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Welknair
2011-08-31, 05:06 PM
Because I had an idea. As you all know, Pyromancer999 (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/member.php?u=52048) makes some awesome (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=184257) feat (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=10460621) chains (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=200935). I'm trying to start up a Homebrewer's Campaign (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=213670) and I was amused that I had created at least one bloodline based on the work of each person I was inviting. Except Pyromancer, that is. I have a couple of requests for bloodlines based on classes of his, but those are going to take a while. I was lamenting over this to a friend of mine. "Well he does have a couple base classes I'm planning on making bloodlines for, but those won't be done for a while. His signature work though is feat chains, and it's not like I can---" Suddenly idea! Many of the Special Abilities from the original bloodlines were bonus feats! What if I- Yeah. I went there.



Inherent
http://fc08.deviantart.net/fs7/i/2005/230/b/5/grim_reaper_by_blackpoint.jpg

Some people are Classy (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=10450013#post10450013). Some people draw power from death (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=184257). Some embrace their Vampiric heritage (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=200935). But all of these individuals must work at it. Unlike the Inherents. Like an Inherent Gentleman is just born classy (which frankly makes him 10X as classy). Or Inherent Reapers are chosen by death instead of having to seek out the powers they desire. Some aren't too happy about this. Then there are those weird individuals that think it's Christmas, Halloween or Easter all year long. The weirdos.

{table=head] Level |
Minor |
Intermediate |
Major

1 | | | Skill 1 +2
2 | | Skill 1 +2 | Chain Feat 1
3 | | | Ability Score 1 +1
4 | Skill 1 +2 | Chain Feat 1 | Chain Feat 2
5 | | | Chain Affinity +2
6 | | Ability Score 1 +1 | Chain Feat 3
7 | | | Skill 2 +2
8 | Chain Feat 1 | Chain Feat 2 | Chain Feat 4
9 | | | Ability 2 +2
10 | | Chain Affinity +2 | Chain Feat 5
11 | | | Chain Affinity +4
12 | Ability 1 +1 | Chain Feat 3 | Chain Feat 6
13 | | | Skill 3 +2
14 | | Skill 2 +2 | Chain Feat 7
15 | | | Ability 3 +1
16 | Chain Feat 2 | Chain Feat 4 | Chain Feat 8
17 | | | Chain Affinity +6
18 | | Ability 2 +1 | Chain Feat 9
19 | | | Skill 4 +2
20 | Chain Affinity +2 | Chain Feat 5 | Chain Feat 10
[/table]

Skill 1-4 +2: The Inherent gains bonuses to skills based upon what their Lineage is.

Chain Feat: The primary feature of the Inherent is their periodic acquisition of Chain Feats. Each time they gain this ability, they may choose one bonus feat from their Chain that they qualify for. If there are no more feats in the Chain, the Inherent gains a Ghost Chain Feat - a feat that counts towards the number of feats they possess in the chain, but offers no other benefits.

Ability 1-3 +1: The Inherent gains bonuses to Abilities based upon what their Lineage is.

Chain Affinity: Inherents are more skilled at communicating with individuals that share something in common with them, whether that be both of them thinking that today is Christmas, or both of them being harvesters of souls. They gain a bonus on all social interaction checks with individuals that have at least one feat from their chain, or as specified in the Inherent's Lineage.

Lineages: Of course each Inherent is different. The Skills and Abilities they gain bonuses to differ depending on which Chain they are based off of, as does their Affinity.


Classy (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=188796)
Skills: Diplomacy, Sense Motive, Appraise, Use Magic Device
Abilities: Charisma, Intelligence, Wisdom
Affinity: Individuals with one or more levels in Aristocrat or with a Cha of 14+

Reaper (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=184257)
Skills: Sense Motive, Intimidate, Spot, Search
Abilities: Charisma, Strength, Dexterity
Affinity: Ghosts, Spectres, and Maruts and any other being that either is a lost soul or enforcing the inevitability of death.

