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View Full Version : [3.5] The Riven Hourglass; Why yes, I can control time![LoB, ToB, Discipline]



CMFJimmy
2010-11-19, 07:28 PM
A brief intro: This is my first post here guys, but I've been secretly reading your forums for a very very long time! The homebrew stuff I've seen here has always been fantastic and inspiring to say the least. When ErrantX came to me a long time ago and said "Lets make a Discipline!" I was at first daunted and at the same time excited by the idea, and Black Heron (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=100874) was its results. I followed the comments, I made my own suggestions to ErrantX, and in the end we had the entry idea combined with the sheer homebrewing awesomeness that is this forum, and that lead to the entire Libram of Battle (http://sorcererstudios.com/forumdisplay.php?3-Libram-of-Battle) concept. Come check it out! Make comments and feel free to tell us what you like and what you hate, we have tough skin!

But enough about me, you came here to see some crazy time control shenanigans!!


The Riven Hourglass

The Riven Hourglass is a discipline focused on the manipulation of the time. Those who follow the teachings of The Riven Hourglass known that time is in fact more than simply the clock on the wall, or the sun that rises and falls, but is in fact The River. A stream powerful and forceful, carrying the world along with it. The practitioners of The Riven Hourglass know how to adjust this flow, separate it, distill it, and change how it interacts with the world.

Those that learn The Riven Hourglass are a strange lot, sometimes acting without any discernible reason to guard against possible threats that may never come to pass. What the outside doesn’t know is that these things never come to pass because of the followers of The Riven Hourglass act to change the course of The River to ensure the world maintains its balance.

The very nature of those that follow The Riven Hourglass allows its teachings to be learned by any disciple except those whose beliefs get in the way of them seeing the truth of things. thus barring Knights. Those that follow it usually have a need to control events, and lead the world to one of their building, either good or evil. The primary skill of followers of The Riven Hourglass is Concentration, as the ability to see The River is important to those who wish to alter it. In order to change it, only slashing weapons will properly do, and thus followers of The Riven Hourglass typically use scythes, falchions, scimitars, daggers, longswords, and shortswords.

CMFJimmy
2010-11-19, 07:29 PM
Maneuver List


1st Level
Reading the Moment: Stance- adds +2 to initiative, may add another +2 to initiative every round
Stagnation: Strike- make attack, if your attack hits, target makes will save, DC 11 + relevant stat, or lose next move action and cannot make attacks of opportunity until the end of your next turn.
Prepared Combatant: Boost – Reload any ranged weapon or draw a weapon as a free action
Swift Strike: Strike-Make a melee attack, it has +5 to hit and damage.
2nd Level
Lend a Moment: Boost- Give up your move action, target touched gets an extra move action on their next turn.
Diverging Strike: Strike- Make an attack, if it hits, make an additional attack against any opponent within range
Adjust the River: Take an immediate move action, lose next standard action.
3rd Level
Unmatched Speed: Stance- Gain +2 AC until your next turn if you use any Riven Hourglass maneuver or boost.
Acceleration: Strike- Make attack, if it hits, gain benefits of the “Haste” spell for next round.
Temporal Cocoon: Strike- Make attack aginst opponent, if it hits, opponent loses next standard action, or takes 5d6 damage. Opponents choice.
4th Level
Paradox Strike: Strike- Make an attack against an opponent dealing an additional 7D6 damage
Ride the Wave: Counter- make opposed concentration check after opponent strikes, if you win, gain an immediate move action.
Lend Time: Boost- Give up your standard action, target touched gets an additional standard action on their next turn.
5th Level
Stolen Acceleration: Strike- Make attack, if it hits you gain haste for 3 round and opponent gets slow for 3 rounds, opponent makes will save, DC 15 + relevant stat, if successful, no slow, and you are only hasted for 1 round.
Purify the Flow: Strike- Make an attack against target, if it hits, target takes 7d6 damage and gets -4 to save vs all Riven Hourglass maneuvers you perform for 2 rounds, DC 15 + relevant stat reduces duration and penalty by half.
Remake the River: Take an immediate standard action, lose next standard action
6th Level
Time Coffin: Strike- Make attack against opponent, if it hits, opponent loses next set of actions, or takes 10D6 damage and be slowed for 2 rounds. Opponents choice.
Slow Time Burst: Strike- All opponents within 20ft of you must make a will save, DC 16 + relevant stat, or be slowed for 3 round.
Become the Flow: Stance- You may take as many attacks of opportunity in a round as you are offered. You may use up to two against a single opponent in a round
7th Level
Released Possibility Strike: Strike- Make full round attack, with each attack that hits you may make an additional attack against any opponent within range.
Stealing the Wave: Counter- make opposed concentration check before opponent strikes, if you win, opponent loses standard action, you gain an immediate standard action.
8th Level
Drown in the River: Strike- make a melee attack against an opponent, if your attack hits, the target takes 15d6 damage as they are rent through time and they lose their next set of actions. Will save DC 18 + relevant stat to instead lose next move action and take half damage.
Twisted River Stance: Stance- You may make an extra standard action as part of your move action and then finish your move action.
9th Level
Split the Stream: Boost – free action: Create a mirror copy of yourself for 1 round. both act separately. At end of turn one vanishes.

