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View Full Version : Magic Item Creation, scrolls and artificers



jseah
2010-09-20, 06:50 AM
from d20srd.org:

These prerequisites must be met for the item to be created. Most of the time, they take the form of spells that must be known by the itemís creator (although access through another magic item or spellcaster is allowed).

Since you are allowed to access the spell from another spellcaster, can you access them from an artificer?

I'm thinking about a setup like this:
Archivist with scribe scroll feat scribes a scroll of a spell he doesn't know, with the party artificer providing access to the spell.
Since the archivist is the one scribing the scroll, the spell is divine and can be then transferred to his prayer book.

This could then be used to bypass all inaccessible scrolls problems. Of course it costs small amounts of xp but that's surely worth the price.

Tyger
2010-09-20, 08:14 AM
from d20srd.org:


Since you are allowed to access the spell from another spellcaster, can you access them from an artificer?

I'm thinking about a setup like this:
Archivist with scribe scroll feat scribes a scroll of a spell he doesn't know, with the party artificer providing access to the spell.
Since the archivist is the one scribing the scroll, the spell is divine and can be then transferred to his prayer book.

This could then be used to bypass all inaccessible scrolls problems. Of course it costs small amounts of xp but that's surely worth the price.

Doesn't work quite like that. The Artificer can't provide the spell, as he doesn't know it. He can "fake it" to make a scroll of the spell, but that spell is neither divine nor arcane.

Now, if you can craft using a scroll for the spell source (not sure if you can do that, but I seem to recall you can), then the Archivist could work with the Artificer, to use that scroll and the Archivist's Scribe Scroll feat to make a Archivist scroll... what form that scroll would take is DM fiat I think.

mucat
2010-09-20, 09:25 AM
The entire point of making Artificer scrolls "neither arcane nor divine" was so that an artificer could not churn out scrolls for a wizard (or archivist) to fill up their spell book with.

To say "Well, if you read the rules just right, they still can" might be an argument for clarifying the rule against it; it's not an argument for actually letting them do this in a game.

I mean, if the DM wants to let Artificers qualify as walking spell libraries, she can, just by saying "Hey, in this campaign, you can scribe artificer scrolls into a spell/prayer book." But if a player tried to say this had to be allowed because the rule against it isn't watertight enough, that player would deserve the subsequent dice pummeling. :smallbiggrin:

Tyger
2010-09-20, 09:42 AM
The entire point of making Artificer scrolls "neither arcane nor divine" was so that an artificer could not churn out scrolls for a wizard (or archivist) to fill up their spell book with.

To say "Well, if you read the rules just right, they still can" might be an argument for clarifying the rule against it; it's not an argument for actually letting them do this in a game.

I mean, if the DM wants to let Artificers qualify as walking spell libraries, she can, just by saying "Hey, in this campaign, you can scribe artificer scrolls into a spell/prayer book." But if a player tried to say this had to be allowed because the rule against it isn't watertight enough, that player would deserve the subsequent dice pummeling. :smallbiggrin:

Couldn't agree more. Was just noting that, by RAW, it might actually work the way jseah was thinking. With the additional step in there.

My players trying this would soon be dodging dice too. :)

Kelb_Panthera
2010-09-20, 03:07 PM
I suppose, technically, a crafter could use eg: a scroll of fireball as the source of a fireball spell, to make a scroll of fireball. Using this to change an arcane scroll into a divine one, or an artificer scroll into either one is probably going to get you smacked with a DMG though. At least on a knee-jerk reaction. Since it still costs the crafter xp I don't see a problem. The only potential abuse I see is the archivist. After all, just because you have an arcane scroll of divine power, doesn't put divine power on the wizard/sorc, duskblade, dread necromancer, wu jen, or any other arcane spellcaster's list. In fact, I'm pretty sure a skill check would be needed just to activate such a scroll if the spell isn't on your list. It might even be impossible.