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View Full Version : Great Cities Defenders: The Doctor vs. Spiderman vs. Godzilla



Urpriest
2011-12-19, 01:50 PM
According to the Global Cities Index (http://www.foreignpolicy.com/node/373401), the three cities with the greatest influence on the world are New York, London, and Tokyo. Each of these cities has an iconic protector, an individual created by that country's media that has been depicted as saving their host city time and time again. What if these iconic protectors were to do battle?

Our contestants:

Spiderman:
http://beinglatino.files.wordpress.com/2011/01/spiderman.gif

A plucky kid from the Big Apple, Peter Parker was bitten by a radioactive spider and gained the spider's proportional strength and agility. Able to sling webs for a variety of purposes, Spiderman has saved his home city from countless dangers, including some at cosmic levels of power.

Allies: Not sure who would be appropriate for this. Could someone more familiar with Spiderman comment?

The Doctor:
http://www.nationalconfidential.com/images/2011/11/matt-smith-doctor-who-pond.jpg

A Time Lord from the destroyed planet of Gallifrey, The Doctor (as he is known) has adopted Earth, and in particular London, as his new home. Able to travel through time and space in his TARDIS and possessed of both boundless ingenuity and the multipurpose sonic screwdriver, the Doctor has saved London from utter annihilation by alien powers countless times.

Allies: The Doctor is almost always accompanied by a brave human companion, plucked from the greater London area to travel with him through time and space. For the purposes of this competition the Doctor may have any one mundane human companion from any point in the series. The TARDIS itself is somewhat alive and has its own opinions, and will count as the Doctor's second ally.

Godzilla:
http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/godzilla.jpg

Godzilla, a mutated monster awakened by the nuclear sins of the modern era, was once content to stomp Tokyo to the ground. However, he later grew to be the city's most potent defender, protecting it from incursions by aliens, monsters, and robots and becoming a hero of the Japanese people. In addition to Godzilla's massive size, he is possessed of immense regenerative abilities and can breathe radioactive fire.

Allies: A leader among Kaiju, Godzilla brings the lesser monsters ankylosaurlike Anguirus and pterodactyline Rodan.


The Situation:
Due to some radioactive time and space related accident, London, New York, and Tokyo have been transported into the center of a dark and empty void, mashed together near their respective city centers. In the middle of the three cities an empty glowing skyscraper rises with three peaks, each facing one city. Destroying the peak facing a given city or disabling a device in the skyscraper's basement returns that city to its proper place, while making it much more difficult to destroy the other two peaks. Each hero is aware of this, and believes it in the best interests of all involved that his city be saved first.

What do you guys think? Is this a fair matchup? Who wins, and how do they win?

Edit: Added an additional win condition to make things a bit more fair for the Doctor.

Eldan
2011-12-19, 01:53 PM
Can the Doctor have as his companion a) someone with a high military rank, b) impressive combat skills, c) from the far future or d) immortal and indestructible?

Because that would change a lot. You did mention London Area, though, so I guess you meant one of his more normal companions.

Chen
2011-12-19, 01:57 PM
How difficult to destroy are the peaks? Spiderman probably gets there fastest, but Godzilla seems to have the easiest time to destroy them. The Doctor seems like he'd be too slow in this contest.

Gullintanni
2011-12-19, 01:59 PM
In terms of allies, Spider-man probably has an edge here. He's a member of the New Avengers, whose roster includes but is not limited to Wolverine, Iron Man and Captain America.

Urpriest
2011-12-19, 02:00 PM
Can the Doctor have as his companion a) someone with a high military rank, b) impressive combat skills, c) from the far future or d) immortal and indestructible?

Because that would change a lot. You did mention London Area, though, so I guess you meant one of his more normal companions.

Yeah, let's have the companion not be Captain Jack Harkness. One of the more normal companions is preferable, though it can be later in their tenure when they've picked up a few tricks. Basically, Martha while wandering the Earth opposing the Master is reasonable, Rose as Bad Wolf is not.

Edit: For Spiderman, the big-name Avengers are no-go for allies, as we shouldn't have someone who might overshadow him. Maybe a lesser known Avenger would be appropriate. Basically, look at who we're giving Godzilla: Anguirus and Rodan are formidable, but almost nobody watches the movies that just star them. They're secondary characters.

As for how difficult the towers are to destroy, let's say about as easy to destroy as an ordinary NY skyscraper. We want to incentivize the various characters to oppose eachother and not spend all their resources trying to find a way to destroy the things.

