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View Full Version : Do you enjoy d&d more and more as you get older?



Ozreth
2011-02-06, 06:29 PM
I got into d&d in my mid teens around 2003. Didn't get to actually start playing regularly until about 21. I'm 23 now, going on 24 and got to wondering how different the game would have been if I got to play on a regular basis when I was 15 years old. Would the games have been more immersive? Would I appreciate them as much as I do now? Who knows. One thing that I can say is that I don't see the game getting old any time soon, and I like that. Maybe that's because my reason for playing is escapism, which is needed more and more as you get older.

Anyways, how about you? Are your games as good if not better as you get older? Or does it become harder and harder for you to find immersion and endless hours of fun in these dungeons as the years go by?

Captain Kidd
2011-02-06, 06:49 PM
Finding endless hours: yes. Back in the mid 90s (ugh I feel old) we could do 8+ hour sessions, even did a couple all weekenders. Now however, job, family, etc. get in the way. We're luck to get 2-1/2, maaaybe 3, hours to a session now.

As for enjoyment of then versus now ... I don't think they can be closely compared. It's apples and oranges in many ways. Back then we were teenagers and blasting monsters, burning down forests (albeit by accident), and epic combat was the rule. My current group however is different, we focus more heavily on the roleplay. So, both are equally fun, but in different ways.

RebelRogue
2011-02-06, 07:03 PM
It's harder to find time, no doubt, but the enjoyment of the game varies according to the group, the DM and the overall style. It feels... different, but only because you've changed yourself (and editions and games have come and gone). Overall, I'd say I still enjoy it about as much as always.

Yahzi
2011-02-06, 08:19 PM
What the Captain said: your tastes change. Exploiting the rules for raw power becomes less interesting.

But the real killer is finding the time. On the plus side, I hear that once your own kids are old enough, you've got a captive player base. :smallbiggrin:

Ormur
2011-02-06, 09:47 PM
I sometime regret not having gotten into role-playing earlier so that I could feel nostalgic about fighting monsters and playing quirky characters. Even though I didn't start playing until I was 20 I sometimes miss the excitement of not knowing what we were up against but as we get a better grasp of the mechanics and more experienced at running games and playing characters I imagine the lack of novelty will be more than compensated for.

I also agree that my biggest complaint is not getting to play enough even though I play quite often.

Ozreth
2011-02-06, 09:59 PM
I sometime regret not having gotten into role-playing earlies so that I could feel nostalgic about fighting monsters and playing quirky characters. Even though I didn't start playing until I was 20 I sometimes miss the excitement of not knowing what we were up against but as we get a better grasp of the mechanics and more experienced at running games and playing characters I imagine the lack of novelty will be more than compensated for.

I also agree that my biggest complaint is not getting to play enough even though I play quite often.

I feel ya. I started playing magic the gathering in '94 when I was 7 years old. Started playing Final Fantasy games and other console RPG's the same year. Got into fantasy novels by '97. It blows my mind that I didn't discover d&d until around 2003 and even then hardly played much until 5 years later. Just thinking about how engrossing the above were for me back then, I can't imagine what dungeons and dragons would have been like.

Would Ravenloft actually have scared me a little?
Would Castle Greyhawk be so deep, dark, and enchanting that I wouldn't be able to sleep until I got to that next level?

Things like that.

Captain Kidd
2011-02-06, 10:30 PM
What the Captain said: your tastes change. Exploiting the rules for raw power becomes less interesting.

But the real killer is finding the time. On the plus side, I hear that once your own kids are old enough, you've got a captive player base. :smallbiggrin:
It's very true. Already doing that with mine. My 6 year old is very creative in what he comes up with. We're currently using The Prince's Kingdom system, but ... it's too mechanics lite for me. And he's disappointed he can't use half of his dice. :)

Remmirath
2011-02-06, 11:41 PM
I'm not sure that I enjoy it more now than I did when I started playing (I was about six, if it makes a difference) - but I am definitely better at it. Better at roleplaying, a heck of a lot better at running campaigns. I certainly don't enjoy it less.

I think it's more that the game is variable enough that you'll probably enjoy it just as much whenever you play it, since it can pretty much change to be what you want it to be (so long as you've got the right group, of course).

Innis Cabal
2011-02-06, 11:43 PM
I find it less and less enjoyable as the fanbase grows more and more whiny and demanding to be honest.

valadil
2011-02-06, 11:53 PM
I still enjoy RPGs, but my tastes have changed as I've aged. Here's how:

First off I've got a weird relationship with gaming. Sometimes I resent it because it gets in the way of socializing. I've got friends who I only see for game. Sometimes I want to hang out with my friends and instead all I get is their characters. Other times I thank gaming for giving me an active social life. My attitude seems to switch every 6 months or so.

