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zenanarchist
2010-07-13, 01:43 AM
Me again!

Due to new class design when my mobile weapons platform didn't work without cheese, I'm looking for big charisma races.

What are some of the most slippery tongued scoundrels (or saints) that you know of.

No cheese. No odd obscure combinations. Try and make it as precise as possible.

Thanks again guys!

Defiant
2010-07-13, 01:44 AM
http://www.crystalkeep.com/d20/rules/DnD3.5Index-Races.pdf

zenanarchist
2010-07-13, 01:46 AM
Jeez defiant. Really?|

Actual work and searching? :smallwink: Nah, thanks mate. Had a browse but am wondering if it's missing anything that might not be in there.

Defiant
2010-07-13, 01:48 AM
Page 51 has a nice summary, whatever stat you're looking for.

AFAIK that's 3.5 races, although some might be missing. It doesn't include 3.0 races, some of which might still be legal.

Regardless, that's my contribution.

Superglucose
2010-07-13, 01:50 AM
Lesser Gloaming, Lesser Asimar, Asimar.

HunterOfJello
2010-07-13, 01:51 AM
Spellscales from Races of the Dragon get a bonus to Charisma. I think they're the only official LA +0 race with a charisma bonus.

Many people take the Magic-Blooded template which gives -2 Wis, +2 Cha to boost their constitution score. It fits well with the sorcerer archetype. You can find the template in the d20 index's (http://www.crystalkeep.com/d20/rules3.0.php) 3e template pdf.

Having the intelligence and skill points from a class with bluff, diplomacy and intimidate as class skills can often be more effective than having a high charisma score after low levels.



If you're looking for the ultimate slippery tounged scoundrel, then check out the Changeling Rogue racial substitution level. If you take Changeling Rogue 1/Factotum or Swordsage, you could make a very useful skillmonkey character with amazing social skills.

zenanarchist
2010-07-13, 01:53 AM
Page 51 has a nice summary, whatever stat you're looking for.

AFAIK that's 3.5 races, although some might be missing. It doesn't include 3.0 races, some of which might still be legal.

Regardless, that's my contribution.

Nah that's awesome. Looking at that manual though there's really not that much that gives Cha bonus is there?

zenanarchist
2010-07-13, 01:54 AM
Spellscales from Races of the Dragon get a bonus to Charisma. I think they're the only official LA +0 race with a charisma bonus.

Many people take the Magic-Blooded template which gives -2 Wis, +2 Cha to boost their constitution score. It fits well with the sorcerer archetype. You can find the template in the d20 index's (http://www.crystalkeep.com/d20/rules3.0.php) 3e template pdf.

Having the intelligence and skill points from a class with bluff, diplomacy and intimidate as class skills can often be more effective than having a high charisma score after low levels.



If you're looking for the ultimate slippery tounged scoundrel, then check out the Changeling Rogue racial substitution level. If you take Changeling Rogue 1/Factotum or Swordsage, you could make a very useful skillmonkey character with amazing social skills.

I'm actually looking for a race that will make my current homebrew (Noise Marine) one hundred percent viable and powerful. Everything they do is based off Cha.

EDIT: Is there a +0 LA template that also grants Cha?

I wouldn't mind +3 to Charisma plus a skilled up diplomat on top of the noise powers.

Beorn080
2010-07-13, 02:10 AM
Death Touched get +4 cha and a bunch of other nice things for LA +1.

Gnome of Chaos. +2 dex con and cha, and a host of interesting things, including 1/day reroll, for +1 LA.

Vulaas
2010-07-13, 02:11 AM
Hellbred (Spirit Aspect) gets +2 charisma for a base race as well. Also has some fun abilities.

NelKor
2010-07-13, 02:30 AM
Dragonwrough Kobolds get +3 Char.

Escheton
2010-07-13, 02:33 AM
Dromite, +3 nat armor, cha bonus, natural psionic. Energy resist 5. +1LA
Can be found in CPsi.

And there is an elf for everything. Think cha is moon-elf or star-elf

Thrice Dead Cat
2010-07-13, 02:55 AM
EDIT: Is there a +0 LA template that also

Primordial Giant!

Yeah, probably less than useful, but it's +4 Cha with no LA in and of itself.