Zaydos
2011-12-19, 02:04 PM
I find it interesting that all three of these characters have had comic book lines published by Marvel.

Honestly in great comic book tradition I'd see Spidey and the Doctor teaming up and finding a way to manipulate Godzilla into destroying all three towers at once.

If cooperation is somehow made impossible I'd say that the Doctor or Spidey would win by tricking Godzilla into destroying their tower. My money would favor Spidey a little since he can quite easily enrage things into mindlessly trying to destroy him and often tricks them into blowing things up while trying to hit him (the same can be said for the Doctor but Spidey is faster which is the tie-breaker in my mind).

Also for allies for Spidey: Black Cat, Doctor Conners (when he's not the Lizard), Johnny Storm (they used to team up sometimes), Ice-Man and Firestar, Daredevil, one of the Avengers, one of the X-Men.

Eldan
2011-12-19, 02:13 PM
Yeah, let's have the companion not be Captain Jack Harkness. One of the more normal companions is preferable, though it can be later in their tenure when they've picked up a few tricks. Basically, Martha while wandering the Earth opposing the Master is reasonable, Rose as Bad Wolf is not.

That's the new series, however. If we look into the old, he had companions from all over time and space. But right. He gets John McNormal, the London office worker, not Romana, Centurion Rory, the Brigadier, Leela or Jack Harkness.

Thing is destroying a sky scraper seems to massively favour godzilla. It doesn't seem to be the Doctor's Approach to the Situation: he would probably rather prefer to find out who did it and why.

Urpriest
2011-12-19, 02:20 PM
That's the new series, however. If we look into the old, he had companions from all over time and space. But right. He gets John McNormal, the London office worker, not Romana, Centurion Rory, the Brigadier, Leela or Jack Harkness.

Thing is destroying a sky scraper seems to massively favour godzilla. It doesn't seem to be the Doctor's Approach to the Situation: he would probably rather prefer to find out who did it and why.

There aren't that many things Godzilla can do, though. And destroying a skyscraper is at least possible for the Doc&Spidey even without getting Godzilla to do it for them, via various forms of technological trickery.

If we really need to make it easier, assume that there's a device in the basement of each skyscraper that is holding the city in place. Getting there will also let the Doctor figure out who caused it, but he knows he'll have a lot more trouble doing if it Godzilla destroys one of the towers. I'll update the starting post with the change.

Thane of Fife
2011-12-19, 09:08 PM
If I may quote Wikipedia:


In Godzilla vs. Megaguirus Godzilla's ray was shown as having incendiary properties and was strong enough to destroy an artificial miniature black hole, while in Godzilla: Final Wars it possessed incredible range, power and pin-point accuracy, able to hit a target in outer space and kill most kaiju with a single shot. In a memorable (and somewhat infamous) scene in Godzilla vs. Hedorah, Godzilla even used his ray to fly by aiming it at the ground and lifting off like a rocket. His ray can also power electrodes, melt steel and rock and evaporate water instantly.

Given that Godzilla can apparently hit things in space, and his breath is strong enough to melt steel, I don't see how he can possibly lose this. He should be able to just blast Tokyo's peak right off the starting bell.

Even without that kind of range, I'd still expect Godzilla to get into range to unleash his breath before Spidey can make it in, and certainly before the Doctor.

Dr.Epic
2011-12-19, 09:33 PM
Spiderman:
http://beinglatino.files.wordpress.com/2011/01/spiderman.gif

A plucky kid from the Big Apple, Peter Parker was bitten by a radioactive spider and gained the spider's proportional strength and agility. Able to sling webs for a variety of purposes, Spiderman has saved his home city from countless dangers, including some at cosmic levels of power.

Allies: Not sure who would be appropriate for this. Could someone more familiar with Spiderman comment?

You're not sure about allies!? You have the entire list of Marvel super heroes to choose from. How about all the Marvel superheroes that live in New York:

-Fantastic Four
-Dare Devil
-the Punisher
-Is Xavier's school located in New York? I'm pretty sure it's somewhere near there in the country, but can't exactly remember.

