay, another monster in the contest! Welcome aboard HalfTangible.

I see a number of statblock issues though. No biggie, we can help fix those. I'll make a separate post for your critter tomorrow.

For anyone who hasn't entered this contest before, I critique ALL the completed entries per Vorpal Tribble's request a way's back. I try to be as fair as possible but I do have a few biases.

First, if you are using a house rule in your creation state it up front so I don't waste my time fixing a "mistake" that is intentional.

Second, if you use a rule that isn't in the SRD, cite the book it is from. Initials are fine. For example: BoVD for Book of Vile Darkness. Adding a page number never hurts either.

The contest format pretty much follows the online SRD (system reference document) which can be found here: http://www.d20srd.org. You can find the open content rules there. The open content rules from other books besides PH, MM and DMG are there too so it's a pretty complete site.

Some rules are fairly obscure so I tend to repeat them periodically for everyone's benefit. Not knowing how to figure out the correct DC on monster Lore is a common problem. It's based on the Knowlege skill.

From the SRD:


In many cases, you can use this skill to identify monsters and their special powers or vulnerabilities. In general, the DC of such a check equals 10 + the monster’s HD. A successful check allows you to remember a bit of useful information about that monster.

For every 5 points by which your check result exceeds the DC, you recall another piece of useful information.

In addition, I don't usually fix spelling or grammar, but I'll point out glaring errors and consistent problems. If you are worried because you are dyslexic or English isn't your first language, don't be. This is a friendly contest. I want every entry to shine. It makes for a better contest all around.

Last of all, I am not perfect. I make mistakes too. so please tell me if I flubbed up something.

Debby

Debihuman
2010-09-06, 11:37 PM
The Vraal has some statblock issues that I'll be addressing.

Hit Dice are 14d10+56 (133 hp) [14 X 5.5 = 77 plus bonus hp (4x14= 56) for a total [77 +56] of 133 hp].

BAB/Grapple: this varies on monster type. Magical beast is the same as fighter. BAB = HD. Grapple is HD + Str modifier + Special size modifier.
BAB is +14. Grapple is +21.

Speed is first listed by feet. Speed is 40 ft.

Attack only should list the creature's primary attack. Damage needs Str modifier. Secondary attacks use 1/2 Str modifier for damage unless there is a special ability or feat that changes this. Claws and bites are melee attacks and that should be noted in the statblock. Primary attacks are listed first in full attack line.

Attack: Claws + 21 melee (2d6+7)
Full Attack: 2 Claws +21 melee (2d6+7) and Bite +16 melee (3d8+3)

Space and Reach are based on creature's size. You note extended reach by tail after standard reach.

Space/Reach: 5 ft./5 ft. (10 ft. with tail)

The special attacks and special qualities are listed by name alphabetically. You note the details separately in a text section. See SRD or 3.5 MM for how this is done.

I don't under stand the special attack. It can only reach 10 feet with its tail. How is it managing a 3 square sweep and is this sweep done with the tail? From the picture, it looks like the creature uses its tail for balance. I'd recommend toning down the damage the tail sweep does.

"Regeneration (4d6)" is sufficient. However, you should probably make this a set number since most monsters are written that way. For example, a troll has Regeneration 5.

A creature that is dazzled by bright light is Light Sensitive. This would be an Extraordinary ability.

Racial bonuses (and penalties) should come from Special abilities or be listed in the text description. If the bonuses/penalties apply to skills they should be listed in the Skills section.

More to come when I'm not so tired. :-)

DracoDei
2010-09-09, 02:51 PM
If I think I might have enough time (which is a big "If"), I think I might actually enter the [Earth] counterparts to my Wing Dragon's [Air]. If Wing Dragons use something vaguely like Fog Cloud for their breathweapon then these guys use something like Wall of Stone. They would fill a cone with stone. If you make your save you just get pushed out of the cone (perhaps taking damage based on distance traveled. If not, you are entombed in solid stone... perhaps skin-tight. So, yes we are talking about a very high starting CR and HD here (and LA = "No").

They can stone-swim of course, and their breathweapon works through rock. No sneak attack though. No flight. but have a burrow speed for if they want to leave a tunnel behind for some reason.

Dexterity 1, but also have a "unstoppable" ability that renders them immune to any decrease of that ability score.

Probably Lawful Neutral to compliment the Wing Dragon's Neutral Good.

LOTRfan
2010-09-10, 07:00 PM
Hey, could some one critique the Atroxasaurus? I'm sure I must've done something wrong, and I'd like an estimate on the CR (the method I use only works for non-epic creatures).

Also, any suggestions would be nice. The more brutal, the better.

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-09-10, 07:34 PM
Hey, could some one critique the Atroxasaurus? I'm sure I must've done something wrong, and I'd like an estimate on the CR (the method I use only works for non-epic creatures).

Also, any suggestions would be nice. The more brutal, the better.
I'll take this one Debi. Expect a message, LOTRfan.

Is this the first creation you've attempted btw? Epic is tough even for the veterans.

LOTRfan
2010-09-10, 07:36 PM
First one for any of these challenges (and for an epic creature of this scale).

Zom B
2010-09-10, 08:33 PM
Well. I'm not so sure anymore that the Kallth have a fighting chance next to the two epic creations - one, literal, the other, in scope - but any review of it would be handy.

EDIT: Having never really ran a campaign where the players had to get to the Underdark from the surface and not owning any of the Underdark-oriented books, just how deep down is it? I took a guess with the Radiosense's depth modifier, but if the Underdark is 400 miles under the surface (+40 bonus!), I need to redo it.

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-09-10, 08:35 PM
First one for any of these challenges (and for an epic creature of this scale).
Ok, critique sent.

Whew, epic creatures give me back aches. I'll get to you as well ZomB if Debi doesn't first.

Edit:


EDIT: Having never really ran a campaign where the players had to get to the Underdark from the surface and not owning any of the Underdark-oriented books, just how deep down is it? I took a guess with the Radiosense's depth modifier, but if the Underdark is 400 miles under the surface (+40 bonus!), I need to redo it.
Oh, I have no idea. I'm just calling anything even under the dirt the underdark.

As one of my examples show, even a cellar qualifies.

unosarta
2010-09-10, 08:42 PM
Well. I'm not so sure anymore that the Kallth have a fighting chance next to the two epic creations - one, literal, the other, in scope - but any review of it would be handy.

Actually, I really like the Kallth. The picture is amazing (where did you find it? I want :smallwink:), and the execution is pretty well done too. The image of one of those things, strange body parts a-glow, and tracking their prey, would be sure to send a shiver or three down a Drow's back.

And putting a large number of them, not even necessarily a pack, into a giant maze, would be incredibly hard on anyone's psyche. Oh no, that corridor ends in a solid wall. And that one too. And look, now you are stuck in a box! And, the Kallth would make probably the best Nuclear weapons tester/sniffer ever. :smalltongue:

Also; Anyone have any more critiques for the Xsoaetsziq?

LOTRfan
2010-09-10, 09:35 PM
Thank's again, Vorpal Tribble.

The Xsoaetsziq is definitely a cool concept. Very interesting.

unosarta
2010-09-10, 09:37 PM
Thank's again, Vorpal Tribble.

The Xsoaetsziq is definitely a cool concept. Very interesting.

Thanks! I was thinking maybe they would be more like the Formian's less civilized cousins, until the World Building-itp gets a D&D setting equivalent.

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-09-10, 09:38 PM
Thank's again, Vorpal Tribble.
Speed: 60 ft. (10 squares) :smallwink:

Zom B
2010-09-10, 10:21 PM
Actually, I really like the Kallth. The picture is amazing (where did you find it? I want :smallwink:)

Searched DeviantArt for "wolf creature" and after looking through a bunch of creations that looked like the Alien Hive Queen spent a wild night in a kennel, I found that beauty staring at me. Originally the kallth had a sort of giraffe-knob on its forehead that it used to project the illusions, but I gladly changed the description to fit. I linked to the artist's page below the picture if you want to look at some more of their stuff. His Prince Zuko (http://ninjatic.deviantart.com/gallery/#/d1xsb9w) is amazingly nice but so is about everything in the gallery.


and the execution is pretty well done too. The image of one of those things, strange body parts a-glow, and tracking their prey, would be sure to send a shiver or three down a Drow's back.

I'm happy with their superiority at hunting. They can track using their Track/Survival, they can sniff you out, they can see through, say, wooden structures like house walls, and they can lure you out by mimicking sounds. I didn't include it, but they like using the sound of a baby crying for that.


And putting a large number of them, not even necessarily a pack, into a giant maze, would be incredibly hard on anyone's psyche. Oh no, that corridor ends in a solid wall. And that one too. And look, now you are stuck in a box!

Hadn't though of the maze idea, but they are pretty well suited to all the tunnels and corridors you can find in the Underdark, and their immunity to their own illusions means that they can lay down a wall and wait behind it to ambush you.

Thanks again for the critique on the flavor and fluff!

unosarta
2010-09-10, 10:52 PM
Searched DeviantArt for "wolf creature" and after looking through a bunch of creations that looked like the Alien Hive Queen spent a wild night in a kennel, I found that beauty staring at me. Originally the kallth had a sort of giraffe-knob on its forehead that it used to project the illusions, but I gladly changed the description to fit.
Humph. Whenever I search DeviantArt, I never have such luck. :smallfrown:



I'm happy with their superiority at hunting. They can track using their Track/Survival, they can sniff you out, they can see through, say, wooden structures like house walls, and they can lure you out by mimicking sounds. I didn't include it, but they like using the sound of a baby crying for that.
That has got to be one of the creepiest ways to be lured out of hiding. :smalleek:
Or, if they know anything about you at all (personal history and such), they could make sounds or images that are really personal to you. Like, if your wife died, they would make her shape, and have her lure you out before they eat you.

:smalleek:



Hadn't though of the maze idea, but they are pretty well suited to all the tunnels and corridors you can find in the Underdark, and their immunity to their own illusions means that they can lay down a wall and wait behind it to ambush you.

Thanks again for the critique on the flavor and fluff!
I was just thinking, a maze inhabited by Minotaur who have trained their Kallth to work in packs, and then employ Kobolds to make traps. That would be fun. :smallbiggrin:

"Ah, man, all these traps are killing me!"
"Look, it's a pit! Jump over!"
*Jumps over the pit*
*When they land on the ground across from the pit, they fall, down, down, into a layer of spikes, instead of landing on the solid ground*
DM: ....

"Well, I suppose I deserve that for even thinking about using this dungeon. So, what characters do you guys want to roll up next?"

Even if they made it past all of the pits, traps, illusions and horrible, horrible spikey death, they would still need to fight the minotaurs. :smallbiggrin:

Debihuman
2010-09-10, 10:53 PM
I'll take this one Debi. Expect a message, LOTRfan.

