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View Full Version : Creative uses of Magitek.



Pokonic
2011-09-24, 10:54 PM
In another thread about what would happen if suddenly magic was intruduced into the modern world, I came up with the idea of Necromancy
inhanced nukes. While rather horrifing too me ( realy, radioactive incorparal undead what leave trails of radiation though solid matter in there wake are so going into my next horrer game) it left me with a rather interesting question: how could magitek be utilised in a world in interesting ways? Lets assume its in the present day, to not make the point of this moot. Also, as a standerd,lets use the magic system used within 3.5as a base, as it is the one that most would know the most.

Some ideas :
A "bloodline detector" enchantment that alows only individuals who are related to the caster or another to enter importent rooms or areas of a buildng, and is usualy used to protect importent documents or sensitve information.

Element-inhanced bullets. Insanely costly to the one who buys it, these bullets are often used by snipers and other high ranked solders for there high kill rate even if they miss. A wound that not only cooked the flesh around it but also melted the bones that it passed through are known to be very hard to deal with even with the best equipment availible.

A magical "power armer". Actualy a advanced Golem, these armors are known for having models nearly any situation, from small and sleek stealth suits with illusionary propertys too the large-and-in-charge war models with huge amouts of on-bord firepower. Naturaly, the most advanced models are custom made, and are not only rare but are also very,very costly to the buyer. Hey, god like firepower does not come cheap, let alown magical god like firepower!

Brewdude
2011-09-25, 12:49 AM
ever see the "ghouls" of Fallout? They even glow in the dark!

Das Platyvark
2011-09-25, 08:00 AM
Magically facilitated robots and AI.
Seriously, with any level of magitek ability on our hands, we could do some pretty cool stuff.

Trixie
2011-09-25, 09:45 AM
Read The Perdido Station (and the rest of the series) by China Mieville. The most creative book about magitek I've ever seen, it does have everything from enhanced nuke-like weapons to magitek clockwork-computers powering magical golem/robots. Really excellent :smalltongue:

irenicObserver
2011-09-25, 09:58 AM
Advanced VR systems, energy generation, really just about improving the cost-effectiveness of everything a hundred-fold.

Tiki Snakes
2011-09-25, 11:07 AM
I can't help but feel that enchanting sniper bullets is frankly overkill. If you've hit enough to deliver the elemental damage, toxin or so on you've pretty much already neutralised the target, really. Especially if you hit bone.

Now, whack some of that mojo on an easily concealed semi-automatic and you've got some real damage potential. Likewise, silencers just don't work in real life because even if you muffle the gun itself, the bullet breaking the speed barrier causes a lot of noise. Magic could fix that nicely, however.

Frozen_Feet
2011-09-25, 11:58 AM
Inhabiting normally uninhabitable places on Earth.

Non-euclidean topologies possible for buildings.

Dimensional travel.

As a rule of thumb, we don't need more destructive weapons. We already have nukes. :smalltongue:

Transhumanism.

Creation of new organisms specifically suited for unearthly environments.

Just as a note, all of these are (theoretically) achievable with "just" tech... because the concept of "magitek" is a bit stupid. Magic formalized into alchemy or spells already is technology. Technology based on wholly known natural laws can already achieve mind-boggling and impressive results.

The Glyphstone
2011-09-25, 12:08 PM
I can't help but feel that enchanting sniper bullets is frankly overkill. If you've hit enough to deliver the elemental damage, toxin or so on you've pretty much already neutralised the target, really. Especially if you hit bone.

Now, whack some of that mojo on an easily concealed semi-automatic and you've got some real damage potential. Likewise, silencers just don't work in real life because even if you muffle the gun itself, the bullet breaking the speed barrier causes a lot of noise. Magic could fix that nicely, however.

Isn't that what a silencer does? Slow the bullet so it stays subsonic?

Kinslayer
2011-09-25, 12:08 PM
Just as a note, all of these are (theoretically) achievable with "just" tech... because the concept of "magitek" is a bit stupid. Magic formalized into alchemy or spells already is technology. Technology based on wholly known natural laws can already achieve mind-boggling and impressive results.

I agree that Magic and Technology don't really have a reason to be combined - but if you were just enchanting things with magic...

+1 Teleport Airtight Building to Mars

Trixie
2011-09-25, 12:15 PM
Isn't that what a silencer does? Slow the bullet so it stays subsonic?

No. You do that by using special bullets with less powder/heavier slug. Silencer only traps and dissipates gasses from burned powder, quieting the gun.