Venom3053000
2011-12-19, 09:41 PM
the Xmen live in Westchester County which is in New York

Dr.Epic
2011-12-19, 09:42 PM
Wait, if we're using New York, why can't we use these guys (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDDHHrt6l4w&ob=av3e)?:smallwink:

Urpriest
2011-12-19, 11:33 PM
You're not sure about allies!? You have the entire list of Marvel super heroes to choose from. How about all the Marvel superheroes that live in New York:

-Fantastic Four
-Dare Devil
-the Punisher
-Is Xavier's school located in New York? I'm pretty sure it's somewhere near there in the country, but can't exactly remember.

Like I said earlier, I'd rather not have people who could potentially overshadow Spidey. So Daredevil is probably ok, but not the Fantastic Four or Wolverine.

dgnslyr
2011-12-19, 11:47 PM
All this talk of these three heroes makes me imagine some kind of alternate reality where they team up to fight crime. There's the action elements of them beating up bad guys, and then the sitcom elements where they get into all sorts of shenanigans on Mt. New TARDIS.

"Spidey, did you finish the milk?"
"That was Godzilla, I swear!"
ROAR (IT WASN'T ME, I TELL YOU)
somehow I feel this joke could have been funnier, but I can't figure out a better way to tell it.

Mando Knight
2011-12-20, 12:52 AM
Like I said earlier, I'd rather not have people who could potentially overshadow Spidey. So Daredevil is probably ok, but not the Fantastic Four or Wolverine.

Though Spider-Man is one of the more popular Marvel heroes and constantly proves his mettle against threats bigger than him, he's still a small fry compared to the other heroes who frequent New York and the two characters he's matched up against. He's fought cosmic-level threats before, yes, but unless he has serious backup he usually just annoys them to death. Spidey's more of a street-level hero.

Diskhotep
2011-12-20, 01:26 AM
I'll bite on this one.

I'm going to have to go with Godzilla on this one, for sheer destructive power and range. Since there is no stipulation that the peaks are immune to his radioactive breath, he can begin blasting it as soon as he sees it, all the while walking toward it until he is close enough to give it that final push (if that's even necessary). Being a giant monster on a rampage, he doesn't even have to know there's a contest going on - the biggest building in the center is going to attract him like Mothra to a flame. His kaiju buddies may help score the assist, but the King of the Monsters can win this all on his own.

The Doctor is in my opinion not well suited for a matchup such as this, nor is Spider-man (especially with the stipulation that his superheroic allies must be comparable in power level). While each has the scientific intelligence to disable the device (and I assume they know it exists to make that condition a fair one), they have to get to the building and find it - all the while avoiding Godzilla's massive blasts of radioactive fire.

Ah -- but the Doctor has the TARDIS, right? Unless he knows precisely where and when he needs to go, he will have to take his typical pot luck in arrival time and location. Judging by every episode I've ever seen, that means he'll arrive in the middle of Godzilla's attack, and either materialize somewhere nearby in a very dangerous location, or deep within the headquarters of the masterminds. My prediction is that he would let Godzilla destroy the first peak (technically winning the challenge), while using the distraction to foil the master plan and save the remaining two cities (either deactivating the MacGuffin in the basement or stopping the masterminds from completing this bizarre plot. In any case, while he may firmly believe that London should be saved first, I think that he would as usual make the harder decision and work for the goal that saves everyone. Note that this attitude does not extend to rescuing individuals unless they are standing nearby or he knows them personally, so for everyone's sake I hope this isn't a season finale or multipart episode.

I love Spider-man, but despite his powers I feel that he is the least suited for this task. While his amazing strength and agility will help, I don't feel they will suffice to disable the peaks, especially while they are under a massive kaiju bombardment. He is a super-scientist as well, so he could disable the device - however he has to first get to it and find it. Some of this could be made easier by his choice of allies, but if we are sticking with ones at a comparable level of power, I'm not sure who he would choose to help. Daredevil? Might be able to locate the device if it broadcast on some ultrasonic frequency or something. Based off the cartoons I grew up with, it's probably his Amazing Spider-Friends Iceman and Firestar. But the biggest thing to consider is Spider-man's compassion. Godzilla cares nothing for the antlike humans screaming at his feet and doesn't know the meaning of "collateral damage". The Doctor lives in the bigger picture, and knows that as far as time and space are concerned fixing the event is much more important than the lives of all those involved. Spider-man, on the other hand, will find it almost impossible to resist taking a little time to rescue those in the path of destruction, which will slow him down.