Cons:

I don't like GMing as much. I have less free time than I used to. I can invest an evening a week in a game. I can't also invest a weekend in writing a game. My primary group started alternating games just so GMs would have two weeks instead of one for prep time. If it gets any worse I'm just going to run premade modules.

I feel like there's a certain amount of "been there, done that." For a while I could get by with choosing my role in a system on the basis of having never played a given role before. Now I feel like I'm rehashing some roles, but the only variable that's changing is who is rehashing which role in a game. So maybe I'm reusing my favorite sorcerer, but Ben is the cleric this time instead of Matt. Or something like that.

My games are more down to business. We play on week nights and everyone wants to be home by midnight. If we're lucky we get 3.5 hours of game time. There's way less room for wandering shenanigans than there used to be. The GM pretty much keeps us on a strict agenda. And I'm not criticizing any particular GM, I do this too. Having an agenda is preferable (for us) over not getting anything done. Back in the good old days we could finish goals and wander in circles in the same session.

Pros:

Scheduling is easier. For regular games anyway. People have fixed schedules. All you have to do is offer a game on a given day and threaten to stick to it. For the most part, everyone has a well organized calendar.

We all have cars. Rides are easy. Sometimes we carpool, sometimes not. Bottom line is it's never an issue.

Same goes for space. Most of us have apartments, some have houses. We all have designated gaming areas. No more basement pool table games.

Full time jobs are nice too. If someone brings a couple 6 packs, there's no need to charge each other for beers. It'll work out in the end. I don't even track if people borrow money anymore, because someone's share of pizza is 15-20 of my work minutes.

Mark Hall
2011-02-07, 12:30 AM
What I enjoy in the game has greatly changed; I no longer get the joy out of combing through books to find the ultimate power combination, or feel a need to cripple a character to have them be interesting (I went through both phases). We get a bit less time per session (usually around 4-6 hours, depending on the group), but I think the time is better, for the most part.

Mastikator
2011-02-07, 01:32 AM
I find myself spending more and more time on roleplaying, and less on actually doing things. Sometimes we can go through entire sessions just roleplaying that we're sitting in front of the campfire telling stories. It's more interesting, and sometimes a little annoying that we aren't getting anything done :smalltongue:
It's less about the instant gratification of being an awesome character, and more about exploring different aspects of yourself through characters. It certainly has a different meaning to me now.
And I leave the instant gratification to the computer games, where it belongs.

Thurbane
2011-02-07, 01:39 AM
To be honest, my enthusiasm level is probably about the same as it's ever been (pretty high), but I guess I spend more time reading books and contemplating builds than I used to.

I'm pushing 40, and been playing for around 25 years or so.

starwoof
2011-02-07, 02:07 AM
I don't think I enjoy roleplaying any less than I used to, but I really miss the kinds of games we played when we were 9-15. Stuff like romping around in a setting with rotating DMs, and all of our players are really powerful gods. My games have gotten so much about crunch lately when it used to be way more free form. I dunno if either is better.

I do wish that I had more time to play. Well, I have plenty of time to play as I am homeless and jobless, but my friends are always 'working' or 'hanging out with their girlfriends'. Blah. I miss the week long sessions of my childhood.

Totally Guy
2011-02-07, 03:29 AM
I started D&D at 23. I'm 27 now. I do feel it's become less enjoyable. I've read too much GM advice on these forums that I find objectionable.

To combat this I look for systems that reinforce player agency by design and I GM those rather than play.

Zaydos
2011-02-07, 03:42 AM
It's harder to find time, no doubt, but the enjoyment of the game varies according to the group, the DM and the overall style. It feels... different, but only because you've changed yourself (and editions and games have come and gone). Overall, I'd say I still enjoy it about as much as always.

Got to agree that group, DM, and style really matter. Heck I've DM'd two games this week, played in a third, and watched another two sessions (the last three were on one day; and one wasn't D&D) and they've all been really different; even though 1 person was in all of them (DM'd one of them), and another was in three of them (DM'd the one I played). Each group had a different dynamic, a different DMing style (the constant was an excellent DM imo; and my style was different because it was "off the cuff one-shot with 0 prep" and "one-shot with pseudo-prep because I don't know what the PCs are") and it really makes a difference.


I feel ya. I started playing magic the gathering in '94 when I was 7 years old. Started playing Final Fantasy games and other console RPG's the same year. Got into fantasy novels by '97. It blows my mind that I didn't discover d&d until around 2003 and even then hardly played much until 5 years later. Just thinking about how engrossing the above were for me back then, I can't imagine what dungeons and dragons would have been like.

Would Ravenloft actually have scared me a little?
Would Castle Greyhawk be so deep, dark, and enchanting that I wouldn't be able to sleep until I got to that next level?

Things like that.

Got into D&D June (May?) of '95, and Magic September of the same. I was 6. Fantasy novels were '97 because I didn't really know how to read well when I was young due to no one knowing if I was saying the proper things.

