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Lappy9001
2012-04-03, 09:44 PM
Classy d20
A classier system :smallcool:

Classy d20 is my love letter to Dungeons and Dragons (and Pathfinder!) and strives to create a game that is flexible, balanced, fast-paced, streamlined, and most importantly, fun to play. I'll be trying my best to adhere to the following goals.

Design Notes and Goals to Achieve:

Not to penalize. The idea is anyone can do something, but can only excel with training
Loosely Class-Based
Each Class gets their own sphere of abilities to focus on, but can (and are even encouraged to) dabble in the abilities of other classes
Mages get Magic Points and Spells
Rogues get Skills Points and Talents
Warriors get Attack Points (BAB, essentially) and Maneuvers
Magic focuses on AoE Damage, Buffing, Control, and Status Effects
Skills focus on Crafting, Interaction, Luck, Mobility, Survival
Maneuvers focus on Attack (and multiple attacks), Damage, Saves, Self-Sufficiency, and Tactics
Each area of expertise stays within its own sphere so not to step on anyone else's toes.
Weapons/Armor are custom-built
Character Creation should be simple (in theory). Roll Attributes, pick a Race/Class, gain an Ability (Maneuver, Spell, or Talent), and pick equipment
My plan is to keep play relatively simple in the beginning, but keep lots of options so complexity evolves as the characters grow.
While players will still be able to pick any ability without meeting a single prerequisite (mostly), the groupings are more focused to encourage specializing in a couple of abilities instead of cherry-picking from a huge list (this also makes it quicker and easier to decide what to pick)


The way the system is designed allows you to focus in one area (fighting, spells, or skills), but allows you to dabble in either of the other two areas as you see fit. The classes are very general, but can fit many different gaming archetypes depending on your selection of abilities. When learning a new ability, you get 2 for the price of 1 (and one scales the more you invest into it). So dig in and have fun!

Table of Contents

Introduction

Getting Started
Attributes
Determining and Using Attributes

The Basics

Using the Dice
Damage Dice and Increments
Modifiers
Types of Rolls
Critical Damage and Natural Rolls
Damage Types and Resistance
Defense
Difficulty

Actions and Combat

Combat Order
Space
Tactics
Essentia

Adventuring and Exploration

Darkness
Difficult Terrain
Hazards
Overland Travel
Life and Death
Conditions
Natural Healing and Rest
Destroying Objects

Races

Dwarf
Elf
Halfling
Human
Kobold
Orc
Racial Templates

Aasimar
Deep-Dweller
Graveborn
Half-Blood
Planetouched
Tiefling


Classes and Leveling

Experience and Levels
Mage
Rogue
Warrior

Maneuvers and Martial Disciplines

Attack Points
Combat Style and Proficiency

Archery
Heavy Armor
Light Armor
Mounted
One-Handed
Shield
Spellbreaker
Tactician
Two-Handed
Weapons Mastery


Spells and Arcane Schools

Magic Points
Spell Effects and Metamagic

Divination
Enchantment
Flame
Healing
Ice
Necromancy
Protection
Storm
Summoning
Teleportation


Talents and Skills

Skill Points
Using Skills and Trained Skills

Alchemy
Athletics
Endurance
Knowledge
Mechanics
Nature
Perception
Runecrafting
Speech
Stealth


Equipment

Currency
Adventuring Gear
Weapons and Armor

Properties
Unarmed Combat
One-Handed Weapons
Two-Handed Weapons
Ranged Weapons
Light Armor
Heavy Armor
Shields


Magic Items

Magical Properties
Crafting Magic Items
Alchemic Items
Magic Armor and Weapons
Wondrous Items
Artifacts

Running the Game

Game Mastery
Rewards
Professions
NPC Class: The Commoner

Custom Races


Building Monsters

Monster Types
Monster Roles

Monster Traits
Bestiary

Ash Strider (Level 4)
Blightling (Level 2)
Bonesplinter (Level ˝ - 4)
Booze (Level 2)
Dryad (Level 4)
Familiar (Level 1)
Ghost: Spectral Adventurers (Level 4)
Gremling (Level ˝)
Hobgoblin (Level 1-2)
Horse (Level 2)
Ogre (Level 3)
Revenant (Level 1)
Salamander (Level 2)
Soot Sprites (Level 2)
Tizali (Level 2)
Treant (Level 7)
Voidling (Level 3)

Lappy9001
2012-04-03, 09:46 PM
Introduction
A world of fantasy and adventure, Classy d20 is a game fueled by your imagination. In this world, you play as a hero, a character that you create and control within the game. Working cooperatively with other players, each controlling their own hero, you combine forces as a team to venture forth, questing for fame, fortune, and the very fate of the world. Filling roles within your team, known as an adventuring party, you can be a stalwart warrior, a cunning rogue, or a powerful mage. As you master the rules of the game you can further customize your hero, and your role in the party, just about any way you see fit!

To play Classy d20, you need 3-6 players and someone to be the Game Master (GM). The GM describes the adventure, makes the final call for any rule disputes, and controls the world around the heroes. Each player controls their own hero, or Player Character (PC), while the GM handles the monsters, the environment, and the people who interact with the characters, called Non-Player Characters (NPCs).

A typical game session starts out with the GM describing the immediate surroundings of the players, who then ask the GM questions about the environment and what they can interact with. These sessions can be one-time gatherings, or gradually build on one another into an epic campaign of adventure. Sometimes quests involve delving into ancient ruins, negotiating politics between warring nations, or saving the lives of countless innocents from a rampaging monster or a ruthless tyrant. Each adventure is unique and the boundaries of a campaign are limited only by your group’s creativity.

Getting Started
To jump right in and create a character, you first need to determine their strengths and weaknesses in the Attributes section below. If you are unfamiliar with the rules, or role-playing games in general, continue on to The Basics. The chapter Actions and Combat is slightly more advanced, yet necessary to understand. Otherwise, skip on to Races and proceed down the sections.


Character Sheet can be found Here (https://www.dropbox.com/s/4jmu81aanemc9tf/Classy%20d20%20Char%20Sheet%202.0.pdf)
Let me know ASAP if this link does not work for you for any reason.

Quick-Play!


Determine attributes

+1 bonus to a number of skills equal to your Intelligence

Choose a Race
Choose a Class

Select primary attribute
Gain class features

Select a maneuver, spell, or talent
Buy equipment
Don’t forget!

Tactics
Essentia pool of Intelligence (minimum 1) + ˝ level
Rest to recover abilities (and gain a +1 bonus on saves if resting in comfortable surroundings)



Attributes
The most foundational aspects of your character are their attributes, which in turn, help define key parts of your character’s persona, as well as what they can physically accomplish. There are six attributes:


Strength (Str): Raw physical power and force of muscle, Strength is used for attack with close combat weapons, damage with weapons, breaking objects, wrestling opponents, and carrying heavy loads. Characters with high Strength are naturally very strong, and are very formidable in combat.

Constitution (Con): Durability and stamina, Constitution deals directly with physical health and how resistant you are to debilitating effects and adverse environments. Characters with high Constitution are remarkably tough and can fight longer and harder than others.

Dexterity (Dex): Coordination and agility, Dexterity is useful for stealth, dodging attacks, attacking with light or ranged weapons, reaction time, and reflexes. Characters with high Dexterity are extremely nimble and are capable of attacking and performing tasks with precision.

Intelligence (Int): Logic and reasoning, Intelligence is used for more skills than any other attribute, including knowledge, crafting, and language comprehension. Characters with high Intelligence are capable and clever, practiced in a diverse range of skills and talents.

Wisdom (Wis): Resolve and insight, Wisdom is often tied to spirituality, encouraging willpower, awareness, and understanding. Characters with high Wisdom are determined and perceptive, innately more aware of the world around them.

Charisma (Cha): Charm and force of personality, Charisma plays a part in your strength of self, and is essential for social skills such as diplomacy, deception, and intimidation. Characters with high Charisma tend to be very creative, have a strong presence and are capable of bending others to their will.

Determining and Using Attributes
Attributes are represented by a single number, initially ranging from +0 to +4, although they can be increased by your race and class. When an ability or roll calls for an attribute, it is referring to this number. You attributes are determined when you create you character, and you assign the number to which ever attributes you wish.

To see what your character's attributes are, roll 3d4 and add up the total, comparing the result to the table below to determine what number will be used for an attribute. Do this six times, and assign each bonus you generate to an attribute of your choice.

The GM may choose to make results slightly higher by having players rolling 4d4 and drop the lowest 1d4 roll or by rolling seven times and drop the lowest roll result (or both).



Result
Bonus


11-12
+4


9-10
+3


7-8
+2


5-6
+1


3-4
+0



Sometimes, the rolls used to determine attributes are simply too low for your liking. In this case (or if you choose to forego rolling entirely), you may choose to use one of the standard arrays presented below:


Average: +0, +1, +2, +2, +3, +4

Balanced: +1, +2, +2, +2, +2, +3

Specialized: +0, +1, +1, +3, +3, +4

Using a dice pool distribution requires to instead roll 4d6. A result of 4-6 is a success, while 1-3 is a failure. Add up the total number of successes, using that total as the attribute bonus, and assign it to an attribute of your choice.

To create slightly higher results, roll 5d6 and drop the lowest 1d6.

Using point buy to determine attributes is to give each character 12 points and have them assign these points into six parts, none of which can be greater than +4 or smaller than +0. Each number is then assigned to an attribute of each player’s choice. It is best for all players to use the same method, as each has different results.


Table of Contents

Lappy9001
2012-04-03, 09:47 PM
The Basics
Classy d20 involves a certain amount of strategy and assumes the PCs and monsters are being represented with miniatures, tokens, or other objects on a grid of 1-inch squares, or with a ruler. However, it is completely possible to play with only pencil and paper to record character information, and dice to determine the result of any challenge. Crucial to understanding Classy d20 is that any action that has a significant chance of failure is determined by the roll of a dice, with your character’s attributes modifying the end effect. Therefore, you wouldn’t need to roll to cross a bridge or hear an ally speak, but you would if the bridge was collapsing or if your ally was calling out to you in the middle of a storm.

Using the Dice
Several types of dice are used within the game:


Four-sided dice (d4)
Six-sided dice (d6)
Eight-sided dice (d8)
Ten-sided dice (d10)
Twelve-sided dice (d12)
And most importantly, the Twenty-sided dice (d20)

The dice are referred to by the number of dice used, the letter ‘d’, and the number of sides on the dice. For example, if you wanted to roll a single twenty-sided dice, you would roll 1d20. And if you wanted to roll four six-sided dice, you would roll 4d6.

Damage Dice and Increments
Weapons and spells alike deal damage using a certain dice, called damage dice. Some use multiple damage dice when dealing critical damage or with certain ranged weapons. Sometimes, the dice that are rolled are increased or decreased by a value known as an increment. Dice progress through increments as follows:


1d4 – 1d6 – 1d8 – 1d10 – 1d12 – 2d6 – 2d8 – 2d10

Modifiers
Dice rolls are influenced by numbers added to or subtracted from the dice roll, called bonuses and penalties respectively, or modifiers when being referred to as a whole. Rolling 1d20 with a bonus of +2 would result in 1d20+2. And rolling 4d6 with a -1 penalty would result in 4d6-1.

There are eight different types of modifiers:


Cunning, Might, and Spirit modifiers are granted from abilities (talents, maneuvers, and spells respectively).

Armor, Item, Shield, and Weapon modifiers are granted from equipment both magic and mundane.

Trait bonuses are granted from a specific set of abilities usually reserved for monsters, appropriately called traits.

Bonuses or penalties of the same type are not added (or ‘stacked’) together, although a bonus and a penalty from the same type can detract from each other. For example, a warrior benefiting from a +4 Might bonus to attack rolls, but suffering from a -2 Might penalty to attack rolls would have an overall bonus of +2. However, the warrior could not benefit from another +2 Might bonus, but could benefit from a +2 Spirit bonus.

Certain ‘untyped’ modifiers are an exception to this rule, and are added in with all other types, unless they come from the same source. The bonuses from a race or class are examples of untyped modifiers.

Types of Rolls
As previously mentioned, you roll the dice for anything that has a significant chance of failure. Any roll that does not use a specific dice (such as weapon or spell damage) uses a d20 plus any relevant modifiers. Rolls are usually compared to a static number such as Defense or Difficulty. In other words, you swing a sword against a goblin’s Defense, or resist the Difficulty of a mage’s magic. If the total result of the roll meets or exceeds the targeted result, it is successful. If you ever end up with a fraction, always roll down unless otherwise specified. Common rolls include:

Melee attack rolls are close combat attacks that (usually) target an adjacent enemy, and are made against that target’s Defense.


Roll 1d20 + Strength + Attack Points (AP) + Modifiers

Ranged attack rolls are long-range attacks that target enemies usually within a range of about 50 ft. (or 10 Squares), and are made against that target’s Defense.


Roll 1d20 + Dexterity + Attack Points (AP) + Modifiers

Damage rolls are made after a successful attack roll, or after using an ability that deals damage. Damage rolls use a specific dice known as damage dice. Some effects such as critical damage increase the number of damage dice used.


Roll damage dice (varies) + Strength (for attacks) + modifiers

Initiative rolls determine who goes first in combat. There are a few ways to increase Initiative, and the results can sometimes change throughout a battle.


Roll 1d20 + Dexterity + Modifiers

Skill rolls encompass a wide variety of tasks and are normally made against the Difficulty of the task as set by the GM.


Roll 1d20 + Attribute + ˝ Level + Skill Points (SP) + Modifiers

Save rolls, called Fortitude, Reflex, and Will saves are made as a last ditch effort to throw off a negative effect. These rolls usually come into play after an effect has already taken place, such as poison from a bite attack, or a spell that ignores Defense. Saves are usually made against an enemy’s Difficulty.


Roll 1d20 + Attribute + ˝ Level + Modifiers

Attribute rolls are made whenever there is a chance of failure from a task, but there are no other rolls suitable to use. The attribute most likely related to the action is used, and is rolled against the Skill Difficulty chart, or an opposed roll if against another creature.


Roll 1d20 + Attribute + Modifiers

Critical Damage and Natural Rolls
Sometimes the result of a d20 roll is an unbelievable stroke of luck or a catastrophic failure, both represented by natural rolls. A natural 20 is when a 20 is rolled before modifiers, and the roll is automatically successful. Conversely, when a 1 is rolled before modifiers, it is called a natural 1 and the roll automatically fails. Natural rolls do not apply to skills.

When a natural 20 is made on an attack roll, an additional damage dice is rolled, and all damage is maximized (called critical damage). For example, a natural 20 on a weapon dealing 1d6 damage with a +2 modifier would deal critical damage of 14 (2d6 maximized +2).

A critical threat is when an attack can deal critical damage on a roll less than 20. When this occurs, another attack roll must be made. If the second roll is successful, the attack deals critical damage.

Damage Types and Resistance
There are four damage types: Cold, Fire, Physical, and Shock. Some abilities allow characters (and monsters!) to ignore damage of a certain type. A character with Resistance to a certain type of damage negates that amount taken from the total damage of the corresponding type. So a mage with +3 Fire Resistance hit for 8 Fire damage would only take 5 Fire damage.

Defense
Your Defense is your character’s primary protection against incoming attacks, usually through dodging the blow or by wearing armor. Defense is what attack rolls are made against. When you attack an opponent, or they attack you, the attack is successful if it meets or exceeds the target’s Defense.


Defense: 10 + ˝ Level + Dexterity/Shield + Armor

Difficulty
Your Difficulty is what enemies attempt to make Save rolls against. Whenever an ability calls for an enemy to make a Save, they roll to meet or exceed your Difficulty. What attribute is used to determine the Difficulty depends on the type of the ability: Maneuvers use Strength, Spells use Charisma, and Talents use Intelligence.


Difficulty: 10 + ˝ Level + Attribute (Strength, Intelligence, or Charisma)


Table of Contents

Lappy9001
2012-04-03, 09:48 PM
Actions and Combat
While exploring, players generally have free reign to do as they will within their PC’s capabilities. But in combat, time is of the essence, and players must carefully choose how they spend that time. Combat takes place in rounds, with each round representing 6 seconds within the game world. During the course of a round, each participant has a turn to perform a number of actions, shown below from greater to lesser:


1 Major Action – 1 Move Action – 1 Minor Action

An action must be finished before beginning another. For example, you have a Speed of 6 Squares and move 4 Squares using a move action. Then, you attack a goblin using a major action. However, you could not move again, even though you have Speed left this turn, because you finished your Move action (unless, of course another effect allows you to move). Greater actions can be traded for lesser ones, such as a major action for a move action. Therefore, it is possible to move twice, or take three minor actions. Below are some common actions:


Attack an enemy – Major
Cast a spell – Major
Charge – Move + Major
Defend – Move
Draw a weapon – Minor
Move a distance equal to your Speed – Move
Move twice your Speed – Move + Move
Move 3 times your Speed – Move + Move + Minor
Use an ability – Varies (Major, unless otherwise specified)
Use an item – Minor (usually)
Use a skill – Major (usually)

Some things, such as speaking or cancelling an active ability require little to no time and are called free actions. A PC technically has unlimited free actions during their turn, but the GM has the final say as to what constitutes a free action, and how many is too many.

Combat Order
Combat begins with each participant making an Initiative roll. Whoever rolls highest goes first, and the order proceeds down to the lowest Initiative result. After the participant with the lowest Initiative result has taken their turn, the round is over and a new round begins, starting with the highest Initiative result. When someone uses an ability that lasts for 1 round, it lasts until the beginning of their next turn.

It is possible for a character to voluntarily delay their turn to allow another character to go first. However, doing so forces the character to use their new result for the rest of the encounter (or until Initiative is rolled again if using the Active Initiative variant).

An optional rule, active initiative is a simple variant that makes combat less static, and benefits characters who have invested in high Dexterity and Initiative. At the start of each round, all combatants roll Initiative as if combat had just started and use the new results. Initiative is rerolled at the beginning of every round.
Space
Tokens or miniatures represent characters and monsters in combat, with each square 1-inch representing 5 feet of space in the world, known as a Square. Simulating space in combat is easily implemented with a 1-inch grid, but using a ruler or tape measurer can work just as well. One Square and all eight Squares around it are called adjacent space. So, if a warrior wanted to attack a goblin with his sword, he could only do so if the goblin was within a Square that was adjacent to the warrior’s own. However, ranged weapons and spells are often exempt from this rule, and instead use a range detailed in their description.

Tactics
To truly master the nuances of warfare can take years of practice and experience, but even the greenest of adventurers can make use of a handful of special abilities known as Tactics. The effectiveness of Tactics can be increased by the Shield, Tactician, and Two-Handed martial disciplines.


Charge
When you move at least 2 Squares, you can make a charge as a free action, granting yourself +2 bonus to Damage rolls made with melee weapons this round.

Defend
As a move action, you gain a +2 bonus to Defense for 1 round.

Flank
When you and an ally are on opposite sides of an enemy’s adjacent space, you both gain a +2 bonus to attack rolls against that enemy.

Essentia
All living creatures possess a spiritual energy known as essentia which is most often intertwined with their very being. However, the races of the world (dwarves, elves, halflings, humans, orcs, and kobolds) are separated from essentia, but can use it to alter their fate. These races have a pool of essentia that they can use a number of times per day equal to Charisma (minimum 1) + ˝ their level (or until recovered by a Rest). One use of essentia can be expended as a free action to add 1d6 onto a d20 roll after the roll has been made but before hearing the result. Essentia can only be used to modify a d20 roll once per round.

Normally, only adventurers and other powerful individuals (or at least, those trained in its use) can actually use essentia. The majority of magical creatures are incapable of using their essentia to alter fate, but instead gain remarkable powers (many are the creatures presented in the Monsters section).


Table of Contents

Lappy9001
2012-04-03, 09:49 PM
Adventuring and Exploration
While most of the danger that PCs face results from combat, traversing the vastness of the world can pose an equally deadly threat. From a lush forest, to a subterranean dungeon, and even to the crowded streets of a major city, the world can be very dangerous to the unwary.

Darkness
The average light source, such as a torch or lantern, emits light out in a 5 Square radius, allowing characters to see in the dark. When immersed in complete darkness, all targets are effectively Blinded unless they have an ability that allows them to see in darkness.

Difficult Terrain
Rubble, undergrowth, and slippery surfaces are all types of difficult terrain that impede movement. It takes twice as much movement to move through a Square that contains difficult terrain.

Bodies of water are effectively a different type of difficult terrain as you can swim through water at ˝ Speed. Holding your breath underwater is detailed under the Endurance Skill.

Hazards
Environmental dangers that cause damage are called Hazards, typically using multiple d10’s for damage. Hazards include rockslides, suffocation, falling (for each 10 feet fallen), or each minute characters are exposed to extreme conditions (temperatures above 150 or below 0 Fahrenheit). The number of d10's rolled depends on the severity of the hazard, but usually never increase in increment.

Overland Travel
Position in combat is crucial, but movement outside of battle generally does not need to be recorded. When walking over vast distances, the amount of miles a character can walk in an hour is equal to ˝ their Speed, and can be maintained for 8 hours out of a day before requiring a Rest. Characters can move faster if need be, moving miles per hour equal to their Speed but can only maintain this for 2 hours out of a day before requiring a Rest.

These speeds assume terrain that is easy to traverse, as more difficult stretches of land reduce the speed as deemed necessary by the DM (usually ˝ Speed). Mounts and vehicles can ease this burden, and are described in the Equipment section.

Life and Death
How much damage your character can endure is represented by Hit Points (HP) and when damage is dealt, they lose HP. When a character reaches 0 HP they are Dying (See Conditions below) and when they drop to negative HP equal to their total Endurance bonus, they are Dead. Characters who have died can no longer interact with the world, end all ongoing abilities used by or affecting them, and unless quickly revived, their soul travels to another plane forever.

Conditions
The various effects that alter a character’s health are called Conditions. Some are helpful while others are detrimental. The same condition cannot be added onto itself, even if both come from different sources. Some Conditions can cancel out an opposing condition, but in doing so do not bestow any additional effects. There are 10 Conditions:


Blinded: You are unable to see. You roll two d20’s for attack rolls and Perception rolls and take the lower result.
Bolstered: You roll two d20’s for Saves and take the higher result. Bolstered cancels out Demoralized.
Concealed: Enemies attack you as if they were Blinded.
Demoralized: You roll two d20’s for Saves and take the lower result. Demoralized cancels out Bolstered.
Dying: When at 0 HP and below, you can take no actions, and lose 1 HP each round at the start at your turn until you are restored HP or are Dead. Either way, you cannot take actions until you are above 0 HP.
Hasted: You gain an additional minor action on your turn and your Speed is increased by 2 Squares. Hasted cancels out Slowed.
Poisoned: You take damage at the start of your turn equal to twice your level +3.
Regeneration: You recover HP at the start of your turn equal to ˝ your level +1.
Slowed: You lose a minor action on your turn and your Speed is reduced by 2 Squares. Slowed cancels out Hasted.
Weakened: You roll twice for all damage dice and take the lower result. You cannot deal critical damage.

Natural Healing and Rest
Many abilities can only be used a number of times per day and must be recovered by taking a 8 hours of uninterrupted sleep or light activity, known as a Rest. During a Rest, characters regain full use of daily abilities as well as recovering full Magic Points and Hit Points. If the Rest is taken in comfortable surroundings such as an inn with warm beds and hot meals, characters also gain a +1 bonus to all saves for one day. An additional rest cannot be taken for 12 hours.

Outside of Rest, characters heal naturally, albeit slowly, recovering HP equal to their level every hour.

Destroying Objects
Sometimes, the obstacles that face the PCs are physical barriers that need to be destroyed in order to progress. Solid objects are hardier than living creatures, and can only be destroyed if their Hit Points are completely overcome. This represents a single assault that demolishes an object, or several attempts at chipping away at the material. If an object taking up a single Square loses all its Hit Points in a single round, the object is destroyed, and the Square it occupied becomes difficult terrain. If this happens to an object taking up more than 1 Square of space, only the Square that was hit is destroyed. Any effect that targets Squares of space affects all objects within.




Material

Hit Points

Example


Fragile

5 HP
Padded cloth, leather, thick glass


Average

10 HP
Treated leather, wooden furniture


Tough

25 HP
Solid wood, plaster, thick ice, manacles


Durable

50 HP
Iron door, masonry


Unyielding

100 HP
Solid stone



An optional rule, after being pushed, if a character collides with a creature or a solid object (an object that takes up roughly 1 Square of space or more), both take 1d6 Physical damage for every Square the character was pushed back. Colliding into a creature or object ends the push, unless the object is destroyed or the creature killed. If the push continues, the effective number of Squares the creature was pushed is set back to 1. This damage counts as a Hazard.

For example, a warrior pushes a goblin back 4 Squares. The goblin is pushed back 1 Square into empty space, then into a glass window on the second Square. Both the goblin and the glass take 2d6 Physical damage. If the window does not take 5 damage the push ends. However, if the window is destroyed, the push continues. Now the goblin is pushed into empty space on the third square and a wooden chair on the fourth. Both the goblin and the chair take 2d6 Physical damage, because the goblin already collided with the window.
Traps
Traps are essentially artificial Hazards intended to waylay intruders and protect sensitive areas. A trap usually takes up a single Square and activates when a creature enters its space. When activated, a trap delivers the effect on all creatures within its Square, or its Square and a certain amount of adjacent space, and becomes inert until reset.

The Difficulty of a trap is 15 + Level. Disabling or resetting a trap takes a Mechanics roll equal to the Difficulty of the trap. There are several broad categories of traps:


Condition Trap: Condition traps inflict a Condition (Blinded, Demoralized, Poisoned, Slowed, or Weakened) and deal 1d6 (Cold, Fire, Physical, or Shock) damage per every 2 levels. Targets that succeed a Save (Fortitude, Reflex, or Will, depending on the trap) take half damage and ignore the effect.

Damage Trap: Damage traps deal 1d6 (Cold, Fire, Physical, or Shock) damage per level. Targets that succeed a Reflex save take half damage.

Movement Trap: Movement traps push targets back 1 Square per level in a single direction. Targets that succeed a Fortitude save are not pushed.

Pit Trap: Pit traps drop creatures 10 feet per level. A creature making a successful Reflex save can immediately move ˝ their Speed as a free action. If unable to escape the affected area of the trap, they fall.

Terrain Trap: Terrain traps simple turn their affected area into difficult terrain.

Generally, traps are best used as part of an encounter with living opponents as they can become tedious and either too deadly or too ineffectual when used alone. And of course, a trap is likely given a unique description more flavorful than “Damage Trap.” For example, a bear trap may be a Slowed Condition Trap, or a movement trap may be a hidden catapult.

The costs of building a trap are generally up to GM discretion (considering the open-ended design of traps), and depends on the complexity of the trap. For example a pit trap is basically a disguised hole, but a Demoralizing Condition trap may use a complex magical apparatus.


Table of Contents

Lappy9001
2012-04-03, 09:50 PM
Races
Many peoples and cultures populate the world, and your character’s race is an important aspect of their identity. Races grant different abilities and modifiers that help them in game, but they also have unique histories and traits that influence their perspective of the world. (Consider the races provided here to be 'core races.' Additional races can be found in the Custom Races section)

The following shows how to read a race’s description:

Attributes: Races grant a +1 bonus to a single attribute.
Speed: This is how fast a character can move during a move action.
Skill: Races grant a +1 bonus to two different skills.
Minor Ability: Each race has a unique passive ability.
Major Ability: Each race has a unique activated ability that can be used once per day. An additional use of this ability is gained every 3 levels. Using a race’s Major Ability is a free action unless otherwise noted, but can only be used once per round.
Language: Each race starts off knowing how to read, speak, and write one or two languages. Knowing a language also means being versed in cultural mores and traditions. Some widespread languages include:


Common: The widespread language of humans is known by almost every race (English!)
Draconic: An intricate and ancient tongue, the language of the dragons is rough to non-dragon ears, but commands a certain sense of power in the words.
Dwarven: The language of the dwarves, Dwarven is simple for Common-speakers to grasp (being the language’s forbear), but the long-standing cultural traditions are far more complex.
Elven: The beautiful and eloquent language of the elves allegedly requires decades of learning to retain more than a rudimentary understanding.
Goblin: The rough language of the goblin folk that possesses no written alphabet.
Runic: The language of the planes is a complex tongue with four main dialects of Aquan, Auran, Ingan, and Terran.
Underword: The sibilant, quiet tongue of subterranean races that incorporates a fair amount of sing language.
Wilden: The verbally simplistic, yet culturally complex language of the beastfolk and other races of the wild.


Dwarf
Dwarves are a hardy and stalwart people that build their stone cities on mountain peaks and rolling hills. Known for their enduring fortitude and loyalty, dwarves make excellent warriors and devoted allies. Standing no more than 4 ˝ feet with stout builds, dwarven men sport long beards while women wear braids, with brown, grey, and dusky red being the most common hair and skin colors. Dwarves are also adept at engineering and are responsible for many clever inventions.


Attribute: +1 Constitution
Speed: 5 Squares
Skill: +1 Endurance, +1 Mechanics
Sturdy: Dwarves ignore Speed penalties from armor. In addition, dwarves affected by the Poisoned condition lose 2 fewer HP each round.
Stone Soul: A dwarf can remove any one Condition (except for Dying) currently afflicting them.
Languages: Dwarves speak Common and Dwarven.


Elf
Elves are a fair and beautiful race known for their long lives and even longer collective memory. Elves are recognized by their slim, tall frames standing above 6 feet, almond-shaped eyes, and long pointed ears to match their keen senses. Infamous keepers on knowledge, elves can live indefinitely if they have a devoted cause, but can become reserved and unsettled at advanced years. Regardless, elves are wise, patient, and masters of arcane magic.


Attribute: +1 Wisdom
Speed: 6 Squares
Skill: +1 Knowledge, +1 Perception
Magic Within: Elves learn 1 Cantrip ability from the mage class.
Arcane Recollection: Immediately after casting a spell, an elf can recover all the MP used in the spell’s casting.
Languages: Elves speak Common and Elven.


Halfling
Halflings are wanderers and nomads at heart, taken to traversing the vast wilderness in great caravans. Halflings are a short folk, rarely reaching higher than 3 ˝ feet, possessing noticeably sharp features and wiry frames. While not known for strength, halflings can move with surprising alacrity when unencumbered and can do so almost silently. Blessed with an uncanny sense of luck, halflings are also adept at herbalism, leading many to become skilled healers.


Attribute: +1 Dexterity
Speed: 5 Squares
Skill: +1 Alchemy, +1 Stealth
Underfoot: A halfling gains a +2 bonus to Speed when unarmored or wearing light armor.
Lucky: A halfling can gain a +1 bonus to Saves for 3 rounds. This bonus increases by +1 every 3 levels.
Languages: Halflings speak Common and Wilden.


Human
Humans are metropolitan by nature and tend to group together to build massive cities of remarkable architectural prowess. Humans are fairly robust, standing at 5 to 6 ˝ feet with rounded ears and incredible diversity in hair, eye, and skin color. Known for possessing a poor collective memory and occasional lack of foresight, humans are nevertheless skilled at crafting and are famously ambitious, able to achieve amazing feats when pressed.


Attribute: +1 Intelligence
Speed: 6 Squares
Skill: +1 Mechanics, +1 Runecrafting
Tenacity: Humans gain a +1 bonus to Fortitude, Reflex, or Will.
Improvisation: A human can reroll a d20 immediately after making the roll, but before hearing the result.
Languages: Humans speak Common and one other language (Dwarven, Elven, or Goblin).


Kobold
Kobolds are the malformed offspring of dragons, but the ones seen in civilized lands are far and away from their degenerate siblings. Extremely small, scrawny, and rarely reaching over 3 feet, kobolds possess draconic features, short tails, and dusky scales mimicking the colors of their dragon parents. Accomplished at elemental magic, kobolds have a surprisingly strong presence, and many become leaders among their pack while others steal away into the brighter outside world.


Attribute: +1 Charisma
Speed: 5 Squares
Skill: +1 Speech, +1 Stealth
Drake Skin: Kobolds gain a +1 bonus to Defense
Dragon’s Wrath: Kobolds can roll maximum damage dice with a single spell that deals Cold, Fire, or Shock damage.
Language: Kobolds speak Common and Draconic.


Orc
Orcs are natural survivors and seem instinctively drawn to some of the harshest environments on the fringes of the world. Powerfully built, orcs typically stand above 6 feet with skin varying from grey to green, notable tusks, and red, green, or yellow eyes. Extraordinary fighters, orcs challenge stronger opponents to better themselves, possessing a natural wanderlust. Many orcs hear the call of nature, and practice the ancient shamanistic traditions of their race.


Attribute: +1 Strength
Speed: 6 Squares
Skill: +1 Athletics, +1 Nature
Troll-Blooded: Orcs affected by the Regeneration Condition recover an additional 2 HP each round.
Rage: An orc can enter a frenzied state and roll maximum damage dice with melee weapons for 3 rounds. However, they take a -2 penalty to Defense during Rage.
Language: Orcs speak Common and Goblin.


Racial Templates
Perfect for players who want to play something more exotic or unusual than an elf or a dwarf, Racial Templates alter the way a Race is played, and grant new strengths and weaknesses to a character. A Racial Template is applied to a Race and swaps out many of its characteristics. Only one racial template may be applied at a time.

Attributes: The base race’s Attribute Bonus changes to this.
Speed: Reduce or Increase the base race’s Speed by this amount.
Skill: Replace a Skill Bonus with this Skill, or if the Skill is already possessed, increase it to +2, and lose the other Skill Bonus.
Minor Ability: Replace the base race’s Minor Ability.
Major Ability: Replace the base race’s Major Ability.
Languages: Adds to known languages.

Aasimar
There exist a rare few in the world who have been blessed by celestials. Often, a blessing is bestowed by an angel as a gift in return for a selfless deed, or to an individual favored by destiny. Aasimar have a natural empathy towards others, and while not all are virtuous, most do devote themselves to a just cause. The birth of an aasimar is seen as a good omen, and the gift can be passed down family lines. Aasimar look like a member of their native race, but with subtle angelic features such as white or gold hair, and can surround themselves with a halo of light.


(Minor) Halo: Aasimar learn the Light cantrip from the mage class.
(Major) Hallow: As a minor action, the aasimar and all adjacent allies recover HP equal to the twice the aasimar's level for 3 rounds.

Deep-Dweller
Far beneath the earth in subterranean cave complexes live those who have adapted to the darkness below. Physically similar to their above ground cousins, deep-dwellers tend to have dusky skin, sometimes pure black, white or silver hair, and white or gold eyes that emit a low glow in darkness. Deep-dwellers tend to be quieter, more wary, and possess more patience than those that live in the light. While uncommon, deep-dwellers find their own reasons to emerging from the depths of the earth, and bring a unique outlook to the world above.


(Skill) +1 Stealth
(Minor) Darkvision: You can see without any light sources (albeit without color) and ignore Concealment from darkness. You take a -2 penalty to Perception rolls when in direct sunlight.
(Languages) Deep-Dwellers speak Underword.

Graveborn
When a rare mortal with a strong will is slain with unfinished business, they may arise from the grave to complete in death what they could not in life. However, this second life has consequences, and graveborn are cursed in that they cling onto the barest spark of life, and remember almost nothing of their former selves except their unfinished tasks. Rising usually within a week of death, graveborn reveal significant decay, but vaguely resemble their former selves, albeit with glowing, determined eyes and a grave pallor.


(Speed) -1 Square
(Minor) Curse of the Grave: Graveborn only recover half the amount from any effect that restores Hit Points.
(Major) Undead Resiliency: Graveborn do not need to eat, drink, breathe, or sleep but must still take a Rest to recover abilities. Graveborn are immune to the Blinded, Poisoned, Slowed, and Weakened status conditions, and do not lose 1 HP per round when Dying. Unlike other Major racial abilities, Undead Resiliency provides a passive benefit.

Half-Blood
Most of the civilized races stem from a common ancestor, and a union between two different races results in a half-blooded child. Depending on the half-blood’s environment and upbringing, their dual heritage can be a gift or a burden, and is often both. Half-bloods blend the physical features of both parents and is identified with the name of both races (such as a human half-elf, or a dwarven half-orc). The dual heritage of a half-blood only lasts for one generation, a union with a full-blood will result in a full-blood of either race.

Creating a half-blood uses one race as a chassis (called the base race) with another (called the half-race).


(Skill) Replace one skill from the base race with one of the half-race, or increase a shared skill to +2, and lose the other skill bonuses.
(Minor) Replace the base race’s minor ability with the half-race’s minor ability.
(Languages) Gain the language of the half-race.

Plane Touched
The movements and phases of the planes can cause strange phenomenon in the physical realm. Those born when the planes align in certain positions often possess the traits of a particular element. This manifestation greatly changes a plane touched’s appearance depending on their favored element, from differently brightly colored skin and hair, glowing eyes, unusually high or low body temperature, and strange runes that cover the body. Plane touched have naturally powerful personalities and are adept at bending the elements to their will.


(Attribute) +1 Charisma
(Minor) Elemental Soul: Plane Touched gain a +3 bonus to Resistance against Cold, Fire, or Shock Damage.
(Languages) Plane Touched speak Runic.

Tiefling
Some souls are cursed by the demons long before their soul departs their body. Tieflings have little control of their heritage, passed on from an ancestor, most commonly through a demonic pact or a dark blessing to a favored minion. The birth of a tielfing is considered an evil omen, and many tieflings born to superstitious parents are abandoned at a young age. However, the fate of a tiefling is their own to decide and have no natural predisposition to good or evil. Tieflings look like their native race, but with subtle demonic features like red eyes or small horns.


(Minor) Darkvision: You can see without any light sources (albeit without color) and ignore Concealment from darkness. You take a -2 penalty to Perception rolls when in direct sunlight.
(Major) Curse: As a minor action you can inflict an enemy within 5 Squares with a penalty equal to ˝ your level (minimum 1) to attack, damage, save, or skill rolls. The curse lasts for 3 rounds.


Table of Contents

Lappy9001
2012-04-03, 09:52 PM
Classes and Leveling
A character’s class is like a very broad description that gauges how they learn new abilities, which attributes are most important, and what role they fill in a party. The three classes are mage, rogue, and warrior. Classes gain additional abilities as they gain Experience (XP) (See Experience and Levels in the section below). The following shows how to read a class’ description.


Starting HP: This is how many Hit Points the class gains at 1st level.

HP per Level: This is how many Hit Points are gained each level, determined by the roll of a particular dice known as a hit dice. You can retry this roll once each level, but must take the second result.

Save Bonus: All classes gain a bonus to Saves equal to ˝ their level, but also gain a +2 bonus to a specific Save at level 1.

Trained Skills: This is how many skills a class can add ˝ their level to. Other skills do not gain this bonus (See Skills and Talents).

Proficiency: This is what weapons and armor a class is trained to use (See Equipment and Weapons).

Vocation: Each class picks a vocation at level 1 that determines a character's primary attribute and grants a set of abilities that can be improved upon reaching a milestone.

Ability: Each level, a class learns an ability that they specialize in, as shown in their table. Abilities target yourself, an ally (which can still be you), an enemy, or a Square of space. You must be able to see the target or Square and cannot be obstructed in order for the ability to function. Unless otherwise stated, using an ability is a major action.

Bonus: Bonus levels (2nd, 3rd, 5th, 7th, and 9th) allow a character to pick an ability outside of their class specialty. In other words, a mage can select a maneuver or talent, a rogue can select a maneuver or spell, and a warrior can learn a spell or talent.

Milestone: Milestone levels (4th, 6th, and 8th) increase a character’s class abilities and increase their primary attribute and another attribute of choice by +1.

Experience and Levels
Characters face many challenges during their adventures, and are able to acquire more power through Experience (XP). Generally, whenever you win a combat encounter, or complete a challenging event, you receive a certain amount of XP depending on the difficulty of the situation. The GM assigns XP for a given encounter using the guidelines below based on how well the party fared. It’s a good idea to award XP for the entire party at once, but this may not always be the case. These guidelines are meant to be loose, so it’s up to the GM to decide how XP is to be assigned (if at all!).


Easy Encounter: 5 XP
Average Encounter: 10 XP
Challenging Encounter: 15 XP
Harrowing Encounter: 20 XP

Each time your character reaches 100 XP, they gain a level, progressing through to the next tier of their class.

Mage
Mages are wielders of magic and are capable of an impressive range of powers through their spells. Generally lacking on Hit Points and Defense, mages often avoid melee combat with ranged spells to decimate enemy ranks, bolster allies, and control the battlefield.

HP at 1st Level: 12 + Constitution
HP per Level: 1d6 + Constitution

Save Bonus: +2 Will
Trained Skills: 2

Proficiency: Mages are proficient with no weapons or armor.




Level


Benefit



1st
Cantrips, Spell, Vocation


2nd
Bonus, Spell


3rd
Bonus, Spell


4th
Mage Milestone, Spell


5th
Bonus, Spell


6th
Mage Milestone, Spell


7th
Bonus, Spell


8th
Mage Milestone, Spell


9th
Bonus, Spell


10th
Spell



Vocation
A mage must choose one of the abilities below to determine their primary attribute:


Cleric
Clerics use Wisdom as their primary attribute and gain the following abilities:


Divine Healing
Whenever you recover HP through or restore the HP of an ally through an ability (not including the Regeneration condition), add your Wisdom to the total HP healed.

Restoration
As a major action, you can relieve an adjacent ally of a single condition (other than Dying). This ability can be used a number of times per day equal to your Wisdom.

Elementalist
Elementalists use Intelligence as their primary attribute and gain the following abilities:


Elemental Focus
Upon gaining this ability, choose a damage type (Cold, Fire, or Shock). As a free action, you can augment the next spell you cast this round that deals Cold, Fire, or Shock damage to instead deal your chosen damage type.

Energy Shield
As a free action, whenever you or adjacent allies would be damaged by an effect that deals Cold, Fire, or Shock damage, you can alter the effect to instead deal your chosen damage type and reduce the damage by 2. This ability can be used a number of times per day equal to your Intelligence.


Sorcerer
Sorcerers use Charisma as their primary attribute and gain the following abilities:


Arcane Ancestry
You can augment spells you cast as if you were 1 level higher.

Wild Magic
As a free action, you can augment the next spell you cast this round to gain one of the following effects: If the spell has a duration, it is increased by 3 rounds. If the spell deals Cold, Fire, or Shock damage, it deals +1 damage per damage dice. If targets of the spell can attempt a Save, the Difficulty of the spell is increased by +1. This ability can be used a number of times per day equal to your Charisma.

Cantrips
You learn minor magic with certain abilities called cantrips. Using a cantrip is a minor action, although only one cantrip can be used in a single turn. At 1st level, you gain the Magic Missile cantrip and an additional cantrip of choice from the list below:


Arcane Shield
You gain a +1 Shield bonus to Defense for 1 round. This bonus increases by +1 each Milestone.

