Have a question for the True Geeks™ among us...

[The Bushranger]

I've discovered that I can't run Terraria on my computer under its current (Intel integrated GMX 4500) video card; and it looks like X-Plane, something I definitely want, won't either. However, my computer has the ability to add a video card, so I'm looking at the Radeon HD 5450 - I have a HP s5-1020 slimline PC - to replace it.

Now, after some Googling, according to a thread on the HP forums, in a post by somebody working at HP, this computer/card combo should work, and it's implied it should work by somebody at Yahoo Answers, too. However, AMD's website says this card's power supply requirement is "400w recommended" - whereas the s5-1020 has a 220w power supply.

So: will this actually work, or do I need a new power supply, too?

[Starwulf]

I've discovered that I can't run Terraria on my computer under its current (Intel integrated GMX 4500) video card; and it looks like X-Plane, something I definitely want, won't either. However, my computer has the ability to add a video card, so I'm looking at the Radeon HD 5450 - I have a HP s5-1020 slimline PC - to replace it.

Now, after some Googling, according to a thread on the HP forums, in a post by somebody working at HP, this computer/card combo should work, and it's implied it should work by somebody at Yahoo Answers, too. However, AMD's website says this card's power supply requirement is "400w recommended" - whereas the s5-1020 has a 220w power supply.

So: will this actually work, or do I need a new power supply, too?

Hmm, I'm not quite as knowledgeable with power supplies as I am with other components of a computer, but I am fairly certain that you will indeed need a new power supply. You could possibly scrape by with a 350w power supply if your card recommended a 400w, but if your power supply is a 220w, that's considerably to low. I would suggest a minimum of a 450-500w power supply, simply because there isn't likely going to be much of a price difference between them and the 400w, and it's always nice to not be running your power supply at it's max.

[Siosilvar]

It will work.

How long it will work before overheating or doing other unpleasant things is up in the air. The card will get all the current it needs, but if your power supply isn't rated to give it that much, it'll heat up faster and you could damage one or the other.

So you're going to want a new power supply as well. Make sure you get one that fits in your computer, and avoid cheap ones like the plague - so you're looking at $50 and up for a 400W Micro ATX power supply. I found one (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817104131) on Newegg that might work, but I can't find the dimensions of the original power supply anywhere, so I'm not sure if it will fit in the space available.

[The Bushranger]

Thanks. :smallsmile:
Hmmm...the power-supply-replacement instructions look scary (http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/document?docname=c02917894&tmp_task=useCategory&cc=us&dlc=en&lc=en&product=5097981). :smalleek:

[OracleofWuffing]

Nah, PSU replacement isn't too much, most everything only goes in one way and- Woah crap. It's one of those Power Supplies. You won't be able to use the PSU that Siosilvar suggested. Well, okay, you might, but all the screws won't fit in correctly and you might need to use some glue, so I would not recommend it (that's assuming that the PSU otherwise has the right connections). Essentially, HP decided to go with some odd-standard or proprietary PSU size on this computer case (http://h10025.www1.hp.com/ewfrf/wc/document?cc=us&dlc=en&docname=bph06788&lc=en&product=5097981), so assume that the power supply won't fit unless the item itself says otherwise.

HP Slimline computers use power supplies that fit into cases that are smaller than ATX. These power supplies are either micro-atx or are of a special design. When ordering a power supply for a slimline PC, make sure to use the original part number (or PC model number) when searching for a replacement or upgrade.
Bold theirs, underline mine for emphasis. You'll also see on the HP instructions that their power supply is much longer than the one from Newegg, so we know your computer does not use Micro-ATX.

Looks like the part number for your Power Supply is 633195-001. Here's (http://h20141.www2.hp.com/Hpparts/Default.aspx?mscssid=4CA3ACEF05E74AACAA383EEC77040 FA7) HP's Parts Store, won't hurt you to give them your serial/product number and see what they might have, but expect lots on shipping and handling charges if they do have what you're looking for.

Wish I had more advice to give, but, well, good luck tracking down a better PSU.

[factotum]

Quick question--you say this is a slimline case? You might want to check that the card will physically fit inside it, then; some of those slimline cases require special low-profile versions of graphics cards to install.

[The Succubus]

Hurrah for proprietary devices! :smallannoyed: "We're going to make your bits and pieces deliberately obscure just to make life difficult for you."

I'm glaring at you too, Sony.:smallannoyed:

[Balain]

Hurrah for proprietary devices! .......

Sadly Companies like HP make money off of computers with proprietary devices and lots of it from what I have heard. Could be wrong though but makes sense.

