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View Full Version : We reject physics in the name of AWESOME! (ToB Discipline, repost, 3.5, WIP)



The-Mage-King
2010-09-27, 07:14 PM
Yep. It's back, and far closer to completion. Just give me a minute to set up the page...



Hero's Edge: A Brief History

Once... Great monster roamed the lands, gleefully slaughtering the hordes of heroes who flocked to them in search of glory. And then the man named only 'Nimbus' noticed the one reason that most warriors lost- they were trained to fight human sized enemies, not larger foes.

Seeking to remedy this problem, he sat off to create a discipline that would help potential heroes kill their larger foes, preferably without being crushed in the process. He succeeded, creating the basis of the Hero's Edge discipline, and became a renown monster slayer.

Sadly, his tale ended in disaster- he was defeated by another martial adept, one who refined his ability to kill lone, human sized opponents to near absurd levels. He died a warriors death.

Fortunately, he had three apprentices, eager students who devoured all he taught them and were well on their way to developing the next step in the school. The three, known only by their unfortunate acronym 'G.A.S.', made a great many advances in the school.

Deciding to divide the work into equal portions, they sat off in separate directions, honing their skills and completing their new discipline as they did so.

Years passed, and the three met up once more, sharing their notes on designing their new school.

The first of the apprentices, who valued overwhelming might more than the others, created a set of techniques designed for sheer power- the ability to make ranged attacks with a swing of a blade was his favorite addition to the school.

The second, who valued utility and quick adaptation to new threats, provided an array of unique techniques that could be used for offense or defense- slamming a sword into the ground and prying to throw pieces of it at foes, or stabbing a sword into the ground and prying to form a shield against ranged attacks and similar techniques were his addition to the style.

And the third,who valued mobility and speed the most, supplied a slew of stances that enabled warriors to use their environment in creative ways- cutting cliffs off to use them as a makeshift weapon/battle field and similar feats were made by he.

Combining the three different approaches, they finished the discipline, creating a school unlike any other, focusing on slaying larger creatures and using the environment to kill their foes. Each taking an apprentice of their own, they split again, wandering the world for the rest of their lives.

Time passed, and the Temple of Nine Swords was created, with Reshar seeking out the greatest martial schools to join it. One of the array of practitioners in that time met him upon his travels, and offered to teach him the skills needed to slay much larger foes and much greater numbers of foes, provided that his art recieved a place in the school. Reshar politely declined, and went on his way, preferring to work with the environment as it was instead of adapting it to his needs mid-battle.

Following the Fall of the Temple, the masters of Hero's Edge sought out other martial adepts and attempted to aid them, lending them their skills when they were in need.

And, in recent days, a small group of Warblades have been attempting to adapt the style to fight constructs. These warriors call themselves 'The Meatbags', for some reason...


Practicioners: Warblades are the primary practicioners of this discipline, though other adepts learn some maneuvers from this on occasion. A Warblade can decide to be trained in this discipline at character creation, trading access to one of his other disciplines for access to this one. In addition, other adepts (including Warblades who were not trained in this discipline) may take one of the Access Feats to gain access to this discipline.


Associated Weapons: the longsword, bastard sword (including katana), greatsword (including no-dachi), fullblade, and any sword made for a character of at least one size category larger than the practicioner. Hero's Edge practitioners rely upon being able to easily cut objects with a long blade, and so mainly use swords.



Key skill: Jump- being a school originally created to combat giant enemies, practitioners need to be able to get high enough up to perform their attacks effectively.

Feats:

Hero's Blade*
Prerequisites: Str 15, One Hero's Edge maneuver
Benefit: When wielding a weapon made for a creature one size category larger than yourself, you take a -1 penalty on attack rolls with that weapon instead of the normal penalty for using an incorrectly sized weapon. In addition, the effort required to wield that weapon is the same as for a creature of the proper size.
Normal: A creature wielding a weapon designed for a creature one size larger would take a -2 penalty on attack rolls and require one step additional effort, wielding a light weapon as one-handed, one-handed as two-handed, and two-handed weapons would be too big to wield.
Special: This feat can be taken by as a bonus feat by Warblades. This feat is treated as Monkey Grip for the purposes of PrC or feat requirements. This feat and Monkey Grip may not both be taken.


Access Feats
Path of the First
Prerequisites: One level in any Martial Adept class, Str 14
Benefit: You may now learn maneuvers from the Hero's Edge discipline as though it was on your class' discipline list. Whenever you use a Hero's Edge strike that deals slashing damage, you may reroll one die of that damage.
Normal: Initiators other than Warblades cannot learn Hero's Edge maneuvers except through the Martial Study feat, and they do not receive one reroll on damage rolls.
Special: You may not take this feat and Path of the Second or Path of the Third.

Path of the Second
Prerequistites: One level in any Martial Adept class, Str 14
Benefit: You may now learn maneuvers from the Hero's Edge discipline as though it was on your class' discipline list. Whenever you use a Hero's Edge strike that requires a Reflex saving throw, increase the DC by 1.
Normal: Initiators other than Warblades cannot learn Hero's Edge maneuvers except through the Martial Study feat, and they do not gain a bonus to their save DCs.
Special: You may not take this feat and Path of the First or Path of the Third.

Path of the Third
Prerequisites: One level in any Martial Adept class, Dex 14
Benefit: You may now learn maneuvers from the Hero's Edge discipline as though it was on your class' discipline list. Whenever you are in a Hero's Edge stance, you gain a +2 bonus on Jump checks, as well as a +1 bonus on attack rolls.
Normal: Initiators other than Warblades cannot learn Hero's Edge maneuvers except through the Martial Study feat.
Special: You may not take this feat and Path of the First or Path of the Second.


*Revised by douglas.

The-Mage-King
2010-09-27, 07:17 PM
Hero's Edge
Key skill: Jump.


1st: Wall Hop (Stance): Bounce off one wall to head further up another
Absurdly Sharp Blade (Boost): Your sword can cut things better. Yay!
Skyward Smack (Strike): What goes up, must go down. Including your opponent.

2nd: Surface Wrecking (Strike): Throw rocks at your foe.
Wall Smash (Strike): Dynamic Entry!
Expand Destruction (Boost): Now with rollover damage!

3rd: Building Surf (Stance): No falling damage as long as you're riding a piece of building down to ground level.
Cross Slash (Strike): Hit every square around you.
Climbhazard (Strike): Toss 'em up, cut 'em down.

4th: Blade Beam (Strike): A blade of energy arcs from your sword. Ranged.
Building Devastation Strike (Strike): Deal extra damage to buildings and constructs.
Floor Shield (Counter): Create a barrier out of the floor to block attacks.

5th: To Hell With Gravity! (Stance): Jump checks have no limits based on your height, other benefits.
Dragoon's Leap (Strike): Deal extra damage to an opponent based on Jump check.
Pick On Someone Your Own Size! (Boost): Grow to match the largest foe, but return to normal if you attack something smaller.

6th: Dragging Slash (Strike): Deal weapon damage for every 10 feet you move across an enemy/building.
Element Blade (Boost): Deal energy damage with normal attacks.

7th: Omnislash (Strike): Strike a cone of foes with all your might!
Blasting Zone (Stance): Hit your enemies and the guys behind them!
Assault Twister (Strike): An upgraded Cross Slash

8th: Zanzetsuken (Strike): Destroy stuff in a single blow!
Omnislash v5 (Strike): Make your foe say "Oh, carp." as copies of your sword appear around them.

9th: Omnislash v6 (Strike): As Omnislash v5, but moreso.

The-Mage-King
2010-09-27, 07:19 PM
Maneuver Descriptions

Note: This discipline was created with Medium sized adepts in mind. For smaller (or larger) adepts, treat any maneuver that specifies the size category of the target as Huge or larger as though it says "Two or more Size Categories larger than the Initiator".

1st:

Wall Hop
Hero's Edge (Stance)
Level: Warblade 1
Well, you run at the wall, jump, and... bounce off it and onto the other wall? Then you bounce off that and head further up.

While in this stance, you may take part of your move action(s) to move along a vertical surface, provided that these two conditions are met- 1) You start the move action on a horizontal surface, and 2) you have a second vertical surface parallel to the surface you're moving up. In effect, you bounce between walls to climb up.

In order to move onto the wall, you must first succeed on a DC 10 Jump check. For every five points in which you exceed the DC, you may move a further five feet up, to a maximum of your land speed.

If you finish your turn on a vertical surface, and lack a way to remain there (such as by sticking a sword into the wall and holding on to it), you will fall.



Absurdly Sharp Blade
Hero's Edge (Boost)
Level: Warblade 1
Initiation Time: One Swift action
Range: Self
Targets: One weapon that deals piercing or slashing damage
Duration: 1 round/level

You run your hand over your weapon's edge in a by far too dramatic manner, causing it to audibly gleam with sharpness.

One of the most basic technique in the library of a user of the Hero's Edge discipline, this is also one of the most useful.

This renders the selected melee weapon capable of cutting through things that it would normally not be able to. Treat the weapon as a Silver or Magic weapon for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction and hardness.

As a practitioner grows in level, he learns how to make the weapon still better able to cut things. A single use of this maneuver can only grant the effect of one of the available options for the users Initiator Level.

{table] Initiator Level|Material
1-5|Silver/Magic
6-10|Cold Iron/Ghost Touch
10-15|Adamantine/Alignment (based on actual alignment)
16-20|Any two of the above
25+|Epic, plus one material from levels 1-15 [/table]


Skyward Smack
Hero's Edge (Strike)
Level: Warblade 1
Initiation Time: One Standard action
Range: Melee
Targets: One creature

So you strike your foe upwards, and let him fall to the ground? Fine.

When you initiate this maneuver, make a touch attack against the target. If it hits, make a Jump check. You send your opponent up a number of feet equal to the Jump check's result. If they are unable to keep themselves from falling, they take normal falling damage from their fall.