Is this the first creation you've attempted btw? Epic is tough even for the veterans.

Thanks -- epic creatures are kinda beyond me.

Kallth look good. I'm not seeing any issues but it's late and I may have missed something. Is radiosense your own creation or is it from another source?

Edit: Even though the Atroxasaurus is epic, I'm not sure it should qualify for Divine Rank 0. Change Organization to Solitary (Unique) and that should clear it up. Also, if it is a divine rank 0, you need to add Immortality as a Special Quality.



Creatures of this rank are sometimes called quasi-deities or hero deities. Creatures that have a mortal and a deity as parents also fall into this category. These entities cannot grant spells, but are immortal and usually have one or more ability scores that are far above the norm for their species. They may have some worshipers. Ordinary mortals do not have a divine rank of 0. They lack a divine rank altogether.

Immortality

All deities (even those of rank 0) are naturally immortal and cannot die from natural causes. Deities do not age, and they do not need to eat, sleep, or breathe. The only way for a deity to die is through special circumstances, usually by being slain in magical or physical combat. Deities of rank 1 or higher are not subject to death from massive damage.


Debby

Zom B
2010-09-10, 11:20 PM
Kallth look good. I'm not seeing any issues but it's late and I may have missed something. Is radiosense your own creation or is it from another source?

My creation, but I wanted to phrase it so that others can use it or I can use it in the future.

HalfTangible
2010-09-10, 11:41 PM
The Vraal has some statblock issues that I'll be addressing.

Hit Dice are 14d10+56 (133 hp) [14 X 5.5 = 77 plus bonus hp (4x14= 56) for a total [77 +56] of 133 hp].

BAB/Grapple: this varies on monster type. Magical beast is the same as fighter. BAB = HD. Grapple is HD + Str modifier + Special size modifier.
BAB is +14. Grapple is +21.

Speed is first listed by feet. Speed is 40 ft.

Attack only should list the creature's primary attack. Damage needs Str modifier. Secondary attacks use 1/2 Str modifier for damage unless there is a special ability or feat that changes this. Claws and bites are melee attacks and that should be noted in the statblock. Primary attacks are listed first in full attack line.

Attack: Claws + 21 melee (2d6+7)
Full Attack: 2 Claws +21 melee (2d6+7) and Bite +16 melee (3d8+3)

Space and Reach are based on creature's size. You note extended reach by tail after standard reach.

Space/Reach: 5 ft./5 ft. (10 ft. with tail)

The special attacks and special qualities are listed by name alphabetically. You note the details separately in a text section. See SRD or 3.5 MM for how this is done.

I don't under stand the special attack. It can only reach 10 feet with its tail. How is it managing a 3 square sweep and is this sweep done with the tail? From the picture, it looks like the creature uses its tail for balance. I'd recommend toning down the damage the tail sweep does.

"Regeneration (4d6)" is sufficient. However, you should probably make this a set number since most monsters are written that way. For example, a troll has Regeneration 5.

A creature that is dazzled by bright light is Light Sensitive. This would be an Extraordinary ability.

Racial bonuses (and penalties) should come from Special abilities or be listed in the text description. If the bonuses/penalties apply to skills they should be listed in the Skills section.

More to come when I'm not so tired. :-)

Thanks. I had to wing most of it because i've never built a monster in dnd format. Excuse me while i go edit this stuff in...

LOTRfan
2010-09-11, 07:42 AM
Thanks -- epic creatures are kinda beyond me.

Kallth look good. I'm not seeing any issues but it's late and I may have missed something. Is radiosense your own creation or is it from another source?

Edit: Even though the Atroxasaurus is epic, I'm not sure it should qualify for Divine Rank 0. Change Organization to Solitary (Unique) and that should clear it up. Also, if it is a divine rank 0, you need to add Immortality as a Special Quality.




Debby


Changed the organization. I think there is a sidebar (either in Deities and Demigods of in the Epic Level Handbook) that states if you are using them in conjunction you could add divine rank: 0 to all the abominations. If this contest requires the more standard version, I'll change it immediately.

HalfTangible
2010-09-11, 10:12 AM
I did most of the suggestions aside from the part about racial bonuses. I'm not sure why that would go in a seperate section from the thing it's affecting, but mostly i'm just lazy.

Zom B
2010-09-11, 10:15 AM
That has got to be one of the creepiest ways to be lured out of hiding. :smalleek:

I got the idea from mountain lions and bobcats (and I believe panthers/jaguars, too). They can imitate the sound of a baby crying (I think they can even make a sound like a person screaming), and it seemed fitting that a relative of these cats (I always assumed the displacer beast was somehow related to a panther, anyway) that was of human intelligence might learn to hone this ability further.


I did most of the suggestions aside from the part about racial bonuses. I'm not sure why that would go in a seperate section from the thing it's affecting, but mostly i'm just lazy.

You can look at my Kallth and see an example of how racial bonuses to skills are listed. They're put elsewhere so you can read the stat block easier.

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-09-11, 03:42 PM
Noticed this morning that next month's will be our 50th competition, and 4 years exactly since I started these on October 2006.

This Halloween competition needs something special to it. I've had the theme planned since last year, but wondering what else I should add...

Definitely going to have a trophy award.

Debihuman
2010-09-11, 07:19 PM
Wow, 50 contests. Very cool. I hope you think of something suitably creepy.

Debby

BladeofOblivion
2010-09-11, 07:30 PM
Wow, 50 contests. Very cool. I hope you think of something suitably creepy.

Debby

Just make the criteria: "Must give nightmares to at least 10% of readers." :smallbiggrin:

Zom B
2010-09-11, 08:11 PM
Hmm, if that's the criterion, I have something in mind.

HalfTangible
2010-09-12, 12:38 AM
Me too, flavor wise, but i'm not sure how i'd get it to work in a dnd setting.

Sir Shadow
2010-09-28, 12:14 PM
Hopefully I'll have the time to enter :)

Bhu
2010-09-28, 06:38 PM
A witch and black cat theme :smallbiggrin::smallwink:

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-09-30, 08:53 PM
Sneak Preview

http://oi51.tinypic.com/w991cx.jpg

Done by request by Domochevsky (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/member.php?u=42418) (and font by myself)

unosarta
2010-09-30, 09:07 PM
Sneak Preview

http://oi51.tinypic.com/w991cx.jpg

Done by request by Domochevsky (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/member.php?u=42418) (and font by myself)

Dagnabbit, and I made that creature for no reason at all. I might just post it up all by its singular. :smallsigh:

Bhu
2010-10-01, 01:51 AM
Feel no pain unosarta. It's tuff to win the monster competition. I think I've lost more than I won and I've entered a lot.

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-10-01, 02:08 AM
...had the new contest written, and was 2 seconds away from posting when firefox crashed :smallfurious:

Tomorrow...

unosarta
2010-10-01, 09:21 AM
Feel no pain unosarta. It's tuff to win the monster competition. I think I've lost more than I won and I've entered a lot.

Well, it was mostly that I had written up a monster for the next one based on the sort-of-not-really hints that VT dropped, but then it is about pumpkins. And my creature was Lovecraftian undersea horror. :smallsigh:

Actually, no, I don't really care about winning the contest. More often than not, I enter because I love the theme, and want to work my creative juices, and because I can get a lot of feedback on these thread, both about how I homebrew, and how the monster works. :smallamused:

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-10-01, 12:56 PM
Bah, I didn't drop no hints :smallwink:

Contest is now up!

Mulletmanalive
2010-10-01, 01:08 PM
I'd been hoping that there'd be something a bit more grisly in the theme but oh well. Maybe this contest will prove that it's possible to make plant creatures that are actively cool rather than a little silly...[i'm looking at you Phantom Fungus :smallmad:]

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-10-01, 01:10 PM
Watch The Ruins and tell me about how plants aren't grisly.

Or the real life fungus that invades ant brains and turns them into zombies to take the spores somewhere to their liking before sprouting from their heads.

Debihuman
2010-10-01, 01:13 PM
Actually, no, I don't really care about winning the contest. More often than not, I enter because I love the theme, and want to work my creative juices, and because I can get a lot of feedback on these thread, both about how I homebrew, and how the monster works. :smallamused:

That's the spirit! I actually do more critiquing than actual homebrewing these days. I try to be fair in doing so and to keep true to the creature as much as possible. However, this is one contest that I may actually enter if I have the time. I have a few ideas....

Debby

Mulletmanalive
2010-10-01, 02:03 PM
Watch The Ruins and tell me about how plants aren't grisly.

Or the real life fungus that invades ant brains and turns them into zombies to take the spores somewhere to their liking before sprouting from their heads.

ok, going to need links to both if i'm going to do that...

Yellow Musk Creepers are real?

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-10-01, 02:08 PM
ok, going to need links to both if i'm going to do that...
Zombie Ants (http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=fungus-makes-zombie-ants)

The Ruins trailer (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vzdto154_to)
(As teenager horror movies go it was actually pretty good. Plants that slowly infected and grew through you. Could vibrate to mimic sounds, such as one of the victim's cell phone ring tone :smallwink: )

I'd also suggest Midworld by Alan Dean Foster.

unosarta
2010-10-01, 02:50 PM
That's the spirit! I actually do more critiquing than actual homebrewing these days. I try to be fair in doing so and to keep true to the creature as much as possible. However, this is one contest that I may actually enter if I have the time. I have a few ideas....

Debby

Yeah, having people vote over it is an incentive, but hardly necessary for me. Also, I have no idea how to deal with plants that are evil or creepy. :smallsigh:

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-10-01, 03:05 PM
Yeah, having people vote over it is an incentive, but hardly necessary for me. Also, I have no idea how to deal with plants that are evil or creepy. :smallsigh:
Ok, think what might grow in the lower planes, or what kind of horrible growths can spread from the Far Realm. Also decided I'd allow deathless/undead plants, so added it to the rules.

Here are some to maybe give you ideas:

Carnage Apple (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=192910#post192910)
Cobblecap (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10198)
Cranny Creeper (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=34255)
Deathcap Myconid (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32662)
Dewmoss (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11631)
Tilinikan (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11063)
Trlleeltrlaa (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=134937)

Queen of Ten Thousand Roots (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=164720) (Greater Deity)

Schylerwalker
2010-10-01, 04:46 PM
Considering what I've been doing in THIS thread ( http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=169861 ), I'm tempted expand on that in this next contest...any plant-themed Metallica songs...?

Demons_eye
2010-10-01, 05:25 PM
Dang it you killed the idea I had for this contest Vorpal. Back to the drawing board.

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-10-01, 05:29 PM
Dang it you killed the idea I had for this contest Vorpal. Back to the drawing board.
Was everyone expecting an aberration competition?

BladeofOblivion
2010-10-01, 06:19 PM
Considering what I've been doing in THIS thread ( http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=169861 ), I'm tempted expand on that in this next contest...any plant-themed Metallica songs...?

