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McClintock
2010-09-24, 10:25 AM
Are there rules for this somewhere?

Emmerask
2010-09-24, 10:30 AM
http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Urban_Adventures#Buying_Buildings

though the prices can still deviate very much from this depending on very many other factors so the dm has the final say :smallwink:

Kaww
2010-09-24, 10:32 AM
Not that I know.

You ask your DM what's the price, he names it, you pay or you don't.

My players bought an abandoned diamond mine. The price was a small fortune to gain a bigger one. I had a base price, and then they haggled and negotiated with the owner (rollplay, appraise and diplomacy) and payed marginally less (good rollplay, bad rolls...).

Shademan
2010-09-24, 11:05 AM
http://dungeons.wikia.com/wiki/Dungeonomicon_%283.5e_Sourcebook%29/Economicon
this article mentions it

Emperor Tippy
2010-09-24, 11:20 AM
The DMG contains some, the Stronghold Builders Guide contains a ton more.

Most of the time you are better off just killing someone and taking their house. It's far cheaper and easier.

Person_Man
2010-09-24, 11:27 AM
I allow PCs to have homes/families/whatever at level 1 for free, with the understanding that they're not going to sell it or rent it out. After all, before becoming adventurers they had to grow up and have a job somewhere. As they gain status/notoriety/fame I'll give out larger and more reputable houses/mansions/keeps/etc. For example, after clearing out an ancient castle, they can keep the castle, and take Leadership to staff it if they want to. Again, the understanding is that it's not property they can buy and sell (after all, their Feudal Lord wouldn't like that), but an in game achievement.

Shenanigans
2010-09-24, 11:33 AM
The DMG contains some, the Stronghold Builders Guide contains a ton more.

Most of the time you are better off just killing someone and taking their house. It's far cheaper and easier.+1

Yeah, the DMG has a table with basic prices for standard buildings, but the SBG is a great book and allows you to be very detailed (if that's what you're looking for.)

Duke of URL
2010-09-24, 11:41 AM
As this subject is near and dear to a game I'm about to start, any idea of getting a good feel on what can actually be accomplished per half hour with a lyre of building?

I'm playing a "benevolent" (okay, evil, but actually trying to help out... just... for his own purposes) emissary from the gods to help rescue folks out of the dark ages (and in turn, return enough faith to the gods to restore their influence). I was thinking of getting the lyre to help build cities, forts. garrisons, etc., as part of a rapid civilization-building and empire expansion strategy. But aside from the description of


Once a week its strings can be strummed so as to produce chords that magically construct buildings, mines, tunnels, ditches, or whatever. The effect produced in but 30 minutes of playing is equal to the work of 100 humans laboring for three days.

there doesn't seem to be any indication as to what this would actually produce. I figure playing an 8-hour day (no problem with the Perform checks) gets 2,400 person days of labor. I just have no idea what 2,400 person days will actually produce.

Emperor Tippy
2010-09-24, 11:52 AM
Step 1: Find the cost of what you want to build. 500,000 GP for a castle per the DMG
Step 2: Taking 10 on Craft gives you 5 GP per week, or .714 GP per day.
Step 3: Multiple .714 by 2,400 (1,714.286 GP)
Step 4: Divide 500,000 GP by 1,714.286 GP (291.7)

So it takes you 292 uses of a lyre of building to make a castle, or 3 for a grand house.

EDIT: You are better off using tricks to play all day straight (and potentially all week). PAO to a warforged and you will either get a 2 day or 1 week duration factor. If you get 1 week then you can reuse the lyre as soon as you finish and effectively be using it continuously.

Shenanigans
2010-09-24, 11:56 AM
As this subject is near and dear to a game I'm about to start, any idea of getting a good feel on what can actually be accomplished per half hour with a lyre of building?

I'm playing a "benevolent" (okay, evil, but actually trying to help out... just... for his own purposes) emissary from the gods to help rescue folks out of the dark ages (and in turn, return enough faith to the gods to restore their influence). I was thinking of getting the lyre to help build cities, forts. garrisons, etc., as part of a rapid civilization-building and empire expansion strategy. But aside from the description of



there doesn't seem to be any indication as to what this would actually produce. I figure playing an 8-hour day (no problem with the Perform checks) gets 2,400 person days of labor. I just have no idea what 2,400 person days will actually produce.
The SBG has rules on how a lyre of building will help you in building.

Duke of URL
2010-09-24, 12:05 PM
The SBG has rules on how a lyre of building will help you in building.

So it does. I'll be looking in here a fair bit, then, at least to come up with reasonable estimates. Now, as to how the "economy" works to produce the raw materials, well, that will be an entirely separate issue...

Shenanigans
2010-09-24, 12:36 PM
So it does. I'll be looking in here a fair bit, then, at least to come up with reasonable estimates. Now, as to how the "economy" works to produce the raw materials, well, that will be an entirely separate issue...Yeah, the DM necessarily has to have a lot of input, because each and every one of those little modifiers is important to keep track of. (I wasn't sure from your post whether you're a player or DM in the situation you mentioned.)

One thing to definitely keep in mind is that there is nothing better to cut costs on your buildings than a mid to high level wizard or druid. When we built strongholds in our main campaign, our wizard and druid were kept busy for several months. :)

Duke of URL
2010-09-24, 12:46 PM
Yeah, the DM necessarily has to have a lot of input, because each and every one of those little modifiers is important to keep track of. (I wasn't sure from your post whether you're a player or DM in the situation you mentioned.)

One thing to definitely keep in mind is that there is nothing better to cut costs on your buildings than a mid to high level wizard or druid. When we built strongholds in our main campaign, our wizard and druid were kept busy for several months. :)

Player, at 10th level with 10th-level Sorcerer spellcasting (it's gestalt, so I've got divine on the other side from Ur-Priest, but only 1st level spells to start... it'll catch up fairly quickly, of course). Basically, I just want to use the lyre to build a city, building by building if I must, and eventually use it in expansion to build forts/garrisons, tunneling, and rebuilding any conquered cities, if it comes to that. Obviously, the lyre can be used defensively as well, but only in a limited manner.

A large part of the game objective is "town building" (while leading the population down the road to the desired religion), so spending a lot of time and resources there is kind of the point.

Emperor Tippy
2010-09-24, 12:54 PM
Too bad you aren't a wizard. If you were you could get a trap of Mage's Lubrication and learn Wall of Stone.

With that combination you can build an entire city in a day or two.

Duke of URL
2010-09-24, 01:02 PM
Too bad you aren't a wizard. If you were you could get a trap of Mage's Lubrication and learn Wall of Stone.

With that combination you can build an entire city in a day or two.

Yeah, well the base race is Rakshasa, so I'm committed to Sorcerer with the RHD stacking. I'm thinking of picking up a Runestaff with fabricate to help churn out basic weapons/armor at a decent rate, adding wall of stone to it wouldn't be too expensive. But that might be overkill if lyre of building will just do it just as well or better.

The lyre is certainly more versatile because it can be used for mines and tunnels as well; the drawback is it's only once per week for as long as I can keep a performance reasonably going, whereas wall of stone via runestaff works anytime I have spell slots available (and I have 5 5th-level slots per day to work with).

Alternatively, wait a few levels until I can cast wall of stone on the divine side, and make do with the lyre until then.