Vampiric Heritage (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=200935)
Skills: Spot, Move Silently, Diplomacy, Jump
Abilities: Charisma, Strength, Dexterity
Affinity: Vampires and Vampire Spawn

Easter (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=196439)
Skills: Jump, Hide, Appraise, Move Silently
Abilities: Dexterity, Charisma, Strength
Affinity: Easter enthusiasts, and to everyone while Easter.

Halloween (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=173098)
Skills: Disguise, Intimidate, Diplomacy, Sense Motive
Abilities: Charisma, Dexterity, Constitution
Affinity: Halloween enthusiasts, and to everyone while Halloween.

Christmas (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=179196)
Skills: Hide, Move Silently, Diplomacy, Climb
Abilities: Dexterity, Constitution, Charisma
Affinity: Christmas enthusiasts, and to everyone while Christmas and Christmas Eve.

Valentine's Day (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=186116)
Skills: Diplomacy, Bluff, Sense Motive, Hide
Abilities: Charisma, Wisdom, Dexterity
Affinity: Anyone in love, and to everyone while Christmas or Christmas Eve.

New Year's (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=181720)
Skills: Perform, Diplomacy, Climb, Gather Information
Abilities: Constitution, Charisma, Strength
Affinity: New Year's enthusiasts, and to everyone on New Year's.

Thanksgiving (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=175643)
Skills: Diplomacy, Sense Motive, Gather Information, Balance
Abilities: Charisma, Wisdom, Constitution
Affinity: Anyone who has thanks to give, and to everyone on Thanksgiving.

Ki Disciple (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=198382)
Skills: Hide, Jump, Tumble, Balance
Abilities: Wisdom, Dexterity, Strength
Affinity: Anyone with Ki

Magic's Child (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=185242)
Skills: Spellcraft, Knowledge (Arcana),
Abilities: Intelligence, Wisdom, Charisma
Affinity: Anyone who reveres spellcasters, but is not a spellcaster themselves

Badass (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=210529)
Skills: Intimidate, Tumble, Use Magic Device, Sense motive
Abilities: Charisma, Strength, Dexterity
Affinities: Anyone of lesser level

Bladesworn (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=185231)
Skills: Intimidate, Spot, Climb, Balance
Abilities: Strength, Dexterity, Constitution
Affinities: Anyone with Weapon Focus with that kind of weapon

Aberrant - Courtesy of Owthro
Skills: Listen, Escape Artist, Intimidate, Knowledge (Dungeoneering)
Abilities: Constitution, Charisma, Strength
Affinity: Aberrations
Special: Select feats from any with the [Aberrant] keyword.



So yeah. It was quick and lazy. Pyromancer, I love your feat chains. And maybe this'll make it easier to integrate them into characters. Maybe not. At least now I can say I've made a bloodline for each of the people on that list.

Pyromancer999
2011-08-31, 06:42 PM
Wow. This is just....great. Really great. Still, although I don't want to be a bother, if you're looking to get all my feat chains (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=186116), you (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=181720) forgot (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=175643) some. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=210529)

Welknair
2011-08-31, 06:46 PM
Wow. This is just....great. Really great. Still, although I don't want to be a bother, if you're looking to get all my feat chains (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=186116), you (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=181720) forgot (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=175643) some. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=210529)

Ah, my Google-fu is weak. And you really should make yourself an Extended Signature. It would help so much.

And I'm glad it's not a huge disappointment.

Pyromancer999
2011-08-31, 06:55 PM
Ah, my Google-fu is weak. And you really should make yourself an Extended Signature. It would help so much.


I would, but it gets a slight bit tedious to track down and add all 50-something of my homebrews. Still, sorry for the inconvenience.


And I'm glad it's not a huge disappointment.

It's super great.

Welknair
2011-08-31, 07:00 PM
I would, but it gets a slight bit tedious to track down and add all 50-something of my homebrews. Still, sorry for the inconvenience.