CMFJimmy
2010-11-19, 07:36 PM
Maneuver Descriptions

1st level



Reading the Moment
The Riven Hourglass (Stance)
Level: Blade Mystic 1, Stalker 1, Warlord 1
Initiation Action: 1 swift action
Range: Personal
Target: You
Duration: Stance

Followers of The River know that simply watching its movements gives one power over those who are blind and is the first step in mastering its secrets. With this stance, the adept is capable of increasing his reactions times in battle by increasing his initiative by 2 every turn on his turn. (he still acts on his old initiative, this affects his new initiative next turn.)

Stagnation
The Riven Hourglass (Strike)
Level: Blade Mystic 1, Stalker 1, Warlord 1
Initiation Action: 1 standard action
Range: Melee attack
Target: One creature
Duration: Instantaneous
Save: Will negates

The River and how it affects others is just as vital as is how it affects oneself. Practitioners of The Riven Hourglass can use this to slow the river around their foes leaving them helpless. The disciple initiates this strike, and if it is successful deals melee damage as normal, and causes its victim to lose his next move action and the ability to make attacks of opportunity until the end of your next turn. The loss of the move action and loss of attacks of opportunity can be negated by a successful Will save DC 11 + relevant stat.

Prepared Combatant
The Riven Hourglass (Boost)
Level: Blade Mystic 1, Stalker 1, Warlord 1
Initiation Action: 1 swift action
Range: Personal
Target: You
Duration Instantaneous

Violence can happen in but an instant, and being prepared for this is the key to winning all conflicts. By manipulating The River around himself, the adept can change the flow to allow him to instantly have his weapons in hand and his ranged weapons loaded and ready.

Swift Strike
The Riven Hourglass (Strike)
Level: Blade Mystic 1, Stalker 1, Warlord 1
Initiation Action: 1 standard action
Range: Melee attack
Target: One creature
Duration: Instantaneous

The adept understands that in order to win, he must speed the flow around himself in order to gain an advantage over those lacking this precious gift. By speeding up The River for but a moment, the adept can allow his attacks to strike with blinding speed giving him a +5 to hit and damage on the attack.

2nd Level


Lend a Moment
The Riven Hourglass (Boost)
Level: Blade Mystic 2, Stalker 2, Warlord 2
Initiation Action: 1 swift action
Range: Touch
Target: One creature
Duration: Instantaneous

Wasted time is not something practitioners of The Riven Hourglass take lightly. Every moment unused is a moment lost forever, and the adept knows how to utilize those lost moments for benefit. The disciple can forsake his place in The River for but a moment in order to give this extra time to an ally, by forgoing his move action, the adept allows the target of this maneuver to gain an additional move action on their next turn.

Diverging Strike
The Riven Hourglass (Strike)
Level: Blade Mystic 2, Stalker 2, Warlord 2
Initiation Action: 1 standard action
Range: Melee attack
Target: Special (see description)
Duration: Instantaneous

By wrapping possibility around his strike and lashing out at his foe with this compressed time, the initiate can turn one strike into two. The adept makes one melee attack against his target, if this attack hits, he may make an additional melee attack at a single target within range.