I just don't think this is a fair matchup, as the contestant's power levels are so varied, as are the genres they are representing. But I'll play along anyway, just to be a good sport. :smalltongue:

My overall prediction is that Godzilla wins the challenge as written, destroying all three peaks (because let's face it, he's not going to turn around and go home while there's still stuff to break). But the overall contest is going to be rendered moot, with the Doctor foiling the plot and bringing the villains to justice (i.e., they refuse to quit and die by their own devices), and Spider-man and friends rescuing those in danger of kaiju assault.

paddyfool
2011-12-20, 07:51 AM
Good answer, Diskhotep. I think that does cover a pretty likely outcome to this scenario. However, I'd like to suggest that Spiderman ends up in Tokyo due to the direction his rescue mission takes him in (seeing as he's the sort to swing towards the rampaging giant atomic lizard monster). And that after a brief spell of "wtf do I do now?", some further rescue missions from the wreckage, a scrap with some yakuza etc., he hitches a lift home on the TARDIS, via some further adventure or other with the Doctor.

Traab
2011-12-20, 09:05 AM
Team up spiderman with punisher. Punisher has the goods to level a building, spiderman has the intellect to set us up the bomb. And unless we go with godzilla and his limitless range ultimate attack beam that lets him insta win at the start, I think spiderman could get there faster. He can move pretty damn fast while web slinging. I dont know much about the doctor, but he has a freaking time machine. He gets the location of the pillar, then travels back in time a few hours before the event happens and lands next to it. The moment the event occurs, he plants his bomb, and leaves. Kaboom.

Urpriest
2011-12-20, 12:09 PM
Team up spiderman with punisher. Punisher has the goods to level a building, spiderman has the intellect to set us up the bomb. And unless we go with godzilla and his limitless range ultimate attack beam that lets him insta win at the start, I think spiderman could get there faster. He can move pretty damn fast while web slinging. I dont know much about the doctor, but he has a freaking time machine. He gets the location of the pillar, then travels back in time a few hours before the event happens and lands next to it. The moment the event occurs, he plants his bomb, and leaves. Kaboom.

The Doctor's time machine is explicitly limited by plot, unfortunately. Once he's landed in a given mess he can't just travel back a few hours and fix it (he's been asked to do so point-blank in several episodes and said it was impossible).

That said, the TARDIS can also fly through the air and/or teleport, and that is something he can occasionally manage mid-mission. So he might beat Spidey there.

Traab
2011-12-20, 12:32 PM
Ive watched numerous films where godzilla just plows right on through buildings like they arent even there. I say we keep his breath weapon at short range just for the sake of argument, otherwise it would become a fairly moot point, as godzilla would just use his pinpoint accurate super laser breath to win instantly. So lets reduce its range to a couple blocks. I think that spiderman and even the doctor could move faster than godzilla, considering he is rather large and may not want to obliterate several square miles of tokyo in his effort to run to the target area. So the real question would be, can spiderman or the doctor get there, setup some method of destroying the building, and get to safety in time to detonate, before godzilla can tail slam or breathe on his own?

Hopeless
2011-12-20, 02:18 PM
Lets be honest here, the three cities are moved into another dimension with an interdimensional pillar linking them together as it whirls through time and space.
Spiderman goes to investigate but unexpectedly Godzilla turns up because you know the bad guys are using him to destroy the three cities by means that if that pillar is destroyed all three cities are dumped into the void and lost forever.
The TARDIS turns up.
If its 10 he steps out and using a megaphone hollers at Godzilla, the creature briefly considers stepping on this particular ant but then notices the blue box and decides to either step back for a ranged shot or just wait and see what happens next because you know thanks to the TARDIS, Godzilla can understand the doctor who then pulls out his sonic and then checks it as he and Spidey meets and of course Spidey becomes the Doctor's latest companion.
Using the TARDIS he drags the three cities back and then lets Godzilla blow up the pillar so they simply return to their original place in space and time.
THEN he goes to have a word with whoever did the deed and after a quick chat he leaves as the shattered pillar's remains drops on the bad guys' hq but Spidey doesn't know about that!

Now if its 11 he'll just use that intercom he used at the end of season 5 and then we see him meet Spidey and the others before resolving the situation with noone the wiser...

grolim
2011-12-20, 02:55 PM
Wait, if we're using New York, why can't we use these guys (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDDHHrt6l4w&ob=av3e)?:smallwink:

That link really should come with a warning....and a gift certificate for therapy.