Elemental Roulette
You can change the damage type of Magic Missile to Cold, Fire, or Shock as a free action. Elemental Roulette can be used in the same round as Magic Missile.

Ghost Sound
You can conjure soft music, whispering sounds, or silent messages that can be sent to allies within 10 Squares.

Handy Haversack
You possess a tiny extradimensional portal always within hand’s reach. The portal is a cubic 1 ft. space and can hold up to 25 lbs. You can store or withdraw an object as a minor action.

Light
You create a heatless light source that lasts indefinitely, floating above you, in your hand, or on a held object. You choose the color and appearance of the light, and can move it up to 5 Squares as a minor action. The light is extinguished if you create another or if you choose to dismiss it as a free action.

Magic Missile
You deal 1d4+1 Physical damage to an enemy within 5 Squares. This attack automatically hits and requires no attack roll. The damage increases by 1d4+1 each Milestone.

Prestidigitation
You can change the visual appearance, color, taste, or touch of an unattended nonliving adjacent object. The effect lasts for 1 hour or until you dismiss it as a free action.

Prayer
Allies within 5 Squares 1d4+1 Hit Points. The HP recovered increases by 1d4+1 each Milestone.

Shadow Weapon
You summon a one-handed weapon in a free hand (assigning Properties if proficient with it) and gain a +1 Weapon bonus to attack and damage rolls with it, although you do not gain proficiency with the weapon. Shadow Weapon lasts indefinitely, until you dismiss it as a free action. The bonus to attack and damage rolls increase by +1 each Milestone.

Telekinesis
You can manipulate an unattended object of 5 lbs. and can move it up to 5 Squares away or towards yourself, although the force is not enough to deal damage. The weight of the objects you can lift increases by 5 lbs. each Mage Milestone.

Mage Milestone
Increase your primary attribute and an additional attribute of choice by +1. An ability granted by your Vocation improves as shown below:


Cleric: The HP restored by Divine Healing increases by 2.

Elementalist: The damage reduced by Energy Shield increases by 2.

Sorcerer: The bonus to damage granted by Wild Magic increases by +1 or 1 round.

Rogues
Rogues make up a jack of all trades class that excels in using skills and talents to overcome obstacles. Rogues are likely to have a trick up their sleeve to solve almost any encounter and can usually improvise if they don’t. Equally effective both in and out of combat, rogues can easily fill any class role, at least temporarily

HP at 1st Level: 16 + Constitution
HP per Level: 1d8 + Constitution

Save Bonus: +2 Reflex
Trained Skills: 4

Proficiency: Rogues are proficient with one-handed weapons, ranged weapons, and light armor.




Level


Benefit



1st
Lucky Shot, Talent, Vocation


2nd
Bonus, Talent


3rd
Bonus, Talent


4th
Rogue Milestone, Talent


5th
Bonus, Talent


6th
Rogue Milestone, Talent


7th
Bonus, Talent


8th
Rogue Milestone, Talent


9th
Bonus, Talent


10th
Talent



Vocation
A rogue must choose one of the abilities below to determine their primary attribute:


Assassin
Assassins use Dexterity as their primary attribute and gain the following abilities:


Agile Strike
You may use your Dexterity in place of Strength for damage rolls with One-Handed weapons.

Sneak Attack
As a free action, when you attack a Flanked enemy or an enemy that has not acted this turn, you can roll an additional weapon damage dice.

Bard
Bards use Charisma as their primary attribute and gain the following abilities:


Jack of all Trades
You gain a +1 bonus to either Attack rolls, Damage rolls, or Saves. You can move this bonus to either Attack, Damage, or Saves as a minor action. The bonuses granted by this ability do not stack with Jack of All Trades or Inspirational Performance.

Inspirational Performance
As a minor action, all allies within 5 Squares can gain your current Jack of All Trades bonus for 3 rounds. This ability can be used a number of times per day equal to your Charisma.

Dilettante
Dilettantes use Intelligence as their primary attribute and gain the following abilities:


Expertise
You gain a +2 bonus to a single untrained skill.

Dabble
As a free action, you can move your bonus from Expertise to another untrained skill of choice. This ability can be used a number of times per day equal to your Intelligence.

Lucky Shot
You use a 1d8 instead of 1d6 when modifying dice rolls with essentia. Your total pool of essentia is your Intelligence + ˝ level + 1.

Rogue Milestone
Increase your primary attribute and an additional attribute of choice by +1. You gain an additional point of essentia. An ability granted by your Vocation improves as shown below:


Assassin: You can roll an additional damage dice with Sneak Attack.

Bard: The bonus granted by Jack of All Trades increases by +1.

Dilettante: The bonus granted by Expertise to untrained skills increases by +1.

Warrior
Warriors are formidable combatants capable of taking on the toughest of foes head on with brute force or clever tactics. Warriors tend to play offensively or defensively, and when they can't quickly dispatch an opponent, warriors can provide distractions or guard allies through their incredible resolve.

HP at 1st Level: 20 + Constitution
HP per Level: 1d10 + Constitution

Save Bonus: +2 Fortitude
Trained Skills: 2

Proficiency: Warriors are proficient with two-handed weapons, one-handed weapons, ranged weapons, heavy armor, light armor, and shields.




Level


Benefit



1st
Challenge, Maneuver, Vocation


2nd
Bonus, Maneuver


3rd
Bonus, Maneuver


4th
Warrior Milestone, Maneuver


5th
Bonus, Maneuver


6th
Warrior Milestone, Maneuver


7th
Bonus, Maneuver


8th
Warrior Milestone, Maneuver


9th
Bonus, Maneuver


10th
Maneuver



Vocation
A warrior must choose one of the abilities below to determine their primary attribute:


Champion
Champions use Constitution as their primary attribute and gain the following abilities:


Battle Vigor
The first time you deal damage to an enemy with a weapon damage roll this round, you recover 2 HP.

Indomitable
As a free action, you can become immune to a single condition for 3 rounds. This ability can be used a number of times per day equal to your Constitution.

Marksman
Marksmen use Dexterity as their primary attribute and gain the following abilities:


Sniper
You gain a +1 bonus to damage rolls made with ranged weapons with the Ammunition property.

Deadly Accuracy
As a free action, you can reroll a failed ranged attack roll with a +2 bonus. This ability can be used a number of times per day equal to your Dexterity.

Ravager
Ravagers use Strength as their primary attribute and gain the following abilities:


Power Attack
As a free action, you can take a -2 penalty on your next melee attack roll this round, and gain a +2 bonus to damage if the attack is successful.

Relentless
As a free action after a failed melee attack roll, you can deal Physical damage to the target of the attack equal to your Strength. This ability can be used a number of times per day equal to your Strength.

Challenge
You may challenge an enemy after attacking them (even on a failed attack roll) as a free action. They take a -2 penalty to attack rolls and saves if they target any creature other than you with an attack roll or ability. Challenge lasts 1 round and can only be used once per round.

Warrior Milestone
Increase your primary attribute and an additional attribute of choice by +1. You gain a +1 bonus on weapon damage rolls, and the penalty inflicted by Challenge increases by -1. An ability granted by your Vocation improves as shown below:


Champion: You recover +1 HP with Battle Vigor

Marksman: The bonus granted by Sniper increases by +1.

Ravager: The bonus to damage granted by Power Attack increases by +1.


Table of Contents

Lappy9001
2012-04-03, 09:54 PM
Maneuvers and Martial Disciplines
The purview of warriors, maneuvers represent mastery over weaponry or tactics, and are divided into groups called martial disciplines. Granting bonuses to attack, damage, and rerolls on saves, maneuvers focus on overwhelming offense, imposing defense, teamwork, and self-sufficiency. When learning maneuvers, the base ability (called the base maneuver in this section) is automatically gained whenever another maneuver from the discipline is learned. However, the base maneuver grants no AP, nor does it benefit from itself if it increases in power from other maneuvers.

Attack Points
Whenever a maneuver is learned a single Attack Point (AP) is gained. Attack Points are automatically added to a character’s attack rolls and applies to any weapon they wield. Attack Points often passively affect maneuvers, increasing their potency.

Combat Style and Proficiency
Many martial disciplines focus on a certain group of equipment, and require a certain combat style in order work effectively. Typically, this is as simple as wielding a one-handed weapon in order to use the one-handed discipline.

Proficiency is gained from a character’s class or from a base maneuver of certain martial disciplines. A character using a weapon or armor they are not proficient with cannot benefit from any Properties the weapon or armor possesses (see Equipment and Weapons in the section below).

Archery
The archery martial discipline benefits the dexterous and perceptive combatant, and focuses on the speed and lethality of ranged weapons. Archery maneuvers rely on dealing critical damage and multiple attacks that greatly increase the chance for a deadly shot.
Combat Style: You must be wielding a ranged weapon.


Deadly Aim (Base Maneuver)
Increase the Critical Threat of ranged weapons by 2 for each Archery maneuver learned. You gain proficiency with ranged weapons.


Hit and Run
You can make a ranged attack roll (still as a major action) during a move action and continue moving with the same move action as long as you have Speed remaining this turn.

Penetrate Defense
After dealing critical damage to an enemy, your next successful ranged attack roll on that target within 1 round automatically deals critical damage.

Rapid Shot
After a successful ranged attack roll, you can make additional attack rolls with ranged weapons this round, each as a minor action.

Heavy Armor
The heavy armor martial discipline focuses in using the often cumbersome weight of mail to its full advantage. Heavy armor maneuvers are less about avoiding attacks, and more about absorbing damage, allowing wielders to fighter longer and worry less about their Hit Points.
Combat Style: You must be wearing heavy armor.


Damage Reduction (Base Maneuver)
You gain a +3 Might bonus to Physical Resistance (or increase an existing bonus by +3) for each Heavy Armor maneuver you possess. You gain proficiency with heavy armor.


Adamantine Stance
Whenever you are forcibly moved from your space, you may reduce the amount of space moved by up to 2 Squares, and an additional Square for every 3 AP you possess.

Great Fortitude
You gain a +2 Might bonus to Fortitude saves. Once per round, you may reroll a Fortitude save after making the roll but before hearing the result from the GM.

Fortification
Whenever you are dealt critical damage, you can, as a free action, ignore the additional damage dice from critical damage. You can use Fortification once per day, and an additional time per day for every 3 AP you possess.

Light Armor
The light armor martial discipline is a popular choice for rogues, duelists, and other skirmish fighters, focusing on mobility. Light armor maneuvers are useful for those who choose to be unburdened by heavy armor, and are effective when wearing no armor at all.
Combat Style: You must be wearing light armor, or no armor.


Mithril Stance (Base Maneuver)
As a free action, you may take a -1 Might penalty to attack rolls and gain a +1 Might bonus to Defense for 1 round. You can choose to increase the penalty by -1 and increase the bonus by +1 for each Light Armor maneuver you possess. You gain proficiency with light armor.


Lightning Reflexes
You gain a +2 Might bonus to Reflex saves. Once per round, you may reroll a Reflex save after making the roll but before hearing the result from the GM.

Momentum
After a successful attack roll, your Initiative result increases by 1.

Sidestep Dodge
Once per round for each light armor maneuver you possess, you can immediately move 1 Square as a free action after being targeted by a failed melee attack, even if you have no Speed remaining this round.

Mounted
Practitioners of the mounted discipline share their martial training with another, a faithful creature that carries them into battle. Mounted combat generally requires more space than normal combat styles, but can allow a fighter to quickly travel anywhere on the battlefield. Training a mount falls under the Nature skill, which is also used to control the mount. A character can use mounted maneuvers while riding any creature with the Mount trait.

A willing creature with the mount trait can allow a rider that does not possess the Giant trait to ride them. A mount and rider share the same space and combine actions, allowing a major, move, and minor action between them. Both act under the same turn, and can use either Initiative (whichever is higher), with the mount’s Speed. Any attack that affects a rider can instead affect the mount and vice versa, and effects that push can either knock the rider off the mount, or instead move the mount.
Combat Style: You must be riding a mount.


Shared Strength (Base Maneuver)
You can spend 1 day with a rideable creature and mark it as your designated mount, although you can only have one such mount at a time. While riding your designated mount, it gains a bonus to HP equal to ˝ your HP total, and a bonus to Fortitude, Reflex, and Will saves equal to ˝ your total bonus for each save. The mount also gains a +1 Might bonus to defense, saves, and +10 HP for each mounted maneuver you possess.


Ride-By Attack
You can make a melee attack roll (still as a major action) during a move action and continue moving with the same move action as long as you have Speed remaining this turn.

Rider's Bond
Any temporary beneficial ability that affects you also affects your designated mount if you are riding or are adjacent to one another.

Spirited Charge
Increase Maneuver Difficulty by +2 while mounted.

One-Handed
Focusing on precision and speed, the one-handed martial discipline allows agile fighters to strike with multiple attacks, often while wielding multiple weapons. In addition to an increased critical threat range, one-handed maneuvers can block attacks and deal extra damage to slower or unwary opponents.
Combat Style: You must be wielding single or dual one-handed weapons.


Dueling (Base Maneuver)
Increase the critical threat of one-handed weapons by 1 for each one-handed maneuver you possess. You gain proficiency with one-handed weapons.


Dual Strike
After a successful melee attack roll, you can make additional attack rolls with melee weapons this round, each as a minor action.

Parry
Once per round as a minor action, you may make a damage roll after taking damage from an enemy attack or ability, and reduce the damage taken by that amount (to a minimum of 0). Parry can be used even if it is not your turn, but still requires the use of a minor action.

Precision
After a successful melee attack on a flanked enemy or an enemy with a lower Initiative result, you roll an additional damage dice for your damage roll. You can roll an additional damage dice for every 3 AP you possess.

Shield
The shield martial discipline focuses primarily on defense, allowing the wielder to deflect attacks rather than absorb them. Shield maneuvers also grant abilities to overrun opponents and guard nearby allies.
Combat Style: You must be wielding a shield.


Iron Stance (Base Maneuver)
You can use the Defend tactic as a Minor action. While using the Defend Tactic, you gain a +1 Might bonus to defense. The bonus increases by +1 for every Shield maneuver you possess. You gain proficiency with shields.


Overrun
When using the Charge Tactic, you can move through enemy space. Enemies in your path must succeed a Fortitude save or be pushed back or aside up to 2 Squares (your choice). If the enemy succeeds on the save, or if they are pushed back, your movement ends. The distance you can push back an enemy increases by 1 Square for every 3 AP you possess.

Shieldmate
When using the Defend tactic, adjacent allies gain a +1 Might bonus to Defense. This bonus increases by +1 for every 3 AP you possess.

Warden
Whenever a melee attack would target an adjacent ally, you can choose for that attack to target you instead.

Spellbreaker
The spellbreaker martial discipline takes use of specialized mental and physical techniques to channel arcane energy into attacks. Spellbreaker maneuvers allow wielders to rob casters of their Magic Points and can even cancel out beneficial spell effects.
Combat Style: None. Spellbreaker can be used with any weapon or armor combination.


Smite
After a successful attack, you can force the enemy you attacked to lose 1d4 MP or to lose 1 use of an ability that has daily uses. Targets that succeed a Will save ignore this effect. The MP loss increases by +2 and the ability loss increases by +1 for every Spellbreaker maneuver you possess.


Break Concentration
As a minor action, you force adjacent enemies attempting to cast spells to double the MP cost of the spell. Targets that succeed a Will save ignore this effect.

Dispel
As a minor action, you cause an enemy target affected by Smite since the start of your last turn must succeed a Fortitude save or have one spell or beneficial condition (Bolstered, Concealed, Hasted, or Regeneration) currently affecting them end immediately.

Iron Will
You gain a +2 Might bonus to Will saves. Once per round, you may reroll a Will save after making the roll but before hearing the result from the GM.

Tactician
Mastering the battlefield through strategy, mobility, and positioning, the tactician martial discipline allows wielders to stay one step ahead of their opponents, and take actions outside of their turn.
Combat Style: None. Tactician can be used with any weapon or armor combination.


Surround
When using the Flank Tactic, you can Flank from any angle, as long as you and an ally are adjacent to the same enemy's space. In addition, you and allies participating in the Flank gain a +1 Might bonus to attack rolls for every Tactician maneuver you possess.


Counter
After being targeted by a failed melee attack, you may use a minor action to immediately make a melee weapon attack against that target, even if it is not your turn. Counter may only be used once per round.

Impede
You can make an attack roll against an enemy who moves into or through your adjacent space as a free action, even if it is not your turn. Impede may only be used once per round, although it can be used even if you have no actions remaining.

Pursuit
When an enemy leaves your adjacent space, you may follow them as a move action up to your Speed if you have Speed remaining this round, even if it is not your turn. Pursuit may be only be used once per round.

Two-Handed
The two-handed martial discipline focuses on overwhelming offense to bring down even the most powerful of opponents. Two-handed maneuvers allow fighters to charge into position, scything through enemies and scattering their ranks.
Combat Style: You must be wielding a two-handed weapon.


Lancer (Base Maneuver)
When using the Charge Tactic, you gain a +1 Might bonus to Speed for each two-handed maneuver you possess. In addition, you gain a +1 Might bonus to Damage rolls for each two-handed maneuver you possess.


Cleave
After a successful melee attack, you may make another melee attack on an adjacent enemy as a minor action.

Knockback
After a successful melee attack, you may push an enemy backwards up to 2 Squares as a minor action. Targets that succeed a Fortitude save ignore this effect. The distance you can push back an enemy increases by 1 Square for every 3 AP you possess.

Sundering Assault
After a successful or failed melee attack, you may cause the space occupied by your opponent to become difficult terrain as a minor action.

Weapon Mastery
The martial discipline of weapon mastery focuses on using a weapon to its maximum potential for both damage and adaptability. By honing both the body and the mind, an adherent to weapon mastery can also use their fists as effectively as any blade.
Combat Style: None. Weapon Mastery can be used with any weapon or armor combination.


Weapon Specialization (Base Maneuver)
Increase the damage dice of any weapon (including your fists) you wield by 1 increment.


Adaptability
A single weapon you wield gains an additional property as long as you possess it. Once the extra property has been chosen, it cannot be changed. If you learn or have learned the Pugilist maneuver, your fists gain an additional property.

Pugilist
You gain a Might bonus to Defense equal to 2 plus ˝ your AP when unarmored. Your fists gain two of the following properties and increase their damage dice by 1 increment; Flurry, Ki-Strike, or Natural Weapon.

Sure Hit
You can reroll a result of 1 on your weapon’s damage dice, once per damage roll.




Table of Contents

Lappy9001
2012-04-03, 09:56 PM
Spells and Arcane Schools
The purview of mages, spells allows magic users to tug on the lines of reality and alter the world around them. Spells are divided into different groups of knowledge called arcane schools. Spells allow casters to clear out large clusters of enemies, weakening individual targets, and to empower allies. When learning spells, the base ability (called the base spell in this section) is automatically gained whenever another spell from the school is learned. However, the base spell grants no MP. All spells use Charisma to determine Difficulty.

Magic Points
Whenever a spell is learned, 1d4+3 Magic Points (MP) are gained. Just like Hit Points, the roll for MP can be rerolled once. Casting a spell uses at least 1 MP, and MP is fully restored during a Rest.

Spell Effects and Metamagic
Most spells become more powerful by spending additional MP when the spell is cast, although what happens by spending this extra MP is detailed in the spell’s description. If a spell forces a target to make a Save roll, each additional 1 MP spent in the casting of the spell increases the spell’s Difficulty by +1. The maximum MP that can be used on a spell equals the level of the caster. Unless otherwise noted, spells can be cast on a space or target within 5 Squares.

When all the spells in an arcane school are learned, the caster can augment the power of the base spell using effects called metamagic. Only one metamagic can be applied to a base spell, and once chosen cannot be changed. Metamagic can generally only be applied to certain base spells, as shown below:


Empower Spell
The damage dice of the base spell is increased by 1 increment. The dice used in Cure Wounds increases by 1 increment.
Spells: Blizzard, Cure Wounds, Fireball, Lightning Bolt.

Extend Spell
The base spell’s duration is increased by 3 rounds.
Spells: Barrier, Jinx, Necrosis

Permanency
The base spell costs 1 less MP to cast, allowing it to be cast without MP if only 1 MP would have been used in the casting.
Spells: Barrier, Blink, Blizzard, Cure Wounds, Fireball, Foresight, Jinx, Lightning Bolt, Necrosis, Recall Obect


Divination
The arcane school of foretelling future events, divination allows casters to alter fate and gain sight from afar. Divination spells are generally more useful outside of combat, although their ability to link allies together telepathically and predict outcomes can be indispensible.


Foresight (Base Spell)
You grant yourself or an ally a +1 Spirit bonus to all d20 rolls made within 3 rounds. The duration increases by 3 rounds, and the bonus increases by +1 for every additional 3 MP spent on this spell.


Augury
You gain a quick look into fate, allowing you to know the general result of an action as favorable, unfavorable, both, or neither. In addition, you can reroll your next essentia roll within 1 minute. Augury can only see into the short-term future of around half an hour. The duration of the spell increases by 1 minute for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.

Mindlink
You establish a telepathic link between yourself and an ally for 1 hour that persists regardless of distance. Participating targets can communicate with a shared language and know the general status of others in the mindlink such as: alive, injured, or dying. The duration increases by 1 hour for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.

Scrying
You can view a familiar object, creature, or space from afar for 1 minute. Your line of sight follows the target, and allows you to view the target's surroundings within 2 Squares. Targets that succeed a Will save ignore this effect and cannot be targeted by Scrying again for 24 hours.


Enchantment
The arcane school of the mind, enchantment spells focus on bending others to the will of the caster. Enchantment spells infiltrate the mind of a target directly, allowing a caster to both mentally cripple opponents in battle, and bolster allies.


Jinx (Base Spell)
You afflict an enemy with a -2 Spirit penalty to Attack and Damage rolls for 3 rounds. Targets that succeed a Will save ignore this effect. The duration increases by 3 rounds, and the penalty increases by -1 for every additional 3 MP spent on this spell.


Fear
You inflict an enemy with the Demoralized condition for 3 rounds. Targets that succeed a Will save ignore this effect. The duration increases by 1 round for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.

Heroism
You grant yourself or an ally the Bolstered condition for 3 rounds. The duration increases by 1 round for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.

Illusion
You create a illusion of an object, creature, or force that lasts for 3 rounds. The illusion replicates sight, smell, sound, and can be moved within 10 Squares of you as a minor action. The duration increases by 1 round for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.


Flame
The arcane school of heat energy, flame spells focus on dealing damage to multiple targets with the power of fire. Flame spells often affect the area around targets to explode in incredible waves of heat that can cause lingering fires or blinding flashes of light.


Fireball (Base Spell)
You throw a ball of flame affecting one Square and its adjacent space, dealing 1d8 Fire damage to all targets within the area. Targets that succeed a Reflex save take half damage. The damage increases by +1d8 for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.


Flame Shield
You wreathe yourself in flame for 3 rounds, causing any enemy that attacks you from your adjacent space to take 1d6 Fire damage. The damage increases by +1d6 and the duration increases by 1 round for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.

Flare
You afflict an enemy with the Blinded condition for 3 rounds. Targets that succeed a Will save ignore this effect. The duration increases by 1 round for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.

Wall of Fire
You cause up to 5 Squares (each Square must be touching another) to burst into flame for 3 rounds, dealing 1d4 Fire damage to all targets within or moving through the area. The damage increases by +1d4, the duration increases by 1 round, and the spell affects 1 more Square for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.


Healing
The arcane school of healing focuses on the healing of the body and spirit, allowing the wounded to bounce right back from harm. Healing spells can also grant beneficial Conditions, and can even bring recently killed characters back to life.


Cure Wounds (Base Spell)
You cause an adjacent ally to recover Hit Points equal to twice their level plus an additional 1d12 HP for every 1 MP spent on this spell.


Rejuvenate
You grant an adjacent ally the Regeneration condition for 3 rounds. The duration increases by 1 round for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.

Resurrection
You bring a dead adjacent ally back to life at 0 HP, then restore HP equal to twice their level. This effect can only revive an ally that died within 1 round for every 1 MP spent on this spell.

Vitality Surge
You grant an adjacent ally the Hasted condition for 3 rounds. The duration increases by 1 round for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.


Ice
The arcane school of ice focuses on dealing damage to multiple targets with the power of Cold. Ice spells can create temporary hail storms, freeze over areas of ground, or cause opponents to become frozen in their tracks.


Blizzard (Base Spell)
You show up to 3 Squares with icy shards, dealing 1d8 Cold damage to all targets within the area. Targets that succeed a Fortitude save take half damage. The damage increases by +1d8 and affects 1 more Square for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.


Flash Freeze
You inflict an enemy with the Slowed condition for 3 rounds. The duration increases by 1 round for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.

Ice Sheet
You freeze one Square and its adjacent space which becomes Difficult Terrain for 3 rounds. The duration increases by 1 round for every additional 3 MP spent on this spell.

Mist Cloud
You conjure a cloud of mist affecting one Square and its adjacent space for 3 rounds, granting the Concealed condition to all targets within. The duration increases by 1 round for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.


Necromancy
The arcane school of necromancy focuses sapping life energy and light away from targets. Necromancy spells can cause the bodies of living creatures to quickly rot and decay while draining away their essence. Those slain by necromancy may revive as a violent undead and strike down their allies.


Necrosis (Base Spell)
You afflict an enemy with the Poisoned condition for 3 rounds. Targets that succeed a Fortitude save ignore this effect. The duration increases by 1 round for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.


Animate Dead
You raise an adjacent corpse into a revenant that follows your commands to the best of its ability (see Revenant in the monster section). The revenant lasts for 1 minute, after which it crumbles to dust. If you are unable to give it commands, the revenant will attack the nearest enemy target while remaining within 5 Squares of you. The duration increases by 1 minute for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.

Death Knell
You create a field of negative energy affecting all space within 5 Squares of your for 1 minute. Each time an enemy is reduced to below 0 HP within range, you and any revenants under your control gain the Regeneration condition for 1 round. In addition, any enemies under the Dying condition within range must succeed a Fortitude save or immediately die. The duration increases by 1 minute for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.

Enervate
You inflict an enemy with the Weakened condition for 3 rounds. Targets that succeed a Fortitude save ignore this effect. The duration increases by 1 round for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.


Protection
The arcane school of protection focuses on creating magical barriers and wards to shield yourself and allies from harm. While protection spells are fairly straightforward, they can guard against a variety of effects including incoming attacks, elemental damage, and environmental hazards.


Barrier (Base Spell)
You grant yourself or an adjacent ally a +5 Spirit bonus to Cold, Fire, Physical, or Shock resistance for 1 minute. The duration increases by 1 minute, and the bonus increases by +5 for every additional 3 MP spent on this spell.


Feather Fall
You cause yourself or an ally within 10 Squares to become lighter for 1 minute, their weight is halved and they float gently from heights taking no falling damage. The duration increases by 1 minute for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.

Glyph of Invulnerability
You cause yourself or an adjacent ally to take no damage from extreme weather conditions for 1 minute. In addition, targets affected are no longer required to breathe. The duration increases by 1 minute for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.

Spell Shield
You grant yourself or an adjacent ally a +1 Spirit bonus to Defense for 1 minute. The duration increases by 1 minute and the bonus increases by +1 for every additional 3 MP spent on this spell.


Storm
The arcane school of storm focuses on dealing damage to multiple targets with the power of Shock. Emitting bolts of electricity, storm spells create a power force of energy that passes right through enemy defenses, and can even send them flying.


Lightning Bolt (Base Spell)
You send a bolt of lightning in a straight horizontal, vertical, or diagonal line, dealing 1d10 Shock damage to all targets within the space (where the bolt passes through the center of their occupied space). Targets that succeed a Reflex save take half damage. The damage increases by +1d10 for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.


Gust of Wind
You unleash a gale of wind at an enemy, pushing them away from you up to 2 Squares, or 4 Squares if the target is hovering of flying. If the enemy collides with a creature or solid object, both take 1d8 Physical damage for every 2 Squares they were pushed. Targets that succeed a Fortitude save ignore this effect. The distance you can push the target increases by 1 Square for every additional 3 MP spent on this spell.

Shockwave
You emit a shockwave, dealing 1d8 Shock damage to all adjacent enemies and pushes them back 1 Square. Targets that succeed a Reflex save either take half damage, or are pushed backed 1 less Square (their choice). The damage increases by 1d10 and the number of Squares creatures are pushed back increases by 1 for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.

Stormcloud
You summon a cloud that hovers over a single target for 3 rounds. Whenever the target attempts an attack or ability that targets you or one of your allies, the target takes 1d12 Shock damage. Targets that succeed a Fortitude save take half damage. The damage increases by 1d12 and the duration increases by 1 round for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.


Summoning
The summoning arcane school allows you to create intangible forces that can perform various tasks. Forces summoned are mindless, take up 1 Square of space, are affected by gravity (they remain ground-based), and cannot be attacked, but can take damage from effects that target space. Any force created through a summoning spell has 5 HP for every 1 MP spent on the spell.


Recall Object (Base Spell)
You can place an invisible mark on a single non-living adjacent item weighing less than 10 lbs. You can then summon the marked item into your hand as a free action, regardless of distance, as long as the item is unattended. Placing the mark on another item removes the previous mark.


Phantom Steed
You summon a transparent steed that possesses the Mounted monster trait and lasts for 1 hour that only you can ride or interact with. The phantom steed can only move while being ridden and has a speed of 6 Squares and can carry 200 lbs. The duration increases by 1 hour, the speed increases by 1 Square, and the weight carried increases by 50 lbs for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.

Supportive Spirit
You summon a supportive spirit that lasts for 1 minute and allows you to use spells that affect your adjacent space to instead affect the spirit's adjacent space. The supportive spirit can be commanded to move at a speed of 4 Squares as a minor action, but must remain within 10 Squares of you otherwise it dissipates. The duration increases by 1 minute for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.

Unseen Servant
You summon an unseen servant that lasts for 1 hour that can perform any simple task with a Difficulty lower than 10. The unseen servant can be telepathically commanded to perform a single task at a time, lift up to 25 lbs, or move at a speed of 4 Squares as a minor action, but must remain within 10 Squares of you otherwise it dissipates. The duration increases by 1 hour for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.


Teleportation
The arcane school of teleportation focuses on instantly moving from one place to another. Teleportation spells can distort the caster’s form to deflect attacks, shift the caster and allies from distant locations, and can swap the positions of combatants in battle.


Blink (Base Spell)
You instantly teleport up to 2 Squares to an unoccupied space as a minor action. After you teleport, you gain Concealment for 3 rounds. The duration increases by 1 round, and the distance you can teleport increases by 2 Squares for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.


Dimension Swap
You change position with another target, or swap the position of two allies. Targets that succeed a Will save ignore this effect.

Distortion Field
You cause the space you move through after casting this spell to become difficult terrain for 1 round. The duration increases by 1 round for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.

Spatial Recall
You create an invisible magical beacon in an adjacent Square that lasts for 1 day. You can then use this spell (costing no MP) to transport yourself and all adjacent allies to the beacon regardless of range, causing it to dissipate. If the beacon’s space is occupied when teleport is attempted, the spell fails. You may only have one beacon active at a time. The duration increases by 1 day for every additional 1 MP spent on this spell.




Table of Contents

Lappy9001
2012-04-03, 09:57 PM
Talents and Skills
The purview of rogues, talents are tricks and powers representing expertise in a wide and varied field of skills. Useful both in and out of combat, talents focus on mobility, interaction, survival, crafting, and luck. When learning talents, the base ability (called the base talent in this section) is automatically gained whenever another talent from the skill is learned. However, the base talent grants no SP, nor does it benefit from itself if it increases in power from other talents.

Skill Points
Whenever a talent is learned 2 Skill Points (SP) are gained, added to the skill that the talent belongs to. Skill points stack with all other modifiers of a skill. All characters gain a +1 bonus to a number of skills equal to their Intelligence at 1st level. Each skill also has an associated Attribute that is added to the overall total of the skill. Unlike maneuvers and spells, some talents grant untyped bonuses.

Using Skills and Trained Skills
Each class gains a number of trained skills; two for mages and warriors, and four for rogues. Trained skills are selected at 1st level and add +5 to the overall bonus to the skill. All skills have multiple uses, and some take more than a single round to complete. Most skills are rolled against a Difficulty set or modified by the GM, while others (specifically Perception, Persuasion, and Stealth) are rolled against another character or monster. In the latter example, both skills are rolled against one another and the highest prevails.

Use the table below as a guideline for Difficulty. Difficulty 10 or lower doesn't normally require a skill roll.




Difficulty


Required Roll



Easy
10


Average
15


Above Average
20


Difficult
25


Challenging
30


Formidable
35


Heroic
40


Near Impossible
50



Alchemy (Intelligence)
The ancient craft of herbalism, the alchemy skill represents knowledge of ingredients both helpful and harmful that can be brewed into alchemical item. An alchemy roll can be used to identify plants, molds, and toxins, and can identify if food or drink are poisoned or otherwise safe to consume. Alchemy can also be used during the course of a Rest to double HP recovery with an Average Difficulty increased by +2 for each target being healed. You can create non-magical alchemical items (items other than potions, bombs, and poisons) with a Alchemy roll of Average Difficulty, 1 hour or work, and ˝ the base price of the item in materials.


Alchemist (Base Talent)
You can now create potions, bombs, and poisons using essentia and the appropriate materials (See the Equipment section for details). You gain +3 Cunning bonus to Cold, Fire, or Shock Resistance (or increase an existing bonus by +3) for each Alchemy talent you possess.


Healing Touch
You can spend 1 essentia as a minor action to restore yourself or an adjacent ally Hit Points equal to your level plus your Intelligence, times 2. In addition, if the target is Blinded, Poisoned, or Weakened, the condition's duration is reduced by 3 rounds.

Masterful Alchemy
Whenever you craft an alchemical item, the process creates two items instead of one.

Transmutation
As a free action before using a bomb, you can change its damage type (Cold, Fire, Physical or Shock), and increase the bomb’s damage dice by 1 increment.



Athletics (Strength / Dexterity)
The Athletics skill focuses primarily on mobility, being used to balance, climb, jump, and swim and are almost always rolled against a Difficulty. The talents granted by athletics allow for new options to move around the battlefield and increased Speed. Unique among the skills, characters can choose to use either Strength or Dexterity as the associated attribute to athletics.


Fleet (Base Talent)
You gain a +1 Cunning bonus to Initiative and Speed while unarmored or wearing light armor for every athletics talent learned.


Evasion
You gain a +2 Cunning bonus to Reflex saves. You may use 1 essentia to move up to ˝ your Speed after a successful Reflex save as a free action if you have Speed remaining this round.

Parkour
You may run up or across vertical walls up to ˝ your Speed during a move action. You must end your movement on a horizontal space otherwise you take falling damage as normal. In addition, you can negate 10 ft. of falling damage for every 1 Speed you possess.

Tumble
You may move through an enemy’s space at half speed with a successful athletics roll, using the target’s Defense as Difficulty.



Endurance (Constitution)
Representing intense physical training and conditioning, Endurance is useful to survive lethal situations, and possibly evade death altogether. This skill can be used to hold your breath for a number of rounds equal to your Endurance bonus and to concentrate amid distractions. Creatures die when they reach negative Hit Points equal to their total Endurance bonus.


Toughness (Base Talent)
You gain 5 Hit Points for every endurance talent learned.


Conditioning
You increase the hit dice used in your class’ HP per level by 1 increment, and use that dice for all future levels. If you have already rolled HP for this level, you may choose to roll again using the increased hit dice.

Diehard
You maintain consciousness while Dying, allowing you to take a single action per round, however you still lose 1 HP.

Second Wind
You gain a +2 Cunning bonus to Fortitude saves. You may spend 2 essentia as a free action to gain the Regeneration condition for 1 minute.



Knowledge (Intelligence)
Knowledge both general and specific, knowledge rolls can be used to recall information about culture, history, religion, creatures, legends, and famous individuals. A knowledge roll can be used to identify the name and type of a monster, abilities the monster possesses, and weaknesses. Although the Difficulty is typically up to the GM depending on how well known the monster's existence is, a generally rule to use Easy Difficulty and add +2 for each monster level to identify name and type. If roll is successful, every 2 by which the Difficulty is exceeded reveals an ability or weakness (character's choice).

Knowledge rolls can also appraise the value of an item with an Average Difficulty and adding +1 for each increment of 100 Gold in the item's price. Knowledge rolls are usually a free action and normally can't be rolled again for the same topic.


Keen Intuition (Base Talent)
You may use 1 essentia as a minor action to immediately reveal abilities or weaknesses possessed by a monster as if you had succeeded on Knowledge roll. The effective roll is successful by an additional 2 for every Knowledge talent you possess.


Arcane Study
You learn two cantrips from the mage class, or learn an additional cantrip if you are already a mage. If you are not a mage, a cantrip that increases in power does so each milestone.

Detect Magic
You can identify spells being cast and spells effecting a target or object within 10 Squares. You can detect the school of a spell cast previously up to 1 day for each MP spend during the spell’s casting. You can also determine any Magical Properties an item possesses.

Surge of Insight
You gain a +2 cunning bonus to Will saves. You may use 1 essentia as a free action to gain a Cunning bonus equal to your level on all skill rolls made within 1 minute rounds.



Mechanics (Intelligence)
Mechanics represents the usage of tools and gadgetry, allowing users to open locks, pilot vehicles, and disable and set traps. Mechanics rolls are almost always made against a set Difficulty. The mechanics skill can be used to repair weapons damaged by the Disable Device as an Average Difficulty, restoring their original properties with the appropriate tools and 1 hour of uninterrupted work.


Tools of the Trade (Base Talent)
You can create traps using the appropriate materials. Whenever you use an item that grants an Item bonus or a weapon with the Masterwork Property, you increase the bonus provided by +1. In addition, traps you create increase their Difficulty by +2 for each Mechanics talent learned.


Disable Device
After a successful melee attack as a minor action, you can force one adjacent enemy to lose a property of one weapon they carry. Targets that succeed a Reflex save ignore this effect. In addition, you are able to jam a lock to prevent it from being opened. Doing so takes 1 round and increases the Difficulty to open a lock by 5.

Jury Rig
You can reassign the damage dice and Properties of a weapon as an Above Average Difficulty with the appropriate tools and 1 hour of uninterrupted work. Applying the Masterwork or Ammunition Properties in this manner requires no gold.

Trapsmith
When you attempt to disable a trap, you do not set the trap off if you fail the roll by 5 or more. In addition, once you successfully reset a trap, you can allow yourself and your allies to pass through the trap's space without setting off the trap.



Nature (Wisdom)
The ability to survive any type of hostile setting falls under the purview of the nature skill. Nature rolls can be used to forage for food, find water, and to track, tame, and ride animals. Nature rolls are made against a Difficulty, except when tracking or taming a creature. If the tracked creature is attempting to hide their tracks, opposed nature rolls are made. Using an opposed nature roll against a non-hostile animal can allow the user to befriend the creature, and teach a trick if tamed and taught the trick over the course of a week. Riding a creature trained as a mount requires a roll of Easy Difficulty, but increases during combat or if the mount is hurt or spooked. An opposed roll is used if the creature refuses to bear the rider.


Endure Elements (Base Talent)
Reduce the damage dice you take from hazards by 1 increment (minimum 1d4) for every Nature Talent you possess.


Beast Friend
You gain a familiar as a companion. You choose which type of familiar you receive when you learn this talent and designate a specialized skill (Athletics, Endurance, Nature, Perception, or Stealth). While within 5 Squares of your familiar, you gain a +2 bonus to the designated skill. You can summon your familiar into your space or dismiss it as a minor action, in which it disappears until summoned again. If killed your familiar disappears, and can be summoned again in 1 day.

Expert Tracker
Reduce the Difficulty to track a creature by 5 for each Nature Talent you possess; if this reduces the Difficulty below 10, you automatically succeed at tracking that creature.

Wild Walker
When determining how many miles your character can traverse in a day use your Speed +2. In addition, you ignore Speed penalties from Difficult Terrain.



Perception (Wisdom)
Relying on the senses, perception is used to spot, hear, smell, or feel objects and creatures that are hidden, or to sense deception. Perception is rolled against a Difficulty when searching for a hidden object (unless a creature is trying to conceal an object on their person), and rolled against either an opposed Stealth roll to find hiding creatures, or an opposed Speech roll to see through lies and falsehoods.


Second Glance (Base Talent)
You may immediately reroll a Perception roll after it was made, but before hearing the result. Second Glance can be used once per day for every Perception talent learned.


Blind Sense
You can see in low light conditions as if they were fully lit. You can make a Perception roll as a minor action to act normally if Blinded or otherwise unable to see. This roll is made against an enemy’s Defense if attacking, or a skill’s Difficulty.

Uncanny Intuition
As a free action, you can make a perception (prompted by the GM) when being viewed from afar or within 2 Squares of a concealed door or passage. You cannot be Flanked.

Weak Point
As a minor action, you can make a Perception roll against an enemy’s defense to determine their current Hit Points.



Runecrafting (Int)
Talented scribes often find that the pen is mightier than the sword, and can sometimes make the sword more powerful. Runecrafting encompasses the use of mundane written language, ancient ciphers, and magic runes alike. Runecrafting can be used to decipher secret codes and create or identify forgeries using opposed Runecrafting rolls.


Artificer (Base Talent)
By scribing a rune on the chosen item, you bind a part of your essence into the object. You can now apply magic properties to weapons, armor, and gems (to create wondrous items) using essentia and the appropriate materials (See the Equipment section for details). You gain an additional point of essentia for every Runecrafting talent you possess.


Arcane Conduit
You can benefit from an additional magical property.

Disruption
You can spend 1 essentia as a minor action to force one adjacent enemy to lose the magical property of one magic item they carry for 1 hour. Targets that succeed a Will save ignore this effect.

Extract Essence
You can destroy a held magical item and use its residual energy in place of your essentia when creating a magical item. However, your total essential pool is still reduced by 1 until the item is destroyed.



Speech (Charisma)
The refined art of communication and language, the speech skill is used while interacting with others to barter, negotiate, intimate, lie, and seduce. Typically a speech roll is rolled against another target’s speech roll when trying to barter, negotiate, intimidate, or seduce. However, when practicing deception, the speech roll is made against the target’s perception roll.


Well Versed (Base Talent)
You learn an additional language for every Speech talent you possess.


Fast Talker
You may immediately reroll a Speech roll after it was made, but before hearing the result. Fast Talker can be used once per day for every Speech talent learned (including this one).

Haggle
When you make a successful Speech roll to buy or sell an item, you can increase the Gold amount by 10% (if selling) or decrease it by 10% (if buying). If both the seller and buyer possess Haggle, the effects are negated.

Powerful Presence
As a minor action, you cause all Bolstered allies or Demoralized allies within 5 Squares to be affected by the condition for an additional round. Targets that succeed a Will save ignore this effect.



Stealth (Dexterity)
The art of deception and remaining unseen, the stealth skill is used whenever a creature attempts to hide or move silently, although they move at half speed while doing so. The stealth skill is typically rolled against an opposed perception roll, determining whether or not they have been detected.


