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Sipex
2010-10-22, 03:02 PM
So I realised I don't have a compelling BBEG written up yet and need some help figuring it out. My PCs are almost paragon (as of next session they will be) so there's been A LOT of story. I'm not going to shove it all down because it'll just overwhelm you guys. I'll post characters and you can give me input somehow.

Knowing these characters and their histories can anyone recommend anything? Bero was my original choice (detailed below) but the party kind of killed him.

Party (6 players, 1 DMPC)

R'tas - Half-elf Rogue
Lived in a small xenophobic town called Brixham which is almost entirely populated by elves. His father was a human and mother elf. His mother was killed when he was 14 and the town naturally blamed his father. His father left (for unknown reasons so far) and he banished himself, being constantly persecuted. He became a hooligan and lived off the streets for the rest of his teen years.
Very chaotic and random but good at heart.
Recently fought and killed his full-elf brother, Bero who worked for the cult the PCs are currently fighting against.

Thel - Half-elf Wizard
Lives in the largest city on the continent called Tarrow and currently attending the mage academy there. Near graduating. Was doing field work for his degree when he got swept up with the party. Kind of a know-it-all, very friendly and a bit naive.
Parents are alive and well within the city (both half-elves). Currently good friends with an older human student named Cyrus who will be graduating when he does. Recently (as of last session) had his girlfriend leave him and has gone emo.

Siarae - Tiefling Infernalock
Currently suffering a bout of memory loss so she doesn't remember who she is for the most part. Started performing mercenary jobs while she tries to figure out what exactly happened to her. Has an odd tattoo on her arm which is arcane in nature but she knows nothing about (in reality, it causes her memory loss). Very flirty, arrogant and a bit mean spirited.
Recently has been visited by an imp on several occasions who serves a demon lord of some sort. The demon lord apparently granted her her powers and now wants payment in the form of favours...or else. Siarae is currently trying to devote herself to Avandra (goddess of freedom) to help break her bonds with the demon.

Caelynna - Eladrin Fighter
Works as a professional mercenary after running away from home due to a disagreement with her father over an arranged marriage. Kind of flirty and very non-traditional. Also hot-headed.
Recently returned home and met her fiance Mindartis. Went through a bunch of stuff with the group there which resulted the in finding out Mindartis was actually dead and had been replaced with a Lamia who had managed to gain control over her father as well. Climactic battle resulted in a dead Lamia (they blew him up) and she made peace with her father.
Her father re-incarnated Mindartis as a horse who she can now telepathically speak to.

Harrow - Dwarven Cleric DMPC
Follows the party, keeping an eye on R'tas due to a request made by the boy's father when he left town. Very anti-social, crabby and generally dwarf-ish. Recently caught up with R'tas who had dissapeared for 10 years.

??? - Elf Ranger/Archer and MoonSorrow - Eladrin Wizard (Illusion based)
Don't know much about these two as they're very very new. They joined the party as mercenaries and have accepted an offer to join them after some work together. ??? is very shy and quiet while MoonSorrow is contemplative.

MoonSorrow comes from a clan of Eladrin who rely heavily on mental powers.


Enemies so far

Bero - Elf - DEAD
Brother to R'tas and worked for a cult the party is currently working against. Shares the same mother as R'tas and bore a grudge against his mother (who left his father and married a human) and his hometown Brixham (which didn't do anything about it, despite their displeasure). Didn't blame R'tas for it though, wanted R'tas to join him.

John - Human - DEAD x2
A Lieutenant in the cult the party is working against. Captured them once when they were snooping around his camp and the party fought back, burning his camp to the group and burning him badly. Seeking revenge he hunted them down and was killed after the wizard used mage hand to wrestle his axe away from him.
Was sort of re-animated with a fusion of technology and necromancy as a mindless soldier and killed again. The party burnt his body the second time.

Doppleganger - DEAD
A female doppleganger who infiltrated the party at request of mayor Astral Caine. Fought the party several times and was eventually killed.