Adjust the River
The Riven Hourglass
Level: Blade Mystic 2, Stalker 2, Warlord 2
Initiation Action: 1 immediate action
Range: Personal
Target: You
Duration: Instantaneous

By looking up and down The River, the adept is capable of seeing events moments before they happen, and pondering their outcome many seconds afterwards before making his move. As an immediate action, the adept can take a move action at the cost of his next standard action.

3rd level


Unmatched Speed
The Riven Hourglass (Stance)
Level: Blade Mystic 3, Stalker 3, Warlord 3
Prerequisite: 1 The Riven Hourglass maneuver
Initiation Action: 1 swift action
Range: Personal
Target: You
Duration: Stance

An adept using The Riven Hourglass can appear as a blur before the eyes, and at times seem almost impossible to follow due to his unmatched speed and control over time. While in this stance, any time the initiator uses a boost or a strike from The Riven Hourglass, he gains a +2 dodge bonus to AC until the beginning of his next turn.

Acceleration
The Riven Hourglass (Strike)
Level: Blade Mystic 3, Stalker 3, Warlord 3
Prerequisite: 1 The Riven Hourglass maneuver
Initiation Action: 1 standard action
Range: Melee attack
Target: One creature
Duration: 1 round

Every strike, and every blow in combat sheds a miniscule fragment of time. The Disciple of The Riven Hourglass knows this and knows how to collect these lost fragments and use them for himself. The initiator makes a melee attack against a one creature. If this attack hits, the attack does normal damage and the initiator is affected as if though by the spell “Haste” (Players Handbook, pg 239) until the end of his next turn.

Temporal Cocoon
Level: Blade Mystic 3, Stalker 3, Warlord 3
Prerequisite: 1 The Riven Hourglass maneuver
Initiation Action: 1 standard action
Range: Melee attack
Target: One creature
Duration: 1 round

Just as time can be slowed and hasted, so can it to be dammed up. By temporarily blocking The River, the initiator of The Riven Hourglass can force his opponents to make a deadly choice. To initiate this maneuver, the adept makes a melee attack against a target. If this attack hits it deals normal damage, and wraps the victim in a web of time. The web does not hinder movement or simple actions, but prevents the victim from taking standard actions. The victim can chose to break the web, as a free action, and make a normal standard action, but this causes it to shatter and slash into him dealing 5d6 points of damage.

4th Level

Paradox Strike
The Riven Hourglass (Strike)
Level: Blade Mystic 4, Stalker 4, Warlord 4
Prerequisite: 1 The Riven Hourglass maneuver
Initiation Action: 1 standard action
Range: Melee attack
Target: One creature
Duration: Instantaneous

There are some things that should never exist in The River, some things that when it and The River meet up causes an upheaval of devastating proportions. By introduction a bit of impossibility into his strike, the disciple of The Riven Hourglass can cause an explosion of time with his strike. Make a normal melee attack, if it hits, it deals normal damage, and an additional 7d6 damage.

Ride the Wave
The Riven Hourglass (Counter)
Level: Blade Mystic 4, Stalker 4, Warlord 4
Prerequisite: 1 The Riven Hourglass maneuver
Initiation Action: 1 immediate action
Range: N/A
Target: One creature
Duration: Instantaneous

Just as the adepts attacks allow him to steal a bit of The River, so does his enemies attacks allow him to gain some extra momentum as well. When an opponent makes an attack against you and hits, you may initiate this maneuver to force an opposed concentration check. If you are successful, you can make an immediate move action.

Lend Time
The Riven Hourglass (Boost)
Level: Blade Mystic 4, Stalker 4, Warlord 4
Prerequisite: 1 The Riven Hourglass maneuver
Initiation Action: 1 swift action
Range: Touch
Target: One creature
Duration: Instantaneous

The adept of The Riven Hourglass is able to look ahead and see the needs of his allies as well as his own. Sometimes an allies need is to great, and they do not have enough time to act, the adept of The Riven Hourglass is prepared to solve just such situations. By giving up a larger portion of his own place in The River, the adept is able to give up 1 standard action, and allow his touched ally to get an additional standard action on their next turn.

