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View Full Version : 3.5 - New Sor/Wiz Spell: Self-Destruct



Jon_Dahl
2012-01-04, 03:02 PM
Self-Destruct
Evocation [Force]

Level: Sor/Wiz 2
Components: V, S, F
Casting Time: 10 minutes
Range: Personal
Area: 5-ft.-radius burst
Duration: 24 hours
Saving Throw: Reflex half
Spell Resistance: Yes

This spell is only activated if you drop to -10 hit points and you are dead (most living creatures) or if you drop to 0 hit points and you are destroyed (most non-living creatures).

Your body explodes and is completely destroyed. Any creature in the area takes 5d8 points of force damage +1 per caster level (maximum of +10).

Focus
Your Last Will written with your own blood on a parchment made out of dragonhide (worth 1 gp).

NeoSeraphi
2012-01-04, 03:05 PM
I actually don't see this being an SR: Yes effect. You're blowing up. Sure, you're dealing energy damage instead of bludgeoning damage (for some reason) but it's an actual explosion, not a burst of energy, so I don't think it would be classified as a magical effect.

Good spell. You should make some higher level versions so that a higher level wizard can take a bigger chunk of his enemies with him.

Jon_Dahl
2012-01-04, 03:13 PM
I actually don't see this being an SR: Yes effect. You're blowing up. Sure, you're dealing energy damage instead of bludgeoning damage (for some reason) but it's an actual explosion, not a burst of energy, so I don't think it would be classified as a magical effect.


Well written. I took "SR: Yes" off.
About higher level versions: Well, I was just thinking that a party cleric (we all have one I hope?) will get Raise Dead at 9th level and I guess that will make everyone dump this spell, not to mention any higher level version. But that's just me.

NeoSeraphi
2012-01-04, 03:24 PM
Well written. I took "SR: Yes" off.
About higher level versions: Well, I was just thinking that a party cleric (we all have one I hope?) will get Raise Dead at 9th level and I guess that will make everyone dump this spell, not to mention any higher level version. But that's just me.

Fair enough. Then I think you should at least up the damage on this one.

Here's a comparison:

You cast a spell. If you die at 10th level, you blow up and deal 3d8+10 damage of an uncommon type to all creatures next to you. Most likely your killer, and possibly one or two allies. (including the cleric who was trying to keep you alive by healing you)

Meanwhile, a cleric, using the same spell slot, casts inflict moderate wounds. He deals 1d8 points of damage less than you (average of -4 damage), of an energy type that is almost as uncommon as yours, and instead of requiring a Reflex save (which can be evaded) he requires a touch attack, a Will save for half, and he has to overcome spell resistance.

BUT! He doesn't DIE. Nor does he require a focus, for that matter.

So let's recap:

Inflict moderate wounds-

Pros:
Can be used to heal
Deals 2d8+10 damage (average of 19)
Targets Will save

Cons:

Requires a touch attack (but still requires you to be in the same range as self-destruct)
Needs to overcome SR.

Self-Destruct-

Pros:
Area of effect
Deals 3d8+10 damage (average of 23)
Unerringly hits incorporeal creatures

Cons:
May hit allies
Can be evaded by a 2nd level rogue or monk
Only works on creatures hitting you in melee (which you shouldn't be in as a wizard, unless you're a gish, and then you shouldn't even need this spell)
Requires you to not only die, but spend a spell slot accepting the fact that you might be dying today

The above is my argument for more damage. Please. There's no reason that this spell should only deal 1d8 more points of damage than inflict moderate wounds. After all, you get to cast inflict moderate wounds more than once.

I'd say make it 5d10+CL, max +10.

Prince Zahn
2012-01-04, 03:36 PM
Self-Destruct
*snip*

And THAT, Sonny Boy Jr., is how the brave orcish sorcerers won the forest wars of 503. [/grandpavoice]

Seems nice, gramps comment^ aside, i can see my dwarven wizard casting this on his last day... "thar's nu way to go ta heaven wit 'onor bett'r than draggin' A horde 'o goblins ta hell doin' so!":amused:

Focus
Your Last Will written with your own blood on a piece of dragonhide. Isn't dragonhide considered a costly material focus(considering it needs to be big enough to write your last will on?) if so, a price tag(worth at least X @P) should be added IMHO.

