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MammonAzrael
2011-01-07, 02:55 PM
Pact Descendant

A pact descendant is a creature that has a dark shadow in it's heritage. One of it's ancestors at some point made a pact with a demon or fae, trading away their soul or innocence for a promise of power or influence, or perhaps even was a mystical being. The legacy of which has manifested in the pact descendant in a dark arcane power that he can bring to bear.


Creating a Pact Descendant
Pact descendant is an inherited template that can be added to any living, corporeal creature with an intelligence score of 4 or more (referred to hereafter as the base creature).

A pact descendant uses all the base creatureís statistics and special abilities except as noted here.

Size and Type
The creatureís type remains the same, but it gains the planetouched subtype. Size is unchanged.

Special Attacks
A pact descendant retains all the special attacks of the base creature and also gains the eldritch blast attack.

Eldritch Blast (Sp): A pact descendant has the innate ability to fire an eldritch blast, an arcane blast powered by itís dark lineage, at-will. An eldritch blast is a ray with a range of 60 feet. It is a ranged touch attack that affects a single target, allowing no saving throw. An eldritch blast deals 1d6 points of damage. Increase this damage by 1d6 for each 5 HD the pact descendant has. An eldritch blast is the equivalent of a spell whose level is equal to one-half the pact descendant HD minimum 1 and maximum of 9th at 18 hit dice or more. An eldritch blast deals half damage to objects.

If a pact descendant gains an eldritch blast from any other source the damage and effects stack.

Special Quality
A pact descendant retains all the special qualities of the base creature, plus the following special qualities.

Cursed Bloodline: A pact descendant is protected by some small vestige of the bargain struck long ago. It has one of the following qualities:

Damage Reduction (Ex): The pact descendant has damage reduction 2/cold iron. Increase this damage reduction by 1 for each 3 HD the pact descendant has.
Dark Blessing (Ex): The pact descendant increases an ability score by 2. Increase this ability score by 1 for each 5 HD the pact descendant has.
Energy Resistance (Su): The pact descendant has energy resistance 5 to one of the following energy types: acid, cold, electricity, fire, or sonic. Increase this resistance by 1 for each 2 HD the pact descendant has. The pact descendant resists an additional energy type for each 7 HD it has. This energy resistance stacks with any other energy resistance the base creature may have.
Fast Healing (Ex): The pact descendant has fast healing 2. Increase this fast healing by 1 for each 4 HD the pact descendant has. This fast healing is only in effect when the pact descendant is below one half itís full normal hit points.
Profane Armor (Su): The pact descendant gains a +2 profane bonus to itís armor class. Increase this bonus by 1 for each 3 HD the pact descendant has.
Profane Resistance (Su): The pact descendant gains a +1 profane bonus to all itís saves. Increase this bonus by 1 for each 4 HD the pact descendant has.
Spell Resistance (Su): The pact descendant has spell resistance equal to 12 + itís HD.


Natural Invocation (Sp): A pact descendant innately knows one least invocation from the Warlock invocation list. It's caster level for this invocation is equal to it's HD. The save DC for this invocation (if it allows a save) is 10 + equivalent spell level + the pact descendantís Charisma modifier. The pact descendant learns an additional least invocation for each 6 HD it has.

Abilities
Change from the base creature as follows: +2 Dex, -2 Wis, +2 Cha

Challenge Rating
Same as the base creature +1.

Alignment
Often Chaotic or Evil.

Level Adjustment
Same as the base creature +1.

Sample Pact Descendant
This example uses a Derro (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/derro.htm) as the base creature.