Astral Caine - Tiefling
Ex-mayor of South Farathon City. Originally hired the party to exterminate goblin raiders. Party then uncovered a plot orchestrated by the mayor which was causing the goblin raids inadvertantly. Arrested and escaped from the desert prison Lalivero during a raid (where the party was present). Holds a grudge against the party for exposing him, defeating him and ruining his plans.

Jalal - Dragonborn
Warden of the desert prison Lalivero (Golden Sun ripoff go!) the PCs recently visited. Also invested in a kidnapping plot of the country's mages which the PCs foiled. Currently arrested by the BRPO. Siarae has also been instructed to kill him by her demon lord.

Imp
Serves Siarae's demon lord by deliverying 'requests' to Siarae. Very cheeky, calls Siarae 'Toots'. So far has made Siarae kill a gang leader, give up half her healing surges to save a White Dragon and instructed her to kill Jalal.

Demon Lord
Unknown so far, besides the fact he/she/it granted Siarae her power. I was thinking maybe Asmodeus.

Green Dragon
Had Kobolds who were stealing stuff from Brixham. Party negotiated with it for it to leave the area. Tricked Thel into putting on a belt which changed his sex for a few levels.

Hobgoblins
Lead by a crazed hobgoblin who was killed by R'tas in an epic infiltration/assassination. Attacked the city of Tarrow and were subdued by the White Dragon who took command after their leader was killed.

White Dragon
Took over the Hobgoblin army (who was paying him already). After being influenced and nearly consumed by a crystal and then saved by Siarae he stopped the attack in return for her saving his life.

Mindartis the Lamia - DEAD
A Lamia who killed Caelynna's fiance, Mindartis, and wore his skin. Also managed to take control of Caelynna's father for a bit with a powerful orb. Wanted Caelynna's skin to escape the fey with. Blown up.

Farathon gang leader - DEAD
Lead a gang in South Farathon City. Was killed by R'tas after Siarae was told to kill her and managed to get the party's help.

Chaotic Entity
Odd entity the players don't really know about yet. Sealed within the planet's 'red moon' after an event 800 years ago. Able to manipulate people through red shards which were somehow involved in it's sealing. Wants nothing more than to consume. Makes for a good epic battle but not a relatable BBEG.


NPCs

Blythe - Catfolk
A rogue who was hired by Astral Caine to infiltrate the party and report back to him. Eventually joined the party after getting R'tas arrested and helped take down the mayor. Sort of dating R'tas now.

Euphora - Doppleganger
Part of a tribe of dopplegangers who have sworn off their transforming powers. Recently was dating Thel but then left him after the event she was investigating was resolved. Didn't want to risk hurting him since she could never really stay with him due to personal matters. Possibly pregnant.

Pete - Human
Leader of the 'Tarrow Guild of Adventurers'. Old and friendly. Manages jobs for the group. Recently injured in a suspicious raid.

Johnathan - Human
A young thief turned engineer who tried to mug the party at the start of the campaign and was captured and brought to justice. Turns out he was just misguided and desperate. Party met up with him later and hired him under the 'Tarrow Guild of Adventurers' as their engineer.

Eileen - Halfling
Leader of the BRPO, an organisation working against the cult the party is working against. Recently proposed to transfer the party's guild under her organisation. They accepted.

Lindal - Halfling
A halfling informant who travelled with the party for a bit. Taught a few of them to speak goblin.

Aaron - Human - DEAD
The guide in the party's very first quest. Helped them fight off goblins before the party realised the goblins weren't inheritly evil. Was killed by Astral Caine after being captured.

Jane - Human
Thel was briefly captured by Astral Caine's secret police, during that time he met another prisoner named Jane, a young girl of 18. Thel felt naturally attracted to her but she was carted away and he hasn't seen her since although he did look for her for a bit.

Male Dragonborn and Male Dwarf
Two prisoners Thel escaped the secret police with. Helped him escape.

Cyrus - Human
A student at Tarrow's Mage Academy. Kind of like a Teacher's Assistant as well. Slightly older than Thel and a bit of a mentor to him. Aids Thel and friends however he can.