Even so I didn't know about Ravenloft or Greyhawk till years later.


As for if I enjoy it more now... I'd say yes. I used to enjoy it because it was a wondrous world that kept me from being picked on by my older brother irl (he needed me to round out the party). Then I wanted to DM so bad, but didn't get to till 3.5 was out (I was playing 3.0 though). Now I've seen a few groups and I'm learning what play style I enjoy more and more.

LansXero
2011-02-07, 03:47 AM
I do feel it's become less enjoyable. I've read too much GM advice on these forums that I find objectionable.

To combat this I look for systems that reinforce player agency by design and I GM those rather than play.

Sorry for asking but how does advice given probably to others affect your enjoyment of the game?

On topic: I got into D&D almost 2 years ago, and I wish I had done so sooner. So far, except for the stretches of lazyness when preparing material, Id say my interest has been on the rise.

Totally Guy
2011-02-07, 04:36 AM
Sorry for asking but how does advice given probably to others affect your enjoyment of the game?

I always take flak for this...

I overthink things.

I think that techniques like "Illusion of Choice" are standard practices. And I get bored.

I think that my part in the save the world storyline is superfluous. Whether I be Harpoon the wizard or Treethan the ranger, it doesn't matter. I think it would be the same save the world story.

So ultimately I don't think there is enough "game" to the game to keep me interested. Gaming is about making choices. And giving those choices in a meaningful way seems to be a suboptimal DMing strategy whenever it gets discussed.

But there are loads of systems out there that get the game part right. I just wish I could play in more of them.

Edit: The best game session I've played in was in October. Gaming generally might be something for me that improves over time. Hard to really tell over such a short amount of time.

Tengu_temp
2011-02-07, 05:35 AM
I started playing RPGs* when I was around 12. Today, I'm 24. I gotta say yes, I enjoy playing them much more now. My playstyle changed over the years too, focusing less and less on random dungeon crawling and hacking monsters and more and more on roleplaying and telling awesome storylines - it matured, in other words. I also switched my focus from live-action games to PbP, which is a debatable improvement (because both forms have their good and bad sides), but which works for me.

* - my personal pet peeve: when people say DND when they mean RPGs. There are other games out there, folks!

Eldan
2011-02-07, 05:39 AM
Started playing D&D (and yes, Tengu, I've only played D&D at a table :smalltongue: ) when I was 15. I'm 24 for now, and I've last played when I was 19. I probably would enjoy it, if I could, but everyone in my group moved abroad for university when we quit school.

Our playstyle didn't change much in those five years. In our first game, we started diplomatic negotiations with the goblins we were supposed to kill (my lawful evil wizard spoke goblin) and made them give back the abducted children in exchange for the right to legally demand tolls and taxes from the merchants going over their pass. The DM was a bit surprised, but went with it. We had the occasional hack'n'slay session, but those remained rare.

dsmiles
2011-02-07, 05:42 AM
To be honest, my enthusiasm level is probably about the same as it's ever been (pretty high), but I guess I spend more time reading books and contemplating builds than I used to.

I'm pushing 40, and been playing for around 25 years or so.

Ditto, only I'm not quite that old (yet). But I have been playing for over 25 years.

Totally Guy
2011-02-07, 05:45 AM
* - my personal pet peeve: when people say DND when they mean RPGs. There are other games out there, folks!

I might make it mine too. That changes all the context and I can be much happier.

Thurbane
2011-02-07, 06:43 AM
Ditto, only I'm not quite that old (yet). But I have been playing for over 25 years.
I play with a group of 6 other guys - 1 of us is over 40, 3 are pushing 40, and the other 3 are in their early-mid 30s. 3 of us have been playing (on and off) for 25 years or so. :smallcool:

Personally, I've been playing since I was about 14, and my only real break was for about 5 or so years, when my group disbanded (this was very late 2E, and I resumed in 3.5). Even during my break, I kept buying (and reading) 2E D&D stuff, along with a few other RPGs. Happily, the group (well, half of it) reformed, with some new additions. :smallsmile:

dsmiles
2011-02-07, 07:50 AM
I play with a group of 6 other guys - 1 of us is over 40, 3 are pushing 40, and the other 3 are in their early-mid 30s. 3 of us have been playing (on and off) for 25 years or so. :smallcool:

Personally, I've been playing since I was about 14, and my only real break was for about 5 or so years, when my group disbanded (this was very late 2E, and I resumed in 3.5). Even during my break, I kept buying (and reading) 2E D&D stuff, along with a few other RPGs. Happily, the group (well, half of it) reformed, with some new additions. :smallsmile:I wish I was in your group. Aahhhh...to play with mature people again...:smallsigh:

Earthwalker
2011-02-07, 07:58 AM
It seems my story is the same as most of the people here.
Yeah I still enjoy DnD (and all role playing games) as much as I used to.

