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fortesama
2011-01-31, 03:42 AM
I've always wondered why those who study magic almost always depicted wearing a dress. Yes, armor gets in the way of magic due to various reasons depending on the setting or system and it's forgivable if it's for some social event or ceremony or if it's part of a dress code. But it gets a little odd when they're get themselves a combat situation. I guess it's forgivable if the robes themselves are magic though.

Then there's Hennet from the Player's Handbook of DnD 3.5 who doesn't wear much at all but that's another story entirely.

Kuma Kode
2011-01-31, 03:47 AM
That was actually why I liked Rappelz's summoners and mage classes (Rappelz is an MMORPG). Summoner's garb? Looks like this (http://i88.photobucket.com/albums/k185/kuma_klaw/dnd/528a9b0b.jpg). Rather sensible.

I usually use that picture for explaining what my wizard is wearing instead of robes to people who can't quite grasp why running around the woods with clothes that drag is a bad idea.

Xiander
2011-01-31, 03:48 AM
Then there's Hennet from the Player's Handbook of DnD 3.5 who doesn't wear much at all but that's another story entirely.

Itīs because magic schools have dresscode, and the students get used to it. :smallwink:

Hennet is a sorceror, and thus he can dress however he likes. :smallbiggrin:

teslas
2011-01-31, 03:52 AM
First of all, outfits in video games, especially Asian ones, are usually in no way accurate in representing anything a person would wade into combat wearing :smallconfused:

That aside, maybe it's cultural pressure? All the cool kids wear big, flowing robes?

Judging by the PHB illustrations though, neither the wizard nor the sorcerer are wearing much. Only the archmage in the DMG comes to mind as wearing anything robe-ish, but it looks pretty freaking magical.

In a practical world, casters would wear similar clothes as to anyone else about to go into a fight in whatever environment they're in. In the high fantasy world, I guess a bunch of nerds thought robes were cool.

Pentachoron
2011-01-31, 03:55 AM
Aside from the shame it instills in their foes to be defeated by a guy in a dress?

Probably because robes are pretty well the de facto outfit of anything occult. Also because I'm pretty sure when you can bend reality to your whim you tend to care very little about trivialities like clothing.

Eldariel
2011-01-31, 03:57 AM
Because lots of robes make for easy cheap parlor tricks; also 'cause they're badass. I guess it's just a historical outlook for wisemen and magicians and kinda stuck with the transition to fantasy.

Ravens_cry
2011-01-31, 03:58 AM
Scholars wore robes, presumingly because a thick wool robe is nice and warm in a draughty scriptorium because your body heat is contained in the robe. Many conceptions of the wizard are based around scholars and magi.
Of course, if you are going adventuring, wear something somewhat more practical.

DragonSinged
2011-01-31, 03:59 AM
Well, another thing to think about is something that Terry Pratchett goes into a few times in his witches series, where the logic follows something like: Witches are powerful, and command respect. What do people stereotypically think of when they think of a witch? Black clothes, big pointy black hat. Therefore, if you want people to know that you are a witch, you should wear black clothes and a big pointy black hat.

This is somewhat the logic that I am following with my current wizard. Could he run around in tights and a tunic? Yeah, sure. But he's a wizard, and a professor and teacher of other wizards, for that matter, and he damned well wants people to know it, regardless of whether he is currently actually casting any spells. So, he dresses like a wizard: Long, comfortable, noble-looking robes.

Not to mention, the breeze is kind of nice.


Edit: Now, if I'm playing a Beguiler, that's an entirely different story...

teslas
2011-01-31, 04:26 AM
Well, another thing to think about is something that Terry Pratchett goes into a few times in his witches series, where the logic follows something like: Witches are powerful, and command respect. What do people stereotypically think of when they think of a witch? Black clothes, big pointy black hat. Therefore, if you want people to know that you are a witch, you should wear black clothes and a big pointy black hat.

This is somewhat the logic that I am following with my current wizard. Could he run around in tights and a tunic? Yeah, sure. But he's a wizard, and a professor and teacher of other wizards, for that matter, and he damned well wants people to know it, regardless of whether he is currently actually casting any spells. So, he dresses like a wizard: Long, comfortable, noble-looking robes.

Not to mention, the breeze is kind of nice.

In a fight where I am actually threatened, and the enemies are intelligent enough to take what I'm wearing into account, wouldn't that just paint a giant target on me?

"Hey! That guy can summon demons, send us to other planes, and fly around while invisibly shooting (also potentially invisible) fireballs at us. Get him before he gets us!"

DragonSinged
2011-01-31, 04:33 AM
In a fight where I am actually threatened, and the enemies are intelligent enough to take what I'm wearing into account, wouldn't that just paint a giant target on me?

"Hey! That guy can summon demons, send us to other planes, and fly around while invisibly shooting (also potentially invisible) fireballs at us. Get him before he gets us!"

Well, that of course entirely depends on the view NPCs have of Wizards in your world. They could just as easily think, "Oh man, that guy in the big shiny armor can cut through like 4 guys with a single swing of his sword! Kill him first!"


Of course, if the NPCs know the fight is coming and are planning ahead of time, then their strategy will be based off of whatever advance knowledge they have of the party, and what the wizard is wearing will probably have no effect on that. If they don't know the fight is coming, then the wizard should be a fair distance away from them anyways, and the meat shields with the big swords or spiked chains or whatever should be all up in their grills, yo, and should hopefully distract them somewhat while the invisible wizard is summoning demons, sending them to other planes, and flying around shooting fireballs at them. Or was he shooting invisible fireballs? Well, whatever.


But again, basically: Do your NPCs have metagame knowledge that the Wizard is Tier 1, and the Monk is not? If not, then what you're wearing shouldn't necessarily affect whether they target you first or not. Unless, of course, they've had a run-in with you before, but again, then what you're wearing won't really change things.

rayne_dragon
2011-01-31, 04:38 AM
wearing a dress.

I find it mildly offensive to refer to robes as a dress because the two are quite distinct. But I also get annoyed at people confusing cloaks and capes, so....

I think the image of robes stems from how for most of history the elite and educated of our society wore robes or similar vestments. Most of the scholarly types of the middle ages were monks or priests, who wore robes. Besides, robes are comfy (dresses less so) and may not be as bad for combat situations as one may think. I've found that sufficiently loose full-length skirts don't hinder fighting ability at all, so I see no reason why this couldn't work with a robe at all (and it isn't like you're fighting with weapons much as a caster either).

Godskook
2011-01-31, 04:43 AM
Most people in D&D are not assuming "we're going into a fight" as their standard for what they wear on a daily basis.

teslas
2011-01-31, 04:45 AM
But again, basically: Do your NPCs have metagame knowledge that the Wizard is Tier 1, and the Monk is not? If not, then what you're wearing shouldn't necessarily affect whether they target you first or not. Unless, of course, they've had a run-in with you before, but again, then what you're wearing won't really change things.

I agree. What advanced knowledge the enemies have of the party is the most important aspect. I also think that as a learned man of learning and knowledge, if you had more than 8 wisdom for common sense and didn't have a problem with pride, you might dress more casually.

What I don't think you're taking into account though, is that most thugs or enemies you'll fight in games can understand that sword and board guy standing in front of him. They know what to expect and can account for it. They might not know what the wizard can do, and thus fear it, and thus want to hurt it before they find out the hard way.

It goes without saying that all enemy mages will know mages are the highest threat, or at least are the most versatile in most situations.

Or you're fighting dire bears and raaawwrr attack the guy in front of me.

Alleran
2011-01-31, 05:08 AM
None of my wizard characters ever bother with robes and pointy hats. My current one prefers simple dark traveling clothes (tunic, trousers, belt, boots) and a long coat. Though he has found a fedora-style hat recently that he's grown quite fond of. And absolutely refuses to leave behind, even to the point of running back into the lair of an angry dragon to fetch it.