Nope. But Creeping Death kinda sounds like it if you don't, you know, listen to the song.

akma
2010-10-01, 06:49 PM
If you all are so dissappointed that the contest isn`t what you wanted, you could always make another contest. There will be no disaster if there will be 2 monster creation contests at the same time. I personelly plan to make a plant creature and hopefully win this contest, and if there will be another contest I might try to win it too.

unosarta
2010-10-01, 06:57 PM
Actually, now I am thinking of making a plant horror that lives on the plane that the Xenosera class had. Were there any plants there? Maybe a fungus or a protozoan would work.

Now I really want to make a life sized malaria virus that split itself and infected victims with malaria, breaking apart their blood cells and then using their corpses as spawning grounds for more life sized malaria. Can I? :smallbiggrin:

The Dark Fiddler
2010-10-02, 05:16 PM
Ooh, the contest I've been waiting for since last Halloween! I'm gonna get my idea for this one statted up if it kills me!

unosarta
2010-10-02, 09:53 PM
OK, I have probably just about everything except the feats done for the Bloodsplitter. Just one question, VT; because of how Malaria works, it is practically impossible to treat it with mundane methods. Because of this, healers cannot replace the host's fortitude save with their heal check unless they use a Medicinal Leech (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9456797&postcount=2). Is that OK with you? It is your homebrew after all.

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-10-03, 08:20 AM
Because of this, healers cannot replace the host's fortitude save with their heal check unless they use a Medicinal Leech (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9456797&postcount=2). Is that OK with you? It is your homebrew after all.
Go for it.

Thinking of working on a spell that also cleanses blood.

unosarta
2010-10-03, 09:49 AM
Go for it.

Thinking of working on a spell that also cleanses blood.

Well, I kind of posted it while waiting for your response, so the Bloodsplitter is up!

Also, I am really, really glad that that is not how RL malaria works, or I would be freaking out right now. :smalleek:

PersonMan
2010-10-03, 09:50 AM
My first entry into one of these contests...The Doom Moss isn't quite finished yet, but I thought I'd post it now, at least to get some help on determining its CR.

The Dark Fiddler
2010-10-03, 10:00 AM
Posted my Pumpkin King... I'm kind of worried that Enthrall might be a bit too wordy and complicated, and the CR is most definitely off, but I'm pretty happy on it, considered I just typed it up in... 45 minutes?

unosarta
2010-10-03, 10:02 AM
My first entry into one of these contests...The Doom Moss isn't quite finished yet, but I thought I'd post it now, at least to get some help on determining its CR.

I can't help you there (although I think there are CR calculators that you can find, IIRC), but I don't think you need to actually list the DC for the Infect ability as (10+1/2 HD+Constitution modifier+2). In most cases, simply saying that it is constitution based, and just listing the DC is enough for most people. If you did it because of the random +2, which might throw people off, you could list it at the bottom of the ability description, but as it is right now, that is not really how WotC does their DCs and really break up the flow of the reading, at least for me. Otherwise, great creation. :smallbiggrin:

As for the Thornshade. Why is the DC on consumptive florification so high? Normally it is 10+1/2 HD+Ability modifier, but none of your ability modifiers add up to 29, and 29 is a pretty high DC. Consider; If, for instance, a rogue (pure rogue in this case, since I don't want to have to deal with multiclass saves) were attacked by this. Your average rogue 16 has a base fortitude save of +5. He likely has a Constitution of 20, at the highest, for +10. He doesn't make the save except on a 19 or 20. Now, consider, if you will, a fighter, who actively wants to have a high Fortitude save. His base is +10 at that level, with a Constitution of 26. His total save is +18. He fails his save roughly half of every time he is affected. And considering how good ability drain can be, making it all but impossible to heal without magic, that is probably too high.

Otherwise, it is an interesting monster, and the fluff is awesome. :smallbiggrin:

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-10-03, 10:36 AM
Ok, who wants a critique, and public or private?

unosarta
2010-10-03, 10:38 AM
Ok, who wants a critique, and public or private?

Oh, oh, oh! Me!
Whichever works for you, I guess

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-10-03, 11:06 AM
Oh, oh, oh! Me!
Whichever works for you, I guess

Critique


Hit Dice: 16d8+112 (184 hp)
Abilities Str 26, Dex 15, Con 24, Int 2, Wis 15, Cha 6
Ok, first off that is a whole friggin' lot of HD and Str/Con for a lil medium creature.

I can see it as it is a creation of Orsa, so its hideously strong, but if so I'd suggest linking to the plane and explaining a little more in the flavor text. Not looking for a nod to my stuff, just think it could use some explanation on how it came to be such a buff daisy.


Armor Class: 24 (10[Base]+2[Dex]+12[Nat])
Armor Class: 24 (+2 dex, +12 natural) is standard.


Full Attack: 2 Slams +20 (1d6+4) and Bite +20 (2d6+8)
The first would be 1d6+12, and the next 2d6+6.

Primary attacks, even if more than one, use full strength mod unless specially modified. Such modifications are usually only present if #1. It's an herbivore or non-combatant creature and then it does half damage, or #2. the creature only has one attack, and then the damage is 1 1/2 mod.


Saves: Fort +16, Ref +6, Will +6
Base saves are Fort +10, Ref +5, Will +5

Con mod is +7, Ref +2, and Wis +2.

So end saves are Fort +17, Ref +6, Will +6


Feats: Improved Unarmed Strike, Improved Grapple, Multiattack, Improved Multiattack, Improved Natural Attack
First, thing this gets 6 feats via 16th level.

Second, Improved Natural Attack is a dead feat. At first making you decide what its attack is. That feat is only for adding to creatures you've advanced so they are tougher than others of their kind.


Infect the Blood: If the Bloodsplitter deals damage with their bite attack, and the opponent has a constitution score, they must make a fortitude save (DC 19) or become infected with the Bloodburst disease.
Standard DC for disease is 10 + 1/2 HD + Con mod, which would make this one 25.

Also need to add the clause: 'The save DC is Constitution-based.'


Skills: The Bloodsplitter gains a +5 bonus to all swim checks in order to swim in the mucus-like plane of Orsa.
If it can do that I'd suggest giving it Amphibious Traits so it can breathe water, even if it can't swim well.


The Bloodsplitters are actually made of many tiny different fungal beings that work in harmony. Reveals the Slime Body quality.
Body of Slime


Also, no advancement? I'm thinking this thing could, with enough HD, get to colossal. Would also explain it looking so large in the sample pic :smallwink:


Anyways, I like the concept. Its not a complex creature, but then it doesn't have to be. Might also add in perhaps the ability to meld with others of its kind to become a big one to fight off greater threads.

It looks like its missing a few things, like the actual disease, so I'll just hold off for final judgment until it's fully complete.

The Dark Fiddler
2010-10-03, 11:09 AM
Ok, who wants a critique, and public or private?

If you're offering. Feel free to point out my flaws in front of everyone else. It's humbling.

unosarta
2010-10-03, 11:20 AM
Response


Ok, first off that is a whole friggin' lot of HD and Str/Con for a lil medium creature.
I do understand that the MM does recommend that the HD, Strength and Constitution be set based on size, but that honestly doesn't make very much sense here. The Bloodsplitter is hundreds of millions of tiny creatures. I think it does not stretch the mind to consider that they are stronger and better able to take wounds than normal creatures.


I can see it as it is a creation of Orsa, so its hideously strong, but if so I'd suggested linking to the plane and explaining a little more in the flavor text. Not looking for a nod to my stuff, just think it could use a little explanation on how it came to be such a buff daisy.
I thought I did explicitly link them. Well, I will add that in, then.


Armor Class: 24 (+2 dex, +12 natural) is standard.
Really? That seems like it would be confusing and annoying for first time players, though. Huh.


The first would be 1d6+12, and the next 2d6+6.

Primary attacks, even if more than one, use full strength mod unless specially modified. Such modifications are usually only present if #1. It's an herbivore or non-combatant creature and then it does half damage, or #2. the creature only has one attack, and then the damage is 1 1/2 mod.
This is probably my fault for mixing up the order, but the bite is the primary attack. The Slams don't take the -5 because it has Multiattack and Improved Multiattack.


Base saves are Fort +10, Ref +5, Will +5

Con mod is +7, Ref +2, and Wis +2.

So end saves are Fort +17, Ref +6, Will +6
I'll admit to the +17, but 2+5=7, not 6.


First, thing this gets 6 feats via 16th level.

Second, Improved Natural Attack is a dead feat. At first making you decide what its attack is. That feat is only for adding to creatures you've advanced so they are tougher than others of their kind.
It is the bite attack. And nowhere in the feat does it mention anything of that sort, and that honestly makes no sense whatsoever from just a fluff standpoint, let alone a mechanical one. And even if it did, I don't really care. The Bloodsplitter qualifies, and it makes sense for them.


Standard DC for disease is 10 + 1/2 HD + Con mod, which would make this one 25.

Also need to add the clause: 'The save DC is Constitution-based.'
Shoot, thanks for reminding me. :smallbiggrin:


If it can do that I'd suggest giving it Amphibious Traits so it can breathe water, even if it can't swim well.
Good idea.


Body of Slime
Hehe, thanks.


Also, no advancement? I'm thinking this thing could, with enough HD, get to colossal. Would also explain it looking so large in the sample pic :smallwink:
Well, considering that the picture has no frame of reference whatsoever, I don't know how one would see it as "large". Still, I think some advancement is in order.


Anyways, I like the concept. Its not a complex creature, but then it doesn't have to be. Might also add in perhaps the ability to meld with others of its kind to become a big one to fight off greater threads.
I like this idea better than the advancement, now that I think of it.


It looks like its missing a few things, like the actual disease, so I'll just hold off for final judgment until it's fully complete.
Um, no, the disease is just under the lore. Do you want me to accentuate it or something, in order to make it easier to see?

The Dark Fiddler
2010-10-03, 11:26 AM
It is the bite attack.

In which case you have to specify in the feats section.


And nowhere in the feat does it mention anything of that sort, and that honestly makes no sense whatsoever from just a fluff standpoint, let alone a mechanical one. And even if it did, I don't really care. The Bloodsplitter qualifies, and it makes sense for them.

He was simply saying that it's kind of silly to give it to a homebrew creature, when you can just decide the damage anyway. Why waste the feat to up the damage a step when you could just say the damage is a step higher than normal? Doesn't stop me from personally using it as a filler feat when I can't think of anything else, though.

unosarta
2010-10-03, 11:33 AM
In which case you have to specify in the feats section.
Which I have done.



He was simply saying that it's kind of silly to give it to a homebrew creature, when you can just decide the damage anyway. Why waste the feat to up the damage a step when you could just say the damage is a step higher than normal? Doesn't stop me from personally using it as a filler feat when I can't think of anything else, though.