What I do when role playing now, GMing or playing is alot different then when I started but its still a great deal of fun and the groups I am in seem to have changed along with me.

bokodasu
2011-02-07, 08:13 AM
Found the oD&D books in a closet when I was 8, been playing off and on since then. I don't think I enjoy it more than I would have if I'd started in, say, high school or college, but maybe I've enjoyed it in different ways? I know when I was younger we didn't bother so much about "rules", but we were also all Mary Sue McMegaPower, so it's nice not wanting to do that any more, even if there's maybe some spontaneity lost.

Ask my daughter in a few years; she started (playing Fudge) when she was just shy of 5, and she's almost 8 now and playing in a regular Sunday afternoon D&D game with some of my college friends. Of course, it's probably different playing with grownups, too; I never did that as a kid.

dsmiles
2011-02-07, 08:18 AM
Ask my daughter in a few years; she started (playing Fudge) when she was just shy of 5, and she's almost 8 now and playing in a regular Sunday afternoon D&D game with some of my college friends. Of course, it's probably different playing with grownups, too; I never did that as a kid.I just got my kids hooked on DnD last summer, and my sister bought them the Red Box for Christmas. :smallwink:

Natael
2011-02-07, 09:34 AM
D&D? Nope, have found myself disliking the system more and more as time goes on (been playing for about 12 years, started on AD&D 2e). Toying with some modification and combination of pathfinder and 3.5 has interested me recently, but mostly I only play D&D because other people do (as long as it isn't 4e). On the other hand, I'm as much into RPing as I ever was, probably a much better RPer than I was before, just prefer to use other systems (GURPS 4e is my system of choice now). Whenever I go to a convention I like to try out at least one system I've never used before, havent come up with any huge gems yet (deadlands is fairly interesting though).

valadil
2011-02-07, 09:49 AM
I always take flak for this...

I think that techniques like "Illusion of Choice" are standard practices. And I get bored.

I think that my part in the save the world storyline is superfluous. Whether I be Harpoon the wizard or Treethan the ranger, it doesn't matter. I think it would be the same save the world story.


Why would you take flak for that? The way you led into it I thought you were going with your slightly less than popular but still perfectly valid views on fudging.

As a PC I want to make my mark on the world. If the game progresses the same regardless of the character I play, why should I even play. I want the presence of my character to affect the story in a unique way. This is why I don't deal well with pre-written modules.

Britter
2011-02-07, 10:59 AM
Up until about two or three years ago I was having a lot more fun with DnD then I had ever before. Then I discovered some systems that did what I wanted a game to do without me having to houserule and struggle as much as DnD (and Shadowrun, my all time favorite game world...but the rules, omg, the rules...).

Since then I have been very hard pressed to enjoy DnD. I still play in a game every now and then, but I won't run it anymore.

Now, my overall enjoyment of RPGs, in general, has definitely increased as I get older. I currently game with some really wonderful people that, much like myself, have come a long way from high school DnD but still have a lot of love for gaming.

Tyndmyr
2011-02-07, 11:09 AM
Why would you take flak for that? The way you led into it I thought you were going with your slightly less than popular but still perfectly valid views on fudging.

As a PC I want to make my mark on the world. If the game progresses the same regardless of the character I play, why should I even play. I want the presence of my character to affect the story in a unique way. This is why I don't deal well with pre-written modules.

Oh, it's a pretty common viewpoint. If I'm a hero, I want to make a difference. I think the better pre-written modules deal well with this. More than one way to go through the RHoD, for instance. The worst ones have uber-leveled NPCs there to keep you firmly on the railroad.

However, that is more of a style thing, not a D&D thing. I enjoy D&D about as much as I always have, but I also enjoy branching out into other systems.

RagnaroksChosen
2011-02-07, 11:09 AM
I've been gaming for about 10 years now (started when i was 15ish)

The only difference is now our sessions are shorter and we tend to gloss over my terrible naming conventions... that and i find it harder to write new campains as i am working 40+ hours and going for more schooling so.

potatocubed
2011-02-07, 11:16 AM
I think I'm enjoying D&D less as I get older, but I'm not sure if that's because my tastes are changing, because the game is changing in ways I don't like, or some mixture of both. I still enjoy it, I'm just more inclined to pick up something else as my first choice system these days.

(Started gaming when I was 9 or so with a D&D Rules Cyclopedia. I'm going to be 31 in a few weeks.)

valadil
2011-02-07, 11:16 AM
Oh, it's a pretty common viewpoint. If I'm a hero, I want to make a difference. I think the better pre-written modules deal well with this. More than one way to go through the RHoD, for instance. The worst ones have uber-leveled NPCs there to keep you firmly on the railroad.

However, that is more of a style thing, not a D&D thing. I enjoy D&D about as much as I always have, but I also enjoy branching out into other systems.