Ravens_cry
2011-01-31, 05:19 AM
None of my wizard characters ever bother with robes and pointy hats. My current one prefers simple dark traveling clothes (tunic, trousers, belt, boots) and a long coat. Though he has found a fedora-style hat recently that he's grown quite fond of. And absolutely refuses to leave behind, even to the point of running back into the lair of an angry dragon to fetch it.
Dunta dun ta, dun da dun, dunta dun ta, dun tun tun! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oVNNhBtBbOs)

Heliomance
2011-01-31, 05:42 AM
So why I ask? It doesn't make much sense, that a man of my stature should have to wear a dress. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2z29Rk8814w)

Yora
2011-01-31, 05:57 AM
I've always wondered why those who study magic almost always depicted wearing a dress.
Gandalf had one.

dsmiles
2011-01-31, 06:01 AM
I'd pick a reinforced greatcoat, goggles, and jackboots, with leather pants and a shirt that I could move easily in. Maybe a snazzy hat to tie it all together. But then again, I play mostly in the Iron Kingdoms.
Something like these guys:
http://privateerpress.com/files/products/iron-kingdoms/seth-alkot-monster-hunter.png
http://privateerpress.com/files/products/iron-kingdoms/draegyn-the-black-bastard.png
http://privateerpress.com/files/products/mercenaries/solos/gorman-di-wulfe-rogue-alchemist.pngI mean, really. Wizards should dress more sensibly.

Eldan
2011-01-31, 06:07 AM
According to Harry Dresden, it's warm and comfy.

Alleran
2011-01-31, 06:23 AM
Dunta dun ta, dun da dun, dunta dun ta, dun tun tun! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oVNNhBtBbOs)
I'd be lying if I said that wasn't partly the inspiration for my dungeon-crawling, treasure-looting wizard. He even makes up all his plans as he goes, to the great annoyance of everybody else.

Yuki Akuma
2011-01-31, 06:26 AM
Robes are practical. They're warm, have room for lots of pockets, don't restrict motion very much, and most come with a hood to keep your head dry when it rains.

Innis Cabal
2011-01-31, 06:27 AM
Robes are practical. They're warm, have room for lots of pockets, don't restrict motion very much, and most come with a hood to keep your head dry when it rains.

I was simply going to say that the person asking has never worn a robe. But that works.

Eldan
2011-01-31, 06:28 AM
And wide sleeves. How can you be a magician without wide sleeves?

I've tried it, it just doesn't work. You are restricted to the simplest of tricks. spells.

umbrapolaris
2011-01-31, 06:28 AM
Robes are practical. They're warm, have room for lots of pockets, don't restrict motion very much, and most come with a hood to keep your head dry when it rains.

and you can ask your summoned succubus to do naughty things under the robe without be noticed by your jealous companions ^^

Spiryt
2011-01-31, 06:41 AM
I'd pick a reinforced greatcoat, goggles, and jackboots, with leather pants and a shirt that I could move easily in. Maybe a snazzy hat to tie it all together. But then again, I play mostly in the Iron Kingdoms.
Something like these guys:
http://privateerpress.com/files/products/iron-kingdoms/seth-alkot-monster-hunter.png
http://privateerpress.com/files/products/iron-kingdoms/draegyn-the-black-bastard.png
http://privateerpress.com/files/products/mercenaries/solos/gorman-di-wulfe-rogue-alchemist.pngI mean, really. Wizards should dress more sensibly.

Lol, and those are more "sensible" options?

With googles hell knows what for, tons of buckles, little useless bits of armor here and there without visible purpose, buckles and pants straight out from Manowar, masks and hats?

From this, I go straight to my answer to the OP:

Clothing in fantasy generally doesn't make much sense.

It's for "aesthetic" purposes born in societies in which clothing also generally had lost a lot of touch with "practical sense".

So it's just whatever looks nice/cool/badass/totallysexyfantasydarkelfchickwithskimpystuff for fantasy reader/player - for fun.

Vistella
2011-01-31, 07:06 AM
Who is forcing you to wear a robe?
dont want it, dont do it

The Glyphstone
2011-01-31, 07:09 AM
Most people in D&D are not assuming "we're going into a fight" as their standard for what they wear on a daily basis.

Adventurers are far from 'most people', even in D&D. They always assume they're going into a fight on a daily basis, usually ones they start.

Lurkmoar
2011-01-31, 07:20 AM
Hey, the orphans attacked first! They were replaced with doppelgangers I tell you!

But I always thought wizards wore robes simple because they could hide their precious spell components more easily. And to just let things hang out, ya know?

Clovis
2011-01-31, 07:55 AM
Often wondered about the same thing. Conversely, my mage never wears a robe but normal adventuring gear, ie high boots, trousers, tunic, cape/overcoat and of course the ubiquitous wizard's utility belt: spell component pouches. As someone already pointed out: why make yourself an obvious target for the first strike? Of course, the familiar hanging about is a dead giveaway but still...
On another note, robes are comfy and keep warmth in quite nicely. But difficult when riding a horse or flying.

Radar
2011-01-31, 07:55 AM
Who is forcing you to wear a robe?
dont want it, dont do it
Wooo! I am invisible! :elan:

Come to think of it, Endure Elements combined with Greater Invisibility does open up a lot of options for unfashionable yet comfortable clothing. It could be fun to Dispell an invisible enemy wizard only to see him wearing a tutu, because he felt like it and didn't think anyone would notice. You can also let your sense of fashion loose with a single casting of Permanent Image (if it can be cast on an item).

Karoht
2011-01-31, 08:01 AM
I've always wondered why those who study magic almost always depicted wearing a dress. Yes, armor gets in the way of magic due to various reasons depending on the setting or system and it's forgivable if it's for some social event or ceremony or if it's part of a dress code. But it gets a little odd when they're get themselves a combat situation. I guess it's forgivable if the robes themselves are magic though.

Then there's Hennet from the Player's Handbook of DnD 3.5 who doesn't wear much at all but that's another story entirely.

I've always believed that it is borrowing from other earlier traditions where magic or power of belief had sway. Druids, Clerics, benedictine monks (non-DnD monks), anything where a group of people might sit around a circle and mumble some words of mojo. It has a historical basis on earth, I guess they just extrapolated it to EVERY magical tradition in DnD. Kinda sorta makes sense if you think about it that way.

Besides, sure beats the old school pagan way where they did it in their birthday suit. Somehow I don't think they can put that on the cover art of a players guide.

J.Gellert
2011-01-31, 08:07 AM
Reason 1: It tells the world that you are powerful. The poor peasants who work the earth must wear their work clothes, guardsmen wear uniforms, and so on. Your robe? It tells the world that you do not have to work. Your eccentric look? It's a big "screw you" to non-wizards.

Reason 2: Dramatic wind.

Ormur
2011-01-31, 08:08 AM
My wizard wears fancy robes because he's a baron and he's got to impress all those eldritch horrors and obstinate NPCs that won't give me their help. It's not like they have any sort of mechanical disadvantages and prestidigitation means you can wade into battle and not worry about having to dry clean all that velvet and silk.

Analytica
2011-01-31, 09:13 AM
I like the thought of clothing that uses a lot of fabric, i.e. robes, as a means of signalling status. Also, if robes have become expected wear for priests, scholars or mages, donning them means that you get better reception from commoners who fear or respect you. It might also make you a target, but unless that was more commonly the kind of situation you were in, across all the periods in your life that formed your habits, it might have lesser impact.

That said, I would like to present the stunning image of a group of wizards at a LARP I went to last year (from here (http://thule.vas.nu/fotogalleri/densvartanyckeln/ordo_novus.html)):

http://thule.vas.nu/fotogalleri/densvartanyckeln/ordo_novus.jpg

with a more non-roby style. Status was signalled according to white > black > red.

onthetown
2011-01-31, 09:26 AM
The Wizard in the Pathfinder Core Rulebook has nice, practical clothes, methinks. The Sorceress, on the other hand... Well, she isn't going to be fighting any Frost Giants anytime soon.

Knaight
2011-01-31, 09:35 AM
Taking inspiration from ancient China.

One would wear robes, including those which dragged behind them for several feet, simply to announce that they can. If they are walking, its on very clean, very dry ground that is some variety of floor or other, so the robe can't get caught, and doesn't get dirty easily. If there is to be travel over dirty ground, its in some variety of wheeled vehicle, with the inside clean.