5th Level

Stolen Acceleration
The Riven Hourglass (Strike)
Level: Blade Mystic 5, Stalker 5, Warlord 5
Prerequisite: 2 The Riven Hourglass maneuvers
Initiation Action: 1 standard action
Range: Melee Attack
Target: One Creature
Duration: 3 rounds
Save: Will negates

Sometimes it is not enough to merely collect the shards of The River from a simple struggle, sometimes you must go for everything. By lashing out and drawing out part of The River from the target, the initiator make a standard melee attack against his target, if he hits, the victim is affected as if by the spell “Slow” (Players Handbook, pg 280) and the initiator is affected as if by the spell “Haste” (Players Handbook, pg 239) for 3 rounds. A successful Will save DC 15 + relevant attribute negates the Slow, and reduces the Haste to 1 round.

Purify the Flow
The Riven Hourglass (Strike)
Level: Blade Mystic 5, Stalker 5, Warlord 5
Prerequisite: 2 The Riven Hourglass maneuvers
Initiation Action: 1 standard action
Range: Melee Attack
Target: One Creature
Duration: 2 rounds
Save: Will for half

The River affects everyone differently and this in turn protects them from manipulations by others. The initiate of The Riven Hourglass can purify the flow in another to make them more susceptible to his own manipulations. To initiate this strike, make a normal melee attack. If this attack hits, deal an additional 7d6 damage, and the target gets -4 penalty to AC and all saves vs The Riven Hourglass maneuvers for 2 rounds. A successful Will save DC 15 + relevant attribute reduces the penalty and the duration by half.

Remake The River
The Riven Hourglass (Boost)
Level: Blade Mystic 5, Stalker 5, Warlord 5
Prerequisite: 2 The Riven Hourglass maneuvers
Initiation Action: 1 swift action
Range: Personal
Target: You

Sometimes there is a problem that requires you to act now, and with more time than you have available. The answer to this is to remake The River to suit your needs. By sacrificing a piece of his future self, the adept of The Riven Hourglass is capable of unleashing a flurry of potential in the now. By giving up your standard action during your next initiative, you gain an additional standard action this round.

6th Level

Time Coffin
The Riven Hourglass (Strike)
Level: Blade Mystic 6, Stalker 6, Warlord 6
Prerequisite: 2 The Riven Hourglass maneuvers
Initiation Action: 1 standard action
Range: Melee attack
Target: One creature
Duration: 1 round

The master of The Riven Hourglass can more thoroughly dam The River for his enemies. By shrouding his weapon in a dark paradox energy, the adept lashes out at his target surrounding him in a black coffin of paradox that prevents all actions, or can be shattered into a thousand small pieces of paradox injuring his foe. To initiate this attack, you make a standard attack, if the attack hits, your foe takes normal damage, and must chose to either forfeit his next full round action, or take an additional 10d6 points of damage and suffer the effects of a "slow" spell (Players Handbook, pg 280) for the next 2 turns.

Slow Time Burst
The Riven Hourglass (Strike)
Level: Blade Mystic 6, Stalker 6, Warlord 6
Prerequisite: 2 The Riven Hourglass maneuvers
Initiation Action: 1 standard action
Range: 20ft burst centered on you
Target: all enemies within range
Duration: 2 rounds
Save: Will negates

By pulling at the flow of all The River’s around him, the master of The Riven Hourglass is capable of selectively slowing all his enemies with a burst of blue-white energy. To initiate this strike all enemies within 20ft burst of you must make a Will save DC 16 + relevant modifier or be affected as if by the spell “Slow” (Players Handbook, pg 280) for 3 rounds and take 5D6 damage from fluctuations in their time movement.

Become the Flow
The Riven Hourglass (Stance)
Level: Blade Mystic 8, Stalker 8, Warlord 8
Prerequisite: 3 The Riven Hourglass maneuvers
Initiation Action: 1 swift action
Range: Personal
Target: You
Duration: Stance

By truly mastering The River, the master of The Riven Hourglass can cause it to flow into every attack, and affect the world around him in an almost discernable way. Blue energy trails behind every attack, and no slight of his opponents goes unpunished. While in this stance you can make any number of attacks of opportunity, and you can make up to 2 attacks of opportunity against a single target that provokes more than once in a round.