It's not even a multiple paths thing for me. I want the freedom to do something with my character that the original author never saw as an option. The only way I've seen this handled by a module is for the GM to go completely off book and improvise along with me for a while.

Tyndmyr
2011-02-07, 11:33 AM
Yeah...when I ran RHoD, we varied from the script a few times. Fortunately, the campaign is written decently well for that. It's got a map, a timeline, and a pretty good explanation of what things happen when and why, and how various events modify that.

In such campaigns, it's not terribly hard to deviate significantly from the main plot without throwing things out of wack. With less well developed campaigns, it is...things that have a strictly linear structure tend to react poorly to player creativity.

Sure, you need a decent DM, but you can use some premade stuff and still give the players a great deal of freedom.

Jaidu
2011-02-07, 11:55 AM
I actually have been able to find more players recently than when I was younger. I wish I had gotten a more consistent playing group before I had kids and a full time job, but I think I enjoy it more because it is a break from reality for a few hours. I don't watch TV or go to movies, I don't play video games, so D&D is my means of relaxing.

grimbold
2011-02-07, 12:48 PM
i think part of the magic of rpgs is that there is much to explore it rally can;t get old

Psyren
2011-02-07, 01:04 PM
Of course! Technology is a great thing. It wasn't too long ago that we couldn't use Skype or Google Docs to have a game for instance, and iPad/Galaxy tabs are revolutionizing how we play as well. Above all, that Microsoft Surface project makes me positively giddy about what tabletop gaming can become.

Tael
2011-02-07, 01:09 PM
Then I discovered some systems that did what I wanted a game to do without me having to houserule and struggle as much as DnD (and Shadowrun, my all time favorite game world...but the rules, omg, the rules...).


Heh, I completely agree. That's why my group shadowruns in GURPS! That and the fact that we don't know anybody who plays shadowrun, but yeah...

Kansaschaser
2011-02-07, 03:30 PM
I find it less and less enjoyable as the fanbase grows more and more whiny and demanding to be honest.

But I like whining! I'm pretty good at it too. My character sheet says I have a total of +18 to my whining skill. (7 ranks and a +3 charisma bonus, +2 synergy from bluff, +4 from the "Rules Lawyer" feat, and +2 competence bonus from trolling forums)

As you can see, I equate a lot of things to game terms. Sometimes when I overlook something, I'll say, "I failed my spot check".

So... yes, I enjoy gaming more than ever.

Tyndmyr
2011-02-07, 03:47 PM
As you can see, I equate a lot of things to game terms. Sometimes when I overlook something, I'll say, "I failed my spot check".

So... yes, I enjoy gaming more than ever.

Me: Whiskey, brandy...whatever, I hate them all, so I never remember the difference.
Friend: T***, Brandy is a prestige class for Whiskey.
Me: Ah. Got it.

Ormur
2011-02-07, 04:34 PM
I'd just like to add that although I have almost exclusively played D&D my comments about enjoying role playing as we get better at it apply to role playing games in general. I don't think my enjoyment is tied to one system and I might grow bored of D&D (although I haven't yet).

It's not about learning the system but learning how to play characters, interact with the plot, give players suitable freedom, how to prepare and create the right atmosphere etc.

Kansaschaser
2011-02-07, 04:41 PM
Me: Whiskey, brandy...whatever, I hate them all, so I never remember the difference.
Friend: T***, Brandy is a prestige class for Whiskey.
Me: Ah. Got it.

Oh wow! That's great.

If only my friends could explain Alcahol and Sports in terms like that. Then I might have a better understanding of both.

Mark Hall
2011-02-07, 05:30 PM
But I like whining! I'm pretty good at it too. My character sheet says I have a total of +18 to my whining skill. (7 ranks and a +3 charisma bonus, +2 synergy from bluff, +4 from the "Rules Lawyer" feat, and +2 competence bonus from trolling forums)

Totally a munchkin feat. Most only give a +3, or +2 to two different ones.

Kansaschaser
2011-02-07, 05:36 PM
Totally a munchkin feat. Most only give a +3, or +2 to two different ones.

Well, it was a Pathfinder feat at first, so it was house-ruled to work with 3.5, so instead of needing 10 ranks in the skill to gain a +4 bonus, I only need 7 ranks. :smallbiggrin:

Delwugor
2011-02-07, 05:37 PM
After playing D&D for 25-30 years I have found that I am profoundly bored with it, actually bored with any fantasy gaming. It seems like I've done it all and the "been-there, done-that" t-shirt collection is outrageous.