Although the part about silencers not working is false, you don't need them, Russia used to produce special, silencer-less guns with gas-catch bullets making literally no noise.

Tiki Snakes
2011-09-25, 12:20 PM
Isn't that what a silencer does? Slow the bullet so it stays subsonic?

I'm hazy on the subject, not being one of the forums many weapons experts, but I don't think so. I was of the understanding that a silencer, such as any exist even, are cheifly to stop the noise created by the bullet being fired at all, and anything beyond that requires careful gun choice.

I may very well be wrong, of course.

Either way, magic would do it better.

[edit] Swordsaged by one of those experts, it seems. :)

The Glyphstone
2011-09-25, 12:43 PM
No. You do that by using special bullets with less powder/heavier slug. Silencer only traps and dissipates gasses from burned powder, quieting the gun.

Although the part about silencers not working is false, you don't need them, Russia used to produce special, silencer-less guns with gas-catch bullets making literally no noise.

Interesting.

Brother Oni
2011-09-25, 01:20 PM
No. You do that by using special bullets with less powder/heavier slug. Silencer only traps and dissipates gasses from burned powder, quieting the gun.

Surely by the time a supersonic bullet hits you, it's too late for you to hear it? :smalltongue:

With regard to the original topic, wouldn't it be just easier for the sniper to activate Silence on his immediate area, thus no shot is ever heard. Assuming a 20ft radius, you could probably hide crew served weapons, which is a terrifying thought - imagine coming under fire from a heavy machine gun, except you can only hear the rounds strike, not the weapon firing.

Elemental enchanted rounds though doesn't sound that imaginative in my opinion though - it's just more powerful rounds that hit harder, something we can already do by upper the calibre or using explosive/AP rounds.

Bullets enchanted with True strike effectively makes them homing bullets, so you never have to expose yourself to enemy fire to fire back. Teleporting bullets that bypass any armour, or can be fired using a Clairvoyance spell for targeting.

Paratroopers with Featherfall instead of parachutes, thus limiting their time in the air and hence exposed.

Pokonic
2011-09-25, 01:36 PM
Heres my thought on the subject on what makes magitek interesting in my eyes.

Whats cooler than a power armor with auto-locking abilitys with heavy firepower?

A smart self-reparing power armor that auto-casts healing spells on its wearer, has runes carved into its body which gives off a passive effects that range from sound damping to illusions, and auto-enchants bullets to both home in on targets and cause them to turn to ice, thats what!

thegurullamen
2011-09-25, 02:05 PM
Teleporting nukes. For the first few years, it'll be all paranoia and rogue states getting their butts kicked out of fear of the no-warning nuclear holocaust. Then some sort of defenses will be devised, say some sort of magical barrier that prevents fission of a particular substance over a wide area (your city here). Just one of many, many possible social ramifications. But enough of that--onto physical stuff.

Increasing the malleability, tensile strength, stress resistance and general strength of every material known to man. The engineering leaps forward from that point are staggering. After all, look at what the discovery of steel did for us. With the proper applications, the word 'unobtainium' might cease to exist overnight. From there, a whole slew of architectural and technological wonders evolve.

And from there, the energy crisis: why manufacture energy from inefficient sources when there's a wealth of stuff out there waiting to be tapped? If not magic itself, then how about the sun? Teleporting a properly resistant station near it could lead to some interesting new energy-production technologies. And if not that, how about a Dyson sphere?

Intragalactic (and maybe eventually intergalactic) travel! Enough said.

Weezer
2011-09-25, 02:16 PM
Read The Perdido Station (and the rest of the series) by China Mieville. The most creative book about magitek I've ever seen, it does have everything from enhanced nuke-like weapons to magitek clockwork-computers powering magical golem/robots. Really excellent :smalltongue:

And for another book by the same author look up Kraken, it has a lot of magitek in the modern world. Very well done.

Prime32
2011-09-25, 02:30 PM
In another thread about what would happen if suddenly magic was intruduced into the modern world, I came up with the idea of Necromancy
inhanced nukes. While rather horrifing too me ( realy, radioactive incorparal undead what leave trails of radiation though solid matter in there wake are so going into my next horrer game) it left me with a rather interesting question: how could magitek be utilised in a world in interesting ways? Lets assume its in the present day, to not make the point of this moot. Also, as a standerd,lets use the magic system used within 3.5as a base, as it is the one that most would know the most.Er, this seems kind of difficult/pointless to me. You want to create undead inside what's effectively a miniature sun? Just use a regular nuke or a weapon that turns people into undead.