2nd:

Surface Wrecking

Hero's Edge (Strike)
Level: Warblade 2
Initiation Time: One Standard Action
Range: Close (25 feet+5 feet/2 Initator Levels)
Targets: One enemy
Saving Throw: Reflex half

Alright, you slam your sword into the ground and pry, before hitting the rocks at your foe.

When you activate this maneuver, you swing your sword at the ground beneath you, kicking up chunks of stone (or whatever you're standing on) and batting the pieces at your foe, dealing 4d6 points of damage. Targets may make a Reflex save with a DC of 12+ the Initiator's Strength modifier to take half damage.


Wall Smash
Hero's Edge
Level: Warblade 2(Strike)
Initiation Time: One Standard action
Range: Melee
Targets: One building or creature.
Prerequisites: Absurdly Sharp Blade

You cut the door in two, bursting in and surprising the Bugbears.

When you initiate this maneuver, make a single attack against the target. If it hits, that attack deals an additional 3d6 Slashing damage and ignores hardness (if made against an inanimate object).

Expand Destruction
Hero's Edge (Boost)
Level: Warblade 2
Initiation Time: Swift action

You blow up the wall. The entire wall.

You may initiate this boost whenever you would deal damage to an inanimate object. If you deal more damage to the section that your are attacking than it has hit points, you may deal the excess hit point damage to an adjacent object, such as the next section of the wall, or the table the sword you were sundering was sitting on. You may repeat this process until you run out of damage to deal, or inanimate targets you wish to deal damage to.




3rd:

Building Surf
Hero's Edge (Stance)
Level: Warblade 3

Well, after cutting part of the building you're standing on off, you manage to ride it down to the ground safely. I friggin' hate this discipline. Why did I even let you take it?

While in this stance, you suffer no falling damage as long as you are riding some object, creatures that are dead included, of at least two size categories larger than you down. In addition, you can move between such objects with surprising speed- by making Jump checks, you can go between different pieces at one half of your base land speed.


Cross Slash
Hero's Edge (Strike)
Level: Warblade 3
Initiation Time: One Full Round action
Targets: All threatened squares

...You spammed a sword attack, cutting through the three zombies around you and inflicting triple damage to the Hydra in front of you. I hate this discipline.

As part of this maneuver, make a melee attack against each square you threaten at your full attack bonus, less 1 per square with a creature in it. This attack deals normal damage to the creature in that square if it hits.
In addition, you may strike the same creature multiple times, if it is in more than one of your threatened squares.



Climbhazard
Hero's Edge (Strike)
Level: Warblade 3
Initiation Time: One Full Round Action
Targets: One target creature
Range: Melee

You jump up, hitting your foe more times than you should be able to.

When you initiate this maneuver, make a melee touch attack against the target. If it succeeds, make a Jump check. Both you and your foe move up a number of feet equal to half of the Jump check's result. You may then make a full attack with an extra attack at your highest attack bonus, with all attacks at a -2 penalty. At the end of this attack, both you and your foe fall back to the ground, taking falling damage. You are treated as though you fell half as far as you did for the purpose of falling damage taken.



4th:

Floor Shield
Hero's Edge (Counter)
Level: Warblade 4
Initiation Time: One Swift Action.

So... You pry up a piece of the floor and block an attack with it. Good.

You may initiate this maneuver when you are being attacked from a range. By stabbing the ground and prying, you lift up a wall of whatever surface you're standing on that blocks all ranged attacks directed at you from one specified direction.

In the case of AoE spells, this maneuver opens a space the size of the initiator in the area, right behind the barrier. This barrier blocks 'line' effects outright, provided that the width of the line is equal to or less than the space of the Initiator of this maneuver.

Ex: A wizard casts fireball at a party of adventurers. Their Warblade activates this maneuver, making a five foot hole in the fireball's circle, allowing him to escape the damage.

Building Devastation Slash
Hero's Edge (Strike)
Level: Warblade 4
Initiation Time: One Standard action
Ranged: Melee
Targets: One building or creature of at least Huge size.
Prerequisites: Absurdly Sharp Blade

Is this why you took Martial Study (Absurdly Sharp Blade)? So you could qualify for this one? Fine. You swing your oversized sword at your foe with such might that it knocks him over. Happy now?

When you use this maneuver, make a single attack against the target. If it hits, that attack deals an additional 7d6 Slashing damage that ignores hardness (if a buidling), and forces the target (if a creature) to make a Fort save (DC 14+ Str mod), or fall prone.

Blade Beam
Hero's Edge (Strike)
Level: Warblade 4
Initiation Time: Standard action
Range: Close
Targets: One creature and up to two creatures behind it. (See text)
Duration: Instant
Saving Throw: None/Reflex half

And you said that this discipline isn't a prime candidate for 'The Book of Weeaboo Fightan Magik'. Shame on you. Anyway, you swing your sword with such force that a blade of energy flies from the tip, cutting a path towards your foe.

When initiating this maneuver, select one foe within 30 feet, and make a ranged touch attack against it. If it hits, you deal your usual melee damage plus 6d6 Slashing damage to that creature, and two creatures within a 30 ft. cone behind the target of your choice must make a Reflex save (DC 14+ Str mod) or take 3d6 points of Slashing damage.



5th:

To Hell With Gravity!
Hero's Edge (Stance)
Level: Warblade 5
Prerequisites: Two Hero's Edge Maneuvers

So... You jump obscenely high when using this stance? Nice.

While in this stance, you no longer divide your Jump check by 4 to determine jump height, you are treated as three size categories larger for the purpose of your vertical reach, and you gain a +5 competence bonus on all Jump checks. In addition, you ignore the first 5d6 points of falling damage.


Dragoons's Leap
Hero's Edge (Strike)
Level: Warblade 5
Initiation Time: One Full Round action
Range: Long (400 ft. + 40 ft./level)
Targets: One creature within range
Prerequisites: One Hero's Edge maneuver

...You honestly did not just say "My friends are my strength", did you? Because I'll throw my DMG at you if you did.

When you initiate this maneuver, make a Jump check against a DC of 20. If you have allies in the area that you will be jumping through, you gain a cumulative +5 bonus on this jump check for each one within 10 feet of your trajectory.

At the end of your leap, make an attack roll against the target. If it hits, it deals an extra 4d6 damage, plus another 1d6 damage for every five points your Jump check exceeds 20.

After making the attack, you land in a square of your choice adjacent to the target of this maneuver.

Alternatively, you may initiate this maneuver without a target, gaining the extra damage from a high jump check and 'holding' it for a number of rounds up to one half of your initiator level. Any time during the time you are holding it, you may expend the 'charge' to add the extra damage to another Hero's Edge or a normal attack.


Pick On Someone Your Own Size!
Hero's Edge (Boost)
Level: Warblade 5
Initiation Time: Swift action
Prerequisites: One Hero's Edge maneuver.

...You grow in size to match your foe, and administer a beatdown to them.

When you initiate this boost, you, and all of your equipment, grow to the same size category as the largest enemy that you are fighting, gaining all of the benefits and draw backs of advancing one or more size categories. If you defeat that opponent, or attack a smaller opponent before defeating it, you, and your equipment, return to your original size at the end of the turn. Otherwise, you, and your equipment, return to your original size at the end of the encounter.



6th:

Dragging Slash
Hero's Edge (Strike)
Level: 6
Initiation Time: One Full Round action
Range: Melee
Targets: One building or creature at least three size categories larger than you.
Prerequisites: Two Hero's Edge Maneuvers

You run up the back of the dragon, dragging your sword in its back as you do so, and jump off, the fire breathing lizard splitting into two pieces as you fall for your landing.

As part of this maneuver, make a Balance check against a DC of the targets AC. If it succeeds, make a move action to run up the (back of, if a creature)target. For every five feet that you travel on the creature, you deal your standard melee damage. You may then make a Jump check to leap off the target and land safely on the ground, a distance away equal to the result of your Jump check, unharmed.

The distance you may move depends upon the individual creature: You may move up to half of its height on this maneuver, rounding to the nearest 5 foot interval.

Element Blade
Hero's Edge (Boost)
Level: Warblade 6
Initiation Time: Swift action
Targets: One weapon that deals piercing or slashing damage.
Duration: 1 round/initiator level
Prerequisites: Absurdly Sharp Blade and one other Hero's Edge maneuver

...You fill your blade with the very essence of flame, and the metal blade ignites.
When you initiate this maneuver, select one of the following energy types- Fire, Cold, or Electricity. For the duration of this maneuver, all attacks made with that weapon deal an extra 3d6 points of damage of that energy type.

If you initiate this maneuver a second time before the duration expires, the first use is automatically canceled, and the newer initiation takes full effect. This maneuver is a Supernatural ability.




7th:

Omnislash
Hero's Edge (Strike)
Level: Warblade 7
Initiation Time: One Full Round action
Range: Melee
Targets: Creatures in a 30 foot cone area.
Prerequisites: Three Hero's Edge Maneuvers

...Dear lord. How many creatures do you hit with this?

When you initiate this maneuver, you effectively make an attack on each square in area of the cone. Make a single attack roll, and compare it to the AC of every creature in the area. If the roll is higher than the AC, it hits that creature, dealing normal damage plus an additional 2d6 points of Slashing damage. If a creature occupies multiple squares, it is hit more than once, recieving the extra damage per strike as normal.

EX: "Fog" initiates this maneuver, targeting an area that has three Medium creatures and one Huge creature in it. He makes an attack roll, getting a result above the AC of all creatures in the area. Each Medium creature takes his normal damage, plus 2d6 slashing damage. The huge creature, however, occupies nine squares. It receives nine applications of his normal attack damage, plus 18d6 slashing damage.



Blasting Zone
Hero's Edge (Stance)
Level: Warblade 7
Prerequisites: Three Hero's Edge maneuvers

So, now your sword somehow can cut everything in a line. Joy.