Headmaster - Human?
The headmaster of the Mage Academy. Not much is known about him really. He's nice enough though but usually very busy.

Jonah - Half-elf
A little boy the party volunteered to seek out after he dissapeared. Was kidnapped by Kobolds when he and his friends tried to liberate stuff being stolen by them. Has inate sorcery powers and was kidnapped again by Jalal then by Astral Caine (Mokuba? heh). Currently with his mother in Tarrow. Party has taken a liking to him.

Jonah's friends
They're Jonah's friends, all elves who live in Brixham. They don't mind that Jonah is only half-elf.

Gerkin and Wicket
Two goblins the party has be-friended and gotten to work with them. Both helped the party in uncovering Astral Caine's plot.

Goblins
A sort of tribal society which lives in the Farathon Forest. Got kind of pissed off since Astral Caine was having their forest secretly logged. Okay now that this has been resolved. Yes, I had been reading Goblins when I decided on this, shush.

Mindartis the Horse
Originally set up in an arranged marriage with Caelynna, was killed and replaced by a Lamia who wanted her skin. As gratitude (and a bit of cheese), Caelynna's father re-incarnated Mindartis as a Horse who now speaks telepathically to Caelynna.

Caelynna's Father
Bit fuzzy on details here but he's some sort of arch mage of Caelynna's city. Originally had a falling out with her but they have made up since then. Controlled by a Lamia for a short time.

Eladrin Couple
A young Eladrin Couple who were arranged to be married but had never met. Met in secret against their family wishes and had a run-in with a medusa. Cured by the party.

Tvtyrant
2010-10-22, 03:12 PM
Use a warlock that belongs to your demonlord; with the exception that your warlock actually thinks he is said demonlord; he even looks like him! Then when your characters run into him they will run rather then fight it out, giving him longevity/allowing your part to survive if they go for the throat.

I would switch it to Mephistopheles though, and have the warlock use hellfire.

Daelen
2010-10-22, 03:20 PM
Take reference from video games, TV shows and movies you enjoy. Personally I've been wanting to include a Sephiroth style villain in a game at some point. Make him relatable but such an ******* you HAVE to kill him by the end.

Burner28
2010-10-22, 05:17 PM
I suppose the key to making an relatable Big Bad is to make sure that the character in question is more than just some archetype.

For example they may have a certain technique in battles, ideology, personality, advantages, disadvantages, goal, motivation, appearance, etc. You can use these words as categories to start you off maybe. By the way, this is just my general guide and not really vital to be used, but you may feel that it benefits you

The evil overlord
History
The overlord may have started off his life as a member of a noble line of people known throughout the history due to their charm and strategic intelligence emphasizing on teamwork and family honor. However due to some reason or other, said noble line gets kicked out by some revolutionists some time before the overlord is born. His parents escaped from said revolutionists and goes off living somewhere more safe where they won't be discovered, changing their appearance. The revolutionaries win, but over the years, for whatever reason, lets the place they rule descent into chaos despite the fact they promised to lead the place into a better future, and no other rulers, adventurers, etc. are either around to or willing to help the citizens

During the years that the evil overlord is raised, he and his younger siblings are taught about their family history, and how the revolutionaries killed their grandparents. Not just that, but they are also told about the state the revolutionaries left the place in. These information as well as some others I can't really specifically say, leads these siblings to feel anger at not just the way in which their family is "destroyed", but also the fact that in their opinions the revolutionaries are selfish, dishonorable hypocrites who betrayed the trust of decent people.

When the siblings were old enough to adventure, they decided to work together, electing the evil overlord as their leader, and so goes around traveling using any means that they feel is necessary in order to be strong enough in order to defeat the revolutionaries.

