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View Full Version : I Forgive You! (3.5 Spell, PEACH)



NeoSeraphi
2011-12-18, 08:59 PM
Seraphi Homebrew(TM)

This is the result of what happens when I buy a new video game. In this case, Dante's Inferno. As always, the title of the thread is what one of my characters would shout out as he executed the spell/maneuver/feat.

Absolution
Evocation [Good]
Level - Pal 2
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Components: V, S, DF
Range: Touch
Target: One undead creature touched
Duration: Instantaneous
Saving Throw: Will Negates
Spell Resistance: Yes

This spell generally only works on mindless undead. If you attempt to cast it on an intelligent undead, the intelligent undead is treated as if it rolled a natural 20 on its saving throw, unless it chooses to voluntarily fail its saving throw. In such an event, the intelligent undead is affected normally.

Your hand glows with the aura of divine light. As you touch the creature with one hand and present your holy symbol with the other, the dark magic that bound the poor soul to its lifeless shell is shattered, and the soul itself is forgiven of all its sins that it committed while it was undead, and allowed to pass on to the next world.

An intelligent undead creature who voluntarily submits to this spell is instead absolved of all its sins, whether it committed them alive or after death, as if it had received the Redemption effect of the atonement spell, and is then destroyed. (However, it must truly wish to repent, as described in the text of the atonement spell)

The undead you touch must make a Will saving throw or be instantly destroyed, as if you had successfully turned it while your paladin level was more than twice its HD. Turn resistance does not assist the creature with its saving throw, although if the creature has somehow gained immunity to being turned, it is immune to the effects of this spell.

The Tygre
2011-12-18, 09:20 PM
D-Dante's Inferno material?

From the video game which I thought I was the only person that liked?

...

Are you ready? You need to get ready. I want you ready for this. Because you're about to be the victim of

http://www.positive-focus.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=5860&g2_GALLERYSID=TMP_SESSION_ID_DI_NOISSES_PMT

NeoSeraphi
2011-12-18, 09:24 PM
Why thank you, The Tygre. :smallbiggrin: Yes, I am enjoying Dante's Inferno very much so far, especially since I discovered how much fun it is to Absolve. I grab people and I yell (IRL) I FORGIVE YOU and they bathe in the light of my forgiveness and my forgiveness is so absolving that they just...break. It's great. :smallbiggrin:

Still, as I was doing all this I stopped and thought "Man, why can't paladins be this epic?"

And then I rushed to the internet.

And here we are.

Cipherthe3vil
2011-12-18, 09:39 PM
Then we're all together here, Dante's Inferno amused me for hours on end sometime ago, back when I still had a decent gaming system.


Shameless linking: >Tendersoul and Pureheart variant (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=11283217#post11283217)<

wiimanclassic
2011-12-18, 10:05 PM
Might want to make it so its absolved of sins WHILE undead. Otherwise some extremely evil guy could make himself undead and find some paladin to absolve him.

The way its worded now you could murder and entire country and then convince some paladin to absolve you (sob story along lines of "eviler guy controlled me, please absolve me so he can't abuse me again blah blah blah") and depending on setting cosmology get into a heaven of some kind, if the afterlife isn't alignment based anyway.

NeoSeraphi
2011-12-18, 10:07 PM
Might want to make it so its absolved of sins WHILE undead. Otherwise some extremely evil guy could make himself undead and find some paladin to absolve him.

The way its worded now you could murder and entire country and then convince some paladin to absolve you (sob story along lines of "eviler guy controlled me, please absolve me so he can't abuse me again blah blah blah") and depending on setting cosmology get into a heaven of some kind, if the afterlife isn't alignment based anyway.

That's some difficult wording there, but I'll give it a shot.

bloodtide
2011-12-18, 10:34 PM
1.Flavor wise this should be more a cleric spell. A cleric does things like confessions and abslotions. The paladin holy warrior does not fit well. The idea of the paladin putting away his weapon and touching an undead?

2.Mechanically the spell does not look even slightly useful. The paladin can use a 2nd level spell to get rid of a mindless undead like a skeleton or a zombie? Or the paladin could save a spell slot and just hack at it with his sword? What is the up side? A 10th level paladin can hack a human skeleton to pieces with one sword hit or cast this spell and do it?

3.flavor wise again, this spell forgives acts the undead did while undead...ok, but what about the evil it might have done to become undead? That does not get forgiven?

NeoSeraphi
2011-12-18, 10:39 PM
1.Flavor wise this should be more a cleric spell. A cleric does things like confessions and abslotions. The paladin holy warrior does not fit well. The idea of the paladin putting away his weapon and touching an undead?

Clerics get atonement and paladins don't. Besides, a cleric may be able to deal with confessions and absolutions, but "The Power of Christ Compels You" = turn to dust is much more paladinlike, in my opinion.