While in this stance, all melee attacks you make affect the creature you attack and any creatures up to 20 feet behind it (compare the first attack roll to the ACs of the other targets). In addition, all attacks made while in this stance deal an extra 4d6 damage.

Assault Twister
Hero's Edge (Strike)
Level: Warblade 7
Initiation Time: One full-round action
Targets: All threatened squares
Prerequisites: Any two Hero's Edge maneuvers

...An upgraded Cross Slash? Fine.

As part of this maneuver, make a melee attack against each square you threaten, using your full attack bonus, less 2 per square with a creature in it. This attack deals triple damage to the creature in that square if it hits.
In addition, you may strike the same creature multiple times, if it is in more than one of your threatened squares.




8th:

Zanzetsuken
Hero's Edge (Strike)
Level: Warblade 8
Initiation Time: One Standard action
Range: Melee
Targets: One building or creature of at least Huge size
Prerequisites: Absurdly Sharp Blade and two other Hero's Edge maneuvers

...You cut the entire falling building in two, causing both pieces to fly behind you and miss you and your party.
When you initiate this maneuver, make a single attack against the target. If it hits, this attack deals normal melee damage plus an extra 2d6 damage to the creature or building for each square it occupies, ignoring hardness if an inanimate object and up to 20 points of DR if a creature. In addition, any creature hit by this attack must make a Fortitude save (DC 18+ Str Modifier) or be stunned for 1d3 rounds.

If you are using this /on a building, and you have enemies near it, you can aim it to hit them, inflicting damage as the DMG recomends. If the target succeeds on a Reflex save (DC 16+ Str modifier), they take half damage.


Omnislash v5
Hero's Edge (Strike)
Level: Warblade 8
Initiation Time: One Full Round Action
Range: Melee
Targets: One foe
Prerequisites: Four Hero's Edge Maneuvers

...You throw your foe and your sword into the air, surrounding him with ghostly copies of your blade, and leap after them. Blurring from one side of your foe to the other, you slash him quickly

When you initiate this maneuver, make a Jump check, as well as a touch attack against the target. If the touch attack succeeds, your target follows you up into the air, floating above his space. You then may make a number of attacks at your full base attack bonus equal to 1/3rd your initiator level, plus one, using ghostly copies of your main weapon, finishing with your real weapon. At the end of your attack chain, you fall to the ground, taking no falling damage, and your foe falls back to their space, taking full falling damage and landing prone.


9th:
Omnislash v6
Hero's Edge (Strike)
Level: Warblade 9
Initiation Time: One full-round action
Range: Melee
Targets: One foe
Prerequisites: Four Hero's Edge maneuvers

Holy ****.

When you initiate this maneuver, make a Jump check, followed by a touch attack against the target. If the touch attack succeeds, your target follows you up into the air, floating above his space. You then may make a number of attacks at your full base attack bonus - 4 equal to one half of your initiator level, plus two, using ghostly copies of your main weapon, finishing with your real weapon. At the end of your attack chain, you fall to the ground, taking no falling damage, and your foe falls back to their space, taking full falling damage and landing prone.

You may not deal bonus damage from stances while using this maneuver.

The-Mage-King
2010-09-27, 07:24 PM
Warrior Poet
As one of the three apprentices of the creator of Hero's Edge, the First had a duty to the school to pass along his teachings to a suitable apprentice, and keep them from those undeserving. Having failed to find such an apprentice, he made a decision- create a poem so brilliant that fully understanding it can enable one to realize the potential of his style when combined with the power of words. People who find the poem and understand it gain new insight into the school of Hero's Edge, and become known as Warrior Poets.

Prerequisites:
BAB: +6
Maneuvers Known: Two Hero's Edge maneuvers, one of at least 3rd level, two Pungeon Pendragon maneuvers, one of at least 3rd level.
Stances: One Hero's Edge stance or one Pungeon Pendragon stance
Spellcasting: Able to spontaneously cast 2nd level Arcane Spells.
Special: Bardic music ability.
Special: Must not have taken either of the feats Path of the Second or Path of the Third.
Special: Must not have levels in either Student of the Second or Follower of the Third.

HD: d8

Class Skills (4 + Int modifier per level): Balance, Bluff, Climb, Craft (Poetry), Concentration, Diplomacy, Jump, Knowledge (History), Martial Lore, Preform (Oratory), Spot, Swim, Truespeak, Tumble.




{table=head]Level|BAB|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Maneuvers Known|Maneuvers Readied|Stances Known|Special|Spell Casting
1|+1|+0|+0|+2|1|0|0|Expanded Repertoire, Bardic Music|+1 level of Bard Spellcasting
2|+2|+0|+0|+3|0|0|1|Arcane Channeling|+1 level of Bard Spellcasting
3|+3|+1|+1|+3|1|1|0|Spellslinging Hero Stance|+1 level of Bard Spellcasting
4|+4|+1|+1|+4|0|0|1|Blazing Poet|+1 level of Bard Spellcasting
5|+5|+1|+1|+4|1|0|0|Arcane Apotheosis|+1 level of Bard Spellcasting[/table]



Spellcasting: At each level you gain new spells per day and an increase in caster level (and spells known, if applicable) as if you had also gained a level in Bard. You do not, however, gain any other benefit a character of that class would have gained. If you have levels in Sublime Chord, you may instead gain spellcasting as though you had also gained a level in it, foregoing the increase in Bardic casting for it.

Maneuvers: At each odd-numbered level, you gain a new maneuver known from the Hero's Edge or Pungeon Pendragon disciplines. You must meet a maneuverís prerequisite to learn it. You add your full Warrior Poet levels to your initiator level to determine your total initiator level and your highest-level maneuvers known.
At 3rd level, you gain an additional maneuver readied per day.

Stances Known: At 2nd and 4th level, you learn a new martial stance from the Hero's Edge or Pungeon Pendragon disciplines. You must meet a stanceís prerequisite to learn it.

Expanded Repertoire: At first level in this class, a Warrior Poet learns how to cast much different spells than usual for bards. You may now select any Conjuration or Evocation spell from the Sorcerer/Wizard spell list that deals energy damage instead of a bard spell when you learn a new spell.
Alternatively, if you have levels in Sublime Chord, you may gain a bonus spell known of up to one level below the highest level you may learn at 1st, 3rd, and 5th levels in this class.

Bardic Music: A Warrior Poet adds their full class level to their Bard level to determine how many uses of Bardic Music they receive per day.

Arcane Channeling (Su): A Warrior Poet gains the ability to channel their touch spells into their attacks at second level. You may take a standard action to cast any touch spell you knowand deliver it through your weapon with a melee attack. The spell must have a casting time of 1 standard action or less, and this casting does not provoke attacks of opportunity. If the attack is successful, the attack deals damage normally, then the effect of the spell is resolved.


Spellslinging Hero Stance (Su): At 3rd level, you learn how to better take advantage of your foes' distraction at your spells or blade. While you are in a stance from either the Hero's Edge discipline or the Pungeon Pendragon discipline, you can forgo its normal benefit as a swift action to gain the effect of spellslinging hero stance. This ability lasts as long as you would maintain the stance, or as described below. You can also stop using spellslinging hero stance and resume gaining the normal benefit of the stance as a swift action.

While using this ability, you treat any creature damaged by a spell you cast within the previous round as though they were flat footed for one attack. Only you may treat them as though they were flat footed. Furthermore, when casting a spell at any creature damaged by a melee attack or maneuver you made or initiated in the previous round, you treat its spell resistance as though it were half of its actual value.

Blazing Poet (Su): At fourth level in this class, you learn how to better use the oft ignored Element Blade maneuver, one pioneered by the First apprentice. Whenever you initiate Element blade, you deal a further d6 energy damage of the type you selected, andall energy damage automatically overcomes resistance to the type of damage, or deals half damage to anything normally immune to it.

Furthermore, as a swift action, you may expend an unexpended Hero's Edge maneuver to gain a bonus on all Truenaming checks equal to the maneuver's level for one round. This use of the Blazing Poet ability is considered extraordinary.

Arcane Apotheosis (Su): At fifth level in this class, you have reached such an understanding of the First's hidden notes that you learned some of his more useful secrets.
As a free action usable once per turn, you may recover a maneuver from the Hero's Edge or Pungeon Pendragon disciplines by expending a number of daily uses of Bardic Music equal to 1/2 the maneuver's level, rounding up.
In addition, you may initiate one of the following maneuvers, chosen when you ready your maneuvers for the first time each day, once per encounter without having it readied- Alea Iacta Est!, Rapier Wit, Cutting Remark, Absurdly Sharp Blade, or Blade Beam. If you later change your readied maneuvers, you may not change this maneuver. If you recover maneuvers during an encounter, you do not recover this maneuver.


Student of the Second
As the most responsible of the three apprentices, the Second chose to take a student to pass on his own developments in the discipline to. After he died, that student took on his own pair of students, and passed the skills to them, with each taking their own students later on. This continued far past the fall of the Temple of Nine Swords, to this very day.

Prerequisites:
Feats: Hero's Blade, Stone Power
Maneuvers Known: Two Hero's Edge maneuvers, one of at least third level, two Stone Dragon maneuvers, one of at least third level.
Stances: One Hero's Edge stance, one Stone Dragon stance.
Special: Must not have taken either of the feats Path of the First or Path of the Third.
Special: Must not have levels in either Warrior Poet or Follower of the Third.

HD:d12

Class Skills (4 + Int modifier per level): Balance, Climb, Concentration, Diplomacy, Intimidate, Jump, Knowledge (History), Martial Lore, Spot, Swim, Tumble.