Probably Just the Wind… (Base Talent)
You may immediately reroll a Stealth roll after making the roll, but before hearing the result. Probably Just the Wind… can be used once per day for each stealth talent learned.


Disguise Self
You can disguise yourself to seem up to 50 lbs. in weight and 1 ft. in height different. You roll two d20’s when you attempt to deceive others with your disguise, and use the higher result.

Muffled Movement
You can move at your full Speed when using the stealth skill to hide or move silently.

Steal
After a successful melee attack, you can steal an unsecured object weighing less than 5 lbs. on the person of the enemy you are targeting. Using Steal is a minor action.



Table of Contents

Lappy9001
2012-04-03, 09:59 PM
Equipment
No matter how powerful and self-sufficient a character may be, adventurers need items and equipment to help them on their way. This section details the mundane tools, weapons, and armor that adventurers use daily, as well as prices for rent and purchase of amenities outside of the dungeon.

Currency
The standard of wealth in most of the world is the gold piece (g). Often just referred to as ‘gold’ this currency may be given different names in other regions or named after famous nobles. The titles ‘crown’ and ‘sovereign’ are common terms for the gold piece. For a sense of scale, the average untrained laborer makes about 50g a week totaling to about 2,000 to 4,000g each year, while those in skilled professions make roughly twice that (around 5,000 to 8,000 g or 100 g per week).

Each character starts with 150g at level 1 representing all that they have acquired prior to the start of the adventure.

Equipment can be bought at the price shown on the equipment table below and sold for half that price. However, prices may be more or less expensive depending on region and scarcity. When price disputes arise, opposed Speech rolls are used to barter.

Adventuring Gear
Below are some items that regularly appear in the inventories of prepared adventurers. Items that warrant a special description are detailed below the table. Ed. Note: Prices are roughly based off real-world estimates, where available!




Item


Cost



Backpack
4g


Barrel
3g


Bedroll
4g


Blanket
3g


Candles (5)
1g


Canvas, 1 square yard
2g


Chest
20g


Climbing Piton
2g


Cookware, ceramic
5g


Cookware, brass
20g


Crowbar
5g


Fishing net, 25 ft
4g


Flint and Steel
1g


Grappling Hook
5 g


Healer's Kit
50g


Lantern
10g


Magnifying Glass
25g


Manacles
25g


Mirror
10g


Oil, 1 pint
2g


Parchment, 10 sheets
1g


Rope, 50 ft.
5g


Shovel
3g


Spyglass
50g


Tankard
1g


Torches (5)
1g


Waterskin
2g



Candle: A candle sheds dim light, covering 1 Square of space when lit and burns for 1 hour.

Climbing Pitons: These small metal stakes can be used to traverse vertical surfaces, and when used with rope grant a +2 Item bonus to Athletics rolls made to climb.

Crowbar: A crowbar can be used to break open a door or object, and provides a +2 Item bonus to the Strength rolls made to break objects.

Flask: Made from glass or steel, a flask holds 10 ounces of liquid.

Flint and Steel: Flint and steel can be used to spark a small fire as a major action.

Grappling Hook: When tied to a rope, a grappling hook can be thrown using Strength or Dexterity like a ranged weapon with an effective range of 3 Squares.

Healer's Kit: Filled with mundane alchemic items, a healer's kit grants a +2 Item bonus to Alchemy rolls to increase healing during a rest. The ingredients typically found in an average healer's kit are common and are normally unfit to be created into magical alchemic items (although these reagents can certainly be stored in a healer's kit).

Lantern: A lantern illuminates all space within 5 Squares and lasts for 6 hours with one pint of oil.

Manacles: Varying by quality, a normal set of manacles restrains the use of a creature's hands with a Difficult Difficulty to slip out of (with a Dexterity roll), or break (with a Strength roll).

Magnifying Glass: This fine seeing glass magnifies objects seen at close, granting a +2 Item bonus to Knowledge rolls to appraise an item.

Mirror: Made from a reflective material like glass, crystal, or polished steel, a mirror can be used to reflect light and see around corners. Casting the Scrying spell while touching a mirror allows you to display the scryed image into the mirror's surface.

Oil: One pint of oil burns for 6 hours when used in a lantern.

Rope: Rope has traits of an Average material, and can be broken or slipped out of with an Above Average Difficulty.

Spyglass: A useful hand-held telescope, a spyglass can be used to gain a +2 Item bonus to Perception rolls when looking from afar.

Torch: A torch illuminates all space within 5 Squares and lasts for 1 hour.

Vial: Made from glass or steel, a vial holds 1 ounce of liquid.

Weapons and Armor
Although weapons and armor are most important to the warrior, all characters can benefit from having a weapon handy at their side. Weapons and armor come in all shapes and sizes, and are sorted into six categories. Weapons include one-handed, two-handed, and ranged while armor includes light, heavy, and shields.

Properties
In order to represent the incredible variety of weaponry available, weapons are custom-built to reflect just about any implement an adventurer could want. This is done through the weapon's damage dice and Properties. All non-magical weapons deal Physical damage and use a specific damage dice. Each weapon group has two possible damage dice (one higher, one lower), and can have one or two different Properties assigned to the weapon. Weapons with lower damage dice can have two Properties, while weapons with higher damage dice only have one Property. Of course, this is an abstraction; characters do not actually assign traits to their weapon (normally), and weapons are pre-assigned their damage dice and Properties upon creation. A character can only benefit from a weapon's Properties if they have Proficiency with the weapon group.

In their description, weapons list the available damage dice and Properties, while armor lists a Defense bonus, skill penalty, and Speed penalty. The Defense bonus provides the wearer with an Armor or Shield bonus to Defense, while the Skill penalty inflicts an Armor or Shield penalty to Athletics and Stealth. The Speed penalty also inflicts an Armor or Shield penalty to the wearer's Speed.

Unarmed Combat
Sometimes, adventurers are caught without their equipment but still need to fight, and others may willingly choose to forsake weapons in favored of more personal forms of combat. Races like humans, elves, dwarves, orcs, halflings, and kobolds use their fists, while monsters normally use claws. Unlike other weapons, fists and claws deal 1d4 damage and only gain Properties from certain Abilities.


Natural Weapon: You may use your Dexterity in place of Strength for Attack rolls.
Ki-Strike: Your fists are counted as ranged weapons with a range of 5 Squares
Flurry: Your fists are counted as one-handed weapons.


One-handed Weapons
One-handed weapons tend to focus on speed and precision, and as the name implies, can be wielded in a single hand. Weapons like daggers, short swords, maces, scimitars, katar, whips, flails, and morningstars are all one-handed weapons. One-handed weapons cost 5g and can have the following properties:


Bludgeoning: You gain a +1 Weapon bonus to damage rolls with this weapon.
Dual: If wielding two one-handed weapons and one has this Property, you gain a +2 Shield bonus to Defense.
Finesse: You may use your Dexterity in place of Strength for attack rolls.
Masterwork: You gain a +1 Weapon bonus to attack rolls with this weapon. However, the price of the weapon doubles. This property does not count towards the total number of properties a weapon possesses.
Piercing: Extra damage dice from Precision maneuver and Opportunist ability become 1d8 instead of 1d6.
Slashing: Increase the critical threat of this weapon by 1 with the Dueling maneuver.





Damage Dice


Properties



1d4
2 Properties


1d6
1 Property



Sample One-Handed Weapons



Weapon


Damage Dice


Properties



Dagger

1d4

Finesse, Piercing


Katar

1d4

Dual, Finesse


Morningstar

1d6

Bludgeoning


Rapier

1d6

Finesse/Piercing


Scimitar

1d6

Slashing


Shortsword

1d6

Piercing/Slashing


Whip

1d4

Finesse, Slashing



Two-handed Weapons
Two-handed weapons allow for far more attacking power than lighter weapons, at the cost of requiring two hands to wield. Two-handed weapons include battle axes, greatswords, warhammers, halberds, mauls, lances, glaives, spears, scythes, and falchions. Two-handed weapons cost 15 Gold and can have the following Properties:


Bludgeoning: You gain a +1 Weapon bonus to damage rolls with this weapon.
Massive: You can push an enemy back an additional Square with the Knockback maneuver.
Masterwork: You gain a +1 Weapon bonus to attack rolls with this weapon. However, the price of the weapon doubles. This property does not count towards the total number of properties a weapon possesses.
Piercing: You gain a +2 Weapon bonus to damage rolls when using the Lancer maneuver.
Reach: Adjacent space for the Impede maneuver counts as 2 Squares.
Slashing: You may make one additional attack roll with the Cleave maneuver, each as a Minor action.





Damage Dice


Properties



1d8
2 Properties


1d10
1 Property



Sample Two-Handed Weapons



Weapon


Damage Dice


Properties



Battle Axe

1d8

Massive, Slashing


Greatsword

1d10

Slashing


Halberd

1d8

Slashing, Reach


Lance

1d10

Piercing


Maul

1d8

Bludgeoning, Massive


Scythe

1d8

Reach, Slashing


Spear

1d8

Piercing, Reach

Warhammer

1d10

Bludgeoning
[/TR]


Ranged Weapons
Ranged weapons have an advantage in that they are meant to be fired or thrown at a distance. Weapons like longbows, crossbows, throwing stars, javelins, darts, slings, boomerangs, and firearms are all ranged weapons. Characters using ranged weapons must be at least 1 Square away from an enemy to attack. Ranged weapons have an effective range of 5 Squares, but can be thrown or shot farther with a cumulative -2 penalty for every 5 Squares outside of their effective range to a maximum of 30 Squares.

Ranged weapons cost 10 Gold and can have the following properties:


Ammunition: This weapon is used with two hands and requires ammunition (arrows, bolts, bullets, etc.) in order to function, which can be drawn as a free action. You do not add your Strength to Damage rolls with this weapon. However, you roll two damage dice when rolling damage (as shown on the table). The price of this weapon triples.
Close Range: You gain a +1 Weapon bonus to damage rolls with this weapon when used on an enemy within the weapon's effective range.
Long Range: Increase the effective range of this weapon by 5 Squares, and maximum range by 30 Squares.
Masterwork: You gain a +1 Weapon bonus to attack rolls with this weapon. However, the price of the weapon doubles. This property does not count towards the total number of properties a weapon possesses.
Returning: This weapon returns to you when used within the weapon's effective range. Cannot be added to weapons with the Ammunition Property.
Versatile: This weapon also counts as a one-handed weapon or a two-handed weapon. Cannot be added to weapons with the Ammunition Property.





Damage Dice


Properties



1d4 (2d4 with Ammunition)
2 Properties


1d6 (2d6 with Ammunition)
1 Property



Sample Ranged Weapons



Weapon


Damage Dice


Properties



Boomerang

1d4

Close Range, Returning


Crossbow

2d6

Ammunition


Javelin

1d6

Versatile


Longbow

2d4

Ammunition, Long Range


Musket

2d4

Ammunition, Close Range, Masterwork


Shortbow

2d4

Ammunition, Close Range


Throwing Axe

1d4

Close Range, Versatile

Throwing Star

1d6

Close Range/Returning
[/TR]


Light Armor
Light armor works best with techniques to dodge incoming attacks, but is still effective at protecting its wearer. Characters add their Dexterity to their Defense when using light armor, but if not Proficient, only gain ˝ the Defense bonus (minimum +1). Light Armor costs 25 Gold.




Armor

Defense Bonus

Skill Penalty

Speed Penalty


Cloth

+1

-

-


Leather

+2

-1

-


Hide

+4

-2

-1



Heavy Armor
Heavy armor is designed to absorb and deflect attacks, but can be cumbersome to wear. Characters cannot add their Dexterity to their Defense when using heavy armor and if not Proficient, only gain ˝ the Defense bonus. Heavy armor cost 50 Gold.




Armor

Defense Bonus

Skill Penalty

Speed Penalty


Chain

+6

-3

-1


Scale

+8

-4

-1


Plate

+10

-5

-2



Shields
Shields are used to deflect attacks away from the wielder, and are best utilized with the Defend Tactic. Shields require one hand to wield. Characters cannot add their Dexterity to their Defense when using a shield and if not Proficient, only gain ˝ the Defense bonus. Shields cost 15 Gold.




Armor

Defense Bonus

Skill Penalty

Speed Penalty


Small Shield

+1

-

-


Large Shield

+2

-2

-


Tower Shield

+4

-3

-1




Table of Contents

Lappy9001
2012-04-03, 11:11 PM
Magic Items
Magic items represent several groups of objects that have been infused with arcane energy from their creator. Magical items are divided into four categories: magic armor and weapons, alchemic items, wondrous items, and artifacts.

Magical Properties
Much like weapons, magic items are assigned a magical property that determines the benefits the item grants. Each category of magic items contains a unique set of magical properties.

Magic items draw on the user’s energy, and many require essentia to be used as if altering a dice roll but instead activating the magic item’s effect. A creature can only benefit from 4 magic properties (not including artifacts or alchemic items) at a time, and cannot benefit from multiple items with the same magical property. If a character could benefit from more than 4 magic properties through wearing multiple items, they can swap one effect for another during a Rest.

Crafting Magic Items
Creating a magic item requires a specific talent, depending on the item which you intend to craft. The Artificer talent is required to create magic armor, magic weapons, and wondrous items, letting you infuse a gem set into the object with a magical property. The Alchemist talent is required for alchemic items, causing a reaction in a special herbal concoction to become a magical property. Only the finest materials can retain the energy; the gem set into the object must be worth at least 500 gold and the regents of alchemic items must be worth at least 25 gold. Purchasing a magic item is generally around 1,000 gold plus the base cost of the item or around 50 gold for alchemic items.

It requires 1 hour of uninterrupted work and at least 1 essentia to infuse the object with energy. Doing so reduces the creator’s total essentia pool by 1, transferring their energy into the item to grant it a magical property. Alchemic items do not reduce the total essentia of the creator, but the creator can only craft a number of alchemic items equal to their current essentia total.

The creator’s essentia remains reduced until the item is used up (in the case of an alchemic item) or destroyed. The creator of a magic item can destroy the object, regardless of distance, by focusing for 1 uninterrupted hour, after which the magical property is removed and their essentia is returned. If the creator of a magic item dies, items they created still retain their magical property.

Alchemic Items
Herbal mixtures are potent on their own, but when imbued with essentia, they become potent arcane creations. All of the concoctions from the Equipment section can be granted magical properties.

Potions must be consumed to gain their effect as a minor action. Poisons can be applied to a weapon as a minor action, and take place on the next successful attack. Bombs can be thrown at an enemy or an area of space within 5 Squares as a major action, and affect all adjacent space to where the bomb lands. Bombs deal 1d4 damage for every 2 levels of the thrower, plus their Intelligence. Alchemic items can have 1 magical property from the list below.


Alacrity (Potion): For 1 hour, whenever you are affected by the Hasted condition, it lasts an additional 3 rounds.

Combustion (Bomb): This bomb deals Fire damage.

Darkness (Poison): For 1 hour, whenever the target is affected by the Blinded condition, it lasts an additional 3 rounds.

Dread (Poison): For 1 hour, whenever the target is affected by the Demoralized condition, it lasts an additional 3 rounds.

Exhaustion (Poison): For 1 hour, whenever the target is affected by the Weakened condition, it lasts an additional 3 rounds.

Frost (Bomb): This bomb deals Cold damage.

Healing (Potion): You can spend 1 essentia to recover Hit Points equal to 3 times your level, plus your Intelligence.

Heroism (Potion): For 1 hour, whenever you are affected by the Bolstered condition, it lasts an additional 3 rounds.

Invisibility (Potion): For 1 hour, whenever you are affected by the Concealed condition, it lasts an additional 3 rounds.

Lightning (Bomb): This bomb deals Shock damage.

Mana (Potion): You can spend 1 essentia to recover Magic Points equal to 1d4 + your Intelligence.

Paralysis (Poison): For 1 hour, whenever the target is affected by the Slowed condition, it lasts an additional 3 rounds.

Restoration (Potion): For 1 hour, whenever you are affected by the Regeneration condition, it lasts an additional 3 rounds.

Sustenance (Potion): You do not need to eat, drink, or sleep for 1 day, although you must still take a Rest to recover daily abilities and MP.

Venom (Poison): For 1 hour, whenever the target is affected by the Poisoned condition, it lasts an additional 3 rounds.


Magic Armor and Weapons
Magical properties applied to armor and weapons generally improve the effectiveness of mundane properties or maneuvers. A weapon or armor may have up to 2 magical properties from the list below.


Aegis (Shield): Increase the bonus from the Iron Stance maneuver by +1.

Bull Rush (Shield): You can push an enemy back an additional 2 Squares with the Overrun maneuver.

Charging (Weapon): Increase the bonus from the Lancer maneuver by +1.

Cold (Weapon): You can choose the damage type of this weapon (Cold or Physical) as a free action. You can spend 1 essentia to roll an additional damage dice of Cold.

Determined (Heavy Armor): You can use the Fortification maneuver an additional time per day.

Dispelling (Weapon): The MP loss from the Smite maneuver increases by +2.

Dodging (Light Armor): Increase the bonus from the Mithril Stance maneuver by +1.

Evading (Light Armor): You can use the Lightning Reflexes maneuver an additional time per round.

Fire (Weapon): You can choose the damage type of this weapon (Fire or Physical) as a free action. You can spend 1 essentia to roll an additional damage dice of Fire.

Hawkeye (Ranged Weapon): Reduce the penalty for using the weapon outside of its effective range by 1.

Fluid (Heavy Armor/Light Armor): Decrease the Skill and Speed Penalty inflicted by 1.

Ironskin (Heavy Armor): Increase the bonus from the Damage Reduction maneuver by +3.

Keen (One-Handed/Ranged Weapon): Increase the weapon’s critical threat by 1 with the Deadly Aim or Dueling maneuvers.

Longshot (Ranged Weapon): Increase the effective range of the weapon by 5 Squares.

Resilient (Heavy Armor): You can use the Great Fortitude maneuver an additional time per round.

Resolve (Armor/Shield): You can use the Iron Will maneuver an additional time per round.

Shock (Weapon): You can choose the damage type of this weapon (Physical or Shock) as a free action. You can spend 1 essentia to roll an additional damage dice of Shock.

Wondrous Items
Magical properties can be applied to gems, and worn in jewelry or accessories, creating wondrous items. Wondrous items include amulets, rings, belts, gloves, boots, circlets, or any other worn item that can have a gem embedded within. Wondrous items may have 1 magical property from the list below.


Alchemic Conversion: You can increase a bomb’s damage dice by 1 additional increment with the Transmutation talent.

Camouflage: You can use the Probably Just the Wind… talent an additional time per day.

Cheetah Speed: Increase the Speed and Initiative bonuses from the Fleet talent by +1.

Comprehend Languages: You can speak and understand two additional languages with the Polyglot talent. Once chosen, these additional languages cannot be changed.

Disruption: You can affect two magic items with the Disruption talent.

Equilibrium: You can spend 1 essentia to use the Parkour talent to walk on water and unstable surfaces as if they were vertical walls.

Guises: You can use the Disguise talent to seem up to 100 lbs. in weight and 2 ft. in height different when deceiving others.

Health: You gain 10 Hit Points with the Toughness talent. If lost, these HP are not restored again until healed.

Intuition: You can use the Second Glance talent an additional time per day.

Life Force: You can restore HP with the Healing Touch talent equal to your level plus your Intelligence times 3.

Nature’s Ally: Reduce damage dice taken from environmental hazards by an additional increment with the Endure Elements talent.

Persuasion: You can use the Fast Talker talent an additional time per day.

Predator: Increase the bonus from the Hunter talent by +1.

Spider Climb: You may run up to your Speed when using the Parkour talent.


Artifacts
Unlike other magic items, artifacts are relics from a bygone age, whose creation has been lost to time. No more than a handful of each artifact exists in the world, and some are entirely unique. Artifacts also do not have magical properties, they have their own special arcane powers.


Astral Beacon: A glowing crystalline orb around two feet in diameter, an astral beacon allows the caster of a Spatial Recall spell to use the astral beacon in place of the magical beacon created by the spell. Some cities have been built around astral beacons, often placed on ornate pedestals allowing for instant transit between two locations.

Auferstehung: This Charging Fire Masterwork Slashing Two-Handed Weapon is incapable of dealing Fire damage to monsters without the Unliving trait. Against monsters with the Unliving trait, it automatically is treated as if 1 essentia had been spent on rolling additional Fire damage. In addition, if it deals a Critical Hit against a monster with the Unliving trait, that monster loses that trait.

Dark Skull: Carved from black obsidian, this unholy object, once activated with an evil rite, causes all creatures that have died within 1 mile to rise as revenants within 1 round. Any creature killed by a revenant created by the dark skull itself becomes a revenant within 1 round.

Dread: This Keen Dispelling Finesse Slashing One-Handed Weapon can be used to inflict the Demoralized or Weakened conditions instead of dealing damage. These conditions last until the victim has a Rest.

Planar Gate: Planar gates are arched structure that vary in size, but are usually at least twenty feet wide and high. Covered in glyphs of the Runic language, a planar gate transports any creature that walks through it to an accompanying gate on another plane.

Staff of True Resurrection: Carved from wood that still lives, a staff of true resurrection allows the caster of a resurrection spell to revive an ally that died within 1 day for every 1 MP spent on the spell.

Statue of the Lost Soldiers: Three rough hewn statues of unarmed soldiers stand upon a dark marble pedestal studded with 6 glowing gems. When a weapon or shield is placed within the open hand of a statue, it gains a random magical property. Once the item is removed, the hand that held the item closes, and a crystal fades, releasing its power. Once the gems no longer glow, the statue is drained of its magic.


Table of Contents

Saidoro
2012-04-03, 11:13 PM
Not terribly much to say yet, but I'll comment on what's up roughly in order.
I like that you're including the ability to use dex as a fighting stat without forcing people to burn a feat on it or anything.
I like that you're allowing everyone to move and act in the same action, that should do a good amount to help keep things balanced.
Ugh. I've never understood why randomly generating ability scores was seen as a good idea. The ability to re-roll certainly helps as does your new table capping the attribute score bonus at +5. But still, that sort of randomness focused on such a small number of rolls really isn't a good thing from a balance standpoint.
The races look mostly alright, if rather uninteresting apart from one major flaw. Odd ability score bonuses don't work. They mean that someone will either gain a significant bonus (+1 to their modifier) or a almost nonexistent one based on a fairly random variable. Someone who rolls pretty much all even attributes will gain very little from their race while someone who would have put odd numbers into both of the things their race boosts anyway gain quite a bit.
The classes are pretty fantastic. With a sufficiently detailed ability list they should be able to replicate almost anything a player wants to play. There are a few improvements that could be made, though:
First off, just a warning. Everyone in the party needs to be able to do something in combat and to make some sort of contribution to a reasonably wide variety of non-combat situations regardless of class. They don't need to be able to instantly solve every conceivable situation the way hi-op characters can in 3.5 and in fact probably shouldn't ever be able to do that but just because someone's a warrior that doesn't mean you can completely neglect them as soon as swords are put away. I apologize if I'm repeating something you already now, but this is important enough that I'm willing to risk that.
Have you considered giving characters a hit point bonus at first level beyond just the maxed die? At low levels in 3.5 modifiers and hit point values are so small that combat is basically entirely random and the only way to ensure victory is to greatly outnumber your opponent and what you have up so far doesn't really seem to fix this.
I worry that the potentially stack-able numeric bonus provided by the warrior's maneuver and rogue's perk features mean they will be the only ones able to perform those functions competently at higher levels. I obviously haven't been able to playtest this, and it's possible that the spell/maneuver/perk system will render this complaint invalid but it's something to be aware of.
Is there going to be any way for characters to retrain their abilities or otherwise access powers they don't currently have? Characters in your system really don't have all that many abilities and placing one in something that turned out to not be useful could be a significant hit to player power. This really isn't that bad, far better than, say, a 3.5 fighter but it does have the unfortunate trait of hurting people who choose their powers for roleplaying reasons or organically based on what their character has been doing the hardest and those are the people who most DMs least like to punish for their design choices.

WyvernLord
2012-04-03, 11:24 PM
Looks good so far looking forward to the rest.
Also it is shield not shied for AC. Though it would be a hilarious idea. :smalltongue:

Lappy9001
2012-04-03, 11:25 PM
Running the Game
Perhaps the most important part of the game is running the world, and the Game Master inheirits the bulk of that task. To ease in the endeavor of making the world more believable or fantastic, playing in a pre-existing universe may hold appeal. Of course, you can just as easily write up your own world either in advance or develop it solely based off the player's actions.

Players can help flesh out the world by designing backstories, characteristics, and motivations for their characters. Each action a character takes is an act of roleplaying, whether they choose to talk or fight, if they're cunning, quiet, adventrous, brash, or anything else in between.

Gamemastery
Becoming a good GM takes time, paitence, practice (and likely the assistance of some online guides) just like anything else, but here are a few tips to help out:


Fun
You are, after all, playing a game with friends. The most important thing is that everyone has fun. What this means can vary from group to group, but try to keep in mind that everyone's enjoyment trumps rules or story alike. Sometimes this means constant battles and dungeon crawls, while othertimes it means straight role-playing where dice are hardly rolled. And sometimes it means fudging dice rolls to increase the challenge of a boring encounter, or giving a haggard character a break. Of course, everyone playing has a role in making sure the game night is enjoyable, each making sure to treat everyone else with respect and open-mindedness.

Consistency
When a GM makes a decision, it is a good idea to stick with that ruling. If you, as a GM decide that standing from a high vantage point grants a +2 bonus to Perception rolls, try to remember that when it comes up again. Of course, sometimes it's easier to make a ruling on the fly as opposed to stalling the action while everyone scrambles to find a rule for 10 minutes. But if your game has rules, it's best to stick with them as often as possible so noone feels cheated.

Flexibility
Sometimes a GM creates an elaborate puzzle or trap with a solution that seems obvious at the time, but thoroughly stumps the players and grinds their progress to a halt. Sometimes the players follow a completely different path than what the GM had intended. Don't be opposed to creative solutions to problems that you may not have thought of, and be ready to make up something off the top of your head when the adventure runs off the rails. Of course, no one can plan or improvise for everything, and it is a courtesy of the players to give the GM some slack if they are struggling to show what happens after something completely unexpected.

Rewards
With the dangers PC's face every day, they tend to be rewarded handsomely for their exploits. The most common reward is XP, but gold, titles, land, and favors often follow to successful adventurers. When trying to assign appropriate XP or treasure for the party, use the party's average level by adding the level of each character, then dividing the result by the number of characters in the party. So if you have a party of 3 adventurers at level 2 and 1 adventurer at level 4, the party's average level is 3 (2+2+2+4 = 10 / 3 = 3.3). The encounter difficulty for monsters works the same, by adding up the level of each monster, then dividing the result by the number of monsters involved in the encounter.

To determine the amount of XP granted from an encounter or adventure using the Experience and Levels rules in the Class section, use the following formula:


Encounter Difficulty < Party Level = Easy Encounter: 5 XP

Encounter Difficulty = Party Level = Average Encounter: 10 XP

Encounter Difficulty (by +1) > Party Level = Challenging Encounter: 15 XP

Encounter (By +2 or more) > Party Level = Harrowing Encounter: 20 XP

To determine the gold value rewarded from an adventurer or encounter:


XP earned x average level of the party + 1d4 per level

Naturally, treasure earned by a party isn't always found as bags of gold coins (although it certainly does happen), but also includes gems, valuable materials, and artwork.

Professions
Professions represent a broad skill set (but does not technically count as a skill) that encompasses all mundane occupations and crafts. With appropriate tools, characters can make a profession roll to craft mundane equipment with one hour of work, as well as provide labor or trade to earn weekly income in gold, equal to the result of a profession roll. A profession roll is either:


Weekly Income: 1d20 + Attribute used in associated skill + 25 per Talent in associated skill

Other Uses: 1d20 + Attribute used in associated skill +2 per Talent in associated skill

Characters can increase their expertise in a profession by learning talents associated with the chosen profession. For each talent associated with the chosen profession, you gain a +25 bonus to the profession roll to earn weekly income or a +2 bonus for any other uses. Skills that are associated with professions include (but are not limited to):


Alchemy: Apothecary, brewer, baker, cook, herbalist.

Knowledge: Architect, cartographer, mason.

Mechanics: Armorer, blacksmith, clock maker, engineer, fletcher.

Nature: Farmer, fisher, gamekeeper, gardener, guide, herder, hunter, rancher, sailor, trainer.

Runecrafting: Barrister, bookkeeping, clerk, librarian, scribe.

Speech: Courtesan, diplomat, herald, innkeeper, merchant, performer.

NPC Class: The Commoner
Not all people in the world are suited for a life of adventure. Many are unable or unwilling to risk life and limb on a daily basis in a quest for treasure or glory, and instead focus on more down-to-earth pursuits. These are the farmers, the workers, the merchants, and every day normal people.

The commoner class works slightly differently from a normal class in that each level is effectively half a level. After a commoner passes level 1, they choose mage, rogue, or warrior as their new class, starting at level 2 and gaining the appropriate abilities. They do not, however gain any save bonuses, trained skills, or proficiency of their new class, although they do use the new HP per Level and select a primary attribute from Specialization (but do not gain any other benefits).

HP at 1st Level: 8 + Constitution
HP per Level: 1d4 + Constitution

Save Bonus: +1 Fortitude, Reflex, or Will
Trained Skills: 1

Proficiency: Commoners are proficient with no weapons or armor



Level
Benefit


0th
Basic Training


1st
Advanced Training



Basic Training
Commoners have only a rudimentary training in many walks of life, reflected in their Basic Training. At 0th level, choose one ability from below:


Arcane Training
You learn one cantrip of choice from the Mage class.

Martial Training
You gain proficiency with in a single weapon or armor group (one-handed, two-handed, ranged, light armor, heavy armor, or shields).

Skill Training
You gain a +1 bonus to two Skills of choice.

Advanced Training
Continuing their pursuits in life, a commoner continues to hone their Abilities. At 1st level, choose one Ability from below:


Advanced Arcane Training
You learn one cantrip of choice from the Mage class and gain 1d4+2 Magic Points.

Advanced Martial Training
You gain proficiency with a single weapon or armor group, and gain a +1 bonus to Attack rolls.

Advanced Skill Training
Choose an untrained skill. That skill becomes a Trained Skill. You gain a +1 bonus to two Skills of choice.

Triscuitable
2012-04-03, 11:26 PM
I'd like to compile this into a PDF, if that's cool. It'd be handy to keep on my PC in case a friend wants to do some quick role-playing.

Lappy9001
2012-04-03, 11:26 PM
I'd like to compile this into a PDF, if that's cool. It'd be handy to keep on my PC in case a friend wants to do some quick role-playing.PDF is in the works, my friend!

It looks a hell of a lot nicer too :smallcool:

Edit: Also, anything in ??Red?? is something I don't have an idea for. If you want, you can all be awesome and suggest something!

Amechra
2012-04-03, 11:33 PM
So, how I'm reading this is that Rogues are the only ones who get skills, am I right?

I do have to express disappointment that you didn't go with a non-skill-point based system, but it's your creation.

Trapsmith should let you jury-rig simple traps, and the last Speech perk should be Polyglot (i.e., pick up new languages with ease, allowing them to act as a proper party face.)

How are you handling multiclassing? Because might I suggest going for a more 4e-ish or Gestalt approach? Because the one thing that I did like about 4e are the multiclass feats.

Lappy9001
2012-04-03, 11:39 PM
So, how I'm reading this is that Rogues are the only ones who get skills, am I right?

I do have to express disappointment that you didn't go with a non-skill-point based system, but it's your creation.
Not quite, but they do get the most, and the most Perks. This system is at least a little better than 3.5, because Skill DC's are very broad, eliminating things like Diplomacy cheese. Also, I personally think the Perks are hella cool. They're my favorite part so far.

Edit: I see how you came to "Rogues Only." Fixing...


Trapsmith should let you jury-rig simple traps, and the last Speech perk should be Polyglot (i.e., pick up new languages with ease, allowing them to act as a proper party face.)I think I know how I'm gonna do traps, and Polyglot is an awesome idea, thanks!


How are you handling multiclassing? Because might I suggest going for a more 4e-ish or Gestalt approach? Because the one thing that I did like about 4e are the multiclass feats.There isn't any. You'll effectively to become whatever the heck you want within the basic 3 class chassis. I even have a section for creating archetypes, like a Paladin as a Warrior who specializes in Shield and Armor maneuvers, and Restoration magic.

Saidoro
2012-04-03, 11:43 PM
You can make whatever the heck you want (+1 Int, +1 Cha orcs, woo!), but it does come at the expense of the races being mechanically uninteresting. Also, you only get a +1 to modifiers, 'cause that's all you use. You don't reference that 16 Strength again, just the +3.

Therefore, a Halfling with a +1 Str bonus, increases his +3 into a +4 :smallcool:
I must have misread that, carry on then.


I wouldn't worry for Mages, though, just about all of the damage spells auto-hit without a save. I'm also using Psionic Augment system, so Mages will get alot of bang (http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_D_Z-D2tzi14/S8TWUJ0APWI/AAAAAAAACwI/014KRxexoQ0/s320/ALOT3.png) for their buck.
This was actually based off a misunderstanding, the perks section wasn't up yet so I thought only rogues got the +3 from picking a perk and only warriors got the +1 from picking a manuever. Looks mostly fine now. I would recommend maximizing everyone's first MP die, though. A mage can pretty much shrug off a few ones, that guy who was raised by wolves and just picked up one spell so he can talk to animals less so.

I'm liking the perks system, someone could still use it to optimize combat and nothing else, but presumably anyone doing so would know exactly what they're getting into so that's pretty much fine. Also, I'm having a hilarious image of a rogue putting all their points into haggle and having people give him money to take their stuff. Might want to add a caveat to that one.

Speaking of which, I'm a bit disappointed that you aren't doing away with the whole wealth=character power thing. It has a way of restricting a lot of campaigns and encouraging unfortunate behavior from the players. We generally don't want the players to tear apart the Brass fortress and sell it for scrap or spend an hour after every fight picking copper pieces off the kobold army's corpses.

Lappy9001
2012-04-03, 11:51 PM
I must have misread that, carry on then.Will do, guv'nah!


This was actually based off a misunderstanding, the perks section wasn't up yet so I thought only rogues got the +3 from picking a perk and only warriors got the +1 from picking a manuever. Looks mostly fine now. I would recommend maximizing everyone's first MP die, though. A mage can pretty much shrug off a few ones, that guy who was raised by wolves and just picked up one spell so he can talk to animals less so.Good idea!


I'm liking the perks system, someone could still use it to optimize combat and nothing else, but presumably anyone doing so would know exactly what they're getting into so that's pretty much fine. Also, I'm having a hilarious image of a rogue putting all their points into haggle and having people give him money to take their stuff. Might want to add a caveat to that one.It'll cap at 30%, which is a lot, but that's 3 Perks you could have been putting into Endurance or Profession to deal more damage and not get killed so it should balance out.


Speaking of which, I'm a bit disappointed that you aren't doing away with the whole wealth=character power thing. It has a way of restricting a lot of campaigns and encouraging unfortunate behavior from the players. We generally don't want the players to tear apart the Brass fortress and sell it for scrap or spend an hour after every fight picking copper pieces off the kobold army's corpses.Oh, I'm not even there yet, just you wait :smallbiggrin:

Saidoro
2012-04-04, 12:12 AM
Here's a speech perk for you:
Inspiring Word As a minor action you may grant a single ally within 60 ft a +1 bonus to Attack rolls, Damage rolls or resistance rolls until the beginning of your next turn. Increase the bonus by +1 and the number of things you can give a bonus to by one each time this perk is selected.
Roughly balanced it against performer, it can never be used on more than one person at a time but you can use it all day long if you want to and can provide a whole bunch of bonuses at once if you focus on it.

Also, the skill cap is 2+level but skill points don't seem to be multiplied at first level. Is this intentional?

Lappy9001
2012-04-04, 12:16 AM
Here's a speech perk for you:
Inspiring Word As a minor action you may grant a single ally within 60 ft a +1 bonus to Attack rolls, Damage rolls or resistance rolls until the beginning of your next turn. Increase the bonus by +1 and the number of things you can give a bonus to by one each time this perk is selected.
Roughly balanced it against performer, it can never be used on more than one person at a time but you can use it all day long if you want to and can provide a whole bunch of bonuses at once if you focus on it.And you can use it more often, nice; I'll consider it.


Also, the skill cap is 2+level but skill points don't seem to be multiplied at first level. Is this intentional?A'yup. Mostly 'cause of the reeeally condensed skill list.

Stubbazubba
2012-04-04, 12:30 AM
For those of you who are replying complaining about the classes being too narrow, go through and read the Bonus class feat for each of the classes and figure out what it does. Everyone will have access to everything, just more so of their main thing. I applaud this approach.

I love a lot of what you've got here. In fact, I'd say there's nothing I particularly dislike. The things that standout the most; reducing spell bloat, giving Warriors options in Core, and allowing every class a little bit of access to every one else's pie.



Regeneration: You regain 1 hp per round each time you select this perk.

So, if my level 1 Rogue uses all 3 of his perks on Regeneration and have enough Dex to keep my AC high enough, I pretty much can't die? Heck, even taking this once, I'd say this dramatically changes the balance of the game. Is this intended to be so powerful?

Also, the Rogue write-up says that "For each Perk a rogue learns, they gain a +3 bonus to the Skill the perk was gained from." Is this in addition to the +3 that Perks usually get, or is it just being restated?

Also, I fear Rogues would very easily get way way way off the RNG compared to others. If a Rogue always kept his Stealth maxed out, there is no Stealth challenge that he could fail that a same-level Wizard could succeed at (the disparity between their bonuses is greater than the entirety of the RNG). Assuming the Rogue keeps his Stealth at max, then at level 1 his Stealth will be 3, +4 DEX, +9 from perks, while the Mage may have +0. OK, that's not off the RNG yet (the disparity is only 16, not 20), but that's at level 1, by level 3, with the Attribute Increase, it's possible to be off the RNG, and by level 10, he's got +8 DEX, +12 Ranks, and +9 from Perks, for a total of +29, before any Magic Items, while the Mage might generously have +2 DEX and +5 ranks, a total of +7. If he's used one of his Perks for Stealth, that at least brings it to +10, but that's somewhat unlikely. So, the Wizard can't succeed on a 20 any test that the Rogue might actually fail. Unless the Wizard is expected to use his MP (this may or may not be unrealistic, since I don't know how MP works yet) to succeed at any and all tasks past a certain point (like, level 5), then something needs to be done. This is a problem with skill-based systems.

I have five suggestions to remedy this:

Cap Ability Modifier at +6, this will encourage players to diversify horizontally with their later Ability Increases.
Do away with Skill Points/level: Instead use 4e's Trained/Untrained arrangement; At first level, Mages get 2 Trained Skills, Warriors get 4, and Rogues get 6. Instead of choosing a Perk, allow a Skill to become Trained instead, if desired. Trained Skills get a +3 bonus, and if you train the same skill again, it raises to +6, but that's all you can train it.
Add 1/2 level to all rolls. This will maintain the power disparity between levels, just not within the same level.
Perks give a +2 bonus to it's skill, not +3.
Magic Items don't give a lot of vertical power, biggest magical bonus is +2.
Total level-independent bonus is now +6+6+6+2 = +20, which is technically still off the RNG from +0, but only by 1 point.


Now, the same level 10 Rogue is rolling d20+25 (+20 above, +5 from level), while the same level 10 Mage is rolling d20+10 (+2 DEX, +3 Trained, and +5 from level), meaning that the Rogue is still doing 75% better, but the appropriate DCs actually overlap (albeit only from 26-30).

I realize this has neutered the power level of level 1 a bit, and I don't know what you had in mind for Magic Items, so this is obviously just a suggestion, if you even see people being off the RNG from each other in skill disparity as a bad thing. It might be seen as too much sacrifice for too little gain, and that would be perfectly justifiable.

Knaight
2012-04-04, 12:33 AM
Comments:
There is really no reason to retain the score-modifier system. Make the modifier the score, change the rolling system (d6-d6, unless you just shift the entire scale up, in which case it can be just 2d6). It is almost entirely gone already, so the tiny bit more required to get rid of it and subsequent simplification is very much desirable.

It might be better to have a d6, d8, d10 hit point progression instead of a d4, d6, d10. This achieves two things: It puts humans in the center of the range, leaving a d4 for really fragile monsters and a d12 for really tough monsters, and it removes a gap and makes it easier to remember.

A rogue with 20 int (+5 mod) gets 11 skill points per level. There are 10 skills.

The Athlete, Allure, and Shadow Leap perks seem questionable - I'd normally be wary of multiplicative effects on difficulty in a linear die system, though they make sense when significantly increasing the effect of luck. Maybe this can be switched to +level or +5.

The Haul perk implies the existence of an encumbrance system that directly tracks weight. I'd strongly caution against this.

The Artificer perk is currently worded in such a way as to only allow upgrading one weapon past the first enchantment.

As it is now, lots of concepts aren't really explained, but need an understanding of D&D mechanics to make sense. You'll probably want to change that eventually.

Other than all this, the system looks fantastic. I can't wait to see more.

eftexar
2012-04-04, 12:43 AM
Hm... While I agree on most of your points, Knaight, what's wrong with having encumbrance and a weight system? It is realistic, otherwise you could carry everything. My willing suspension of disbelief won't allow for an infinite carrying capacity. On another note if it is there it should be more realistic than 3.5 (because in 3.5 once your strength gets to a certain point it just doesn't matter anymore).
On another note I hope this system isn't heavily reliant on magic items. That's one of the biggest things that irritated me about 3.5 (though it (and WoD) still remains my favorite system).

Edit > A couple of other concerns though. How do you plan on doing spells? I'm sort of hoping for a massive reduction in range (anything past 200 is just insane) and durations (especially for buffs), plus the elimination of auto success spells (but that's just more my two cents than anything).

Knaight
2012-04-04, 01:43 AM
Hm... While I agree on most of your points, Knaight, what's wrong with having encumbrance and a weight system? It is realistic, otherwise you could carry everything. My willing suspension of disbelief won't allow for an infinite carrying capacity.
A few things.
1) Weight based encumbrance really isn't that realistic, as distribution counts for a lot. So it fails even that.
2) For this realism you are paying a high price in micromanagement. There are much better ways to handle this, without enabling the carrying of infinite amounts of stuff.

eftexar
2012-04-04, 01:48 AM
Fair enough, but the only other system I can think of is space. Certain items take up so much space (like sacred if anyone has played it). Do you think something like that would work better?

Knaight
2012-04-04, 01:53 AM
Fair enough, but the only other system I can think of is space. Certain items take up so much space (like sacred if anyone has played it). Do you think something like that would work better?
Suffice to say there is the whole matter of varying degrees of abstraction. In any case, this is getting to be a bit of a derail, though so far it's provided useful clarification - if you want to continue this discussion, PM me or start a new thread and PM me the link to it.