Why would one follow the guidelines for Strength and Constitution for size, but not natural attacks? :smallconfused:
Still, it's an OK filler feat, which is what its true purpose is. Even now, when I did give it a new feat for the one I missed, that feat doesn't feel very "true" to the monster. Oh well.

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-10-03, 11:33 AM
Feel free to point out my flaws in front of everyone else. It's humbling.

Critique


Hit Dice: 9d8+9 (50 HP)
Would be 49.5, and then you just round down to 49.


Attack: Tentacle +11 (1d8+5)
Full Attack: 4 Tentacles +11 (1d8+5)
+11 melee


Environment: Farms
That'd probably just be 'Temperate Plains'


First, the Pumpkin King must grapple the creature.
Suggested: First, the Pumpkin King must make a successful grapple attempt against its target.


The creature targeted by this ability may make a will save (DC 18), though it gets a -2 penalty to the save.
Suggested: The creature targeted by this ability may make a Will save (DC 18), taking a -2 penalty to the save.


The save DC is charisma based and the Pumpkin King has a +2 racial bonus to it, which increased by 1 for every creature already enthralled.
Suggested: The save DC is Charisma-based and the Pumpkin King has a +2 racial bonus to it, which is increased by 1 for every creature already enthralled.


If the creature fails the save, the creature is conscious again.
If the victim fails its save, it is resurrected to full HD without level loss, and is conscious again. It is affected as if it had been dying, as follows. If the creature was dying, it is healed to half its maximum HP...


The Pumpkin King loses one tentacle attack for every creature it has enthralled...
If, as I assume, it must keep a hold on the creature, I'd make sure that that stipulation was explained.


...though it gains a +2 enhancement bonus to its Intelligence score and its regeneration, fast healing, and natural armor all improve by one.
Here's a suggestion, with creature with an intelligence score of 3 or higher it gets int-bonuses. For creatures below 3 int, it gains a bonus to wisdom. Basically dumb creatures just let it be more aware.

In fact, I'd say if it had two or more creatures enthralled it'd have all-around vision.

Might also say that they all act on the Pumpkin King's initiative as if they were the same creature.


All in all, I was intrigued by this fellow, especially the specialized enthrall of it taking them over and using them as meat puppets. That picture though is too amusing to be scary :smallwink:

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-10-03, 11:48 AM
Response



I do understand that the MM does recommend that the HD, Strength and Constitution be set based on size, but that honestly doesn't make very much sense here. The Bloodsplitter is hundreds of millions of tiny creatures. I think it does not stretch the mind to consider that they are stronger and better able to take wounds than normal creatures.
Possibly, though so are most slime molds. And jellyfish for that matter. It's fine though, just unusual.


Really? That seems like it would be confusing and annoying for first time players, though. Huh.
*spreads hands*

Just the standard, for better or worse.



This is probably my fault for mixing up the order, but the bite is the primary attack. The Slams don't take the -5 because it has Multiattack and Improved Multiattack.
Wasn't saying the secondary attack should takes -5, just that secondary attack 'damage' is halved.


I'll admit to the +17, but 2+5=7, not 6.
Err, chalk that up to brain fart/miss-type


It is the bite attack. And nowhere in the feat does it mention anything of that sort, and that honestly makes no sense whatsoever from just a fluff standpoint, let alone a mechanical one. And even if it did, I don't really care. The Bloodsplitter qualifies, and it makes sense for them.
It may qualify, but what is the feat improving from? It naturally has that attack.

It makes sense from a mechanical and fluff standpoint that if you advance a creature 4 HD it is growing larger in size to some degree.

If you want it in there that's fine, and there is no rule saying it can't be, it's just, as I said, a dead feat.



Um, no, the disease is just under the lore. Do you want me to accentuate it or something, in order to make it easier to see?
Somehow passed right over the bloodburst spoiler. Maybe stick that spoiler up under the disease.

That's a pretty nasty disease, and I like it.

unosarta
2010-10-03, 11:58 AM
Possibly, though so are most slime molds. And jellyfish for that matter. It's fine though, just unusual.
I guess.


*spreads hands*

Just the standard, for better or worse.
Still. Well, I guess I could change it, but that is the format I have been using for a while now.



Wasn't saying the secondary attack should takes -5, just that secondary attack 'damage' is halved.
It is. And it was before. Probably just a misunderstanding because I put the bite after the slams.


Err, chalk that up to brain fart/miss-type
No problem. :smallwink:
Happens to the best of us.


It may qualify, but what is the feat improving from? It naturally has that attack.

It makes sense from a mechanical and fluff standpoint that if you advance a creature 4 HD it is growing larger in size to some degree.

If you want it in there that's fine, and there is no rule saying it can't be, it's just, as I said, a dead feat.
Taking the feat doesn't give the attack. It improves it. And honestly, as I mentioned to the Dark Fiddler, it is mostly a filler feat because I couldn't find any better, more thematic ones.



Somehow passed right over bloodburst. Maybe stick that spoiler up under the disease.

That's a pretty nasty disease, and I like it.
Ok.

And yeah, I was trying my best to make it similar to Malaria, which is not a fun illness. Unfortunately, I couldn't find a way to perfectly mirror Malaria, mostly because Malaria also has a dormant state in which it does not actually start the cycle, and people can live their entire lives with Malaria, without any of the symptoms, but if that Malaria is transmitted again via mosquito, the next victim can get the viral Malaria, and no one has any idea of how it works. But that would have been incredibly complicated, so I simply made it deadly and not fun at all.

The Dark Fiddler
2010-10-03, 11:59 AM
Would be 49.5, and then you just round down to 49.

Curse rounding down, I liked that even 50 HP. :smallfrown:



All in all, I was intrigued by this fellow, especially the specialized enthrall of it taking them over and using them as meat puppets. That picture though is too amusing to be scary :smallwink:

Thanks. Like I said, the idea struck me just a tiny bit too late for last year's competition, so I was really excited for this year's. I was actually scared it was too similar to something done already, because it just seemed like an obvious idea.

And hey, it's not my fault there's no better pictures of Pumpking, the King of Ghosts, and that he's kind of the perfect fit for the monster. :smalltongue:


Taking the feat doesn't give the attack. It improves it. And honestly, as I mentioned to the Dark Fiddler, it is mostly a filler feat because I couldn't find any better, more thematic ones.

Weapon Focus, perhaps? It may only be a +1 to attack rolls, but those are harder to randomly justify than higher damage.

PersonMan
2010-10-03, 12:04 PM
Oooh! Oooh! Me next, me next! *violent arm-shaking*
A critique by Vorpal Tribble! My inner fanboy is having a wild party!

EDIT:
@DCs: Eh, I want to keep it the way it is. I find parentheses easy to skip over, personally.

Miscellaneous: I find it humorous that I was kept from finishing the Doom Moss by playing DnD. I also find it humorous that it has the same abbreviation as Dungeon Master.

Also, I have no idea on the remaining four feats to give the Origin Patch, and I don't want to just give it a bunch of Toughness, or something.

unosarta
2010-10-03, 12:05 PM
Weapon Focus, perhaps? It may only be a +1 to attack rolls, but those are harder to randomly justify than higher damage.

A really, really weak feat. And having it seems to imply that the Bloodsplitter has focused its ability with that weapon, giving it greater understanding and ability, which seems really not thematic considering that they are practically mindless walking fungal flesh consuming monstrosities. Why would they train with their slams, when they would need to be busy eating everything in sight in order to get the energy required to feed all of the mini-fungi.

That was really what was so hard about it. I need a feat that seems like something they wouldn't actively have to train for, and one that would be acquired naturally, which almost no feat actually is, barring the monster feats, which is why I chose Improved Natural Attack.

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-10-03, 12:06 PM
@Uno


Taking the feat doesn't give the attack.
Didn't mean to imply it did.

Filler feats are fine, though plenty of nice ones that might fit it as well. Ability Focus (Infect the Blood) to up the DC or Great Fortitude because its just a friggin' tough bad-mutha, or Improved Toughness to up the HP, etc.

unosarta
2010-10-03, 12:07 PM
Didn't mean to imply it did.

Filler feats are fine, though plenty of nice ones that might fit it as well. Ability Focus (Infect the Blood) to up the DC or Great Fortitude because its just a friggin' tough bad-mutha, or Improved Toughness to up the HP, etc.
Oo, those sound good. Thanks!


[Edit]: Now that it has Improved Toughness, it has an even 200 hp. Oh yeah. :smallcool:

PersonMan
2010-10-03, 12:11 PM
EDIT:
@DCs: Eh, I want to keep it the way it is. I find parentheses easy to skip over, personally.

Miscellaneous: I find it humorous that I was kept from finishing the Doom Moss by playing DnD. I also find it humorous that it has the same abbreviation as Dungeon Master.

Also, I have no idea on the remaining four feats to give the Origin Patch, and I don't want to just give it a bunch of Toughness, or something.

Reposting this because another page was made between my edit and the original posting.

EDIT: Alright, now I'm running the Moss through Vorpal's CR thingie.

...And I found an epic fail that put the Origin Patch's HP in the 30s.

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-10-03, 12:26 PM
Oooh! Oooh! Me next, me next! *violent arm-shaking*


Armor Class: 7(+2 size, -5 dex,),7 touch,7 flat-footed
Armor Class: 7 (+2 size, -5 dex), touch 7, flat-footed 7


Base Attack/Grapple: +3/-10
+3/-


Saves: Fort +9, Ref -5(Always Fails), Will -4
Not that it matters, but Ref would be -4. Just the principal of the thing.


Skills: Know(local) +10
Nuh uh, no laziness in this contest, you spell it ALL out :smallwink:

Knowledge (local) +10


Feats: Ability Focus(Infection),
He'd get one more feat there.


Environment: Temperate areas
Environment: Any temperate land


Infect(Ex): Whenever a natural weapon is used to attack a Doom Moss patch, or whenever a living creature directly touches the Doom Moss, they must make a Reflex save (DC 10+1/2 Hit Dice+Constitution bonus+2, 19 for an average Doom Moss patch)
Must make a Reflex save (DC 10 + 1/2 HD + Con mod + 2 racial modifier)


On a result of 1-15, spores are on the weapon but nor triggered.
not triggered


Challenge Rating: X
This is a difficult case here. It doesn't really seem like a creature per se, but is as close to one as a Shrieker fungus. While the latter shrieks to draw attention, this one doesn't seem to have much that'd induce others to come on in heeeere, unless it just looks soft an inviting, cat lies in it, gets infected, etc.

A thought, how about if it can identify the race of a creature it can emit a pleasant smell. For humans, some freshly baked bred, cats some catnip, dogs a tasty treat, etc. Since it grows around populated areas it'd know of such things.

Perhaps it has little hooks all over it, that touching it can deal 1 point of non-lethal, but if, say, something passes through its square they can also possibly bring it along with them, even if it can't attack them.