Motivation(From the character's point of view)
We will need to defeat those scums, those criminals, in order to get rid of the obstacles that stand in the way of that dying nation's glorious restoration. To restore order is to restore peace- this is what our mother, our father, my grandmother, our grandfather and our ancestors would have been proud of. Siblings, as sure as I am that I am dressed in blue, so I am sure that we are the only ones with the intelligence, the pragmatism and the will to save these poor people from those illfitting mockeries of what it means to be a good ruler. We were always meant to rule these people and so it is only us that has the skill needed to fulfill our destiny and restore our tainted image. But we must do it with honor. We must do it whilst not violating the inalienable rights of the innocents. We must never sink to their standard by hurting innocent, noble children. Because as sure as I am that we would not dare harm each other and therefore act dishonorable so we must have taboos concerning the weak and the poor, especially when we will be rulers and save that nation and to do that, I cannot use cowards.

Personality
The evil overlord is charming, easygoing, fierily loyal to any loved ones and to his goal and fettered by his conscience to carry out any task that he feels goes beyond his self interests. He has a high expectations in general, not just of his success, but also of his siblings' potentials, willing to help them get through whatever issues they had. Yet he is always mercilessly assessing them in whatever situation they are in based on their current performance. He himself is always seeking to rise above what he feels he can do, always fearing he isn't maintaining his family honor.

Strength
His biggest strength is his ability to come across as charming and likable. This serves him well because of the fact this attracts goons looking for work. He is able to use his personality to motivate his siblings as well as those that works around him.

Weakness
His biggest weakness is the fact he is too reliant on his siblings lacking a independent mentality. To combat this, he makes sure to try not to be alone when he is vulnerable.

jiriku
2010-10-22, 06:00 PM
My money's on Cyrus, who, while genuinely Thel's friend, has ambitions to replace the headmaster as head of the mage's college and is willing to manipulate those around him into unwittingly contributing to his rise. You can have a great moment with this:


Thel: "Cyrus, it was you all along! How could you?"
Cyrus: "Sorry old friend, but only you had the power to do this, and I couldn't ask you and take the risk that you'd say no. And now...you know too much. Goodbye/"
Thel: "What do you mean?"
Cyrus: "I have to kill you now. I'm sorry, Thel."

Frosty
2010-10-22, 06:08 PM
I suppose the key to making an relatable Big Bad is to make sure that the character in question is more than just some archetype.

For example they may have a certain technique in battles, ideology, personality, advantages, disadvantages, goal, motivation, appearance, etc. You can use these words as categories to start you off maybe. By the way, this is just my general guide and not really vital to be used, but you may feel that it benefits you

The evil overlord
History
The overlord may have started off his life as a member of a noble line of people known throughout the history due to their charm and strategic intelligence emphasizing on teamwork and family honor. However due to some reason or other, said noble line gets kicked out by some revolutionists some time before the overlord is born. His parents escaped from said revolutionists and goes off living somewhere more safe where they won't be discovered, changing their appearance. The revolutionaries win, but over the years, for whatever reason, lets the place they rule descent into chaos despite the fact they promised to lead the place into a better future, and no other rulers, adventurers, etc. are either around to or willing to help the citizens

During the years that the evil overlord is raised, he and his younger siblings are taught about their family history, and how the revolutionaries killed their grandparents. Not just that, but they are also told about the state the revolutionaries left the place in. These information as well as some others I can't really specifically say, leads these siblings to feel anger at not just the way in which their family is "destroyed", but also the fact that in their opinions the revolutionaries are selfish, dishonorable hypocrites who betrayed the trust of decent people.

When the siblings were old enough to adventure, they decided to work together, electing the evil overlord as their leader, and so goes around traveling using any means that they feel is necessary in order to be strong enough in order to defeat the revolutionaries.

[/B]Motivation(From the character's point of view)[/B]
We will need to defeat those scums, those criminals, in order to get rid of the obstacles that stand in the way of that dying nation's glorious restoration. To restore order is to restore peace- this is what our mother, our father, my grandmother, our grandfather and our ancestors would have been proud of. Siblings, as sure as I am that I am dressed in blue, so I am sure that we are the only ones with the intelligence, the pragmatism and the will to save these poor people from those illfitting mockeries of what it means to be a good ruler. We were always meant to rule these people and so it is only us that has the skill needed to fulfill our destiny and restore our tainted image. But we must do it with honor. We must do it whilst not violating the inalienable rights of the innocents. We must never sink to their standard by hurting innocent, noble children. Because as sure as I am that we would not dare harm each other and therefore act dishonorable so we must have taboos concerning the weak and the poor, especially when we will be rulers and save that nation and to do that, I cannot use cowards.

