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Phosphate
2011-12-02, 04:01 PM
So, this is pretty much the reason why I'm doing this. I'm very much tired of shenanigans. I'm tired of characters with very high Diplomacy checks, I'm tired of teleporting straight into the king's room and decapitating him, I'm tired of enchanting leaders or shapeshifting as them to get an army basically for free. I feel this is an area of the game that can't be corrected by fixing individual abilities. Or banning specific strategies.

No, here we have to remove the root of the problem: the fact that Aristocrat is an unapologetically useless class :smallmad:. And as much as the approach of making people with high authority stronger is pretty unrealistic, it makes sense from a gameplay point of view. So, here's what I have in mind:

The High Noble

http://img.wallpaperstock.net:81/king-arthur-man-2-wallpapers_1248_1024.jpg"Strange as it may seem, Sir Samuel, I am occasionally capable of governing this city for minutes at a time without seeking your advice and guidance." - Lord Vetinari

While lowly royals do nothing but waste their time in petty fights and intrigue over who gets what inheritance, there are those members of nobility who actually have the power, training and influence to make a difference. Warlords, sires, dukes, kings, even emperors that are first in the heat of battle and last to return to their fortress have the honor of calling themselves High Nobles, rightful bearers of positions of command.

Background: High Nobles are grown in castle keeps, being given a vast education in the arts, sciences, history and weapons of the land, being erudite rulers with a keen tactical mind. Moreover, their experience in battle and with the intricate structures of international politics make them an invaluable catalyst both in times of peace and war.

Race: All races that embrace the system of monarchy have High Nobles.

Alignment: Any non-chaotic

Class Restrictions: You can only be a High Noble if your first character level is in this class. Also, a High Noble cannot multiclass, except as regulated by the Eccentricity feature.

Age: moderate
Gold: as fighter X 5

{table=head]Level | Base Attack Bonus | Fort Save | Ref Save | Will Save | Special
1st | +1 | +2 | +2 | +2 | Ruling Clause, Noble Allure, Savvy
2nd | +2 | +3 | +3 | +3 | Uncanny Dodge, Habitual Armor Wear
3rd | +3 | +3 | +3 | +3 | Eccentricity
4th | +4 | +4 | +4 | +4 | Bonus Feat
5th | +5 | +4 | +4 | +4 | Resolve, Leadership
6th | +6/+1 | +5 | +5 | +5 | -
7th | +7/+2 | +5 | +5 | +5 | Chain of Failed Assassinations, Multicultural Army
8th | +8/+3 | +6 | +6 | +6 | Bonus Feat
9th | +9/+4 | +6 | +6 | +6 | -
10th | +10/+5 | +7 | +7 | +7 | Sublime General, Rallying Cry
11th | +11/+6/+1 | +7 | +7 | +7 | For King and Country, Unflinching
12th | +12/+7/+2 | +8 | +8 | +8 | Bonus Feat
13th | +13/+8/+3 | +8 | +8 | +8 | Divine Right to Rule, Frightful Presence
14th | +14/+9/+4 | +9 | +9 | +9 | Primal Devotion, Retribute
15th | +15/+10/+5 | +9 | +9 | +9 | -
16th | +16/+11/+6/+1 | +10 | +10 | +10 | Bonus Feat
17th | +17/+12/+7/+2 | +10 | +10 | +10 | Inherited Mystery
18th | +18/+13/+8/+3 | +11 | +11 | +11 | -
19th | +19/+14/+9/+4 | +11 | +11 | +11 | Legendary General
20th | +20/+15/+10/+5 | +12 | +12 | +12 | Bonus Feat
[/table]

Class Features

Hit Dice: d10
Skill Points: 6+int mod (x4 at first level)
Class Skills: Appraise (Int), Bluff (Cha), Diplomacy (Cha), Disguise (Cha), Forgery (Int), Gather Information (Cha), Handle Animal (Cha), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (all skills taken individually) (Int), Listen (Wis), Perform (Cha), Ride (Dex), Sense Motive (Wis), Speak Language (None), Spot (Wis), Swim (Str), and Survival (Wis)

Weapon and Armor Proficiencies: The High Noble is proficient with all simple and martial weapons, and one exotic weapon of his choice; all armors, and all shields.


Ruling Clause: The High Noble must be in a position of active authority. If he steps down from position willingly (magical manipulation doesn't count), he automatically loses all class features (except for BAB, saves, and proficiencies) until he returns to his position.

Noble Allure: Naturally distinguished, a High Noble treats all his ability scores as 2 points higher for the purpose of meeting feat prerequisites.

Savvy: A High Noble is constantly aware of his own intentions and interest. Anyone using a Diplomacy check on him takes a penalty equal to class level/3 (minimum 1).

Uncanny Dodge (Ex): At 2nd level, a High Noble retains his Dexterity bonus to AC (if any) even if he is caught flat-footed or struck by an invisible attacker. However, he still loses his Dexterity bonus to AC if immobilized. If a High Noble already has uncanny dodge from a different class, he automatically gains improved uncanny dodge instead.