I like it, though feels like it needs just that little bit extra something to propel it.

PersonMan
2010-10-03, 01:17 PM
*Frantic correcting*

Inner Fanboy: V-Vorpal Tribble...praised me?! YES!

Alrighty. For the most part, Doom Moss usually just grows all over the place, eventually getting into crops. Since, due to its DR and HP, it's nearly impossible to remove normally, it's eventually burned or individual patches are carried away. This results in either massive growth, or infection.

I'll think about adding something like that, however.

...Once I finish all this homework.

Morph Bark
2010-10-03, 01:40 PM
I have a question regarding the type of the creatures. May it be so that the entry is a Plant-type, but augmented from another type, or from another type which is an augmented Plant?


...upon re-reading that, it doesn't make much sense to me, but might as well just post it so that it gets some thought.

PersonMan
2010-10-03, 01:46 PM
If you mean a Plant-ify-ing thing, I think that'd be within the spirit of the contest.

Morph Bark
2010-10-03, 02:01 PM
If you mean a Plant-ify-ing thing, I think that'd be within the spirit of the contest.

Well, I'm not actually working on a template or anything, it just came up while I was working out my idea. I'm trying to go for a kind of plant-possessing spirit that doesn't really have stats when it isn't inside a plant and it can only heal damage while inside a plant. I figured it would still be plant type for that reason... or wouldn't it be? :smalleek:

unosarta
2010-10-03, 02:13 PM
Well, I'm not actually working on a template or anything, it just came up while I was working out my idea. I'm trying to go for a kind of plant-possessing spirit that doesn't really have stats when it isn't inside a plant and it can only heal damage while inside a plant. I figured it would still be plant type for that reason... or wouldn't it be? :smalleek:

It almost seems to be Undead (incorporeal). But I don't really know.

PersonMan
2010-10-03, 02:19 PM
I agree with Uno. However, I still think that it's within the spirit of the contest. If I were you, I wouldn't devote too much time into it until Vorpal's said yay or nay, but...well, even if it doesn't work you can always just post it on its own.

Which I may do for my Doom Moss. I don't know why, but I love the thought of an entire campaign revolving around destroying an infestation of low-CR plants that can't even attack normally but are still threatening to destroy the world.

Imagine what would happen if some was sent to the Elemental Plane of Fire. I think that, by a strict RAW interpretation of the Fire Growth rules, each patch could spawn 8 every round with enough damage.

...I'd change it, but the thought of a plant that that has to be kept away from an entire plane at all costs intrigues me.

unosarta
2010-10-03, 02:25 PM
Imagine what would happen if some was sent to the Elemental Plane of Fire. I think that, by a strict RAW interpretation of the Fire Growth rules, each patch could spawn 8 every round with enough damage.

:smalleek:

Alternatively, a Bloodsplitter becomes intelligent. And then decides he hates all life. And then starts spreading the Bloodburst disease everywhere.

A small town would be gone in several weeks, maybe a month. A small country would be gone in under a year, if there were multiple. The world? But a decade away. Now I am sort of glad that I kept the Bloodburst incubation period so that it actually fit the one for regular Malaria.

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-10-03, 02:48 PM
I have a question regarding the type of the creatures. May it be so that the entry is a Plant-type, but augmented from another type, or from another type which is an augmented Plant?
...yeah, I suppose augmented plant type could work.



Which I may do for my Doom Moss. I don't know why, but I love the thought of an entire campaign revolving around destroying an infestation of low-CR plants that can't even attack normally but are still threatening to destroy the world.

Imagine what would happen if some was sent to the Elemental Plane of Fire. I think that, by a strict RAW interpretation of the Fire Growth rules, each patch could spawn 8 every round with enough damage.
HA! Yeah, that does put a new light on it :smallamused:

PersonMan
2010-10-03, 03:07 PM
:smalleek:

Alternatively, a Bloodsplitter becomes intelligent. And then decides he hates all life. And then starts spreading the Bloodburst disease everywhere.

A small town would be gone in several weeks, maybe a month. A small country would be gone in under a year, if there were multiple. The world? But a decade away. Now I am sort of glad that I kept the Bloodburst incubation period so that it actually fit the one for regular Malaria.

Worse.

Both happen at the same time.

Also, I added more fluff to the Doom Moss.

unosarta
2010-10-03, 03:08 PM
Worse.

Both happen at the same time.

Also, I added more fluff to the Doom Moss.

And then a zombie apocalypse. They never would have seen it coming. :smallamused:

Morph Bark
2010-10-03, 03:14 PM
And then a zombie apocalypse. They never would have seen it coming. :smallamused:

A yellow musk zombie apocalypse.

unosarta
2010-10-03, 03:22 PM
A yellow musk zombie apocalypse.

I like the way you think.

Also, aliens. :smallcool:

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-10-03, 03:25 PM
Btw, for those of you who were going to post your cthulhu-esque creatures on the board, message me so I can tell you something.

Morph Bark
2010-10-03, 05:31 PM
I like the way you think.

Also, aliens. :smallcool:

Cloverfield? :smallamused:


Also, I posted up my monster. I think it deserved Plant type as it is, though I guess an Unliving subtype of sorts would befit it. (Then again, yellow musk zombies still have a Con score...)

unosarta
2010-10-03, 05:35 PM
Cloverfield? :smallamused:
See, but that just makes me think of the Tarrasque, and a swarm of Tarrasques isn't frightening, it is just ridiculous.

...Unless they were vampire Tarrasques.


Also, I posted up my monster. I think it deserved Plant type as it is, though I guess an Unliving subtype of sorts would befit it. (Then again, yellow musk zombies still have a Con score...)

Well, it has tomb-tainted soul. How does that work? :smallconfused:

Morph Bark
2010-10-03, 05:38 PM
Well, it has tomb-tainted soul. How does that work? :smallconfused:

All Tomb-Tainted Soul requires is a non-good alignment... and presumably a Con score. Since it has both: voila?

unosarta
2010-10-03, 05:39 PM
All Tomb-Tainted Soul requires is a non-good alignment... and presumably a Con score. Since it has both: voila?

Oh, no, it works mechanically. I meant type-wise. Undead (plant, augmented)? I literally have no idea how that works.

Morph Bark
2010-10-03, 05:43 PM
Oh, no, it works mechanically. I meant type-wise. Undead (plant, augmented)? I literally have no idea how that works.

Well, I figured that the creature is mainly a plant, it's just a plant that is possessed. Therefore, it is a Plant type. Just like how a human possessed by a demon is still a Humanoid (human).

unosarta
2010-10-03, 05:50 PM
Well, I figured that the creature is mainly a plant, it's just a plant that is possessed. Therefore, it is a Plant type. Just like how a human possessed by a demon is still a Humanoid (human).
What if that spirit possessed other plants, then? Or is it some weird spirit that only possesses one kind of plant. :smallconfused:

Morph Bark
2010-10-03, 05:58 PM
What if that spirit possessed other plants, then? Or is it some weird spirit that only possesses one kind of plant. :smallconfused:

It is meant to be that a specific hollow haunter is bound to a single kind of plant. Or more specifically: a single patch or field of that kind of plant. Hence why I figured I'd have it so that they most commonly are bound to pumpkins or similar plants...

If I need clarifying somewhere or should alter something, I'd like to hear it. An in-depth critique of the hollow haunter is also welcome (if it indeed fits in with this competition, which I hope :smallfrown:).

unosarta
2010-10-03, 06:06 PM
It is meant to be that a specific hollow haunter is bound to a single kind of plant. Or more specifically: a single patch or field of that kind of plant. Hence why I figured I'd have it so that they most commonly are bound to pumpkins or similar plants...

If I need clarifying somewhere or should alter something, I'd like to hear it. An in-depth critique of the hollow haunter is also welcome (if it indeed fits in with this competition, which I hope :smallfrown:).

Every kind of plant has the same statistics? I mean, I can see it but...

And no, clarification isn't really necessary in this case. Nothing is wrong as far as I can see mechanically, in my brief skimming, but I just have to wonder. I mean, if it were a specific kind of creature that inhabits a specific kind of plant I guess it could work...

*wanders off, rambling to himself*

squeekenator
2010-10-03, 11:41 PM
Ok, who wants a critique, and public or private?

OOH! OOH! PICK ME! Public, if you'd be so kind.


As for the Thornshade. Why is the DC on consumptive florification so high? Normally it is 10+1/2 HD+Ability modifier, but none of your ability modifiers add up to 29, and 29 is a pretty high DC. Consider; If, for instance, a rogue (pure rogue in this case, since I don't want to have to deal with multiclass saves) were attacked by this. Your average rogue 16 has a base fortitude save of +5. He likely has a Constitution of 20, at the highest, for +10. He doesn't make the save except on a 19 or 20. Now, consider, if you will, a fighter, who actively wants to have a high Fortitude save. His base is +10 at that level, with a Constitution of 26. His total save is +18. He fails his save roughly half of every time he is affected. And considering how good ability drain can be, making it all but impossible to heal without magic, that is probably too high.

10 + 12 (1/2 HD) + 5 (Con mod) +2 (Ability focus) = 29

And yes, the DC is very high, and it will kill people lots. But keep in mind that it's a CR18 monster who deals insignificant damage with its regular attack (also, everyone has a cloak of resistance +5 at that point). If it ever tries to take on a full party, it'll get wizard-blasted out of existance in the first round of combat, and by that point the party cleric can be preparing multiple Miracles, so you can wipe clean all the ability drain it deals without much difficulty.

PersonMan
2010-10-04, 12:35 AM
A yellow musk zombie apocalypse.

That are also mutated carriers for Doom Moss and Magic Malaria*!

*Or whatever the monster is. It's morning and I'm too lazy to check.

unosarta
2010-10-04, 07:47 AM
10 + 12 (1/2 HD) + 5 (Con mod) +2 (Ability focus) = 29

And yes, the DC is very high, and it will kill people lots. But keep in mind that it's a CR18 monster who deals insignificant damage with its regular attack (also, everyone has a cloak of resistance +5 at that point). If it ever tries to take on a full party, it'll get wizard-blasted out of existance in the first round of combat, and by that point the party cleric can be preparing multiple Miracles, so you can wipe clean all the ability drain it deals without much difficulty.
Oh, I always forget ability focus. And I guess that is true, but if that is the reasoning, it seems to me you could take it one step further and wonder why you even need monsters at that level, if your caster or wizard can take care of all of them with but a standard action.


That are also mutated carriers for Doom Moss and Magic Malaria*!

*Or whatever the monster is. It's morning and I'm too lazy to check.
Bloodsplitter. But yeah, that is a freaky image. :smalleek:

And then, once the party has gotten some levels on them from killing all of the plague spreading, mutated, mossy fiends, they encounter a thornshade.