WyvernLord
2012-04-05, 12:40 AM
I love this system. It makes me want to play rogues over warrior characters. That is very weird with me.
Congratulations you crazy man this is awesome. You can totally sig that. :p yes I know about smilies they aren't invisible though.
Can't wait for the spells. Will be staring at this thread.
Is there supposed to be a d20 in the damage line? Because that would be scary with these HP. :smalleek:
Love the weapons and their fighting styles. Impede plus polearm and a shield fighter with safeguard next to you is a tough nut to crack. Add some range behind those two and it will be massacre-licious. Only problem is the wording and specials on one handed weapons is wonky. For example only swords get to add Dex to damage but daggers don't. That's weird.
Also no Str to attack with one-handers. What about the burly shield fighter I wanted to play. :smallfrown:
Also I recommend changing staff to rod if it is one-handed. Just thinking about it. What if you actually want to hit someone with it. You aren't going to do any damage if you use a staff one handed.
That went longer then expected. :smallredface:

Knaight
2012-04-05, 01:06 AM
New comments regarding the maneuvers and weapons sections:

Manuevers
It's unclear how many attacks you normally get in a round - there's some verbiage implying more than one, but it is odd. This should be clarified.

Critical Damage is undefined.

Rapid shot seems strictly better than multishot, unless that is the only attack allowed in the round.

Dodge should probably work when unarmored.

Unhindered removes any incentive to use anything but Full Plate. That might not be a bad thing, but seems somewhat questionable.

Weapons and Armor
-10 is a bit excessive for nonproficiency, and -5 should be plenty. -5 can reduce a hit chance from 15-20 to 20, which is effectively multiplying hit chance by 20%. That should be plenty.

The chance of ignoring armor on a critical is a bit of a cumbersome mechanic. Changing it to ignoring part of armor should neatly sidestep the issue, and this is one of those areas where it actually makes sense to use a multiplicative effect and reduce the difference between armors.

The great sword is literally always worse than the maul for everyone but warriors. Bumping the damage up to d12 for everyone fixes this neatly.

I'd recommend bumping the spear up to +5 against charges.

The weights are all a bit on the high side - if you drop 1 handed to 2 pounds, and 2 handed to 4 pounds it is a bit more realistic. However, this does conflict with the apparent goal of increments of 5 for weight.

If you're willing to simplify further, I'd recommend streamlining the armor system: Reduce it to four armors, Light (+2, -0), Medium Light (+4, -5), Medium Heavy (+6, -10), Heavy (+8, -15). The shields are excellent as is.

WyvernLord
2012-04-05, 01:20 AM
Manuevers
Rapid shot seems strictly better than multishot, unless that is the only attack allowed in the round.
Depends on if you want to use pinning shot too.
Dodge should probably work when unarmored.
It totally should.
Unhindered removes any incentive to use anything but Full Plate. That might not be a bad thing, but seems somewhat questionable.
Especially since except for hide only warriors get armors that bind movement. It's almost a tax on warriors it's that important that you get move speed.

The last one brings me to a suggestion. Spending perks on gear proficiency it would be great for rogues who want to use bigger weapons. Or mages who a little more armor but want to preserve their spell selection.

Ninjadeadbeard
2012-04-05, 02:30 AM
This looks amazing! I've been streamlining 3.5 recently for my players, and this looks a lot easier and cleaner! If we weren't already settled on a system, we'd definitely go with this one.

I can't wait to see the magic section. I'm curious as to how you're doing mana points (so I can steal your genius for my own nefarious purposes :smallwink:).

Alchemyst
2012-04-05, 03:46 AM
Firstly, let me say I do love what you've got going on here! And look forward to seeing it closer to completion.

Next... For Speech I was going to suggest an alignment based "Words of..." idea ala BoVD/BoED. But seeing no mention of alignment, that throws it out of whack. But I'm not completely lost on this idea, it does give me inspiration.

Furthering the idea, and removing the alignment restrictions we could get a strange amalgam of the two, to maybe get something like this?

Words of Exaltation - Through your great voice and mastery of word play you are able to inspire you and your allies within a 60' radius, granting them a buff in their abilities. When you use this ability, you choose what benefit you grant from the following: +1/2 level to ToHit and Damage, or skill rolls, or defenses, or gain temporary hit points equal to half their hit die. This may only be used 1/day per number of times this perk has been acquired.
Words of Contempt - Your words flow out like an invisible menace, striking fear into your enemies. When you use this ability all enemies within a 60' radius lose 1/2 of user's level to ToHit and Damage, defenses, or skills. This may only be used 1/day per number of times this perk has been acquired.


And me, trying to make it interesting to all was difficult. I probably failed. And doubtlessly should be balanced and worded better... And yeah... two abilities. Not one. I realize that, but I tried!
I'm unsure of what kind of bonus these modifiers should be typed as.

WyvernLord
2012-04-05, 11:06 AM
Right now by RaW you can use any maneuver with any weapon with or without shields. While cool I'm checking if that is your intention. It's definitely implied in the opposite direction. Another idea is having some weapon style specific maneuvers and others that are more general.
And four warriors standing in a square with Aegis and Safeguard up is a impenetrable block. Use the best armor and use a sword and your Dex should be top priority. Your defense will be impenetrable.

Lappy9001
2012-04-05, 12:43 PM
Thank you, everyone who commented or put in a good word! I appreciate it more than you know :smallcool:

Stubbazubba:

For those of you who are replying complaining about the classes being too narrow, go through and read the Bonus class feat for each of the classes and figure out what it does. Everyone will have access to everything, just more so of their main thing. I applaud this approach.

I love a lot of what you've got here. In fact, I'd say there's nothing I particularly dislike. The things that standout the most; reducing spell bloat, giving Warriors options in Core, and allowing every class a little bit of access to every one else's pie. Thank you so much :smallsmile:


So, if my level 1 Rogue uses all 3 of his perks on Regeneration and have enough Dex to keep my AC high enough, I pretty much can't die? Heck, even taking this once, I'd say this dramatically changes the balance of the game. Is this intended to be so powerful?

Also, the Rogue write-up says that "For each Perk a rogue learns, they gain a +3 bonus to the Skill the perk was gained from." Is this in addition to the +3 that Perks usually get, or is it just being restated?Yeah, I'm gonna have to tighten up Perks a bit. I'm gonna use your Trained/Untrained suggestion, and I'll clarify that the bonus is the same one you normally get from Perks. Thank you for the advice!


I have five suggestions to remedy this:

Cap Ability Modifier at +6, this will encourage players to diversify horizontally with their later Ability Increases.
Do away with Skill Points/level: Instead use 4e's Trained/Untrained arrangement; At first level, Mages get 2 Trained Skills, Warriors get 4, and Rogues get 6. Instead of choosing a Perk, allow a Skill to become Trained instead, if desired. Trained Skills get a +3 bonus, and if you train the same skill again, it raises to +6, but that's all you can train it.
Add 1/2 level to all rolls. This will maintain the power disparity between levels, just not within the same level.
Perks give a +2 bonus to it's skill, not +3.
Magic Items don't give a lot of vertical power, biggest magical bonus is +2.
Total level-independent bonus is now +6+6+6+2 = +20, which is technically still off the RNG from +0, but only by 1 point.


Now, the same level 10 Rogue is rolling d20+25 (+20 above, +5 from level), while the same level 10 Mage is rolling d20+10 (+2 DEX, +3 Trained, and +5 from level), meaning that the Rogue is still doing 75% better, but the appropriate DCs actually overlap (albeit only from 26-30).

I realize this has neutered the power level of level 1 a bit, and I don't know what you had in mind for Magic Items, so this is obviously just a suggestion, if you even see people being off the RNG from each other in skill disparity as a bad thing. It might be seen as too much sacrifice for too little gain, and that would be perfectly justifiable.Cool ideas, I'll add in the Ability Cap, the Trained/Untrained, and +2 Perks. Maybe the 1/2 level bonus to all rolls. I'll have to see how things go.

Knaight:

Comments:
There is really no reason to retain the score-modifier system. Make the modifier the score, change the rolling system (d6-d6, unless you just shift the entire scale up, in which case it can be just 2d6). It is almost entirely gone already, so the tiny bit more required to get rid of it and subsequent simplification is very much desirable. Good plan, I'll fix that.


It might be better to have a d6, d8, d10 hit point progression instead of a d4, d6, d10. This achieves two things: It puts humans in the center of the range, leaving a d4 for really fragile monsters and a d12 for really tough monsters, and it removes a gap and makes it easier to remember.When I get to monsters, there are 5 classes (in a sense) with Minion (1d4), Warlock (1d6), Lurker (1d8), Sentinel (1d10), and Brute (1d12). I'm on the fence whether or not to bump Wizards and Rogues up. I like the HP disparity between them and Warriors. I'm not totally set on it, though, so you could probably convince me.


A rogue with 20 int (+5 mod) gets 11 skill points per level. There are 10 skills.I'm gonna go with Stubbazubba's 4e Trained/Untrained so it shouldn't be an issue. Thanks for pointing it out!


The Athlete, Allure, and Shadow Leap perks seem questionable - I'd normally be wary of multiplicative effects on difficulty in a linear die system, though they make sense when significantly increasing the effect of luck. Maybe this can be switched to +level or +5.I get Athlete and Allure, but why Shadow Leap? My original plan for Athlete (allow melee types to overcome encumbrance) is pretty much moot now, so I'm gonna change it.


The Haul perk implies the existence of an encumbrance system that directly tracks weight. I'd strongly caution against this.It's gonna be a pretty basic system, not nearly as elaborate as 3.5


The Artificer perk is currently worded in such a way as to only allow upgrading one weapon past the first enchantment.Nice catch, fixing...


As it is now, lots of concepts aren't really explained, but need an understanding of D&D mechanics to make sense. You'll probably want to change that eventually.Yeeeeah, I'm gonna work on that. Gotta get everything up first. Don't let me forget :smalltongue:


Other than all this, the system looks fantastic. I can't wait to see more.Thank you, you're awesome.


New comments regarding the maneuvers and weapons sections:

Manuevers
It's unclear how many attacks you normally get in a round - there's some verbiage implying more than one, but it is odd. This should be clarified.It's normally just the one, but Archery and One-Handed Maneuvers (along with Cleave), let you get around this.


Critical Damage is undefined.I actually Ninja'd you to that one. It's up in the Combat section.


Rapid shot seems strictly better than multishot, unless that is the only attack allowed in the round.I'm not happy with how those turned out anyhow. Probably gonna fix it.


Dodge should probably work when unarmored.That...would make sense :smalltongue: Fixed!


Unhindered removes any incentive to use anything but Full Plate. That might not be a bad thing, but seems somewhat questionable.Gonna make another Light/Heavy disparity like Fortification. Should fix this.


Weapons and Armor
-10 is a bit excessive for nonproficiency, and -5 should be plenty. -5 can reduce a hit chance from 15-20 to 20, which is effectively multiplying hit chance by 20%. That should be plenty.Done.


The chance of ignoring armor on a critical is a bit of a cumbersome mechanic. Changing it to ignoring part of armor should neatly sidestep the issue, and this is one of those areas where it actually makes sense to use a multiplicative effect and reduce the difference between armors.Hmm...good idea.


The great sword is literally always worse than the maul for everyone but warriors. Bumping the damage up to d12 for everyone fixes this neatly.Good idea, but I don't know what cool trait to give it. Maybe it won't get one for doing the most damage?


I'd recommend bumping the spear up to +5 against charges.Done and done.


The weights are all a bit on the high side - if you drop 1 handed to 2 pounds, and 2 handed to 4 pounds it is a bit more realistic. However, this does conflict with the apparent goal of increments of 5 for weight.I realize it's not realistic (historic greatswords were like, 6 pounds tops, but fantasy weapons are almost always larger than their realistic counterparts. I do have an idea to let you adjust it as you like, mostly if you wanna role-play it being heavier for 'realism.' It's pretty negligible either way, though.


If you're willing to simplify further, I'd recommend streamlining the armor system: Reduce it to four armors, Light (+2, -0), Medium Light (+4, -5), Medium Heavy (+6, -10), Heavy (+8, -15). The shields are excellent as is.This might give Medium Armor-wearers the short end of the stick, but I like the idea alot (http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_D_Z-D2tzi14/S8TRIo4br3I/AAAAAAAACv4/Zh7_GcMlRKo/s400/ALOT.png). I'll see what I can do.

WyvernLord:

I love this system. It makes me want to play rogues over warrior characters. That is very weird with me.
Congratulations you crazy man this is awesome. You can totally sig that. :p yes I know about smilies they aren't invisible though.
Can't wait for the spells. Will be staring at this thread.Thank you so much for the kind words! I really appreciate it :smallcool:

Is there supposed to be a d20 in the damage line? Because that would be scary with these HP. :smalleek:Heh, no. Thanks!

Love the weapons and their fighting styles. Impede plus polearm and a shield fighter with safeguard next to you is a tough nut to crack. Add some range behind those two and it will be massacre-licious. Only problem is the wording and specials on one handed weapons is wonky. For example only swords get to add Dex to damage but daggers don't. That's weird.
Also no Str to attack with one-handers. What about the burly shield fighter I wanted to play. :smallfrown:I'll fanagle that around a bit.

Also I recommend changing staff to rod if it is one-handed. Just thinking about it. What if you actually want to hit someone with it. You aren't going to do any damage if you use a staff one handed.
That went longer then expected. :smallredface:I'll look into that one too, thanks.


Right now by RaW you can use any maneuver with any weapon with or without shields. While cool I'm checking if that is your intention. It's definitely implied in the opposite direction. Another idea is having some weapon style specific maneuvers and others that are more general.
And four warriors standing in a square with Aegis and Safeguard up is a impenetrable block. Use the best armor and use a sword and your Dex should be top priority. Your defense will be impenetrable.Oh, I forgot to add in how Dex affects armor! Dang. And no, Shields should only be used with 1-handed weapons.

A proper defense is intended...but an Apportation-focusing Mage could totally scatter that line just long enough. I'll keep it in mind, though.


The last one brings me to a suggestion. Spending perks on gear proficiency it would be great for rogues who want to use bigger weapons. Or mages who a little more armor but want to preserve their spell selection.Oh shoot, I forgot that too. Taking a Maneuver automatically makes you proficient in that type of weapon, armor, or shield. Thanks for reminding me!

Alchemyst:

Firstly, let me say I do love what you've got going on here! And look forward to seeing it closer to completion.Thankee kindly :smallcool:


Next... For Speech I was going to suggest an alignment based "Words of..." idea ala BoVD/BoED. But seeing no mention of alignment, that throws it out of whack. But I'm not completely lost on this idea, it does give me inspiration.

Furthering the idea, and removing the alignment restrictions we could get a strange amalgam of the two, to maybe get something like this?

Words of Exaltation - Through your great voice and mastery of word play you are able to inspire you and your allies within a 60' radius, granting them a buff in their abilities. When you use this ability, you choose what benefit you grant from the following: +1/2 level to ToHit and Damage, or skill rolls, or defenses, or gain temporary hit points equal to half their hit die. This may only be used 1/day per number of times this perk has been acquired.
Words of Contempt - Your words flow out like an invisible menace, striking fear into your enemies. When you use this ability all enemies within a 60' radius lose 1/2 of user's level to ToHit and Damage, defenses, or skills. This may only be used 1/day per number of times this perk has been acquired.
[QUOTE=Alchemyst;13017537]Good ideas...I'll try to implement a buff thing. There might be a brief mention of alignment in variant rules, but there's not any mechanical effects in game.

[QUOTE=Alchemyst;13017537]And me, trying to make it interesting to all was difficult. I probably failed. And doubtlessly should be balanced and worded better... And yeah... two abilities. Not one. I realize that, but I tried!
I'm unsure of what kind of bonus these modifiers should be typed as.Currently, I'm trying for the idea that everything stacks with everything...a potentially horrible idea, but I think I can pull it off. Let me know if this idea makes me mad with power...


Ninjadeadbeard:

This looks amazing! I've been streamlining 3.5 recently for my players, and this looks a lot easier and cleaner! If we weren't already settled on a system, we'd definitely go with this one.That's quite a complement! Thank you :smallsmile:


I can't wait to see the magic section. I'm curious as to how you're doing mana points (so I can steal your genius for my own nefarious purposes :smallwink:).It's basically Psionic Power Points, but there are no spell levels. You can cast any spell you dang want to at any level :smallcool:

WyvernLord
2012-04-05, 01:13 PM
Thank you for doing this project. I will be here to over analyze everything about this system. Keep up the good work. That way I don't have to poke to many holes in the system. :smalltongue:
Also I ment more like you can use the shield maneuvers with a two-handed weapon and vice versa. By RaI it is obviously not supposed to do that.
Picking maneuvers with certain weapon types giving proficiency is a fun idea. Makes a lot of sense too.
Still waiting for the spells. Hurry up, Hurry up, Hurry up, Hurry up!
Just read the new weapon rules. They make me smile. :smallsmile:

Lappy9001
2012-04-05, 01:17 PM
Thank you for doing this project. I will be here to over analyze everything about this system. Keep up the good work. That way I don't have to poke to many holes in the system. :smalltongue:
Also I ment more like you can use the shield maneuvers with a two-handed weapon and vice versa. By RaI it is obviously not supposed to do that.
Picking maneuvers with certain weapon types giving proficiency is a fun idea. Makes a lot of sense too.
Still waiting for the spells. Hurry up, Hurry up, Hurry up, Hurry up!Yeah, the thing is that most of the stuff is done, it's just not Html ready. I refuse to put up a cluttered mess up on the boards :smalltongue:

Monsters is the exception. I wanted to get the system finished before I had to write, then re-write 50 monsters :smallyuk:

Edit: Already fixed the Shield thing. Only works with One-Handed weapons. Sorry to disappoint :smallwink:

WyvernLord
2012-04-05, 01:58 PM
Went over the stuff again. Needs more unarmed combat. Even just a mention of I don't like it is better then nothing. I would suggest a maneuver making it a viable option. Unarmed rogue fighting. Bar room brawls. We need unarmed combat rules.

Lappy9001
2012-04-05, 02:38 PM
Went over the stuff again. Needs more unarmed combat. Even just a mention of I don't like it is better then nothing. I would suggest a maneuver making it a viable option. Unarmed rogue fighting. Bar room brawls. We need unarmed combat rules.Cool. Adding it in as a Fighting Style. More News at 11

Lappy9001
2012-04-05, 03:34 PM
Non-comprehensive list:

Added in Trained Skills
Adjusted Perks from +3 to +2 bonus
Can only take additional Perks from Trained Skills
Changed Weapons/Armor
Filled in some of the Perks (Gonna get Equipment/Traps up soon)
Added Fighting Styles (you can now make a pretty beast monk or barbarian)
Changed Shield fighting to work only with One-Handed weapons (or unarmed)
Some other stuff I don't remember.

Gonna work on getting up Magic/Spells plus whatever needs fixed. Thanks again, everyone!

WyvernLord
2012-04-05, 03:59 PM
Wheeee, fighting styles are awesome. Quick hole spot, Pugilist only give plus half BaB but you can get plus BaB to defense when wearing heavy armor. Kind of messed up.
Just waiting on spells now. And monsters.

If you need any play-testing I'll help. Depending on my schedule I might even DM.

Ninjadeadbeard
2012-04-05, 07:23 PM
It's basically Psionic Power Points, but there are no spell levels. You can cast any spell you dang want to at any level :smallcool:

We're using a similar method in the streamlined 3.5. We still have spell levels, but you can cast something higher level than you for a HP hit (Lvl 1 Wizard burns health to throw a fireball). And like I said, I'm looking to "borrow" your mana system :smallamused:. The rest looks so darn good I don't doubt it'll be awesome. Keep it up!

Lappy9001
2012-04-05, 08:13 PM
We're using a similar method in the streamlined 3.5. We still have spell levels, but you can cast something higher level than you for a HP hit (Lvl 1 Wizard burns health to throw a fireball). And like I said, I'm looking to "borrow" your mana system :smallamused:. The rest looks so darn good I don't doubt it'll be awesome. Keep it up!Awesome :smallcool:

The first bit of Magic is up, along with the first 3 Magic Schools. I've got some other work to do, but I should be able to have the other 2 up before the night's out.

WyvernLord
2012-04-05, 10:45 PM
Looking very good so far. I have noticed a similarity to a game called, Warrior Rogue, Mage though. Your progression is a little smoother though. Higher powered too.
Individual spell groups now.
Aporter, Yay movement.
Evoker, yay combat
Illusionist, Lol, you mad bro.
All descriptions based on people who specialize in that magic group.
Are all groups going to have five spells. Because as written right now that provides a problem to mages spells known list.

Lappy9001
2012-04-05, 10:59 PM
Looking very good so far. I have noticed a similarity to a game called, Warrior Rogue, Mage though. Your progression is a little smoother though. Higher powered too.
Individual spell groups now.
Aporter, Yay movement.
Evoker, yay combat
Illusionist, Lol, you mad bro.
All descriptions based on people who specialize in that magic group.
Are all groups going to have five spells. Because as written right now that provides a problem to mages spells known list.Never heard of it, really. Warrior, Rogue, and Mage are such well-established archetypes that it's hardly a new idea.

Glad you like the Schools...I just finished Restoration and Transmutation will be up in just a bit. Mages are supposed to learn three schools of magic. I don't know how I made an error that big. Each School has 6 spells, but yeah.

Edit: I remember now. Each School was originally going to have more Spells contained within it, drawn from other schools, effectively making the possible Spell list 20. If you cast a Spell that you knew from multiple places, it could be augmented as if you were 1 level higher. I ditched this last minute in favor of the 3 school listing.

eftexar
2012-04-05, 11:28 PM
I really like how you are balancing the magic with melee. While magic, granted, still does more than melee, it is more limited now (no ridiculous range and a higher mp limit, but the mage can still do stuff) and melee now has a considerable boost to damage. This balances the gap quite a bit (especially with the criticals still in the mix)
I hope your planning on avoiding combat enhancing spells or at least limit them to being weaker than normal melee at any level (there are so many ways to emulate a fighter with magic). Not sure if you think that is an issue but...
Judging from how everything else is balanced though, don't you think cloak of energy does too much? And I'm going to ask for avoidance of the 1/hour level duration. I think part of the problem with spellcasters in 3.5 is the long duration of spells. Maybe set them at just a flat 1 hour regardless of level?

WyvernLord
2012-04-05, 11:40 PM
One thing, the wording on death ward means everything you drop below 1 HP your regain the health. I'd add in a clause like this. "When this ability is used the spell is discharged for 2 MP it may be used on more time." that is probably to low of a augment cost. But still it would be an invulnerability spell without that.

Lappy9001
2012-04-05, 11:55 PM
I really like how you are balancing the magic with melee. While magic, granted, still does more than melee, it is more limited now (no ridiculous range and a higher mp limit, but the mage can still do stuff) and melee now has a considerable boost to damage. This balances the gap quite a bit (especially with the criticals still in the mix)
I hope your planning on avoiding combat enhancing spells or at least limit them to being weaker than normal melee at any level (there are so many ways to emulate a fighter with magic). Not sure if you think that is an issue but...
Judging from how everything else is balanced though, don't you think cloak of energy does too much? And I'm going to ask for avoidance of the 1/hour level duration. I think part of the problem with spellcasters in 3.5 is the long duration of spells. Maybe set them at just a flat 1 hour regardless of level?The logic for Cloak of Energy was that it wouldn't have a lot of opportunities to hit many enemies, although it ironically has a larger space.

And 1 hour cap...I like it. I think I'll change most of those to that, thanks!


One thing, the wording on death ward means everything you drop below 1 HP your regain the health. I'd add in a clause like this. "When this ability is used the spell is discharged for 2 MP it may be used on more time." that is probably to low of a augment cost. But still it would be an invulnerability spell without that.I was supposed to add that in. Thank you!

Also, Transmutation is up.

WyvernLord
2012-04-06, 12:12 AM
Transmutation is fun but definitely a secondary school.
I'm now splitting the groups of magic into groups. Primaries and secondaries. Primaries are evocation and healing. They are constantly wanted and used types of magic. Secondaries are still extremely useful but are more situational and require better tactics if it is your main school for combat. Secondaries are illusion, aporter, and transmutation. In larger groups grappling extra secondaries be comes a lot more useful when the extra battlefield control spells of the secondaries helps set up the rest of the groups abilities.

Lappy9001
2012-04-06, 12:25 AM
Transmutation is fun but definitely a secondary school.
I'm now splitting the groups of magic into groups. Primaries and secondaries. Primaries are evocation and healing. They are constantly wanted and used types of magic. Secondaries are still extremely useful but are more situational and require better tactics if it is your main school for combat. Secondaries are illusion, aporter, and transmutation. In larger groups grappling extra secondaries be comes a lot more useful when the extra battlefield control spells of the secondaries helps set up the rest of the groups abilities.The cool part is that it isn't really an issue. A Warrior or Rogue who picks a spell in Apportation/Illusion/Transmutation is doing so for a specific effect and still has plenty of options. A Mage will have other Schools to fall back on, and even if they pick all three, they're enough to still be potent. So yeah, hit the nail on the head :smallbiggrin:

WyvernLord
2012-04-06, 12:34 AM
I made the secondary section larger because the original post made it sound like you had to have a primary or not be very useful. Instead of my actual point where you just need to be a little more clever with secondaries. Primaries are useful in a hammer sort of way. You should know that saying by now though. :smallsmile:
Secondaries are more of a wrench or pliers. Useful in many situations just not for obvious reasons.
Transmutation is kind of weird though it's abilities are very obvious but need better placement the primaries.

Ninjadeadbeard
2012-04-06, 12:44 AM
So Transmutation doesn't get a Polymorph effect? It just seems like there's a lot of "Change target square thus" spells.

Lappy9001
2012-04-06, 01:03 AM
So Transmutation doesn't get a Polymorph effect? It just seems like there's a lot of "Change target square thus" spells.Part of the goal to reduce the silliness of spells was to keep them very structured. Transmutation affects objects, primarily. Plus, I don't want to touch polymorph with a 10 ft. pole.

I am open to more Transmutation ideas...I'm personally not super impressed how it turned out.

Ninjadeadbeard
2012-04-06, 01:28 AM
I am open to more Transmutation ideas...I'm personally not super impressed how it turned out.

How about a spell that changes what weapons are made out of. If you've got an enemy monster that's weak against silver or something, the party mage casts this on the fighter's sword, giving it SILVER as a temporary status, and thus getting through damage reduction or whatever.

Or I suppose an enterprising PC could turn a bunch of wooden nickels into gold and then make off like a bandit before the time runs out and the angry lynchmob hunts the party down :smalltongue:.

WyvernLord
2012-04-06, 05:17 PM
A purely fluff complaint. Illusion would be better as Glamour IMO. It is a slightly more accurate term, again IMO.

Knaight
2012-04-07, 02:04 AM
Regarding spells - I'd suggest limiting mana expenditure by spells known instead of by level. I'd also consider the current spell's known restrictions pretty harsh - maybe you could just double the mana cost of all spells not in the favored school (or two favored schools, for mages).

Regarding spell terminology - Mana is really not ideal for a few reasons, not the least of which is overuse. Other terms would be preferable (e.g Essence, Vis).

Lappy9001
2012-04-07, 08:28 PM
Regarding spells - I'd suggest limiting mana expenditure by spells known instead of by level. I'd also consider the current spell's known restrictions pretty harsh - maybe you could just double the mana cost of all spells not in the favored school (or two favored schools, for mages).

Regarding spell terminology - Mana is really not ideal for a few reasons, not the least of which is overuse. Other terms would be preferable (e.g Essence, Vis).Double augmentation for non-favored schools, love it!

How else is Mana Point not ideal? It's an easy connection between RPG's and Video Games for new players and prevents the redundancy of Spells and Spell Points.


A purely fluff complaint. Illusion would be better as Glamour IMO. It is a slightly more accurate term, again IMO.Enchantment was my first choice, but it's strangely paired with Magic Items so...yeah

Knaight
2012-04-08, 05:06 AM
How else is Mana Point not ideal? It's an easy connection between RPG's and Video Games for new players and prevents the redundancy of Spells and Spell Points.
The sheer dullness of it is the big issue, particularly as there are a lot of options regarding spell choice.


Enchantment was my first choice, but it's strangely paired with Magic Items so...yeah
You can probably get Enchantment to work as a name, particularly if you have a different name for any actual magic construction.

Regarding evocation - the damage seems really high. Take energy burst - this hits with (level)d8 against (level)d4 or (level)d6 in some cases, and while that is significant mana expenditure (2/7 of the total mana on average, before accounting for the initial bonus which puts it a bit lower) it also has a very good chance of being an instant kill. Pulse is similarly nasty. Sure, a high constitution deals with this to some extent, but reducing everything but single target effects a bit would be reasonable.

As for energy resistance - a mechanic that might work well is resistance per die of incoming damage, where it is 1 MP per point per die. This serves a few purposes. First, it is essentially a way to handle a pseudo-multiplicative effect, which helps with scaling. Secondly, it makes complete immunity difficult to get for all but high level mages, which is entirely reasonable. Third, it essentially takes energy damage from a one dimensional system to a two dimensional volume and intensity system, which is nice. Energy resistance could be 2+1 per level, and level 7 mages can effectively nullify a d8 value, level 9s a d10, and nobody a d12, where d12 represents resistance piercing effects.

Regarding transmutation, there is currently a lack of things that change the shape of living beings. Is this deliberate, an oversight, or to come later?

One last thing - where do physical and mental resistance actually come in, and how are they calculated?

Saidoro
2012-04-09, 12:56 AM
Doubling augmentations for non-favored schools is problematic as many spells don't even have an augmentation cost. It might be better to double the entire cost or say that they don't get any mana points from selecting a spell of a non-favored school instead. Speaking of: mana isn't overused, it's just the default term. You call a hammer a hammer and you call a pool of homogeneous magical energy usable in spellcasting mana. We could call it a mallet or claw hammer instead, but really, what's the point?

The blacksmith perk has stacking issues. If you just take it once or twice it's really terrible, but if you take it to the exclusion of anything else it's amazing to the point where a rogue who just took blacksmith could deal 32d8 damage with a longbow at 10th level. Having one thing scale exponentially while everything else is linear is bad.

Would a mage dual wielding rods get the arcane implement bonus twice?

Here's a potential transmutation spell for you:
Dispell
Duration: Instant Range: 100 ft
You may end any single temporary magical effect within range. Make a mental resist check against the effect and if you succeed the effect immediately ends.
It doesn't really fit well in transmutation but then, it doesn't really fit well anywhere else either and it's a common enough trope that there should probably be space for it somewhere.
Also, you may want to add augments to some of the transmutation spells to make them last longer. It's really the only school where long duration effects make much sense.

Lappy9001
2012-04-09, 02:34 AM
The sheer dullness of it is the big issue, particularly as there are a lot of options regarding spell choice.


You can probably get Enchantment to work as a name, particularly if you have a different name for any actual magic construction.

Regarding evocation - the damage seems really high. Take energy burst - this hits with (level)d8 against (level)d4 or (level)d6 in some cases, and while that is significant mana expenditure (2/7 of the total mana on average, before accounting for the initial bonus which puts it a bit lower) it also has a very good chance of being an instant kill. Pulse is similarly nasty. Sure, a high constitution deals with this to some extent, but reducing everything but single target effects a bit would be reasonable.

As for energy resistance - a mechanic that might work well is resistance per die of incoming damage, where it is 1 MP per point per die. This serves a few purposes. First, it is essentially a way to handle a pseudo-multiplicative effect, which helps with scaling. Secondly, it makes complete immunity difficult to get for all but high level mages, which is entirely reasonable. Third, it essentially takes energy damage from a one dimensional system to a two dimensional volume and intensity system, which is nice. Energy resistance could be 2+1 per level, and level 7 mages can effectively nullify a d8 value, level 9s a d10, and nobody a d12, where d12 represents resistance piercing effects.I'm actually a little confused at what you mean. Would you mind reiterating? :smallsmile:


Regarding transmutation, there is currently a lack of things that change the shape of living beings. Is this deliberate, an oversight, or to come later?Deliberate. Part of the challenge to make the spells very concise, although I'm gonna try to work them in somewhere.


One last thing - where do physical and mental resistance actually come in, and how are they calculated?Yeah, I need to write those in.

Physical Resistance: Highest Physical Attribute + Race bonus (the set one, plus any scaling if you choose) + Perk bonuses/misc.

Mental is the same, but with the highest Mental attribute.


Doubling augmentations for non-favored schools is problematic as many spells don't even have an augmentation cost. It might be better to double the entire cost or say that they don't get any mana points from selecting a spell of a non-favored school instead. Speaking of: mana isn't overused, it's just the default term. You call a hammer a hammer and you call a pool of homogeneous magical energy usable in spellcasting mana. We could call it a mallet or claw hammer instead, but really, what's the point?I'm not so sure about negating the MP from non-favored Spells. The MP pool is deliberately conservative as it is. I do see the draw to the idea, however...I'll mull it over :smallsmile:


The blacksmith perk has stacking issues. If you just take it once or twice it's really terrible, but if you take it to the exclusion of anything else it's amazing to the point where a rogue who just took blacksmith could deal 32d8 damage with a longbow at 10th level. Having one thing scale exponentially while everything else is linear is bad.Well, you can actually only gain a Perk 3 times, so you'll never gonna get more than 2d10.

Do you have any other ideas for it? I figure a Warrior/Rogue might not have many qualms about dropping a Perk to beef up their weapon a bit.


Would a mage dual wielding rods get the arcane implement bonus twice?Good question, I'll clarify that they can't.


Here's a potential transmutation spell for you:
Dispell
Duration: Instant Range: 100 ft
You may end any single temporary magical effect within range. Make a mental resist check against the effect and if you succeed the effect immediately ends.
It doesn't really fit well in transmutation but then, it doesn't really fit well anywhere else either and it's a common enough trope that there should probably be space for it somewhere.
Also, you may want to add augments to some of the transmutation spells to make them last longer. It's really the only school where long duration effects make much sense.It pretty much fits, thank you! And that augment is a great idea! :smallcool:

Knaight
2012-04-09, 11:25 AM
I'm actually a little confused at what you mean. Would you mind reiterating? :smallsmile:
It was a bit scattered. Reduced to a manageable form:
1) The name Illusion could be replaced by Enchantment as you suggested prior, particularly if something else handles magic items.
2) Evocation damage is really high, to the point of common instant kills. Reducing it some would probably be a good idea.
3) Energy resistance could be applied on a per die basis. This makes it scale better.
4) The spell Energy Resistance could give 1 + 1/mp energy resistance, applied to each incoming die individually. This can give immunity to d6 attacks at level 5, d8 at level 7, d10 at level 9, and d12 never. This also sets up d12 energy attacks as resistance piercing attacks.

Lappy9001
2012-04-10, 01:58 PM
It was a bit scattered. Reduced to a manageable form:
1) The name Illusion could be replaced by Enchantment as you suggested prior, particularly if something else handles magic items.
2) Evocation damage is really high, to the point of common instant kills. Reducing it some would probably be a good idea.
3) Energy resistance could be applied on a per die basis. This makes it scale better.
4) The spell Energy Resistance could give 1 + 1/mp energy resistance, applied to each incoming die individually. This can give immunity to d6 attacks at level 5, d8 at level 7, d10 at level 9, and d12 never. This also sets up d12 energy attacks as resistance piercing attacks.The system doesn't generally scale that way, but I fixed evocation a bit. Thanks for the clarification :smallsmile:

Things:

Updated Safeguard and Arcane Implement so they don't stack with one another.
Aegis and Gambit basically do the same thing, so I've updated it a bit with Gambit basically granting evasion.
Replaced the Crushing property (ignore 5% of armor) with "adds one and a half times Strength to damage."
Cleaned up Transmutation a bit, adding in Dispel (Thanks Saidoro!)
Evocation spells allow Physical Resist saves for half damage.
Clarified some of the Restoration spells
Recompose now has an interesting strategy where you can target an opponent's weapon, effectively negating the maneuvers attached to it, or alter your own to gain additional maneuvers.
Table of Contents updated!

Lappy9001
2012-04-12, 02:48 PM
Put up a section detailing what the system is all about for those who only wish to skim the basic rules
(ha-cha!)How it Works
Races allow you to customize 1st level bonuses to your liking, and while you can easily conform to fantasy archetypes, you can just as easily break them.

There are 3 main types of abilities, skill Perks (cool abilities tied to skills), magic Spells (abilities tied to a Mana Point pool), and weapon Maneuvers (fighting techniques tied to types of weapons/armor). Each helps you benefit your character (Perks give +2 to skills, Spells grant 1d4+1 MP, and Maneuvers give a +1 bonus to Attack/Damage).

Classes come in 3 flavors: Mage, Rogue, Warrior. However, each is basically just a chassis to keep things from getting too out of hand; Mages get more magic Spells, Rogue's get more skill Perks, and Warriors get more weapon Maneuvers. Each can pick abilities from the other two, but they simply get more of their own. You don't even need it listed on a table. Your character simply progresses as you gain abilities.

Minimal 'hidden' abilities in that you everything you can do is written on your sheet. Prevents things like grapple, attack of opportunity, etc. from being forgotten.

Simple as that!
As well as the first of the Exotic Heritage part of the variant rules. This section is great for PC's who want to be a bit more unique, be it the blood of an angel/demon or the blessing of an elemental.

Knaight
2012-04-12, 05:20 PM
Now that it is updated, I'm coming back to an earlier point about terminology - the term Attribute Modifier is unnecessary, and can just be Attribute. The only reason D&D needs both is the weird 10 centric +0 base scale, which you don't have.

Lappy9001
2012-04-12, 05:54 PM
Now that it is updated, I'm coming back to an earlier point about terminology - the term Attribute Modifier is unnecessary, and can just be Attribute. The only reason D&D needs both is the weird 10 centric +0 base scale, which you don't have.Yeah yeah, I keep meaning to go back to that. Thanks for the reminder; fixing in progress.

Edit: Done! :smallcool:

Amechra
2012-04-12, 08:35 PM
You need to list all of what the Monstrous Traits do; I have no way of knowing what being Undead does, for example.

Also, you might want to specify that Criticals deal double damage; as written, it sounds like there is a separate value called critical damage that you need to go look for.

Knaight
2012-04-12, 10:34 PM
One question: What is the interaction between augmentation for Alchemy and the excess cost for non-preferred schools?

EDIT: Regarding the system: There's currently a pretty major gap - mounts. As long as everyone stays on foot, everything seems fine, but what happens when people mount up? How do mounts operate in combat? What are the skills connected to riding? How does it all work?

If you don't have any ideas, I have a few options that could work, though they'll need tweaking.

Option 1
First, change from ten skills to twelve, adding an Animal skill and slightly reducing what Nature handles. I'm not sure what the twelfth skill would be, but having 11 just seems wrong. Adjust the skills per class upward to adjust for this, where it goes from 2, 4, 6 to (3, 5, 7), (3, 5, 8), or (3, 6, 9).

Then, add the Animal Skill. That opens up the following perks, which likely need to be simplified and/or rebalanced.

Companion: Taking Companion once allows any of these companions, of which one is picked [list of non combat companions, e.g. ravens, cats, etc.]. Taking it twice grants any of these [list of smaller combat companions, e.g large hawk, wolf, etc.]. Taking it thrice grants any of these [list of larger combat companions, maybe including some magical beings].

Ride: Taking ride once allows the effective riding of horses in combat. Taking it twice allows more exotic land animals, such as lizards, and taking it thrice allows flying mounts.

Something Else: I don't even know. Maybe poison handling?

Option 2
The other way to handle this is to wrap the most riding into Nature, and use maneuvers instead. Add a category for fighting with animals, which would involve maneuvers along these lines.

Mount Sturdiness - Any mounts used gain one level per two levels while being ridden, up to a maximum level of six.

Companion - Gain an animal companion (e.g. Wolf, Great Hawk) that fights with you.

Ride By - The character may move, attack, then move again while on a mount, using the mount's speed.

Mount Training - The character may ride unusual mounts, such as lizards, serpents, and large birds.

Horse Archer - The character may take advantage of their mounts speed. If they move towards their target and fire within 30 feet, that counts as a ranged charge.


Option 3
Add the Mounted state. It does certain things, and type of maneuver gains one more maneuver that includes mounted combat. These may include countering the mounted state, such as the potential for shooting someone off their mount with a ranged weapon. This probably wouldn't include much in the way of stats for mounts, and doesn't encompass animal companions at all.

Lappy9001
2012-04-14, 10:06 PM
You need to list all of what the Monstrous Traits do; I have no way of knowing what being Undead does, for example.I thought it would be assumed that I would add that into the Monster section :smalltongue:


Also, you might want to specify that Criticals deal double damage; as written, it sounds like there is a separate value called critical damage that you need to go look for.Done! Thank you :smallcool:


One question: What is the interaction between augmentation for Alchemy and the excess cost for non-preferred schools?Double augmentation, as normal. I'll clarify, thank you.


EDIT: Regarding the system: There's currently a pretty major gap - mounts. As long as everyone stays on foot, everything seems fine, but what happens when people mount up? How do mounts operate in combat? What are the skills connected to riding? How does it all work?

If you don't have any ideas, I have a few options that could work, though they'll need tweaking.

Option 1
First, change from ten skills to twelve, adding an Animal skill and slightly reducing what Nature handles. I'm not sure what the twelfth skill would be, but having 11 just seems wrong. Adjust the skills per class upward to adjust for this, where it goes from 2, 4, 6 to (3, 5, 7), (3, 5, 8), or (3, 6, 9).

Then, add the Animal Skill. That opens up the following perks, which likely need to be simplified and/or rebalanced.

Companion: Taking Companion once allows any of these companions, of which one is picked [list of non combat companions, e.g. ravens, cats, etc.]. Taking it twice grants any of these [list of smaller combat companions, e.g large hawk, wolf, etc.]. Taking it thrice grants any of these [list of larger combat companions, maybe including some magical beings].

Ride: Taking ride once allows the effective riding of horses in combat. Taking it twice allows more exotic land animals, such as lizards, and taking it thrice allows flying mounts.

Something Else: I don't even know. Maybe poison handling?

Option 2
The other way to handle this is to wrap the most riding into Nature, and use maneuvers instead. Add a category for fighting with animals, which would involve maneuvers along these lines.

Mount Sturdiness - Any mounts used gain one level per two levels while being ridden, up to a maximum level of six.

Companion - Gain an animal companion (e.g. Wolf, Great Hawk) that fights with you.

Ride By - The character may move, attack, then move again while on a mount, using the mount's speed.

Mount Training - The character may ride unusual mounts, such as lizards, serpents, and large birds.

Horse Archer - The character may take advantage of their mounts speed. If they move towards their target and fire within 30 feet, that counts as a ranged charge.


