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View Full Version : It's that time again- need some help for a "healer"



Fizban
2010-09-28, 11:58 AM
For the first time in a while it looks like there's a game (DnD 3.0/5) that I could be joining, so it's time to roll up a character. I see these sorts of threads all the time, but every one's a little bit different, so here's mine:

I need advice for a 6th level person with healing capability. The DM flies by the seat of his pants (in his own words) and the game is supposed to be focused on teaching a couple new players, so I need to be mostly self-reliant and not too complicated. They've been using mostly core-only and while he said I could bring in a couple other things if I need them, I don't want to go overboard. When asked what kind of character the party needs, he said they could use someone that could heal, so I'm thinking cleric or druid.

Obviously I don't want to spend every round healing, but I would like to know which of the cheap healing boosters from say, MiC, would be best at this level so that when I do have to heal it will be most effective. If there's a good low level feat that will give a boost that would also work. It doesn't sound like the party will be returning to town any time soon so I can't just rely on wands. I'm leaning more towards druid because it has more options and I think it would require fewer outside sources to get going, but they aren't as good at burst healing as clerics. The DM said his one problem with druids was people that weren't using the class effectively (he refers to it as an advanced player class), and while I know my stuff in that department I'd still like to have that emergency healing ready because I know the party will expect it.

So playgrounders, ready for an encore?

jgumbyrx
2010-09-28, 12:56 PM
well, HERE (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/20066481/Optimized_Healer)'s a little something I put together a while back. (and can be toned-down as needed).

not sure if that's what you're looking for, but that's my 2cp.

Fouredged Sword
2010-09-28, 01:05 PM
Cleric of palor is a good option. Healing capable tank and melee fighter. Go dwarf and hit things with a two handed weapon. Add heals after combat to bring people back up to health. Consider takeing draconic aura vigor from dragon magic as your little something from another book. (free healing up to half everyones HP)

For a skillmonkey version of above see the bard class.

For a bear version of above see the druid class.

For a minmax version of the above be a rogue with a wand of lessor vigor or simply any class with a belt of healing or three, or ten (magic item compendium).

Healing is mostly an out of combat situation though, so don't focus to hard on it. Damage will outstripe healing without serious amounts of cheeze, so I would just focus on picking your friends up when they fall and healing after battle.

Caliphbubba
2010-09-28, 01:11 PM
I know you said mostly Core only, but if you can get some other stuff in an
Eldritch Disciple might be cool. Cleric3/Warlock2/ED1 w/ the healing blast gift of the divine patron. Pretty much unlimited out of combat healing.

Edit: doh I forgot about the spend a turn attempt to activate the gift of the divine patron. lame.

Fizban
2010-09-28, 02:18 PM
Thanks jgumbyrx, that's the kind of stuff I'm looking for. The stuff from Complete Champion is pretty good, though I'm somewhat annoyed that I couldn't use Sacred Healing (PHBII) with an Amulet of Retributive Healing. It looks like all the good ways to boost healing are cleric only so I won't be able to try and pull double duty as a druid, rats.

jgumbyrx
2010-09-28, 03:02 PM
well, if you wanted to do the druid thing and healbot, then you could always just take the feat "Spontaneous Healer" from Complete Divine.

Fizban
2010-09-28, 03:12 PM
It's not the spontaneity, it's that Druids get cure spells a level later, so that's a whole die (and +2-4 from feat) less. Although it looks like they get the vigor spells at the same time, so if I could be completely sure healing was only out of combat, it'd be okay. But like I said, the only thing they don't have is someone for those in combat emergencies.

Keld Denar
2010-09-28, 03:24 PM
I like cleric with a side of action denial. Cleric3/ChurchInquisitor6/whatever gives you the awesome Inquisition domain for uber dispels, and near immunity to the Illusion and Enchantment schools of magic. Then load up with things like Divine Defiance (Immediate action counterspell, Fiendish Codex II), Battlemagic Perception spell (Clr3 from HoBattle), and a pair of rings, Greater Counterspelling and Spell Battle respectively. That gives you a ton of options for playing mother-may-I with enemy spellcasters. Preventing damage is the best kind of healing. Its also a rather low investment of resources, so you can dump a couple other feats on things like Divine Spell Powah, Augemented Healing, Healing Touch, Divine Ward, or a few other really nice clericy toys.

Zaydos
2010-09-28, 03:28 PM
There's also Touch of Healing from Complete Champion to keep all your allies at 50% health outside of combat; it's a feat and requires you to keep a 2nd level or higher healing subschool spell available to be cast.