Muahahahahaha! :smallcool:
There really needs to be an evil face emote.

Morph Bark
2010-10-04, 08:00 AM
And then, once the party has gotten some levels on them from killing all of the plague spreading, mutated, mossy fiends, they encounter a thornshade.

Muahahahahaha! :smallcool:
There really needs to be an evil face emote.

I got the image of a Large thornshade with a patch of hollow haunter-infested pumpkins on its back... now I want to try that out, but my players are only level 1. :smalleek:

And yes, there should be. Xykon's isn't enough.

PersonMan
2010-10-04, 08:14 AM
I got the image of a Large thornshade with a patch of hollow haunter-infested pumpkins on its back... now I want to try that out, but my players are only level 1. :smalleek:

And yes, there should be. Xykon's isn't enough.

You think too small. What you should have said was:

I got the image of a Large thornshade with a patch of hollow haunter-infested pumpkins on its back with Doom Moss on those and Bloodsplitters on those riding on an infected vampire Tarrasque...now I want to try that out, too bad my players are only level 1. :smallamused:

Morph Bark
2010-10-04, 08:18 AM
You think too small. What you should have said was:

I got the image of a Large thornshade with a patch of hollow haunter-infested pumpkins on its back with Doom Moss on those and Bloodsplitters on those riding on an infected vampire Tarrasque...now I want to try that out, too bad my players are only level 1. :smallamused:

HMMM...

How about we have a bloodsplitter carry a Huge thornshade carrying a Colossal dry lich Tarrasque, all of which are covered in Doom Moss? :smallbiggrin:

Wait, where we going for horror or comedy? Is this competition the Scary Movie of plant-based campaign ideas? If so, we need more aliens from outer space.

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-10-04, 08:38 AM
There really needs to be an evil face emote.
I'd be so happy with just an eyebrow lifting or rolling eyes one.



OOH! OOH! PICK ME! Public, if you'd be so kind.


Hit Dice: 24d8+148 (252 hp)
Unless I missed a modifier, extra HP would be 130 instead of 148.

Average HP would be 238.

24 (HD) x 4.5 (half d8) + 24 (HD) x 5 (Con mod) + 10 (Improved Toughness) = 238


Base Attack/Grapple: +18/+24
Grapple would be 28.

18 (BAB) + 6 (Str mod) + 4 (Improved Grapple)


Feats: Ability focus (consumptive florification), improved natural attack (slam), improved toughness, power attack, improved initiative, combat reflexes, improved grapple, dodge, mobility
Though I know you may have just been using it for a filler feat, improved natural attack is a dead feat since you can make their attack anything you want it to be. Is intended as a feat to give to creatures you improve by HD when you make them bigger and stronger.


Consumptive Florification (Su):
At the end just need to add, 'The save DC is Constitution-based.'


Cloak of Darkness (Su): A thornshade is constantly surrounded by pitch blackness that not even true seeing can penetrate.
How about spells that see through magical darkness?


This fellow has a background full of potential, but the crunch ends up being a bit bland and doesn't seem to match the fluff at all.

They're big bad sorcerers who crave power and were pursuers of magical power yet all their abilities could be that of a creature with an Int of 0. All it does is feed and has feats to help it feed. They have no magical abilities whatsoever despite their sorcerous background. Nor does anything they do seem to grant them power besides that of physical ability.

Why would any of them become one of these voluntarily? And as the making of one suggests, they don't do it voluntarily often, if ever, but if such is the case, who would bother? The thing can't be controlled by them, and it loses most of its most powerful abilities. Seems like a waste of magical potential.

I can't help but think you should make this a template instead, or at least give it a sorcerer spell progression.

Something to justify its existence and the effort gone to make it.

unosarta
2010-10-04, 09:05 AM
HMMM...

How about we have a bloodsplitter carry a Huge thornshade carrying a Colossal dry lich Tarrasque, all of which are covered in Doom Moss? :smallbiggrin:

Wait, where we going for horror or comedy? Is this competition the Scary Movie of plant-based campaign ideas? If so, we need more aliens from outer space.

Huge? You're thinking too small! Colossal++ Bloodsplitter carrying a Colossal ++ Thornshade, carrying a Colossal +++ dry lich, dracolich, ghost, feral Tarrasque, all of which are covered in doom moss which is lit on fire by a continual flame spell.

I am not sure now that you mention it. On their own, each is pretty scary, but when combined they just get ridiculous. Also, calling it now, the next entry will be alien plants. >_>


I'd be so happy with just an eyebrow lifting or rolling eyes one.
Actually, an eyebrow lifting one would be pretty nice, especially since it is pretty hard to recreate in regular text, let alone forum emotes.

Debihuman
2010-10-04, 09:14 AM
Lore checks start with 10 + Monster's HD. This information can be found in Skills Knowledge check. Doom Moss, Pumpkin King and Hollow Hunter should revise their charts.

Creatures normally increase in size when they double their hit dice. I'm seeing a lot of odd advancements here.

If a creature doesn't move it's speed should be Speed: 0 ft. (immobile).

Balanced creatures normally have an appropriate number of Special Abilities to match their HD. I'm see a lot of imbalances in both directions -- too few and too many. A good balance is 1 Special ability per HD [not including ones that come from the creature's Type].

All Plant creatures possess the following traits (unless otherwise noted in a creature’s entry).

* Low-light vision.
* Immunity to all mind-affecting effects (charms, compulsions, phantasms, patterns, and morale effects).
* Immunity to poison, sleep effects, paralysis, polymorph, and stunning.
* Not subject to critical hits.
* Proficient with its natural weapons only.
* Proficient with no armor.
* Plants breathe and eat, but do not sleep.


Unfortunately, I don't have time to do a full critique of everyone's creatures. I'm going to give an abbreviated version.

Bloodspitter has natural armor +12, which seems a little excessive. Is it armor plated or something? You should probably explain that in the fluff somewhere. I'm not entirely sure you need the Amphibious subtype since it doesn't have the Aquatic type. You could just say that they breathe both air and water. Where can I find information about the Plane of Orsa?

The major problem with the Doom Moss is that it doesn't really qualify as a "creature." It is really just a Hazard and too easy to avoid. If you recognize it, you just walk around it without touching it. How difficult is this to Spot? It might be underpowered for CR 5. I like the Fire Growth ability (missed that earlier). However, it is fairly easy to overcome. Just cast acid arrow or launch vials of acid from 10 feet until it is dead. You are out of range from its infect ability.

Thornshade probably has too many HD. There just isn't anything particularly epic about it to warrant the 24 HD. If you halved the HD you'd have a more balanced monster. I don't see this as much of a challenge for CR 18. Since it is made from the souls of spellcasters, it should probably have a few spell-like abilities.

Calling a pumpkin king's attacks "tentacles" seems a little strange. Perhaps these should be slam attacks like an assassin vine. It has 9 HD and should have 4 feats so it still is missing a standard feat.

Conversely, the Hollow Hunter doesn't have enough HD. 4 HD are too low to justify the number of special abilities it has. It should have at least 10 more HD.

Debby

PersonMan
2010-10-04, 01:31 PM
On Lore checks-In the later Monster Manuals, the ones with handy-dandy lore tables, appear(at least as far as I remember, I'm AFB at the moment) to use 10+CR rather than 10+HD.

As for the obstacle thing...well, it's easy to deal with once you know how to do so. If you don't, it can be a lot more dangerous, and if you mess up badly enough you don't get a chance to try again with the right tricks.

It's as easy to spot as normal(albeit fast-growing) moss. Telling the difference is the problem.

Debihuman
2010-10-04, 01:37 PM
It's 10 + HD for Knowledge (See online SRD here: http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/knowledge.htm)


In many cases, you can use this skill to identify monsters and their special powers or vulnerabilities. In general, the DC of such a check equals 10 + the monster’s HD. A successful check allows you to remember a bit of useful information about that monster.

Debby

Morph Bark
2010-10-04, 02:19 PM
Creatures normally increase in size when they double their hit dice. I'm seeing a lot of odd advancements here.

I've seen both that in official content and 1.5x startin HD = size increase. In my eyes the second one seemed to suit my critter better.


Conversely, the Hollow Hunter doesn't have enough HD. 4 HD are too low to justify the number of special abilities it has. It should have at least 10 more HD.

10?! Really? What exactly are you counting as "special abilities" here, then? I wouldn't call the skill bonuses or weaknesses special abilities, myself, for one.

Also, as a minor, but delicate note, it's haunter, not hunter. Only a minor difference is spelling, but it can mean a large difference in meaning.

The Dark Fiddler
2010-10-04, 02:26 PM
I'd be so happy with just an eyebrow lifting...

:smallconfused:


Lore checks start with 10 + Monster's HD. This information can be found in Skills Knowledge check. Doom Moss, Pumpkin King and Hollow Hunter should revise their charts.

*Mutters something about nitpicking :smalltongue:*



Calling a pumpkin king's attacks "tentacles" seems a little strange. Perhaps these should be slam attacks like an assassin vine.

Perhaps, though unless there's a more concrete reason than that I think I'll leave it. I personally think "tentacles" fits better, so I guess it's just down to personal taste?


It has 9 HD and should have 4 feats so it still is missing a standard feat.

*Counts up* ...dammit! :smallannoyed:

Thanks for the critique though! :smallsmile:

Debihuman
2010-10-04, 03:19 PM
I've seen both that in official content and 1.5x startin HD = size increase. In my eyes the second one seemed to suit my critter better.

I was pointing out a good rule of thumb for making monsters easy to pug-and-play. Of course, you are free to do anything you want.



10?! Really? What exactly are you counting as "special abilities" here, then? I wouldn't call the skill bonuses or weaknesses special abilities, myself, for one.


You add the Special Attacks and Special Qualities for the total number of Special Abilities. You can discount Plant traits and the Vulnerability to Force but the rest are considerably powerful.

It's clear that you aren't really interested in constructive criticism and so I won't bother continuing. I do apologize for my typo on the creature's name.

Remember please that this is a contest. Better entries get more votes.

Debby

squeekenator
2010-10-04, 04:20 PM
Unless I missed a modifier, extra HP would be 130 instead of 148.

Average HP would be 238.

24 (HD) x 4.5 (half d8) + 24 (HD) x 5 (Con mod) + 10 (Improved Toughness) = 238

Improved Toughness gives 1 hp per hit dice.


Grapple would be 28.

18 (BAB) + 6 (Str mod) + 4 (Improved Grapple)

Ooops, forgot to add the improved grapple bonus in. Done.


Though I know you may have just been using it for a filler feat, improved natural attack is a dead feat since you can make their attack anything you want it to be. Is intended as a feat to give to creatures you improve by HD when you make them bigger and stronger.

I mainly took it because 1d8 is usually the cap for medium slam damage. Getting it higher than that requires some sort of justification, and I couldn't think of any reason for the thornshade to have exceptionally powerful slam attacks.


