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Owrtho
2011-06-26, 09:36 PM
Well, for a while I've wanted to try putting together a spell list focused around dreams & nightmares with about two spells per level as a feat for my ozodrin (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=8551543) class, but have found the official sources lacking in dream spells (could only find nightmare, and a spell for messaging someone in their sleep. I'm not counting the spells that just put people to sleep), and am not particularly skilled at making and balancing spells myself. As such I thought I'd make a thread to request help with creating such a list of spells and am posting two I've had the idea for for a while, but am uncertain on actual balance or level they should be at.

Inspiring Dream, Lesser
Enchantment (Compulsion, Dream, mind-affecting)
Level: Bard 4, Cleric 4, Sor/Wiz 5
Components: V, S, M
Casting Time: 1 minute
Range: Self
Effect: 5-ft per level radius
Duration: 1 hour/level
Saving Throw: Will negates
Spell Resistance: No
While casting this spell, you choose simple message, or a concept or image to convey. Upon casting the spell goes into effect for 1 hour per caster level. During this time, any creature that approaches within 5 feet of you per caster level will become affected if it is asleep, or falls asleep before the end of the spell duration (even if it leaves the area of the spell).
Upon waking, an affected creature must make a will save, or find itself driven to express the conveyed image, concept, or message in the way it can best, though they will rarely produce exactly what you conveyed. This means that artists will try to capture it in their artwork, writers through writing, sculptors through sculpting, craftsmen through their craft singers and dancers through song and dance, etc. For the purposes of determining what they are best at, choose their highest craft, perform, or, if appropriate, profession skill. If they lack ranks in any of those skills they will simply mention something related to the dream at some point during the day. To succeed in conveying the message, a DC 15 check with the appropriate skill, at which point. If they succeed, one may notice there is a message hidden in the work by succeeding a spot (or listen if appropriate) check (DC 40 - the check made to create it). People who produced something as a result of the spell receive a -5 penalty to noticing there is a message, while those who have already noticed there is a message gain a +5 bonus to seeing it in other works also inspired by this spell, provided it was the same message. If one has noticed there is a message an intelligence check must be made to decipher it (DC 30 - caster level). If a person has noticed the message in more than one work, they gain a +1 bonus on the check for each work after the first, provided they have them on hand to compare.
If the person is inspired by the same message, concept or image the next time the go to sleep, either through the duration lasting that long or the spell being cast on them again conveying the same thing, they gain a +2 bonus on their check to produce a new work or improve one already made the next day. These bonuses are cumulative, as long as they are affected by the spell each night and failed the will save upon waking.

Material component: a piece of scolecite.

Inspiring Dream, Greater
Enchantment (Compulsion, Dream, mind-affecting)
Level: Bard 7, Cleric 7, Sor/Wiz 8
Components: V, S, M
Casting Time: 5 minute
Range: Long (1 mile/level)
Effect: 1/4 mile per level radius
Duration: 1 day/level
Saving Throw: Will negates
Spell Resistance: No
This spell acts as Lesser Inspiring Dream except it has a casting time of 5 minutes, may be cast at a distance of 1 mile per level, has a radius of 1/4 mile per level, and a duration of 1 day per level. It also will not affect new people entering the area of effect after the spell is cast unlike the lesser version, instead being limited to those already there when the spell was cast.

Material components: a piece of scolecite and a piece of malachite.

Owrtho

begooler
2011-06-26, 10:58 PM
Heroes of Horror has dream based spells, feats related to such spells, and also discusses adventuring in dreamscapes. That book might be a good source of inspiration for you.

Owrtho
2011-06-26, 11:29 PM
Thanks for the tip. I wouldn't have placed that as the book for dream related stuff. I'll need to look through it in more detail at some point. That said, it still only adds 6 more dream related spells spread between 4 levels, so more spells will be needed.

Owrtho

GoblinArchmage
2011-06-27, 01:03 AM
The fluff for Phantasmal Killer and Weird make them seem somewhat nightmarish, not to mention they are Illusion (Phantasm) spells. Actually, most of the Illusion (Phantasm) and Illusion (Shadow) spells seem like they would work for this type of thing. If you want you could change some of the fluff for the Shadow spells so that they come from dreams instead of from the Plane of Shadow.

Delegreg
2011-06-27, 12:18 PM
The Lesser version sounds like a limited, but wider version of Dream (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Dream), or Sending (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Sending)

How to determine if the message has been conveyed :

via a spot (or listen) check to determine if the target realizes it is a message (DC=40-perform check)
then roll a straight intelligence check (DC=25-CL) to determine if the target understood the meaning.

I give indicatory DCs, they should be adjusted through playtesting ...