Option 3
Add the Mounted state. It does certain things, and type of maneuver gains one more maneuver that includes mounted combat. These may include countering the mounted state, such as the potential for shooting someone off their mount with a ranged weapon. This probably wouldn't include much in the way of stats for mounts, and doesn't encompass animal companions at all.
I love the idea of a Mounted status, that's really smart thinking.

I actually prided myself on having made the system with a total of 100 abilities (30 Maneuvers, 30 Perks, 30 Spells, and 10 Monstrous Traits), so I might want to work it in there, or just disregard it, as long as I don't give too many things (that's what the 100 was meant to do; keep things from getting too crazy).

So yeah, great idea, I'll see what I can do; probably Option 3.

Edit: Gonna the Maneuvers into 10, with 3 in each :smallcool:

FlamingKobold
2012-04-15, 01:28 AM
It's getting to be late enough here that I don't have time to really critique much, but I do want to say that I really love what you've done with this system and I'm considering GMing a PbP for it soon. (The only constraint is that my RL is rather busy at the moment). But this is a great system, nice job!

Lappy9001
2012-04-15, 02:50 AM
It's getting to be late enough here that I don't have time to really critique much, but I do want to say that I really love what you've done with this system and I'm considering GMing a PbP for it soon. (The only constraint is that my RL is rather busy at the moment). But this is a great system, nice job!The greatest honor you can bring to a homebrewer! I thank you :smallcool:

Fighting Styles! There's 10 of them (8 now...won't have time before the server backs itself up).

Monster rules should be up sometime soon. Apologies for sporadic updates, this is a side project to keep me sane while I finish my thesis :smalltongue:

Craft (Cheese)
2012-04-15, 08:54 AM
I have one concern: It seems like you've pretty much done away with classes with the ability system, with everyone able to pick any ability they want at each level. Why do you still have the three classes?

bobthe6th
2012-04-15, 09:16 AM
point buy chassis get really overly complicated. classes at least allow chassis without argument over balanced chassis v.s powers gained.

Craft (Cheese)
2012-04-15, 09:44 AM
point buy chassis get really overly complicated. classes at least allow chassis without argument over balanced chassis v.s powers gained.

Doesn't have to be. You could implement it as "get three bonuses at 1st level" and rework the (now) class-exclusive features (like mages getting two favored schools) as obtainable bonuses. I'm just curious why (what's left of) classes was kept instead of being removed entirely.

Lappy9001
2012-04-15, 11:32 AM
I have one concern: It seems like you've pretty much done away with classes with the ability system, with everyone able to pick any ability they want at each level. Why do you still have the three classes?


point buy chassis get really overly complicated. classes at least allow chassis without argument over balanced chassis v.s powers gained.


Doesn't have to be. You could implement it as "get three bonuses at 1st level" and rework the (now) class-exclusive features (like mages getting two favored schools) as obtainable bonuses. I'm just curious why (what's left of) classes was kept instead of being removed entirely.The problem is that people have a habit of spreading themselves too thin when they have any ability at their disposal. Each class allows players to still fit into a particular niche, but without forcing it. Most of the abilities are actually designed to encourage particular builds. There are no forced class skills, but it's a pretty optimal idea for a Warrior to take Endurance and Profession as trained skills, just as Knowledge, Healing, and Perception is a great choice for mages. The fact that Profession benefits each class (Artificer: Mages, Blacksmith: Warriors, Performer: Rogues) hearkens back to 3.5 when everybody had a Profession skill. However, nothing against a Warrior who wants to take Knowledge, Mechanics, Speech, and Stealth 'cause they can if they wanna.

I do plan to implement a point buy system into Variant Rules if I can get it to not be complicated, but I also plan to keep 3 classes within the core system. If you have some ideas for that, I'd love to hear 'em :smallsmile:

So yeah tl;dr

Classes make it easier to stay focused
Classic builds are encouraged through the rules, but you can play whatever
I really like the 3 class system

Craft (Cheese)
2012-04-15, 11:57 AM
The problem is that people have a habit of spreading themselves too thin when they have any ability at their disposal. Each class allows players to still fit into a particular niche, but without forcing it. Most of the abilities are actually designed to encourage particular builds. There are no forced class skills, but it's a pretty optimal idea for a Warrior to take Endurance and Profession as trained skills, just as Knowledge, Healing, and Perception is a great choice for mages. The fact that Profession benefits each class (Artificer: Mages, Blacksmith: Warriors, Performer: Rogues) hearkens back to 3.5 when everybody had a Profession skill. However, nothing against a Warrior who wants to take Knowledge, Mechanics, Speech, and Stealth 'cause they can if they wanna.

...

So yeah tl;dr

Classes make it easier to stay focused
Classic builds are encouraged through the rules, but you can play whatever
I really like the 3 class system


A perfectly fine set of reasons.


I do plan to implement a point buy system into Variant Rules if I can get it to not be complicated, but I also plan to keep 3 classes within the core system. If you have some ideas for that, I'd love to hear 'em :smallsmile:

For attributes, have a cumulative cost system: It costs 2 points to raise a score from +1 to +2, 3 points to raise that to +3, so upping a score from +0 to +3 costs 6 points. You can gain 1 point for lowering a score -1, or three points for lowering a score -2, but I wouldn't allow scores to be dumped any lower than -2 without careful DM discretion. An upper cap on how high scores can be bought up is optional: Maybe +4 or +5?

15 points being standard sounds good, with the DM possibly allowing more points if he wants a higher-power campaign. Assuming no upper cap, this leaves the highest possible score a character can get before racial bonuses as +7, assuming they dump everything else as much as possible (with the -2 lower limit, of course.)


As for a non-core class, my key idea is easily expressed as the Freelancer (better name?): They get no class features at 1st level, but instead get additional bonuses, along with freelancer-only bonuses that amount to the features obtained by other classes. The ideal setup would be that a freelancer can take any combination (including none) of class features provided by the core 3 classes, potentially getting some features at a level later than 1 (if they decide to "multiclass"), so the DM can declare an all-freelancer campaign with no trouble.

eftexar
2012-04-15, 06:50 PM
I still really like where this is going and how you've done the spells. The races are slightly boring though, as the human can replicate everyone else's capabilities. You don't need anything too complicated, but should have something to set them apart (maybe simple stuff like a +10ft to the elf or even a 2 DR for the dwarf).

Lappy9001
2012-04-15, 08:46 PM
I still really like where this is going and how you've done the spells. The races are slightly boring though, as the human can replicate everyone else's capabilities. You don't need anything too complicated, but should have something to set them apart (maybe simple stuff like a +10ft to the elf or even a 2 DR for the dwarf).Thank you :smallcool:

I really should clarify, as it has confused a few people. There essentially aren't any races, "human" replicates everything 'cause they're just the sample race. Dwarves, Elves, Halflings, and Orcs are just some races you could create under the system, and they by no means need to conform to those rules.

Basically, you give yourself the stats you want (Like Elf +1 Strength, +1 Constitution), then call yourself whatever race you wanna be, and assign appropriate fluff.

Lappy9001
2012-04-17, 10:41 PM
So I'm really not happy with how Spells turned out, so I'm gonna open this up to anyone who wants to put in an idea. I'm trying to make things so that there are 30 Spells, preferably divided into 5 or 10 Schools.

I'm just kind of in a rut of how I'm going to get things to work out, so any help is greatly appreciated! :smallcool:

eftexar
2012-04-17, 10:47 PM
I personally like the spells how they are, but what are your problems with them? If you don't tell us anything we might just reproduce the same problems.

Lappy9001
2012-04-17, 10:59 PM
I personally like the spells how they are, but what are your problems with them? If you don't tell us anything we might just reproduce the same problems.Well thank you! I like how Apportation turned out, but the rest seem to be somewhat repetitive within themselves. I do think I'll incorporate a bit of polymorph into Transmutation, and maybe some summoning somewhere. Basically, I think the spells within schools sorta mesh together.

Amechra
2012-04-18, 01:59 AM
Fold Alteration into Restoration, and add Fleshcraft:

Fleshcraft
Duration: 1 Minute Range: 5 ft
This spell allows you to duplicate the effects of a small list of Perks and Maneuvers; select 3 of the following when you first learn this spell.
Acrobat, Conditioning, Regeneration, Haul, Endure Elements, Arcane Sight, Unhindered, Berserk, Passive Stance, Pugilist, +1 to Strength or Dexterity or Constitution.
Upon casting this spell, the target creature gains the benefit of one of the above abilities off your list.
This spell lasts one Minute longer for each point of Mana past the first that you use to cast this spell.

Just add some Monster Traits, and this works for a passable Polymorph spell.

And if you make a summoning spell, it should fall under Evocation (by the way, fold those damaging abilities into each-other; I would suggest combining Resist Energy and Cloak of Energy, but only allowing one version of the ability to affect a creature at once.)

Lappy9001
2012-04-18, 06:20 PM
Fold Alteration into Restoration, and add Fleshcraft:

Fleshcraft
Duration: 1 Minute Range: 5 ft
This spell allows you to duplicate the effects of a small list of Perks and Maneuvers; select 3 of the following when you first learn this spell.
Acrobat, Conditioning, Regeneration, Haul, Endure Elements, Arcane Sight, Unhindered, Berserk, Passive Stance, Pugilist, +1 to Strength or Dexterity or Constitution.
Upon casting this spell, the target creature gains the benefit of one of the above abilities off your list.
This spell lasts one Minute longer for each point of Mana past the first that you use to cast this spell.

Just add some Monster Traits, and this works for a passable Polymorph spell.

And if you make a summoning spell, it should fall under Evocation (by the way, fold those damaging abilities into each-other; I would suggest combining Resist Energy and Cloak of Energy, but only allowing one version of the ability to affect a creature at once.)That was so totally what I was looking for in a polymorph spell :smallcool:

Thanks bro!

Lappy9001
2012-04-21, 04:47 PM
Okay, did a ton of stealth edits over the past few days. Highlights include:

Rounding now states that you can always take the average of a dice roll when levelling up.
Added rules for stacking. Same bonuses do not stack with themselves, but stack with all others.
Added Status conditions.
Added Difficulty, the number opposed Resistance rolls are made against.
Clarified Mental and Physical Attributes.
Changed all the Maneuvers/Perks/Spells that classes get to a flat 12. Might change this one.
Added Parkour Perk to Athletics.
Altered Blacksmith Perk to benefit primarily to Warriors.
Added Emissary Perk to Speech.
Finally added in Mounted fighting style.
Added Teleport spell to Apportation, combined Levitate into Inertia.
Folded Pulse into Energy Blast, added Energy Barrier and Summon Elemental. Removed Cloak of Energy 'cause Energy Barrier can pretty much do the same thing, albeit to a lesser extent.
Altered Confusion.
Removed Fear and added Heroism Spell.
Huge changes to Transmutation. Probably more to come.
Added in Monstrous Traits, building Monsters section soon to come.
Fixed plenty of typos and grammatical errors.

Thanks everyone for your help! I couldn't have done all this without ya :smallcool:

I greatly appreciate anyone who wishes to thumb through the changes further!

Knaight
2012-04-23, 12:49 AM
I appear to be addicted to this whole "criticism" thing. As such:

The list of rolls in post 2 should note that they are against a difficulty.
The word "Stacking" at the bottom of post 2 needs to be bold.
Choosing to take average for attributes or rolling is not sufficient. If there is a nonrandom system, it needs to be better.
The death rules are problematic. As of now, everyone from -5 to 2 constitution dies at -10, with a jump to 15, then 20, then 25 for 3, 4, and 5 constitution. How about - [20+(2*Constitution)], which creates a range from -10 to -30.
This is minor, but the shade of yellow chosen for the word "Constitution" is eye-bleeding bad.
Attribute rolls are still less than ideal. (1d10-1d10)/2 is preferable to (4d6-10)/2, as it is at least somewhat simpler.
The sample race doesn't actually note that it is the template with which races are built. Change that.
Regarding classes, your current system of deterministic leveling is outright worse than random, as it gets N/2 on a dN, instead of an average (N+1)/2. This isn't necessarily a problem, but you should be aware of it.
The "Stagger" condition is poorly worded. Change it to "You can take no Minor actions. When first staggered, you are pushed back 5 feet into the nearest unoccupied space." to keep the original meaning but make sense.
Said original meaning doesn't illustrate what happens when completely surrounded. Fix that.
A little more standardization in maneuvers/perks/spells gained would be nice. As of now, the Mage starts with 3 spells and gains 1 per level. The Rogue and Warrior start with 2 Perk/Maneuvers, and gain 1 per level, except for 2 on level five. If they switch to the Mage method, the system gets more elegant.
Skills don't actually scale at all by level. I'd recommend changing that - as is, an attribute that starts at +5, is boosted to +10, with a skill that has two perks is only rolling +16. That makes the top two difficulties impossible to hit. Add in +level to skill rolls, and the max becomes +26, which still only reaches heroic on a 14+ and doesn't currently reach Near Impossible.
Given that, dropping Near Impossible to 45 creates a situation where those that train the skill to the max have a 10% chance of pulling it off. That would be near impossible, better fits the rest of the skills, and generally works better.
Resilience has some...interesting implications with a base d10. Either cap it at d12, or institute d12+d4, d12+d6. That still has a jump if invested in for Warriors, but that is fine. d10, d12, d20 really isn't.
Halving skill difficulties is still a bad idea, given the system's largely linear scaling so far. Parkour and Shadow Leap thus need to be fixed.
Resilient currently loses utility as levels increase. If the +5 hp changes to +level Hp, gained once, that goes away. Or does it retroactively affect earlier levels?
Vigilance uses the term "flanked", which is not a game term in Classy d20.
Blacksmith isn't the best name for its effect.
The wording regarding Base Attack is inelegant. Rewording it to "You have Base Attack equal to the number of maneuvers you own. Base Attack is added to attack and damage" cleans it up a bit.
The Lancer maneuvers rely on charge. Charge isn't a game term, and charging mechanics don't actually exist. The closest is a mention of the attack bonus on an attack after moving for Warriors.
Two of the mounted maneuvers have the same issue. My bad. Also, the wording isn't up to the rest of the maneuvers. Also my bad.
The Weaken effect in Cripple contradicts the Weaken condition.
Impede only works at the adjacent space, which means there are odd interactions with Reach. They may well be positive.
Dodge requires excessive rolling. How about this: You can force one attacker to reroll their attack per turn.
The sentence fragment "while heavy armor weighs between 50 pounds" has problems. It either needs to lose or gain a word.
Dimension Swap should state that "Targets may" instead of "Enemies must". As of now, an enemy who thought that they were actually getting a good deal still resist, and it isn't immediately apparent that allies can choose to resist.
Blink should allow augmenting: +1mp = +5 percent avoidance. Also, it is really powerful with automatic duration scaling - a high level character can basically spend an action to negate 1/4 of the incoming attacks. As such, duration should also require spending MP. Think about it this way - it automatically scales because of enemy attacks automatically getting better.
Inertia warrants an "increase gravity" option to increase falling damage and decrease carrying capacity.
Resurrection doesn't need "0 plus" in it's description, as it restores to X HP instead of restores X HP.
Technically speaking, the wording of Resurrection allows it to affect living creatures who died recently. That means it could knock a creature who died recently but is at full health down to 10% HP. There are other interpretations, but this is a muddily worded exploit that is just asking for flame wars.
Dispel is guaranteed to work on anything but a creature. Sophisticated wards intended to keep people out, but technically unattended? Gone.
What gp actually is is never actually discussed in the rules. General costs are also absent.
Size Augmenting upwards is actually a pretty big disadvantage most of the time. If it bumps up both strength and HD, it might be better.
Almost all the abilities that note that they give spells don't note augmentation level. Be aware of that.
There is currently very little on magical items and persistent magical effects. Adding an optional section that goes a bit more into these in detail would be nice.
The same applies to mundane items that are not weapons or armor.


As for dual wielding and flurry: Here are the numbers for typical damage.

Normal: (Damage)(Chance To Hit)
Dual Wielding: 2*(Damage)(CTH-.1)
Dual Wielding + Flurry: 3*(Damage)(CTH-.2)

Normal vs Dual Wielding: Dual Wielding is better unless the chance to hit is below 20%. If you change it, Dual Wielding is better unless the chance to hit is (10*Penalty)% or lower.

Normal vs Dual Wielding + Flurry: Dual Wielding + Flurry is better unless the chance to hit is below 30%. If you change it, Dual Wielding + Flurry is better unless the chance to hit is (15*Penalty)% or lower.

Dual Wielding vs Dual Wielding + Flurry: Dual Wielding + Flurry is better unless the chance to hit is below 40%. If you change it and retain the same penalty for both, Dual Wielding + Flurry is better unless the chance is (20*Penalty)%.

These numbers might well need to be played with.

I'd also recommend making a Combat Options page, which details general options. There's general Charging, Flanking, etc. I would also add general Dual Wielding, general Flurry (at much higher penalty), etc. It makes things a bit more complicated, but it isn't too much and adds a fair bit.

As always, I continue to love the system more and more with each update.

Saidoro
2012-04-23, 09:37 AM
Resistance is weird. As it is it's you have a 50% chance to resist a spell at first level assuming equal ability modifiers and then that just goes down from there. is the point to force people to take the + resistance perks? Wouldn't it be better to just ditch the perks and have it scale naturally?
Summon elemental should probably have its power scale to the power points spent rather than the caster's level. On a related note: you should probably specify how the elemental's modifiers are generated. Maybe make a list of modifiers and let the player assign which goes to which score.
Also, the exotic backgrounds should grant their ability in the place of one of the character's first level abilities. As it is people can gain something for nothing by just putting that their great-grandpa was a troll in their backstory.
I disagree with Knaight about ability score generation. The system he proposes is simple but it is also significantly more random. I'd really rather not make character creation more luck-based than it already is.

Knaight
2012-04-24, 06:38 PM
How do you feel about homebrew in your system? I had an idea for semi-magical items that I've been considering playing around with, and this is one of the systems that I think it could work in.

Lappy9001
2012-04-24, 11:12 PM
I appear to be addicted to this whole "criticism" thing. As such:

The list of rolls in post 2 should note that they are against a difficulty.
The word "Stacking" at the bottom of post 2 needs to be bold.
Choosing to take average for attributes or rolling is not sufficient. If there is a nonrandom system, it needs to be better.
The death rules are problematic. As of now, everyone from -5 to 2 constitution dies at -10, with a jump to 15, then 20, then 25 for 3, 4, and 5 constitution. How about - [20+(2*Constitution)], which creates a range from -10 to -30.
This is minor, but the shade of yellow chosen for the word "Constitution" is eye-bleeding bad.
Attribute rolls are still less than ideal. (1d10-1d10)/2 is preferable to (4d6-10)/2, as it is at least somewhat simpler.
The sample race doesn't actually note that it is the template with which races are built. Change that.
Regarding classes, your current system of deterministic leveling is outright worse than random, as it gets N/2 on a dN, instead of an average (N+1)/2. This isn't necessarily a problem, but you should be aware of it.
The "Stagger" condition is poorly worded. Change it to "You can take no Minor actions. When first staggered, you are pushed back 5 feet into the nearest unoccupied space." to keep the original meaning but make sense.
Said original meaning doesn't illustrate what happens when completely surrounded. Fix that.
A little more standardization in maneuvers/perks/spells gained would be nice. As of now, the Mage starts with 3 spells and gains 1 per level. The Rogue and Warrior start with 2 Perk/Maneuvers, and gain 1 per level, except for 2 on level five. If they switch to the Mage method, the system gets more elegant.
Skills don't actually scale at all by level. I'd recommend changing that - as is, an attribute that starts at +5, is boosted to +10, with a skill that has two perks is only rolling +16. That makes the top two difficulties impossible to hit. Add in +level to skill rolls, and the max becomes +26, which still only reaches heroic on a 14+ and doesn't currently reach Near Impossible.
Given that, dropping Near Impossible to 45 creates a situation where those that train the skill to the max have a 10% chance of pulling it off. That would be near impossible, better fits the rest of the skills, and generally works better.
Resilience has some...interesting implications with a base d10. Either cap it at d12, or institute d12+d4, d12+d6. That still has a jump if invested in for Warriors, but that is fine. d10, d12, d20 really isn't.
Halving skill difficulties is still a bad idea, given the system's largely linear scaling so far. Parkour and Shadow Leap thus need to be fixed.
Resilient currently loses utility as levels increase. If the +5 hp changes to +level Hp, gained once, that goes away. Or does it retroactively affect earlier levels?
Vigilance uses the term "flanked", which is not a game term in Classy d20.
Blacksmith isn't the best name for its effect.
The wording regarding Base Attack is inelegant. Rewording it to "You have Base Attack equal to the number of maneuvers you own. Base Attack is added to attack and damage" cleans it up a bit.
The Lancer maneuvers rely on charge. Charge isn't a game term, and charging mechanics don't actually exist. The closest is a mention of the attack bonus on an attack after moving for Warriors.
Two of the mounted maneuvers have the same issue. My bad. Also, the wording isn't up to the rest of the maneuvers. Also my bad.
The Weaken effect in Cripple contradicts the Weaken condition.
Impede only works at the adjacent space, which means there are odd interactions with Reach. They may well be positive.
Dodge requires excessive rolling. How about this: You can force one attacker to reroll their attack per turn.
The sentence fragment "while heavy armor weighs between 50 pounds" has problems. It either needs to lose or gain a word.
Dimension Swap should state that "Targets may" instead of "Enemies must". As of now, an enemy who thought that they were actually getting a good deal still resist, and it isn't immediately apparent that allies can choose to resist.
Blink should allow augmenting: +1mp = +5 percent avoidance. Also, it is really powerful with automatic duration scaling - a high level character can basically spend an action to negate 1/4 of the incoming attacks. As such, duration should also require spending MP. Think about it this way - it automatically scales because of enemy attacks automatically getting better.
Inertia warrants an "increase gravity" option to increase falling damage and decrease carrying capacity.
Resurrection doesn't need "0 plus" in it's description, as it restores to X HP instead of restores X HP.
Technically speaking, the wording of Resurrection allows it to affect living creatures who died recently. That means it could knock a creature who died recently but is at full health down to 10% HP. There are other interpretations, but this is a muddily worded exploit that is just asking for flame wars.
Dispel is guaranteed to work on anything but a creature. Sophisticated wards intended to keep people out, but technically unattended? Gone.
What gp actually is is never actually discussed in the rules. General costs are also absent.
Size Augmenting upwards is actually a pretty big disadvantage most of the time. If it bumps up both strength and HD, it might be better.
Almost all the abilities that note that they give spells don't note augmentation level. Be aware of that.
There is currently very little on magical items and persistent magical effects. Adding an optional section that goes a bit more into these in detail would be nice.
The same applies to mundane items that are not weapons or armor.


As for dual wielding and flurry: Here are the numbers for typical damage.

Normal: (Damage)(Chance To Hit)
Dual Wielding: 2*(Damage)(CTH-.1)
Dual Wielding + Flurry: 3*(Damage)(CTH-.2)

Normal vs Dual Wielding: Dual Wielding is better unless the chance to hit is below 20%. If you change it, Dual Wielding is better unless the chance to hit is (10*Penalty)% or lower.

Normal vs Dual Wielding + Flurry: Dual Wielding + Flurry is better unless the chance to hit is below 30%. If you change it, Dual Wielding + Flurry is better unless the chance to hit is (15*Penalty)% or lower.

Dual Wielding vs Dual Wielding + Flurry: Dual Wielding + Flurry is better unless the chance to hit is below 40%. If you change it and retain the same penalty for both, Dual Wielding + Flurry is better unless the chance is (20*Penalty)%.

These numbers might well need to be played with.

I'd also recommend making a Combat Options page, which details general options. There's general Charging, Flanking, etc. I would also add general Dual Wielding, general Flurry (at much higher penalty), etc. It makes things a bit more complicated, but it isn't too much and adds a fair bit.

As always, I continue to love the system more and more with each update.Dude, thanks for all that work, that's the harder step of system design. I really, sincerely, appreciate it :smallcool:

Most of the response is "Cool, I'll fix that."

But sorry for the Yellow, it looks better in the .pdf :smalltongue:

Also Resilient is supposed to only advance HD once, and allows for the +5 up to two more times.

Skills also level with you, albeit slowly. I'm gonna overhaul that dang Race section. And get to work on the rest of the changes.

Edit: Also, I have no idea what this meant:

Regarding classes, your current system of deterministic leveling is outright worse than random, as it gets N/2 on a dN, instead of an average (N+1)/2. This isn't necessarily a problem, but you should be aware of it.


Resistance is weird. As it is it's you have a 50% chance to resist a spell at first level assuming equal ability modifiers and then that just goes down from there. is the point to force people to take the + resistance perks? Wouldn't it be better to just ditch the perks and have it scale naturally?It technically scales with level. You get +2 to Physical or Mental from your race, and a +1 bonus every level, to be assigned by you. The many Attribute Boosts also help this.

Again, I'm gonna fix the Races section.


Summon elemental should probably have its power scale to the power points spent rather than the caster's level. On a related note: you should probably specify how the elemental's modifiers are generated. Maybe make a list of modifiers and let the player assign which goes to which score.Oh, absolutely. Overlooked that one, thank you.

Also, the exotic backgrounds should grant their ability in the place of one of the character's first level abilities. As it is people can gain something for nothing by just putting that their great-grandpa was a troll in their backstory.Good plan!

I disagree with Knaight about ability score generation. The system he proposes is simple but it is also significantly more random. I'd really rather not make character creation more luck-based than it already is.I'm gonna add in Point Buy and a Pre-generated set, 'cause that's what the people seem to want :smallcool:


How do you feel about homebrew in your system? I had an idea for semi-magical items that I've been considering playing around with, and this is one of the systems that I think it could work in.Please do! My current philosophy is that the default magic items are only those that can be crafted by a character. Anything else is an artifact, or lesser artifact.

I could certainly use more ideas, though, so go right ahead!

eftexar
2012-04-25, 12:19 AM
I approve of the new spells, but have a few reservations.

Because of how the elemental barrier spells is worded it could technically stack for infinity. You might mention that only so many clouds can be stacked or that only clouds from a single casting stack.
I have no problem with you combining illusions and non-illusion mind-affects into one school, but I don't think you can call it the school of illusion anymore.
Shapechange is cool, but not awesome yet. What about having it grant a single monstrous trait or simply adding a temporary Exotic Background?


Besides that hmm...

Instead of having the classes simply pick up perks and then saying, "When a character selects a Perk in a Skill (see below), they can instead choose to make the skill trained," why not just allow them to train in a skill as part of their class ability in place of a perk.

Amechra
2012-04-25, 12:54 AM
So I take it that "Charging" is that maneuver where the Warrior moves 10' to receive a +2 to Hit and Damage?

Because it would be nice to make that explicit; maybe alter "On a Charge" to read "Whenever they move at least 10' before attacking"?

And change Flanked in Vigilance to "A Warrior does not receive a bonus to attack rolls when he is on the opposite side of an ally from you", only with much cleaner wording.

And he meant the average number of HP you would get from leveling.

Knaight
2012-04-25, 01:25 AM
Edit: Also, I have no idea what this meant:


If you choose not to roll for HP and MP increases, you lose .5 on average. The rest of that is just the math behind it.

As for the magical items - what I'm working about is easily artifact grade, and can easily be changed into 36 unique artifacts*, instead of 36 item properties. Some rules may need to be dropped, and general simplification warranted if that is the case, but that is easy.

*21 of these are actually done by first draft standards, as are underlying rules, so this should be seen soon enough.

Lappy9001
2012-04-25, 01:23 PM
So I take it that "Charging" is that maneuver where the Warrior moves 10' to receive a +2 to Hit and Damage?

Because it would be nice to make that explicit; maybe alter "On a Charge" to read "Whenever they move at least 10' before attacking"?

And change Flanked in Vigilance to "A Warrior does not receive a bonus to attack rolls when he is on the opposite side of an ally from you", only with much cleaner wording.

And he meant the average number of HP you would get from leveling.Cool, I'm gonna fix those too, thank you!


If you choose not to roll for HP and MP increases, you lose .5 on average. The rest of that is just the math behind it.That actually exists on a suggestion from a friend who wanted taking an average roll to be a possibility. It might just need to be made better, so thank you for bringing it to my attention!


As for the magical items - what I'm working about is easily artifact grade, and can easily be changed into 36 unique artifacts, instead of 36 item properties.Sounds great, thank you.

Also, I've made a few characters while working on the Character Sheet, and everything is turning out pretty well. However, I think I'm gonna allow everyone to grab an ability outside of their primary at 1st level. This does mean that rogues need a new ability at 1st level. Totally up for suggestions on that :smalltongue:

Lappy9001
2012-04-27, 02:38 AM
Okay, I think I've got just about everything on Knaight's awesome list that I can manage at the moment, with the notable exception of prices and skill/resistance scaling.

Prices will be added in the Equipment section, which I'll admit I completely forgot about, and scaling will come up in Levelling Up under Classes. Those and Monster Building are coming up sometime soon...as well as any typos/errors I manage to find.

Thanks again to everybody, and if you see something you like, or want something put in, please, speak up! :smallbiggrin:

Edit: Oh, and there will also be a bunch of links to common terms and things...I'm almost at a point where that's possible.

Amechra
2012-04-27, 02:52 AM
May I suggest that their first level ability be the ability to take Perks one additional time? Or would that be too unbalancing?

Maybe allow them a little "pocket change"; in other words, they always have a little something in their pockets, like a dagger if you are captured and "relieved" of your weapons, or maybe a handkerchief if you need one...

Hell, maybe give them the ability to reroll one d20 roll 1/[Arbitrary Length of Time], or the ability to take 10 on all skill checks?

Lappy9001
2012-04-27, 02:58 AM
May I suggest that their first level ability be the ability to take Perks one additional time? Or would that be too unbalancing?

Maybe allow them a little "pocket change"; in other words, they always have a little something in their pockets, like a dagger if you are captured and "relieved" of your weapons, or maybe a handkerchief if you need one...

Hell, maybe give them the ability to reroll one d20 roll 1/[Arbitrary Length of Time], or the ability to take 10 on all skill checks?I've actually been meaning to replace Well-Prepared from Nature with an Animal Companion sort of thing. It would fit much better with rogues :smallsmile:

Taking 10 is a good idea too, since it's not implemented anywhere else

Knaight
2012-04-27, 04:41 AM
Okay, I think I've got just about everything on Knaight's awesome list that I can manage at the moment, with the notable exception of prices and skill/resistance scaling.

It's looking pretty good. I'm noticing a few formatting errors that I missed earlier - the armor and weapons section needs bold headers - but is generally solid. I'm probably done with criticism for a while*.

*Once the monsters come out though, I fully intend to be back.

Amechra
2012-04-29, 09:25 PM
I am supplying a link to something about Flying. Please, make it happen. (http://forum.faxcelestis.net/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=520)

Lappy9001
2012-04-30, 11:00 PM
I am supplying a link to something about Flying. Please, make it happen. (http://forum.faxcelestis.net/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=520)Could you paraphrase it or give me another link? I keep getting 500 Internal Service Errors.

Fax's stuff is superb, so I'll definitely look at it :smallsmile:

Saidoro
2012-05-01, 12:43 PM
The site appears to be down, here's (http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:hzf7YYn9L20J:forum.faxcelestis.net/viewtopic.php%3Ff%3D1%26t%3D520+&cd=2&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us)a cached copy.Google is your friend, they have copies of everything.

Knaight
2012-07-01, 10:03 PM
I notice there was just a major edit change as of 3 days ago, and a more minor one yesterday (which prevents my post being thread necromancy). Given that it wasn't a new post, this thread is still languishing several pages behind, and is now being pushed up so that the new edit might be noticed. Incidentally the fire beetle posted appears to be for a different system entirely, probably 4e, given the way it egregiously breaks the attribute rules the what the skills look like.

blackwind1kaze
2012-07-14, 02:37 AM
Fire Beetle
http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/dx0601iw_alchemybeetle.jpg

ABILITY SCORES
Str 13, Con 16, Dex 10, Int 8, Wis 16, Cha 18

AC: 23 Fort: 17 Reflex: 17 Will: 18
HP: 55 Surges: 13+1 Surge Value: 13

TRAINED SKILLS
Religion +6, Intimidate +13, Endurance +5, Insight +12, Perception +10

UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics -2, Arcana +1, Bluff +6, Diplomacy +6, Dungeoneering +5, Heal +5, History +1, Nature +5, Stealth -2, Streetwise +6, Thievery -2, Athletics -1

FEATS
Level 1: Weapon Focus (Heavy Blade)
Level 2: Bardic Dilettante
Level 4: Weapon Proficiency (Bastard sword)

POWERS
Lay on Hands: Ardent Vow
Paladin at-will 1: Ardent Strike
Paladin at-will 1: Virtuous Strike
Paladin encounter 1: Valorous Smite
Paladin daily 1: Majestic Halo
Paladin utility 2: Call of Challenge
Paladin encounter 3: Righteous Smite
Paladin daily 5: Glorious Charge

Sorry if i'm Necro-ing but...

*pulls out 4e MM book*

Fire Beetle

Ability Scores:
Str 18, Con 14, Dex 10, Int 1, Wis 12, Cha 8

AC: 19; Fort: 17; Ref: 13; Will: 14
HP: 62; Bloodied: 13

abilities/feats(?):
Initiative +2
Sense: Perception +3; Darkvision
languages: none

powers:
Bite (standard; at-will) - Reach 2; +10 Vs. AC; 1d10+4 DAM
Entangling Spittle (Standard; recharge on 4-6 on 1d6) - Ranged 5; +8 Vs. Ref; the target is immobilized (save ends {which i believe is a DC 10?})

Now why a Beetle would need to know Heavy Blade and Bastard sword is beyond me.



Resistance Rolls are used when an attack hits automatically (like most spells) or has a secondary effect. This allows your PC or shrug off poison or oppose a mental assault. Physical Resist rolls are used against bodily effects, and Mental Resist rolls are used against mind-affecting effects. These rolls are made against an opponent's Difficulty.

1d20 + Attribute + Miscellaneous Bonus

spelling error: it should be "This allows your PC 'to' shrug off poison..."


Generally, it's a good idea to benefit the whole party at once, but this may not always be the case. These guidelines are meant to be loose in implementation, so it's up to the GM's judgement how this XP is to be assigned.

Spelling error: judgement should be judgment


Artificer: You can enhance weapons or armor with supernatural abilities. You may enchant a weapon with the Bolster, Corrode, Elemental Weapon, or Keen spells. You may enchant an armor or shield with the Bolster or Resist Energy spells. Enchanting an item takes 1 hour, costs double MP to augment Spell effects, and 1,000 gp. You can enchant an item with an additional Spell each time you select this perk, costing an additional 1,000 gp.

This "You may enchant an armor or shield with the Bolster or Resist Energy spells." should probably turn into this "You may enchant a piece of armor or shield with the Bolster or Resist Energy spells."

"Weapons and Proficiency" could probably be "Weapons and Armor Proficiency"


Weapons are divided into three categories, each focused on a specific Maneuver. One-Handed Weapon use either a character's Dexterity or Strength for Attack rolls, Ranged weapons use just Dexterity, and Two-Handed weapons use only Strength.

this "Weapons are divided into three categories, each focused on a specific Maneuver." should either be A) "Weapons are divided into three categories each focused on a specific Maneuver." or B) "Weapons are divided into three categories; each focused on a specific Maneuver."

When might this be available in .PDF?

Lappy9001
2012-07-19, 02:37 PM
Oh my...I didn't expect anyone to come across this while I was working on stealth updates :smalleek:

Certainly appreciate the extended interest, though!


I notice there was just a major edit change as of 3 days ago, and a more minor one yesterday (which prevents my post being thread necromancy). Given that it wasn't a new post, this thread is still languishing several pages behind, and is now being pushed up so that the new edit might be noticed. Incidentally the fire beetle posted appears to be for a different system entirely, probably 4e, given the way it egregiously breaks the attribute rules the what the skills look like.


Sorry if i'm Necro-ing but...

*pulls out 4e MM book*

Fire Beetle

Ability Scores:
Str 18, Con 14, Dex 10, Int 1, Wis 12, Cha 8

AC: 19; Fort: 17; Ref: 13; Will: 14
HP: 62; Bloodied: 13

abilities/feats(?):
Initiative +2
Sense: Perception +3; Darkvision
languages: none

powers:
Bite (standard; at-will) - Reach 2; +10 Vs. AC; 1d10+4 DAM
Entangling Spittle (Standard; recharge on 4-6 on 1d6) - Ranged 5; +8 Vs. Ref; the target is immobilized (save ends {which i believe is a DC 10?})

Now why a Beetle would need to know Heavy Blade and Bastard sword is beyond me.Yeah, I've been experimenting with different formats for the monster stat blocks...before a big re-write took up most of my energy.

Thank you for the spelling fixes...I'll keep those in mind. I probably should have put out a formal message, but the project won't get any updates 'till I get this re-write up. Thanks again, for youse guy's interest!


When might this be available in .PDF?Once it's reasonably finished. I have some experience converting stuff like into this into .pdf, so it will definitely happen, but I've learned that it's easier once you have everything done.

Amechra
2012-07-19, 04:23 PM
I felt like making a 10th level character:
Giantkin Stonelord Warrior

+1 to Athletics and Endurance
+2 to Physical Resist

Str +9 (+4 Attribute Boost, +1 Racial)
Con +2 (+1 Racial)
Dex -1
Wis +0
Int +6 (+4 Attribute Boost)
Cha -2

Average HP at 10: 93
Base attack bonus: +24
Defense: 27(+3 against adjacent creatures.)
Average attack roll: 1d20+31
Weapons: Unarmed Strike (4d10+9, Finesse, Crits on a 18-20); Dagger (4d6+9, Finesse, Stealthy, Crits on a 18-20) Adds +24 to damage for both while Berserk.
Difficulty 29
Mental Resist: +6
Physical Resist: +11

Trained Skills
-Profession
-Stealth
-Endurance
-Athletics

Maneuvers:
Berserk
Pugilist
Cripple
Critical Strike
Lacerate: Deals 12 damage a round to people as a Minor action.
Dual Wielding
Flurry
Momentum
Dodge
Gambit
Torment
-Undecided-

Perks:
Resilient
Parkour
Man at Arms x3
Sneak Attack x3
Artificer?

Wields a Dagger in one hand, nothing in the other. Fights naked.
---

So, did I read Base Attack Bonus thingy properly? Also, are you OK with the fact that I could run into battle wielding a weapon that deals 4d10+33 damage? Let's put it this way:

In a hypothetical fight between two clones of this guy, 1 punch deals on average 55 damage, and he hits on a 2. So, all he needs to do is take a -2 penalty to hit, and he could kill himself in a round.

So that dagger he's wielding? What of it? Oh, that's so that when he's flanking, he adds 3d8 damage to that 4d10, which means that if he uses smart tactics, he doesn't need to Berserk to kill himself (Average 44 damage; he can drop his attack by 4 to get three attacks, for an average of 124 damage.)

Now, making this build made me ask a pair of question: namely, can you dual-wield your Unarmed Strike?

And secondly, does Base Attack get doubled for Warriors, Perk skill bonuses for Rogues, and MP for Mages?

Now to build a completely borked Mage.

Lappy9001
2012-07-19, 10:07 PM
How did you get a +24 Base Attack? It should only be 12, unless you mean your total attack bonus. That alone reduces things quite a bit :smalltongue:

Also, your Unarmed would deal 4d8, not 4d10.

Part of the reason for the re-write is that I did pretty poor in the clarification of abilities. Thanks for the Warrior, I'll critique it further and eagerly await a borked mage :smallcool:

Amechra
2012-07-19, 11:45 PM
Well, in the maneuvers section, there is a line saying that you increase your Base Attack bonus by 1 whenever you get a new maneuver.

There is a similar note in the Warrior's entry, which implies that they get another +1 whenever they get a maneuver.

Plus, I took the Exotic Race option from below, to get the Giantkin option: It ups the size of your weapon's damage dice by 1 size. So, 1d8->1d10.

Also, why is it so obviously better to fight unarmed if you are going for 1 handed weapons? Seriously, all of your other one-handed weapons only deal damage up to a 1d6, while your hands deal 1d8.

But anyway... Mages are actually quite easy, since they only need like 2 Perks to be effective; off the top of my head, I could build a Mage whose defense works out to 35+their Dexterity at level 10, with a +7 to that if they are right next to them. That's on top of wearing light armor.

To put that in perspective, a 10th level Fighter would have to have a Strength/Dex of at least +10 to hit them (+8 if they were flanking), or a +3 to their Dexterity at a range.

Unless you use Beast Form, you cannot increase any of your stats past +9. Though Heroism might let them hit...

Frankly, if you add in that they are wearing Hide armor (+4 to Def), no-one can hit them unless their a Warrior with a Dex of +7 plus their Dex, which is just infeasible.

No-one else can even come close.

You know how much mana this costs the Mage?

11

How am I doing this?

First, you have to start out with an +4 Intelligence.
Pick a race that gets a bonus to Intelligence.
Put all your level up bonuses into Intelligence
Pick Beast Form as a Spell. Make sure that the school is Favored.
Pick up the Blood Magic Perk. Pick some other nice Perk, why not.
Pick up Torment and Gambit. Also, might as well grab Dodge and Efficient Defender. Fill up the rest of your Bonus slots with Maneuvers.

You have an Intelligence of +9 by this point.
Now cast Beast Form, augmented to the full. Take the damage (either you have Heal as a spell known, or you have Regeneration once) for Blood Magic, to raise the Augment limit by 1.

Your Intelligence is boosted by 6 to become +15. Put your choice of speed or defense boost towards Defense.

You are in Light armor, so you add your Intelligence to your Defense. Torment means that adjacent people get half your Intelligence as a penalty to all their attacks.

Dodge means that, even if they do by some miracle manage to hit you, you can just make them reroll.

Of course, if you really want overkill, you can just sacrifice another 11 Mana to raise your Dexterity in the same manner, thus giving yourself a Defense of lolno.

Of course, anyone can do this; it's just that this example Mage gets an average of 61 Mana to play with, while everyone else gets 35.

If they focus on magic.

That's... 30 minutes of Beast Form goodness, if they want to max it out; Mages can manage 50, and they have other nice toys to play with...

Like the fact that their Difficulty is literally 35 in this case, which means that your average person will not be able to pass your Charm resistance roll.

Or, hell, here's a fun one:
You are a 1st level Mage. You have the good fortune to have a +4 Intelligence.

So, each day you start off with 8+3d4(already rolled when you made the character) Mana. Nice. So, you pick Flight, Telekinesis, and Inertia as your first level spells, and, I don't know, you pick Flight as your Gift of Magic.

Your first Bonus is to grab one of the Archery Maneuvers.

Now, cast Flight. Cast Inertia on someone, increasing the effects of gravity.

Fly 20 feet above them. Cast Telekinesis to pick them up 15'.

That's probably a lot of damage, though you haven't listed how to calculate falling damage yet... And you haven't posted Keen or Bolster in the spells section...

Or you can just shove the guy into the ground for 1d8 damage; they have to make a Mental Resistance roll against 15 to not get shafted, though.