Pact Descendant Derro
Small Monsterous Humanoid (Planetouched)
Hit Dice 3d8+3 (16 hp)
Initiative +7
Speed 20 ft.
Armor Class 19 (+1 size, +3 Dex, +2 natural, +3 studded leather armor), touch 14, flat-footed 16
Base Attack/Grapple +3/-1
Attack Short sword +4 melee (1d4/19-20 plus poison) or eldritch blast +7 ranged (1d6/20)
Full Attack Short sword +4 melee (1d4/19-20 plus poison) or eldritch blast +7 ranged (1d6/20)
Space/Reach 5 ft./5 ft.
Special Attacks Eldritch blast, poison use, spell-like abilities, sneak attack +1d6
Special Qualities Madness, damage reduction 3/cold iron, darkvision 60 ft., spell resistance 15, vulnerability to sunlight
Saves Fort +2, Ref +6, Will +7
Abilities Str 11, Dex 16, Con 13, Int 10, Wis 3*, Cha 18*
Skills Bluff +6, Hide +11, Listen +0, Move Silently +9
Feats Blind-Fight, Improved Initiative
Environments Underground
Organization Team (2-4), squad (5-8 plus 1 3rd-level sorcerer), or band (11-20 plus 30% noncombatants plus 3 3rd-level sorcerers and 1 sorcerer of 5th-8th level)
Challenge Rating 4
Treasure Standard coins; double goods; standard items
Alignment Usually chaotic evil
Advancement By character class
Level Adjustment -- (+3 if sane)

Pact descendant derro are stealthy and bloodthirsty, more-so than their kin. The dark magic within them whispers of pain and torment, in an almost intoxicating way. They like to carefully arrange cruel traps and deadly ambushes, and strike savagely from hiding. They delight in taking captives who can be tortured to death later, and favor traps and poisons that disable without killing. They will often operate from a distance, trying to sicken as many opponents as possible before their bloodlust becomes too great and they charge in with their shortswords swinging.

Eldritch Blast (Sp)

A pact descendant derro has the innate ability to fire an eldritch blast, an arcane blast powered by itís dark lineage, at-will. An eldritch blast is a ray with a range of 60 feet. It is a ranged touch attack that affects a single target, allowing no saving throw. An eldritch blast deals 1d6 points of damage. Increase this damage by 1d6 for each 5 HD the pact descendant derro has. An eldritch blast is the equivalent of a spell whose level is equal to one-half the pact descendant derroís HD minimum 1 and maximum of 9th at 18 hit dice or more. An eldritch blast deals half damage to objects.
If a pact descendant derro gains an eldritch blast from any other source the damage and effects stack.

Madness (Ex)
Pact descendant derro use their Charisma modifier on Will saves instead of their Wisdom modifier, and have immunity to confusion and insanity effects. A pact descendant derro cannot be restored to sanity by any means short of a miracle or wish spell.
*The racial madness of the pact descendant derro provides a +6 bonus to their Charisma scores and a -6 penalty to their Wisdom scores. A pact descendant derro restored to sanity gains 6 points of Wisdom and loses 6 points of Charisma.

Poison Use (Ex)
Pact descendant derro typically carry 1d4 doses of large scorpion venom, applying it to their short swords. Pact descendant derro are not at risk of poisoning themselves when handling poison.

Sneak Attack (Ex)
Any time a pact descendant derroís opponent is denied his Dexterity bonus to AC, or if a pact descendant derro flanks his opponent, he deals an extra 1d6 points of damage. This ability is just like the rogueís sneak attack and subject to the same limitations.

Spell-Like Abilities
At willódarkness, ghost sound; 1/dayó daze (DC 14), sound burst (DC 16). Caster level 3rd. The save DCs are Charisma-based.

Sickening Blast
This eldritch essence invocation allows the pact descendant derro to change his eldritch blast into a sickening blast. Any living creature struck by a sickening blast must make a Fortitude save (DC 16) or become sickened for 1 minute. A sickened creature struck by a second sickening blast is not affected by the sickening aspect of the blast but still takes damage normally. The DC is Charisma based.

Vulnerability to Sunlight (Ex)
A pact descendant derro takes 1 point of Constitution damage for every hour it is exposed to sunlight, and it dies if its Constitution score reaches 0. Lost Constitution points are recovered at the rate of 1 per every 24-hour period spent underground or otherwise sheltered from the sun.
Skills

Pact descendant derro have a +4 racial bonus on Hide and Move Silently checks.


Pact Heir

A pact heir is a creature that has awakened their arcane heritage, and has embraced it. They have explored the darkness running through their veins. Some have made peace with it, others fight it, but all use it.


Creating a Pact Heir
Pact heir is an acquired template that can be added to any living, corporeal creature with an intelligence score of 4 or more that has the pact descendant template (referred to hereafter as the base creature).