Enchantment is the appropriate school, Compulsion the appropriate subschool, you should add the mind-affecting and dream descriptors, ie :


Enchantment(Compulsion) (mind-affecting, dream)

not sure if the dream descriptor exists, but you should add it anyway, so you can mention it later in your feat, ie :


"This feat allows you to add all spells with the dream descriptor to your known spell list"


Long casting time, short AoE, high potential number of targets, mostly irrelevant duration, this would make for a 5th or 6th level spell (you can touch more targets than the Dream spell, but the message may not be conveyed, which vies for an almost equivalent level, adjust according to the DCs)

Greater version should be 8th at least (very long range, extreme duration, potentially thousands of targets, and i'm sure you'll reduce the understandability DCs)

Make them one level lower for Clerics or Bards, as dreams are one of the gods's favored means of communication, and Bards's stories are frequently the cause of people's dreams.

ie :


Lesser ...
Level: Cleric 5, Bard 5, Sor/Wiz 6

Greater ...
Level: Cleric 7, Bard 7, Sor/Wiz 8



Hope this helps

Cya

Owrtho
2011-06-27, 02:20 PM
The Lesser version sounds like a limited, but wider version of Dream (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Dream), or Sending (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Sending)

Well, it was inspired slightly by those, and largely by Call of Cthulhu by H. P. Lovecraft (in which most of the artists in a city have recently begun making similar works due to being plagued by similar dreams)


How to determine if the message has been conveyed :

via a spot (or listen) check to determine if the target realizes it is a message (DC=40-perform check)
then roll a straight intelligence check (DC=25-CL) to determine if the target understood the meaning.

I give indicatory DCs, they should be adjusted through playtesting ...

That is a good idea. It solves the problem I was having of trying to tie the caster level into the craft/perform check rather than the check to determine the message, though I will likely modify it slightly.


Enchantment is the appropriate school, Compulsion the appropriate subschool, you should add the mind-affecting and dream descriptors, ie :
not sure if the dream descriptor exists, but you should add it anyway, so you can mention it later in your feat, ie :

I thought so. Forgot about the mind affecting. I'll add those.


Long casting time, short AoE, high potential number of targets, mostly irrelevant duration, this would make for a 5th or 6th level spell (you can touch more targets than the Dream spell, but the message may not be conveyed, which vies for an almost equivalent level, adjust according to the DCs)

Greater version should be 8th at least (very long range, extreme duration, potentially thousands of targets, and i'm sure you'll reduce the understandability DCs)

Make them one level lower for Clerics or Bards, as dreams are one of the gods's favored means of communication, and Bards's stories are frequently the cause of people's dreams.

Reasoning here seems sound. I'll likely go more with sending on the lesser version, making it 4th and 5th level rather than 5th & 6th. Mainly taking into account the fact that what bumps dream up seems to be the unlimited message length, which this lacks. Also may be worth noting that the ones affected ate not inherently aware of the message either, and the spell isn't actually intended to be used on who you would send the message to. Rather, the spell is intended to be used where you expect the recipient to go, hoping they will notice it among the various artwork and the like it inspires when they are there (thinking of that I may give those who are actually affected by the spell a penalty to noticing & determining the message).

I don't plan on reducing the understanding DC of the greater version though. It mainly relies on more targets giving more chances to make the check, making it easier to notice any individual one.

Owrtho

Cipherthe3vil
2011-06-27, 02:52 PM
I want to help.
But Dream spells just always seem to be related to having to effect a sleeping target... Otherwise they're usually just illusion spells...
I just can't think of anything interesting. :smallfrown:

Mulletmanalive
2011-06-27, 03:00 PM
A few interesting ideas i've already used via my non-D&D magic system that you're welcome to as ideas:

- sending the target off into a daydream, in that they're reconstituting the environment themselves. The target spends the next round making three rounds of combat against the caster or a proxy inside their own head. The resources expended in these rounds are lost.

- Linking the dreams of multiple people together to adventure inside a target's mind [after watching Inception, i'd like to run an entire campaign based on this]

- Dream Seeds: spells that cause the person to experience a selection of specific dreams the next X times they sleep

- dream theft: stealing another person's dreams away from them so that you can dissect the imagery and such-like at your liesure

Delegreg
2011-06-29, 10:40 AM
Dream spells could be a nice way to deal with day long buffs and/or healing effects...

Take the following list as my daily brainfart :smallsmile:


Resourcing dream : target is considered "healed" (ie : as if someone succeded on a heal check on them) in regards to rest and heals twice (or thrice) the normal amount of HP during the night
Dream of health : target wakes cured of any conditions/poisons/diseases
Dream of blessing : target wakes cured of any curses
Appeasing dream : cast on sleeping target, target is immune to fear for the next day
Refreshing dream : target is immune to fatigue for the next day
Arcane might dream : target arcane caster gains a spell slot (highest level) for the day
Divine might dream : target divine caster gains a spell slot (highest level) for the day
Enhancing dream : target caster gains +1 to spell DC for the day
(Metamagic) dream : target caster may use (metamagic feat) without augmenting the spell level once during the next day
Dream of war : target gains +x to hit for the day (x depends on caster level or dream spell level)
Dream of carnage : as above but bonus to damage
Dream of P**** Envy : target may enlarge self once during the next day


Spell stats and fluff left to your discretion :smallcool:

Hope this helps