Yuki Akuma
2010-09-28, 03:41 PM
Any class capable of using a wand of lesser vigor.

jiriku
2010-09-28, 04:02 PM
It's not the spontaneity, it's that Druids get cure spells a level later, so that's a whole die (and +2-4 from feat) less. Although it looks like they get the vigor spells at the same time, so if I could be completely sure healing was only out of combat, it'd be okay. But like I said, the only thing they don't have is someone for those in combat emergencies.

This is not an issue for you once you reach 7th level. SNA4 for a unicorn and you've got healing plus a meat shield.


However, cleric is undeniably a stronger healer. Assuming you take the Augment Healing feat (and you should), the key healing spells for an effective healer are not cure spells. They are:

L1: lesser vigor
L2: close wounds
L3: insignia of healing
L4: positive energy aura, healing spirit
L5: darts of healing, energetic healing, healing circle

also utilize revenance + revivify for all your cheap-rez-with-no-level-loss needs.

mabriss lethe
2010-09-28, 04:15 PM
It'll require two outside sources: Tome of Magic and Complete Champion.

Binder 5 (minimum) with Improved Binding and Healing Devotion.
Bind Tenebrous. At the beginning of your adventuring day, take a few minutes to transfer Healing devotions to your party powered by your pool of ever-refreshing turn/rebuke attempts. Your party can now gain a minute of fast healing by spending their own immediate actions and after combat, you can top them up using the same trick.

Person_Man
2010-09-28, 04:16 PM
Incarnate 4/Crusader 2

Incarante gives you the Theraputic Mantle soulmeld. ANY healing effect gets a Spell Level + Essentia Invested bonus. Incarnate is also chock full of Skill and Defensive buffs. DR, SR, retributive damage, etc.

Crusader: Martial Spirit stance. 2 points of healing whenever you hit someone. Plus numerous other Divine Spirit maneuvers heal. A nice DM will let you use this out of combat as well.

At this ECL you should have an essentia capacity of 3 (2 from hit dice, 1 from Incarnate). Martial Spirit doesn't have a spell level, but when combined with Theraputic Mantle it will still heal 5 points of damage whenever you hit something. It shouldn't be hard to rack up 4ish+ attacks per turn. Thus you can heal 20ish points of damage every round just by attacking, without spending any additional actions.

From there you might want to head into Hellreaver, which can heal 10/20/30 points per round (it scales with your level) to yourself or allies as a Swift Action every round.

Fizban
2010-09-28, 04:44 PM
[Dispel Build with heals]
I like the build, but the DM told me they've only fought 2 casters so I don't think I'll need that much dispelling.

Touch of Healing
A must have, naturally. It'll be staying on the list as long as it's okay'd.

[Spells]
Yup, gotta love the Revenance trick. Where's this Insignia spell located?

[Out of the box thinking]
This is why I wish I knew incarnum better, all those wacky effects. This is also a cool build, but it's far too complicated for this game. Even though I could keep track of it myself and all the other players would need to do is mark healing, I don't think the DM would like the difference.

[More tricks]
And here's another good trick, but still too wacky for this game. Filed for later use :smallbiggrin:

Keld Denar
2010-09-28, 04:56 PM
I think Insignia of Healing is in Races of Destiny.

Fizban
2010-09-28, 05:32 PM
Dang, that is a pretty nifty spell. Or rather, it's Mass Cure Light at a more appropriate level than 5th. Which is nifty.

Well, here's what I've got so far:

Human Cleric (Good, Magic) Spontaneous Restoration variant
Feats: Augment Healing, Imbued Healing (B), Touch of Healing, Divine Spell Power

For healing spells I'd bring some Lesser Vigor's for topping off after using the Touch out of combat, then Close Wounds, Healing Insignia/Mass Lesser Vigor, and Light of Venya. Aside from entering every fight with full hp, I should be able to give everyone DR 3/evil in every fight and can also dole out +2 on saves against magic if a spellcaster appears, and LoV is a ranged heal with a huge boost from DSP. Cure and Restoration spells are on spontaneous tap.

Buff spells: Bless is pretty basic, Magic Circle is useful, need another level before Recitation and Divine Power. Any suggestions?

Combat: Frost Breath and Nauseating Breath give me a couple save or lose effects, and I can use Brambles for melee damage or Darkfire for ranged. Brambles and Darkfire both greatly benefit from a CL increase and I can use Light of Faith to make sure I get it with DSP. Tremor seems pretty nifty.

Gear: fullplate, shield, and Amulet of Retributive Healing are all good, but that leaves quite a bit of cash left. The best I can think of so far is just a Circlet of Mages for extra spells. We're given a Handy Haversack and Ring of Sustenance free for convenience. As before, I'm looking for things that won't be obviously disruptive. Anklets of Translocation are great, but very obvious, and the other players might not like my having an item none of theirs can compare to, so the DM would probably like me to keep it low key.