At the end just need to add, 'The save DC is Constitution-based.'

Done.


How about spells that see through magical darkness?

Nothing. True Seeing mentions in its description that the subject sees through all normal and magical darkness, so if that doesn't work then other spells that see through darkness won't either.


They're big bad sorcerers who crave power and were pursuers of magical power yet all their abilities could be that of a creature with an Int of 0. All it does is feed and has feats to help it feed. They have no magical abilities whatsoever despite their sorcerous background. Nor does anything they do seem to grant them power besides that of physical ability.

I was considering giving them spell-like abilities, but they do have two defining supernatural abilities to make them feel magical. I'm also a bit wary of giving them proper spellcasting, because they're supposed to act almost like vampires, stalking someone then dragging them into the shadows to feed off them. If they kept their full casting ability they would have no reason to fight like that, and would instead fly around the countryside flinging fireballs at everything. I suppose it couldn't hurt to give them a few nifty spells that help them to hunt, though. I'll do that now.


Why would any of them become one of these voluntarily? And as the making of one suggests, they don't do it voluntarily often, if ever, but if such is the case, who would bother? The thing can't be controlled by them, and it loses most of its most powerful abilities. Seems like a waste of magical potential.

Same reason you would cast Apocalypse from the Sky, even though it damages you and costs you an artifact. It may inconvenience you, but the immense and indiscriminate damage it does to everything else justifies that cost to some. They certainly aren't created often, but they aren't really meant to be common.

unosarta
2010-10-04, 04:43 PM
Bloodspitter has natural armor +12, which seems a little excessive. Is it armor plated or something? You should probably explain that in the fluff somewhere. I'm not entirely sure you need the Amphibious subtype since it doesn't have the Aquatic type. You could just say that they breathe both air and water. Where can I find information about the Plane of Orsa?

Debby

Oh, I think I was just trying to get it in line with what the MM says a normal creature of a certain CR's AC is supposed to be, but with Body of Slime, I suppose that isn't really necessary.

The Plane of Orsa is a plane created by VorpalTribble for the last PrC contest, I will link it in the entry.

Morph Bark
2010-10-04, 05:07 PM
It's clear that you aren't really interested in constructive criticism and so I won't bother continuing. I do apologize for my typo on the creature's name.

Remember please that this is a contest. Better entries get more votes.

Debby

Please don't misunderstand. I appreciate the critique and am fully aware of the nature of the competition, I was just rather shocked at the idea that 10 HD would be more appropriate for it. I haven't ever seen such rules-of-thumb before, so I just go by with what feels right. More abilities to me are just to make a monster more interesting and/or connect fluff with crunch.

I apologize if I came across as rude. When things are pointed out for my stuff I usually want to provide a reason for why I did something. :smallfrown:


EDIT: I increased the HD of the hollow haunter to 8 and modified saves, attack bonus, skills and Lore checks appropriately. Hope I didn't miss anything...

fangthane
2010-10-04, 05:35 PM
My contribution is in; please feel free to offer constructive criticism and error-checking if you like. I've done my best to make sure the latest batch of micro-adjustments got captured but I have a nasty tendency of missing things so I wouldn't be surprised if one or two numbers don't add up properly. Oh, and I make it a point of pride to make creatures which break 'standard' rules of D&D but which usually break them both for and against enough to fit anyhow. VT probably remembers that. Probably also remembers that I absolutely love a party hijack. ;)

Offhand, I'd offer the following notes:
Lore checks are inflated to 10+maxCR base because of its alien nature; however, it's such an oddity that any mention will have hit a bard's radar, so near-impossible BK checks can determine some aspects.
CR increases on advancement aren't consistent with 1/4 HD because frankly this beastie's threat isn't based on HD so much as it is on its sheer whupassitude and extras. Don't blame me for that, blame the BBC. :)
I didn't include skills and feats because it inherits, but it's not a template nor should it be; think of it as similar to Giger's Alien, which also inherits certain of its traits from the host. In fact, I sort of wonder whether Alien borrowed from Doctor Who but that's another story. ;)
CR levels were based around taking a fighter of same-level against a vanilla (no feats/skills) version, so it may still be a little nasty; CR is baseline for each size category.

As I say though, while I've tried to break things in such a way that the whole thing works, I may have missed some things so feel free to pick on me - I can take it. :)

SlaadLord
2010-10-04, 07:39 PM
My critter's up. Critiques and comments please?

The Glyphstone
2010-10-04, 08:04 PM
*hobbles in, waving his cane around*

Well, sonnies, has it really been fifty of these here competitions? I used to be quite the 'brewer back in my day, and I made some pretty kickin' moonshine in my spare time too. Figured I'd come out of retirement for this anniversary though, so take a look at the Graveroot (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9483333&postcount=11) and tell me what you think?

Debihuman
2010-10-04, 08:22 PM
Please don't misunderstand. I appreciate the critique and am fully aware of the nature of the competition, I was just rather shocked at the idea that 10 HD would be more appropriate for it. I haven't ever seen such rules-of-thumb before, so I just go by with what feels right. More abilities to me are just to make a monster more interesting and/or connect fluff with crunch.

I apologize if I came across as rude. When things are pointed out for my stuff I usually want to provide a reason for why I did something. :smallfrown:


EDIT: I increased the HD of the hollow haunter to 8 and modified saves, attack bonus, skills and Lore checks appropriately. Hope I didn't miss anything...

Apology accepted.

Normally, I'd be shocked at telling someone they need more HD! I'm usually telling people to tone things down. In your case, I think that the special abilities are warranted. However, to justify that level of power, you really do need a commensurate number of Hit Dice. I thought I had sufficiently explained that but apparently not. Note to Self: Miscommunication does go both ways. :smallwink:

Now that you've made the changes, it needs more feats. :smallbiggrin:

Good luck!

Debby

HalfTangible
2010-10-04, 08:34 PM
I had a Jackal Lantern halfway typed up.

Then i saw someone had done the exact same thing and called it a pumpkin king. But better. :smallsigh: Ah well. Something else might come up...

Must... think... of... something...

Debihuman
2010-10-04, 08:44 PM
Fangthane:

For Stage I Krynoid (Pod)

Speed should be 0 ft. (immobile)

You forgot size modifier to AC. [Small size adds +1 to Attack and AC and -4 to Grapple].

It gets 1 feat and needs skills. Plants gain "Skill points equal to (2 + Int modifier, minimum 1) per Hit Die, with quadruple skill points for the first Hit Die, if the plant creature has an Intelligence score. However, some plant creatures are mindless and gain no skill points or feats."

It gets 15 skill ranks to work with for 2 HD. [3x4=12 +3 = 15].

For Stage II Krynoid (Parasite/Adult):

Challenge Rating should be listed only for the creature at hand. You can list how advancing the creature changes things in a separate section below the creature.

Lore is 10 + creature's HD as I've been mentioning. Should start at 12 not 22.

Next up:


*hobbles in, waving his cane around*

Well, sonnies, has it really been fifty of these here competitions? I used to be quite the 'brewer back in my day, and I made some pretty kickin' moonshine in my spare time too. Figured I'd come out of retirement for this anniversary though, so take a look at the Graveroot (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9483333&postcount=11) and tell me what you think?

I think it looks pretty good as is. I don't see any overt errors in the statblock.

Debby

The Glyphstone
2010-10-04, 08:53 PM
*psst.* Edit posts instead of double-posting please? I'd feel guilty knocking someone with a Warning right after they gave me advice.

Debihuman
2010-10-04, 08:54 PM
My critter's up. Critiques and comments please?

Since it takes several seconds for a horrorvine to germinate, is there a way to stop it before it is completed? Can this be interrupted in any way?

Otherwise, it looks pretty good.

Debby

SlaadLord
2010-10-04, 10:40 PM
Added a vulnerability to the new growth. Thanks otherwise.

The Glyphstone: Looks good, a very sinister creature...slam attack might be a bit powerful, but otherwise...

The Glyphstone
2010-10-04, 10:53 PM
Added a vulnerability to the new growth. Thanks otherwise.

The Glyphstone: Looks good, a very sinister creature...slam attack might be a bit powerful, but otherwise...

If it's too much, I can always take out Imp. Natural Attack and drop it to 1d8+5 instead. It's only a difference of about 4 damage/round on average though, from 12 down to 9.

Debihuman
2010-10-04, 11:57 PM
*psst.* Edit posts instead of double-posting please? I'd feel guilty knocking someone with a Warning right after they gave me advice.

Oops, I've fixed it. Didn't even realize that I'd double posted since I was going back and using the quote feature. I'll watch that in the future.

Now, have I gotten to everyone's creature or is there one I missed? If I haven't gotten to it and it's complete, let me know. I generally wait until the creatures are complete before going over them.

Debby

Morph Bark
2010-10-05, 01:55 AM
Apology accepted.

Normally, I'd be shocked at telling someone they need more HD! I'm usually telling people to tone things down. In your case, I think that the special abilities are warranted. However, to justify that level of power, you really do need a commensurate number of Hit Dice. I thought I had sufficiently explained that but apparently not. Note to Self: Miscommunication does go both ways. :smallwink:

Now that you've made the changes, it needs more feats. :smallbiggrin:

Good luck!

Debby

Hah, thanks for the notice. Knew I had forgotten something! But that is always easier than to actually know what you forgot (then again, if you did, you wouldn't have forgotten it). I added the appropriate amount of feats and made Improved Grapple into a bonus feat since it otherwise would require Improved Unarmed Strike - and I don't see how a non-humanoid-or-giant creature could have that.


I also added to Knotting and Vine web on the vines' AC and hp, for a measure on how to take care of those abilities (at least for the while being: until the hollow haunter uses repossession).

Vorpal Tribble, if it isn't too much of a hassle for you, would you mind also reviewing my hollow haunter for me? It'd be much appreciated.


EDIT: Saw I had left in the "vine whip" ability in the special attacks listing on the statblock even though I had taken it out at the last moment before posting. It is now removed.

SlaadLord
2010-10-05, 07:50 AM
The Glyphstone: I think that would be good. Improved Natural Attack is really more for advancing monsters anyway. Perhaps Power Attack? Oh, and your Initiative Modifier should be +8 (+4 Dex, +4 Imp. Initiative.)

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-10-05, 09:38 AM
Vorpal Tribble, if it isn't too much of a hassle for you, would you mind also reviewing my hollow haunter for me? It'd be much appreciated.


Initiative:
+2


Attack: Vine +7 melee (1d3+1)
Full Attack: Four vines +7 melee (1d3+1)
+8 melee
(BAB 6 + Size mod +1 + Str mod +1)


Ingesting 1 lbs of a dead hollow haunter's plant forces a Fortitude save (DC 10 + half the hollow haunter's HD + hollow haunter's Charisma modifier).
Not Constitution modifier? I know it doesn't have one, but saying it gets a +4 bonus or so would help it out. Just not sure Charisma really comes into it, the effect being a physical property of the plant.