Expanding this to wizards is sensible. Expanding this to adventuring wizards really isn't, as their relations with finery are going to cause trouble unless they are limited to expensive fabrics, patterns, embroidery, unobtrusive jewelery, or other similar status symbols.

Eldan
2011-01-31, 09:38 AM
Well, not really. A single casting of prestidigitation and mending can take care of your clothes, really. So, dirt isn't all that much of a problem.

shadow_archmagi
2011-01-31, 09:44 AM
If I recall correctly, there's no difference between a trenchcoat and a robe, besides that robes are fuzzy.

Gnoman
2011-01-31, 09:46 AM
Odin wore robes when he walked the earth, and if it's good enough for Odin...


(The Generic Wizard is based heavily on Gandalf, and Gndalf was based heavily on Odin's mortal avatar.)

Telonius
2011-01-31, 09:58 AM
They wear robes because robes are not form-fitting. Years of doing nothing but study can take a toll on a body. Wearing a robe that obscures the body from head to floor can help give a false impression of a more solid figure. His opponents don't see two scrawny legs that look like they're barely holding up a withered old body. They see a more solid-looking object.

Skeletor
2011-01-31, 10:09 AM
I dunno I always tend to play a wizard who wears what would be considered more of a 'rogueish' garb. I find it's particularly useful when you need to do some magic with out being suspected.

CycloneJoker
2011-01-31, 10:28 AM
A dude can wear a dress/skirt if he wants, assuming he has a 5-1/2' long sword on his back. Or is throwing logs.

BTW, wear a nightweave(?), or the diplomacy equivalent, tunic, socks, stockings, and every other article of clothing you don't have a magic item in the slot.

Zaydos
2011-01-31, 10:44 AM
Odin wore robes when he walked the earth, and if it's good enough for Odin...


(The Generic Wizard is based heavily on Gandalf, and Gndalf was based heavily on Odin's mortal avatar.)

By heavily you mean dresses the exact same, has a longer beard than some representation, two eyes, and smokes pipeweed.

But yes it comes largely from Gandalf via Odin; although examples do exist before Gandalf which are most likely best explained by the clothing of monks and other religious figures who were also the best educated members of their society at the time (benedictine monks I'm looking at you) and known for skill with magic.

Honestly I'd say it's a mix of both.

Roderick_BR
2011-01-31, 10:49 AM
Because they wouldn't look good in t-shirts and shorts :smalltongue:

Seriously, my wizards wears practical travel clothes (equipment chapter, PHB) instead of "wizard's robes".
It's mostly a cultural thing. Some story had someone in robes, with cool floating capes and stuff, and everyone copied. See Elminster before and after Forgotten Realms went into 3.x

WarKitty
2011-01-31, 11:14 AM
I tend to assume that the outer layer of most travel clothes is a long cloak. Sort like this:

http://ny-image1.etsy.com/il_fullxfull.54189805.jpg

bokodasu
2011-01-31, 11:15 AM
Because D&D denies the existence of everything between the belt and the boots, and you need something to cover up the empty space. How else to explain the lack of a "pants" slot?

Fhaolan
2011-01-31, 11:31 AM
Most depictions of wizards are derived from Greek depictions of the Persian Zoroaster Magi. Zoroastrianism, also called Mazdaism, was once one of the most widespread religions who's priests, called Magi, were encouraged to be both priests and philosophers. As such, it was associated it very heavily with astrology and alchemy. Robes were part of the priestly costume, and somewhat pointy hats were quite popular in the Persian regions. When the Greeks depicted these things, they had a tendency to put astrological/alchemical symbols all over the robes to highlight the Magi in the image.

Over time, many parts of the Zorastrianism religion were borrowed by other religions. While Zorastrianism was nominally an inclusive religion which encouraged this as a method of spreading it's faith, some of those borrowing religions were exclusive ('One True Faith' types) and once they borrowed enough to convince conversion they demonized Zorastrianism and associated it with demon-summoning, witchcraft-equivalents, etc. From this it's an easy skip to the Evil Wizard dressed in robes and a pointy hat all covered in mystical symbols.

arguskos
2011-01-31, 11:42 AM
Most depictions of wizards are derived from Greek depictions of the Persian Zoroaster Magi. Zoroastrianism, also called Mazdaism, was once one of the most widespread religions who's priests, called Magi, were encouraged to be both priests and philosophers. As such, it was associated it very heavily with astrology and alchemy. Robes were part of the priestly costume, and somewhat pointy hats were quite popular in the Persian regions. When the Greeks depicted these things, they had a tendency to put astrological/alchemical symbols all over the robes to highlight the Magi in the image.

Over time, many parts of the Zorastrianism religion were borrowed by other religions. While Zorastrianism was nominally an inclusive religion which encouraged this as a method of spreading it's faith, some of those borrowing religions were exclusive ('One True Faith' types) and once they borrowed enough to convince conversion they demonized Zorastrianism and associated it with demon-summoning, witchcraft-equivalents, etc. From this it's an easy skip to the Evil Wizard dressed in robes and a pointy hat all covered in mystical symbols.
Curious. I'll have to ask my grandfather, who is a Zoroastrian, about such things. He may have a few texts lying around detailing such practices. While this skirts dangerously close to RL religion, I wanted to thank you for the heads up about it.

Fhaolan: always an interesting read.

grimbold
2011-01-31, 11:42 AM
Scholars wore robes, presumingly because a thick wool robe is nice and warm in a draughty scriptorium because your body heat is contained in the robe. Many conceptions of the wizard are based around scholars and magi.
Of course, if you are going adventuring, wear something somewhat more practical.
agreed
however i like to have wizards who were normal comfortable clothes
also my mom upon seeing hennet decided that he must have a belt fetish

Flickerdart
2011-01-31, 11:44 AM
however i like to have wizards who were normal comfortable clothes
Ragamoffyn wizards, Awaken, or reverse sandwich trick? :smallwink:

Psyren
2011-01-31, 12:08 PM
I love robes; they just ooze with badass occult flavor. I hate wearing a vest and pants in WoW on my casters (even the shamans and druids) and will only do so when the stats are a clear win.

Though playing a psion in a t-shirt and jeans would be pretty cool too:

http://c.wrzuta.pl/wi11209/a4d24ba900079cb548df79bc/0/psyren%2520-%2520ageha%2520yoshina%2520

Keld Denar
2011-01-31, 12:34 PM
A wizard should wear monk robes. Whats the best way to take out a wizard from afar? Arrows. What do monks do with arrows? I refer you to the scene in Hero.

Anyone who's ever encountered a monk before will hopefully make that mistake and target someone else. Well, until you start flinging flaming bat poo at people.

Maho-Tsukai
2011-01-31, 01:02 PM
In my newest campaign setting that I am slowly creating "robe-wearing" classes tend to go for a more "modern" look(though EVERYTHING dose due to the setting being both high tech AND high magic, at the same time...and not in the gloomy, FFVII Cyberpunk way....or the "Old-world style, new world tech" type of thing that MTG's Ravnica setting(and to a lesser extent Ebberron) use.

For a few examples of the "look" I am going for check out the pics below..

Male Wizard(Necro) or Death Master:
http://i1178.photobucket.com/albums/x373/TagForcePart2/28%20-%20The%20Duelist%20Genesis/TDGS-EN026-DharctheDarkCharmer.jpg

Female Wizard(Evoc)or Fire-based Sorcerer
http://i1093.photobucket.com/albums/i436/TagForcePart1/15%20-%20The%20Lost%20Millenium/TLM-EN028-HiitatheFireCharmer.jpg

Yeah, I know...their yugioh cards...but I don't care because they have the general look of casters in my newest setting...So yeah...also, while I know said look is not 100% practical it's more practical then the robes.

So, yeah..Robes do have an awesome factor but you can easily take practical yet boring and make it look awesome....all it usually takes is slapping on a badass long coat which, while not all that practical can be removed in a pinch, unlike robes, and still has the flowy-coolness that robes have.

The Shadowmind
2011-01-31, 02:14 PM
Why do Wizard's wear robes?
Why because they don't have the legs for a mini-skirt.:smalltongue:

Psyren
2011-01-31, 02:23 PM
Why do Wizard's wear robes?
Why because they don't have the legs for a mini-skirt.:smalltongue:

There ARE female wizards, you know...:smalltongue:

(In any case, speak for yourself!)