EDIT: not that I'd want to pay admission at those levels to go BOOOOOOM!, >_>

Jon_Dahl
2012-01-04, 04:04 PM
@NeoSeraphi

You make a good argument. Originally I had compared my spell to Scorching Ray but your comparison makes more sense. I feel that 5d8+CL is quite high but since I really can't think of a good argument, I decided to edit OP.


Isn't dragonhide considered a costly material focus(considering it needs to be big enough to write your last will on?) if so, a price tag(worth at least X @P) should be added IMHO.

I was thinking about that too. However, dragonhide is surprisingly cheap: Armor made of it costs only double. So I assume that a piece of parchment would cost 4 sp instead of 2 sp. I felt that the price was so insignificant that I passed it. Compared to dragonhide-armors I can't see the focus costing more than 1 gp. So... I passed. However if people really feel it's an oversight, I can correct that. Sure, no problem.

bloodtide
2012-01-04, 04:35 PM
If your going to do [force] damage, that is a magical effect. After all force energy is shooting out of your dead body and hitting foes. That is what is doing damage, not flying body parts. Plus [force] damage is special as it will hit incorporeal creatures.

So this spell should be Sr:Yes.

NeoSeraphi
2012-01-04, 04:42 PM
If your going to do [force] damage, that is a magical effect. After all force energy is shooting out of your dead body and hitting foes. That is what is doing damage, not flying body parts. Plus [force] damage is special as it will hit incorporeal creatures.

So this spell should be Sr:Yes.

By your logic, orb of force should be SR: Yes. And it's not.

Circle of Life
2012-01-04, 04:54 PM
By your logic, orb of force should be SR: Yes. And it's not.

Using the orb spells as a point of either logic or balance is a pretty bad idea though.

Blast of Force would be a more appropriate comparison.

NeoSeraphi
2012-01-04, 04:59 PM
Using the orb spells as a point of either logic or balance is a pretty bad idea though.

Blast of Force would be a more appropriate comparison.

Fair enough, I just don't see why being a force effect should automatically require SR: Yes.

Either way, blast of force would definitely be a closer comparison, you're right. And with my handy-dandy Spell Compendium, I decree it to be...SR: Yes!

Though, in my opinion, you shouldn't change it back to SR: Yes. Instead, you should change it to simple bludgeoning damage that overcomes DR as if it was magical. I mean really, the last thing anyone wants to hear at the table is "Hey, can you just roll a caster level check for me? I need to know if your grand self-sacrificing explosion will even affect your enemy!" (Chiaotzu cast this spell against Nappa, but was unable to beat his SR...)

Yitzi
2012-01-04, 05:58 PM
Fair enough, I just don't see why being a force effect should automatically require SR: Yes.

Because force energy is fully magical in nature, and therefore subject to spell resistance (and also able to affect incorporeal creatures at full effectiveness).

lesser_minion
2012-01-04, 07:08 PM
Fair enough, I just don't see why being a force effect should automatically require SR: Yes.

The rules for what kind of effect should allow SR and what kind of effect shouldn't are actually spelled out in the DMG, mainly because they aren't as clear-cut as the "SR: No" and "SR: Yes" lines make them out to be.

In this case, you'd actually need an SR: Varies line: a personal-range spell ignores its caster's SR, but a creature damaged by an evocation* should receive SR against that evocation.

* But not by its side-effects or consequences: if you're in a gas pocket when a fireball ignites it, you take damage from the resulting explosion, whether the fireball penetrates your SR or not.

radmelon
2012-01-04, 09:44 PM
The spell reminds me of this quote:

....T'all you fine dandies so proud, so ****-sure, prancin' aboot with your heads full of eyeballs! Come and get me I say! I'll be waiting on ya with a whiff of the 'ol brimstone. I'm a grim bloody fable, with an unhappy bloody end!

Jon_Dahl
2012-01-05, 01:48 AM
I fixed it back to SR: Yes so hopefully we don't have to talk about that anymore ;)

Hanuman
2012-01-05, 02:48 AM
Easier than gluing blast disks to familiars I guess.

I like Dance of Ruin from BoVD personally. I'd personally like something more like a template or something of the sorts that scales to HD and HD#.