Grip of death: The hollow haunter’s ghostly essence gives an unearthly strength to its vines. It has a +4 bonus on grapple checks.
I'd add to that: This stacks with the bonus granted by Improved Grapple.


The creature must make a successful Strength of Escape Artist check with the DC set by the hollow haunter’s Use Rope check to break free.
Strength or Escape Artist


Repossession (Su): As a move action, a hollow haunter may exit their current body and enter another viable one within 15 feet. They may only enter plant bodies appropriate for their size and they keep the amount of damage they had already taken.
What defines 'viable'? Have some more questions once I know that.


All in all this is a really cool, if somewhat situational creature. Knotting and Vine web get my thumb's up for pretty unique abilities, and Vulnerability to Force isn't very often seen either.

The Glyphstone
2010-10-05, 09:46 AM
The Glyphstone: I think that would be good. Improved Natural Attack is really more for advancing monsters anyway. Perhaps Power Attack? Oh, and your Initiative Modifier should be +8 (+4 Dex, +4 Imp. Initiative.)

Maybe, though that doesn't really fit its combat tactics - if it's in a straight-up fight, it's doing something wrong...a graveroot's attack bonus is too low to afford taking any penalties, since it's not aiming to do damage with its slam so much as use it to get people into a grapple. I'll give it Toughness instead.

PersonMan
2010-10-05, 10:02 AM
It's 10 + HD for Knowledge (See online SRD here: http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/knowledge.htm)

[SRD quote]

Debby

I'm back with my books, so I'll quote the relevant stuff.


Monster Manual V offers a table of lore with each monster's entry. ... The baseline DC to identify a monster and remember one bit of information about its special abilities or vulnerabilities is equal to 10 + the monster's CR. (This is a change from the description of the Knowledge skill, PH 78.)


Glyphstone, I'd give it Improved Toughness, it'll help more.

fangthane
2010-10-05, 11:33 AM
Fangthane:

For Stage I Krynoid (Pod)

Speed should be 0 ft. (immobile)

You forgot size modifier to AC. [Small size adds +1 to Attack and AC and -4 to Grapple].

Ahh, thanks. My attention to detail in some regards is a bit less than perfect, and I'd initially had it as medium but scaled it back a bit. :)



It gets 1 feat and needs skills. Plants gain "Skill points equal to (2 + Int modifier, minimum 1) per Hit Die, with quadruple skill points for the first Hit Die, if the plant creature has an Intelligence score. However, some plant creatures are mindless and gain no skill points or feats."

It gets 15 skill ranks to work with for 2 HD. [3x4=12 +3 = 15].

Hehe I was hoping to avoid this entirely because the thing's a spore pod, basically built to be a curiosity that sprouts and eats the neighborhood, but I suppose I can work on some proper skills :)


For Stage II Krynoid (Parasite/Adult):

Challenge Rating should be listed only for the creature at hand. You can list how advancing the creature changes things in a separate section below the creature.

Lore is 10 + creature's HD as I've been mentioning. Should start at 12 not 22.

I wasn't precisely sure how to get the CRs in there, will have to do some adjustment though - and I've actually come up with something which might work better for the Lore. Should have an update later, and thanks very much for the comments. :)

The Glyphstone
2010-10-05, 11:44 AM
Glyphstone, I'd give it Improved Toughness, it'll help more.

I was going to at first, but that'd be non-SRD material. I guess it's not that difficult of a chore to vaguely detail what the feat does though.


Hehe I was hoping to avoid this entirely because the thing's a spore pod, basically built to be a curiosity that sprouts and eats the neighborhood, but I suppose I can work on some proper skills :)

Just give it ranks in Hide, if it's trying to be innocuous and inconspicuous.

Morph Bark
2010-10-05, 11:58 AM
+2


+8 melee
(BAB 6 + Size mod +1 + Str mod +1)


Not Constitution modifier? I know it doesn't have one, but saying it gets a +4 bonus or so would help it out. Just not sure Charisma really comes into it, the effect being a physical property of the plant.


I'd add to that: This stacks with the bonus granted by Improved Grapple.


Strength or Escape Artist


What defines 'viable'? Have some more questions once I know that.


All in all this is a really cool, if somewhat situational creature. Knotting and Vine web get my thumb's up for pretty unique abilities, and Vulnerability to Force isn't very often seen either.

Forgot the size modifier on the attack, thanks for catching that.

The "Strength of Escape Artist" was a d'oh moment, since "of" means "or" in my native tongue.

A viable body would be the kind of plant the hollow haunter belongs to. Like the pumpkin (or other quashes) example given in the fluff text. I'm not sure how to word that better... in an awkward and unique case like this, my capability for wording things right takes a confusing turn.

If you have more questions, I'd be glad to answer them.


EDIT: Forgot to comment on the Con/Cha thing... I thought Cha might work better since it is due to the ghostly essence part that it gets that effect. I'll specify that in the ability.

Debihuman
2010-10-05, 02:43 PM
Bloodsplitter -- I just noticed that the attack lines seem off. Are both attacks primary attacks? If not, you only list the creature's primary attack in the Attack line. Normally, secondary attacks remain secondary even if they are used as primary attack. Because the creature has 2 attacks it doesn't get 1+1/2 Str damage.

Debby

SlaadLord
2010-10-05, 02:52 PM
Vorpal, would you terribly mind giving me a public review?

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-10-05, 03:06 PM
Vorpal, would you terribly mind giving me a public review?


Frightful Presence (Ex): Whenever a Llwynof moves, attacks or uses its Germinate ability, all creatures within 30 feet with less than 6 Hit Dice that witness the event must succeed on a Will Save (DC 16) or become shaken for 5d6 rounds. A creature that succeeds on the saving throw is immune to that same horrorvine's frightful presence for 24 hours.
Just need to add: The save DC is Charisma-based with +2 bonus from Ability Focus.


Emotive Subversion (Su): Whenever a morale effect meant to provide a morale bonus is used within 150 feet of a living Llwynof, it instead applies a morale penalty unless the user succeeds at a Charisma check (DC 14).
As above, minus +2 bonus bit.


Very, very interesting creature. The abilities are great and will truly mess with a group who think 'ah ha, I will cast against the fear!'. Gehenna should be crawling with jungles of fiendish version that have to be cut back as they invade on cities and prisons and such. Can also imagine some dictator keeping one in a pot to see how it reacts and thus how much he is intimidating his opponents.

I might just use these in a game of mine if you don't mind...

fangthane
2010-10-05, 03:29 PM
I just took a look and I agree with Tribble as far as emotive subversion being an absolute gem of a trait. Hose the clerics a bit without really affecting bards much at all. :)

And here I thought I had a pretty nifty plant specced out. :smallbiggrin:

The Glyphstone
2010-10-05, 04:21 PM
I guess since it has to be requested, your thoughts on my submission VT?

unosarta
2010-10-05, 04:26 PM
Bloodsplitter -- I just noticed that the attack lines seem off. Are both attacks primary attacks? If not, you only list the creature's primary attack in the Attack line. Normally, secondary attacks remain secondary even if they are used as primary attack. Because the creature has 2 attacks it doesn't get 1+1/2 Str damage.

Debby

No, only the bite is. Really? Huh, I never knew that. :smallbiggrin:
I will change it.

SlaadLord
2010-10-05, 06:10 PM
I might just use these in a game of mine if you don't mind...

I'd be honored. Other changes made.

The Vorpal Tribble
2010-10-05, 07:38 PM
I guess since it has to be requested, your thoughts on my submission VT?

Suggestions:


Hit Dice: 9d8+45 (81 HP)
4.5 x 9 + 45 = 85 HP


Base Attack/Grapple: +6/+19
Grapple would be 15 unless I missed another modifier somewhere:
BAB 6 + Str mod 5 + Tendril hooks 4 = 15


Attack: Slam +12 melee (1d8+5)
Full Attack: Slam +12 melee (1d8+5)
(1d8+7)
Since it only has a single attack, its slam deals 1 1/2 str mod.


Special Attacks: Improved Grab, Constrict, Tendril Hooks, Drag Beneath
Special Qualities: Plant Traits, Tremorsense 100ft. Immunities, earth glide
Nitpick, but alphabetically is standard.


Environment: Temperate
Environment: Any temperate land


Creatures aboveground may attempt to start digging the buried creature free. Eight total full-round actions from Medium creatures can partly expose the graveroot and its victim, enough that line of effect is granted to both, though the graveroot has improved cover from any attackers other than its victim.
This I'm wondering about, with earth glide it can disappear for a thousand feet if it wants. What keeps it so near the surface?


Aside from that, it's certainly a deadly enough creature, though it seems a pretty one trick pony. Assuming they survive the first round, its pretty unlikely either will be able to harm the other. It'll hide underground, and if it comes back out pretty much any 8th leveler will take it out.

It's sort of like a ghost, but can pull you into the wall. Once you know its waiting in the wall, you can take precautions.

I'm thinking either lower the HD and CR, or give it something to spice it up.

The Glyphstone
2010-10-05, 08:36 PM
Suggestions:



4.5 x 9 + 45 = 85 HP

Werps.



Grapple would be 15 unless I missed another modifier somewhere:
BAB 6 + Str mod 5 + Tendril hooks 4 = 15
It had the Improved Grapple feat at one point, I must have deleted it. I'll crank up the Tendril Hooks bonus to +8 then, since it's intended grapple mod is to be matched against lvl8 characters.



(1d8+7)
Since it only has a single attack, its slam deals 1 1/2 str mod.
Werps werps.



Nitpick, but alphabetically is standard.


Environment: Any temperate land
Noted.



This I'm wondering about, with earth glide it can disappear for a thousand feet if it wants. What keeps it so near the surface?
Mainly, because if it could move while dragging, the ability would be instant death for whoever got grappled. I was thinking a justification that it temporarily loses Earth Glide while 'granting' it to another creature, but I don't know how far that'd fly.



Aside from that, it's certainly a deadly enough creature, though it seems a pretty one trick pony. Assuming they survive the first round, its pretty unlikely either will be able to harm the other. It'll hide underground, and if it comes back out pretty much any 8th leveler will take it out.

It's sort of like a ghost, but can pull you into the wall. Once you know its waiting in the wall, you can take precautions.

I'm thinking either lower the HD and CR, or give it something to spice it up.
Well, it's really hard to actually attack because of being underground, and note that it can strike at people while still buried and drag them underneath. Any 8th leveler can kill it if they manage to catch it aboveground and prevent it from retreating, but until they do manage to figure out a way to uproot it, it can just keep constantly harrassing them from 5ft. underground with its total cover until it gets a meal, gets bored, or their readied actions do enough damage to drive it away.