Flickerdart
2011-01-31, 02:27 PM
There ARE female wizards, you know...:smalltongue:

(In any case, speak for yourself!)
Don't be ridiculous. Women can't grow the necessary beard.

Besides, female wizards are called witches.

Kaldrin
2011-01-31, 02:28 PM
I've never had any kind of magic using character wear robes in any game I've ever been in. As a result of that though, you're usually going to see a group of adventurers and know who the magic users are though... the ones wearing no armour whatsoever are usually the squishy ones.

Toliudar
2011-01-31, 02:44 PM
A wizard should wear monk robes. Whats the best way to take out a wizard from afar? Arrows. What do monks do with arrows? I refer you to the scene in Hero.

Anyone who's ever encountered a monk before will hopefully make that mistake and target someone else. Well, until you start flinging flaming bat poo at people.

This is brilliant.

Also, I blame the Wizard's much-vaunted 15-minute workday. If you're spending 23.75 hours lounging around in your rope trick in your nightshirt, who can be bothered to get dressed for a few minutes of spell-chucking?

Keinnicht
2011-01-31, 03:00 PM
Itīs because magic schools have dresscode, and the students get used to it. :smallwink:

Hennet is a sorceror, and thus he can dress however he likes. :smallbiggrin:

Mialee's outfit would not pass any school's dress standards, either, though. Unless the elves go to Fetish Fuel School of Magic.

I think the answer is because robes have a spooky kind of seriousness about them. There's just something intimidating about a frail bald guy in a plain robe who can throw fireballs with a few gestures.

Look at Raistlin. The only thing keeping that guy intimidating is his style of dress. Based on the description of how frail he is, nobody could take him seriously if he dressed like Hennet, no matter how skilled a mage he is.

Keld Denar
2011-01-31, 03:05 PM
The power of cleavage and bare midrifts compels you!

Prime32
2011-01-31, 03:08 PM
Mialee's outfit would not pass any school's dress standards, either, though. Unless the elves go to Fetish Fuel School of Magic.Mialee is secretly an albino drow. And, since females become clerics, a crossdresser.

Psyren
2011-01-31, 03:12 PM
Don't be ridiculous. Women can't grow the necessary beard.

Sure they can - they just need to be dwarves!



Look at Raistlin. The only thing keeping that guy intimidating is his style of dress. Based on the description of how frail he is, nobody could take him seriously if he dressed like Hennet, no matter how skilled a mage he is.

Agreed, he'd look like a walking skeleton in tunic+breeches. Voluminous/baggy clothes help to mask how scrawny you are - any number of contemporary rappers can attest to this :smallwink:

Blackfang108
2011-01-31, 03:17 PM
I've always wondered why those who study magic almost always depicted wearing a dress. Yes, armor gets in the way of magic due to various reasons depending on the setting or system and it's forgivable if it's for some social event or ceremony or if it's part of a dress code. But it gets a little odd when they're get themselves a combat situation. I guess it's forgivable if the robes themselves are magic though.

Then there's Hennet from the Player's Handbook of DnD 3.5 who doesn't wear much at all but that's another story entirely.

According to Harry Dresden, it's because Wizard Laboratories are drafty and COLD.

Squark
2011-01-31, 03:26 PM
Sure they can - they just need to be dwarves!

Except in all of the stock D&D settings, female dwarves cannot grow beards.

WarKitty
2011-01-31, 03:46 PM
What exactly are people thinking of as robes? Because one of these looks comfortable and practical, and one looks just plain silly:

http://i599.photobucket.com/albums/tt79/Jese_Cabron/robes.jpg

arguskos
2011-01-31, 03:49 PM
Mialee is secretly an albino drow. And, since females become clerics, a crossdresser.
No she's not. Female drow are attractive. She's a frog.

Mialee: Frog-Lady from Neptune. :smallyuk:

Coidzor
2011-01-31, 03:54 PM
The power of cleavage and bare midrifts compels you!

What cleavage? Mialee is a purple mutant frog (except when she's orange).


Except in all of the stock D&D settings, female dwarves cannot grow beards.

Shh! That's what they want you to think!

Spiryt
2011-01-31, 03:54 PM
What exactly are people thinking of as robes? Because one of these looks comfortable and practical, and one looks just plain silly:

http://i599.photobucket.com/albums/tt79/Jese_Cabron/robes.jpg

Uh, they both exactly the same, with one having different colors and damn stars.

May look silly but it comfort stays the same.

Prime32
2011-01-31, 03:58 PM
No she's not. Female drow are attractive.You didn't read the last part of my post, did you? :smalltongue:

Callista
2011-01-31, 04:02 PM
I think wizard robes come from the same source as the robes you wear for graduation. They're a sign of having a degree, being learned in something.

Squark--Female dwarves with beards comes from Tolkien. So I feel quite justified in giving my female dwarf a beard, even if D&D designers are too badly attached to the idea that all females must conform to the human idea of hotness, even if they aren't humans! I say: If I'm playing a lady dwarf and I want her to have a beard, she'll have a beard, dangit, and she's going to braid it into lots of tiny little braids and decorate it with mithril beads and be absolutely vain about it, because she's a girl, and girls are just like that!:smallbiggrin:

kamikasei
2011-01-31, 04:13 PM
I generally just envision robes as like cassocks or kimonos - tailored and worn so as not to hinder movement. An adventuring wizard may wear them, but they'd be quite practical. Stay-at-home, ivory tower wizards might go for more impractical ostentation.

(Also, I generally assume they're being worn over a normal shirt and pants.)

...even if D&D designers are too badly attached to the idea that all females must conform to the human idea of hotness...
...because she's a girl, and girls are just like that!:smallbiggrin:
Was that deliberate irony?

Hawriel
2011-01-31, 04:15 PM
Wizards wear robes for the same reason that monks, priests, romans, indians (even today), nuns, Jesus, Moses, aribs (even today), aboriginal americans, ok just about evey culture on the planet. Its a simple clothing item to wear. Easily made. ITs not abnormal for any person to wear robe like clothing. It would be just as normal for a fighter to wear robes.

I know its hard for oh so sophisticated GAP, and OLD NAVY shoppers to understand.

Psyren
2011-01-31, 04:35 PM
ITs not abnormal for any person to wear robe like clothing. It would be just as normal for a fighter to wear robes.

Your analogy falls apart here - the contention is not the wearing of robes in a relaxed setting, but specifically in combat; a place few nuns, romans, arabs etc. would choose to be in, or wear robes in if they were.

(Speculating on Jesus' AC in robes sounds as though it would be against the forum rules, so I won't :smalltongue:)

WarKitty
2011-01-31, 04:37 PM
Your analogy falls apart here - the contention is not the wearing of robes in a relaxed setting, but specifically in combat; a place few nuns, romans, arabs etc. would choose to be in, or wear robes in if they were.

(Speculating on Jesus' AC in robes sounds as though it would be against the forum rules, so I won't :smalltongue:)

Actually iirc arabic fighters did wear robes into combat. In the desert environment it was a significant advantage over the heavily armored european knights.

Of course, I've actually taken a fondness to putting my rogues and other light armor types in loose robes worn over leather. It's a lot of fun when the guy suddenly gets sneak attacked by the robe-wearer.

Trekkin
2011-01-31, 04:44 PM
Wizards wear robes because people laughing at the guy in the robe are legally target practice in some jurisdictions.

Besides, these are people who can teleport halfway across the world to turn the infant grandparents of the poor sap who their infallible future-vision informs them will one day oppose them into an eldritch abomination so beyond normal comprehension that the normal--and indeed, automatic-- explanation for the existence of creatures of its sort is to blame wizards for them, before the interference of literally omnipotent beings is considered.
It is entirely possible that their powers are such that they have retroactively changed the course of evolution by selecting against the genes required to object to their wearing robes after altering heredity, psychology, and causality to work like that.