This is why I started posting my stuff in an extended signature as soon as they no longer fit in my normal one. If you do it as you go, it's not as difficult.

Edit: Added those Chains.

Amechra
2011-08-31, 09:10 PM
What happens when you run out of feats to take?

Welknair
2011-08-31, 09:15 PM
What happens when you run out of feats to take?

I haven't done a thorough search, but I can't find any that have fewer than 10.

Though may have a problem if you're over-eager and start taking Chain Feats with your normal feat allotment. Not sure what to do then. Perhaps have a "Generic" feat, that just counts towards the chain for purposes of the other feats with abilities based upon the number of chain feats you have?

Amechra
2011-08-31, 09:30 PM
I know the Valentines one has only about 5, so...

Pyromancer999
2011-08-31, 09:42 PM
I know the Valentines one has only about 5, so...

It's actually 8, but point is still taken. My policy is to do appropriate [Holiday] feats near the actual holiday, so no more until then, though. Here's a few ideas, though:

-Replace couple chain feats with a minor ability after 1st and a cap ability for each chain at 20th(but might be too much work)
-Replace couple chain feats with just +1 effective feats


Also, found one last feat chain of mine: Bladesworn (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/archive/index.php?t-185231.html).

Welknair
2011-08-31, 09:47 PM
-Replace couple chain feats with just +1 effective feats


I think I'll go with that one for now.

And I'm adding the Bladesworn.

Jallorn
2012-06-23, 01:11 PM
So thread necromancy and all, but you should do a psionic one. That would lend itself well to this methinks.

Welknair
2012-06-23, 02:02 PM
So thread necromancy and all, but you should do a psionic one. That would lend itself well to this methinks.

Huh, could have sworn I made one. If I find the time, I may try my hand at it. I have a million and one things on my plate, though.

radmelon
2012-06-23, 02:40 PM
Well, the hero-born bloodline does have a psion option.

EdroGrimshell
2012-06-23, 10:59 PM
Huh, could have sworn I made one. If I find the time, I may try my hand at it. I have a million and one things on my plate, though.

Already did. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=12271807&postcount=163)

Amechra
2012-06-23, 11:37 PM
I notice you lack an Abyssal Heritor Inherent option. How... disappointing.

Also, one that would give you Psionic feats would be loverly.

Edit:

You are also missing Fighter feats and Luck feats. For shame!

Welknair
2012-06-24, 12:27 AM
I notice you lack an Abyssal Heritor Inherent option. How... disappointing.

Also, one that would give you Psionic feats would be loverly.

Edit:

You are also missing Fighter feats and Luck feats. For shame!

I've been busy, you know! If someone else would like to draw up the appropriate blocks for those chains, I'd happily add them.



Randomnote: I'm considering a Base Class that is SAD-Int, but is entirely non-magic. Something along the lines of a "Traveling Scholar". Think I should go for it?

radmelon
2012-06-24, 12:37 AM
An int-based magicless class? Go for it.

EdroGrimshell
2012-06-24, 03:17 PM
I notice you lack an Abyssal Heritor Inherent option. How... disappointing.

Also, one that would give you Psionic feats would be loverly.

Edit:

You are also missing Fighter feats and Luck feats. For shame!

Easy enough.

Psionic
Skills: Psicraft, Concentration, Autohypnosis, Use Psionic Device
Abilities: Intelligence, Wisdom, Charisma
Affinity: Psionic Creatures

Fighter
Skills:
Abilities: Strength, Constitution, Dexterity
Affinity: Anyone with a Full BAB progression

Luck
Skills: Pick a different, non-trained only skill each time this is gained.
Abilities: Choose a different ability score for each increase
Affinity: Creature with at least one Luck Reroll

Abyssal Heritor + Fell
Skills: Intimidate, Bluff, Knowledge (The Planes), ---
Abilities: Strength, Constitution, Charisma
Affinity: Evil Outsiders, Chaotic Outsiders, and Creatures with Fell or Abyssal Heritor Feats
Special: Abyssal Heritor Feats and Fell Feats count towards the bonuses both grant.
These are easy enough to make, and luck seems to be the easiest one.