{table=head] Level|BAB|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Maneuvers Known|Maneuvers Readied|Stances Known|Special
1|+1|+2|+0|+0|1|0|0|Brutal Blow, Code of Conduct
2|+2|+3|+0|+0|1|1|0|-
3|+3|+3|+1|+1|1|0|1|Destructive Hero Stance
4|+4|+4|+1|+1|0|1|0|Powerful Strike
5|+5|+4|+1|+1|1|0|0|Dragon's Edge[/table]


Brutal Blow (Ex): Upon taking the first level in this class, you learn how to efficiently channel your sheer power into your blows. When using a one handed weapon, you add 1.5 times your strength modifier to damage rolls, and with a two handed weapon, or a one handed weapon being used with both hands, twice your strength modifier.

Code of Conduct: A Student of the Second must follow a loose set of rules laid down by the origin of their training. The code is as follows: Embrace your dreams, and, whatever happens, protect your honor as a warrior.

Destructive Hero Stance: At third level in this class, you learn how to use the favored stance of the second apprentice. Whenever you would enter a stance from the Hero's Edge or Stone Dragon disciplines, you can forgo its normal benefit as a swift action to gain the effect of Destructive Hero stance. This ability lasts as long as you would maintain the stance.
While using this ability, all attacks you make against objects deal 1.5 times normal damage, and all attacks made against creatures with DR that can be overcome by a special material act as though they were using that material. In addition, all your successful attacks against any creature daze the target for one round, with a successful Fortitude save (DC 10+ 1/2 level+ Str mod) negating the effect.

Powerful Strike (Ex): At the fourth level in this class, you learn how to better apply your sheer strength to attacks. Whenever you make a melee attack with a light weapon, you add 1.5 times your strength modifier to the damage instead of your strength modifier. When using a one handed weapon, you add twice your strength modifier , and with a two handed weapon, or a one handed weapon being used with both hands, 2.5 times your strength modifier.

Dragon's Edge (Su): From fifth level in this class on, whenever you are in a Hero's Edge stance, you may initiate Stone Dragon maneuvers while not touching the ground. In addition, whenever you initiate a Stone Dragon strike, you may expend a Hero's Edge maneuver as a swift action to add a number of d6 to the damage equal to the level of the expended maneuver. Whenever you initiate a Hero's Edge maneuver that requires a Jump check, you may expend a Stone Dragon maneuver as a swift action to gain a bonus of twice the expended maneuver's level.


Follower of the Third

A forgotten piece of lore about the three apprentices of the Hero's Edge creator is that they all aimed for the title of "Hero". The third of them, by far the most powerful, was the only one to receive that title. Alas, all things must come to an end, and he fell.

Of course, not all could believe that he fell, and a following of his style remained. These are the Followers of the Third.


Prerequisites:
BAB: +5
Feats: Blade Meditation (Hero's Edge), Hero's Blade
Maneuvers Known: Three Hero's Edge Maneuvers, three Diamond Mind maneuvers
Stances: One Hero's Edge stance, one Diamond Mind stance.
Special: Must not have taken either of the feats Path of the First or Path of the Second.
Special: Must not have levels in either Warrior Poet or Student of the Second.


HD: d10

Class Skills (4 + Int modifier skills points per level): Balance, Concentration, Iaijutsu Focus, Intimidate, Jump, Knowledge (Arcana), Knowledge (The Planes), Martial Lore, Spot, Swim, Tumble.


{table=head]Level|BAB |Fort Save| Ref Save|Will Save|Maneuvers Known|Maneuvers Readied|Stances Known|Special
1|+1|+0|+2|+0|1|1|1|Background Music
2|+2|+0|+3|+0|1|0|0|Pure Speed
3|+3|+1|+3|+1|0|1|0|Falling Hero Stance
4|+4|+1|+4|+1|1|0|0|Diamond Hero
5|+5|+1|+4|+1|1|1|1|Angelic Apotheosis[/table]




Maneuvers: At 1st, 2nd, 4th, and 5th level, you gain one new maneuver known from the Diamond Mind or Hero's Edge disciplines. You must meet a maneuverís prerequisite to learn it. You add your full Follower of the Third levels to your initiator level to determine your total initiator level and your highest-level maneuvers known.
At 1st level, 3rd level, and 5th level, you gain an additional maneuver readied per day.

Stances Known: At 1st and 5th level, you learn a new martial stance from the Diamond Mind or Hero's Edge disciplines. You must meet a stanceís prerequisite to learn it.

Background Music (Ex): Upon first becoming a follower of the third, background music manifests around you for 30 ft. The music is something foreboding, usually with ominous Latin chanting, but possibly another accompaniment. This effect if usually active, causing the Follower of the Third to automatically fail all Move Silently checks he makes, but it grants a +5 bonus on Intimidate checks made in a duel of wills or to demoralize an opponent. This can be suppressed as a move action, but reactivates at the first appropriate dramatic moment.

Pure Speed (Su): At second level in this class, you have learned the proper footwork and motions needed in order to accelerate greatly. For a total number of rounds per day equal to twice your levels in this class, you may act as though under a Haste effect. You may divide your time using this ability as you wish. Use of this ability is a Swift Action.

Falling Hero Stance (Ex): At third level in this class, you learn how to use the favored stance of the third apprentice. Whenever you would enter a stance from the Hero's Edge or Diamond Mind disciplines, you can forgo its normal benefit as a swift action to gain the effect of Falling Hero stance. This ability lasts as long as you would maintain the stance.
While using this ability, you take no falling damage. In addition, if you fall more than 20 feet, you may treat your fall as though it were a charge, making a single melee attack at the end of it, with all of the normal benefits of a charge, plus an additional 1d6 damage per 10 feet of fall, maximum 20d6.

Diamond Hero (Ex): At fourth level in this PrC, you have hardened your will so much that you can trade use of one of your normal techniques for improving your other style. Whenever you are in a Diamond Mind or Hero's Edge stance, you may choose to expend a maneuver you have readied from either discipline as a swift action. If you do so, you gain one of two benefits.
If the maneuver expended was a Hero's Edge maneuver, you gain a bonus to Concentration checks equal to that maneuver's level until you leaves the stance or the end of the encounter, whichever comes first. If the maneuver expended was a Diamond Mind maneuver, you gain a bonus to Jump checks equal to twice that maneuvers level, until you leave the stance or the end of the encounter, whichever comes first.

Angelic Apotheosis (Su): At fifth level in this class, you have finally discovered the lost secret of the third apprentice, and can sprout a lone wing from your shoulder on a whim. When the wing is extended, you gain a fly speed equal to your base land speed, with perfect maneuverability, and gain a bonus on all Jump checks equal to your base land speed divided by 5 (Ex: A Follower of the Third with a 30 foot base land speed recieves a +6 bonus to Jump checks, while a Follower of the Third with a 20 foot base land speed recieves +4). In addition, whenever you are in a Diamond Mind or Hero's Edge stance, you receive a +2 bonus on all attack rolls.

The Tygre
2010-09-27, 09:19 PM
I'm almost afraid of what 9th level maneuvers can do. Almost.

The-Mage-King
2010-09-27, 09:23 PM
I'm almost afraid of what 9th level maneuvers can do. Almost.

The reason that it doesn't pass the line is...?

DracoDei
2010-09-27, 09:26 PM
One option might be a stationary maneuver (almost certainly a boost, but maybe a stance) that allows you to roll over your excess damage from one section to adjacent sections, so instead of knocking a 10'x10' hole in a building you knock a 20'x20' hole.

Another one would be something that causes you to grow to the size of the largest opponent you can see, until you attack another animate creature, or defeat them. More Power Rangers or something than Final Fantasy... but I think it works.

The-Mage-King
2010-09-27, 09:36 PM
My plans for the other 8th and the 9th level maneuver are as follows:

8th: Omnislash v5. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zwbEHsCcIF4)

9th: Omnislash v6. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CGI8m3b3rN0)

YES.

Though those would work too...

Hm... 7th level need something...

The Tygre
2010-09-28, 01:19 AM
The reason that it doesn't pass the line is...?

DragoonWraith's swordmage. It literally has an attack that slices through an atom. A -frekkin' atom-. That's right; nuclear explosions follow.

DracoDei
2010-09-28, 01:31 AM
Actually, I am not sure but that the Boost for making BIG holes in walls wouldn't fit in at 2nd level just fine. Granted it might not be the most useful thing at that level, unless you are in an Oriental style campaign with the sliding doors made of paper, but it would at least give an option at that level, and start to pave the way for Master of One (PairO'Dice Lost's version) since that has very strict limits on how many maneuvers you can have from outside your discipline. The growth thing could go at.... I dunno, anywhere from 5th to 8th sounds plausible to me, but I am pretty sleepy right now.

Lix Lorn
2010-09-29, 04:26 AM
DragoonWraith's swordmage. It literally has an attack that slices through an atom. A -frekkin' atom-. That's right; nuclear explosions follow.
And this is bad... why?

I like the discipline. The backstory is cool as well. One thing, with the Access feats, if say, a Swordsage takes one of them, he is better at Hero's Edge than a Warblade.
Cause he gets the special added bonus...

Morph Bark
2010-09-29, 05:36 AM
I like the discipline. The backstory is cool as well. One thing, with the Access feats, if say, a Swordsage takes one of them, he is better at Hero's Edge than a Warblade.
Cause he gets the special added bonus...

He does need to spend a feat though. I do think however that adding Warblade/Fighter feats that do something similar (but better, as they would not give the ability to learn Hero's Edge, but you'd need to know a Hero's Edge maneuver first) would be good.

Also... First = G, Second = A, Third = S?

absolmorph
2010-09-29, 06:15 AM
I would very much enjoy seeing this fleshed out.
I'll probably give this to one of my players. As far as I can tell, none of it is really unbalanced.

Additionally, I'd like to nominate To Hell With Gravity! as one of the best maneuver names ever.

The-Mage-King
2010-09-29, 09:56 AM
He does need to spend a feat though. I do think however that adding Warblade/Fighter feats that do something similar (but better, as they would not give the ability to learn Hero's Edge, but you'd need to know a Hero's Edge maneuver first) would be good.

Also... First = G, Second = A, Third = S?

Hm... Noted... Though... A Warblade can take one of those with no problem...