A pact heir uses all the base creatureís statistics and special abilities except as noted here.

Special Attacks
A pact heir retains all the special attacks of the base creature and also gains the one of the following special attacks:

Blood Magic (Su): When a pact heir casts a spell, uses a spell-like ability, or uses a supernatural ability it may deal itself 1 Constitution damage to increase the DC of the spell, spell-like ability, or supernatural ability by 2. This damage cannot be prevented or reduced in any way.
Burning Blood (Ex): Each time the pact heir is dealt damage with a piercing or slashing attack, itís blood sprays outward in a cone, dealing 1d4 acid damage plus 1d4 per 3 HD to all within range (no saving throw). The blood sprays out to a distance of 5 feet per die of damage (so a creature with 8 HD would spray blood that dealt 3d4 acid damage in a 15 foot cone). A pact heir is not harmed by itís own blood.
Frightful Presence (Ex): When the pact heir attacks it inspires fear in all creatures within 30 feet that saw the attack. A potentially affected creature that succeeds at a Will save (DC 10 + Ĺ pact heirís hit dice + pact heirís Charisma modifier) becomes immune to that pact heirís frightful presence for 24 hours. On a failure, creatures with 5 or less HD than the pact heir become panicked (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/conditionSummary.htm#panicked) for 3d6 rounds, creatures with 1-4 less HD than the pact heir become frightened (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/conditionSummary.htm#frightened) for 2d6 rounds, and those with HD equal to or greater than the pact heir become shaken (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/conditionSummary.htm#shaken) for 1d6 rounds.
Leech Essence (Su): The pact heir may a melee touch attack as a standard action to deal damage equal to its eldritch blast damage and heal a number of hit points equal to the damage dealt.


Special Quality
A pact heir retains all the special qualities of the base creature and also gains the following special qualities:

Cursed Bloodline: A pact heir some of the power granted to itís ancestor from the bargain it struck long ago. It has two of the following qualities, neither of which may have been selected for the pact descendant template:

Damage Reduction (Ex): The pact heir has damage reduction 2/cold iron. Increase this damage reduction by 1 for each 3 HD the pact heir has.
Dark Blessing (Ex): The pact heir increases an ability score by 2. Increase this ability score by 1 for each 5 HD the pact heir has.
Dark Insight(Su): The pact heir gains a +1 profane bonus to all its attack rolls. Increase this bonus by 1 for each 5 HD it has.
Energy Resistance (Su): The pact heir has energy resistance 5 to one of the following energy types: acid, cold, electricity, fire, or sonic. Increase this resistance by 1 for each 2 HD the pact heir has. The pact heir resists an additional energy type for each 7 HD it has.
Fast Healing (Ex): The pact heir has fast healing 2. Increase this fast healing by 1 for each 4 HD the pact heir has. This fast healing is only in effect when the pact heir is below one half its full normal hit points.
Inhuman Speed (Ex): All modes of movement the pact heir has increase by 5 ft. per 2 HD it has. Increase the distance of the pact heirís 5 foot step by 5 ft. for each 6 HD it has.
Profane Armor (Su): The pact heir gains a +2 profane bonus to itís armor class. Increase this bonus by 1 for each 3 HD the pact heir has.
Profane Resistance (Su): The pact heir gains a +1 profane bonus to all itís saves. Increase this bonus by 1 for each 4 HD the pact heir has.
Profane Strength (Su): The pact heir gains a profane bonus to all its damage rolls equal to half its HD.
Spell Resistance (Su): The pact heir has spell resistance equal to 12 + itís HD.
Unnatural Sight (Ex): The pact heir blindsense 30 ft. Increase the range of its blind sense by 5 ft. for each 3 HD it has. This becomes blindsight if the pact heir has 12 or more HD.


Natural Invocation (Sp): A pact heir with 8 or more HD innately understands some of the deeper powers of its legacy. It knows one lesser invocation from the Warlock invocation list. It's caster level for this invocation is equal to it's HD. The save DC for this invocation (if it allows a save) is 10 + equivalent spell level + the pact heirís Charisma modifier. The pact heir learns an additional lesser invocation for each additional 8 HD it has.