Personality
The evil overlord is charming, easygoing, fierily loyal to any loved ones and to his goal and fettered by his conscience to carry out any task that he feels goes beyond his self interests. He has a high expectations in general, not just of his success, but also of his siblings' potentials, willing to help them get through whatever issues they had. Yet he is always mercilessly assessing them in whatever situation they are in based on their current performance. He himself is always seeking to rise above what he feels he can do, always fearing he isn't maintaining his family honor.

Strength
His biggest strength is his ability to come across as charming and likable. This serves him well because of the fact this attracts goons looking for work. He is able to use his personality to motivate his siblings as well as those that works around him.

Weakness
His biggest weakness is the fact he is too reliant on his siblings lacking a independent mentality. To combat this, he makes sure to try not to be alone when he is vulnerable.
This Evil Overlord could be Lawful Neutral, depending on what acts he is willing to do. The fact that he is unwilling to hurt innocents already pushes him away from Evil somewhat.

JonestheSpy
2010-10-22, 06:26 PM
Take reference from video games, TV shows and movies you enjoy.

Jayzuz, doesn't anyone read frickin' BOOKS anymore? You know, the actual source material most games, movies, and TV are inspired by?..grumble, grumble...

Anyway, what occurs to me is that this unnamed demon lord should be behind almost everything. It's the entity the cult was worshiping, whether they knew it or not, and is '"helping" the party at the same time. Have it actually be pulling the strings of Eileen and the BRPO, too. Eileen would probably be the one to have the climactic battle with, unless you choose a demon much less powerful than Asmodeus or his peers, but she would still be the "relatable" one.

Now why is the demon doing all this? You'll have to figure that out. Maybe it's just promoting conflict - destructive, unnecessary conflict - for its own sake like the IFCC does. Maybe all these battles will lead to the weakening of some gate or barrier that limits his power, or it's trying to free the Chaotic Entity so it can destroy the world!

Aron Times
2010-10-23, 01:25 AM
Lelouch from Code Geass is the hero because he's the main character. Otherwise, he would be the villain. Seriously, the sheer amount of mind-controlled minions he sacrifices makes most BBEGs evilgasm with delight.

Try pitting your players against an Enchantment-focused caster with a sprinkling of Well Intentioned Extremist. Send loved ones of suicide missions for the greater good and see how the party reacts.

Agrippa
2010-10-23, 01:56 AM
Lelouch from Code Geass is the hero because he's the main character. Otherwise, he would be the villain. Seriously, the sheer amount of mind-controlled minions he sacrifices makes most BBEGs evilgasm with delight.

Try pitting your players against an Enchantment-focused caster with a sprinkling of Well Intentioned Extremist. Send loved ones of suicide missions for the greater good and see how the party reacts.

Then I would quickly and brutally slaughter the bastard. No amount of good intentions begin to justify using innocent people as suicide agents. Add mind control on top of that and you get pure and undeniable evil, regardless of the reason. And if you use my family and friends I just might take my time with you.

Gensh
2010-10-23, 02:23 AM
Then I would quickly and brutally slaughter the bastard. No amount of good intentions begin to justify using innocent people as suicide agents. Add mind control on top of that and you get pure and undeniable evil, regardless of the reason. And if you use my family and friends I just might take my time with you.

Actually, the thing is that he tries to avoid involving innocents in most cases, and on top of that, admitted that just about everything he ever did was morally questionable at best. If you watch the show in one sitting, he's actually really petty and definitely cowardly overlord material at the beginning, but after certain events, he actually begins trying to practice what he preaches. And he won't use your family or friends (unless he has to), he'll use his own :smallwink:. In any case, he's definitely a sympathetic protagonist by the end, even if he has some rough spots in a few parts of the series.