The others will need to be made eventually... Maybe style feats, like xefas is doing... Yes... Maybe called... Poetic Psionics... Buster Basher, and... Focused Blade...?


And yes, they still are. Who else could I put as the three students?

Morph Bark
2010-09-29, 10:23 AM
The others will need to be made eventually... Maybe style feats, like xefas is doing... Yes... Maybe called... Poetic Psionics... Buster Basher, and... Focused Blade...?

"Poetic Psionics" made me think Genesis is also in on using Pungeon Pendragon (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=156726). :smalltongue:



And yes, they still are. Who else could I put as the three students?

Meant moreso in reference to the feats. Considering there are three and you put G.A.S. in that order, I figured the feats would correspond to the three apprentices in that same order as well.


Though with a background story like that, I have to wonder... will there also be a Path of the Zeroth for the original master?

Maybe an idea would be to expand on what you have now with things based off Sq, Z, T and So? They have (somewhat) similar fighting styles (Z least of all, I admit, and So depends, but eh) to C.

Sq = Squall, Z = Zidane, T = Tidus, So = Sora, C = Cloud.
:smallwink:

The-Mage-King
2010-09-29, 11:16 AM
There... may be an Original Path feat...

Or a 10-level PrC...

Like my three 5-level PrCs that are in progress...






And, really, isn't he? I mean, it'll work. Or, of course, he's a Bard/Warblade...

Hm... Revised first feat name... Poetic Prescision.

Yes, that will work. I'll be working on those later today.

EDIT: As for the rest... Zanzetsuken is a common ability, Cloud cuts a building in half in AC:C, and, well, Dissidia is... an inspiration.

Morph Bark
2010-09-29, 11:41 AM
Heh. I see.

Also, nitpick, but it's actually *Zantetsuken. Also, I think 6d6 per square is too much. A Large target will take 24d6 extra damage, which is already more than enough for an 8th-level maneuver. A Colossal creature would take 150d6 extra damage. I'm thinking maybe 2d6 per square is more in line? You'd deal a maximum of 50d6 extra (on Colossal creatures) at level 15, almost as if you're Arcane Channeling disintegration (which would actually deal less damage even at level 20 and allow a save) - 32d6 on Gargantuan creatures (which is like a level 16 disintegrate) and 18d6 on Huge and 8d6 on Large creatures. I'd also lower the stun time by a lot, unless you'd allow a Reflex save for halving the extra damage.

Also, for building falling damage, as a DM I'd use the weight charts for that (for each 200 lbs that an object weighs, and each 10 feet it falls, it deals 1d6 damage - so a 2000 lbs building falling from 30 feet would deal 30d6 damage, Reflex half in this case).

Or where you going for a higher power level (damage-wise) than ToB?

The-Mage-King
2010-09-29, 12:43 PM
Heh. I see.

Also, nitpick, but it's actually *Zantetsuken. Also, I think 6d6 per square is too much. A Large target will take 24d6 extra damage, which is already more than enough for an 8th-level maneuver. A Colossal creature would take 150d6 extra damage. I'm thinking maybe 2d6 per square is more in line? You'd deal a maximum of 50d6 extra (on Colossal creatures) at level 15, almost as if you're Arcane Channeling disintegration (which would actually deal less damage even at level 20 and allow a save) - 32d6 on Gargantuan creatures (which is like a level 16 disintegrate) and 18d6 on Huge and 8d6 on Large creatures. I'd also lower the stun time by a lot, unless you'd allow a Reflex save for halving the extra damage.

Also, for building falling damage, as a DM I'd use the weight charts for that (for each 200 lbs that an object weighs, and each 10 feet it falls, it deals 1d6 damage - so a 2000 lbs building falling from 30 feet would deal 30d6 damage, Reflex half in this case).

Or where you going for a higher power level (damage-wise) than ToB?



Hm... Revising right now... Give me a second...

The-Mage-King
2010-10-03, 10:15 AM
Added the first PrC. Look it over.

Lix Lorn
2010-10-03, 10:20 AM
I KNEW he was one of the inspirations. XD

Morph Bark
2010-10-03, 10:53 AM
In combination with my Limit Dragoon (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=168962), that Falling Hero stance looks like it could be made to be WHOAMG. (Especially since, technically, once you reach the peak of a Jump you just start falling...)

Also, is there a cap on the bonus damage from Falling Hero? Capping it at 20d6 just like falling damage would seem appropriate.

As for Angelic Apotheosis, why not make that also a stance and give it a few additional benefits? (Well, wings give a +10 bonus on Jump checks a lot of the time anyway...) I mean, Seph didn't have the wing out at all times, after all.

Adding the choice of a small ability later on relating to Background Music might also be an idea. Something Bardic Music-ish of sorts, as if they'd have a pair of level-1 bards with them at all times? Just an idea.

IcarusWings
2010-10-03, 11:39 AM
I do hope that there will be PrCs based on Zack and Cloud as well?

(Zack maybe less so, as his style is just made up of moves from everyone who's had an influence on his life)

The Tygre
2010-10-03, 11:54 AM
And this is bad... why?

Who said anything about it being bad? :smallamused:

The-Mage-King
2010-10-03, 01:09 PM
I KNEW he was one of the inspirations. XD


Who else would I use for my discipline focused on cutting things to pieces with an oversized sword?


In combination with my Limit Dragoon (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=168962), that Falling Hero stance looks like it could be made to be WHOAMG. (Especially since, technically, once you reach the peak of a Jump you just start falling...)

Also, is there a cap on the bonus damage from Falling Hero? Capping it at 20d6 just like falling damage would seem appropriate.

As for Angelic Apotheosis, why not make that also a stance and give it a few additional benefits? (Well, wings give a +10 bonus on Jump checks a lot of the time anyway...) I mean, Seph didn't have the wing out at all times, after all.

Adding the choice of a small ability later on relating to Background Music might also be an idea. Something Bardic Music-ish of sorts, as if they'd have a pair of level-1 bards with them at all times? Just an idea.

Hm...

Naturally. How else would he kill Aerith/Aeris? He min-maxed his falling damage, that's how!

I'll fix that.

Point on the Angelic Apotheosis thing. I'll adjust that...

And maybe the bardic music thing will be a feat made later... After all, I know that Background Music will be a wonderful thing to stick onto other classes...


I do hope that there will be PrCs based on Zack and Cloud as well?

(Zack maybe less so, as his style is just made up of moves from everyone who's had an influence on his life)

Listen, the first disciple's name starts with a G. The second, with an A.

The second one will be the Zack/Cloud style one. I've already got the abilities named, they just need to be defined...

Lix Lorn
2010-10-03, 01:12 PM
:smalleek:
She dies?!?![/joke]
Seriously, does ANYONE not know? Apart from the guy I accidentally spoiled it too once...

The-Mage-King
2010-10-03, 01:21 PM
:smalleek:
She dies?!?![/joke]
Seriously, does ANYONE not know? Apart from the guy I accidentally spoiled it too once...

...

...It's a meme (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/EverybodyKnowsThat). Roll with it.

IcarusWings
2010-10-03, 01:22 PM
Listen, the first disciple's name starts with a G. The second, with an A.

The second one will be the Zack/Cloud style one. I've already got the abilities named, they just need to be defined...

I never really thought Angeal and Cloud's fighting styles were all that similar.

Lix Lorn
2010-10-03, 01:24 PM
...
I was playing on the joke. Although I did totally **** a friend off by telling them, and then finding out that they DIDN'T know.

The-Mage-King
2010-10-03, 01:27 PM
I never really thought Angeal and Cloud's fighting styles were all that similar.

...Point.

That'll be my fourth PrC...

Yeah... That should do it...



Oh, yeah, to inform you all in advance: the other two PrCs, Warrior Poet and Honor Bound (noun), are in progress. WP will be a Bard/Warblade focused discipline, using M-Bark's Pungeon Pendragon (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=156726) discipline as its second, and HB(n) will use Stone Dragon.

Yes.

EDIT: ...

...

...Tell them that Kadaj is a Sephiroth Copy. That'll teach them to not look for spoilers.

Agrippa
2010-10-03, 03:26 PM
For Sephiroth I probably would have just used the jumping and two hander friendly maneuvers from Tiger Claw plus a few from Iron Heart and Diamond Mind. Other than that this discipline would make sense for the other SOLDIER members plus Cloud. By the way, I'm brainstorming up a few campaign settings. More like deciding on how to stat up preexisting fictional universes as campaign settings and then tie them all together. Just imagine these two ideas. Sephiroth in league with Seymour Guado, Jonathan Teatime, General Zod and maybe Jasmine (http://buffy.wikia.com/wiki/Jasmine). At the same time his dear old dad Doctor Hojo picks up a few new friends too. Namely Warren Mears (http://buffy.wikia.com/wiki/Warren_Mears), Nicodemus Archeleone, Sabertooth, Doctor Destiny (especially as portrayed in Sandman) and the Red Skull.

The-Mage-King
2010-10-04, 09:32 AM
Second (har-har) prestige class up, with another maneuver or so soon to follow.

The-Mage-King
2010-10-04, 01:01 PM
Mayhaps I misphrased that...

Please critique the new PrC in the fourth post and the two new maneuvers (one 1st, one 8th).

IcarusWings
2010-10-04, 01:15 PM
The new manoeuvres look cool, Skyward Sweep or whatever it is (can't remember the name) seems like it might be a bit powerful for level one but I'm not best on balance.
Omnislash 5 seems quite underpowered, at 15th level which is when you first gain access to it, you gain 4 attacks, this is easily gained through a normal full attack and a single TWF extra attack, at 20th level you need a simple two TWF extra attacks to equal it. Admittedly, the attacks from the manoeuvre are at full BAB and therefore more likely to hit, but it still seems a bit weak.

Also what's the difference between Omnislash 5 and 6, other than a different colour.