Abilities
Change from the base creature as follows: +2 Dex, +2 Con or +2 Int, +2 Cha

Challenge Rating
Same as the base creature +1.

Alignment
Usually Chaotic or Evil.

Level Adjustment
Same as the base creature +1.

What do you think? Is this too powerful for +1/+2 LA? Not powerful enough? Would you take it? Would you take it even if you werenít considering taking levels in Warlock?

Since pacts donít grant any singular specific bonuses, I tried to make a decent variety, to give the feeling that lots of different people have made pacts for the power they wanted, which obviously differs from person to person. I would welcome any suggestions for more Special Attacks and Qualities, as these are just some options I thought up and certainly they are not exhaustive.

3/5/2012 Note - These templates are based off of the warlock as presented in Complete Arcane, not the homebrew version of the class I created (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=226021). That is why all the abilities are demonically flavored, instead of offering a broader range of ďgifts.Ē If you want to combine the two it shouldnít present an issue, just refluff the abilities you want to fit your chosen heritage. Drop the planetouched subtype when appropriate.

EDITS
Changed Demon-blooded to Pact-blooded
Changed the abilities from +2 Cha to +4 Cha
Added sample pact-blooded creature
Added Cursed Bloodline to pact-blooded
EB damage now scales with hit dice, as does natural invocation
Changed the abilities from +4 Cha back to +2
Updated the sample creature
Changed Pact-blooded to Pact Descendant
Added the Pact Heir template
Changed Pact Heirís DR, Enhanced Ability, Fast Healing, Inhuman Speed and Unnatural Sight to EX abilities
Dark Power now grants bonus equal to half HD, not full HD
Changed some naming and cleaned up the formatting a bit.
Burning Bloodís range now increases with HD
Leech Essence now deals full eldritch blast damage

Pyromancer999
2011-01-07, 04:09 PM
Not bad, but I'd change the name to Pact-Blooded/Descendant, as it's not only demons who make pacts. Looks good as-is.

MammonAzrael
2011-01-07, 04:14 PM
The name was one of the things that took me the longest. Pact-blooded does work better for allowing the Fae angle, and I did avoid anything specifically demonic. Still doesn't quite ring perfectly, but it's better, so I'll take it. :smallsmile: Thanks.

bartman
2011-01-07, 04:59 PM
I don't think this is overpowered in the least for a +1, in fact, i think it may even be underpowered. Take a look at Feral, it is a +1 and gets a ton more than this template does. (I know, Feral is overpowered, but hey, its a WOTC template...) Dark is another on I like, +1, gets a few extra goodies than this one does.

I would consider adding something small from your list of suggestions, like maybe the AC bonus, or the CHA boost. I think the fast healing or the DR are a bit much, without bumping it to +2, but it seems pretty cool to me.

This definitely makes the Supernatural Transformation feat a must for people who continue the warlock class. I would consider using it if i go for another warlock.

MammonAzrael
2011-01-07, 05:13 PM
Yeah, I don't want Feral. :smalltongue: I was trying to think of a balanced +1 LA template and could only think of Mineral Warrior, which is on the high side of strong. I forgot about Dark, that's a good one.

The one I was leaning towards the most was another +2 to Cha. It fits nicely, and encourages your Natural Invocation to have a save.

I agree that Fast Healing (even temporary FH), or any DR high enough to be relevant, would be too strong for a +1 LA.

I'm glad you like it. If you do decide to use it, be sure to let me know how it goes! :smallsmile:

Pyromancer999
2011-01-07, 06:23 PM
If you had the time and wanted to power it up a little, you could always grant a benefit based on the type of pact made.

MammonAzrael
2011-01-07, 07:16 PM
True...although that feels more like an Evolved Undead style template change to me. An additional template that requires this one first. While Warlock fluff seems to operate under the assumption that the powers are demonic in origin, I know it leaves enough leeway to include Fae (or whatever else a DM feels like including). So having the generic one feels right...