There's also an intimidation component; they're not armored enough to take a blow, not dressed lightly enough to dodge it, and old enough that if they were going to die from fighting poorly, it would have happened by now. The logical conclusion is that somehow, by some art so strange it apparently transcends physical reality, no sword is ever going to touch them.

snoopy13a
2011-01-31, 04:47 PM
I think wizards should dress foppish. A group of NPCs who are priority targeting are going to take out the person wearing wizard robes first. On the other hand, the supposely ineffective aristocrat can be saved for last.

Ravens_cry
2011-01-31, 04:47 PM
Actually iirc arabic fighters did wear robes into combat. In the desert environment it was a significant advantage over the heavily armored european knights.
In a desert environment, robes create a breeze effect that keeps you cool,especially compared to a metal mesh over a padded undergarment to prevent chaffing.
Most D&D takes place in colder climates however.

Jayabalard
2011-01-31, 04:52 PM
Except in all of the stock D&D settings, female dwarves cannot grow beards.That really depends on what you mean by "Stock D&D settings" ... female dwarves have beards in Greyhawk (often shaved, with some being totally non beareded in 3e); and in forgotten realms it varies wildly by edition: they are depicted as growing sideburns, mustaches, or beards. There's also some variation by subrace; I seem to recall someone references races of faerun in a thread on this topic that stated clearly that some female dwarfs have beards.

I seem to recall that they had beards in dragonlance as well; female gully dwarfs didn't have full beards (just whiskers on their cheeks but not on their chins) but the other subraces did.

Odin the Ignoble
2011-01-31, 04:52 PM
Wizards do it because it's comfortable, and they enjoy a draft around the nether bits. A modern equivalent would be somebody walking around in a bathrobe and fuzzy slippers.

I think they do it because know one who isn't a wizard will question it.

Spiryt
2011-01-31, 04:58 PM
Actually iirc arabic fighters did wear robes into combat. In the desert environment it was a significant advantage over the heavily armored european knights.


Hmmm...

Link, goddamn photobucket (http://media.photobucket.com/image/Saladin/KnightDamien/Comparisons/Saladin-Saracens06.jpg)

http://www.recklessbooks.co.uk/communities/9/004/007/811/829/images/4532460004.jpg

Those are not sources, to say at least, but it's just quick example for illustration.

Arabic heavy riders, and everyone that could afford heavy armor were often more heavily armored than european knights.

Especially faris or later mameluks, under Saladin for example.

Mail between two layers of quilted fabric were not unheard of, just like scales and lammerelars, generally unused in Europe.

If robes were "advantage" over armor, European would wear them too. It's as simple as that.

Generally anything east of Turkey tends to be portrayed as light armored and ninja in fantasy and mass culture, but it doesn't have much to do with reality. :smallwink:

Ravens_cry
2011-01-31, 05:11 PM
That really depends on what you mean by "Stock D&D settings" ... female dwarves have dwarves in both Greyhawk (often shaved, with some being totally non beareded in 3e); in forgotten realms it varies wildly by edition: they are depicted as growing sideburns, mustaches, or beards. There's also some variation by subrace
I should hope so, a female dwarf giving birth a human or an orc would lead to some . . .interesting questions.

Eldariel
2011-01-31, 05:23 PM
I should hope so, a female dwarf giving birth a human or an orc would lead to some . . .interesting questions.

While human giving birth to a dwarf, orc, dragon or Cthulhu is par de course :smallamused:

arguskos
2011-01-31, 05:40 PM
You didn't read the last part of my post, did you? :smalltongue:
Male drow are usually portrayed as attractive too. Mialee can't be ELVEN, she's a frog. Seriously. Frog. A horrifying horrifying frog.

Callista
2011-01-31, 05:43 PM
Was that deliberate irony?Yes, yes it was... notice the :smallbiggrin:?

Super_Fluous
2011-01-31, 05:47 PM
They're as comfortable as possible. When you're rewriting the laws of reality, you don't want something as foolish as your pants riding up and giving you a wedgie to make your hand slip and causing all of your companions' heads to explode.

Ravens_cry
2011-01-31, 05:55 PM
Male drow are usually portrayed as attractive too. Mialee can't be ELVEN, she's a frog. Seriously. Frog. A horrifying horrifying frog.
I think she looks fey. Wide spaced eyes, a tiny nose, an arrow sharp chin, and cheek bones you could skin an apple with?
Definitely one of the Fair Folk.
Remember, Elves are not humans.

Callista
2011-01-31, 06:57 PM
Who says all elves are beautiful?

Mialee just happens to be an ugly elf.

Dwarves are cooler anyway.

Eldariel
2011-01-31, 07:11 PM
Remember, Elves are not humans.

Neither are they purple or orange, which is what the art of Mialee shows her as.

dsmiles
2011-01-31, 07:13 PM
Who says all elves are beautiful?

Mialee just happens to be an ugly elf.

Dwarves are cooler anyway.

Aaaaahhh, but Goblins are the best. :smallbiggrin:

Ravens_cry
2011-01-31, 07:17 PM
Neither are they purple or orange, which is what the art of Mialee shows her as.
Lighting makes all the difference. The one where she is purple she is obviously doing some mystical hoodoo that is affecting the lighting. In the other, prestidigitation equivalent of a spray-on tan mayhap?
***
Yeah, that is total bull.
Most complaints centre around her features though, and to that I say, so what? I rather like how alien she looks personally.

dsmiles
2011-01-31, 07:27 PM
Lighting makes all the difference. The one where she is purple she is obviously doing some mystical hoodoo that is affecting the lighting. In the other, prestidigitation equivalent of a spray-on tan mayhap?
***
Yeah, that is total bull.
Most complaints centre around her features though, and to that I say, so what? I rather like how alien she looks personally.

Well, consider me on "Team Mialee is a Space Frog." Of course, that druid's no looker, either.

I think they could have gotten better artists for the 3e/3.5e PCs.

arguskos
2011-01-31, 07:31 PM
Well, consider me on "Team Mialee is a Space Frog." Of course, that druid's no looker, either.
Mialee: Space Frog from Space.


I think they could have gotten better artists for the 3e/3.5e PCs.
Yeah. Like Rob Liefield. :smalltongue: yeah I went there :P

Frozen_Feet
2011-01-31, 07:34 PM
Robes? In my games and setting, Wizards tend to wear clothing akin to gis, kimonos and hakamas. And so do Monks, Fighters, Paladins, Clerics and a score of other classes. Armor, when it can, is hidden under layers of clothing - even when it can't, Wizards and the like can create magical equivalent out of wholecloth. Considering the magical bling on the other classes... yeah. You aren't distinquishing adventurers dressed for war from each other by looks alone; probably not even through actions, since the magicky types likely have ways to swing lethal implements regardless, and the fighty types have dozens of magical thingamajobs hidden in their sleeves in case of emergency.

Ravens_cry
2011-01-31, 07:37 PM
Well, consider me on "Team Mialee is a Space Frog." Of course, that druid's no looker, either.

I think they could have gotten better artists for the 3e/3.5e PCs.
Call me Team Elves Ain't Humans then. This will tell you something about my personal standards of beauty because I found the iconic druid Vadania quite haunting.
Krusk on the other hand looks like a tightly muscled knot of scars and gristle.:smallyuk:

Reynard
2011-01-31, 07:41 PM
Krusk on the other hand looks like a tightly muscled knot of scars and gristle.:smallyuk:

So, more like a real adventurer would?

Eldariel
2011-01-31, 07:43 PM
Aaaaahhh, but Goblins are the best. :smallbiggrin:

I raise you Mindflayers, my good sir. All those tentacles...

Lurkmoar
2011-01-31, 07:47 PM
Yeah. Like Rob Liefield. :smalltongue: yeah I went there :P

That would just be too cruel... (http://www.comicsbulletin.com/rage/images/050327/godysseypages4and5.jpg)


Robes? In my games and setting, Wizards tend to wear clothing akin to gis, kimonos and hakamas. And so do Monks, Fighters, Paladins, Clerics and a score of other classes. Armor, when it can, is hidden under layers of clothing - even when it can't, Wizards and the like can create magical equivalent out of wholecloth. Considering the magical bling on the other classes... yeah. You aren't distinquishing adventurers dressed for war from each other by looks alone; probably not even through actions, since the magicky types likely have ways to swing lethal implements regardless, and the fighty types have dozens of magical thingamajobs hidden in their sleeves in case of emergency.