The-Mage-King
2010-10-04, 02:45 PM
The new manoeuvres look cool, Skyward Sweep or whatever it is (can't remember the name) seems like it might be a bit powerful for level one but I'm not best on balance.
Omnislash 5 seems quite underpowered, at 15th level which is when you first gain access to it, you gain 4 attacks, this is easily gained through a normal full attack and a single TWF extra attack, at 20th level you need a simple two TWF extra attacks to equal it. Admittedly, the attacks from the manoeuvre are at full BAB and therefore more likely to hit, but it still seems a bit weak.


Hm... I suppose I can up that to 1/3rd initiator level.... That gives... well, 6 at level 15, 7 at 20.


Also what's the difference between Omnislash 5 and 6, other than a different colour.

10 attacks, actually.

YES.

Morph Bark
2010-10-04, 02:54 PM
Considering they're ToB-based PrCs... a few extra class skills and 4 skill points/level might not be wrong.

The-Mage-King
2010-10-04, 02:55 PM
...Point...

Suggestions for the class skills?

Morph Bark
2010-10-04, 03:03 PM
Perhaps Gather Information for the Second, Diplomacy could work for the Third too, at least if we're going by the characters they're based off of (Seph seemed quite charismatic and pre-fall not such a bad guy at all).

Climb for either maybe. And it might be worthwhile to consider putting Iaijutsu Focus on the class skill list of one of them. Perform is a definite yes for the First, of course (and Truespeak of course). Also, might want to consider putting in a clause that you can only take levels in one of them.

Lastly, as the prerequisites are now, you can get in with just level 1 maneuvers and stances. Might be the intention, but worth reconsideration, as many ToB PrCs have at least one of their maneuver-based prerequisites include something like "one maneuver of Stone Dragon of level 3" or the like.


EDIT: Also, Spot is one I'd definitely consider for all three. Need to see your targets from far up, yes? A Knowledge skill or two wouldn't be too bad either.

DracoDei
2010-10-04, 03:09 PM
I tend to think of full BAB attacks being worth a lot more than iteratives, if only because you can Power Attack for more...


I don't know about Spot... the targets are supposed to be ginormous usually, correct? Buildings and Kaiju?

The-Mage-King
2010-10-04, 03:35 PM
Perhaps Gather Information for the Second, Diplomacy could work for the Third too, at least if we're going by the characters they're based off of (Seph seemed quite charismatic and pre-fall not such a bad guy at all).

Climb for either maybe. And it might be worthwhile to consider putting Iaijutsu Focus on the class skill list of one of them. Perform is a definite yes for the First, of course (and Truespeak of course). Also, might want to consider putting in a clause that you can only take levels in one of them.

Lastly, as the prerequisites are now, you can get in with just level 1 maneuvers and stances. Might be the intention, but worth reconsideration, as many ToB PrCs have at least one of their maneuver-based prerequisites include something like "one maneuver of Stone Dragon of level 3" or the like.


EDIT: Also, Spot is one I'd definitely consider for all three. Need to see your targets from far up, yes? A Knowledge skill or two wouldn't be too bad either.

Hm... Will fix the "of at least X level" thing, I was planning the clause about only one of the three being enterable, and... Yeah, those will work.

I'm also thinking Know. (Arcana), and Know. (The Planes) for the Follower of the Third...


Yeah, that'll work.






Also, for the most part, yes, the targets are supposed to be big things that have a -40 on Hide checks. Thing is, the three apprentices decided to take it in a slightly different direction than that after their master died at the hands of a warrior who was trained in fighting people his size...

Yeah, they branched out a bit. Crippling overspecialization, and all that.

DracoDei
2010-10-04, 03:41 PM
Ah, right... Spot sounds like it COULD be fine then.

The-Mage-King
2010-10-04, 09:22 PM
Edited both PrCs with better skill lists, and added a Special prerequisite that negates the possibility of them being taken by someone with levels in one of the other two.

The-Mage-King
2010-10-05, 08:46 PM
Alrighty, alrighty. three maneuver up, basically filling in 1st-5th level maneuvers completely.

I do need some ideas for two 6th and one 7th level maneuvers, though... I'd like a boost amongst them...

Suggestions?

DracoDei
2010-10-05, 08:58 PM
I would add the phrase "You may repeat this process until you run out of damage to deal, or inanimate targets you wish to deal damage to." to Wall Smash Expand Destruction. Such was my original intent, and being able to level moderate sized houses with a single blow is perfectly in keeping with the concept of this class. It shouldn't matter much for practical purposes...

The-Mage-King
2010-10-05, 09:00 PM
I would add the phrase "You may repeat this process until you run out of damage to deal, or inanimate targets you wish to deal damage to." to Wall Smash. Such was my original intent, and being able to level moderate sized houses with a single blow is perfectly in keeping with the concept of this class. It shouldn't matter much for practical purposes...

...Wall Smash, or Expand Destruction? Because they're not the smae thing...

DracoDei
2010-10-05, 09:06 PM
Expand Destruction was what I was referring to. Sorry... thought the other was called "Dynamic Entry" but I see that is the short description.

*Flaps off to edit.*

The-Mage-King
2010-10-05, 09:08 PM
Expand Destruction was what I was referring to. Sorry... thought the other was called "Dynamic Entry" but I see that is the short description.

*Flaps off to edit.*

No sweat.

Though I suppose that I should modify the short description on Wall Smash...

IcarusWings
2010-10-06, 12:40 AM
For Pick on Someone your Own Size I would suggest putting in a clause about your weapons and stuff growing too, along with all the associated benefits.

The-Mage-King
2010-10-06, 10:06 AM
...

...

...I knew I forgot something.

I'll fix that now.

Anyway, about maneuver ideas... Any suggestions?

Douglas
2010-10-06, 10:14 AM
Hero's Blade
Prerequisites: Str 15, One Hero's Edge maneuver
Benefit: When wielding a weapon made for a creature one size category larger than yourself, you take a -1 penalty on attack rolls with that weapon.
Special: This feat can be taken by as a bonus feat by Warblades. This feat is treated as Monkey Grip for the purposes of PrC or feat requirements. This feat and Monkey Grip may not both be taken.
As written, this feat is actively bad and would never be taken. I'm guessing the intent is for the -1 penalty to replace the normal penalty, and probably also the increased effort, but nothing actually written in the feat indicates that. As is, you take the normal increase in effort, the normal -2 penalty, and the new -1 penalty in addition.

The-Mage-King
2010-10-06, 10:16 AM
As written, this feat is actively bad and would never be taken. I'm guessing the intent is for the -1 penalty to replace the normal penalty, and probably also the increased effort, but nothing actually written in the feat indicates that. As is, you take the normal increase in effort, the normal -2 penalty, and the new -1 penalty in addition.

Thank you for that. No one noticed, apparently...

Douglas
2010-10-06, 12:11 PM
Better, but you still don't mention the effort required. If it's meant to be Monkey Grip But Better, you need to mention that the weapon category (light, one-handed, two-handed) stays the same. Assuming I have the intent right, try this:

Hero's Blade
Prerequisites: Str 15, One Hero's Edge maneuver
Benefit: When wielding a weapon made for a creature one size category larger than yourself, you take a -1 penalty on attack rolls with that weapon instead of the normal penalty for using an incorrectly sized weapon. In addition, the effort required to wield that weapon is the same as for a creature of the proper size.
Normal: A creature wielding a weapon designed for a creature one size larger would take a -2 penalty on attack rolls and require one step additional effort, wielding a light weapon as one-handed, one-handed as two-handed, and two-handed weapons would be too big to wield.
Special: This feat can be taken by as a bonus feat by Warblades. This feat is treated as Monkey Grip for the purposes of PrC or feat requirements. This feat and Monkey Grip may not both be taken.

The-Mage-King
2010-10-06, 02:15 PM
Better, but you still don't mention the effort required. If it's meant to be Monkey Grip But Better, you need to mention that the weapon category (light, one-handed, two-handed) stays the same. Assuming I have the intent right, try this:

Hero's Blade
Prerequisites: Str 15, One Hero's Edge maneuver
Benefit: When wielding a weapon made for a creature one size category larger than yourself, you take a -1 penalty on attack rolls with that weapon instead of the normal penalty for using an incorrectly sized weapon. In addition, the effort required to wield that weapon is the same as for a creature of the proper size.
Normal: A creature wielding a weapon designed for a creature one size larger would take a -2 penalty on attack rolls and require one step additional effort, wielding a light weapon as one-handed, one-handed as two-handed, and two-handed weapons would be too big to wield.
Special: This feat can be taken by as a bonus feat by Warblades. This feat is treated as Monkey Grip for the purposes of PrC or feat requirements. This feat and Monkey Grip may not both be taken.

...Annd that is it. I'll just take that, m'kay?

blackjack217
2010-10-06, 04:18 PM
In the spirit of the class may I present:

Skull beat down
Hero's Edge (Strike)
Level: Warblade 9
Initiation Time: Full round action
Range: Melee
Targets: One creature of at least medium size
Prerequisites: four Hero's Edge maneuvers
... did you really just take out his skull and beat him to death with it? That doesn't seem physically possible.

Make a melee touch attack. If it hits roll d20 on a 20 the target dies (no save) otherwise you make a auto hit auto crit full attack dealing normal + 1d12 per size above medium.

DracoDei
2010-10-06, 05:51 PM
I don't like it... it is too comical and I don't see how it fits the rest of the discipline other than being over the top. This is Final Fantasy here... not the Venture Brothers.

The-Mage-King
2010-10-06, 07:09 PM
In the spirit of the class may I present:

Skull beat down
Hero's Edge (Strike)
Level: Warblade 9
Initiation Time: Full round action
Range: Melee
Targets: One creature of at least medium size
Prerequisites: four Hero's Edge maneuvers
... did you really just take out his skull and beat him to death with it? That doesn't seem physically possible.

Make a melee touch attack. If it hits roll d20 on a 20 the target dies (no save) otherwise you make a auto hit auto crit full attack dealing normal + 1d12 per size above medium.