I think I'll work up a pact-specific bonus template though, as it could be nifty and fun. :smallsmile:

Stycotl
2011-01-08, 03:51 PM
my only suggestion is to make eldritch blast and invocations scale. certainly keep them well below a warlock's progression, but something like:


eldritch blast: 1d6 at 1st level, with a +1d6 every 5 levels after that (so 4d6 at 16th level).

invocations: one least invocation at 1st level, and another least invocation every 5 levels after that (so 4 least invocations at 16th level).

my reasoning is that warlock is generally an underpowered class as it is, though really cool. after 2nd level or so, a 1d6 eldritch blast is absolutely useless to everyone but a rogue and a smattering of other classes in an even narrower smattering of circumstances.

and a single least invocation is cool, but i don't think that it makes a few ability bonuses and the aforementioned mostly useless 1d6 blast equal to a +1 LA template.

personal thoughts though.

MammonAzrael
2011-01-08, 04:34 PM
I completely agree with the scaling damage for eldritch blast. My worry is that having that much extra damage from only a single LA will make any Warlock want this without hesitation. Although a 13d6 is a whole ~14 more damage, so it isn't really that scary.

While a 4d6 ranged touch attack isn't too much more useful to most classes than a 1d6, at least it looks more impressive. (and feels better to roll!)

Right now I'm working on some extra templates that are specific to creatures that granted the pact, and they'll grant scaling damage.

The thing I like about the Invocations is that even the Least ones remain fairly relevant at higher levels. Well, some become obsolete, but some are still useful. I could see an extra couple invocations, and it wouldn't be terrible unbalancing.



The biggest difficulty I'm facing is not overshadowing the Warlock class too much. As you said, it is a rather mediocre class when it comes to power, regardless of how cool it is. I suppose that no matter how I tweak it, pretty much any Warlock would be happy to pick up this template. So I just have to stop worrying about that. And stop assuming LA buyoff is an easy answer, as it is a variant rule.

Thanks for the input, great personal thoughts. :smallsmile:

DracoDei
2011-01-08, 07:34 PM
One thought MIGHT be to make only half of the EB dice (rounded UP) stack with those from other sources.

Fable Wright
2011-01-08, 08:07 PM
Cursed Bloodline seems like a cooler name for an ability.
I agree with the stacking damage, just plain added to the warlock's ability.
But actually, you can get DR 2/cold iron at first level; it's not too hard to accomplish. One idea that you might use is that you get DR X/Cold iron, starting at one, increasing by 1 every 3 levels, fast healing 2 at third level that activates when you're below half health, +1 every 4 levels, and Eldritch Blast +1d6 at 5th level, and every 5 levels thereafter. At first level, you get an Eldritch Blast attack, which does not stack with the Eldritch blast attack from a warlock. However, a warlock with this ability can make a full attack with his Eldritch Blast. This template is a gimme for warlock characters, yes, but it could definitely fit with the flavor and give them a much-needed boost at the higher levels when the damage gets less impressive, and covers many of the flaws of the warlock class, at the levels that need it.

MammonAzrael
2011-01-09, 12:22 AM
@ Dracodei - Interesting idea. Depending on how much I add to the template, this may be a good option.

@ DMofDarkness - I like that name so much more. I'm thinking of changing the template name to that...though it could be a nifty attack, too.

You agree that the damage should stack with the Warlock's EB? Does this mean you agree with the increased damage too I take it?

The DR or Fast healing I can get behind, but I don't want to overload it with features. I think it boils down to the point that whatever the template grants needs to scale. This can and will be done.

MammonAzrael
2011-01-10, 03:04 AM
So, big update to the first template, which is now Pact Descendant. And the addition of the second template, Pact Heir.

Thoughts?

tzaan
2011-01-10, 03:21 AM
so I could be a Pact Descendant Warlock, get smacked in the face with Convenientium some point in the campaign and also become a Pact Heir - I'm now a warlock with essentially a +2 to caster level EB? sorry if that's wrong. Combine that with Warlock's Scepter and the other EB boosting goodies and you're really cooking with gas :smallsmile:

and toward the endgame you'd have all the really useful least/lesser invocations (flying, sight-based, skill enhance..) ? *low whistle*

maybe I've just spelled out the stupidly obvious, but what can I say? I'm stupid and obvious. I'd totally play a PD/PH. Hell, it'd grant me access to Eldritch Theurge without taking levels in Warlock...hmmmm, so many ideas

Cadian 9th
2011-01-10, 03:40 AM
Good work, I like it.