So your setting is Asian flavored? All my characters tend to roam around in big fancy cloaks... cloaks are awesome. Unless they're posing as commoners. Hardly anybody notices commoners... makes great cover for thieves and wizards traveling incognito.

Ravens_cry
2011-01-31, 07:47 PM
So, more like a real adventurer would?
Maybe, still ugly though. Back to wizards robes, if we mean something like a monks habit I can see that been doable in the feild, but the long, massive sleeves, catch on thorns, get dragged in the mud, trip over your own feet, kind we see in your stereotypical wizard?
Not practical at all. Neither is the thousand belt, goggles that do nothings dungeon punk iron kingdoms wear either.

dsmiles
2011-01-31, 07:51 PM
Mialee: Space Frog from Space.


Yeah. Like Rob Liefield. :smalltongue: yeah I went there :P
He's a little action-comic-booky for me, I was thinking more along the lines of Elmore. He's kind of an iconic fantasy artist, in my book.

Krusk on the other hand looks like a tightly muscled knot of scars and gristle.:smallyuk:We're MEN! (Manly men!) We're men in TIGHTS! (Tight tights!)

Lurkmoar
2011-01-31, 07:53 PM
We're MEN! (Manly men!) We're men in TIGHTS! (Tight tights!)

Tight tights!

Ravens_cry
2011-01-31, 07:55 PM
We're MEN! (Manly men!) We're men in TIGHTS! (Tight tights!)
Read Manly Guys Doing Manly Things (http://thepunchlineismachismo.com/archives/71). It is Manly, by Brando.

dsmiles
2011-01-31, 07:55 PM
Tight tights!

A cookie for you, good sir.
http://www.geekologie.com/2010/08/24/ninja-cookies.jpg

Squark
2011-01-31, 08:07 PM
A cookie for you, good sir.
http://www.geekologie.com/2010/08/24/ninja-cookies.jpg

:smallfrown: I couldn't spot the cookies :smallwink:

As I see it, wizards wear robes for two mutually exclusive reasons; either a) Because it's a sign of their station and it intimidates the common people (and because there are also sorts of magical robes), or b) Because they're geeks who don't care what people think about them, so they'll wear what's comfortable.


Or C) Robes are Awesome. And anyone who says otherwise is in for a world of magical hurt.

Knaight
2011-01-31, 08:30 PM
Call me Team Elves Ain't Humans then. This will tell you something about my personal standards of beauty because I found the iconic druid Vadania quite haunting.
Krusk on the other hand looks like a tightly muscled knot of scars and gristle.:smallyuk:

Eh, I thought Vadania looked pretty, if a bit odd, which was the intended effect. Mialee however is a space frog.

Eldariel
2011-01-31, 08:38 PM
Eh, I thought Vadania looked pretty, if a bit odd, which was the intended effect. Mialee however is a space frog.

+1numbersforaddedeffect

Frozen_Feet
2011-01-31, 08:43 PM
So your setting is Asian flavored?

No. Some aspects of clothing are just similar. Overall, I mix and match different cultures to the extent that such qualifiers pretty much lose meaning.

Lurkmoar
2011-01-31, 08:48 PM
Interesting. I wish to subscribe to your news letter.

I still think robes are pretty awesome, especially if you have a English accent to go along with it. And some tights underneath.

Cerlis
2011-01-31, 08:51 PM
because magi, clerics and monks in the real world all wear/wore robes.

as well as robes (of some form) are worn in many other countries even today.


I think a better question would be why many people in western civilization see robes as weird clothing and even compare them to other bits of clothing that are indeed different (i.e. Dresses.

Ravens_cry
2011-01-31, 08:57 PM
Eh, I thought Vadania looked pretty, if a bit odd, which was the intended effect. Mialee however is a space frog.
Well, by her official stats, (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/cc/20000626b) she has an 8 charisma. If Charisma and physical beauty coordinate at all, she has every reason to look alien and weird to human eyes.

dsmiles
2011-01-31, 09:02 PM
Well, by her official stats, (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/cc/20000626b) she has an 8 charisma. If Charisma and physical beauty coordinate at all, she has every reason to look alien and weird to human eyes.Aaaahhh, but charisma isn't entirely based on looks alone. It's also a measure of personality. She could look spectacular but be a complete *****, or be horribly ugly and be a very nice person. It measures a combination of looks and personality.

EDIT: With a Charisma of 8, she probably has the personality of a soap dish, to go along with the "Space Frog from Space" look.

Tvtyrant
2011-01-31, 09:06 PM
You could always have them in a hoodie and slacks if you wanted; sure they are out of context but so are many of the things in D&D. Like monks.

Also I would like to point out that Byzantine clothing tended to be similar to wizard (http://www.adrianaallen.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/byzantine_clothing.jpg)clothes (http://www.fashion-era.com/images/all_greeks_romans/empress-theodora300.jpg).

Also, Tabards (http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.theknightshop.co.uk/catalog/images/100872.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.theknightshop.co.uk/catalog/teutonic-knight-tabard-p-1280.html&usg=__Y9DhaVhjwoj8vME3iGLHB6uGpWo=&h=500&w=303&sz=18&hl=en&start=0&zoom=1&tbnid=55A9lMRSAFcfAM:&tbnh=161&tbnw=98&ei=TGxHTaX3HpGosQPMsO3lAQ&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dknight%2Btabard%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26 safe%3Doff%26biw%3D1440%26bih%3D628%26tbs%3Disch:1 0%2C342&um=1&itbs=1&iact=hc&vpx=424&vpy=37&dur=1809&hovh=289&hovw=175&tx=112&ty=149&oei=TGxHTaX3HpGosQPMsO3lAQ&esq=1&page=1&ndsp=25&ved=1t:429,r:19,s:0&biw=1440&bih=628)are fairly similar to robes as well.

Ravens_cry
2011-01-31, 09:20 PM
Aaaahhh, but charisma isn't entirely based on looks alone. It's also a measure of personality. She could look spectacular but be a complete *****, or be horribly ugly and be a very nice person. It measures a combination of looks and personality.

EDIT: With a Charisma of 8, she probably has the personality of a soap dish, to go along with the "Space Frog from Space" look.
I agree that looks and Charisma aren't a 1:1 ratio, but I rather disagree it means how nice you are. While it is true that people generally like being around nice people, people with forceful or persuasive personalities, what I consider to be the other part of the Charisma equation, can be complete bastards. I am not saying it is always the case, but it is hardly unknown either.
I personally always imagined her as being generally calm cool and collected, but rather abrasive when pestered, i.e. anyone interrupts her research.

Ragitsu
2011-01-31, 09:21 PM
Robes are cool. Does there really need to be a reason beyond that?

Also, recognize that there are more than just dark blue robes, and don't think you need all robes to be magical.

Velaryon
2011-01-31, 09:41 PM
Then there's Hennet from the Player's Handbook of DnD 3.5 who doesn't wear much at all but that's another story entirely.


agreed
however i like to have wizards who were normal comfortable clothes
also my mom upon seeing hennet decided that he must have a belt fetish

Hennet is definitely a bit of a freak (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=anNtAshm30s#t=00m17s).


As for robes, the main reason is undoubtedly because that's how mages and such have been portrayed throughout our history. All the other explanations are good and sensible, but for the most part I think that's the real reason.

Eldariel
2011-01-31, 10:40 PM
With a Charisma of 8, she probably has the personality of a soap dish, to go along with the "Space Frog from Space" look.

Huh; 10-11 is average, 8 only a bit under. Now, if her Cha was like 4, I could understand that, but 8? It isn't that low.

Coidzor
2011-02-01, 03:21 AM
I think a better question would be why many people in western civilization see robes as weird clothing and even compare them to other bits of clothing that are indeed different (i.e. Dresses.

I agree, I never really got it myself.


I think she looks fey. Wide spaced eyes, a tiny nose, an arrow sharp chin, and cheek bones you could skin an apple with?
Definitely one of the Fair Folk.
Remember, Elves are not humans.

They were, however, supposed to be beautiful and terrible, last I recall. Mialee is just terrible. Like boxbot (http://gunnerkrigg.wikia.com/wiki/Boxbot).