7th level

Released Possibility Strike
The Riven Hourglass (Strike)
Level: Blade Mystic 7, Stalker 7, Warlord 7
Prerequisite: 3 The Riven Hourglass maneuvers
Initiation Action: 1 standard action
Range: Melee attack
Target: Special
Duration: Instantaneous

By harnessing the possibility that he could attack anywhere, the master of The Riven Hourglass instead attacks everywhere. To initiate this maneuver, make a full round attack (even if you have moved) as normal. For each attack that hits, you may make another attack against another target within range. Each of these extra attacks is made at the same attack bonus as the hit that triggered it.

Stealing the Wave
The Riven Hourglass (Counter)
Level: Blade Mystic 7, Stalker 7, Warlord 7
Prerequisite: 3 The Riven Hourglass maneuvers
Initiation Action: 1 immediate action
Range: N/A
Target: One Creature
Duration: Instantaneous

The master of The Riven Hourglass has grown so strong in The River that he can literally pull the entirety of an opponents attack away from him, and use the energy in the attack as his very own. As an opponent goes to attack you, make an opposed concentration check. If you win, the opponent looses his standard action, and you gain an immediate standard action

8th Level

Drown in the River
The Riven Hourglass (Strike)
Level: Blade Mystic 8, Stalker 8, Warlord 8
Prerequisite: 3 The Riven Hourglass maneuvers
Initiation Action: 1 standard action
Range: Melee attack
Target: One Creature
Duration: Instantaneous
Save: Will save (special)

By pouring the entirety of The River into his strike, the master of The Riven Hourglass can lay any opponent low. Long glowing black and blue energy streaks down the black and crashes into the enemy with a torrent of power. To initiate this attack, make a melee attack against an opponent. If this attack hits, it deals normal damage, and an additional 15D6 damage, and the target loses their next turn. A Will save, DC 18 + relevant modifier reduces the additional damage by half, and instead causes the loss of the next move action.

Twisted River Stance
The Riven Hourglass (Stance)
Level: Blade Mystic 6, Stalker 6, Warlord 6
Prerequisite: 2 The Riven Hourglass maneuvers
Initiation Action: 1 swift action
Range: Personal
Target: You
Duration: Stance

The master of The Riven Hourglass can twist the threads of The River to allow him to perform the nearly impossible by bending and weaving pieces of time together that normally must be seperate. While in this stance, the adept can move and make an extra standard action at any point in that move, but he must move at least 10ft to gain this benefit.

9th Level

Split the Stream
The Riven Hourglass (Boost)
Level: Blade Mystic 9, Stalker 9, Warlord 9
Prerequisite: 4 The Riven Hourglass maneuvers
Initiation Action: 1 swift action, 1 move action, 1 standard action
Range: Personal
Target: You
Duration: 1 round

The ultimate usage of The River, the grandmaster of The Riven Hourglass can literally split The River in two creating two full possibilities, and performing the truly impossible. After initiation this maneuver, the grandmaster of The Riven Hourglass has two separate entities both capable of performing 1 standard action, 1 move action, and 1 swift action (including boosts). At the end of the turn when both entities have performed their actions, the master chooses which reality to keep and which to forsake. The forsaken reality falls to dust, just as his future possibilities go with him.

Mulletmanalive
2010-11-20, 03:28 AM
Please unspoiler the list of abilities: the manoeuvres themselves are fine spoilered but on the list, it stops it doing its listly duty.

I'm thinking some of those "lose your actions" abilities might be both more interesting and fair if they operated like the Cenobyte powers and caused the target to "stitch in time" and disappear for a moment. No actions but no getting bitchslapped to high heaven while you're at it.

I have no idea how to examine the counters that allow you to take actions from your next turn. They're either free actions [screw you action economy] or big gambles, depending on whether the combat lasts another turn [not something D&D's design relies on, especially in the kind of games that tend to use TOB.

Dead_Jester
2010-11-20, 08:01 AM
This looks good, but a few maneuvers probably need fixing.

Diverging strike could just give another attack (compare it to Wolf-Fang Strike).

Lend Time shouldn't cost a standard action to give a full-round. It would probably be more balanced if it cost a full-round and gave a standard action.