Murdim
2010-07-13, 03:19 AM
And there is an elf for everything. Think cha is moon-elf or star-elf

That's the star elves, from Forgotten realms. +0 LA, -2 Con, +2 Cha, extraplanar spectral weapons and armors, no weapon proficiencies. Probably one of the Sue-ish-est subrace in a setting that loves to Sue its countless elven subraces up to levels that would make Ebony Dark'ness Dementia Raven Way (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/FanFic/MyImmortal) cringe.

Moon elves are the FR counterparts to standard D&D high elves. Except taller. (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/OurElvesAreBetter) Yeah. (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SoYeah)

UnChosenOne
2010-07-13, 03:25 AM
Gruuwar: +2 Dex, +2 Cha, -2 Str, -2 Wis. Dragon #317, p. 26.
Changeling: +2 Dex, +2 Cha, -2 Str, -2 Con. Dragon #304, p. 59.
Complacent Human: +2 to any ability score in other hand it loses bonus feat and extra skill points. Dragon #320, p. 88.

Fortuna
2010-07-13, 03:31 AM
That's the star elves, from Forgotten realms. +0 LA, -2 Con, +2 Cha, extraplanar spectral weapons and armors, no weapon proficiencies. Probably one of the Sue-ish-est subrace in a setting that loves to Sue its countless elven subraces up to levels that would make Ebony Dark'ness Dementia Raven Way (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/FanFic/MyImmortal) cringe.

Moon elves are the FR counterparts to standard D&D high elves. Except taller. (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/OurElvesAreBetter) Yeah. (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SoYeah)

I wonder whether linking to TVtropes is close enough to talking in the theatre to warrant the special hell?

Thrice Dead Cat
2010-07-13, 03:36 AM
I wonder whether linking to TVtropes is close enough to talking in the theatre to warrant the special hell?

Hey, it's text here (and there). You may lose five hours, but all the action is still here!

zenanarchist
2010-07-13, 04:16 AM
Hmmmm changeling appeals actually. Quite a lot!

Is it listed anywhere other than DMagazine?

Tshern
2010-07-13, 04:23 AM
Hmmmm changeling appeals actually. Quite a lot!

Is it listed anywhere other than DMagazine?
Eberron and in one of the Monster Manuals. Bear in mind though, that the Magazine version is very, very different from the standard.

zenanarchist
2010-07-13, 04:24 AM
Eberron and in one of the Monster Manuals. Bear in mind though, that the Magazine version is very, very different from the standard.

Is this due to our friend the wizard being "efficient"? lol

HunterOfJello
2010-07-13, 04:57 AM
EDIT: Is there a +0 LA template that also grants Cha?


The Magic-Blooded Template is LA +0 and gives -2 Wis, +2 Cha, along with several spell-like abilities. Check my first post for more info.

Murdim
2010-07-13, 05:49 AM
I wonder whether linking to TVtropes is close enough to talking in the theatre to warrant the special hell?
Some people (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/HateDumb) always say (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ptitlexxpmjrh25rbg) TvTropes will ruin your life. (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TVTropesWillRuinYourLife) YMMV. (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/YourMileageMayVary)

Swooper
2010-07-13, 05:54 AM
Iirc the Fire Souled template is only LA +1 (might be +2 though), and gives a cha boost as well as Leadership for free. It's in the Crystal Keep template pdf.

zenanarchist
2010-07-13, 11:26 PM
Iirc the Fire Souled template is only LA +1 (might be +2 though), and gives a cha boost as well as Leadership for free. It's in the Crystal Keep template pdf.

Leadership is cheddar. It won't be allowed. Especially with a mage. Bit sad but...hrm.

Thrallherd could make it interesting.

2xMachina
2010-07-14, 05:05 AM
Leadership is cheddar, but Thrallherd is interesting? :smallconfused:

Math_Mage
2010-07-14, 05:10 AM
Leadership is cheddar, but Thrallherd is interesting? :smallconfused:

QFT. Sort of a "Nightsticks are broken, but Candles are interesting" disconnect there.

IdleMuse
2010-07-14, 01:09 PM
Seriously, Fire-Souled is worth asking your DM about even if you remove Leadership with no replacement. A Fire-Souled Lesser Aasimar is a +6 cha race with only LA+1.

Tinydwarfman
2010-07-14, 03:57 PM
What is a Gloaming? And what book?

Found it, but it's +2 LA, so doesn't lesser not work on it?

PId6
2010-07-14, 04:52 PM
Fire-Souled is actually a +3 template; the Crystalkeep index is wrong.