By the way? Flight makes you immune to melee damage.

It's kinda cool; you can just float there and shoot people with your bow.

I might go see if I can break minions next; Summon Elemental just summons a level 1+ minion with the Elemental ability, right?

Mark Hall
2013-02-23, 11:56 AM
The Mod Wonder: Revived under consent of Mods.

Lappy9001
2013-02-23, 08:34 PM
Thank you for that Mark Hall!

Alright, after a lot (and I mean a lot) of re-working and editing, I'm ready to post the updated version of Classy d20! Currently, I'm about at where I left off last time and I wanted to see if anyone had any initial thoughts (I'd love to hear them!)

Got finish tweaking equipment and magic items. I'll likely have something up tonight or tomorrow night.

Things:

I still don't have mounted rules. They're a pain and a half to implement. They'll be coming in Variant Rules.
Flying as well. Characters normally can't do it. Monsters can, and it'll come as a Monster Template.
I lied; no Point-Buy. I really don't like Point-Buy systems and I never have but if someone else wants to make one, I'll be more than happy to implement it.
Monster rules won't be up until I get majority of the kinks out of the base system. I've learned my lesson about this.

Lappy9001
2013-02-24, 07:12 PM
Alright, Equipment and Weapons are up. Still gotta do Armor, Shields, and Magic Items but I've done enough formatting for the moment :smalltongue:

Amechra
2013-02-26, 01:04 AM
I haven't had a chance to go back and check, but have you fixed the little exploits I found (namely, Intelligence and Dexterity are god stats. Nothing else need apply.)

Lappy9001
2013-02-26, 01:49 AM
I haven't had a chance to go back and check, but have you fixed the little exploits I found (namely, Intelligence and Dexterity are god stats. Nothing else need apply.)This version is in many ways dissimilar from the previous, but the most exploitative abilities (I believe a few Perks and Maneuvers) no longer rely on Attributes as flat bonuses.

Also, if you're interested, I have all of the material from the previous version in it's (mostly) original form.

Lappy9001
2013-02-27, 01:17 AM
Quickie Fixes to the Spells section: Fixed typos in Protection that now read Barrier, gave the Flame, Ice, and Storm Schools a little more "oomph" now that their damage dice increasing abilities also have an additional effect (an aura affect for Fireball, more Squares to affect in Blizzard, and a potential range of 150 ft. with Lightning Bolt/Arc).

Also, the Martial Disciplines, Arcane Schools, and Skills will each have a description, and possible fluff text for the individual Abilities if people think it's necessary (I can see both some pros and cons: It'll help define the Ability's role better and give players a better idea of what it does, but it can clutter up the formatting and well, there's 120 of them...not that I entirely mind, but it's not something to go into lightly less I'm sure it'll have a positive impact)

Last update post to prevent too much bumping. Armor and Magic Items up tomorrow after work. Any comments or critique are very much appreciated :smallcool:

Lappy9001
2013-03-13, 02:44 AM
Took longer than I thought, but life will do that to ya. It turns out I've run out of space in the original posting, so I'm going to start posting additional information here. Currently, I still need to update the Magic Properties section (although I did spell out the essential Magical Components), and to fill out the descriptions for Martial Disciplines and Arcane Schools. I did get Skills done, however, which require those descriptions somewhat more. Still to come is Specializations, Variant Rules (such as Racial Templates, Collateral Damage, and dynamic Initiative), and eventually Monsters.

Any and all critique is still wonderfully appreciated!

Also, does anyone think I should include flavor text for each Ability, or is it better to let the name and mechanics do the imagining for me?

celtois
2013-03-13, 10:48 PM
I feel like the abilities the halflings get are pretty weak in comparison to the rest of the races.

+1 to saves 1/day

This is compared to regaining magic (Elf), doing max damage on spells (kobold) or melee attacks (Orc), Ignoring conditions (Dwarf)

Maybe make it scale with level or something so it stays more relevant like the rest of the abilities.

Knaight
2013-03-14, 04:22 PM
It's good to see this back. I can confirm that I'm still interested*, though the amount of feedback I'm able to produce will probably be slightly less than it used to be. Still, might as well start immediately:

The races major abilities list 1/day, this is also specified in the major ability text. That is somewhat redundant.
Arcane Recollection doesn't specify when it must be used. As written, it can grab all the MP back from any spell they cast whenever, which creates a lot of bookwork. If it has to be done right after the spell, it works better.
The orc is described as "powerfully build" instead of "powerfully built".
The Attribute range is unspecified. I assume it is now 1-4, at least to start, but clarifying that would be helpful.
Light activity is undefined as concerns resting.
Drake-Skin should be either Drake-Skinned or Drake Skin.
The organization is a bit weird. In particular, Attack Points and Mana should probably be listed near Attributes.
Penetrate Defense doesn't actually trigger a reflex save. Current wording technically says that succeeding on any reflex save, which would have to be due to unrelated phenomena, cancels it. I suspect this isn't what was intended.
Rapid shot works after any attack - this might be a feature, particularly for hand crossbow fighters.
I'm not sure the effect areas are ever actually defined.
The Armor tables are a mess. Also, the Iron Clad trait actually drops the penalty for Linked Mail below most light armor.
Momentum is seriously cool and needs to be kept in.
Shieldmate stacking from multiple people having it seems really, really abusable.
I'm liking the new magic system, with spell specializations. Keep this.
Fireball has "is1d6" written by it. Add a space.
Blizzard technically allows targeting of any three squares in 25 feet. They might need to be adjacent.
Inferno is odd in what it effects.
Wild shape adds to damage, but if you have pugilist it does nothing, and if you have pugilist and weapon specialization unarmed it actually drops it a die. Maybe it should just increase it two steps.
The 3 MP spent used persistently should probably say "additional 3 MP spent"
Lighting Bolt technically allows a line with you in the center that is 50 feet long to start with. It also doesn't specify how much it needs to stick to the coordinate grid.
Arc doesn't specify that it only has forward propogation, and is instead written in such a way that lightning bolt branches, possibly just rotates, and does other weird behavior. It also technically doesn't necessitate rotation at the target being struck.
How does teleport interact with occupied spaces? Particularly spatial recall?
How mix poison interacts with ammunition should probably be specified.
Parkour seems potientially overpowered.
Resiliency doesn't specify how it increases HP.
Polyglot doesn't specify whether or not one learns languages for previous talents taken.
Does Channel move the ability, or spread it to two people?
Rugged looks like it could be used in the short term for near complete immunity to elemental attacks, based on damage distribution of spells.
Intuition should say "or when within" instead of "or within".
Factotum seems pretty worthless.
Sales between two people with Haggle should be clarified. As is, possibilities exist for 99%, 100%, or 101% of the original sales price depending on stacking order interpretations.
Inspire should probably have a restricted use. As is it isn't always on, but can be activated for free as often as one wants.
The 50 gold fine clothes probably shouldn't be described as containing copious amounts of jewelery.
Magical components look like they will necessitate being careful with weapon and armor weights. It's just something to keep in mind.
Returning seems a little bit cheap, given how overtly magical it is.


*Read: Am making an exception to leaving the forum because of this particular thread.

Lappy9001
2013-03-17, 10:33 PM
Sorry for the delay...I'm kept quite busy with a new job these days. Thanks for all the feedback so far!


I feel like the abilities the halflings get are pretty weak in comparison to the rest of the races.

+1 to saves 1/day

This is compared to regaining magic (Elf), doing max damage on spells (kobold) or melee attacks (Orc), Ignoring conditions (Dwarf)

Maybe make it scale with level or something so it stays more relevant like the rest of the abilities.Excellent point. I feel like +4 for 1 minute 4/day (as of level 9) is a bit much...maybe only for 3 rounds like the Orc's rage? I'm also open to alternative ideas.


It's good to see this back. I can confirm that I'm still interested*, though the amount of feedback I'm able to produce will probably be slightly less than it used to be. Still, might as well start immediately:Knaight, you beautiful poster you! Thank you gracious for this bounty of critique!


The races major abilities list 1/day, this is also specified in the major ability text. That is somewhat redundant.
Arcane Recollection doesn't specify when it must be used. As written, it can grab all the MP back from any spell they cast whenever, which creates a lot of bookwork. If it has to be done right after the spell, it works better.
The orc is described as "powerfully build" instead of "powerfully built".
The Attribute range is unspecified. I assume it is now 1-4, at least to start, but clarifying that would be helpful.
Light activity is undefined as concerns resting.
Drake-Skin should be either Drake-Skinned or Drake Skin.All Fixed!


The organization is a bit weird. In particular, Attack Points and Mana should probably be listed near Attributes.I kinda agree, but I also think they need to be described in their relevant section. I did both last time and some people assumed they stacked...


Penetrate Defense doesn't actually trigger a reflex save. Current wording technically says that succeeding on any reflex save, which would have to be due to unrelated phenomena, cancels it. I suspect this isn't what was intended.
Rapid shot works after any attack - this might be a feature, particularly for hand crossbow fighters.Penetrate Defense completely reworded. Rapid Shot does indeed need to be after a Ranged Attack.


I'm not sure the effect areas are ever actually defined.They're actually not. I assumed it wouldn't be needed, since Adjacent Squares and Space is covered in Actions and Combat. I wanted to attempt Spells and similar effects without making any additional areas of effect. It either affects a target, adjacent space, and/or a square of space (sometimes in a line, but that's pretty self-explanatory).


The Armor tables are a mess. Also, the Iron Clad trait actually drops the penalty for Linked Mail below most light armor.Yeah, it kinda is. The tables fought with me, but the real badness stems from the fact that Armor Properties are kinda pointless if there are only 3. Weapons can have lots of different combinations, but Armor can't (Shields don't even have any). I also realized I forgot to add shields. This one will be fixed soon.


Momentum is seriously cool and needs to be kept in.Thank you! I feel like I cribbed the idea from somewhere else though.


Shieldmate stacking from multiple people having it seems really, really abusable.I actually learned my lesson this time. The Defense bonus granted is a Might bonus, which don't stack.


I'm liking the new magic system, with spell specializations. Keep this.Awesome, thanks. I feel like I finally succeeded in making a simplistic spell system.


Fireball has "is1d6" written by it. Add a space.Fixed!


[list] Blizzard technically allows targeting of any three squares in 25 feet. They might need to be adjacent.That's actually intentional. It's why there can only be 3 targets initially, since the caster can specifically pick out enemies.


Inferno is odd in what it effects.In addition to increasing the range of the Spell, it's supposed to have a flame cloak kinda effect (like a burst in 4e). Any ideas for a better wording?


Wild shape adds to damage, but if you have pugilist it does nothing, and if you have pugilist and weapon specialization unarmed it actually drops it a die. Maybe it should just increase it two steps.This one will be fixed. I'm going to include an unarmed section into the Weapons section. It'll cover Wild Shape too.


The 3 MP spent used persistently should probably say "additional 3 MP spent"Good idea. That one will take some to fully implement, but I'll edit it in.


Lighting Bolt technically allows a line with you in the center that is 50 feet long to start with. It also doesn't specify how much it needs to stick to the coordinate grid.

Arc doesn't specify that it only has forward propogation, and is instead written in such a way that lightning bolt branches, possibly just rotates, and does other weird behavior. It also technically doesn't necessitate rotation at the target being struck.I attempted to tighten up Lightning Bolt's description a bit. Arc is meant to do pretty wacky things (not doubling back on itself though, whoops); tightened this up too.


How does teleport interact with occupied spaces? Particularly spatial recall?[List]I thought it was pretty well described, hmm...

Spatial Recall now doesn't work if the beacon's space isn't unoccupied.


[list] How mix poison interacts with ammunition should probably be specified.Ah, good catch.


Parkour seems potientially overpowered.You think so? I suppose I could reduce it to half Speed, but I don't quite see the overpoweredness.


Resiliency doesn't specify how it increases HP.Fixed, hopefully.


Polyglot doesn't specify whether or not one learns languages for previous talents taken.Fixed, however I feel the Talent is underpowered.


Does Channel move the ability, or spread it to two people?Channel needs to be removed completely. It was a hold-over from when Magic Items worked differently, as now they will just grant an ability. This means I need an idea for a Mechanics Talent.

I am thoroughly sorry for not answering everything right now. This is the only chance I've got for a bit to get in a post at all. I will get to the rest as soon as I'm able! Thank you for all the critique so far!

Amechra
2013-03-17, 11:09 PM
I think you got Momentum from CRE8 (http://cre8-rpg-alpha.wikispaces.com/CRE8+Home).

Which is utterly understandable...

(Unless parallel evolution.)

Lappy9001
2013-03-20, 05:15 PM
I think you got Momentum from CRE8 (http://cre8-rpg-alpha.wikispaces.com/CRE8+Home).

Which is utterly understandable...

(Unless parallel evolution.)
Never heard of it, actually. What are you thoughts on the changes Amechra?

Aaaand, I got some free time. Here's the rest of Knaight's awesome critique:


Wild shape adds to damage, but if you have pugilist it does nothing, and if you have pugilist and weapon specialization unarmed it actually drops it a die. Maybe it should just increase it two steps.
Mmkay, both just increase the Damage Dice by 1 step. I remembered to add in the Unarmed Weapons section. Now you can Flurry or go all Ki-Strike DBZ style.

Rugged looks like it could be used in the short term for near complete immunity to elemental attacks, based on damage distribution of spells.
Should be better now.

Intuition should say "or when within" instead of "or within".
Thanks, fixed.

Factotum seems pretty worthless.
It’s slightly better now. It’s just handy because there’s no limit to how much you can make use of it. The system doesn’t have an “assist” mechanic otherwise as part of my attempt to remove as many obscure abilities as possible.

Sales between two people with Haggle should be clarified. As is, possibilities exist for 99%, 100%, or 101% of the original sales price depending on stacking order interpretations.
It doesn’t do anything if both buyer and seller have Haggle. At the least it keeps one from under/overshooting the other.

Inspire should probably have a restricted use. As is it isn't always on, but can be activated for free as often as one wants.
Fixed. Also updated Intimidate.

The 50 gold fine clothes probably shouldn't be described as containing copious amounts of jewelery.
That’s probably a good idea :p

Magical components look like they will necessitate being careful with weapon and armor weights. It's just something to keep in mind.
Yeah, I actually had an idea to reduce the weights of those…I’ll do that now.

Returning seems a little bit cheap, given how overtly magical it is.
You think so? I figured it would work as a boomerang kinda effect. At any rate, it no longer applies to ammunition. How do you feel about the customizable weapons in general? It’s kind of a prototype and I’d like to see what people think (the idea was broadly cribbed from the 4e Gamma World)

Other Updates:
Stealth has been updated entirely.
There were a few left-over mentions of ‘energy damage’ which have been removed.
I actually forgot to fix Rest…and included that the restful bonus doesn’t stack with itself (staying at 3 inns in a row, etc.). Although I’d actually be a little impressed if characters bothered to try this.
Fixed some errors in the Ranged Weapons section (they didn’t have a default range which…kinda defeats the purpose :P

celtois
2013-03-20, 05:46 PM
I don't know exactly what flavour you're going for with your halflings.

But something like this might be cool.
Lionhearted: Halfing's may not show it outwardly but they rarely flinch at a challenge, and results in them often accomplishing tasks despite the odds stacked against them, through shear determination. Halflings get a +2 bonus to saves against fear, and 2/day they may gain a +3 bonus on an attack roll, skill, or save. (The logic behind +3 is that the human reroll results (roll 2d20) averages to 13.825 ish instead of 10.5. So the results are roughly speaking equal mechanically. Except the human ability is more versatile (It can turn a sure failure into a success, while the halfling ability just pushes them over the edge for near successes, so I figured it needed an extra use. ))

Lappy9001
2013-03-20, 08:21 PM
I don't know exactly what flavour you're going for with your halflings.

But something like this might be cool.
Lionhearted: Halfing's may not show it outwardly but they rarely flinch at a challenge, and results in them often accomplishing tasks despite the odds stacked against them, through shear determination. Halflings get a +2 bonus to saves against fear, and 2/day they may gain a +3 bonus on an attack roll, skill, or save. (The logic behind +3 is that the human reroll results (roll 2d20) averages to 13.825 ish instead of 10.5. So the results are roughly speaking equal mechanically. Except the human ability is more versatile (It can turn a sure failure into a success, while the halfling ability just pushes them over the edge for near successes, so I figured it needed an extra use. ))Any old halfling fluff works fine. One thing I'm trying to avoid is having bonuses to rather specific things (like a resistance against charm/fear/poison/etc). I like the jest of it though. I did update the old one after your first comment, and it looks like this:


Lucky: A halfling can gain a +1 bonus to Saves for 3 rounds. This bonus increases by +1 every 3 levels.

Amechra
2013-03-20, 08:26 PM
I haven't had a chance to look at it yet; I've got some time tonight, though, so I'll try to break everything over my knee again.

I do it out of a wish for your material to improve!

Lappy9001
2013-03-20, 08:31 PM
I haven't had a chance to look at it yet; I've got some time tonight, though, so I'll try to break everything over my knee again.

I do it out of a wish for your material to improve!I know, ye kind soul!

Hopefully I'll give you more of a challenge this time :smallwink:

Edit: Oh, also as a head's up I'm gonna be rewording quite a few Maneuvers and Spells (for Knaight's idea of "additional 3 MP spent"). I'll let you guys know when I make the change, though.

blackwind1kaze
2013-03-28, 04:27 PM
Another way is to roll seven four-sided dice (6d4) and drop the lowest result. However, the total result cannot be more than 18. However, if the total result is less than 13 you can instead choose to use the standard array.

It should be six four sided dice (6d4) and drop the lowest die.

Also so this means even if you roll 5 four's and 1 two and drop the two, you can only have the total be 18 instead of 20?

Lappy9001
2013-03-28, 09:28 PM
It should be six four sided dice (6d4) and drop the lowest die.

Also so this means even if you roll 5 four's and 1 two and drop the two, you can only have the total be 18 instead of 20?It actually is supposed to be 7, one for each Attribute (minus the dropped dice). The idea is so you can get some randomness but not be too over/underpowered (unless you wanna be under in a stat, I suppose). I'm a big proponent of dice rolls instead of point buy, but I suppose the argument could be made that if it's limited too much, rolls are just as bad.

Magic Items coming soon, btw. Haven't found much time to format the dang thing..Edit: Found some time :smallbiggrin:

Lappy9001
2013-03-28, 11:39 PM
Out-of-date material.

Magic Items
..........Magic items are objects that have been infused with mystical energy, part from their creator, and part from a creature with strong ties to the arcane.

Essentia
..........All living creatures possess a spiritual energy known as essentia which is most often intertwined with their very being. However, the races of the world (dwarves, elves, halflings, humans, orcs, and kobolds) are separated from essentia, but can use it to alter their fate. These races have a pool of essentia that they can use a number of times per day equal to 3 + ˝ their level (or until recovered by a rest). One use of essentia can be expended as a free action to add 1d6 onto a d20 roll after the roll has been made but before hearing the result.

The majority of magical creatures are incapable of using their essentia to alter fate, but instead gain remarkable powers (many are the creatures presented in the Monsters section).

Crafting Magic Items
..........Creating a basic magic item requires a specific talent (Artificer for magic items and Alchemist for alchemic items), the object to serve as the focus for the energy, and the creator's essentia. The creation process takes 1 hour of work in which the creator's total essentia pool is set to 0 and transferred from their body into the item, granting the item a magical property.

Each created item reduces the creator's total essentia pool by 1 until used up (such as potions) or destroyed. The creator of a magic item can destroy an item (regardless of distance) by focusing for 1 uninterrupted hour, after which the magical property is removed and the point of essentia is returned. If the creator of a magic item is dead for a week or longer, the magical property is drained from the item.

Permanent magic items can be created by substituting the soul of a magical creature for the creator's essentia. However, this process must be done within 1 hour of the creature's death and requires a precious gemstone (usually worth at least 1,000 gold) that must be set into the item as a focus. Alchemic items cannot be made permanent.

Using Magic Items
..........Using the power of a magic item costs 1 use of essentia, as if it had been used to alter a dice roll.

Lappy9001
2013-03-28, 11:44 PM
Okay, now I'm decidedly in territory that has been tested very little. Magic Gemstones are my equivalent to rings and wondrous items, with the goal being to dissolve overly-complex item slots (head, shoulder, feet, hands, etc.). Now, you only have 3 slots to wear whatever it is you want, wherever you want. The other idea is to have the items grant new abilities or improve on existing ones (but not muscle in on abilities that already exist). No flat +1 or whatever bonuses here, at least, that's the idea.

However, I think I need some better ideas for Magical Components. Things that can be harvested from magic creatures as the source of their power (so probably more like a dragon's heart than their scales). Cold, Fire, and Shock are standard issue, and I think Toxic (and possibly Holy and Demonic since there's no alignments) are fine. The rest, I don't really know.

So, I'm totally open to ideas both for Magic Items (Weapons, Armor, and Gemstones alike), as well as Magic Components (down to the name, I'm not entirely sold on it). I'd like to keep the number of Magic Components low, but the more Magic Items, the merrier. In fact, please shoot some ideas my way. Magic Items in general has always been a department that I've had problems creating and even using within a game.

They also currently don't have prices, so that's something that's gonna have to be solved.

Saidoro
2013-03-29, 03:56 PM
It's back! :smallbiggrin:
A few notes:
The rogue's Dilettante focus isn't indented.
Does an Evocation Mage add charisma to cantrip damage?
When an Indomitable warrior is hit by a status effect when he already has one suppressed can he choose to end his suppression of the old effect to suppress the new one?
Warrior's challenge is kind of weird, as things stand now if they challenge a rogue and that rogue spends their next turn tossing a fire bomb at the warrior and then fixes themselves up with healer's touch they still take the save penalty for targeting themselves with the healing power. On the other hand, if they throw a fireball and then patch themselves up with a healing potion they don't because potions aren't targeted. Was this intentional?

When learning Maneuver, the first italicized:smallconfused: ability must be learned before any other Maneuvers in a Martial Discipline can be learned.
The wording on Dual Strike is really weird.
I'm guessing the various "per 3 AP" maneuvers have a minimum of 1.
All of the effects from the various spell enhancements stack, right? they don't replace the original effect? Do secondary effects which mention a save(such as fear) force the target to make a second save or are they based on the original one?
Teleport really seems like it should be a move action, the biggest advantages it grants are things like moving through walls that don't care about the action type, and it really has very little combat application as is.
Overall spells seem to over-reward specialization a bit. We want mages to specialize but if most of them are spending their first four spells on the same school that can make early levels a bit samey.
The recollection knowledge talent references perception talents.
Inspire and Threaten are identical.
I still don't like wealth-based item systems, but gold pieces aren't really tied to anything but combat gear so I guess it's easy enough to abstract them into a metagame resource.(I'd be a bit happier if you added a note about such an abstraction in the rules somewhere.) I like the system though, the items supplement the user without replacing them.
What happens if someone has multiple flaming swords? Can they just swap them out for extra uses per day? Can you hand your flaming sword to your friend after using it and let him use the additional damage die? Are you basically expecting higher level characters to carry around golf bags full of weapons an gems and swap them around as needed?

Pain (Toxic): After a successful Attack roll, this weapon its Damage Dice to an opponent on next turn 1/day.
I really this effect.

Lappy9001
2013-03-31, 03:01 PM
It's back! :smallbiggrin:Awwww yeah :smallcool:
A few notes:

The rogue's Dilettante focus isn't indented.Got it, fixed.

Does an Evocation Mage add charisma to cantrip damage?Negative, it only affects Spells (just like how a Warrior's Damage boost doesn't affect Relentless)

When an Indomitable warrior is hit by a status effect when he already has one suppressed can he choose to end his suppression of the old effect to suppress the new one?It's intended to be a 'no' since there's only a few Status conditions, so immunity is pretty easy. Do you have any suggestions to tighten up the phrasing?

Warrior's challenge is kind of weird, as things stand now if they challenge a rogue and that rogue spends their next turn tossing a fire bomb at the warrior and then fixes themselves up with healer's touch they still take the save penalty for targeting themselves with the healing power. On the other hand, if they throw a fireball and then patch themselves up with a healing potion they don't because potions aren't targeted. Was this intentional?I actually came up with this idea, then found out that 4e did it before me, and worded it much better. The catch is that 4e uses attack rolls for spells too. I'll try to think of a better way to word mine.

Edit: Howzit look now?Challenge
Benefit: You may challenge an enemy target after attacking them (even on a miss) as a free action. They takes a -2 penalty to Attack rolls and Save rolls if they target one of your allies other than yourself, or target a Square of space that does not include you. Challenge can only be used once per round.
The wording on Dual Strike is really weird.In Classy d20, you can only make 1 attack per action. However, it's usually a Major action. Dual Strike lets you attack a Minor actions, after using a Major (so you can't just convert all your other actions into Minors. You gotta make that first normal attack).

I'm guessing the various "per 3 AP" maneuvers have a minimum of 1.Yup. I mentioned that I needed to rewrite Maneuvers....this is partly why.

All of the effects from the various spell enhancements stack, right? they don't replace the original effect? Do secondary effects which mention a save(such as fear) force the target to make a second save or are they based on the original one?They're added onto the base spell. For example:

Beguile
Benefit: Within 25 ft., one enemy target takes a -2 Spirit penalty to Attack and Damage rolls for a duration. This duration is 3 rounds for every 1 MP spent on this spell. Targets that succeed a Will save ignore the effect.
Fear
Benefit: An enemy target affected by Beguile must succeed an additional Will save or become Demoralized for the duration.
Now, the enemy target has to make 2 Save rolls, one for Beguile, and one for Fear (hence why it says an additional Will save). If you know both Spells, you get both effects for 1 MP, unless you wanna increase the duration. Thus, blaster mages have more incentive to spend more MP, but obviously tend to run out of MP faster. An older draft also had the Difficulty roll increase when you spent more MP, and I think I'll re-implement that.

Teleport really seems like it should be a move action, the biggest advantages it grants are things like moving through walls that don't care about the action type, and it really has very little combat application as is.Some Arcane Schools are obviously more secondary (and great for Warriors and Rogues) and Dimension Swap/Concealment do add to the combat application, but you have a great point there.

Overall spells seem to over-reward specialization a bit. We want mages to specialize but if most of them are spending their first four spells on the same school that can make early levels a bit samey.After building a few characters, I've found that it's best to learn Spells from two different schools at once, rather than one at a time (like a Spell from each School every other level). Or just go crazy and learn a ton of different ones because the base Spells are generally powerful to carry themselves, providing you have the MP and the level to get a lot of use out of them. And of course, your magical repertoire is supplemented by cantrips and Talents that clearly favor Mages (Knowledge, Perception, Nature, and Mechanics, I've found have some awesome synergy with a Mage). And, of course, there's little stopping a Mage from grabbing some Maneuvers and picking up some Heavy Armor or a Two-Handed weapon.

The recollection knowledge talent references perception talents.

Inspire and Threaten are identical.Both fixed, thanks!


I still don't like wealth-based item systems, but gold pieces aren't really tied to anything but combat gear so I guess it's easy enough to abstract them into a metagame resource.(I'd be a bit happier if you added a note about such an abstraction in the rules somewhere.) I like the system though, the items supplement the user without replacing them.Thanks, supplementing, and not replacing, was one of the goals. And I don't quite know what you mean by wealth-based item systems or metagame resources.

What happens if someone has multiple flaming swords? Can they just swap them out for extra uses per day? Can you hand your flaming sword to your friend after using it and let him use the additional damage die? Are you basically expecting higher level characters to carry around golf bags full of weapons an gems and swap them around as needed?Don't adventurers already do this? If you got the gold and the ability to carry it all, why not, I say.


I really this effect.Me too :smallbiggrin:

Thanks for all the critique so far. And I am still in desperate need of magic item ideas. Any help is greatly appreciated!

Saidoro
2013-03-31, 05:35 PM
It's intended to be a 'no' since there's only a few Status conditions, so immunity is pretty easy. Do you have any suggestions to tighten up the phrasing?
The current wording should work, I was just wondering if you were intending the version I asked about.

Edit: Howzit look now?Challenge
Benefit: You may challenge an enemy target after attacking them (even on a miss) as a free action. They takes a -2 penalty to Attack rolls and Save rolls if they target one of your allies other than yourself, or target a Square of space that does not include you. Challenge can only be used once per round.
Looks good. It still bugs a little bit if someone casts a spell that makes a wall or something but that's a small enough corner case it probably isn't worth butchering your wording over.(Especially since there aren't currently any spells like that.)

An older draft also had the Difficulty roll increase when you spent more MP, and I think I'll re-implement that.
Probably a good idea, debuffers have crazy endurance in this draft compared to blasters.

Some Arcane Schools are obviously more secondary (and great for Warriors and Rogues) and Dimension Swap/Concealment do add to the combat application, but you have a great point there.
People have a lot more mobility in Classy d20 than in 3.5, Teleport is still a useful spell, but its use is pretty much noncombat. Spending a major action and a big chunk of MP to move isn't worth it and even spending it to swap will only rarely be so.

After building a few characters, I've found that it's best to learn Spells from two different schools at once, rather than one at a time (like a Spell from each School every other level). Or just go crazy and learn a ton of different ones because the base Spells are generally powerful to carry themselves, providing you have the MP and the level to get a lot of use out of them. And of course, your magical repertoire is supplemented by cantrips and Talents that clearly favor Mages (Knowledge, Perception, Nature, and Mechanics, I've found have some awesome synergy with a Mage). And, of course, there's little stopping a Mage from grabbing some Maneuvers and picking up some Heavy Armor or a Two-Handed weapon.
It's mostly a matter of action economy. Casting Darkened Enervating Necrosis will generally be a better use of your action than the option to cast straight Fireball or straight Necrosis or straight Beguile even when it isn't a very good option. Consider putting a cap on how many spells from one school can be learned (2/3 levels maybe?).

Thanks, supplementing, and not replacing, was one of the goals. And I don't quite know what you mean by wealth-based item systems or metagame resources.
A metagame resource is something like experience or character levels that don't exist in the world being simulated but are still usable by the players to influence what's going on. A wealth-based item system is exactly what it sounds like, something where the characters can easily exchange wealth for character power and vice-versa. I generally don't like them because it can strain the game when the characters are either extremely wealthy or extremely poor and in so doing can limit what sorts of games can be run. To make GP into a metagame resource you'd basically give them out in the same way you do experience and run the normal game-world economy off something else entirely(which you don't need to specify, let the GMs figure it out).

Don't adventurers already do this? If you got the gold and the ability to carry it all, why not, I say.
That wasn't a complaint, I was just clarifying intent. That's exactly the sort of thing that happened all the time in 3.5 despite the designers generally not intending for it to do so, so I thought I'd ask.

I'll let you know if I come up with any good items.

Lappy9001
2013-03-31, 09:04 PM
Looks good. It still bugs a little bit if someone casts a spell that makes a wall or something but that's a small enough corner case it probably isn't worth butchering your wording over.(Especially since there aren't currently any spells like that.)Yeah that's true too. But if it generally keeps baddies from running over the warrior to tackle a mage, I'll have done my job :smalltongue:


People have a lot more mobility in Classy d20 than in 3.5, Teleport is still a useful spell, but its use is pretty much noncombat. Spending a major action and a big chunk of MP to move isn't worth it and even spending it to swap will only rarely be so.Cool; Move Action Teleport it is.


It's mostly a matter of action economy. Casting Darkened Enervating Necrosis will generally be a better use of your action than the option to cast straight Fireball or straight Necrosis or straight Beguile even when it isn't a very good option. Consider putting a cap on how many spells from one school can be learned (2/3 levels maybe?).I'll see what I can do.


A metagame resource is something like experience or character levels that don't exist in the world being simulated but are still usable by the players to influence what's going on. A wealth-based item system is exactly what it sounds like, something where the characters can easily exchange wealth for character power and vice-versa. I generally don't like them because it can strain the game when the characters are either extremely wealthy or extremely poor and in so doing can limit what sorts of games can be run. To make GP into a metagame resource you'd basically give them out in the same way you do experience and run the normal game-world economy off something else entirely(which you don't need to specify, let the GMs figure it out).So it's like Wealth in d20 Modern, yes? I like the sound of it...I'll look into this some more. It'll help balance out Magic Items (and Haggle) too.


That wasn't a complaint, I was just clarifying intent. That's exactly the sort of thing that happened all the time in 3.5 despite the designers generally not intending for it to do so, so I thought I'd ask.Sorry, didn't mean for that to come off that way. I suppose it could also be limited by to the wielder (fluffed by using the wielder's essence and such). I'll get to thinking on that one.


I'll let you know if I come up with any good items.Thank you, please do :smallcool:

Gonna implement these changes now and fix the Table of Contents for better browsing. Also updated Mage cantrips.

Ziegander
2013-03-31, 09:21 PM
Has this been PDF'd yet?

Lappy9001
2013-03-31, 09:24 PM
Oy vey...Spent the last 20 minutes formatting the table of contents then the browser closed :smallsigh: Mm'kay, it's done now!


Has this been PDF'd yet?I'm gonna wait until I get things tied down a bit more, but I shall then. I still gotta do the Variant Rules section. And monsters, of course, but that probably gets its own pdf.

Ziegander
2013-03-31, 09:27 PM
I'm gonna wait until I get things tied down a bit more, but I shall then. I still gotta do the Variant Rules section.

Okay, sounds good. I'll anxiously await it's arrival. There's a lot to love about your simple little rules set!


And monsters, of course, but that probably gets its own pdf.

Yeah, no kidding.

Knaight
2013-04-09, 09:55 PM
So it's like Wealth in d20 Modern, yes? I like the sound of it...I'll look into this some more. It'll help balance out Magic Items (and Haggle) too.

Wealth is just an abstraction at the character level, it's still not a metagame resource. I don't know how much experience you have with non-D&D systems, but one of the really common metagame resources are metagame points that you spend to influence the game (rerolling dice, for example), such as Fate Points, Bennies, etc. Magic items and the like might reduce the amount of those you get per session, or cost them to use, thus limiting their power and making them an out-of-character thing to access, while still being good at the character level.

Lappy9001
2013-04-11, 11:41 PM
Wealth is just an abstraction at the character level, it's still not a metagame resource. I don't know how much experience you have with non-D&D systems, but one of the really common metagame resources are metagame points that you spend to influence the game (rerolling dice, for example), such as Fate Points, Bennies, etc. Magic items and the like might reduce the amount of those you get per session, or cost them to use, thus limiting their power and making them an out-of-character thing to access, while still being good at the character level.I'm not sure about implementing that, at least for wealth. I've always felt in a medieval fantasy setting, a singular gold piece would matter quite a lot, so keeping track of exact money is pretty important.

However, it would work great for Magic Items, so I'm prolly gonna implement that there.

Finally got that rewrite of Maneuvers up. Very few actually changed mechanically (I believe only Parry and Dispel), but the wording should be more precise overall. Next up is Magic Items (I've got about 25 Magic Gem abilities and a overhall of Magical Components, possibly the name too). Talents and Spells (minus some minor tweaks) seems to be pretty well-written as-is.

Knaight
2013-04-11, 11:50 PM
I'm not sure about implementing that, at least for wealth. I've always felt in a medieval fantasy setting, a singular gold piece would matter quite a lot, so keeping track of exact money is pretty important.

However, it would work great for Magic Items, so I'm prolly gonna implement that there.

I would strongly recommend not connecting wealth to any kind of meta game resource. Magic items do work pretty well with them though, but as of now there isn't a resource they are connected to, which is problematic. Mostly, I was clarifying a point and not endorsing one.

On Manuevers:

I don't believe you've ever actually explicitly laid out the necessity of picking up the first talent before the indented ones.
The line for piercing shot technically doesn't have to come from you with the way it is currently worded, and even if it did it could shoot out in both ways.
The Light Armor talents should probably also work with no armor.
The One Handed group references Light Weapons. It should be renamed to the Light Weapons group.
Warden is a bit weird, in that it could let you take a hit from a melee strike from someone who can't even reach you or a ranged strike that has to go through someone else. If you are in space (0,0) your ally is in (0,1) and the enemy is in (0,2) it's...odd. Maybe you should have to be a valid target to begin with, and the ally can't be cover?

On Talents:

Endurance is worded oddly.
Resilience doesn't specify how HP changes. Are the hit dice rerolled? Does the 3 added supersede any changes? Is it just +1/level, +3? How does this work?
Polyglot has a similar issue: Is it those already learned, those to be learned later, what?
Wild Walker might be a bit much. Becoming literally impossible to track seems excessive, and not needing rations should probably be restricted to where foraging is at least somewhat conceivable.
I like Speech as a skill, particularly in how competitive speech interactions play out.


On Spells:

Beguile is worded awkwardly.
"This Effect" in Scorch could refer to either only the burning space or the recurring damage.
Tough Hide should probably not just set claw damage at a particular level, as that is largely inconsistent with the rest of the spells.


On Equipment:

Everything needs some degree of clarification, but there are highlights.
Redescribing the heavy weapons section could help. It's really hard to take it seriously when "strength alone" is presented as all that matters for any weapon, let alone things like spears.
Reach needs to be redescribed. It's a semi-coherent sentence fragment.
Masterwork needs to be taken out of the properties that lower damage.
Ammunition is listed with the other properties despite not actually bringing the die down and existing as something that can be paired with another two. It's also unclear what happens for non-ammunition ranged weapons, and how it works in general.
A Tower Shield that reduces speed would actually work well, as it gives you three shield options without meaningfully reducing choice due to how they interact.

Lappy9001
2013-04-11, 11:56 PM
I would strongly recommend not connecting wealth to any kind of meta game resource. Magic items do work pretty well with them though, but as of now there isn't a resource they are connected to, which is problematic. Mostly, I was clarifying a point and not endorsing one.I appreciate it!

And of a more minor note, I'm also going to be fixing the MP wording to "additional 3 MP spent," and to allow those focusing on Enchantment and Necromancy to increase the Difficulty of their Spells by augmenting with additional MP.

Lappy9001
2013-05-01, 12:24 AM
Well, I'm DMing which prioritizes my time, but I work on this on my free moments, so be assured I'm not just slacking :smalltongue:


I don't believe you've ever actually explicitly laid out the necessity of picking up the first talent before the indented ones.
The line for piercing shot technically doesn't have to come from you with the way it is currently worded, and even if it did it could shoot out in both ways.
The Light Armor talents should probably also work with no armor.
The One Handed group references Light Weapons. It should be renamed to the Light Weapons group.
Warden is a bit weird, in that it could let you take a hit from a melee strike from someone who can't even reach you or a ranged strike that has to go through someone else. If you are in space (0,0) your ally is in (0,1) and the enemy is in (0,2) it's...odd. Maybe you should have to be a valid target to begin with, and the ally can't be cover?
[/LIST]
Cool, thanks, I'll get these fixed.


Endurance is worded oddly.
Resilience doesn't specify how HP changes. Are the hit dice rerolled? Does the 3 added supersede any changes? Is it just +1/level, +3? How does this work?
Polyglot has a similar issue: Is it those already learned, those to be learned later, what?I'll work on those too, thanks!

Wild Walker might be a bit much. Becoming literally impossible to track seems excessive, and not needing rations should probably be restricted to where foraging is at least somewhat conceivable.This one surprised me as I had it pegged at 'useful for the ignore terrain bit.' 3.5 druids get trackless step at 3rd level and I've never been in a game that seriously utilized rations (even here, they're pretty much optional).


I like Speech as a skill, particularly in how competitive speech interactions play out.
[/LIST]Thanks!



Beguile is worded awkwardly.
"This Effect" in Scorch could refer to either only the burning space or the recurring damage.
Tough Hide should probably not just set claw damage at a particular level, as that is largely inconsistent with the rest of the spells.
I'll get those too. And dang, guess I forgot to fix the polymorph branch /3.5 developers.


On Equipment:

Everything needs some degree of clarification, but there are highlights.
Redescribing the heavy weapons section could help. It's really hard to take it seriously when "strength alone" is presented as all that matters for any weapon, let alone things like spears.
Reach needs to be redescribed. It's a semi-coherent sentence fragment.
Masterwork needs to be taken out of the properties that lower damage.
Ammunition is listed with the other properties despite not actually bringing the die down and existing as something that can be paired with another two. It's also unclear what happens for non-ammunition ranged weapons, and how it works in general.
A Tower Shield that reduces speed would actually work well, as it gives you three shield options without meaningfully reducing choice due to how they interact.
Yeeeeah equipment needs work. And tower shields, love it!

Mmkay, hopefully I'll have an updated version soon. I went through and found (and fixed!) quite a few typos and inconsistencies as well as things that just didn't read well, and I hope to reflect that on the online soon.

EDIT: Oh, I forgot I was going to mention this: I've been doing some serious work on monsters and it's very promising, I'll have something to show for it soon. The downside is that I don't think I'll be able to make summoning work and still keep true to my design principles for the system. It also makes me want to have acid as a damage type. The might make things wonky, though. We'll see....

Monsters will probably look like this (looks better in Word, promise):

Troll (Goblin)
Tough Monster (Giant) 5
HP: ____/ 67
Str: +5 Dex: +2 Wis: +3
Con: +5 Int: +0 Cha: +0

Initiative: +2 Perception: +3
Speed: 30 ft. Stealth: +5*

Defense: 17 Resist: -
Fort: +9 Ref: +4 Will: +5

Attack (Claw): +7 Melee
1d10 + 5 Melee

Special Attack
Frenzy
Benefit: A troll can enter a frenzied state, taking a -2 penalty to Defense, but rolling maximum damage dice with melee weapons for 3 rounds. If there are no targets left to attack during Frenzy, a troll must attack the nearest target.

Special
Darkvision
Diehard
Regeneration
Wild Walker

Skills
+7 Endurance*, +4 Nature

Phoenix Fledgling(Elemental)
Support Monster (Tiny, Flying) 3
HP: ____/ 21
Str: +0 Dex: +5 Wis: +3
Con: +2 Int: +2 Cha: +2

Initiative: +5 Perception: +4*
Speed: 30 ft. (fly) Stealth: +5

Defense: 16 Resist: Fire Immunity
Fort: +3 Ref: +6 Will: +6

Attack (Claw): +5 Melee
1d4+2 Fire

Special Attack ( / 6 MP)
Cure Wounds
Benefit: An adjacent ally recovers HP equal to twice their Level. They recover an additional 1d12 HP for every 1 MP spent on the spell.

Special
Fire Aura
Benefit: All allies within 25 ft. of a phoenix fledgling gain a +2 bonus to Fire Damage rolls per Damage Dice.

Plane Shift
Benefit: An elemental can teleport themselves and any adjacent allies to another plane of their choosing, once per day.

Skills
+2 Endurance*, +3 Perception*, +3 Nature*

Knaight
2013-05-05, 02:02 PM
I'm liking the monster stat blocks, though there's a lot on them that doesn't make sense with the information released thus far.

Lappy9001
2013-05-11, 05:49 PM
Big Update here!