However, I think it scales a bit too well, stepping on Warlock's toes. It is very awesome due to the Alignment restriction lifting, as well as the Instictive Darkness feat from Drow of the Underdark. You can create darkness as an At-Will immediate action... I've lost the HD, BA, Skills and Saves, but I got some good ability boosts and decent abilities, and all the class features of a 1st level warlock. In Gestalt this is really quite good.

Blood Magic, however, is really really bad. The boost isn't actually that huge, but the penalty is immense. 2 Con damage may sound like small, but in practice it's really bad. Perhaps change it to +2 CL and +2 Save DC, for 1 constitution damage?

MammonAzrael
2011-01-10, 04:24 AM
@ tzaan - Well really you're getting smack in the face with Convenientium when you were born with the template. Although there is no reason having that template is what caused you to become a Warlock in the first place. Researching your past and your powers, especially if you're a Warlock, makes perfect sense nearly any way you swing it. :smallsmile:

But no, you wouldn't be rocking a +2 CL. You'd be getting extra EB damage, +3d6 to be precise (14 extra damage on average) at 20th level, assuming no LA buyoff. And even with the buyoff your EB would be at 14d6...hardly backbreaking, but certainly a good boost, since Warlock's damage is pretty bad for a blaster.

Yeah, you should have access to most of the Least/Lesser Invocations you want. I'm not sure if I'm happy with the scaling knowledge of invocations. Though I'd mind it a lot less if there were a lot more options to choose from (like say...homebrew invocations :smalltongue:)

@ Cadian 9th - the scaling numbers need to be played with, these are just estimates. I want the template to be worth taking, by classes other than Warlock. But the problem is the Warlock is inherently not a powerful class, regardless of how much awesome flavor it has, and so I'm afraid some toe-stepping will happen. This is part of why I've wanted everything to stack with what the Warlock already gets; if everyone gets the same boost from it, then the Warlock is still happy, but if the Warlock doesn't get as much, there is even less reason to actually be a Warlock. Additionally I'd like it to be a relevant template to slap on a monster.

Also, a +1 template based on the warlock should be roughly equivalent to the first level in warlock. Don't you think?

That said, it is possible that all the scaling abilities need to be increased in scale by a HD or two.

As for Blood Magic...I'm wary, because I didn't want to spawn cheese. I was considering several ideas - Xd6 damage, damage equal to your HD, damage equal to your Cha score, 1 Con burn (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/psionicPowersOverview.htm#abilityBurn)...I decided to go safe. Of course, I was also considering allowing you to spend 2/4/6/etc Con to boost the DC an equivalent amount, not just limiting to a flat 2 for 2. And it really should boost CL.

I need to go to bed for now, but I'll be updating it tomorrow. Thanks for the input, both of you. :smallbiggrin:

tzaan
2011-01-10, 07:07 AM
Yeah, you should have access to most of the Least/Lesser Invocations you want. I'm not sure if I'm happy with the scaling knowledge of invocations. Though I'd mind it a lot less if there were a lot more options to choose from (like say...homebrew invocations )

I've got a buttload of rulebooks with additional invocations/ invocations you can nick from other casters and repurpose - draconomicon and suchlike. I forget the actual books (got so many of 'em) but in the end, with a few magic items to supplement, a Warlock could almost be self-sufficient, no? Flying, self-healing, DR, skill enhancement, darkvision, see invisibility...it's a pony with not just one trick but a whole damn carnival.

I'm trying to beat together an 'Eldritch Artificer' PrC that would allow me to craft any item that I wouldn't have an invocation for (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=9509864#post9509864 almost cuts the mustard) and with these templates I wouldn't have to worry about dead levels as much when I'm pitching it to a DM

MammonAzrael
2011-01-10, 08:38 PM
Official invocations are located in Complete Mage and Dragon Magic, I believe. There are also some hiding in Dragon Magazine. And you ultimately have a decent selection, its just that Invocations are so nifty I'd like to see more. :smallsmile:

Updated Blood Magic, and I'm thinking of removing the scaling invocations learning for Natural Invocation. With the additions of Cursed Bloodline, I don't think the templates need to keep learning new Invocations.