Habitual Armor Wear (Ex): A High Noble is so much used with wearing restrictive armor that the max dex to AC of his armors is treated as higher by 2.

Eccentricity: Due to most of his time being occupied by ruling matters, a High Noble cannot multiclass normally. Instead, at level 3 and every 3 levels thereafter, while gaining a level in this class he also gains a level in another class (his ECL is still treated as increasing only by 1). He gains all the benefits of the level gained in the other class, except for the saves progression, BaB and hit dice: those are all still taken from the High Noble table.

Bonus Feat: At levels 4, 8, 12, 16, and 20, a High Noble may gain a bonus feat. This feat must be a General feat, and the High Noble must meet all the prerequisites. If he chooses to spend it on a Fighter Bonus Feat, he may also choose to gain a(n) Exotic Weapon Proficiency, Rapid Reload, Improved Critical, Weapon Focus, Weapon Specialization, Greater Weapon Focus or Greater Weapon Specialization. A High Noble is treated as a fighter of his level for the purpose of meeting the prerequisites for these feats.

Resolve (Ex): A High Noble adds his Cha mod to his Sense Motive checks and Will saves, but only when saving against mind-affecting effects.

Leadership: A level 5 High Noble gains Leadership as a bonus feat.

Chain of Failed Assassinations (Ex): A level 7 High Noble has been through enough failed assassinations to know what to expect from his assailants. He gains the Alertness feat and becomes immune to poison.

Multicultural Army (Ex): A level 7 High Noble ignores all alignment restrictions of Leadership.

Sublime General: A level 10 High Noble is such distinguished a general that he gets double the number of followers from Leadership, and a +2 permanent gain to Wisdom.

Rallying Cry: Exciting his troops in battle as a full round action, a High Noble can make all followers within 300 feet of himself gain his cha modifier to all saves for 5 rounds.

For King and Country: Fearless in battle, if a High Noble would be frightened or panicked, he becomes shaken for twice as many rounds instead.

Unflinching (Ex): A level 11 High Noble knows how to stand his ground, and is treated as one size larger for the purpose of resisting bull rushes, overruns and trips.

Divine Right to Rule (Su): A High Noble of high enough importance is eventually recognized as such by the outer planes. He is treated as being under the constant effects of Protection from Good, Protection from Evil, Protection from Law and Protection from Chaos. If those are dispelled on him, they take 24 hours to return. Otherwise, they can be suppressed and reactivated as a swift action.

Frightful Presence (Ex): Every time a High Noble charges or kills an opponent, creatures within 60 feet that are not under his command must make a will save against a DC of 10+class level/2+Cha mod. If they succeed, they may not be affected by Frightful Presence for 24 hours. If they fail, they are shaken for 5d6 rounds. If a High Noble makes a successful Intimidate check against such a creature, it becomes Panicked instead for the remainder of the duration.

Primal Devotion: Regardless of the magic they are subjected to, a High Noble's followers can never attack him directly.

Retribute (Ex): This ability can be used once per encounter. When performing a ranged or melee physical attack against an opponent, the damage is multiplied by the number of followers that opponent killed in that particular encounter.

Inherited Mystery: At level 17, a High Noble receives a well kept secret of his family. He may gain any one of the abilities below:



Long Live the King (Su): The High Noble stops aging and becomes immune to disease.

Blood of Legends (Ex): The High Noble gains Fast Healing 5.

Extreme Darwinism (Ex): The High Noble is immune to critical hits and sneak attacks.

Ward of Security (Su): Teleporting within 1 mile of the High Noble becomes impossible.

Fate Defier (Su): The High Noble cannot be scryed and divination predictions completely ignore his very existence.

Knowledge of Solomon: The High Noble can use Augury at will as a spell-like ability.

Greatness of the Goa'uld (Psi): A High Noble can use True Mind Switch as a psion of his level, without paying any power points (he must still pay the XP cost).

Deadspeak: A High Noble can see and have conversations with ghosts in the ethereal plane. This does not, however, allow him to see ethereal or invisible living things.

Legendary General: A level 19 High Noble gets quadruple the number of followers from Leadership, and a further +2 gain to Wisdom.

legomaster00156
2011-12-02, 06:10 PM
1. The King Arthur pic was an awesome choice.
2. This is actually stronger than several PC classes (probably Tier 3), and I can imagine a few PC's playing rebellious nobles who fled for a life of adventuring. If I may, I recommend the following requisite: "The High Noble must be in a position of active authority. If he steps down from position willingly (magical manipulation doesn't count), he automatically loses all class features (except for BAB, saves, and proficiencies) until he returns to his position."

arguskos
2011-12-02, 06:25 PM
Hell, just fill in those dead levels (and yes, any level with only a bonus feat is a dead level) and call this a PC class. I think there's some solid potential here.

Eccentricity would need to go away though.

Grod_The_Giant
2011-12-02, 10:43 PM
I appreciate all the work you've done here, but I can't help but feeling like this is going about things the wrong way. If you want powerful nobles, it's quite simple to just give them ranks in PC classes-- with full PC gold, even, if you really want. Otherwise, it makes sense for them to be physically weak. Look at it this way: the warrior king is a warblade, or a marshal, maybe. The sage-like king has wizard levels. And so on.