GloatingSwine
2011-12-25, 08:14 PM
The Doctor would find a clever way to destroy all three towers simultaneously. (Most likely by reversing the polarity of the neutron flow. You'd be surprised how often that works).

Stuff like that is what he does.

I mean Godzilla is impressive at smashing things, but he's not the kind of individual that makes galaxy conquering immortal terrors from beyond space **** themselves, is he now?

Spider Man is a non-factor. Smashing buildings is not his job, unless he paints "Hulk is a big green *****" up the side of it. That'll get'r done.

Traab
2011-12-25, 09:21 PM
The Doctor would find a clever way to destroy all three towers simultaneously. (Most likely by reversing the polarity of the neutron flow. You'd be surprised how often that works).

Stuff like that is what he does.

I mean Godzilla is impressive at smashing things, but he's not the kind of individual that makes galaxy conquering immortal terrors from beyond space **** themselves, is he now?

Spider Man is a non-factor. Smashing buildings is not his job, unless he paints "Hulk is a big green *****" up the side of it. That'll get'r done.

Bah, smashing buildings may not be his job, but he is a scientist, im sure he is capable of throwing together a quick and dirty fertilizer bomb or something to take out a building if he needs to. I will admit that that is his weakness here, but considering he gets to bring along someone to help, that can be compensated for.

Soras Teva Gee
2011-12-25, 11:03 PM
How the heck is the Doctor the iconic protector of London (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/BritainIsOnlyLondon)

Xondoure
2011-12-27, 03:13 AM
Spiderman is too busy stopping Godzilla from burning the cities down to worry too much about the towers while the doctor swoops in to restore time and space. It'd be a very entertaining scenario though, to be sure.

Edit: And the Doctor would almost certainly figure out whats behind it and return all three cities at once.

Urpriest
2011-12-27, 05:20 PM
How the heck is the Doctor the iconic protector of London (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/BritainIsOnlyLondon)

Pretty much every episode in which he saves the world from an overt alien invasion (well in the new series) he does it from London. Especially Christmas episodes. He wanders around helping the rest of Britain (and the world), sure, but London tends to be his city. He's stopped the Titanic from falling on Buckingham Palace and watched Big Ben get bisected by a flying saucer, and he's messed with the inhabitants of Number 10 Downing Street quite frequently.

Soras Teva Gee
2011-12-28, 02:38 AM
Pretty much every episode in which he saves the world from an overt alien invasion (well in the new series) he does it from London. Especially Christmas episodes. He wanders around helping the rest of Britain (and the world), sure, but London tends to be his city. He's stopped the Titanic from falling on Buckingham Palace and watched Big Ben get bisected by a flying saucer, and he's messed with the inhabitants of Number 10 Downing Street quite frequently.

Yeah it still stinks to me of "we need a British superhero.... uh.... um... the Doctor?"

If I think of the Doctor protecting London disportonately I chock it up to writer laziness which is not a good basis in my mind for iconic protector status.

Urpriest
2011-12-28, 02:45 PM
Yeah it still stinks to me of "we need a British superhero.... uh.... um... the Doctor?"

If I think of the Doctor protecting London disportonately I chock it up to writer laziness which is not a good basis in my mind for iconic protector status.

The same is true for Godzilla and Tokyo though. The only one who is really particularly city based is Spiderman, and as people have acknowledged in this thread he's the worst example of the archetype.

Mewtarthio
2011-12-28, 03:50 PM
Though Spider-Man is one of the more popular Marvel heroes and constantly proves his mettle against threats bigger than him, he's still a small fry compared to the other heroes who frequent New York and the two characters he's matched up against. He's fought cosmic-level threats before, yes, but unless he has serious backup he usually just annoys them to death. Spidey's more of a street-level hero.

I have to agree. This whole scenario really seems like it would be better suited to the Fantastic Four.

paddyfool
2011-12-29, 01:35 PM
I have to agree. This whole scenario really seems like it would be better suited to the Fantastic Four.

Who also are more generally on the Doctor's level. Hell, they even have time travel, and Richards has him matched for brains (different specialities, but both canonically obscenely smart, however much less-smart writers may make them both seem otherwise).

Soras Teva Gee
2011-12-30, 06:55 PM
The same is true for Godzilla and Tokyo though. The only one who is really particularly city based is Spiderman, and as people have acknowledged in this thread he's the worst example of the archetype.