Other than that, I would suggest introducing a villain that the party doesn't realize is a villain. They're just walking along through a field or whatever and they meet a charming, lighthearted person. S/he's plenty nice, and they meet repeatedly over a period of time, eventually coming to know and love s/him, almost like the [family member] they never had. Later, they find out that s/he is a living construct created by the chaotic entity to gather followers and ultimately set it free. Agonize the party further by making s/him genuinely ask the party to help with puppydog eyes and have s/him be visibly disappointed when they decline.

Cerlis
2010-10-23, 02:46 AM
easy easy easy easy.

Long ago after R'tas' father left He got into something dark. Perhaps he was short on money, having a hard time finding a stable life, missing his family when he hears rumors about some people who can speak with the dead. He gets involved and when making direct contact with him is enticed by thoughts of hearing his wife again, and seeing his child (through scrying) and as soon as his heart is vulnerable they goad him with ideas of resurrection. In the ritual he touches a red stone, the Chaos Entity's doing. By infecting someone with such strong good but sad emotions that good emotion is corrupted. Long story short over the years, the Man has become a Demon Lord, his body fused and corrupted by the Red Shard of the entity.

Your session should lead to a confrontation with "the monster behind all this horror" in which The Cleric recognizes the face of the demon (i'm thinking the big winged monster Bal'rogg type from the MM.) and soon R'tas is able to recognize his face from his own features. but thats not the only problem.


Siarae starts feeling sick the moment she steps in the same room and her tattoo burns bright. and perhaps Caelynna or the man-horse recognize a foul stench.

You see it is he who is behind it all. Now be careful, it will seem cliche is suddenly the entire party "knows each other" like this, so your goal isnt for that. I think also your two newcomers when they see him to remember the night before they set off, they had nightmares that they dont remember till now, of a voice telling them to meet their destiny.

The idea here is that your guy here is a powerful demon, one of many but the group wont find that out until after the campaign is 3/4s done or something. Who is trying to spread their influence to anyone with a strong will, a power or ability. in the same session in which they meet R'tas' father they should encounter some more adventurer's perhaps they split up when they face a fork in the dungeon. (a small group would be best, no more than three). Part way in the one of them (either barbarian or a wizardly type, prone to magical influence and sensitivity) attacks them, seeming berserk, and only gaining his sanity in time to feel the blade leave his chest and give the party a accusing horrified look. The entire world is getting farmed. After this any adventurer or man of power (physical or magical, not political)that is asked (except the distrustful ones) will tell of dreams and nightmares telling them to seek their destiny. The Chaotic one is using demons and corrupted humans like R'tas' father to spread more shards to those with strongest will and then turn them against their own nation, kill each other and their leaders to sew chaos and use the strongest to gain control and take over the world to ensure perpetual destruction.

-----------

the catch is though...before the party finds out just how big the plans are, but after they face The Dark Father who is the leader of the cult, the one who cursed the Tiefling, the friend of the cleric, father of the rogue and manipulator of anyone in this nation with a destiny, they find out he is doing this against his will. He recognizes his daughter too, and his friend, he tells them of the Chaotic Ones plans, when the Chaotic One realizes this it sinks its claws deeper into The Dark Father, and he attacks the party. Thats why i suggested such a powerful demon, he will be imposing but when he fights them he will be holding back, halving his actions and pulling punches trying to fight it, giving the party time to escape (make sure to show how powerful he is so they think to escape) and i belive most demons are magical, if things look grim he may forcibly teleport them out, in which the anger of the Chaotic One will tremble through the Tiefling's bones through her connection to him.

Some of the party have discovered a loved one in trouble, some have discovered the force behind the ruination of their lives, while others discover they have been manipulated....and that many will die or fall into the hands of evil like they almost did if they dont do something about it.(oo, if the PCs actually do well in the fight you should find a low dmg action each player can do and the Chaotic One randomly mind controls one of the players for one turn, that will scare em) .