Mostly Inclusive Change Log:

General
Overall formatting
Fixed numerous errors and typos
Color-Coding the four damage types (Cold, Fire, Physical, and Shock)
Dropped "ft." in favor of Squares. This is a tentative change, although it does make monsters and area effects easier.
Added in a return to Table of Contents in each post for easy browsing

Attributes
Slight change to determining Attributes, although it essentially works the same.
Added Point-Buy option
Included three standard arrays (helpful for monsters, I've found out)

The Basics
Clarified Natural Rolls and Modifiers

Actions
Clarified Free actions
Minor tweaks to Tactics

Adventuring and Exploration
Status Conditions became redundant...now just "Conditions"

Races
Clarified how racial traits are gained (this makes it easier to apply Racial Templates)
"Wildling" was meant to be "Wilden" fixed now
Added in elemental dialects for the Runic Language (Aquan, Auran, Ingan, and Terran)
Sturdy in the Dwarf section now helps mitigate poison
Elves can learn a single cantrip of choice

Classes
All classes now have Proficiency and Trained Skills listed
Cantrips are different (and 10 of them!) for mages and scale with Mage Milestones
Warrior Challenge should read better

Maneuvers and Martial Disciplines
The Base Ability in each section is now clearly stated
Changed some names, slightly.
Martial Disciplines now have flavor text
In Archery, replaced piercing shot in place of Hit and Run
Warden is left the same, while slightly unrealistic, I don't think it's going too far, and gimping it for realism would make it far less useful
Heavy/Light weapons are now Two-handed/One-handed weapons
Heavy/Light Armor no longer affect Speed or Skill penalties for armor in favor of movement denial and combat expertise
Break Concentration and Smite should now read as intended

Spells and Arcane Schools
Big changes in wording
Arcane Schools now have flavor text
Spells have range detailed in the general description
Augmenting now affects the Spell's Difficulty
Base Spell's importance is clearly spelled out
Fixed Beguile's odd wording
Jinx scales and is now more useful
Conditions from Fireball and Blizzard now last longer
Revenants created by Animate Dead persist for much longer, and give necromancers real incentive to augment their spells
Big Summoning overhall.
Teleportation as a school should be more useful.

Skills and Talents
Characters get a +1 bonus to a number of skills equal to their Intelligence at 1st level, Trained or non.
Alchemy and Mechanics now empathize Essence, which replaces Magical Components.
Profession changed the most, and Vocation breaks my rule of "no overly-specific bonuses" but if any place could use it, it's profession
Specialist moved to Knowledge and changed to Scholar
Moved some Talents around. Speech got a few changes, as did Perception.

Equipment
Fixed an embarrasing amount of typos

Weapons and Armor
Big changes to Properties and Damage Dice.
Added in sample weapons.
Shields are a part of armor, not separate. This was the original intention.

Magic Items
Alchemic Items unchanged.
Essence is the new Magical Components.
Limit on how many magical items you can benefit from imposed
Magitech Weapons added
No more Armor Magical Properties
Added in a bunch of Wondrous Items (more to come)

Lappy9001
2013-05-12, 03:35 PM
This section will be moved to "Running the Game"

Variant Rules: Classes
..........There is more than one way to play Classy d20, and listed in this section are some optional changes that can be easily implemented during a campaign. Of course, feel free to tweak existing variants, or use you own as you see fit.

Commoner
……….Not all people in the world are suited for a life of adventure. Many are unable or unwilling to risk life and limb on a daily basis in a quest for treasure or glory, and instead focus on more down-to-earth pursuits. These are the farmers, the workers, the merchants, and every day normal people.

The commoner class works slightly differently from a normal class in that each level is effectively half a level. After a commoner passes level 1, they choose mage, rogue, or warrior as their new class, starting at level 2 and gaining the appropriate Abilities. They do not, however gain any Save Bonuses, Trained Skills, Attribute Focus Abilities, or Proficiency of their new class, although they do use the new HP per Level and select their Primary Attribute from Attribute Focus.

HP at 1st Level: 8 + Constitution
HP per Level: 1d4 + Constitution

Save Bonus: +1 Fortitude, Reflex, or Will
Trained Skills: 1

Proficiency: Commoners are proficient with no weapons or armor

{table=head]
Level |
Benefit

0th | Basic Training
1st | Advanced Training
[/table]

Basic Training
Benefit: Commoners have only a rudimentary training in many walks of live, reflected in their Basic Training. At 0th level, choose one Ability from below:

Arcane Training
Benefit: You learn one cantrip of choice from the Mage class.

Martial Training
Benefit: You gain Proficiency with in a single weapon or armor group (one-handed, two-handed, ranged, light armor, heavy armor, or shields).

Skill Training
Benefit: You gain a +1 bonus to two Skills of choice.
Advanced Training
Benefit: Continuing their pursuits in life, a commoner continues to hone their Abilities. At 1st level, choose one Ability from below:

Advanced Arcane Training
Benefit: You learn one cantrip of choice from the Mage class and gain 1d4+2 Magic Points.

Advanced Martial Training
Benefit: You gain Proficiency in You gain Proficiency with in a single weapon or armor group, and gain a +1 bonus to Attack rolls.

Advanced Skill Training
Benefit: Choose an untrained skill. That skill becomes a Trained Skill. You gain a +1 bonus to two Skills of choice.


Table of Contents

Knaight
2013-05-12, 03:43 PM
Post 2)

You roll 6 dice for 6 attributes, but something is dropped. A 7th die is needed here.
12 points are allotted for attributes, but even without a dropped die the rolled system averages 15. 15 points is somewhat more reasonable (it also runs low for a number of reasons, but being able to allocate them helps with that).
"And most importantly! Twenty-sided dice (d20)" is awkwardly phrased.
I'm liking the six modifier system, but having something to cover non-weapon non-armor non-shield equipment could help. I'd also note that having the highest bonus and the highest penalty of each is probably necessary, otherwise there are problems where spells can just take bonuses out entirely by applying penalties or spell penalties can just be wiped out by applying a bonus.
Damage should probably more explicitly delineate that strength is melee only, instead of using "Strength (Melee)"

Post 5)

The temperature's are a bit odd. 150 F is ridiculously hot, vastly exceeding -25F when it comes to danger.
Poisoned seems like it might be a little heavy on the damage for low-hit die types. It also gets progressively more dangerous as levels increase, which is odd. Maybe having it equal 5 plus 2 per level damage would fix the issues.

Post 6)

Sturdy should say "one fewer HP per round".
Humans actually having a non-default status is excellent.
"Rolling maximum damage dice" is oddly worded.

Post 7)

Experience is needlessly convoluted. Divide all numbers by 50, or possibly 10. The jump from 100 to 200 is also odd, as increments of 50 really should work.
Light has several typographical errors, starting with "can move" needing an "it" and a period after squares that shouldn't be there.
"Damage Dice" should be "Damage Die" under Opportunist.
The rogue milestone wording implies both dilettante and opportunist exist on one character.

Post 8)

Adamantine Stance might be a bit excessive. A huge bonus to resisting movement (like +10) instead of immunity might work.
Mithril Fluidity has an odd name. "Fluidity" alone might work better.
Dispelling Strike doesn't specify who chooses what spell is removed.
Cleave doesn't specify whether the enemy needs to be adjacent to you or to the person struck.
Pugilist has an "unarmored" effect, not an "unarmed" one.

Post 9)

Fireball says "adjacent space" instead of "adjacent spaces" and has a redundant "its". It also needs to specify that only the center square is targeted because of the range mechanic.
How many light sources Darkness can extinguish isn't specified, and whether or not it takes the heat with it when extinguishing the light also isn't specified.
Barrier needs a +2 per additional MP at the very least, given spell scaling.
Physical is not purple in Shockwave.
Eidolan: As written, they obey your order for one minute, they don't get summoned for one minute. Whether or not you can summon a new one if the first is taken out without waiting a minute is ambiguous.
Blink is written oddly.
Spatial Recall probably should allow a will save.

Post 10

"Explosive combs" should probably be "explosive bombs".
Gemstones seem like an odd place to store essence.
Grenadier is worded in such a way that the bombs' intelligence is what matters.
Poison should probably also wear off after failed ranged attack rolls.
Athletics seems to increase speed a bit excessively (it can nearly double it). +1/2 works better, along with wording that notes that the +1/2 only really applies to double moves (-1/2 could also be used elsewhere, and interactions can help here).
Recollection needs different indentation.
Build knowledge roll difficulty into the monster or attach it to campaign specific knowledge. Otherwise, there are really bizarre stupid results which just don't make sense.
Scholar is oddly worded.
It would probably help to rename blacksmith to weaponsmith and add blacksmith to the list of professions.

Posts 11 and 12)

Carry Weight really, really doesn't work as is. Characters could easily be able to carry a maximum of 30 pounds (with 1 strength), which doesn't work particularly well. Even a really strong character with 7 strength (4, plus one per milestone) can only carry 210 pounds, and is severely slowed past 70.
There should probably be a Concealable trait for one handed weapons that makes them easy to hide.
Masterwork still needs to be moved so it doesn't reduce damage.
The halberd is an illegal weapon due to having three properties.
The default range of ranged weapons should probably be 10, not 5. 25 feet maximums just seem weird.
Ammunition needs to be moved so it doesn't reduce damage.
Long Range vastly outpowers close range.
Close range can probably afford to be better. As a second trait it is worthless (you lose 1 damage to gain it), and given that ranged damage starts low it's not like 2 or 3 damage is excessive.


General)

Hit Points and Magic Points should probably also allow a deterministic increase. It should be slightly over half, to account for the two rolls.
There is some weirdness to bolding and indentation for talents, maneuvers, and spells. Specifically, the talents, maneuvers, and spells themselves don't stand out, only the effects.
Increment's don't appear to ever actually be spelled out.
It might make sense for there to be more thorough dodging of spells (that is to say, moving out of the squares if you succeed on a reflex save). The areas are generally small enough that this makes sense.
Weapon damage scaling seems pretty slow in a few ways. Having attack points also affect damage could help with this, as could adding another die (two with Ammunition) every so often (say, levels 5 and 10).
Mounts: We still need this, somehow.


To get more than this, I'd need to look into play testing it. I do have concerns regarding attack scaling vs. defense scaling, utility of equipment, etc, but that involves either more number crunching than I really want to do or playtesting.

Lappy9001
2013-05-13, 10:25 PM
Oh Knaight, what would I do without you? :smallcool:



You roll 6 dice for 6 attributes, but something is dropped. A 7th die is needed here.
12 points are allotted for attributes, but even without a dropped die the rolled system averages 15. 15 points is somewhat more reasonable (it also runs low for a number of reasons, but being able to allocate them helps with that).I'm still working out the kinks on the attributes, numerically. 15 sounds good; tomorrow's my edit day, I'll test it out a bit more then. I'm actually having a problem with scores being waaay too high (like, four +4 stats) which is why it's kinda on the low side.


"And most importantly! Twenty-sided dice (d20)" is awkwardly phrased.Yeah, I can see that :smalltongue:


I'm liking the six modifier system, but having something to cover non-weapon non-armor non-shield equipment could help. I'd also note that having the highest bonus and the highest penalty of each is probably necessary, otherwise there are problems where spells can just take bonuses out entirely by applying penalties or spell penalties can just be wiped out by applying a bonus.Thank you, trying to keep things simple. That's a great idea! I'll do some testing.


Damage should probably more explicitly delineate that strength is melee only, instead of using "Strength (Melee)"Ah, thanks.


The temperature's are a bit odd. 150 F is ridiculously hot, vastly exceeding -25F when it comes to danger.Yeah, I'll actually do my research for this one.


Poisoned seems like it might be a little heavy on the damage for low-hit die types. It also gets progressively more dangerous as levels increase, which is odd. Maybe having it equal 5 plus 2 per level damage would fix the issues.Well, you know, I want Conditions to remain relevant, especially since there's some builds that pretty much just do that (that's why there is no "remove one condition" Spell or whatever. The dwarf ability to cure one and the warrior ability to suppress it makes them quite powerful). I'll work with those numbers, though, see what comes of it.


Sturdy should say "one fewer HP per round".Ah, thanks for the catch.


Humans actually having a non-default status is excellent.Thanks, love it when my ideas work as intended :smallcool:


"Rolling maximum damage dice" is oddly worded.Ah, it kinda is, thanks.


Experience is needlessly convoluted. Divide all numbers by 50, or possibly 10. The jump from 100 to 200 is also odd, as increments of 50 really should work.
Light has several typographical errors, starting with "can move" needing an "it" and a period after squares that shouldn't be there.
"Damage Dice" should be "Damage Die" under Opportunist.
The rogue milestone wording implies both dilettante and opportunist exist on one character.
Adamantine Stance might be a bit excessive. A huge bonus to resisting movement (like +10) instead of immunity might work.
Mithril Fluidity has an odd name. "Fluidity" alone might work better.
Dispelling Strike doesn't specify who chooses what spell is removed.
Cleave doesn't specify whether the enemy needs to be adjacent to you or to the person struck.
Pugilist has an "unarmored" effect, not an "unarmed" one.Good catches all, thanks.


Fireball says "adjacent space" instead of "adjacent spaces" and has a redundant "its". It also needs to specify that only the center square is targeted because of the range mechanic.Cool, thanks.


How many light sources Darkness can extinguish isn't specified, and whether or not it takes the heat with it when extinguishing the light also isn't specified.I'll specify it, thanks.


Barrier needs a +2 per additional MP at the very least, given spell scaling.Mmm, thanks. I went a bit far with that one.


Physical is not purple in Shockwave.I figured I'd miss a few of those. What do you think of the change btw? Useful, unnecessary, or something else?


Eidolan: As written, they obey your order for one minute, they don't get summoned for one minute. Whether or not you can summon a new one if the first is taken out without waiting a minute is ambiguous.Mmm, I'll tighten that wording up.


Blink is written oddly.
Spatial Recall probably should allow a will save.
I'll get those too.


"Explosive combs" should probably be "explosive bombs".Ah, but it is essential for the Rouge class.


Gemstones seem like an odd place to store essence.You think so? I was trying not to blatantly rip off Elder Scrolls soul gems.


Grenadier is worded in such a way that the bombs' intelligence is what matters.Yeah, I'm trying to make them scale to the user. May have not been the best implementation.


Poison should probably also wear off after failed ranged attack rolls.Dang, fell through the cracks!


Athletics seems to increase speed a bit excessively (it can nearly double it). +1/2 works better, along with wording that notes that the +1/2 only really applies to double moves (-1/2 could also be used elsewhere, and interactions can help here).One and a half, normally (unless you're a short race). This is a personal bias, as I love characters with high move speeds. High mobility is also a pretty big focus of Classy d20. Perhaps if I change the name? (I can see how Sprint gives the wrong meaning)


Recollection needs different indentation.


Build knowledge roll difficulty into the monster or attach it to campaign specific knowledge. Otherwise, there are really bizarre stupid results which just don't make sense.But of course :smallwink: (another personal bias here, I also love making Knowledge skills relevant)


[LIST] Scholar is oddly worded.
It would probably help to rename blacksmith to weaponsmith and add blacksmith to the list of professions.[/LISTI'll work on 'em!


Carry Weight really, really doesn't work as is. Characters could easily be able to carry a maximum of 30 pounds (with 1 strength), which doesn't work particularly well. Even a really strong character with 7 strength (4, plus one per milestone) can only carry 210 pounds, and is severely slowed past 70.It's bad, I know. I'll work on fixing it.


There should probably be a Concealable trait for one handed weapons that makes them easy to hide.Awesome idea :smallcool:


Masterwork still needs to be moved so it doesn't reduce damage.

Ammunition needs to be moved so it doesn't reduce damage.Masterwork and Ammunition don't affect damage? :smallconfused:


The halberd is an illegal weapon due to having three properties.It has a slash, implying that you can build it multiple ways (of course, you could anyway. Rapiers and shortswords have it too, but I'll clarify.


The default range of ranged weapons should probably be 10, not 5. 25 feet maximums just seem weird.Looked it up, you're totally right!


Long Range vastly outpowers close range.

Close range can probably afford to be better. As a second trait it is worthless (you lose 1 damage to gain it), and given that ranged damage starts low it's not like 2 or 3 damage is excessive.
I'll look into this


Hit Points and Magic Points should probably also allow a deterministic increase. It should be slightly over half, to account for the two rolls.It used to in the last draft, I forgot to add it back in.


There is some weirdness to bolding and indentation for talents, maneuvers, and spells. Specifically, the talents, maneuvers, and spells themselves don't stand out, only the effects.It looks fine to me, but that's prolly because I look at it too much. I'll experiment with the formatting.


Increment's don't appear to ever actually be spelled out.I've lost a few things in the transfer over it seems...I'll go find those and put them back in.


It might make sense for there to be more thorough dodging of spells (that is to say, moving out of the squares if you succeed on a reflex save). The areas are generally small enough that this makes sense.Brilliant, I love it! :smallcool:


Weapon damage scaling seems pretty slow in a few ways. Having attack points also affect damage could help with this, as could adding another die (two with Ammunition) every so often (say, levels 5 and 10).

To get more than this, I'd need to look into play testing it. I do have concerns regarding attack scaling vs. defense scaling, utility of equipment, etc, but that involves either more number crunching than I really want to do or playtesting.I actually did some reasonably thorough number crunching and they held up for a decently built character, and moderately for a less-well build character (attack vs defense anyway)...but that was on an earlier draft. I'll work on it again; I like the idea regardless.


Mounts: We still need this, somehow.They're in the next Variant rules section. In case you're wondering, they are: Variant Rules: Gameplay and Variant Rules: Races, btw (Variant Classes has more to be added to it, as you may have guessed). Monsters are next, and they are quite the monumental effort :smallsigh:

As always, I thoroughly appreciate your assistance and welcome any and all critique and opinions :smallcool:

Knaight
2013-05-14, 12:52 AM
Oh Knaight, what would I do without you?:smallcool:
Presumably a lot more of your own proofreading.:smallwink:


Well, you know, I want Conditions to remain relevant, especially since there's some builds that pretty much just do that (that's why there is no "remove one condition" Spell or whatever. The dwarf ability to cure one and the warrior ability to suppress it makes them quite powerful). I'll work with those numbers, though, see what comes of it.
The issue is how it grows in relevance, with poison being much less dangerous the lower level one is. Which is...odd.


I figured I'd miss a few of those. What do you think of the change btw? Useful, unnecessary, or something else?
I find that it helps, currently. It does look odd, and it probably could be handled better (maybe a color change for the title of the ability?), but that's a minor aesthetic problem at most.


Yeah, I'm trying to make them scale to the user. May have not been the best implementation.
The implementation looks fine. The issue is in the wording, as it references the intelligence of the bomb and not the intelligence of the bomber.


One and a half, normally (unless you're a short race). This is a personal bias, as I love characters with high move speeds. High mobility is also a pretty big focus of Classy d20. Perhaps if I change the name? (I can see how Sprint gives the wrong meaning)
My worry is more that mobility is worth a lot, and getting +4 to move on top of a bunch of other stuff is potentially overpowered. +2 to move really isn't, as much.


Masterwork and Ammunition don't affect damage? :smallconfused:
A masterwork weapon probably shouldn't do less damage, right now they do. The same thing applies to a weapon that uses ammunition, though perhaps to a lesser extent.


They're in the next Variant rules section. In case you're wondering, they are: Variant Rules: Gameplay and Variant Rules: Races, btw (Variant Classes has more to be added to it, as you may have guessed). Monsters are next, and they are quite the monumental effort :smallsigh:
Excellent.

Lappy9001
2013-05-14, 09:26 AM
Presumably a lot more of your own proofreading.:smallwink:We can't have that, now! :smalltongue:


The issue is how it grows in relevance, with poison being much less dangerous the lower level one is. Which is...odd.Right, duly noted.


I find that it helps, currently. It does look odd, and it probably could be handled better (maybe a color change for the title of the ability?), but that's a minor aesthetic problem at most.I'll experiment around with it today.


The implementation looks fine. The issue is in the wording, as it references the intelligence of the bomb and not the intelligence of the bomber.Ooooh, I see now. Apparently my system does have intelligent magic items.


My worry is more that mobility is worth a lot, and getting +4 to move on top of a bunch of other stuff is potentially overpowered. +2 to move really isn't, as much.If it makes a difference, it's only +3 from Sprint. The Base Talent isn't added in (unless that clause didn't get transferred over either :smallsigh:) Good, it's still there.

I think the most you can get right now is 12 Squares with a Hasted halfling in light/no armor. (5 Base, +2 Underfoot, +3 Sprint, +2 Hasted). I think I might give halflings a +2 with Underfoot instead of changing the base speed. That may get wonky. I gotta work out the math anyhow.


A masterwork weapon probably shouldn't do less damage, right now they do. The same thing applies to a weapon that uses ammunition, though perhaps to a lesser extent.Oh, I understand what you mean now. They're mostly there due to a lack of Properties. Now that I've got more, they can be added on separately.

Gonna fix the Table of Contents while I still have internet. I won't for the next 12 hours, so that's when I'll work on those changes, and I'll implement them possibly tomorrow...depends on how much time I have when I get off work.

Lappy9001
2013-05-24, 01:59 AM
Well, this is a great example of why I should never give myself deadlines, like ever. Anyway, I've worked out a few of the fiddly bits like poison, experience, and modifiers (and realized I forgot to include the Damage section entirely). You add 1/2 level to Defense, which I had been doing for a while, but apparently forgot to include! More tweaks to come.

What I have done is some testing on Attack and Defense, and it holds up fairly well as levels increase. Generally, a roll of 10-12 is what you'd need to hit a character that has been reasonably optimized against yourself. The only time where I really forsee trouble is something like a Rogue with no Maneuvers or offensive Spells. However, a character like this probably isn't meant to be an attacker anyway.

One thing I like is that Light Armor/Dexterity is superior to Heavy Armor/Shield by a small bit (like +1-3), however, Heavy Armor/Shield beats it out by a good +3-4 when using the Defend tactic.

As-is, I'm okay with Attributes how they are. 12 point buy or the chance to roll to get slightly higher (with 15) or lower (with 10). Either way, it's not too much of an advantage or disadvantage.

Right now, Classy d20 is in that awkward section where a lot of projects die; where you have thrown all your awesome ideas into a compilation and enter a state of constant fine-tuning and editing. Which is a large reason why things are slow, and I do apologize for this. I might have to save a post for the next two Variant Rules sections because they're in a state of re-working. Monsters are more promising, however, and I want to get that pushed out soon.

Current plan is to finish these last bit of tweaks, and see if I can get Variant Races and Variant Gameplay out, otherwise I'll just move on to monsters.

Knaight
2013-06-09, 09:41 AM
A few quick comments:

Poison appears to work well.
The phrase "maximum damage dice" is a bit off.
I'm liking experience. Keeping the 5-10 etc. does work well as a flavor nod, while also getting numbers to where they are more reasonable.
The problems regarding equipment modifiers which reduce damage but shouldn't (e.g. masterwork) is still here.
"Thieve's Cloak should be Thief's cloak in the table.


Also, I'm looking forward to the new stuff.

Lappy9001
2013-06-12, 12:12 AM
Out-of-date material.

Variant Rules: Gameplay
..........There is more than one way to play Classy d20, and listed in this section are some optional changes that can be easily implemented during a campaign. Of course, feel free to tweak existing variants, or use you own as you see fit.

Active Initiative
……….Reflecting a more chaotic combat, active initiative is a simple variant that makes combat less static, and benefits characters who have invested in high Dexterity and Initiative. At the start of each round, all combatants roll Initiative as if combat has just started and use the new results. Initiative is rerolled at the beginning of every round. Active Initiative can be used on its own, or as a part of the gritty combat variant.

Gritty Combat
……….In many genres like video games and movies, it’s common to see to see combatants throwing others through a building or tearing up a city street during a fight. The premise of gritty combat is that characters and monsters can mostly shrug off normal amounts of damage, but a single might assault (often from a Critical Hit) can overwhelm them completely.

Threshold
……….A character’s threshold is a number equal to ˝ their Hit Points (rounded down). If a character takes damage equal to their threshold in a single round, they are pushed back 2 Squares (away from the attacker) and roll on the injury table (see the Injuries section below). Characters that succeed a Fortitude save of 10 + ˝ the total damage dealt to them that round, are only pushed back 1 Square and do not suffer an injury. Total Hit Points below 0 and Damage negated through resistance is not counted towards a character’s threshold.

Collateral Damage
……….After being pushed, if a character collides with a creature or a solid object (an object that takes up roughly 1 Square of space or more), both take 1d8 Physical damage for every Square the character was pushed back. If there is no available space for a character to be pushed back, they take Physical damage equal for each Square they would have been pushed back. This damage does not count as a hazard.

Solid objects are hardier than living creatures, and are only destroyed is their Hit Points are completely overcome. This represents a single assault that demolished an object, or several attempts at chipping away at the material. If an object taking up a single Square loses all of its Hit Points in a single round, the object is destroyed, and the Square it occupied becomes Difficult Terrain. If this happens to an object taking up more than 1 Square of space, only the Square that was hit is destroyed. Any effect that targets Squares of space effects all objects within.

{table=head]
Material|
Hit Points|
Example

Fragile Object |
5|Padded cloth, leather, thick glass, ice sheet

Average |
10|Treated leather, wooden furniture

Tough |
25|Thick ice

Durable |
50|Solid wood, thin iron or stone

Unyielding |
100|Solid iron or stone[/table]

Injuries
……….Injuries are intended to make combat somewhat more visceral, with damage to characters being reflected in more than simply Hit Point loss. The most common way that characters acquire injuries is by taking damage over their Threshold, although some spells produce similar effects. Injuries work just like Conditions, except that injuries last until the Condition is treated. Whenever a character rolls on the injury table, they roll 1d6 and take the result as shown on the table below:

{table=head]
Roll|
Injury|
Condition

1 | No Injury | -

2 | Broken Bone | Slowed

3 | Eye Injury | Blinded

4 | Head Trauma | Demoralized

5 | Heavy Bleeding | Poisoned

6 | Painful Wound | Weakened[/table]

New Abilities
……….These Abilities are meant to be used with this variant rule set, and replace existing Abilities. When replaced in this manner, a character can never take the Ability they traded out for.

First Aid
Benefit: You can relieve an adjacent ally of a single Condition (other than Dying) as a Major action a number of times per day equal to your Intelligence.
(Replaces Grenadier or Mix Poison)

Knockback
Benefit: After a successful melee attack, you may push an enemy away from you in a direction of your choosing up to 2 Squares ad a Minor action. Targets that succeed a Fortitude save ignore this effect. Furthermore, if you damage a character over their Threshold, you can push them back an additional Square for every 3 AP you possess.
(Replaces Knockback)

Harm
Benefit: An enemy affected by Necrosis must succeed a Fortitude save or roll on the injury table.
(Replaces Darkness or Enervate)
Mounted Combat
……….This variant rule reflects fights that take place on horseback (or with other more exotic steeds) as opposed to a character on foot. A character can ride a mount that is of Large size or bigger, and can control their mount with the Nature skill. Your mount acts on your turn under your Initiative result, and you move with your mount’s Speed. Add your mount’s carrying capacity to your own.

New Abilities
……….These Abilities are meant to be used with this variant rule set, and replace existing Abilities. When replaced in this manner, a character can never take the Ability they traded out for.

Mounted Archer
Benefit: You can use the Charge Tactic with a Ranged attack when riding a mount.
(Replaces Hit and Run)

Faithful Steed
Benefit: You gain a special Familiar that can be ridden as a mount.
(Replaces Beast Friend)

Shared Strength
Benefit: While riding a mount, you ignore Difficult Terrain, and any beneficial effect that affects you, also affects your mount.
(Replaces Wild Walker)

Coming Soon:
New Damage Types: Acid and Sonic

Lappy9001
2013-06-12, 12:32 AM
Out-of-date material.

Variant Rules: Races
..........Perfect for players who want to play something more exotic or unusual than an elf or a dwarf, Racial Templates alter the way a Race is played, and grant new strengths and weaknesses to a character. A Racial Template is applied to a Race and swaps out many of its characteristics. Only one racial template may be applied at a time.

Attributes: The base race’s Attribute Bonus changes to this.
Speed: Reduce or Increase the base race’s Speed by this amount.
Skill: Replace a Skill Bonus with this Skill, or if the Skill is already possessed, increase it to +2, and lose the other Skill Bonus.
Minor Ability: Replace the base race’s Minor Ability.
Major Ability: Replace the base race’s Major Ability.
Languages: Adds to known languages.

Aasimar
..........There exist a rare few in the world who have been blessed by celestials. Often, a blessing is bestowed by an angel as a gift in return for a selfless deed, or to an individual favored by destiny. Aasimar have a natural empathy towards others, and while not all are virtuous, most do devote themselves to a just cause. The birth of an aasimar is seen as a good omen, and the gift can be passed down family lines. Aasimar look like a member of their native race, but with subtle angelic features such as white or gold hair, and can surround themselves with a halo of light.

(Minor) Halo: You learn the Light cantrip from the mage class.
(Major) Healing Touch: As a Minor action, an adjacent ally either recovers HP equal to twice your level plus your Primary Attribute, or is relieved of a single Condition (other than Dying).

Deep-Dweller
..........Far beneath the earth in subterranean cave complexes live those who have adapted to the darkness below. Physically similar to their above ground cousins, deep-dwellers tend to have dusky skin, sometimes pure black, white or silver hair, and white or gold eyes that emit a low glow in darkness. Deep-dwellers tend to be quieter, more wary, and possess more patience than those that live in the light. While uncommon, deep-dwellers find their own reasons to emerging from the depths of the earth, and bring a unique outlook to the world above.

(Skill) +1 Stealth
(Minor) Darkvision: You can see without any light sources (albeit without color) and ignore Concealment from darkness. You take a -2 penalty to Perception rolls when in direct sunlight.
(Languages) Deep-Dwellers speak Underword.

Graveborn
..........When a rare mortal with a strong will is slain with unfinished business, they may arise from the grave to complete in death what they could not in life. However, this second life has consequences, and graveborn are cursed in that they cling onto the barest spark of life, and remember almost nothing of their former selves except their unfinished tasks. Rising usually within a week of death, graveborn reveal significant decay, but vaguely resemble their former selves, albeit with glowing, determined eyes and a grave pallor.

(Speed) -1 Square
(Minor) Curse of the Grave: Graveborn only recover half the amount from any effect that restores Hit Points.
(Major) Undead Resiliency: Graveborn do not need to eat, drink, breathe, or sleep but must still take a Rest to recover abilities. Graveborn are immune to the Blinded, Poisoned, Slowed, and Weakened status conditions, and do not lose 1 HP per round when Dying.

Half-Blood
..........Most of the civilized races stem from a common ancestor, and a union between two different races results in a half-blooded child. Depending on the half-blood’s environment and upbringing, their dual heritage can be a gift or a burden, and is often both. Half-bloods blend the physical features of both parents and is identified with the name of both races (such as a human half-elf, or a dwarven half-orc). The dual heritage of a half-blood only lasts for one generation, a union with a full-blood will result in a full-blood of either race.

Creating a half-blood uses one race as a chassis (called the base race) with another (called the half-race).

(Skill) Replace one skill from the base race with one of the half-race, or increase a shared skill to +2, and lose the other skill bonuses.
(Minor) Replace the base race’s minor ability with the half-race’s minor ability.
(Languages) Gain the language of the half-race.

Plane Touched
..........The movements and phases of the planes can cause strange phenomenon in the physical realm. Those born when the planes align in certain positions often possess the traits of a particular element. This manifestation greatly changes a plane touched’s appearance depending on their favored element, from differently brightly colored skin and hair, glowing eyes, unusually high or low body temperature, and strange runes that cover the body. Plane touched have naturally powerful personalities and are adept at bending the elements to their will.

(Attribute) +1 Charisma
(Minor) Elemental Soul: Plane Touched gain a +3 bonus to Resistance against Cold, Fire, or Shock Damage.
(Languages) Plane Touched speak Runic.

Tiefling
..........Some souls are cursed by the demons long before their soul departs their body. Tieflings have little control of their heritage, passed on from an ancestor, most commonly through a demonic pact or a dark blessing to a favored minion. The birth of a tielfing is considered an evil omen, and many tieflings born to superstitious parents are abandoned at a young age. However, the fate of a tiefling is their own to decide and have no natural predisposition to good or evil. Tieflings look like their native race, but with subtle demonic features like red eyes or small horns.

(Minor) Darkvision: You can see without any light sources (albeit without color) and ignore Concealment from darkness. You take a -2 penalty to Perception rolls when in direct sunlight.
(Major) Curse: As a Minor action you can inflict an enemy within 5 Squares with a penalty equal to ˝ your level (minimum 1) to Attack, Damage, Save, or Skill rolls. The curse lasts for 1 minute.

Coming Soon:
Playing a Monster

Kornaki
2013-07-09, 07:53 PM
Hey, I'm going to try to run a roll20 game with some friends with this system and have a couple questions (and thought it might be a boost of support to know someone else is using it!)

For the warrior's indomitable ability.... if I get poisoned and use it, am I just delaying that poison damage or is the poison gone and I can't be poisoned for X rounds, after which I can be poisoned again? It seems like it should be the former but the word immune is weirding me out.

Also for the magical essences that you get off of creatures - does every single person drop one of those when they die (like if you kill a commoner are you expected to get an essence? and which one?)

I really liked the simplicity and versatility of the classes which is why I recommended it to the group. Awesome work!

EDIT TO ADD: Also a player pointed out that the heavy armor base maneuver is +1 physical resistance for every 1 AP, while most maneuvers give a +1 to something for every 3 AP - is this intentional?

Haha one last one (maybe): the piercing one handed ability - if you have two properties so base 1d4 weapon damage, does it still increase the damage for precision to 1d8?

Also found a typo I think: Under heavy armor it say "Characters cannot add their Dexterity to their Defense when using a shield ". Since this rule is repeated under the shield section, I assume it is meant to say when using heavy armor

Also there's no Natural Healing and Rest section under Adventuring and Exploration as the table of contents promises

Lappy9001
2013-07-25, 06:44 PM
Hey, I'm going to try to run a roll20 game with some friends with this system and have a couple questions (and thought it might be a boost of support to know someone else is using it!)That's very flattering, and yes it is, thank you! I need to get cracking with some updates. Heads up, as one thing I've found about using an unfinished system, it can get weird if things are changed. Races/Classes are pretty much set at this point as are most abilities. Magic Items/components/essence and all that are going to be changed for a much more simplistic system (Alchemy and Mechanics will be tweaked slightly). Magic may have a very slight update to wording, but will essentially be the same.


For the warrior's indomitable ability.... if I get poisoned and use it, am I just delaying that poison damage or is the poison gone and I can't be poisoned for X rounds, after which I can be poisoned again? It seems like it should be the former but the word immune is weirding me out.Both, sort of. You take no effects from poison, basically ignoring it until for the duration of Indomitable. Although if poison outlasts Indomitable, you're still poisoned. You can use Indomitable again, however but it will (now updated) use up a Minor action. It's sort of like a limited immunity.


Also for the magical essences that you get off of creatures - does every single person drop one of those when they die (like if you kill a commoner are you expected to get an essence? and which one?)Magical creatures only. It may sound like a cop out to say 'don't worry about it' but an update will make essense (at least components) less important, even removed entirely.


I really liked the simplicity and versatility of the classes which is why I recommended it to the group. Awesome work!Thanks :smallcool:


EDIT TO ADD: Also a player pointed out that the heavy armor base maneuver is +1 physical resistance for every 1 AP, while most maneuvers give a +1 to something for every 3 AP - is this intentional?Yeah, since +3 for every 3 AP seems unnecessary and unfairly stiffs rogues and mages.


Haha one last one (maybe): the piercing one handed ability - if you have two properties so base 1d4 weapon damage, does it still increase the damage for precision to 1d8?Ah, updated so that you can only have 2 different properties. Thanks for the catch.


Also found a typo I think: Under heavy armor it say "Characters cannot add their Dexterity to their Defense when using a shield ". Since this rule is repeated under the shield section, I assume it is meant to say when using heavy armorThe intent is correct, although the wording is wrong. You can't add Dex for either Heavy Armor or Shield.


Also there's no Natural Healing and Rest section under Adventuring and Exploration as the table of contents promisesI lost it with a re-write and forgot to add it back in (it's there now). I need to fix the table of contents in general.

Lappy9001
2013-08-08, 01:34 PM
Building Monsters
Below is the template, monster traits, and some advice for using and creating monsters in Classy d20:

Sample Template:
Monster Name (Type)
Role (Giant, Tiny, or Unliving, if necessary) Level
HP: ____/ 000
Str: +0 Dex: +0 Wis: +0
Con: +0 Int: +0 Cha: +0

Initiative: +0 Perception: +0
Speed: 00 Stealth: +0*

Defense: 00 Resist: - (Cold, Fire, Physical, or Shock)
Fort: +0 Ref: +0 Will: +0

Immune: -
Weakness: -

Attack (Bite/Claw/Slam/Weapon ; Properties): +0 Melee/Ranged
0d00 + 0 Cold, Fire, Physical, Shock

Special Attack
Ability
Description

Special Qualities
Ability
Description

Special Traits
Ability

Skills
+0*, +0 (The * denotes Trained Skills)

Equipment
Armor, Tools, Weapons

Languages
None

Sample Template (HTML):
Monster Name (Type)
Role (Giant, Tiny, or Unliving, if necessary) Level
HP: ____/ 000
Str: +0 Dex: +0 Wis: +0
Con: +0 Int: +0 Cha: +0

Initiative: +0 Perception: +0
Speed: 00 Stealth: +0*

Defense: 00 Resist: - (Cold, Fire, Physical, or Shock)
Fort: +0 Ref: +0 Will: +0

Immune: -
Weakness: -

Attack (Bite/Claw/Slam/Weapon ; Properties): +0 Melee/Ranged
0d00 + 0 Cold, Fire, Physical, Shock

Special Attack
Ability
Description

Special Qualities
Ability
Description

Special Traits
Ability

Skills
+0*, +0 (The * denotes Trained Skills)

Equipment
Armor, Tools, Weapons

Languages
None[/HTML]

Basics
Monsters use the same Attribute arrays as PC's, and have access to the same Skills and Combat Tactics. Otherwise, they follow different rules, as detailed in Monster Type and Monster Roles below.



Average: +0, +1, +2, +2, +3, +4

Balanced: +1, +2, +2, +2, +2, +3

Specialized: +0, +1, +1, +3, +3, +4

Role or Class
Choosing between a role or class limits what Abilities the monster has access to. Classes use Maneuvers, Talents, and Spells, while roles use Traits exclusively. Monster roles best represent a monster that has honed their natural abilities or a monster that cannot normally train to cast spells or use weapons. Monsters who level up by class will have a very different "feel" in that their abilities are on par with the PC's. However, their monstrous origin will still remain due to the bonus traits they receive through their monster type.

Complexity and Challenge
While there is a time and a place for a monster that is simply tough and hits hard until the PC's make it fall down first, most monsters should be unique and present different challenges. However, it is equally important that a monster isn't too complex. Try to limit powers (like Special Attacks) to a minimum, because a monster will only have so much time to use an ability before being slain by (or slaying) the PC's.

Leveling a Monster
Each level, a monster receives one trait, so choosing how high the monster's level should be is simple, just consider what abilities you want the monster to have then level them until they have all of those abilities.

For example, say you wanted to make a troll. It needs to be big, strong, and tough, as well as having regenerative abilities and rending claws. Start off with the Goblin type, choosing Giant as its 1st level trait, then Permanant Condition (Regeneration) at 2nd level. Afterwards, perhaps Improved Natural Weapon or Improved Hit Points to make the monster suitably tough.

Getting Creative
Don't restrict your creativity when building a monster. Just because you may expect dragons to be giant quadrupedal flying lizards, but there's no reason why you couldn't create an aquatic humanoid race of dragons who are skilled at healing. Monsters can be as wacky or realistic as your campaign demands. With these considerations you may want to use a unique monster trait:


Special Ability [Custom]
This is a custom power or ability.

The Special Ability monster trait can effectively represent any sort of ability and is best used sparingly. Often, the trait is an ability completely unique to the monster, or represents an concept that is not well-implemented by the existing abilities. Special Ability can also be used to replicate the effects of a Maneuver, Talent, Spell, but does not grant Attack Points, Skill Points, or Magic Points.

Monster Types
As players guide and control their characters further into the world, they will undoubtedly encounter many strange, wondrous, and dangerous creatures along the way. Monsters are creatures other than the main races, including beasts both magical and mundane, fey bound to the forces of nature, mighty dragons, undead monstrosities, and beings of living nightmare. Although monsters are by nature different from player characters, they are created and level up in a very similar fashion.

Monsters are divided into several categories called monster types. All monsters use the Base Monster as a chassis, and they add in more specific bonuses. Often, monsters don't use weapons, and instead use their own natural weapons (bite, claws, slam, etc.), and these work like the Natural Weapon property, in that monsters can add their Dexterity to Attack rolls instead of Strength. The monster's role (see below) determines the damage their natural weapon deals.

Base Monster
This is the base for which all monsters are built. Monsters use the following modifiers to their stats, and then select a type (in the case of a compound type, they can only select one). Each type provides a bonus trait selected at level 1, as well as languages that the monster knows.

Attribute: +1 Any, -1 Any
Speed: 5 Squares
Skill: +2 Any


Animal
Animals are the beasts of the world, both natural and magical, and typically have no motivations greater than basic survival instincts.

Bonus Trait: Any
Languages: None

Construct
Any unnatural being that has been physically constructed by another creature, and includes machines, various undead, golems, and other creations.

Bonus Trait: Unliving
Languages: None

Dragon
Unique magical beasts with elemental affinities, dragons are powerful reptiles that increase in power as they grow in size.

Bonus Trait: Energy Blast
Languages: Draconic

Elemental
Spirits physically composed of energy from the four planes, elementals are fey beings that often act in the interest of the natural order.

Bonus Trait: Elemental Immunity
Languages: Runic

Goblin
Deadly demi-humanoids that adapt and evolve, goblins seek out violence and hostile environments to quickly grow into more powerful forms and possess no empathy for other life forms.

Bonus Trait: Frenzy
Languages: Goblin

Humanoid
Any member close to the common races that for whatever reason levels up as a monster instead of a class. This includes undead raised from the common races, beastfolk (humanoid/animal hybrids), and cursed individuals (such as lycanthropes).

Bonus Trait: Any
Languages: (Pick one) Common, Dwarven, Elven, Goblin, Wilden

Outsider
Whereas elementals are beings native to all the planes, outsiders are beings not native to the physical plane in particular. The most common members of this type are the celestials, benevolent spirits who seek to guide and protect mortals, and fiends, malovent beings determined to terrorize, seduce, and manipulate mortals into their own ends.

Bonus Trait: Plane Shift
Languages: Common, Runic

Plant
Living plants capable of performing actions, plants are often watchful guardians or active hunters.