He's a little action-comic-booky for me, I was thinking more along the lines of Elmore. He's kind of an iconic fantasy artist, in my book. [/COLOR]

I think you missed the joke. :smallconfused: Unless Elmore is another artist unworthy of the name that I've had the pleasure of never encountering?

ffone
2011-02-01, 03:23 AM
Robes allow lots of pockets for spell components.

Also they're based on Anglo- and Scandinavian folklore; those places are cold!

Ragitsu
2011-02-01, 03:25 AM
http://marcusstratus.deviantart.com/art/artdragondream-Wizards-Robe-112144301

Sir Dar
2011-02-01, 03:55 AM
Why wizard robes?

They are easy to take off and on.Letting you bring that female drow wizard to your tent in the middle of the day.Have your *fun* alone time and no one in your party will be any the wiser.:smallwink:

dsmiles
2011-02-01, 05:35 AM
I think you missed the joke. :smallconfused: Unless Elmore is another artist unworthy of the name that I've had the pleasure of never encountering?I guess I did. :smallredface: Sometimes that happens.
A Smattering of Larry Elmore:
http://dragonlance.vanhardeveld.com/lance69.jpg
http://blogs.msdn.com/blogfiles/davedev/WindowsLiveWriter/ArtDesignandCodeHowdidwegethere_1022E/Elmore1_1.jpg
http://tohs.webs.com/Dragonlance%20-%20Larry%20Elmore.jpg
...and my personal favorite
http://www.fantasygallery.net/elmore/Death_0f_Sturm.jpg

Ravens_cry
2011-02-01, 06:49 AM
I agree, I never really got it myself.



They were, however, supposed to be beautiful and terrible, last I recall. Mialee is just terrible. Like boxbot (http://gunnerkrigg.wikia.com/wiki/Boxbot).

Fair Folk in a mythological sense includes all manner of boogies, including many things that aren't beautiful and those that are often only appear that way through glamour, a reflection of our desires that reveals nothing of what they actually are. The reason they are called the Fair Folk is the same reason the Furies were called 'The Kindly Ones'. They aren't creatures you wanted to anger by insulting in some way.
Nice referencing Gunnerkrigg court though, it is one of my favourite webcomics.:smallsmile:

Czin
2011-02-01, 07:41 AM
and you can ask your summoned succubus to do naughty things under the robe without be noticed by your jealous companions ^^

But...doesn't any kind of intimate contact with a succubus result in level drain? Erinyes's are much safer to get touchy feely with, since they can *only* sever your well...you know....:smallbiggrin:

dsmiles
2011-02-01, 08:01 AM
But...doesn't any kind of intimate contact with a succubus result in level drain? Erinyes's are much safer to get touchy feely with, since they can *only* sever your well...you know....:smallbiggrin:Ony if you don't have protection...from evil!
*rimshot (http://instantrimshot.com/)*
:smallbiggrin:

Yuki Akuma
2011-02-01, 08:05 AM
Succubi have to consciously activate their level drain, actually. A succubus love slave is perfectly safe as long as you don't starve her. :smalltongue:

DeltaEmil
2011-02-01, 08:11 AM
It's perfectly okay to starve them. They don't need to eat anything anyway, and if you summon a vile fiend from the lower planes, you might as well just be a butch to your summoned bitch. Then, after you're not pleased with her anymore, stab her through her eyes and summon a new one with red hairs.

Ravens_cry
2011-02-01, 08:20 AM
Can we stop discussing how to sexually abuse creatures of the neather planes?
It's skeeving me out and I enjoy arguing that a remove curse on a male who got gender bent by a Girdle of Femininity and while in such a state got pregnant would result in an ectopic pregnancy for Mister Seahorse.

Slipperychicken
2011-02-01, 08:26 AM
Historically, priests, witches, scholars, medics, and many others wore robes instead of pants. Why? because tailoring pants-legs by hand is expensive, and scholars and monks aren't rich enough to buy pants.

Wizards are just the logical extension of that: everyone who does academic stuff wears robes, so why wouldn't the guy who studies magic do so too?

It also helps cover up the wizards' scrawny "I-put-a-6-in-Con" a**.

dsmiles
2011-02-01, 08:38 AM
Can we stop discussing how to sexually abuse creatures of the neather planes?
It's skeeving me out and I enjoy arguing that a remove curse on a male who got gender bent by a Girdle of Femininity and while in such a state got pregnant would result in an ectopic pregnancy for Mister Seahorse.
That...sounds painful...:eek:

shadow_archmagi
2011-02-01, 08:48 AM
Robes

Ah. Yes. Wizards are students, and students are poor.

I think all my wizards will enjoy Ramen from now on.

Lurkmoar
2011-02-01, 09:22 AM
Ah. Yes. Wizards are students, and students are poor.

I think all my wizards will enjoy Ramen from now on.

All those mystic tomes and rare spell components aren't cheap ya know...

Frozen_Feet
2011-02-01, 10:09 AM
I had a sudden urge to post this. (http://www.graphicsdb.com/data/media/433/Kuchiki_Byakuya.jpg) And this. (http://www.witch-king.tk/albums/nazgul/Nazgul.jpg) And this. (http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_c3WtQv44wGc/SwJH2kaqKpI/AAAAAAAAB28/4LUuefffq7Y/s1600/grim_reaper.jpg)

Not only are Wizards associated with long, flowing robes and the like... death is too. Isn't it a tradition for the evil Wizard types to combine the two for that extra spooky factor? :smallcool:

Coidzor
2011-02-01, 05:00 PM
^: Ah, the nazgul. The original gishes who never cast spells.


That...sounds painful...:eek:

Oh, fighters are used to getting mildly eviscerated. Now, if it was a wizard or sorcerer or... :smalleek: bard....

shadow_archmagi
2011-02-01, 06:07 PM
All those mystic tomes and rare spell components aren't cheap ya know...

You're telling me!

300 dollars for algebra textbook, I ask you.

dsmiles
2011-02-01, 06:09 PM
You're telling me!

300 dollars for algebra textbook, I ask you.OH THE HUMANITY!!! :smallwink:

Lurkmoar
2011-02-01, 08:56 PM
You're telling me!

300 dollars for algebra textbook, I ask you.

Insanity, insanity I say! I acknowledge that information is power, but... it always gets me they make NEW roman history books every year. And the book store always gives you the shaft when you try to sell the thing.

Ravens_cry
2011-02-01, 09:15 PM
That...sounds painful...:eek:
Indeed. However with a little healing magic and surgery, both should be just fine.

Czin
2011-02-01, 09:27 PM
Can we stop discussing how to sexually abuse creatures of the neather planes?
It's skeeving me out and I enjoy arguing that a remove curse on a male who got gender bent by a Girdle of Femininity and while in such a state got pregnant would result in an ectopic pregnancy for Mister Seahorse.

To further mentally scar you allow me to paint this mental image for you. Imagine the above abuse, but with a daemonette of slaanesh instead of a succubi. :smallbiggrin:

Gnoman
2011-02-01, 09:33 PM
Female dwarves with beards comes from Tolkien.

No, they don't. The only reference to female dwarves in all of Tolkien's work was in a fragment that Christopher Tolkien salvaged from his father's erased writings. Bearded Dwarf women came much later as a concept, and was purely intended as a joke originally.

Ravens_cry
2011-02-01, 09:33 PM
To further mentally scar you allow me to paint this mental image for you. Imagine the above abuse, but with a daemonette of slaanesh instead of a succubi. :smallbiggrin:
:smallsigh: This is hardly forum rules friendly material.

CycloneJoker
2011-02-01, 10:56 PM
To further mentally scar you allow me to paint this mental image for you. Imagine the above abuse, but with a daemonette of slaanesh instead of a succubi. :smallbiggrin:

My BRAIN! MY POOR, POOR BRAIN! Gimme the brain bleach!

Coidzor
2011-02-01, 11:38 PM
For one thing they're just too bulky.

ericgrau
2011-02-02, 01:29 AM
For the same reason monks, Greeks, merchants and other random people wore robes. They're simple outfits before the invention of the zipper and they're easy to move in.