A "bloodline detector" enchantment that alows only individuals who are related to the caster or another to enter importent rooms or areas of a buildng, and is usualy used to protect importent documents or sensitve information.Three words: "Gene therapy lol."


Element-inhanced bullets. Insanely costly to the one who buys it, these bullets are often used by snipers and other high ranked solders for there high kill rate even if they miss. A wound that not only cooked the flesh around it but also melted the bones that it passed through are known to be very hard to deal with even with the best equipment availible.Considering that even bullets that shatter inside a target are banned for wartime use under the Geneva convention, I can't see these being allowed anywhere.


A magical "power armer". Actualy a advanced Golem, these armors are known for having models nearly any situation, from small and sleek stealth suits with illusionary propertys too the large-and-in-charge war models with huge amouts of on-bord firepower. Naturaly, the most advanced models are custom made, and are not only rare but are also very,very costly to the buyer. Hey, god like firepower does not come cheap, let alown magical god like firepower!Since you said you werre going with 3.5, Special Quality: Berserk (Ex). :smalltongue:

Pokonic
2011-09-25, 02:55 PM
Er, this seems kind of difficult/pointless to me. You want to create undead inside what's effectively a miniature sun? Just use a regular nuke or a weapon that turns people into undead.

Meh, you are realy right on this one. I was thinking of more about the distructive capabilitys that a necromantic nuke would do rather than the actual viablity of it. How about a substance that activly transforms creatures into undead that can come in all three commen forms of matter,lasts for years on end by itself, and can contaminate almost anything? Here is a hint: if you are downriver, dont drink the water and dont step in puddles, and forget about going outside when mists start to form if you like your flesh.


Considering that even bullets that shatter inside a target are banned for wartime use under the Geneva convention, I can't see these being allowed anywhere.
Besides criminals and those with the connections, correct?


Since you said you werre going with 3.5, Special Quality: Berserk (Ex).
Oh great, now I am imagining some unfortunate bugger being traped in a stealthy killing power armor with no way to comunicate with the outside world. And if it comes with a automatic life support system, the poor guy inside could be traped for years on end with no control of what the armor does...:smalleek:

Also, a interesting thought came to mind: how long would it take for every goverment power with the magical power to do so would set up Faerun style mythals in goverment hubs?

Brother Oni
2011-09-25, 03:36 PM
Besides criminals and those with the connections, correct?

Criminals in possession of what you suggest to be military class hardware (criminals don't go sniping people - that's for serial killers and war zones) are liable to attract the attention of their host country's government and their armed forces.

Such criminal groups that also don't abide by Geneva Convention restrictions are liable to be labelled as terrorists, which will probably significantly affect their goals, which as criminals, is making money, not fighting for a particular ideology.

In any case, why do you need such special rounds? A standard FMJ kills people just as effectively as an over penetrating elemental enhanced bullet and has the additional benefit of being cheap, easily obtainable and not highly illegal.
They might have an anti-materiel use, but we've got large calibre weapons for that and it's frowned upon if they get used on personnel.

Pokonic
2011-09-25, 03:44 PM
In any case, why do you need such special rounds? A standard FMJ kills people just as effectively as an over penetrating elemental enhanced bullet and has the additional benefit of being cheap, easily obtainable and not highly illegal.

To get pass the rune-inscribed 3 inch thick steel golem battle suit of the guy in front of you, of course!:smalltongue:

drakir_nosslin
2011-09-25, 03:49 PM
I find it interesting that this thread deals almost exclusively with military 'creative' uses of magitek. Where's all the improvements of normal life?
Where's the life-extending pills, the garbage remover that shifts all stuff to the sun, the instant-teleport travel companies? Where's the 'exam-potions' which helps you to memorize an entire semester's worth of knowledge in an evening? Where's the new space-tech, the flying cars, the automated food-replicators, the 'companion-dolls' (oh, come on, you know that they'd pop up as soon as magic got widespread)... I could go on for a while, but I think you get my point.

Pokonic
2011-09-25, 04:05 PM
I find it interesting that this thread deals almost exclusively with military 'creative' uses of magitek. Where's all the improvements of normal life?
Where's the life-extending pills, the garbage remover that shifts all stuff to the sun, the instant-teleport travel companies? Where's the 'exam-potions' which helps you to memorize an entire semester's worth of knowledge in an evening? Where's the new space-tech, the flying cars, the automated food-replicators, the 'companion-dolls' (oh, come on, you know that they'd pop up as soon as magic got widespread)... I could go on for a while, but I think you get my point.