Bonus Trait: Condition Immunity
Languages: Wilden

Monster Roles
Monsters fall into three roles that work similarly to a character’s class. Just like PC’s, monsters gain power through their roles, although some rare monsters do take levels in a class. Every monster gains the following bonuses:


Attribute Bonus: +1 bonus to Primary Attribute and +1 to another Attribute. A monster gains this ability every even level.
Attack Bonus: +˝ level
Damage Bonus: +˝ level
Defense Bonus: +˝ level
Save Bonus: +˝ level
Trained Skill Bonus: +˝ level


Quick Monster
Quick monsters are extremely fast, designed for hit-and-run style fighting or for ambush tactics. Often, quick monsters attack opponents as soon as combat begins, allowing other monsters to ready their own actions.


HP per Level: 8
Natural Weapon: 1d6
Save Bonus (1st level) +2 Reflex
Trained Skills: 3
Every Odd Level: +1 Initiative bonus, +1 Speed bonus

Support Monster
Support monsters are generally poor frontline fighters, and are instead more suited to buffing allies and distracting opponents. Sometimes support monsters serve the role of artillery, blasting enemies from far away.


HP per Level: 6
Natural Weapon: 1d4
Save Bonus (1st level) +2 Will
Trained Skills: 4
Every Odd Level: +1 bonus to a single Skill of choice, +1 use of a trait with daily uses

Tough Monster
Tough monsters are built to take opponents head on and are capable of both dealing and absorbing significant damage. Tough monsters can sometimes engage a party on their own, or protect weaker monsters.


HP per Level: 10
Natural Weapon: 1d8
Save Bonus (1st level): +2 Fortitude
Trained Skills: 2
Every Odd Level: +1 Attack bonus, +1 Defense bonus

Weak Monster
Weak monsters have poor offense and defense alike, and are usually only dangerous in large groups. All weak monsters possess the minion weakness, meaning that they can often be taken down in a single attack, allowing for encounters with hordes of weak monsters.


HP per Level: 4
Natural Weapon: 1d4
Save Bonus (1st level): +1 Any
Trained Skills: 2
1st Level: A weak monster gains the Minion weakness, but does not gain a bonus trait this way (unless the monster takes 2 additional weaknesses).



Table of Contents

Lappy9001
2013-08-08, 03:14 PM
Monster Traits
Traits are the natural and magical Abilities of beasts, spirits, and anything monstrous. Traits are divided into 3 main categories, and 2 sub-categories. The main categories are Special Attacks which are activated abilities with a limited use, Special Qualities which are passive abilities, and Special Traits that normally provide bonuses to attack, defense, saves, etc. The sub-categories are Weaknesses that are flaws in a monster's defenses, and Minor Traits which are effectively traits that can be taken without penalty. The effects of traits do not stack with a bonus or penalty from the same trait. For example, a player with a -2 penalty from a monster's curse, could not take the same penalty again from the curse ability until the initial effect wears off.

Adding a trait to a monster is a simple act of copying the trait and it's description, and filling any need information unique to the monster (which are shown in parentheses). So, for a 3rd level fire-breathing red dragon with a Primary Attribute of 5, the Energy Blast trait would turn this:


Energy Blast
Daily Use: ___ / (˝ Primary Attribute)
Difficulty: (10 + ˝ level + Primary Attribute)
As a major action, a (monster) can target a Square and its adjacent space, dealing (1 + ˝ level)d8 (Cold, Fire, Physical, or Shock) damage to all targets in the area. Targets that succeed a (Fortitude, Reflex, or Will) save take half damage.

Into this:


Dragon's Breath (Energy Blast)
Daily Use: ___ / 2
Difficulty: 16
As a major action, a red dragon can target a Square and its adjacent space, dealing 2d8 Fire damage to all targets in the area. Targets that succeed a Reflex save take half damage.

When assigning a monster a trait, feel free to change the name of any trait to better suit the monster's 'feel'. For example a dragon's breath would likely fall under the Energy Blast trait. To rename it Dragon's Breath, have the trait read Dragon's Breath (Energy Blast) in the monster's description. The (parenthesis) are essential to know what traits have been assigned to a monster.

Special Attack
While not necessarily an attack, traits categorized as Special Attacks are abilities that must be actived by the monster in order to be used. Unless otherwise noted, a Special Attack has a range of 5 Squares. Special Attacks can be used a certain amount of times per day equal to ˝ the monster's Primary Attribute (minimum 1, rounded down).


Affliction
Daily Use: ___ / (˝ Primary Attribute)
Difficulty: (10 + ˝ level + Primary Attribute)
As a minor action, a (monster) can afflict the target of a (bite, claw, slam) attack with the (Blinded, Demoralized, Poisoned, Slowed, or Weakened) condition for 3 rounds. Targets that succeed a (Fortitude, Reflex, or Will) save are unaffected.

Curse
Daily Use: ___ / (˝ Primary Attribute)
Difficulty: (10 + ˝ level + Primary Attribute)
As a major action, a (monster) can inflict an enemy within 5 Squares a (˝ level + ˝ Primary Attribute) penalty to (Choose two: Attack, Damage, Saves, or Skill) rolls for 3 rounds. Targets that succeed a (Fortitude, Reflex, or Will) save are unaffected. A target can only be under the effect of 1 curse at a time.

Empower
Daily Use: ___ / (˝ Primary Attribute)
As a major action, a (monster) can grant an ally within 5 Squares the (Bolstered, Concealed, Hasted, Regeneration) condition for 3 rounds.

Energy Blast
Daily Use: ___ / (˝ Primary Attribute)
Difficulty: (10 + ˝ level + Primary Attribute)
As a major action, a (monster) can target a Square and its adjacent space, dealing (1 + ˝ level)d8 (Cold, Fire, Physical, or Shock) damage to all targets in the area. Targets that succeed a (Fortitude, Reflex, or Will) save take half damage.

Energy Missile
Daily Use: ___ / (˝ Primary Attribute)
Difficulty: (10 + ˝ level + Primary Attribute)
As a major action, a (monster) can target up to (3 + ˝ level) Squares, dealing (1 + ˝ level)d8 (Cold, Fire, Physical, or Shock) damage to all targets in the area. Targets that succeed a (Fortitude, Reflex, or Will) save take half damage.

Energy Wave
Daily Use: ___ / (˝ Primary Attribute)
Difficulty: (10 + ˝ level + Primary Attribute)
As a major action, a (monster) can target all Squares within a straight line, starting from the (monster)’s space, dealing (1 + ˝ level)d8 (Cold, Fire, Physical, or Shock) damage to all targets in the area. Targets that succeed a (Fortitude, Reflex, or Will) save take half damage.

Frenzy
Daily Use: ___ / (˝ Primary Attribute)
As a minor action, a (monster) can enter a frenzied state, taking a -2 penalty to Defense, but rolling maximum damage dice with melee attacks for 3 rounds. If there are no adjacent enemies to attack while frenzy is active, the (monster) must attack the nearest target.

Healing Touch
Daily Use: ___ / (˝ Primary Attribute)
As a minor action, a (monster) can heal an adjacent ally (Primary Attribute + level) Hit Points, or remove a single condition (other than Dying).

Plane Shift
Daily Use: ___ / (˝ Primary Attribute)
As a major action, a (monster) can teleport itself and any adjacent allies to another plane of the (monster)’s choosing.

Push
Difficulty: (10 + ˝ level + Primary Attribute)
As a minor action, a (monster) can push the target of a (bite, claw, slam) attack (1 + ˝ level) Squares towards or away from the (monster). Targets that succeed a (Fortitude, Reflex, or Will) save are unaffected.

Slowing Terrain
Daily Use: ___ / (˝ Primary Attribute)
As a major action, a (monster) can target up to (3 + ˝ level) Squares, causing them to become difficult terrain for 3 rounds.

Sweep
As a minor action after a successful (natural weapon) attack, a (monster) may make another melee Attack on an adjacent enemy.

Special Qualities
Special Qualities are passive abilities that are 'always on' powers for a monster. However, they are different from Special Traits in that they are unique enough that a description of the ability is helpful in the monster's stat block.


Amphibious
As a move action, a (monster) can swim (Speed) Squares per round and can breathe underwater.

Bonded
A (monster) is bonded with an individual, known as the (monster)'s master, and gains a bonus to Hit Points equal to ˝ its master’s HP total. A (monster) gains a bonus to Attack, Defense, and Saves equal to ˝ its master’s level, and shares their initiative result in battle.

Burrow
As a major action, a (monster) can tunnel through loose earth, sand, or gravel (˝ Speed) Squares per round. The (monster) can choose to leave a tunnel or not.

Climb
As a move action, a (monster) can walk up and cling to walls and ceilings (˝ Speed) Squares per round.

Death Throes
When a (monster) dies, it can immediately make a free attack roll against an adjacent enemy, or use a special attack trait that has daily uses remaining.

Energy Aura
A (monster) can cause all effects that deal (Cold, Fire, Physical, or Shock) within 10 Squares to deal +1 damage per damage dice.

Healing Aura
A (monster) can cause all effects that recover Hit Points within 10 Squares to heal +1 damage per dice.

Flight
Unlike other Special Qualities, flight uses a different description in the monster statistics: Fly (Speed) Squares, Major action; Hover (Speed) Squares, Minor action

A (monster) can fly or hover (Speed) Squares per round and is immune to falling damage as long as it can use the actions to fly or hover. Flying requires a major action each round to maintain flight, and the (monster) cannot be targeted by melee attacks from enemies on the ground, nor can it target them with melee attacks. Hovering requires a minor action each round and the (monster) is treated as on the ground but becomes immune to difficult terrain and ground hazards.

Permanant Condition (Bolstered, Concealed, Hasted, or Regeneration)
A (monster) is permanently under the effect of the (Bolstered, Concealed, Hasted, or Regeneration) condition. If the condition is removed it is suppressed for 3 rounds then comes back.

Surround
A (monster) can flank from any angle as long as it and an ally are adjacent to an enemy.

Special Traits
Special Traits are passive, flat bonuses that are added to a monster's stats in order to make them more effective. Unlike Special Qualities and Special Attacks, Special Traits are not actually spelled out in a monster's description. Rather, the name of the trait is noted under the 'Special Traits' section, and the actual benefit is noted in a section the creature's statistics, as detailed in each trait.


Condition Immunity
Section: Immunity
The monster is immune to the (Blinded, Demoralized, Poisoned, Slowed, or Weakened) condition.

Energy Immunity
Section: Immunity
The monster is immune to (Cold, Fire, Physical, or Shock) damage.

Energy Resistance
Section: Resistance
The monster gains (Cold, Fire, Physical, or Shock) Resistance (3 + twice level). This trait can be taken multiple times. Each time taken, this resistance applies to a different damage type.

Giant
Section: Monster Role (Giant)
The monster becomes larger, occupying 4 adjacent Squares of space, instead of 1, decreases Dexterity by 1, and increases damage dice from natural weapons by 1 increment.

Improved Initiative
Section: Initiative
The monster gains a +3 bonus to Initiative.

Improved Hit Points
Section: Hit Points
The monster increases maximum Hit Points by 5 + level. This trait can be taken multiple times. Each time taken, the monster increases their maximum Hit Points by 5 + level.

Improved Natural Defense
Section: Defense
The monster gains a +3 Trait bonus to Defense. This trait can be taken multiple times. Each time taken, the bonus increases by +3.

Improved Natural Weapon
Section: Attack
The monster’s natural weapon increases damage dice by 1 increment.

Improved Saves
Section: Fortitude, Reflex, or Will
The monster gains a +2 Trait bonus to a single save, or a +1 Trait bonus to all saves. This trait can be taken multiple times. Each time taken, the bonus increases by +2 (if a single save) or +1 (if all saves).

Improved Skill
Section: Skills
The monster gains a +3 Trait bonus to two Skills of choice. This trait can be taken multiple times. Each additional time taken, the bonus increases by +1.

Improved Speed
Section: Speed
The monster gains a +2 Trait bonus to Speed. This trait can be taken multiple times. Each additional time taken, the bonus increases by +1.

Swarm
Section: Monster Role (Swarm), Attack
This monster is actually a group of monsters smaller than the space the swarm occupies. The monster must occupy the space of an enemy in order to make melee attacks, but these attacks automatically hit and natural weapons deal two damage dice.

Unliving
Section: Monster Role (Unliving), Immunity
The monster only recovers ˝ the amount from any effect that restores Hit Points. However, it does not need to eat, drink, breath or sleep but must take a rest to recover abilities. The monster gains immunity to two conditions (other than Dying). When reduced to 0 HP the monster crumbles to dust and cannot be revived.

Minor Traits
Lesser abilities that are almost more for description than design, minor traits don't count as normal traits do. A monster can select up to four minor traits for free, although any additional minor traits count as normal traits. Minor traits are detailed in a monster's statistics with *astericks* around them and are included under the Special Traits section unless specified otherwise.


Bonus Language: (Language Learned)
The monster learns a single language.

*Cantrip (Magic Missile)*
Daily Use: ___ / (˝ Primary Attribute)
Section: Special Attack
As a minor action, a (Monster) can deal (˝ level)d4 + (1+ ˝ level) (Cold, Fire, Physical, or Shock) damage to an enemy within 5 Squares. This attack automatically hits and requires no Attack roll.

*Darkvision*
A monster can see without any light sources and ignores Concealment from darkness. However, it takes a -2 penalty to Perception when in direct sunlight..

*Huge*
Section: Monster Role (Huge)
A monster with the Giant trait becomes even larger, taking up a 3x3 Square block of space.

*Elemental Body*
A monster's natural weapons deal (Cold, Fire, or Shock) damage, instead of Physical.

*Mount*
This monster can be ridden using the rules detailed under the Mounted maneuver.

*Proficiency (Light Armor, Heavy Armor, One-Handed, Ranged, Shield, or Two-Handed)*
The monster gains proficiency with a single type of weapon and armor. This trait can be taken twice to provide proficiency with a different type of weapon and armor. Unlike PC's a monster cannot use weapons or armor unless they possess this trait for the appropriate type of weapon or armor.

*Telepathy*
A monster can speak telepathically with any creature that can speak a language within 5 Squares.

*Tiny*
Section: Monster Role (Tiny)
A monster that does not have the Giant trait becomes smaller, decreasing damage dice by 1 increment, decreasing Strength by 1, and allowing it to occupy 1 Square of space with another Tiny creature.

Weaknesses
Many monsters of myth have weak points, and weaknesses seek to flesh out a monster with openings for the PC's to strike. Like special traits, weaknesses are not described in the monster's statistics, and only includes the name of the weakness. A monster can take two weaknesses in order to gain an additional trait.


Attribute Penalty (Str, Con, Dex, Int, Wis, or Cha)
The monster takes a -2 penalty to a single Attribute. This weakness can be taken twice to apply the penalty to two Attributes.

Condition Weakness (Blinded, Demoralized, Poisoned, Slowed, or Weakened)
A monster is permanently under the effect of the (Blinded, Demoralized, Poisoned, Slowed, or Weakened) condition. If the condition is removed it is suppressed for 3 rounds then comes back.

Elemental Weakness
A monster takes 1˝ times damage from the (Cold, Fire, Physical, or Shock) energy type.

Minion
Reduce Damage and Save bonuses by ˝ (minimum 0), as well as the monster’s effective level (to a maximum of 5 and a minimum of ˝). In addition, reduce Defense by -2. If the monster takes more damage in a single attack equal to ˝ its total hit points, it must make a fortitude save equal to 10 + the damage taken or die instantly. Minion counts as two weaknesses.
Section: Special Qualities, as follows:
If a (monster) takes more than (˝ total Hit Points) points of damage in a single turn, they must make a Fortitude save (10 + damage taken) or immediately die.

Slow Land Speed
When not moving with the Amphibious, Burrow, Climb, or Flight traits, the monster's Speed is reduced to 2.

Speed Penalty
The monster takes a -2 penalty to Speed.

Weak Attack
The monster’s natural weapon decreases damage dice by 1 increment and the monster only adds ˝ Strength or Dexterity to damage.


Table of Contents

Knaight
2013-08-08, 08:02 PM
It looks interesting, but the traits would need to be shown in more detail before I can comment all that much.

blackwind1kaze
2013-08-09, 05:15 AM
Traits I believe should be coming next so I'm holding on to le goblin tongue until I see it. But in regards to the monster ability bonus, they get effectively a +2 on the bonus levels? Does this mean that if the monsters current level is two, they could put that additional +1 into the primary attribute or does it have to be a different one? (just clearing it up.)

Lappy9001
2013-08-09, 02:49 PM
Not trying to hold off to build up hype, I promise :smalltongue:

Currently caring for a very sick family member, so I'll just post traits as I complete them (there's about 30-40 and almost all are at least half complete. I just need to flesh them out fully).


Traits I believe should be coming next so I'm holding on to le goblin tongue until I see it. But in regards to the monster ability bonus, they get effectively a +2 on the bonus levels? Does this mean that if the monsters current level is two, they could put that additional +1 into the primary attribute or does it have to be a different one? (just clearing it up.)It's just like how it works for players, +1 Primary, +1 other. Except for weak monsters who only increase their Primary Attribute. I'll look at it again and see if I need to clarify it a bit. (Some) Traits up in just a minute...

Lappy9001
2013-08-12, 11:25 PM
There! Looks like I'm pretty finished with monster traits for the moment. Couple of notes I have regarding them:

I think I may need some methods of categorizing traits to make them easier to use.
Monsters have a completely different set of abilities because many PC abilities require a fair bit of extra work. That's fine for a character, but this way monsters will only have one or two unique abilities (condisering the average in-battle lifespan of a monster).
The types are different than 3.5; elementals include fey, plants include oozes, and undead/construct are factored in as traits (as unliving...there really isn't much difference between them in D&D) so they can be applied to anything.
I'm pretty happy how flight turned out.
I already have a lot of neat ideas for monster descriptions (and the knowledge skill). Some of it is setting-specific, but I have blueprints up for a Classy d20 world any way :smallbiggrin:
I realize some traits are obviously better than others. The idea is to make unique monsters rather than optimized ones. I realize this is potentially a problem for challenge rating, which right now is just dependant on the monster's level. Works great for weak monsters, though.
My goal is to make monsters that all have cool attacks, not just scary sacks of meat for the players to kill (though they do have their place).

Next is the monster template (It's here now!) than a bucket load of monsters! Monsters made by others will be most welcome :smallcool:

Gonna do some general updates too, and hopefully make the format a bit more friendly on the eyes.

Lappy9001
2013-08-14, 05:39 PM
Here's a couple just for funsies while I test out the rules. Already, I'm gonna have to make some changes to make monsters easier to build. I'm slightly concerened about the numbers so there may be yet more tweaking. When things are in a more usuable state, I'll add in all the fluff and stuff. Most likely, I'll add monsters as I go then make a bit index of them all. I'd like to get them all together, but that seems unrealistic.

Gremlin
Gremlin (Goblin)
Weak Monster (Tiny) ˝
HP: ____/ 5
Str: +0 Dex: +5* Wis: +2
Con: +2 Int: +0 Cha: +1

Initiative: +4 Perception: +2
Speed: 7 Stealth: +7*

Defense: 13 Resist: -
Fort: +1 Ref: +5 Will: +1

Attack (Bite): +3
1d4 + 0 Physical

Special Attack
Frenzy (____ / 1 per day)
Benefit: Gremlins can enter a frenzied state, taking a -2 penalty to Defense, but rolling maximum damage dice with their bite attack for 3 rounds. If there no enemies left to attack during frenzy, a gremlin must attack the nearest target.

Special Qualities
Darkvision
Benefit: Gremlins can see without any light sources and ignore Concealment from darkness. Gremlins take a -2 penalty to Perception when in direct sunlight.

Minion
Benefit: Gremlins must make a Fortitude save of 10 if they take more than 2 points of damage in a single turn. If they fail this save, they immediately die.

Skills
+5 Athletics*, +7 Stealth*

Troll
Troll (Goblin)
Tough Monster (Giant) 3
HP: ____/ 38
Str: +4 Dex: +3 Wis: +2
Con: +5* Int: +0 Cha: -1

Initiative: +3 Perception: +2
Speed: 7 Stealth: +6*

Defense: 16 Resist: -
Fort: +8 Ref: +3 Will: +3

Attack (Claw): +7
1d12 + 7 Physical

Special Attack
Frenzy (____ / 2 per day)
Benefit: Trolls can enter a frenzied state, taking a -2 penalty to Defense, but rolling maximum damage dice with their bite attack for 3 rounds. If there no enemies left to attack during frenzy, a troll must attack the nearest target.

Special Qualities
Darkvision
Benefit: Trolls can see without any light sources and ignore Concealment from darkness. Trolls take a -2 penalty to Perception when in direct sunlight.

Permanent Regeneration
Benefit: Trolls are permanently under the Regeneration Condition, and recover 3 HP at the start of their turn.

Traits
Improved Natural Weapon

Skills
+7 Endurance*, +6 Stealth*

Lizardfolk Guard
Lizardfolk Guard (Beastfolk)
Tough Monster 1
HP: ____/ 11
Str: +3* Dex: +2 Wis: +2
Con: +3 Int: +2 Cha: +1

Initiative: +2 Perception: +2
Speed: 5 Stealth: +2

Defense: 16 Resist: -
Fort: +5 Ref: +2 Will: +2

Attack (Club, Bludgeoning): +3 Melee
1d10 + 6 Physical

Attack (Spear, Versatile): +3 Melee/+2 Ranged 5
1d6 + 5 Physical

Special Qualities
Amphibious
Benefit: Lizardfolk can swim 5 Squares per round and can breathe underwater.

Traits
Improved Defense
Proficiency

Skills
+4 Endurance*, +4 Nature*

Lizardfolk Sun Shaman
Lizardfolk Sun Shaman (Beastfolk)
Support Monster 2
HP: ____/ 16
Str: +0 Dex: +1 Wis: +3
Con: +2 Int: +2 Cha: +6*

Initiative: +1 Perception: +4*
Speed: 5 Stealth: +1

Defense: 14 Resist: 3 Fire
Fort: +3 Ref: +2 Will: +6

Attack (Claw): +1 Melee
1d4 + 0 Physical

Special Attack
Sun’s Blessing (____ / 1 per day)
Benefit: Lizardfolk can grant allies within 5 Squares a +2 bonus to Defense for 1 minute.

Sun’s Wrath (____ / 3 per day)
Benefit: As a Major action, deal 2d8 Fire damage to all targets within a straight line out to 5 Squares, starting from the lizarefolk’s space. Targets that succeed a Reflex save of 17 take half damage.

Special Qualities
Amphibious
Benefit: Lizardfolk can swim 5 Squares per round and can breathe underwater.

Traits
Elemental Resistance (Fire)
Improved Defense

Skills
+6 Nature*, +4 Perception*, +8 Speech*

Giant Spider
Giant Spider (Animal)
Quick Monster 1
HP: ____/ 9
Str: +1 Dex: +5* Wis: +4
Con: +3 Int: +0 Cha: -2

Initiative: +7 Perception: +6*
Speed: 7 Stealth: +7*

Defense: 15 Resist: -
Fort: +3 Ref: +7 Will: +4

Attack (Bite): +5
1d6 + 1 Physical

Special Attack
Poison (____ / 2 per day)
Benefit: As a Minor action, a spider can poison the target of a successful bite attack. The target must succeed a Fortitude save of 15 or become Poisoned for 1 minute.

Web (____ / 2 per day)
Benefit: As a Major action, 1 Square and its adjacent space within 5 Squares becomes difficult terrain for 1 minute.

Special Qualities
Climb
Benefit: A spider can cling to walls and ceilings, and can walk up them with a Speed of 3.

Spider Swarm
Spider Swarm (Animal)
Weak Monster (Swarm) ˝
HP: ____/11
Str: +1 Dex: +3* Wis: +2
Con: +3 Int: +0 Cha: -2

Initiative: +3 Perception: +2*
Speed: 5 Stealth: +3*

Defense: 11 Resist: -
Fort: +4 Ref: +3 Will: +2

Attack (Swarm): Auto-Hits
2d4 + 1 Physical

Special Attack
Poison (____ / 2 per day)
Benefit: As a Minor action, a spider can poison the target of a successful bite attack. The target must succeed a Fortitude save of 13 or become Poisoned for 1 minute.

Special Qualities
Climb
Benefit: A spider can cling to walls and ceilings, and can walk up them with a Speed of 3.

Minion
Benefit: Spiders must make a Fortitude save of 11 if they take more than 5 points of damage in a single turn. If they fail this save, they immediately die.

Traits
Improved Hit Points

Edit: These are now largely obsolete with the new monster rules.

Knaight
2013-09-25, 12:20 AM
Good to have this back.

Tough Monster is bolded on the adult red dragon, that formatting error needs to go.
The fire resistance is also less than hugely impressive in all cases, and increases relatively slowly, though that might not be an issue (I need to refamiliarize myself with Classy d20 before commenting much).
Crush as a daily attack seems weird.
Death Throes has a uses per day section. This is probably unnecessary.
The support special is a bit odd, in that it seems like there are limited areas where it would work well within the context of the setting.
Giant lets you take up any 4 adjacent squares, and change what they are. Diagonals are technically adjacent. So, Giant allows a diagonal line. If it were changed to allow either a 2x2 block or a 1x4 block which can turn, it likely wouldn't be an issue.
The healing aura isn't clearly differentiated from the others with how it is worded, as is all auras increase 1 type of damage and increase healing effects by 1.
Whether or not improved hit points continues to add HP when you go up in level is ambiguous.
Huge isn't even listed as a trait.
Tiny is pretty weak, but still costs a monster trait. Some sort of free customization option for things both good and bad (into which Tiny falls) would be helpful.
Stability is similar to Tiny in that respect.
The beastfolk description ends mid sentence.
A flaw/weakness section for monsters would be useful.
As noted, formatting is a mess right now.


I'll see about getting to more of this after said refamiliarization.

Lappy9001
2013-09-27, 12:36 AM
Good to have this back.

Tough Monster is bolded on the adult red dragon, that formatting error needs to go.
The fire resistance is also less than hugely impressive in all cases, and increases relatively slowly, though that might not be an issue (I need to refamiliarize myself with Classy d20 before commenting much).
Crush as a daily attack seems weird.
Death Throes has a uses per day section. This is probably unnecessary.
The support special is a bit odd, in that it seems like there are limited areas where it would work well within the context of the setting.
Giant lets you take up any 4 adjacent squares, and change what they are. Diagonals are technically adjacent. So, Giant allows a diagonal line. If it were changed to allow either a 2x2 block or a 1x4 block which can turn, it likely wouldn't be an issue.
The healing aura isn't clearly differentiated from the others with how it is worded, as is all auras increase 1 type of damage and increase healing effects by 1.
Whether or not improved hit points continues to add HP when you go up in level is ambiguous.
Huge isn't even listed as a trait.
Tiny is pretty weak, but still costs a monster trait. Some sort of free customization option for things both good and bad (into which Tiny falls) would be helpful.
Stability is similar to Tiny in that respect.
The beastfolk description ends mid sentence.
A flaw/weakness section for monsters would be useful.
As noted, formatting is a mess right now.


I'll see about getting to more of this after said refamiliarization.Sorry, that was my fault for not posting the monster rules first. The reason it took me so long to get any monsters up was that I was getting those rules sorted out. Special Attacks and Special Qualities are up and most of those comments have aleady been addressed in the new version.

Some of the dragon's information got garbled in the transit from Word to forum post. I'll fix those next.

Lappy9001
2013-10-04, 08:44 PM
Bonesplinter
Piles of scattered bones litter the lairs of dangerous predators and ancient dungeons alike, providing an omnious warning to any trespassers. However, if these fatal remains absorb continual necrotic energy, they can become a serious threat themselves. Bonsplinters are shambling mounts of bones, dust, and debris from the dead of battles long past and strike out at the living with an unthinking fury.

Bonesplinter Hulk
Bonesplinter Hulk (Construct)
Tough Monster (Giant, Unliving) 4
HP: ____/ 58
Str: +4 Dex: +2 Wis: +1
Con: +5* Int: -1 Cha: -1

Initiative: +2 Perception: +1
Speed: 5 Stealth: +2*

Defense: 17 Resist: -
Fort: +9 Ref: +4 Will: +3

Immunity: Poison, Weakened
Weakness: Attribute Penalty (Int, Cha)

Attack (Slam): +8 Melee
1d10 + 6 Physical

Special Attack
Scattered Debris [Slowing Terrain]
Daily Use: ___ / 2
As a major action, a bonesplinter hulk can target up to 5 Squares, causing them to become difficult terrain for 3 rounds.

Sweep
As a minor action after a successful slam attack, a bonesplinter may make another melee Attack on an adjacent enemy.

Special Qualities
Splinter (Special Ability)
When a bonesplinter hulk is destroyed, it collapses into 1d4+1 bonesplinter hordes that act immediately, and then roll their own initiative result. The bonesplinter hordes form in the bonesplinter hulk’s adjacent space, attempting to start their action in the space of an enemy.

Traits
Improved Defense

Skills
+7 Endurance*

Bonesplinter Horde
Bonesplinter Horde (Construct)
Weak Monster (Swarm, Tiny, Unliving) ˝
HP: ____/ 8
Str: +1 Dex: +3 Wis: +0
Con: +4 * Int: -1 Cha: +0

Initiative: +3 Perception: +1
Speed: 5 Stealth: +3*

Defense: 14 Resist: -
Fort: +2 Ref: +1 Will: +0

Immunity: Poison, Weakened
Weakness: Attribute Penalty (Int, Cha), Minion

Attack (Swarm): Auto-Hit Melee
2d4 Physical

Special Traits
Improved Defense


Table of Contents

Lappy9001
2013-10-04, 09:02 PM
Voidling
Almost all goblins spend their lives in the shadows, but some never emerge into the light at all. Voidlings are evolved from gremlins that have become one with the darkness, and have let a bit of the void into their souls. Voidling haunt tombs, caves, and even alleyways where the sun never shines, feeding off any refuse or unwary travelers that come their way.

Voidling
This short creature looks like a misshapen living shadow, it’s slender ears are almost as long as it is tall, and subtly twitch like an insect’s antennae. The creature is covered in jet black downy fur, broken only by two pale grey glowing eyes and twin claws that extend from where its fingers should be.

Voidling (Goblin)
Support Monster (Tiny) 3
HP: ____/ 21
Str: +0 Dex: +4 Wis: +6*
Con: +1 Int: +2 Cha: +0

Initiative: +4 Perception: +7*
Speed: 5 Stealth: +9*

Defense: 15 Resist: -
Fort: +2 Ref: +5 Will: +11

Attack (Claw): +5 Melee
1d6 Cold

Special Attack
Frenzy
Daily Use: ___ / 3
As a minor action, a voidling can enter a frenzied state, taking a -2 penalty to Defense, but rolling maximum damage dice with melee attacks for 3 rounds. If there are no enemies to attack while frenzy is active, the voidling must attack the nearest target.

Void Shroud (Empower)
Daily Use: ___ / 5
As a major action, a voidling can grant an ally within 5 Squares the Concealed condition for 3 rounds.

Special Qualities
Shadow Meld (Permanent Condition)
A voidling is permanently under the effect of the Concealed condition. If the condition is removed, it is suppressed for 3 rounds then comes back.

Special Traits
*Darkvision*
*Elemental Body*
Improved Natural Attack

Skills
+5 Athletics*, +3 Endurance*


Table of Contents

Lappy9001
2013-10-04, 09:23 PM
Ghost: Spectral Adventurers
Strong-willed souls who have unfinished business or meet a particularly gruesome death occasionally rise from the dead as spectral versions of their former selves. Adventurers often fit both prerequisites, and in death can rise to bolster the ranks of the ruins and dungeons where they themselves met their demise.

Spectral Fighter
Spectral Fighter (Humanoid)
Tough Monster (Unliving) Level 4
HP: ____/ 63
Str: +6* Dex: +2 Wis: +4
Con: +4 Int: +1 Cha: +0

Initiative: +2 Perception: +4
Speed: 4 Stealth: -4

Defense: 22 Resist: -
Fort: +8 Ref: +4 Will: +6

Immunity: Poison, Weakened

Attack (Longsword; Masterwork) +9 Melee
1d6 + 8 Physical

Special Attack
Curse
Daily Use: ___ / 3
Difficulty: 18
As a major action, a spectral fighter can inflict an enemy within 5 Squares a -5 penalty to Attack and Damage rolls for 3 rounds. Targets that succeed a Fortitude save are unaffected. A target can only be under the effect of 1 curse at a time.

Special Qualities
Flight
A spectral fighter can fly 4 Squares as a major action or hover as a minor action.

Incorporeal (Permanent Condition)
A spectral fighter is permanently under the effect of the Concealed condition. If the condition is removed it is suppressed for 3 rounds then comes back.

Special Traits
*Darkvision*
*Proficiency*
Improved Hit Points

Skills
+10 Athletics*, +6 Endurance*

Equipment
Scale Armor, Large Shield, Longsword (Masterwork)

Spectral Thief
Spectral Thief (Humanoid)
Quick Monster (Unliving) 4
HP: ____/ 38
Str: +1 Dex: +5* Wis: +3
Con: +2 Int: +2 Cha: +1

Initiative: +7 Perception: +4*
Speed: 7 Stealth: +8*

Defense: 19 Resist: -
Fort: +4 Ref: +9 Will: +5

Immunity: Poisoned, Weakened

Attack (Short Sword; Finesse): +6 Melee
1d6 + 3 Physical

Attack (Shortbow; Ammunition) +6 Ranged
2d6 Physical

Special Attack
Curse
Daily Use: ___ / 2
Difficulty: 17
As a major action, a spectral thief can inflict an enemy within 5 Squares a -4 penalty to Attack and Skill rolls for 3 rounds. Targets that succeed a Reflex save are unaffected. A target can only be under the effect of 1 curse at a time.

Special Qualities
Flight
A spectral thief can fly 7 Squares as a major action or hover as a minor action.

Incorporeal (Permanent Condition)
A spectral thief is permanently under the effect of the Concealed condition. If the condition is removed it is suppressed for 3 rounds then comes back.

Surround
A spectral thief can flank from any angle as long as it and an ally are adjacent to an enemy.

Special Traits
*Darkvision*
*Proficiency*

Skills
+7 Athletics*

Equipment
Leather Armor

Spectral Wizard
Spectral Wizard (Humanoid)
Support Monster (Unliving) 4
HP: ____/ 28
Str: +0 Dex: +3 Wis: +6*
Con: +1 Int: +3 Cha: +3

Initiative: +3 Perception: +8*
Speed: 5 Stealth: +3

Defense: 15 Resist: -
Fort: +3 Ref: +5 Will: +10

Immunity: Poisoned, Weakened

Attack (Slam): +5 Melee
1d4 +2 Physical

Special Attack
Curse
Daily Use: ___ / 4
Difficulty: 18
As a major action, a spectral wizard can inflict an enemy within 5 Squares a -5 penalty to Damage and Save rolls for 3 rounds. Targets that succeed a Will save are unaffected. A target can only be under the effect of 1 curse at a time.

Fireball [Energy Blast]
Daily Use: ___ / 3
Difficulty: 18
As a major action, a spectral wizard can target a Square and its adjacent space, dealing 3d8 Fire damage to all targets in the area. Targets that succeed a Reflex save take half damage.

Magic Missile
Daily Use: ___ / 4
As a minor action, a spectral wizard can deal 2d4+2 Cold, Fire, Physical, or Shock damage to an enemy within 5 Squares. This attack automatically hits and requires no Attack roll.

Special Qualities
Flight
A spectral wizard can fly 5 Squares as a major action or hover as a minor action.

Incorporeal (Permanent Condition)
A spectral wizard is permanently under the effect of the Concealed condition. If the condition is removed it is suppressed for 3 rounds then comes back.

Special Traits
*Cantrip (Magic Missile)*
*Darkvision*

Skills
+5 Alchemy*, +5 Knowledge*, +5 Speech*


Table of Contents

Kornaki
2013-10-06, 10:15 PM
The party I'm running through this is on a nice little aquatic adventure and I made a couple monsters I thought I would post here now that they've seen them in combat. The monster creation rules are a little different than when I made them but hopefully I've edited them to be correct to the current edition.


Merfolk Hunter
A vicious brute, this scaly creature glistens from water that continues to drip off his body. He has a large leathery fin protruding from the top of his head and down the back of his neck, and six inch long claws extend from his bony hands.

Merfolk Hunter(Beastfolk)
Tough Monster (Medium) 1
HP: ____/ 13
Str: +2 Dex: +6 Wis: +1
Con: +3 Int: +0 Cha: +0

Initiative: +6
Speed: 6

Defense: 19 Resist: -
Fort: +5 Ref: +6 Will: +0

Attack (Claw): +3 Melee
1d10+3 Physical

Special Qualities
Amphibious (Permanent Condition)
As a move action, a Merfolk Hunter can swim 6 Squares per round and can breathe underwater.

Special Traits
*Improved Natural Weapon*


Skills
+2 Nature


Frost Wizard
A smaller example of the species, this merfolk makes up for his lack of size with magical prowess. He glows with a faint blue aura that perfectly matches the color of his scales.

Frost Wizard(Beastfolk)
Support Monster (Medium) 1
HP: ____/ 6
Str: +0 Dex: +5 Wis: +4
Con: +2 Int: +0 Cha: +1

Initiative: +5
Speed: 6

Defense: 15 Resist: -
Fort: +2 Ref: +5 Will: +6

Attack (Claw): +0 Melee
1d8 Physical

Special Attack


Frost Orb
Daily Use: ___ / 2
Difficulty: 14
As a major action, a Frost Wizard can target a Square and its adjacent space, dealing 1d8 Cold damage to all targets in the area. Targets that succeed a Fortitude save take half damage.

Special Qualities
Amphibious (Permanent Condition)
As a move action, a Frost Wizard can swim 6 Squares per round and can breathe underwater.

Water Elemental

Water Elemental (Elemental)
Quick Monster 2
HP: ____/ 18
Str: +5 Dex: +6 Wis: +1
Con: +3 Int: +0 Cha: +1

Initiative: +7 Perception: +1
Speed: 7 Stealth: +6

Immune: Physical
Weakness:

Defense: 16 Resist: -
Fort: +3 Ref: +8 Will: +1

Attack (Slam.): +6 Melee
1d6 + 5 Physical

Special Attacks
Flood ____/3
As a major action, a Water Elemental can target up to 4 Squares, flooding them with water and causing them to become difficult terrain for 3 rounds

Special Qualities
Amphibious (Permanent Condition)
As a move action, a Water Elemental can swim 7 Squares per round and can breathe underwater.

Special Traits
Energy Immunity
Water Elementals are immune to Physical damage, as weaponry passes right through them.

Lappy9001
2013-10-07, 01:45 AM
Awesome! Aquatic monsters :smallcool:

There's some minute number differences, but they look totally legit (I can correct them, if you'd like). Speaking of which, did you have any issues with the creation rules? Any traits that were missing or anything that didn't quite fit or wasn't clear?

Kornaki
2013-10-07, 06:30 PM
Yeah, if you want to update them go for it. I don't know if they'll fight these guys again but if they do I'd use the updated version.


The rules were pretty clear to me... I was surprised that you (I think) changed slowing terrain; when I made my water elemental it was a 5 square radius according to what I wrote down, which seemed fairly reasonable.

Lappy9001
2013-10-07, 10:06 PM
Cool, I'll do that. Not that there's much that needs to be done; they look great!

I've got a lot of time tomorrow (but no internet until midnight), so expect some monsters when I can get up to posting them.

Knaight
2013-10-25, 02:29 PM
Finally got around to additional monsters: They seem to be working quite well.

Liliet
2013-12-04, 04:48 AM
First of all: this is absolutely awesome.

I like building characters very much, and I usually build a "test" character of every game system I come across. This system is the first I encounter to be simple enough for me to build a max level character, not just 1st level. This is awesome #1.

Awesome #2 is that I hate the idea of rogues being the damage dealers. That's the warriors' role. Here I was able to build a rogue with a focus on battlefield control, a role usually exclusive to mages, and that's fantastic.

Awesome #3 is eliminating differences between weapons, which is to say that they are still customisable, but you can pick whatever you want by flavor and then adjust it mechanically, and you don't get cash-penalised for exotic options. And Finesse property, wheeeee ^^

Awesome #4 is just the way everything works. I like it. I like it more than DnD. It's much more flavortastic. Mana instead of vancian casting, all spells being equal, warriors and rogues getting just as many options as mages do... Supernatural options for non-spellcasters... Just so awesome.

Here's my character build:
Daniel Dolores Rachel of Deepwater
Aasimar Human Rogue
lvl 10

---Attributes:
Str 1
Dex 6
Con 2
Int 7
Wis 4
Cha 2

68 HP
8 Speed
9 Essentia
3 AP
9 MP
21 Defense
+2 Initiative

---Saves:
Reflex +13
Will +9
Fortitude +7

---Languages:
Common
Elven
Draconic
Wilden

---Abilities:
Dilettante 4/day
Lucky Shot 4/day
Healing Touch 27

---Cantrips:
Light
Telekinesis
Ghost Sound

---Maneuvers
Dueling
Dual Strike
Parry

---Spells
Jinx
Charm
Blink
Dismension Swap

---Talents
-Alchemist
-Fleet x2
-Well-Versed x2
-Rugged +3 Cold Resistance
-Second Glance x2
-Vocation - Herbalist
-Fast Talker
-Probably Just the Wind...
Beast Friend
Tumble
Arcane Study
Blind Sense
Parkour
Alchemic Resistance
Muffled Movement
Always Prepared
Detect Magic
Threaten

---Skills
Alchemy +2 Trained avg 24
Athletics (Dex) +2 Trained avg 23
Endurance +0 avg 12
Knowledge +2 avg 19
Mechanics +0 avg 17
Nature +1 avg 15
Perception +2 Trained avg 21
Profession +2 Trained avg 24
Speech +1 avg 13
Stealth +2 avg 18

---Equipment
73 gp
Backpack
Bedroll
Flint and Steel
Lantern
Rope
Waterskin

Rapier 1d6 Finesse
Dagger 1d4 Finesse, Piercing
Shortbow 2d4 Ammunition, Close Range
Longbow 2d4 Ammunition, Long Range
Leather Armor +2/-1



-----------------tactics&design
1) swift, fluid movement, undetectable&uninterraptable;
2) tricking, distracting and otherwise influencing enemies;
3) noticing things;
4) communicating with & supporting the team;
5) alchemist/herbalist as a profession - awesome&practical
Aaand as I was building a character I had a lot of questions.

1) How do skills work? It's not clear from either Basics section or Skills section. Do skill points get distributed among skills? Are they summed to apply to all skills? Do they apply to strictly the skill of the talent learned?

2) Why are skill DCs so high if there's so few sp? My character is rather unoptimised in that regard, jack-of-all trades all over the place, but I did a bit of math regarding the "ideally optimised" character.
max: +1 race, +1 first level, +3 talents, +5 level, +8 attribute = +18
18+20 = 38
Heroic&NearImpossible unattainable
???

3) