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JamesW
2012-03-15, 06:09 AM
Hello everyone!

So, I'm making a dwarven tank for a local group of players that I want to play with. Here is what I've decided on the build so far...

Race: Gold Dwarf (+2Con, -2Dex)

Str: 14
Dex: 10
Con: 16
Int: 14
Wis: 12
Cha: 16

(I have Cha high because I plan on taking Leadership at level 6 and I want my cohort to be higher than level 4 when I do)

A little bit of info about the character will help people analyze this a bit easier. Upon reaching level 6 I will take leadership and gain a dwarven cleric cohort with the Protection and Renewal domains. She will be casting Shield Other on my tank as soon as battle starts so that he is splitting damage with the cleric. So, the cleric will be a healer/buffer in a sense but also get up there in melee and attack and help flank for other members of the party.

Now... back to the build..

level 1: Crusader - <feat>(not sure what I should pick), Furious counterstrike, Steely Resolve 5
Maneuvers: Vanguard Strike, Charging Minotaur, Douse the flames, Leading the Attack, Stone Bones
Stance: Iron Guard's Glare

level 2: Knight - Fighting Challenge +1, Knight's Challenge, Knight's Code

level 3: Crusader - <feat>(not sure what I should pick), Indomitable Soul
Stance: Thicket of Blades (Can I take this now? Or do I need to take two levels in knight to be able to take this?)



Anyway, I'm still not sure about a lot...

I know I what to take four levels in Knight for Bulwark of Defense, Shield Block, Knight's Challenge, and most of all, test of mettle.

I know I also want to go pretty deep into crusader. I am just not sure how deep I want to go.

Are there any other classes, prestige or not, that I might want to look into for this build? I was thinking about dipping into paladin as well to get Divine Grace and Divine Health. Being immune to all diseases is a nice thing to have.

So far here is what I'm planning on then..

Knight - 4 levels
Paladin - 3 levels (or 5 if I want the special mount since I get mounted combat from the knight class)
Crusader - ? levels (at least enough to get the cool crusader tanking stuff like thicket of blades)

So... anyone know of anything else that will help? Also, what are some good feats for tanks to take?

Thanks in advance!

Biffoniacus_Furiou
2012-03-15, 09:03 AM
(I have Cha high because I plan on taking Leadership at level 6 and I want my cohort to be higher than level 4 when I do)


Cohort Level
The character can attract a cohort of up to this level. Regardless of a character’s Leadership score, he can only recruit a cohort who is two or more levels lower than himself.

Your cohort can never be higher level than your level -2, regardless of what your leadership score is. You can maintain a max level cohort until you hit 11th level with a Cha 12. With Cha 14 your cohort will be max level until you hit 16th. You don't need a Cha 16 for Leadership until after you've reached 16th level, and by then you should be able to get a Cloak of Cha or something more interesting like a Crown of Flames (MIC).


For your feats, Extra Granted Maneuver is a good idea. Instead of your maneuvers recycling every four rounds, they'll recycle every three rounds, so you'll be able to use your favorite maneuvers more often. Stone Power is also pretty good for tanking, and Shield Specialization and Shield Ward in PH2 are also useful. EWP: Kusari-Gama (DMG p144-145) and Stand Still (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/psionicFeats.htm#standStill) would also be useful for keeping opponents from going after other party members.

Jade Dragon
2012-03-15, 10:10 AM
...Don't take Leadership unless your group explicitly allows it. It is the most broken feat in the game, and the only contender is Greenbound Summoning.

beskargam
2012-03-15, 10:31 AM
Hello everyone!

So, I'm making a dwarven tank for a local group of players that I want to play with. Here is what I've decided on the build so far...

Race: Gold Dwarf (+2Con, -2Dex)

Str: 14
Dex: 10
Con: 16
Int: 14
Wis: 12
Cha: 16

(I have Cha high because I plan on taking Leadership at level 6 and I want my cohort to be higher than level 4 when I do)

A little bit of info about the character will help people analyze this a bit easier. Upon reaching level 6 I will take leadership and gain a dwarven cleric cohort with the Protection and Renewal domains. She will be casting Shield Other on my tank as soon as battle starts so that he is splitting damage with the cleric. So, the cleric will be a healer/buffer in a sense but also get up there in melee and attack and help flank for other members of the party.

Now... back to the build..

level 1: Crusader - <feat>(not sure what I should pick), Furious counterstrike, Steely Resolve 5
Maneuvers: Vanguard Strike, Charging Minotaur, Douse the flames, Leading the Attack, Stone Bones
Stance: Iron Guard's Glare

level 2: Knight - Fighting Challenge +1, Knight's Challenge, Knight's Code

level 3: Crusader - <feat>(not sure what I should pick), Indomitable Soul
Stance: Thicket of Blades (Can I take this now? Or do I need to take two levels in knight to be able to take this?)



Anyway, I'm still not sure about a lot...

I know I what to take four levels in Knight for Bulwark of Defense, Shield Block, Knight's Challenge, and most of all, test of mettle.

I know I also want to go pretty deep into crusader. I am just not sure how deep I want to go.

Are there any other classes, prestige or not, that I might want to look into for this build? I was thinking about dipping into paladin as well to get Divine Grace and Divine Health. Being immune to all diseases is a nice thing to have.

So far here is what I'm planning on then..

Knight - 4 levels
Paladin - 3 levels (or 5 if I want the special mount since I get mounted combat from the knight class)
Crusader - ? levels (at least enough to get the cool crusader tanking stuff like thicket of blades)

So... anyone know of anything else that will help? Also, what are some good feats for tanks to take?

Thanks in advance!

Pally is only worth it for a 2 lvl dip really. Even less so now bc as a crusader your CHA is already going to your will saves. Reflex saves aren't really that important, and you have a solid fort save. The pallys mount only scales with pally lvls, so nothing really super vawsome there unless you use more pally lvls than what it sounds like you want.....

JamesW
2012-03-15, 12:26 PM
Hmmm... Okay.

thanks for the input.

So,

4 Knight, 2 Paladin, 14 Crusader

Just need to figure out the mix I want to get now.

Thinking about this...

lvl 1: Crusader, Extra Granted Maneuver
Maneuvers: Vanguard Strike, Charging Minotaur, Douse the flames, Leading the Attack, Stone Bones
Stance: Iron Guard's Glare

lvl 2: Paladin
lvl 3: Paladin, Shield Specialization
lvl 4: Knight
lvl 5: Knight
lvl 6: Knight
lvl 7: Knight
lvl 8-20: Crusader

This should make me tanky enough I think.

@Jade - Leadership is allowed, and I'm not taking it to break the game... just make me a better tank and help the group since the group lacks healers of any kind except potions and healing belts.

Anything else anyone can think of? Other prestige classes that might work better than Crusader 8-20?

Hmmm... might drop paladin if I'm going to change the stats around so that Charisma is not so important...

Race: Dwarf
Str: 14
Dex: 12
Con: 18
Int: 10
Wis: 12
Cha: 12

That is after racial stat mods.

If I go this route I'll be doing the following

lvl 1: Crusader, Extra Granted Maneuver
lvl 2-5: Knight, Shield Specialization
lvl 6-20: Crusader, Leadership, Stand Still, Stone Power

Particle_Man
2012-03-15, 02:04 PM
Well there are a few "crusader" prestige classes in ToB (one specifically for Dwarves that focuses on Stone Dragon stuff, on specifically for worshippers of Wee Jas that focuses on hiding and getting extra swift actions/extra maneuvers - paladin 4/crusader might work as an entry for the latter.

Personally I am a big fan of "crusader all the way" as tank but that is just me.