I still like gaming in general, but want a much wider variety in genre and play styles. I was doing this with other groups from my main I've played with for 15 years. But playing only with these ... old bums :smallsmile: ... right now.
We are currently playing M&M (I love Supers) but the rest of the group is strongly in favor of fantasy. This leaves me with a problem after this game is done, stay and yawn through another boring D&D campaign or bow out for a period and miss playing with my old friends. :smallconfused:

Kansaschaser
2011-02-07, 05:41 PM
After playing D&D for 25-30 years I have found that I am profoundly bored with it, actually bored with any fantasy gaming. It seems like I've done it all and the "been-there, done-that" t-shirt collection is outrageous.

I still like gaming in general, but want a much wider variety in genre and play styles. I was doing this with other groups from my main I've played with for 15 years. But playing only with these ... old bums :smallsmile: ... right now.
We are currently playing M&M (I love Supers) but the rest of the group is strongly in favor of fantasy. This leaves me with a problem after this game is done, stay and yawn through another boring D&D campaign or bow out for a period and miss playing with my old friends. :smallconfused:

I think the enjoyment you get from D&D or any other game is how much imagination you put into it. I can run D&D for several years before my cerebral cortex explodes and I need a break. After several months to a year away from D&D, I can start running a D&D game again.

This has held true for any game I've run. Be it D&D, Cyberpunk, Shadowrun, Star Wars, Battletech, etc...

Delwugor
2011-02-07, 05:57 PM
You are right there. I've had this problem for a while but it was satisfied by second groups. Right now I have not found another group which I can match up with and not playing some form of fantasy.

I've thought about turning to some online gaming (almost jumped in on a PbP M&M game here). But I have no experience with it, am not good at putting things in writing (in case you hadn't noticed), and basically love the face-to-face aspect of tabletops.

The other thought I've had is run some games for my teen-aged sons and maybe their friends. That problem is they are much more into the first shooter video games and online competitions than role-playing.

The final problem is that I'm an old fart who has problems changing how he does things in order change what he does ... :smallamused:

Velaryon
2011-02-07, 06:18 PM
First off I've got a weird relationship with gaming. Sometimes I resent it because it gets in the way of socializing. I've got friends who I only see for game. Sometimes I want to hang out with my friends and instead all I get is their characters. Other times I thank gaming for giving me an active social life. My attitude seems to switch every 6 months or so.

I believe I know exactly what you mean. On the one hand, gaming has expanded my social circle - I have friends that I've met through joining people's games, and friends I've met through joining those people's games and so on. On the other hand, many of my friends I never see anymore except for gaming. We don't go to movies, hang out and play video games, or that kinda stuff anymore because every weekend that people are free, it's someone's turn to run their game.



I don't like GMing as much. I have less free time than I used to. I can invest an evening a week in a game. I can't also invest a weekend in writing a game. My primary group started alternating games just so GMs would have two weeks instead of one for prep time. If it gets any worse I'm just going to run premade modules.

I sympathize with this as well. Premade modules hold no appeal for me or for those that I regularly game with, but I'm not one of those people who can run a game completely off-the-cuff. I don't have to plan out every little detail, but I still need to spend a couple of nights before every game going over my books and character sheets, staring at my computer screen while trying to think of plot developments based on what's been happening, and so on. It eats up a lot of my time outside the game itself, which I am not at all fond of. Generally my games end when I get fed up with the amount of work it takes to run them.



Why would you take flak for that? The way you led into it I thought you were going with your slightly less than popular but still perfectly valid views on fudging.

As a PC I want to make my mark on the world. If the game progresses the same regardless of the character I play, why should I even play. I want the presence of my character to affect the story in a unique way. This is why I don't deal well with pre-written modules.

I agree with this too. I don't do well with campaigns where there is little to no freedom for the players to affect their surroundings. One game I can think of was being run by a friend of mine. He's a great roleplayer, and a fantastic storyteller, but his style is to tell a predetermined story in his homebrewed world, which already has its established major NPCs. The players are mostly along for the ride to witness and experience his story, and they get to roll dice for combat. If they try to get off the rails, something will usually put them back on. Even though the story is really good, I just don't enjoy that style of gaming.

On the flipside though, I've been in campaigns where the GM basically has no story at all, and leaves everything up to the players to get things moving. That works sometimes, but other times it leaves a lot of faltering and stumbling as the players try to decide what they want to do.

My own campaign shoots for a middle ground. I try to give my players room to explore, decide what they want to do and who their characters are, and then shape a story around them. Unfortunately it's a lot of work and sometimes I veer too far into planning what I want to happen, or leave things so open that I have no idea how to prepare for the next session. But for the most part it's a fun time for us. I just wish it didn't entail so much out-of-game preparation.

Starbuck_II
2011-02-07, 06:27 PM
Anyways, how about you? Are your games as good if not better as you get older? Or does it become harder and harder for you to find immersion and endless hours of fun in these dungeons as the years go by?

Well, I started in high school with AD&D. At the time only the DM had the books so I only read enough to make a fighter and did so. Never got to use weapon mastery (DM did'nt use many rules) so I wasn't a great warrior like I could have been (should have been a ranger).

It was cool, but I was never good at puzzles (DM liked them).

Than later near end of high school I tried 3.0: it was easier (Thac0 aside) to grok everything plus DMs actually used the rules. From there 3.5 when it came out and so on.

I'll always play if I'm able. Doesn't matter edition. I just like playing make believe and kicking butt. Kicking reason to the curb and doing the impossible.

Aemoh87
2011-02-07, 06:36 PM
I love rpgs and they stay just as good. The biggest problem has been the dawn of the net and how people can move ideas so quickly. I am not that old but it's just recently come up that some of my more novice players are googling characters just to try to be broken. That is frustrating.

Thurbane
2011-02-07, 08:16 PM
Me: Whiskey, brandy...whatever, I hate them all, so I never remember the difference.
Friend: T***, Brandy is a prestige class for Whiskey.
Me: Ah. Got it.
If I'm understanding your analogy correct, then unfortuantely that's waaay wrong.

Cognac is a PrC for Brandy.

Whiskey is whiskey is whiskey (but comes in many different varieties - Scotch, Bourbon etc.). :smallbiggrin:

Psyren
2011-02-07, 08:28 PM
If I'm understanding your analogy correct, then unfortuantely that's waaay wrong.

Cognac is a PrC for Brandy.

Whiskey is whiskey is whiskey (but comes in many different varieties - Scotch, Bourbon etc.). :smallbiggrin:

And rum is OP :smalltongue:

Thurbane
2011-02-07, 08:46 PM
And rum is OP :smalltongue:
I actually got a bottle of OP rum as a housewarming gift on the weekend, but I digress... :smalltongue:

valadil
2011-02-07, 09:04 PM
My own campaign shoots for a middle ground. I try to give my players room to explore, decide what they want to do and who their characters are, and then shape a story around them. Unfortunately it's a lot of work and sometimes I veer too far into planning what I want to happen, or leave things so open that I have no idea how to prepare for the next session. But for the most part it's a fun time for us. I just wish it didn't entail so much out-of-game preparation.

We agree on a lot apparently. My short term aim when I prep is to have enough material that I can run a whole session if the players do nothing. But when the players talk, I shut up and let them carry the game. My long term aim is to give the players enough things to do and talk about that if I don't feel like prepping for a week, they can take over the game and I'll react to them.

Spirited Charge
2011-02-07, 10:36 PM
For me, the game has always kept me captivated. As a child, I'd make characters like paladins who were for me a lot like superheroes, and then I'd go and give them a silly name like Sword xD. After a few years of that, I took my hand at DM'ing but wasn't yet mature enough to realize that things wouldn't work out exactly like I had it in my mind's eye.

After one bad session where we mostly argued, I was scared off from having the power of a DM. After which, I let the others take their own stabs at it while I sat back and powergamed to my hearts content.

These days though, I've started up DM'ing again. Unlike before, I'm a bit more spontaneous with what can happen in a session and have the diligence to work for months on making just the campaign setting.

Has anyone else wondered what the real difference was between making a campaign setting and creating a fantasy setting for a novel? I enjoy the first so much, it interests me if I may want to test my luck at the second.

Tael
2011-02-07, 10:45 PM
For me, the game has always kept me captivated. As a child, I'd make characters like paladins who were for me a lot like superheroes, and then I'd go and give them a silly name like Sword xD. After a few years of that, I took my hand at DM'ing but wasn't yet mature enough to realize that things wouldn't work out exactly like I had it in my mind's eye.

Aw, hells yeah! I totally know what I'm going to name my next barbarian now.
"What is your name good sir?"
"Some call me... Axe!"
:smallcool:

Zaydos
2011-02-07, 11:52 PM
For me, the game has always kept me captivated. As a child, I'd make characters like paladins who were for me a lot like superheroes, and then I'd go and give them a silly name like Sword xD. After a few years of that, I took my hand at DM'ing but wasn't yet mature enough to realize that things wouldn't work out exactly like I had it in my mind's eye.

After one bad session where we mostly argued, I was scared off from having the power of a DM. After which, I let the others take their own stabs at it while I sat back and powergamed to my hearts content.

These days though, I've started up DM'ing again. Unlike before, I'm a bit more spontaneous with what can happen in a session and have the diligence to work for months on making just the campaign setting.

Has anyone else wondered what the real difference was between making a campaign setting and creating a fantasy setting for a novel? I enjoy the first so much, it interests me if I may want to test my luck at the second.

Reminds me of myself. I was... umm... 8ish when I first tried to DM. We didn't argue but the players only agreed to play (I was their friend's annoying little brother) if they got to be psionic dragons. And I only had the 2e MM.

I actually got less spontaneous for a while and started diligently crafting everything, I was lucky enough to have a party that would follow my hooks and didn't break things (I had one person who tried and he would have succeeded if he hadn't tried to do so by breaking rules in character creation). Never had to railroad, I put a clue in a direction and they jumped on it.