They have to stop, save, redeem or kill an innocent man who is a pawn of a great evil, as well as potentially fight off innocent adventurer's (and some not so innocent who love the power and chaos) who have fallen under evil's sway, to save the world


Lelouch from Code Geass is the hero because he's the main character. Otherwise, he would be the villain. Seriously, the sheer amount of mind-controlled minions he sacrifices makes most BBEGs evilgasm with delight.

Try pitting your players against an Enchantment-focused caster with a sprinkling of Well Intentioned Extremist. Send loved ones of suicide missions for the greater good and see how the party reacts.
__________________

dont confuse "hero" and "protagonist" :P

Burner28
2010-10-23, 09:08 AM
This Evil Overlord could be Lawful Neutral, depending on what acts he is willing to do. The fact that he is unwilling to hurt innocents already pushes him away from Evil somewhat.

I suppose you have a good point, but just to mention, I was writing the motivation part in a first person point of view of the evil overlord.:smallamused:

Aron Times
2010-10-23, 10:21 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fot-PBRFebg&feature=fvst

Here's how Lelouch uses his mind control ability for the first time.

JackOfAllGeeks
2010-10-23, 10:51 AM
I guess it depends on your definition of relate-able, but my favorite villains are the ones who are *almost* heroes -- the arguably well-intentioned extremists who intend to "solve" a problem through questionable means. The trick is that such a character requires up-front investment and enough exposition that the characters can really get a good idea of the guy's motivation. It should be something along the lines of "people will suffer, but it's for The Greater Good." Or something that seems good on the outset, but would have far-ranging unintended consequences.

Alternatively, it could be someone who's truly evil, but who the characters can't just go and kill. Maybe he's the ruler of a kingdom, and killing him would either leave his people vulnerable to barbarian hordes or cause a terrible war of succession. Or maybe he's an Archangel who was set to guard a Great Evil but has been slowly corrupted by it -- to the point where he still acts as the seal to the prison, but is now himself tormenting others.

Something like that.

Gensh
2010-10-23, 04:23 PM
dont confuse "hero" and "protagonist" :P

No, he's right. Lelouch is the hero because he's the protagonist, just like he's the villain in the spinoff in which Suzaku is the protagonist. Whether he's good or evil depends on how much you know of his motivations and your own personal ethics. From Suzaku's perspective, he's a demon most of the time, but from Kallen's, he's more or less a benevolent god.

Sipex
2010-10-25, 09:19 AM
Thanks for the suggestions guys, lots of ideas flowing now.

I like the idea of R'tas' father being the BBEG while still being a pawn to the greater entity. He's sent R'tas a few notes warning him of what's to come so this explains why he knows what he does and he sends out the notes in bouts where he gets control back.

Making him the Demon Lord is a big hamfisted I think but having an NPC from one of the other characters as Siarae's lord is a good idea. Ties the characters closer together. If I can somehow tie that into the chaos entity (crystals, like you said) that would work. (By the way, you were spot on, the shards warp the people and things around them. Thel is about to be transformed due to his emotional instability and his player is actually running a dungeon/encounter around it.)

Cyrus is also a good idea, Cyrus gave the group their first shard without the group knowing it (he placed it in a project I called the spell amplifier which randomly enhanced spells cast through it to either have negative or positive effects). I was just going to play it off as 'Cyrus didn't know' but it could very well work out as 'Cyrus was testing the shards usability or trying to infect the group'. It also works as a double switch, Cyrus has a goatee and is a very stereotypical sounding villain so the party mistrusted him at first but now they're convinced he's good.

Cyrus could also be working ahead, getting the party to gather all the current shards (The shards need to be gathered to free the chaos entity, it's your classic Macguffin quest but my players are very trope friendly).

With all that considered I actually might make R'tas' father the demon lord and Cyrus the mastermind of the cult. I just need to figure out how to work Caelynna in there (Mindartis the Lamia was supposed to be her key in but the party killed him >.>) so she doesn't feel left out and possibly the other two as time goes on.

Thanks again!