Keld Denar
2010-09-28, 05:37 PM
If you plan on making excessive use of Divine Spell Power, look into taking levels of Sacred Exorcist. You can get your first level at 8, and by ECL12, you'll have a persistant Consecration field. This field supplies you with a continuous +3 bonus on all TU checks, and DSP is a TU check. Also, anything that increases your Cha or Cha checks (such as Marshall's Motivate Cha minor aura) will also increase your DSP check. Its not hard to optimize it a bit to where you'll break even on a 1, and everything you roll above 1 is golden, and only a little harder to be able to get +20 so that even a roll of 1 results in +4 effective levels. Just sayin.

jiriku
2010-09-28, 08:31 PM
Divine Spell Power + Heighten Turning will give you +4 caster level pretty much every time.

I like light of venya. Hadn't noticed that spell before. Pity it's not conjuration (healing) so you can combine it with Augment Healing, but then again, healing for up to 2d6+20 out to Medium range at your level is pretty spiffy, as is the ability to break the healing into two packets.

You might consider the Divine Restoration cleric ACF from Dungeonscape. You'll have to give up one of your domain powers, but you gain the ability to spontaneously convert spells to cast lesser restoration, restoration, and greater restoration.

If you can spare a feat slot for Scribe Scroll, a good use for some of that spare wealth would be to prepare extras of spells like lesser restoration (if you didn't get the ACF), remove disease, slow poison, remove paralysis, remove fear, remove blindness/deafness, and other counters to various status debuffs. Heck, even without Scribe Scroll, buying a couple of these wouldn't hurt.

GoodbyeSoberDay
2010-09-28, 08:37 PM
If you can't get DMM Persisted Mass Lesser Vigor through (yeah, a bit cheesy, but it helps the whole party and reduces downtime), I second Wands of Lesser Vigor. Often enough, though, the real need for a cleric is in his superior ability to remove conditions (poison, disease, curses, what have you). Even if (when, hopefully) you're not healing every round, the party will love you if you get rid of all the non-hp nasties.

Fizban
2010-09-29, 01:50 AM
@ Keld: Hey, I never even thought of Consecrate, that's a nice extra boost. I'm reading Sacred Exorcist as getting that power at 5th for ECL 13.

@jiriku: Divine Restoration is what I meant, yeah. Ability damage is not something you want to wait till tomorrow to cure, and the good domain only gives a measly +1 CL with good spells, so it's practically free. I wasn't thinking of scribe scroll, but that would also be a good idea, and once I get gear down to the last few thousand I'll grab some scrolls and save the rest for cash.

@GoodbyeSoberDay: Yup. I haven't put together a daily list yet, but hopefully there will be some room for Healing Lorecall in there, and then cash for a few scrolls of emergency curse breaking and whatnot. There's actually a guy in the party with a cursed item blinding him right now so I almost want to go without such a scroll simply so I can say "Hmm, while my powers are not strong enough to cure him, I feel they may be soon, OOC translation: I can do it next level."

NineThePuma
2010-09-29, 01:56 AM
If the DM allows homebrew, try the Healer class by TG Oskar; it's a devoted support unit that I've found to be very efficient. That's just my two coppers, anywho.

Malbordeus
2010-09-29, 04:49 AM
ugh, Divine spell power... surely there are better feats?

looking at the PHB2 there are a few good divine feats - divine ward and sacred healing come immediatly to mind, and sacred purification.

sacred healing provides a bigger healing bumpf to your higher level spells than just a higher caster level will aford from Divine spellpower.

might I also sugest losing a domain for Divine Magician (alternate class feature from CM) as there are a few good arcane abjurations that dont turn up on the cleric list.

and spells - my group swears by Mass Aid as loss of temp hp is hp you dont need to heal... also provokes a lot of off colour jokes around the table too. so bonus :P

HunterOfJello
2010-09-29, 07:13 AM
You could always ask your DM if you could play a Pathfinder Cleric.

They get a healing burst ability that they can use multiple times per day instead of Turn Undead.

Fizban
2010-09-29, 10:15 AM
ugh, Divine spell power... surely there are better feats?

looking at the PHB2 there are a few good divine feats - divine ward and sacred healing come immediatly to mind, and sacred purification.

sacred healing provides a bigger healing bumpf to your higher level spells than just a higher caster level will aford from Divine spellpower.

might I also sugest losing a domain for Divine Magician (alternate class feature from CM) as there are a few good arcane abjurations that dont turn up on the cleric list.

and spells - my group swears by Mass Aid as loss of temp hp is hp you dont need to heal... also provokes a lot of off colour jokes around the table too. so bonus :P

I have ranged healing spells so I don't need Divine Ward, and Sacred Healing (PHBII) is worse than Augment Healing, which I already have. Divine Spell Power isn't for healing anyway, it's for attacking. Divine Magician is nice but then I'd lose an option for Imbued Healing. Mass Aid isn't bad but it's not a healing spell so it loses the benefit of two feats.