Remake the River needs a descriptor, probably (Boost), and could potentially be too strong for it's level as it let's you initiate 2 maneuvers. I'd consider moving it to a higher level (probably 7th)

Slow Time Burst should probably also do a little damage (maybe 5d6, save for half) in addition to the slow effect.

Released Possibility Strike needs to stat at what Bab the new attacks are made, and if these extra attacks can grant more (which could lead to theoretical damage loops).

Drown in the River should probably do a slight bit less damage (10d6 or 12d6).

CMFJimmy
2010-11-21, 03:11 PM
First off, thanks for the replys guys. I really appreciated the input and have really thought about it a bit.

I fail at using quotes and I have most of this typed, so bear with me.

For the concept of using the stitch in time concept presented by Mulletmanalive: How would causing the loss of an action as a counter which could dodge an attack and cause the standard action loss in just the same way be any different?

As far as strikes that cause the lost actions, making them stitch in time would be interesting, but I don't know, that just seems to be a different that I'm being stubborn about.



Lend Time shouldn't cost a standard action to give a full-round. It would probably be more balanced if it cost a full-round and gave a standard action.


I can justify lowering the granted action down to a standard action as opposed to a full set of actions. White Raven Tactics is still better however. This is done.



Remake the River needs a descriptor, probably (Boost), and could potentially be too strong for it's level as it let's you initiate 2 maneuvers. I'd consider moving it to a higher level (probably 7th)

Fixed the descriptor.

As for moving it in level, Celerity is a 5th level spell. Celerity's drawback can be cured. I realize there is a disagreement in which it is asked, should a non caster be as powerful as a caster? My opinion is, yes they should sometimes.


Slow Time Burst should probably also do a little damage (maybe 5d6, save for half) in addition to the slow effect.

That is an interesting thought actually. I was pondering how I could make this a hair better and damage might just be the trick that I was overlooking, Thanks!


Released Possibility Strike needs to stat at what Bab the new attacks are made, and if these extra attacks can grant more (which could lead to theoretical damage loops).

This has been updated to be more clear. It should give a second attack at the same BAB. No further extra attacks are triggered after the first round of extra attacks. I might clarify further if it still seems confusing.


Drown in the River should probably do a slight bit less damage (10d6 or 12d6).

I thought really long and hard about this one actually. Its damage has changed 3 times since I wrote it. At first it was 15D6, and then we talked about it and thought it did to much damage, so we scaled it back to 10D6. After some thinking however I felt that if I was the victim of this strike, 98 times out of 100 I would take the damage. I felt increasing the damage a bit might make the choice less obvious every time.

Do you feel there is a way to increase the odds the victim might choose to take the action loss?

Cieyrin
2010-11-21, 03:13 PM
Definitely looks neat, though it needs some refinement.

Firstly, Temporal Cocoon is missing it's Strike designation.
Slow Time Burst's duration in the summary is 2 rounds, while the text says 3 rounds.
Released Possibility Strike is a tad confusing in its description. You make a full attack as a Standard action and get extra attacks for each attack that hits, right? Do attacks gained from hits also spawn new attacks if they also hit, as it seems a tad over the top to me. Limiting it to one additional hit per attack seems like more than enough, especially when you throw in two-weapon fighting and Cleaves.
Split the Stream's Initiation Action makes little sense, as the summary says it's a free action, the mechanics say it's effectively a full round action and the text says you have two selves that can each do a round of actions. Also, where does the split entity start? Do they both start from the same square, so one has to move before anything else? Does the split have all effects and stances the original had when the Boost is activated? It needs further explanation than what is given.

My final point is related to the presentation itself, as there's an amazing lack of commas and other proper punctuation, as well as some grammatical errors. I'd point them all out but that would unnecessarily lengthen the post and would probably be better off as a PM, anyways.

It is ambitious, though, and I do like what you have here, it just needs some polishing to make it better. Them's my 2 coppers. Take as you will.

DracoDei
2010-11-22, 10:01 AM
Did you change Drown in the River at some point? Because I don't see any real choice it gives to the victem. As usual it is better in every way to make the save (less action loss, and half damage) than to fail it.