Amechra
2012-06-24, 10:14 PM
Sweet!

And you totally should make an Int-SAD class that has no casting; though if you make it based around maneuvers, would that count as lacking "casting", per se?

Welknair
2012-06-24, 10:32 PM
And you totally should make an Int-SAD class that has no casting; though if you make it based around maneuvers, would that count as lacking "casting", per se?

I think I may have to drop the idea, simply due to time constraints. If I do get around to making it, I'd rather it not be an Initiator or a Caster. That of course leaves me with the question of what it IS. Starting point was Swashbuckler's Insightful Strike at first level, being geared towards giving bonuses to allies due to knowing stuff about targets.

The inspiration was the new 3.5 campaign my main group started yesterday. I'm trying something new, with a no-magic world (except for NPC Ozodrin). I found very quickly that there were no non-magic classes that favored INT too highly.

Now that I think of it, I should be thinking up a non-magic CHA-SAD class, because 7 out of my 8 players, and the 8th doesn't optimize at all. I'm using Rich's Diplo fix to avoid Diplomancer hijinks, and that was one of the few reasons left that someone would pump CHA. So yeah, my group are a bunch of ugly anti-social people. :smalltongue:

Amechra
2012-06-25, 10:09 AM
Take a look around; I know that Realms of Chaos made an ultra-sexy class called the Charlatan which essentially allows you to play an (under control) Diplomancer. It looks quite fun and balanced.

There's also the Factotum for Int-based fun, but you'll have to look around for ACFs for the little bits of SLAs they get (you might as well replace it with an Archivist's Dark Knowledge class feature, or Bardic Knowledge.)

Those are the ones that I remember as being +1 for those ability scores in a non-Magic sense...

Out of curiosity, what Chassis do you think would make Bloodlines balanced as an NPC class? For a while, I've just kinda wanted to staple them onto the Aristocrat chassis, but does that sound balanced to any of you? Yes, I am aware that someone with a Fighter Inherent Bloodline is superior to a Fighter, but quite frankly, the Fighter sucks.

Welknair
2012-06-25, 11:32 AM
I think using Aristocrat ought to be pretty close to balanced. If you wanted to be a bit more specific chassis-wise, you could always reduce the number of class skills, and add any skills that they get a bonus to from the class. Perhaps have them have their one good save be whatever they get the appropriate ability boost to first? So a Bloodline that give a +1 to Con before either of Dex or Wis would result in a Good Fort Save instead of the Good Will placed on the chassis.

Owrtho
2012-06-25, 04:25 PM
I think using Aristocrat ought to be pretty close to balanced. If you wanted to be a bit more specific chassis-wise, you could always reduce the number of class skills, and add any skills that they get a bonus to from the class. Perhaps have them have their one good save be whatever they get the appropriate ability boost to first? So a Bloodline that give a +1 to Con before either of Dex or Wis would result in a Good Fort Save instead of the Good Will placed on the chassis.

The question there becomes what you do for saves when the bloodline grants strength, intelligence, and charisma buffs. A hard ruling might work, possibly for will, given the two mental ability score buffs, or fortitude, if they get strength first. Though it may also work to do a just what makes sense, even if that is less easily applied across the board.

Also there may be a need to update this bloodline for the bladesworn (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=185231) feat tree.
Given the weapon focus, I might suggest ability scores of strength, dexterity, and constitution. In that order, with a note that if you select a weapon that weapon finesse applies to the order of strength and dexterity is swapped.
The affinity would be anyone who predominantly uses the same type of weapon as the one you chose, or who has weapon focus with that weapon.
For the skills though all I can think of is tumble. Possibly slight of hand, though that doesn't quite fit since they conjure the weapon from nothing rather than just being skilled at drawing it quickly or hiding it. Perhaps Craft (Weaponsmithing).

Owrtho