Ravens_cry
2011-02-02, 01:42 AM
For the same reason monks, Greeks, merchants and other random people wore robes. They're simple outfits before the invention of the zipper and they're easy to move in.
People were wearing pants long before the invention of zippers.

ericgrau
2011-02-02, 01:56 AM
It's hard to make complex gestures in suspenders and/or baggy pants? You know how much that spellbook costs? Can't even afford a good tailor to get something that fits :smalltongue:.

More to the point one piece tunics and robes were a lot more common than they are today. Not like D&D wizards can't wear any old outfit though.

Gorgondantess
2011-02-02, 02:28 AM
Has anyone here ever worn a nice robe? Do you know how insanely comfy it is? I'm wearing one right now, and it is insanely comfy. As one who snaps the laws of physics over their knees on a regular basis, you just wear a nice robe around, not caring what people think of your appearance.
The guy who treated reality the opposite way- Albert Einstein- did the same. He would be frequently seen walking the streets of New York in the mornings, muttering to himself, in nothing but a nice, comfy robe.
Smart people like robes. Wizards are smart. Therefore, wizards like robes. It's simple logical deduction.

Eldan
2011-02-02, 04:28 AM
Historically, priests, witches, scholars, medics, and many others wore robes instead of pants. Why? because tailoring pants-legs by hand is expensive, and scholars and monks aren't rich enough to buy pants.

What kind of monk are you talking about? We have a building here, it's eight or nine stories tall, and about eighty meters on a side. It's the abbot's secondary residence. He also owned half the canton for most of the middle and dark ages.

dsmiles
2011-02-02, 05:31 AM
What kind of monk are you talking about? We have a building here, it's eight or nine stories tall, and about eighty meters on a side. It's the abbot's secondary residence. He also owned half the canton for most of the middle and dark ages.I believe that he was using the monks in the Middle Ages and Renaissance for that info. Monks were poor, and priests were usually rich and corrupt (if you believe all the movies :smalltongue:).

Eldan
2011-02-02, 06:04 AM
I'm talking about the abbey as well.
The monks (as in, the abbey) owned half the canton, as I said. In fact, most abbeys owned huge tracts of land. Around here, they were usually the biggest land owners, far beyond most nobles. Can't think that this was much different elsewhere. Nowadays they aren't as rich anymore, of course. As an example, the library (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abbey_library_of_Saint_Gall)(world heritage) is now public and the court I mentioned before belongs to the city.

Now, wandering beggar monks, that's a different thing. But they both wore robes.

dsmiles
2011-02-02, 06:07 AM
Eh, my knowledge of Euopean Middle Ages and Renaissance comes alomost entirely from the folklore of England, Ireland, Scotland, and Wales. Zurich is kind of out of my jurisdiction. :smallwink:

kamikasei
2011-02-02, 06:08 AM
Can't think that this was much different elsewhere.
Really? I'd expect that to vary enormously from place to place.

Do you have any idea what the monks in that abbey wore? Just because the abbey had wealth and power doesn't mean the monks in it, as individuals, had any. If you like, just replace "couldn't afford pants" with "weren't supposed to spend money on things like pants".

Eldan
2011-02-02, 06:10 AM
St. Gallen, actually. Where I grew up. All the pictures I've seen show them in robes. Mostly monks robes, sometimes more expensive, priestly robes, but robes.

Think of it like this:
The abbeys usually founded and paid for cathedrals. So, they can't be poor, really. Pretty much every abbey I know owned at least a few surrounding farms.

Gnoman
2011-02-02, 07:49 AM
That was money spent on feeding the local Brotherhood and venerating God. Putting it toward vain trivialities would have been a waste.

Runestar
2011-02-02, 08:22 AM
Where else is the fighter going to hide once combat starts? :smalltongue:

AshDesert
2011-02-02, 08:42 AM
St. Gallen, actually. Where I grew up. All the pictures I've seen show them in robes. Mostly monks robes, sometimes more expensive, priestly robes, but robes.

Think of it like this:
The abbeys usually founded and paid for cathedrals. So, they can't be poor, really. Pretty much every abbey I know owned at least a few surrounding farms.

The wealth of the monasteries wasn't owned by any of the monks, and they were required by most of the different monk philosophies to use the money for good causes, like funding the building of cathedrals. Most monks themselves took vows of poverty (see what they did there) where they couldn't own anything individually other than very simple clothes. Just because the monastery was rich didn't mean the monks were.

As for the topic, I like wearing normal adventuring clothes (although very well made, I can't look like one of those peasants:smalltongue:) as Wizards in most situations, but very fancy-looking robes for more formal situations. In a fantasy setting, robes are just an easy way to convey the message "I can rewrite reality on a whim, think twice before you try anything" to everyone without actually saying anything.

shadow_archmagi
2011-02-02, 09:47 AM
My characters always wind up looking like Commissars.

Letting people know you can re-organize reality is just a bit too much; all they need to know is your can re-organize their skull.

Ormur
2011-02-02, 02:05 PM
There are plenty of medieval accounts and records of monks living in luxury, spending fortunes on wine and finery. The monasteries were often filled with the younger sons of nobles and they were accustomed to a certain lifestyle.

There were periodic backlashes against this and the rules of beggar monks and efforts by pious church officials to enforce a more frugal lifestyle, especially in the high middle ages, were a reaction to those perceived excesses.

Maybe simple robes are less expensive than pants but many of the robe wearing organizations mentioned here as the model for wizards didn't dress in very simple robes anyway. I prefer the robes of my wizard characters to be more sumptuous anyway.

TsugaruRage
2011-02-20, 03:05 PM
I find it mildly offensive to refer to robes as a dress because the two are quite distinct. But I also get annoyed at people confusing cloaks and capes, so....

I think the image of robes stems from how for most of history the elite and educated of our society wore robes or similar vestments. Most of the scholarly types of the middle ages were monks or priests, who wore robes. Besides, robes are comfy (dresses less so) and may not be as bad for combat situations as one may think. I've found that sufficiently loose full-length skirts don't hinder fighting ability at all, so I see no reason why this couldn't work with a robe at all (and it isn't like you're fighting with weapons much as a caster either).

Same here.

Also, I just love the way that robes look and feel. If I could get away with it, I'd totally put on a robe and wizard hat where-ever I go.
Atlas.... Society won't allow me too :c


Besides, sure beats the old school pagan way where they did it in their birthday suit. Somehow I don't think they can put that on the cover art of a players guide.

As a History/Anthropology student who focuses on Pagan Theology, I can tell you that this is not accurate in the least (for European Paganism as well as most other forms that I know about).

Different cultures had different modes of dress such as this (http://dawna-suwalszczyzna.com.pl/1/zrodliska_2006_kulgrinda_mal.jpg) for Baltic Pagans, this (https://files.pbworks.com/download/jVfLcqKK36/thevikingworld/4747360/Sveinbj%C3%B6rn_Beinteinsson_1991.jpg) for Norse and this this (http://www.usna.edu/Users/history/abels/hh205/arapacis.jpg) for the Greeks/Romans.

Daftendirekt
2011-02-20, 03:24 PM
Reason 1: It tells the world that you are powerful. The poor peasants who work the earth must wear their work clothes, guardsmen wear uniforms, and so on. Your robe? It tells the world that you do not have to work. Your eccentric look? It's a big "screw you" to non-wizards.

Reason 2: Dramatic wind.

This.

For me, it really depends what kind of wizard I'm making. For example, my 10 year old (or gnomish equivalent) illusionist boy just wore a tunic and breeches. My literally-1000 year old sun elf Olin Gisir had layered robes, very fine and regal looking. The female Red Wizard I've got in the works would be wearing a fairly simple knee-length black dress (think Homecoming dress? I dunno. About that level of intricacy. Not big fancy noble dress) underneath an open, untied Red Wizard robe. For dramatic wind, as said so well :D

Again, it's all about what image you're going for.

stainboy
2011-02-20, 06:31 PM
Robes are useful for hiding tentacles and grafted ghoul arms. Wizards without such... extravagances wear robes anyway in solidarity. It's like refusing search without a warrant even if you have nothing to hide.



Where else is the fighter going to hide once combat starts? :smalltongue:

+1d4 internets. And now I'm sad.