I don't like it... it is too comical and I don't see how it fits the rest of the discipline other than being over the top. This is Final Fantasy here... not the Venture Brothers.

Yeah, I'm aiming for more of the "How the hell does a 5' 10" 150 pound dude jump straight up 50 feet and bisect a dragon with a three foot long sword" style of defying physics than the "kill someone with their own skull" type... Sorry.

Though that style would make for an... interesting discipline...

blackjack217
2010-10-06, 07:26 PM
I don't like it... it is too comical and I don't see how it fits the rest of the discipline other than being over the top. This is Final Fantasy here... not the Venture Brothers.
wrong reference

DracoDei
2010-10-06, 08:20 PM
Ok, what is it a reference to?

The-Mage-King
2010-10-06, 08:22 PM
Ok, what is it a reference to?

Red versus Blue, I believe.

blackjack217
2010-10-06, 09:30 PM
Red versus Blue, I believe.

you win the prize, now to find a prize. Also I can't stop thinking of a maneuver based monk. After all, the monk is supposed to be able to do the absurd, but can't.

IcarusWings
2010-10-07, 12:27 AM
Also I can't stop thinking of a maneuver based monk. After all, the monk is supposed to be able to do the absurd, but can't.

It's called an Unarmed Swordsage

Agrippa
2010-10-07, 02:04 AM
Yeah, I'm aiming for more of the "How the hell does a 5' 10" 150 pound dude jump straight up 50 feet and bisect a dragon with a three foot long sword" style of defying physics than the "kill someone with their own skull" type... Sorry.

Though that style would make for an... interesting discipline...

My thoughts exactly. If you want a set of disciplines based off of Genesis's fighting style use Diamond Mind, Iron Heart and Hero's Edge. Angeal's/Zack's/Cloud's style could be reflected by Iron Heart, Stone Dragon and Hero's Edge while Sephiroth would have Diamond Mind, two-hander friendly Tiger Claw maneuvers, Iron Heart and of course Hero's Edge. The maneuver mentioned wouldn't fit either of the the three. Now Tifa on the other hand might pull off something like that.

Morph Bark
2010-10-07, 04:57 AM
Yeah, I'm aiming for more of the "How the hell does a 5' 10" 150 pound dude jump straight up 50 feet and bisect a dragon with a sevenfoot long sword" style of defying physics than the "kill someone with their own skull" type... Sorry.

Though that style would make for an... interesting discipline...

Fixed That For You. :smallwink:

Alternatively, you could just play kadoosh (http://noneedforbushido.com/2009/comic/360/).


Now Tifa on the other hand might pull off something like that.

Or use Limit Monk. :smalltongue:

The-Mage-King
2010-10-07, 06:24 PM
Or use Limit Monk. :smalltongue:

...You know, a gestalt campaign where everyone had levels in one of the Limit classes would be kinda neat...

dgnslyr
2010-10-07, 06:39 PM
I... I think I just nerdgasmed. This is my favorite homebrew ToB discipline, by far.

On the other hand, it seems more powerful than other disciplines, but a discipline with maneuvers this awesome is allowed to. As for a 9th level maneuver, how about something out of left field? You already have the big ones, Omnislash, Renzokuken, etc., below ninth, so it better be really awesome. I'd like to see what the 9th level maneuver will be.

The-Mage-King
2010-10-07, 06:42 PM
I'd like to see what the 9th level maneuver will be.

As mentioned... The Omnislash v6. The one from AC: Complete.

Morph Bark
2010-10-08, 03:36 AM
Personally, I think it would be hilarious to have a 9th-level maneuver with a really intricate and imposing name, but have it just commonly be known as "Chef's Knife".

Fan
2010-10-08, 05:38 AM
Who else would I use for my discipline focused on cutting things to pieces with an oversized sword?



Hm...

Naturally. How else would he kill Aerith/Aeris? He min-maxed his falling damage, that's how!

I'll fix that.

Point on the Angelic Apotheosis thing. I'll adjust that...

And maybe the bardic music thing will be a feat made later... After all, I know that Background Music will be a wonderful thing to stick onto other classes...



Listen, the first disciple's name starts with a G. The second, with an A.

The second one will be the Zack/Cloud style one. I've already got the abilities named, they just need to be defined...

How (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DRChk-YVy1c) about (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N7DPuxs2ERo&feature=related) this guy (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26w_fmJH4wQ&feature=related)?

If not him, then I suggest a new hero based upon Kamina, a man known for his determination, telling you to believe in the him who believes in you, and this. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JrK_k2UaNTA)

The-Mage-King
2010-10-08, 09:12 AM
Personally, I think it would be hilarious to have a 9th-level maneuver with a really intricate and imposing name, but have it just commonly be known as "Chef's Knife".

A Tonberry... *shudder*


How (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DRChk-YVy1c) about (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N7DPuxs2ERo&feature=related) this guy (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26w_fmJH4wQ&feature=related)?

If not him, then I suggest a new hero based upon Kamina, a man known for his determination, telling you to believe in the him who believes in you, and this. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JrK_k2UaNTA)


Uh, no. I already have the major players in the discipline planned out, alond with the name of their master and his PrC's bare bones...


Besides, TDO already made a discipline (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=5569037) for Hamina. I mean Kamina.

The-Mage-King
2010-10-22, 10:06 AM
Right. I just updated the second and third posts with three new maneuvers, including the capstone.

Their names?

Element Blade.

Assault Twister.

Omnislash v6.

Look 'em over and see if they need revising.

The-Mage-King
2010-10-22, 04:53 PM
So... They're good? I can call this done (aside from a PrC or three)?

Excellent...

The-Mage-King
2010-10-23, 12:43 PM
And I have just put up the last of the three main PrC, though I think it might be a little on the strong/highly specific end...

absolmorph
2010-10-23, 02:28 PM
That's, uh, pretty specific.

Omnislash v6 seems like it'll do a lot of damage.
At level 17, it's 10 attacks. With Blasting Zone, that's already 40d6 damage. A medium character using a greatsword with the Hero's Blade feat will do 3d6+Str per hit, bringing the total damage to 70d6+(10*Str)
Assuming a Strength score of 30 (which gives a bonus of +10), that's going to be 70d6+150, averaging at 395 (39.5 per attack). Each attack will have a bonus of +22.
That just seems kinda high to me.

The-Mage-King
2010-10-23, 02:45 PM
That's, uh, pretty specific.

Omnislash v6 seems like it'll do a lot of damage.
At level 17, it's 10 attacks. With Blasting Zone, that's already 40d6 damage. A medium character using a greatsword with the Hero's Blade feat will do 3d6+Str per hit, bringing the total damage to 70d6+(10*Str)
Assuming a Strength score of 30 (which gives a bonus of +10), that's going to be 70d6+150, averaging at 395 (39.5 per attack). Each attack will have a bonus of +22.
That just seems kinda high to me.

Hm.. Suggestions for lowering it to a more reasonable amount? Maybe just adding a caveat that you cannot gain bonus damage from stances on it?

absolmorph
2010-11-03, 02:19 PM
Hm.. Suggestions for lowering it to a more reasonable amount? Maybe just adding a caveat that you cannot gain bonus damage from stances on it?
That could help. That would bring the damage down to 30d6+(10*Str).
For reference, the level 9 Desert Wind maneuver deals 100 fire damage in a 60 foot burst (centered on you). This deals 255 on average (using the same Strength I previously did).
Devoted Spirit grants a Heal spell with a range of 10 feet, Diamond Mind grants two full attacks, Iron Heart grants an extra 100 damage to one attack and Shadow Hand adds 15d6 and a you roll to determine what ability damage you do.
So, assuming straight Warblade, this is only somewhat better than Diamond Mind's level 9 maneuver, giving 2 more attacks and whatever falling damage (which is unlikely to be huge).

It took me a while to remember to check the thread, otherwise I would have done this earlier.

Thrawn183
2010-11-03, 03:21 PM
I'd like to see you change the size restrictions from Huge or larger to 2 size categories or more larger than the initiator.

The-Mage-King
2010-11-03, 05:01 PM
That could help. That would bring the damage down to 30d6+(10*Str).
For reference, the level 9 Desert Wind maneuver deals 100 fire damage in a 60 foot burst (centered on you). This deals 255 on average (using the same Strength I previously did).
Devoted Spirit grants a Heal spell with a range of 10 feet, Diamond Mind grants two full attacks, Iron Heart grants an extra 100 damage to one attack and Shadow Hand adds 15d6 and a you roll to determine what ability damage you do.
So, assuming straight Warblade, this is only somewhat better than Diamond Mind's level 9 maneuver, giving 2 more attacks and whatever falling damage (which is unlikely to be huge).

It took me a while to remember to check the thread, otherwise I would have done this earlier.

Added the caveat, and I believe... Yes, I believe that was the last thing to deal with!


I'd like to see you change the size restrictions from Huge or larger to 2 size categories or more larger than the initiator.

...And no it wasn't.

Hm...Give me a second to do something to save me the trouble of editing all that...

NecroticPunch
2010-11-03, 05:22 PM
Hm... why aren't there any stances? :smallconfused:

The-Mage-King
2010-11-03, 05:48 PM
Hm... why aren't there any stances? :smallconfused: ... There. Are.

NineThePuma
2010-11-03, 07:35 PM
I like this. =D

I am sad I can't use more than one of the Student PrCs at once though.

Might I recommend adding some of Sephi's more memorable abilities as well? Such as Octoslash and Heartless Angel?

absolmorph
2010-11-04, 02:25 AM
I think someone with more experience with balance should give any more critique; I'm don't have too much experience with homebrew. It looks like it's pretty good, overall. There's not much

However, I am using this as the focus of an NPC in my campaign. He was introduced exploding a jail cell, which he was in because he leapt onto a dragon's back. Unarmed and unarmored.