Well Godzilla doesn't have literally the whole of space and time to jump around to either. And we could probably make a good point for being Japan's over just Tokyo. And its still something of his role where the Doctor has a more complex (which isn't to say better automatically) role of adventurer on the largest scale possible, with an occasional saving of planets, universes, and everything everywhere at least once.

And Spidey is a bad example because he can't do much to actually protect the city as a whole. Stop a bank robbing, no problem. People trapped in a fire, he's there. Alien invasion, not a chance. If he was more powerful he'd have a case, though there is still the problem of 90% of Marvel being in NYC.

I still find Spidey better suited to the role though. Shame Bats and Supes both protect fictional places.

dgnslyr
2012-01-01, 11:22 AM
Isn't Gotham City said to be based on New York City? I'd make a fair case to put Batman as New York's defender. Besides, Batman is just plain better than Spiderman. :smalltongue: I don't actually know anything about comics so whee wikipedia

Soras Teva Gee
2012-01-01, 01:48 PM
Isn't Gotham City said to be based on New York City? I'd make a fair case to put Batman as New York's defender. Besides, Batman is just plain better than Spiderman. :smalltongue: I don't actually know anything about comics so whee wikipedia

Gotham certainly is.... but so is Metropolis. And there is also NYC. DC geography is, complex.

dgnslyr
2012-01-01, 01:51 PM
I guess DC really likes New York, and they couldn't fit all the superheroes in one city? Seems a tad lazy, if you ask me.

Soras Teva Gee
2012-01-01, 02:08 PM
I guess DC really likes New York, and they couldn't fit all the superheroes in one city? Seems a tad lazy, if you ask me.

Well its actually inertia from the Golden and Silver Ages before a real connected universe. Many many DC heroes are based in fictional cities. Which is somewhat liberating as you can for example have any type of city or politics or so forth. Being more "realistic" puts certain limitations in place, because to be a place you have to y'know be a place.

(Cringe at the conceptual problems with having Lex Luthor winning the 2000 Presidential election and not being ousted for years... when history follows the same overall shape but your comics routine exceed current events)

Incidentally you simply could not have Supes and Bats in the same city as their cities represent two respective ends of metropoli. Though so help me I often get the feeling Metropolis and Supes have shifted to being more Chicago area over the years. Gotham is always Eastern seaboard (Nolan movies excepted) I think generally thought to be in Jersey. Young Justice amusingly had Gotham replacing Bridgeport CT, which doesn't have a particularly good reputation as a city... so probably intentional there.

Bhu
2012-01-02, 05:14 PM
Depending on what's going on Godzillahas the potential for Mothra as an ally, who has been retconned as a sort of God in the newer series who continually reincarnates.

GloatingSwine
2012-01-09, 04:32 PM
Isn't Gotham City said to be based on New York City? I'd make a fair case to put Batman as New York's defender. Besides, Batman is just plain better than Spiderman. :smalltongue: I don't actually know anything about comics so whee wikipedia

Metropolis is New York by day, Gotham is New York at night.

Goosefeather
2012-01-09, 09:03 PM
I posit that if we're going to tie the Doctor to an Earth city, it should be Cardiff rather than London :smalltongue:

(The series is mostly shot in South Wales, with Cardiff usually standing in for London - and Swansea for Cardiff, for some reason!)

Traab
2012-01-09, 09:48 PM
Well its actually inertia from the Golden and Silver Ages before a real connected universe. Many many DC heroes are based in fictional cities. Which is somewhat liberating as you can for example have any type of city or politics or so forth. Being more "realistic" puts certain limitations in place, because to be a place you have to y'know be a place.

(Cringe at the conceptual problems with having Lex Luthor winning the 2000 Presidential election and not being ousted for years... when history follows the same overall shape but your comics routine exceed current events)

Incidentally you simply could not have Supes and Bats in the same city as their cities represent two respective ends of metropoli. Though so help me I often get the feeling Metropolis and Supes have shifted to being more Chicago area over the years. Gotham is always Eastern seaboard (Nolan movies excepted) I think generally thought to be in Jersey. Young Justice amusingly had Gotham replacing Bridgeport CT, which doesn't have a particularly good reputation as a city... so probably intentional there.

Yeah...... Bridgeport? Not the nicest of places you can wander around in in my home state. My step dad grew up there. His old apartment building still has a bullet hole in the glass on the front door. Its been there over 30 years now. Aside from not having rich people in it, its actually fairly close to gotham.