Now I'm back to spontaneity and don't even bother planning much. Have different groups now and I'm a bit lazy (I need to get over that). As for world creation I find making campaign settings easier you have a set of rules from which they can grow; fantasy worlds are harder and you need to give them their own organic set of rules (hence most D&D novels don't follow D&D rules very well). They're different but both are rewarding. I'm just only good with campaigns.

Akal Saris
2011-02-08, 12:01 AM
I was about to post that the days when all my PCs played dragons and semi-deities were long gone, but then I thought about it for a moment, and really they still are playing fairly similar characters 12 years later, only now they're actually rules-legal and have distinct characters other than 'James the Fighter/Thief.'

That kind of makes me happy =)

And really, D&D is as fun for me now as ever, though it all comes down to the people that I play with in the end.

Zaydos
2011-02-08, 12:22 AM
I was about to post that the days when all my PCs played dragons and semi-deities were long gone, but then I thought about it for a moment, and really they still are playing fairly similar characters 12 years later, only now they're actually rules-legal and have distinct characters other than 'James the Fighter/Thief.'

That kind of makes me happy =)

And really, D&D is as fun for me now as ever, though it all comes down to the people that I play with in the end.

I didn't mention that they were also half-gods :smalleek:

Oh wait you mean played dragons and played semi-deities. My first experience they played dragon demigods.

Shyftir
2011-02-08, 12:36 AM
I didn't mention that they were also half-gods :smalleek:

Oh wait you mean played dragons and played semi-deities. My first experience they played dragon demigods.

So you mean they were playing Exalted with D&D rules?

Zaydos
2011-02-08, 12:50 AM
So you mean they were playing Exalted with D&D rules?

Except we only had the 2e Monster Manual and a knowledge of Red Box D&D so they were playing Exalted with psionics that we didn't know how they worked at all and were just going by the name. Also I put in my first DMPC because I needed a reason for two baby dragons to be adventuring (especially together)... I then discovered that beholders were not level appropriate encounters so he developed the ability to throw a quarterstaff into its central eye...

It was a bad experience... now I think it would be kind of awesome to recreate.

Maybe I should give Exalted a try sometime.... hmm....

Lord Raziere
2011-02-08, 12:58 AM
Maybe I should give Exalted a try sometime.... hmm....

I recommend it. real detailed, well through out....the rules are designed to enhance roleplaying (the more well described and awesome your action, the likelier it is to succeed). and its designed for you to be able to break reality while still being balanced.

cause all your foes can break reality even more :smalltongue:

Zaydos
2011-02-08, 01:08 AM
I recommend it. real detailed, well through out....the rules are designed to enhance roleplaying (the more well described and awesome your action, the likelier it is to succeed). and its designed for you to be able to break reality while still being balanced.

cause all your foes can break reality even more :smalltongue:

I wanted to try a low combat system, but Exalted seems just up the alley of some of the people I'd likely be playing with. I'll probably start looking into it, thanks.

big teej
2011-02-08, 09:32 AM
I always take flak for this...

I overthink things.

I think that techniques like "Illusion of Choice" are standard practices. And I get bored.

I think that my part in the save the world storyline is superfluous. Whether I be Harpoon the wizard or Treethan the ranger, it doesn't matter. I think it would be the same save the world story.

So ultimately I don't think there is enough "game" to the game to keep me interested. Gaming is about making choices. And giving those choices in a meaningful way seems to be a suboptimal DMing strategy whenever it gets discussed.

But there are loads of systems out there that get the game part right. I just wish I could play in more of them.

Edit: The best game session I've played in was in October. Gaming generally might be something for me that improves over time. Hard to really tell over such a short amount of time.


I'll probably have to edit this a gazillion times by the time I finish the thread and post up my own answer

but this made me sad

I let my players drive the campaign, the choices they make determine what I prep for next session, and how I work things this session....

now eventually this 'crazy' idea of 'letting the players make decisions' as opposed to the illusion of choice is going to cause my players to make a choice I didn't forsee, which leads to the following


Big Teej behind the DM screen
party: "yea, we ignore that, and go that way"
me: uhm......... okay.
I am totally unprepared for that course of action, so y'all roleplay or somethin while I come up with something.


but I digress.

the only time I offer an illusion (to my knowledge) is in dungeon crawls, because sometimes, every path really does lead to the same place.


....

and then there was the time I was running a premade module and the players took mercy on me and followed the rooms 'in order' (which granted, by the design of the dungeon, kinda made sense except in like 3 places )

big teej
2011-02-08, 10:35 AM
been playing it since....... senior year in high school (09)

I enjoyed the game then.


I love it now and am utterly capable of rambling for hours about my favorite hobby.

it even competes with READING