Cadian 9th
2011-01-10, 09:29 PM
Official invocations are located in Complete Mage and Dragon Magic, I believe. There are also some hiding in Dragon Magazine. And you ultimately have a decent selection, its just that Invocations are so nifty I'd like to see more. :smallsmile:

Updated Blood Magic, and I'm thinking of removing the scaling invocations learning for Natural Invocation. With the additions of Cursed Bloodline, I don't think the templates need to keep learning new Invocations.

Blood Magic is now a little bit too powerful - contrary to common belief, Warlocks do not always need charisma; Only if they want to add effects like shaken and sickened, then more awesome ones later... Certainly, these templates do not mind a creature with low charisma. The abudance of small healing possible and temporary hit points make the downside neglible.

From an optimization point of view (I love these templates), I'd go for a dwarven Pact Heir wizard with Dark Power and Enhanced Ability (Int), and Blood Magic - I'd be starting with +2 Dex, +4 Con, +2 int, -2 Cha, dwarf abilities etc. Dark power would be a handy boost. I'd put an 8 in Charisma, take the Pathetic Charisma flaw, for Charisma 4. For 4 damage to myself (With my +4 con) I've got +2d6 damage with fireball and +2 DC, which is nifty.

Perhaps take it to 1 constitution damage? Every two uses reduces your actual HP by your character level? That damage can't be healed back short of a 3 round lesser restoration (Or less at higher levels, but at higher levels its impact is lessened somewhat) and doesn't care about temporary hit points. It also adds a hard limit to the maximum number of augments you can make, short of restoration.

MammonAzrael
2011-01-10, 10:14 PM
No, but the creature will have a required +4 to Charisma. Just trying something out, honestly. My biggest concern with 1 Con damage is I don't want Naberius shenanigans. Which is why it was initially 2 Con damage. :smallsmile: But 1 Con burn feels a little too steep, and makes it an ability that would be rarely used.

I'm not sure how your Drawf managed those stats...from what I can see he'd have +4 Dex, +2/4Con, +0/2 Int, and +2 Cha.

I see what you're talking about regardless though. :smallsmile:

And while awesome, I'm thinking Dark Power is just too strong. Probably needs to be cut in half or more, considering it is unrestricted bonus damage. At lv 20 a flat +18 is more than 5d6 to every single damage roll.

Cadian 9th
2011-01-10, 10:49 PM
Silly me, I missed the " Pact heir can be applied to any corpereal creature with the Pact Descendent template. " >.<

Even better, +4 dex, +4 con, -2 Wis.

I know I just did the opti-fu example, but really, optimizers are always going to be able to use something in an overpowered way. It's our gift.

Naberius actually really suits the character, in my opinion, giving you silver tongue and skills. The faster ability healing essentially is giving you 1 free +2 CL and +2 DC per round but does mean if you have an uneven con score you'll be losing HP regardless for that round. The key is that it's once per round. This makes up for the lost caster levels from Naberius and the Templates.

You see? The +2 CL and +2 Save dc is good since it covers the templates. Now I tinkered with some builds, it seems actually quite balanced.

MammonAzrael
2011-01-10, 11:30 PM
I know that optimizers will always try to break things. And I've got no problem with that! :smallsmile:

I also agree that Naberius fits in well with this template...should I just not worry about it? After all, whoever aims for it will have to sacrifice another level to get the ability healing. And obviously there will be plenty of characters that wouldn't choose Blood Magic in the first place. Yes, I think I just convinced myself.

And yeah, you can't be an heir without being a descendant! :smalltongue:

Cadian 9th
2011-01-11, 01:20 AM
Yeah. A lot of homebrewer's beat themselves up about it. You want to keep it in mind, I think, but make sure it's balanced for normal play and that's it.

:smallredface:

MammonAzrael
2011-01-12, 05:17 AM
Ya. And at this point I'm getting close to happy with the balance of it. It's certainly a template I'd consider taking.

Now I'm thinking it simply may scale a little too much. I'm thinking about removing the scaling invocation gains (so you'd only get one least/lesser invocation), and toning down some of the Cursed bloodline scaling...especially Dark Power. It's like Craven+ and that feat is already kinda dumb.