For generic rulers, they don't need to be physically powerful- they can hire those who are. They'll have house wizards who dimension lock their throne rooms and private chambers and keep them constantly supplied with buffs. They'll have high-ranking guards at all times. They'll have the best defensive magic items. Don't stick with level-appropriate gear or encounters-- if level 6 players strike out on their own and try to kill the king, have them run into a dozen level 10 fighters. If a level 10 party goes after the king, stop them with his level 16 wizard chancellor, accompanied by the same fighters. If a level 15 party goes after the king... they probably should be able to take him out, because they're some of the strongest people in the game world.

And if, by some miracle, a lower-level party does take over the kingdom, using clever tactics to overcome the heavy protections that any rich noble will naturally accumulate... they probably earned the accomplishment, and will be telling the story for years.

Now, as for this class... it's very strong. Easily tier 3, and in the worst way (diplomacy cheese, leadership cheese). Worse, it's dip-friendly. Even though you limit characters to taking it at first level, dipping for the first four levels gives you:
The second-best hit die
Full BAB
All good saves
One exotic weapon
A huge bonus to max dexterity in armor
Easy qualification for feats
One or two bonus feats
All the class features of a level from another class, but with a far better chassis.

After that, it's pretty much ok, apart from all the leadership cheese. Please, I beg you-- remove it. Only players need to spend a feat to get minions; the DM just assigns them to NPCs as he sees fit. When players do get minions... it's not pretty. Even if not from a balance point of view, having a few dozen followers will slow their turn to a crawl.

Moribundus
2011-12-03, 03:03 AM
--


I disagree. If you read the title/text, you will see that it is an NPC class, and therefore not generally playable by PCs. I think despite the fact that it is incredibly strong. . .and in some interesting ways, that is exactly the point. If I had to fight a king, I don't want him to be some sort of pushover -- keep the high level guards and wizards. . . just top it off with one of these BAMF's.

Phosphate
2011-12-03, 09:47 AM
1. The King Arthur pic was an awesome choice.

I know, and I thought it nicely complemented the Vetinari quote. I like those two because each has qualities that the other lacks: Arthur is fearless and honorable, while Vetinari is a genius in the modern sense of the word and very open to change.


2. This is actually stronger than several PC classes (probably Tier 3), and I can imagine a few PC's playing rebellious nobles who fled for a life of adventuring. If I may, I recommend the following requisite: "The High Noble must be in a position of active authority. If he steps down from position willingly (magical manipulation doesn't count), he automatically loses all class features (except for BAB, saves, and proficiencies) until he returns to his position."

Rebellious noble fleeing for a life of adventuring =/= non-chaotic alignment. Although your requisite is a very good idea and I'll borrow it, thank you very much.


Hell, just fill in those dead levels (and yes, any level with only a bonus feat is a dead level) and call this a PC class. I think there's some solid potential here.

Eccentricity would need to go away though.

The dead levels are self-filling, that's the whole concept of the class. Also, I am not making this an NPC class because I'm bad at making PC classes, I am making this as an NPC class because I want it for NPCs only.


I appreciate all the work you've done here, but I can't help but feeling like this is going about things the wrong way. If you want powerful nobles, it's quite simple to just give them ranks in PC classes-- with full PC gold, even, if you really want. Otherwise, it makes sense for them to be physically weak. Look at it this way: the warrior king is a warblade, or a marshal, maybe. The sage-like king has wizard levels. And so on.

The point I am making - is that kings wouldn't have the time to advance in several classes that an adventurer has, so he technically shouldn't be able to do as you suggested. And, as I said, realism is not my goal. Realistically, it makes no sense for a real life aristocrat to have better BaB and twice as much health as a commoner who works for a lifetime, so is it so bad to take it further?


For generic rulers, they don't need to be physically powerful- they can hire those who are. They'll have house wizards who dimension lock their throne rooms and private chambers and keep them constantly supplied with buffs. They'll have high-ranking guards at all times. They'll have the best defensive magic items. Don't stick with level-appropriate gear or encounters-- if level 6 players strike out on their own and try to kill the king, have them run into a dozen level 10 fighters. If a level 10 party goes after the king, stop them with his level 16 wizard chancellor, accompanied by the same fighters. If a level 15 party goes after the king... they probably should be able to take him out, because they're some of the strongest people in the game world.

Servants can be captured. Taken out one by one. Or they can even betray the big man. Point is, with enough screwing around you get to an alleged "final battle" that lasts 1 hit. I don't want that. Sure, not all of nobility should be High Nobles, but a couple ought to be. Those that are not, well yeah, they can rely solely on others. But are you saying that ALL kings should be physically inept? Because this is not a class I want to see replace all aristocrats, just some really important and active ones, like Arthur.


Worse, it's dip-friendly...

Ok, I admit I should have been more adamant in this respect. HIGH NOBLES CANNOT MULTICLASS AT ALL. I thought Eccentricity explained that rather well. But yeah, I better just state it plainly at the top of the class.