The-Mage-King
2010-11-04, 10:49 AM
However, I am using this as the focus of an NPC in my campaign. He was introduced exploding a jail cell, which he was in because he leapt onto a dragon's back. Unarmed and unarmored.

...

...Give me that fellows name. He shall be marked down among the "notable users" when I get around to writing it.

Because that is entirely approproiate for the discipline.

absolmorph
2010-11-04, 11:44 AM
...

...Give me that fellows name. He shall be marked down among the "notable users" when I get around to writing it.

Because that is entirely approproiate for the discipline.
Egonil Plamenagi, wandering swordsman extraordinaire.
I thought a cell door being destroyed (from the inside) was a fitting introduction for the guy who would be a tutor for this discipline.
The rest was just me figuring out why he was there.

NineThePuma
2010-11-09, 08:17 PM
A question!

Are you aware that Stone Dragon maneuvers only work while in contact with the ground?

absolmorph
2010-11-09, 09:12 PM
A question!

Are you aware that Stone Dragon maneuvers only work while in contact with the ground?
I'm assuming you were looking at the Student of the Second prestige class. If I'm correct, look at the capstone. And most of the Hero's Edge maneuvers can be used just fine on the ground, too. Only a few require aerial defiance of physics.

Lix Lorn
2010-11-29, 05:27 AM
Hey, TMK! What are the hit dies for the PrCs? Also, does the second have a BAB requirement?

The-Mage-King
2010-11-29, 10:30 AM
...Knew I forgot something. In order- d8, d12, d10.

And the second does not have a BAB requirement.

Lix Lorn
2010-11-29, 10:35 AM
Awesome, and intriguing! xD

The-Mage-King
2010-11-29, 10:39 AM
Awesome, and intriguing! xD

It does have an IL 5 requirement, though.

Lix Lorn
2010-11-29, 11:23 AM
I took it after ten levels of Swordsage, so it oughta be okay. xD

absolmorph
2010-11-29, 10:21 PM
I have a question, actually.
I'm looking at Follower of the Third. How does the Falling Hero Stance interact with multiple attacks on a charge?

Havvy
2011-01-08, 09:15 PM
Requesting permission to transfer to DnD-Wiki. The feats, PrCs, and of course, the discipline itself.

The-Mage-King
2011-01-08, 09:18 PM
Hm... Premission Granted.

IcarusWings
2011-01-09, 06:10 AM
Now that there's no fear of necro, I've got a question about the Hero's Blade feat, as it lets you wield weapons as if one size category larger, can you wield medium-sized two handed weapons as one-handed weapons (this question is due to my character in your game, who is aiming to dual-wield a Greatword and a Longsword).

I'd say it certainly fits with the source material.

The-Mage-King
2011-01-09, 09:16 AM
Hm... I'd say that's best left to your DM in that case.


So, for you specifically, "yes", but in general, "ask your DM".

Havvy
2011-01-11, 03:57 AM
When initiating this maneuver, select one foe within 30 feet, and make a ranged touch attack against it. If it hits, you deal your usual melee damage plus 6d6 Slashing damage to that creature, and two creatures behind it of your choice have to make a Reflex save (DC 14+ Str mod) or take 3d6 points of Slashing damage.

When initiating this maneuver, select one foe within 30 feet, and make a ranged touch attack against it. If it hits, you deal your usual melee damage plus 6d6 Slashing damage to that creature, and two creatures within a 30 ft. cone behind it the target of your choice have to make a Reflex save (DC 14 + Str mod) or take 3d6 points of Slashing damage.

Unless you want me to target the creature 10 miles behind it, because I just don't like him.

Also, can you make it a note that these maneuvers allow you entry into Bloodstorm Blade and that Bloodstorm Blade increases your initiator level for this discipline?

Oh, and can I get an up-to-four sentence summary of what this martial discipline does? The history is good, but I cannot find anything in it that basically describes it.

Oh, and except for the prestige classes, I basically have this transferred. ::smallsmile:

The-Mage-King
2011-01-11, 11:15 AM
When initiating this maneuver, select one foe within 30 feet, and make a ranged touch attack against it. If it hits, you deal your usual melee damage plus 6d6 Slashing damage to that creature, and two creatures within a 30 ft. cone behind it the target of your choice have to make a Reflex save (DC 14 + Str mod) or take 3d6 points of Slashing damage.

Unless you want me to target the creature 10 miles behind it, because I just don't like him.

How did I miss that...


Also, can you make it a note that these maneuvers allow you entry into Bloodstorm Blade and that Bloodstorm Blade increases your initiator level for this discipline?

But they don't. The only way this is assosciated with Iron Heart is that they mesh well. That's it.

Besides, Bloodstorm Blade is throwing things. This has shooting lasers from your sword, and only one of those too.


Oh, and can I get an up-to-four sentence summary of what this martial discipline does? The history is good, but I cannot find anything in it that basically describes it.

"Leap into action and reject conventional physics to kill your enemies! A high-flying, dragon-bisecting, over the top discipline."

That work?

DracoDei
2011-01-11, 01:43 PM
You forgot the "building smashing".

The-Mage-King
2011-01-11, 01:46 PM
You forgot the "building smashing".


"Leap into action and reject conventional physics to kill your enemies! A high-flying, dragon-bisecting, property-damaging, over the top discipline."

Havvy
2011-01-11, 01:51 PM
That will work nicely. Thanks.

Havvy
2011-01-15, 12:18 AM
Angelic Apotheosis (Su): At fifth level in this class, you have finally discovered the lost secret of the third apprentice, and can sprout a lone wing from your shoulder on a whim. When the wing is extended, you gain a fly speed equal to your base land speed, with perfect maneuverability, and gain a bonus on all Jump checks equal to your base land speed. In addition, whenever you are in a Diamond Mind or Hero's Edge stance, you receive a +5 bonus on all attack rolls.

This means that you will hit 25% more of the time when in a Diamond Mind or Hero's Edge stance than when not in a stance. That is a *huge* melee boost. It would be more appropriate if it was +2 or +3 at the maximum. Anything higher, and you'll fall off of the RNG, which is bad. Top off the flight, and the bonus to jump, it becomes quite a powerful feature.

The flight and jump bonuses are good enough (though explaining whether 5ft or 1ft = +1 to jump would be useful) for the capstone of this class, especially seeing that it is short (5 levels), and you gain 1 BAB, 1 maneuver, 1 maneuver readied, and 1 stance.

The-Mage-King
2011-01-15, 12:21 AM
This means that you will hit 25% more of the time when in a Diamond Mind or Hero's Edge stance than when not in a stance. That is a *huge* melee boost. It would be more appropriate if it was +2 or +3 at the maximum. Anything higher, and you'll fall off of the RNG, which is bad. Top off the flight, and the bonus to jump, it becomes quite a powerful feature.

The flight and jump bonuses are good enough (though explaining whether 5ft or 1ft = +1 to jump would be useful) for the capstone of this class, especially seeing that it is short (5 levels), and you gain 1 BAB, 1 maneuver, 1 maneuver readied, and 1 stance.

Hm... Point. Give me a minute to adjust that a little...

Havvy
2011-01-15, 01:57 AM
Background Music (Ex): Upon first entering this PrC, you, somehow, manifests an extraordinary piece of background music that is active most of the time. The type of music for this class feature is usually something foreboding, with ominous Latin chanting, but may be something else. This effect if usually active, giving the Follower of the Third a -10 penalty on Move Silently checks, but a +5 bonus on Intimidate checks made in a duel of wills or to demoralize an opponent. This can be suppressed as a move action, but reactivates at the first appropriate dramatic moment.

I would write as:


Background Music (Ex): Upon first becoming a follower of the third, background music manifests around you for 30 ft. The music is something foreboding, usually with ominous Latin chanting, but possibly another accompaniment. This effect if usually active, causing a follower of the third to fail all Move Silently checks against creatures that can hear the music. When performing a duel of wills against a creature that can hear the music, that creatures takes a -5 penalty. The background music can be suppressed as a move action, but reactivates at the first appropriate dramatic moment.

This removes the meta-elements from the description, gives a range to the background music, makes the background music give the target a penalty instead of granting you a bonus (more flavor than anything), and makes move silently an auto-fail against those who can hear it.

For the example, I'd write "(If your base land speed was 30ft, you would gain a +6 bonus to Jump)" since base land speed has many things that can change it, of which the racial base is only one.

The-Mage-King
2011-01-15, 10:01 AM
I would write as:

This removes the meta-elements from the description, gives a range to the background music, makes the background music give the target a penalty instead of granting you a bonus (more flavor than anything), and makes move silently an auto-fail against those who can hear it.


My only issue is that the bonus on Intimidate checks is good for both Duel of Wills and demoralizing. I'll use the part about Move Silently auto-failing, but the Intimidate part needs to stay a bonus.


For the example, I'd write "(If your base land speed was 30ft, you would gain a +6 bonus to Jump)" since base land speed has many things that can change it, of which the racial base is only one.

Yeah, I'll edit that once more.

Havvy
2011-01-18, 04:40 PM
The feat prerequisite for the follower of the third says Hero's Grip. Is that meant to be Hero's Blade or some other feat? If it is another feat, can you say where it is from?

The-Mage-King
2011-01-18, 04:46 PM
The feat prerequisite for the follower of the third says Hero's Grip. Is that meant to be Hero's Blade or some other feat? If it is another feat, can you say where it is from?

It's supposed to be Hero's Blade.


...I'll edit it when I get home.

Hazzardevil
2011-01-27, 04:14 PM
TMK already knows how much I like this dicipline, so I have decided to make a post on it. I even decided to allow this to be one off the diciplines available for my homebrew monk.
I to be honest preferred teh theme music when you could still make move silently checks. Mostly so something like this could happen.

Heroic edge: I am sneaking, I am sneaking.
BBEG: What the hell is that music?
Heroic edge: Physic rejecting power of awesome!
Slash/stab/bludgeon/range/magic