Mostly because it spun into a little talk about how silencers work, and that about the magical bullets. But no, your right. Automated windmills powered by weather-controling panals, flying cars/buses ( now Airbuses are literaly airbuses), GPS type handhelds that are not even physical, stuff like that. Even golems and other constucts are a way for companys to have super-heavy or risky labor( sulfer mining anyone?) done without risk to human life. Heck, people could live far longer with the many cure-all pills and suplaments that would come out, and who would not want a soda that stimulates just the right taste buds?

However, the cost to keep up a teliporter to the sun may be a bit much for the average taxpayer.:smalltongue:

Ravens_cry
2011-09-25, 04:08 PM
At home? How about solving the energy crisis, without nuclear power, without depleting Earth resources in any way?
With a no error teleportation spell and a cameraphone sending an image, paramedics could arrive near instantly. Even simply knowing the location and Google mapping the area would make things much, much, faster.
We could send a probe with a camera to Mars, the Moon, or anywhere else, and then teleport to that location. Much cheaper than a rocket. If we set up a base, we could teleport supplies.
And even when we need rockets, there is so many spells that would make manned space exploration easier, whether endless energy sources or logistics solvers.

jseah
2011-09-26, 07:58 AM
Roughly in order of chronology:
Materials
Materials that exceed single-wall carbon nanotubes in specific strength? We'll have a space elevator in no time.
Special mention goes to "Wall of Force". If magic can create an anchor point that can support an infinite amount of weight and never move relative to the local gravitational field, suddenly reactionless drives are possible in near-planet orbits.
- Oh and the space elevator is now a space skyscraper.
- And geostationary now has a totally new meaning. And is not an orbit at all.

Spacecraft radiation shielding and micrometeorite resistance goes through the roof. Manned expeditions aren't so dangerous and expensive.

Production of complex products is massively simplified by craft magic. We can pull materials out of thin air, do 100-step assemblies in under a second, transmute lead to gold.
Prices of electronics and low-material-but-hard-to-make things plummets. Expect to see computers cost about the same as a week's worth of hamburgers and be way more powerful than today's (due to heat resistance and small microchips)

Doing everything just got easier. You need less people to move things, do things, fix things. Prices of everything drops. (in real terms, inflation is not likely to go away however; your wage just went way up)
We produce far more for less effort.

Vote in a military nut for president? Even a 100 000 ton dreadnought in space wouldn't put a significant dent into the now quadrillion+ US GDP. Also, 100 000 tons is peanuts compared to the massively expanded manufactories.

The productivity jump of the industrial revolution will pale before the jump that will happen from getting magitech.

Energy
We break the 1st law of Thermodynamics (and the 2nd by consequence). Both ways. Energy from nowhere means global warming for a totally different reason... too much waste heat. Deleting energy is possible too, but why bother?

Seriously, once we have magic power plants that churn out 200 times the power of nuclear power plants and take zero input with zero risk, electricity anywhere there is a grid becomes ridiculously cheap.
Why turn off the lights/fan/airconditioner? It's not like you'll save much more than a few dollars a year doing that. Would you pay 10 dollars for complete climate control in your house all year round? I sure would.
Or maybe electricity supply would shift to a subscription model (to pay for maintenance of lines and the grid), then it doesn't matter how much you use.

Too much heat isn't a problem once the CO2 starts to drop from us not burning oil. And weather control means it doesn't affect us anyway.


Specific energy of our fuel is practically infinite (breaks 1st law). Space travel became ALOT easier with high delta-v rockets and basically magic torch drives can make an Earth-Mars run in a fortnight, and no launch windows. If teleportation doesn't just negate all of that. (eg. only transporting things that can fit in that teleport circle)

Also flying cars. With reactionless drives and near-instant acceleration to top speed, also alot safer (brake to 0 in <1 second, and no-g force).

Information
Illusions + computers make projection of real 3D CGI images possible. In the real world. The computer monitor is obsolete.
Together with insanely cheap electronics, Augmented Reality becomes pervasive and the gap between cyberspace and realspace becomes thinner. You can play WoW while walking down the street. Save Manhattan from the roving boss encounters cooperatively with whoever is also there. (or telepresence / teleports from elsewhere) Hop across the roofs of London (telepresence of course) and participate in a guild war!

Virtual Reality is not far behind.

Artificial Intelligence is given a massive boost by cheap server farms that can crunch whatever algorithm you feed it. And experimenting with novel computer designs is cheap, including building chips specifically made to mimic brain neurons or optimized for neural network programs.
This feeds into...

Knowledge
Divination, knowledge can now have a defined price tag. Pay for the spell, learn new things!
Research shoots through the roof, setting up a lab with specialized equipment and controlled environments is cheap. (thanks to improved manufacturing) Got a crackpot theory you want to test, why a fully kitted out bio-lab runs under $10 000 now (and average salaries top 100k per year)?

Dangerous experiments would probably be restricted by law to labs in space, but with rock-bottom launch costs (and even lower postage when the space skyscraper goes up) any self-respecting university can have one.

Once AI finally gets going (and with divination to point out mistakes and suggest new ways to try, it'll be alot faster), we hit the knowledge singularity.

After that... who knows?

Eldan
2011-09-26, 08:44 AM
Someone once suggested how to build a computer with the ability to predict the future and near-infinite computing power in D&D with some creative applications of yes/no divinations and contingent spells (if the answer to this is yes, do X, else do Y). If we can combine divinations with actual electronics, quantum computing, photon computers, near-infinite electricity or whatever else we want...

Yeah.

Also, who needs cooling fans. We can produce "cold energy". Literally a form of energy that makes things cooler. Pops up all over in fantasy.

jseah
2011-09-26, 09:39 AM
<...>
the ability to predict the future and near-infinite computing power in D&D with some creative applications of yes/no divinations
<...>
That was me and Doctor Rocktopus. It originated from a discussion on the WotC boards about how to make a rocket engine with magic that was powerful enough to push the moon out of orbit.

Yeah, we kinda got off topic. And yes, we did push the moon out of orbit.
And destroy the entire universe in a flash of infinite energy. (not really, but close)

byaku rai
2011-09-26, 12:48 PM
... Create Food and Water. No more world hunger ever, especially if you can bind it to a use-activated magic item.

Energy becomes limitless, which also makes it free. Conjuration magic allows us to produce infinitely superior materials from thin air, negating the need for resource drain on Earth as well as obliterating scarcity. Without scarcity as a driving force, economics no longer have any function. Money, and everything else, is literally worthless. With no need to fight over resources, massive cultural changes occur, possibly even resulting in a unified human race as we reach out from Terra and the Sol system and begin to conquer the galaxy.

Oh, and to the military magitek people: we have to assume that any advancements one side makes, the other side does as well.

Brother Oni
2011-09-26, 01:02 PM
All of this is assuming that magic is a renewable or infinite source however. :smalltongue:

Xondoure
2011-09-26, 01:43 PM
All of this is assuming that magic is a renewable or infinite source however. :smalltongue:

This. There's always a price, or at least there is in any decent story that knows anything about the world.

Frozen_Feet
2011-09-26, 09:33 PM
All of this is assuming that magic is a renewable or infinite source however. :smalltongue:

In addition to not destroying your immortal soul or letting loose world-destroying horrors.

Indeed, in one of my favorite RPG settings, there was a world-spanning culture of magi, with immortality and dimensional travel for everyone. Emphasis on "was": opening too many dimensional gates to too many different worlds at once caused the worlds to collapse on each other, rendering most of the world akin to the Zone from Stalker: a roadside picnic.

What's left of the inhabitable part was almost destroyed as soon by overpopulation and famine before remaining magi put a stop on immortality elixir.

irenicObserver
2011-09-27, 01:37 PM
I can't help but feel that enchanting sniper bullets is frankly overkill. If you've hit enough to deliver the elemental damage, toxin or so on you've pretty much already neutralised the target, really. Especially if you hit bone.

Now, whack some of that mojo on an easily concealed semi-automatic and you've got some real damage potential. Likewise, silencers just don't work in real life because even if you muffle the gun itself, the bullet breaking the speed barrier causes a lot of noise. Magic could fix that nicely, however.

Somehow using magic to redirect a portion of the equal and opposite force to increase stopping power. That's actually the first thing I should have said, redirecting forces to your needs, kid of like FMA Alchemy, but virtually undetectable since any light and sounds energy is also redirected to your ends.

Actually, the one and only end no matter the goal, Singularity building superstructures throughout the galaxy.