2.Mechanically the spell does not look even slightly useful. The paladin can use a 2nd level spell to get rid of a mindless undead like a skeleton or a zombie? Or the paladin could save a spell slot and just hack at it with his sword? What is the up side? A 10th level paladin can hack a human skeleton to pieces with one sword hit or cast this spell and do it?


Let's see...how about when a paladin is completely disarmed? Paladins have a terrible spell list for dealing with a lack of weaponry. All other casters (save rangers) have ways of using their spells to augment their natural offense. Paladins only use it to augment their melee capacity, which is not versatile enough.



3.flavor wise again, this spell forgives acts the undead did while undead...ok, but what about the evil it might have done to become undead? That does not get forgiven?

If the undead is mindless, it was not changed of its own will. (Skeletons and zombies are reanimated against their will). If it is intelligent, it is atoned. So yes, it is forgiven for the evil it practiced to become undead.

Steward
2011-12-18, 11:56 PM
Clerics get atonement and paladins don't. Besides, a cleric may be able to deal with confessions and absolutions, but "The Power of Christ Compels You" = turn to dust is much more paladinlike, in my opinion.

That's true, and besides -- Paladins get quasi-judicial spells like Mark of Justice (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/markOfJustice.htm) or Zone of Truth (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/zoneOfTruth.htm), so this seems thematically appropriate just on that level.

I like this spell -- it mixes power with compassion. Unintelligent undead servants deserve to return to rest.

(Here's a thought -- what happens if some enterprising necromancer creates an evil version of the spell. "Damn you!!" that condemns a Deathless creature and sends it to the Lower Planes? Thank goodness the forces of evil don't have good homebrewing skills! (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/3.5e_Homebrew))

NeoSeraphi
2011-12-19, 03:46 AM
I like this spell -- it mixes power with compassion. Unintelligent undead servants deserve to return to rest.


Why thank you. I personally thought it was both a merciful and flavorful way for a paladin to deal with undead, as well as to feel like he was actually turning something.

dspeyer
2011-12-19, 11:17 AM
No limits on the power of the creature or on the power of the necromancer who raised it? If an epic necromancer animates the skeleton of a great wyrm dragon, an 8th level paladin (or 3rd level archivist) can reverse that with one spell? That seems overpowered.

Yitzi
2011-12-19, 12:20 PM
(Here's a thought -- what happens if some enterprising necromancer creates an evil version of the spell. "Damn you!!" that condemns a Deathless creature and sends it to the Lower Planes?

Doing it against the creature's will (and I don't think there are any mindless Deathless) would probably need an epic spell; the reason this is only level 2 is that it can't affect a non-mindless creature unless it chooses to fail its save.

Fiery Diamond
2011-12-19, 12:32 PM
No limits on the power of the creature or on the power of the necromancer who raised it? If an epic necromancer animates the skeleton of a great wyrm dragon, an 8th level paladin (or 3rd level archivist) can reverse that with one spell? That seems overpowered.

And here someone else was just complaining about it not being powerful enough. I'm amused. Also, Will Save. If a Great Wyrm Skeleton manages to fail its Will Save to a 2nd level spell, it deserves whatever it has coming to it. And as was pointed out above, the paladin has to get close enough to touch the thing. If an eighth level paladin manages to do that to a Great Wyrm Skeleton AND the Great Wyrm fails the save, I'd be truly impressed.

Zaydos
2011-12-19, 01:33 PM
It's a divine touch range save or die.

Compare Slay Living (PHB); Lv 5, death effect, deals mild damage on a failed save.

This is undead only (-0 to -1 level), mindless undead only (coupled with undead only let's say an easy -2), no penalty on a failed save (-0.5), paladin exclusive (-0 to -1 so -0.5). I'd say the level is about right.

Or compare to Rigor Mortis (from one of the undead books) which is a 2nd level touch range save or lose; all they have to do is coup de grace you afterwards.

So yeah I'd say it's not too strong.

Siosilvar
2011-12-19, 03:20 PM
Thank goodness the forces of evil don't have good homebrewing skills! (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/3.5e_Homebrew))

That had better be sarcasm, because D&D Wiki is pretty much the definition of "forces of evil". :smallwink:

TuggyNE
2011-12-19, 03:27 PM
That had better be sarcasm, because D&D Wiki is pretty much the definition of "forces of evil". :smallwink:

I think his point was that D&D Wiki is pretty much exactly not the definition of "good homebrewing skills". :smallbiggrin:

NeoSeraphi
2011-12-19, 03:54 PM
No limits on the power of the creature or on the power of the necromancer who raised it? If an epic necromancer animates the skeleton of a great wyrm dragon, an 8th level paladin (or 3rd level archivist) can reverse that with one spell? That seems overpowered.

If a great wyrm dragon has failed a DC 12+Wis Will save, it rolled a natural one (which represents a surge in power on the paladin's part, or the intervention of fate, or something).

Plus, what I believe you're failing to take into account is divine magic is divine. The paladin gains this power from the gods themselves.

I honestly don't see the problem with this, since the DC is so low.