Eldariel
2010-09-29, 10:55 AM
ugh, Divine spell power... surely there are better feats?

Huh? It's among the best feats a Cleric can take O.o

Keld Denar
2010-09-29, 02:48 PM
Actually, Divine Spell Power is not for attacking, but for buffing. With something like Greater Magic Weapon of Magic Vestaments, the +4 CL can, and probably will, bump you into the next bracket of effectiveness. It also makes your buffs MUCH harder to dispel, a VERY important distinction when you start dealing with extra-planars who can GDM at will.

You'll probably end up doing more damage over the course of 1 combat by giving someone a +5 GMW instead of a +4 GMW than you will by dealing an extra 4d6 damage with a Flame Strike or such.

Its also handy for dispelling, provided you haven't hit the +20 cap on GDM or the +25 cap on Chain Dispel.

Eldariel
2010-09-29, 04:14 PM
Actually, Divine Spell Power is not for attacking, but for buffing. With something like Greater Magic Weapon of Magic Vestaments, the +4 CL can, and probably will, bump you into the next bracket of effectiveness. It also makes your buffs MUCH harder to dispel, a VERY important distinction when you start dealing with extra-planars who can GDM at will.

You'll probably end up doing more damage over the course of 1 combat by giving someone a +5 GMW instead of a +4 GMW than you will by dealing an extra 4d6 damage with a Flame Strike or such.

Its also handy for dispelling, provided you haven't hit the +20 cap on GDM or the +25 cap on Chain Dispel.

Don't forget how convenient it is to get four extra hours on your all-day buffs, especially before like 20.

KingoftheTrees
2010-09-29, 06:52 PM
You could always take the Sacred Healing feat from Complete Divine. One turn attempt to grant all allies within 60 feet fast healing 3 for1 +( your Cha mod) rounds.
If you really want to be a healing battery, try Radiant Servant of Pelor with the Spontaneous Domain Casting(Healing) ACF from PHB II, then take the feat Improved Domain Power (Healing) in Dragon 342, page 24 to cast any Conjuration (healing) spells at range 1/cleric level/day (range of close).

jgumbyrx
2010-09-29, 08:20 PM
If you really want to be a healing battery, try Radiant Servant of Pelor with the Spontaneous Domain Casting(Healing) ACF from PHB II, then take the feat Improved Domain Power (Healing) in Dragon 342, page 24 to cast any Conjuration (healing) spells at range 1/cleric level/day (range of close).

um, I think I already covered this:

well, HERE (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/20066481/Optimized_Healer)'s a little something I put together a while back. (and can be toned-down as needed).


I'm just sayin'. :tongue:

Fizban
2010-09-29, 08:50 PM
Actually, Divine Spell Power is not for attacking, but for buffing. With something like Greater Magic Weapon of Magic Vestaments, the +4 CL can, and probably will, bump you into the next bracket of effectiveness. It also makes your buffs MUCH harder to dispel, a VERY important distinction when you start dealing with extra-planars who can GDM at will.

You'll probably end up doing more damage over the course of 1 combat by giving someone a +5 GMW instead of a +4 GMW than you will by dealing an extra 4d6 damage with a Flame Strike or such.

Its also handy for dispelling, provided you haven't hit the +20 cap on GDM or the +25 cap on Chain Dispel.
My plan is to use it on Light of Venya and Darkfire to max out their healing/damange to 2d6+20 and 5d6 per attack respectively, assuming a good roll. That would make LoV just about as good as cure serious but with range, and with haste or a couple more levels would give me 10d6 ranged touch per round on Darkfire. A pair of 1d8+10 Nimbus of Lights at the start of combat would also be useful, and of course if the DM starts dispelling I can use it to block that instead.

Don't forget how convenient it is to get four extra hours on your all-day buffs, especially before like 20.
I hadn't thought of that either, but 4 more hours is quite a long time indeed.

I got some more information on the dungeon and magic items. The group is a good party thrown in the dungeon by an evil aligned city government, and in order to get out they have to kill everything inside. Aside from a few +1 weapons most of their magic items are unidentified or otherwise unusable until they get out and back to town for liquidation, and he's also counting the Haversacks and Rings of Sustenance against their WBL. This means that aside from the AoRH that he okay'd in place of a +1 weapon the DM would like me to eschew anything nifty and just bring some emergency scrolls and potions. So I guess with those simplifications I don't need any more help for gear.