Draconic is a better template if you want +2 Cha for LA +1.

dgnslyr
2010-07-14, 05:19 PM
Magic-Blooded template is worth +2 Cha, -2 Wis, no LA, with low-light vision and a handful of spell-like abilities. It's somewhere in here. (http://www.crystalkeep.com/d20/rules/DnD3.0Index-Templates.pdf)

faceroll
2010-07-14, 06:14 PM
An old age (rules in the DMG or PHB) Draconic (races of the dragon template) Magic-Touched (3.0 dragon magazine) Lesser Aasimar (back of 3.5 PGtF) gets -1str, -1con, -3 dex, +2 int, +0 wis, +8 cha for only +1LA.

dspeyer
2010-07-14, 09:20 PM
There's also merfolk.

This is the sort of question I wrote the monster finder in my sig for.

Scarey Nerd
2010-07-15, 10:24 AM
Derro Derro Derro!!!
+4 Dex, +2 Con, +6 Cha, -6 Wis, all for a lovely LA+0.

Well, there are 3 HD that come with it, and you have to be insane...

IdleMuse
2010-07-15, 11:49 AM
Fire-Souled is actually a +3 template; the Crystalkeep index is wrong.

Draconic is a better template if you want +2 Cha for LA +1.

Thanks for making this known. Otherwise I'd likely never have checked the original issue!

senrath
2010-07-15, 11:54 AM
Thanks for making this known. Otherwise I'd likely never have checked the original issue!

Yeah, never use anything from Crystalkeep without first double checking it against the book/magazine/whatever it originally came from. There are quite a few typos.

2xMachina
2010-07-15, 11:57 AM
Dragon Mag is harder to get access to though. But then again, DM's probably don't take Dragon Mag stuff without evaluating first.

Zovc
2010-07-15, 01:58 PM
Hellbred (Spirit Aspect) gets +2 charisma for a base race as well. Also has some fun abilities.

Aren't they able to punt puppies for great justice and not falter in the alignment department?

senrath
2010-07-15, 02:02 PM
Aren't they able to punt puppies for great justice and not falter in the alignment department?

Eh, sort of. An Evil act is still an Evil act, but they can use Evil equipment and cast Evil spells even if they wouldn't otherwise. The example they gave, if I'm remembering correctly is that a Hellbred Paladin can wield an Unholy Longsword without problem, and can use it to fight evil. But he'll still fall if he uses it to slaughter innocents.

Andion Isurand
2010-07-15, 03:09 PM
"Lesser" Half-Giant -- Complete Psionic pg. 148
with the Spark (Magic-blooded) template -- Dragon Magazine 306, pg. 65
and the Primordial Giant template -- Secrets of Xendrik, pg. 81


LA +0
-4 str, -2 dex, +4 int, -2 wis, +6 cha
two favored classes of warlock and sorcerer
...among other traits

Devils_Advocate
2010-07-16, 05:10 PM
Derro Derro Derro!!!
+4 Dex, +2 Con, +6 Cha, -6 Wis, all for a lovely LA+0.

Well, there are 3 HD that come with it, and you have to be insane...
:smallconfused: Insane derro are LA -, not LA +0. As in, not available as a choice of race for a player character. And sane derro are LA +2 and don't have racial adjustments to Charisma nor Wisdom.

zenanarchist
2010-07-22, 06:56 PM
"Lesser" Half-Giant -- Complete Psionic pg. 148
with the Spark (Magic-blooded) template -- Dragon Magazine 306, pg. 65
and the Primordial Giant template -- Secrets of Xendrik, pg. 81


LA +0
-4 str, -2 dex, +4 int, -2 wis, +6 cha
two favored classes of warlock and sorcerer
...among other traits

Nice! Very nice actually. Not too cheesy I take it? Allowable?

Andion Isurand
2010-07-22, 07:29 PM
The rules in the Complete Psionic lacks decisive wording either way... although many other "lesser" races can be found on the net and in the books.

Lesser Half-Giants without the 2 templates in this case would get...

-2 Dex, +2 con
giant type
medium size
30ft speed
low-light vision
+2 on saves vs fire effects, magical and mundane
favored class: psychic warrior

...which is a little underwhelming as a +0 LA race before the templates which is probably for the best

Fluff: without the powerful build, I'd assume you wouldn't be quite as tall or large as a regular half-giant...

///////////////////

as far as the listed templates go, can't say either way how the average DM would rate them as cheese