The average joe doesn't know that the proprietary parts are very hard to replace or even impossible, so you have to go out and buy a whole new computer.

So if you are buying a new computer and have a store near you like Memory Express (http://www.memoryexpress.com/)
Buy all your computer parts and put them together yourself, or get them to put it together for you for a bit extra, or buy one of the systems they pre-built.

I sure hope that makes sense....It made sense to me, but I am running on a serious lack of sleep.

[OracleofWuffing]

Quick question--you say this is a slimline case? You might want to check that the card will physically fit inside it, then; some of those slimline cases require special low-profile versions of graphics cards to install.

That's one of the first things I looked in to, heh. From what I saw on retail pages, the card comes with an interchangeable low-profile plate to fit into slim cases. Using that drops the VGA port, but you still have a DVI port and I think HDMI.

That said, it might be easier to find a different video card. Which is still a nightmare in itself.

[The Bushranger]

We looked into getting a custom computer when we got this one; all that we saw were significantly more expensive, though...

Might look into it again. At this rate getting a new computer again might be the best option. :smallsigh::smalltongue:

Thanks for all the help. :smallsmile:

[OracleofWuffing]

:smallfrown: Yeah, sorry that there wasn't better news there.

For what it's worth, it looks like the video card options HP is using for their current 220watt Power Supply Slimline systems are:

512MB DDR3 AMD Radeon HD 6450
1GB DDR3 NVIDIA GeForce GT520


Don't know if those would run the games you're looking at- my opinion is that computers were designed to run fully-interactable graphical environments and not mere "games" :smalltongue:- but checking in on those two would probably be the safest bet.

[The Bushranger]

Huh. The first of those, at least, says 400w required on AMD's site...while the second says 300.
Silly HP!

[The Bushranger]

...oh, and as a footnote: I discovered that the GMA 4500 card my computer came with does support Shader (4.0 even), and Terraria is running now.

Weeeeird!

[thubby]

this is why i hate HP.

yes, you need more power. if HP is anything like dell, you can put in a code or the product number or whatever and they'll tell you what pieces you can use to upgrade with.

(side note, i also dislike dell, i just have more experience with their site)

[Karoht]

My honest recommencation.
Go to a computer store. Not one of the chain stores though. Bring your rig with you.
Have them recommend you a power supply to match your graphics card.
If possible get a 450w or 500w supply.
Get them to install it properly, pay the extra for the warrenty on the card and the power supply.

Especially if you are unsure of what you are doing yourself.

[tyckspoon]

Huh. The first of those, at least, says 400w required on AMD's site...while the second says 300.
Silly HP!

Power supply requirements on video cards are *always* massively overstated. The entry-level tier of cards (vaguely defined as 'things that don't need an external power connector'- ie, they draw everything through the installation slot on the motherboard) actually use very little power. They'd probably run ok on a system with an honest 250w PSU, or even the 220 you have. Especially on the slimline boxes, which tend to have relatively low-draw components (efficiency hard drives instead of fast ones, micro-ATX motherboards, cheaper/power-efficiency lines of processors chosen over muscle, etc) already.

The thing is.. it requires an honest PSU. One that has been stress-tested under real working conditions to its rated output. A '400w' PSU *should* be able to reliably loaded to 400w and provide stable power under that condition for its normal expected lifespan (several years, at least.) But most PSUs aren't- the OEM ones are hit-and-miss, and the really cheap ones you see online/on sale all the time almost never are. Their marketing ratings don't reflect real world conditions (they were tested in a freezer, basically) or they're labeled with the peak wattage the PSU was able to spike instead of the sustained wattage, shortly before they shut the thing down so it wouldn't burst into flame and set off the sprinkler system in the test room again.

So the card manufacturers pad their requirements to compensate. A $20 "400w" PSU probably won't do anything near 400w. But it'll give the ~200-some a typical system might pull at absolute full draw, and it'll do that pretty reliably.

(The other factors are that they don't know what else is in your system- if you've got four hard drives, 2 disc drives, and 6 fans your power requirements are significantly different than the 1 HDD/1 disc drive/PSU fan only setup common to unmodified OEM systems, and their recommendation has to work for both, and that HP and the other major OEM sellers often have access to special editions of cards that may be engineered to take up less space/use less power/be less powerful while still having the same model name as the retail market edition.)

((Also-also double check the physical card you intend to buy against the case if at all possible- many slim-line boxes have very little internal clearance, and a card with a bulky enough cooler may still not fit even if it is/has a low-profile option for the external plate.))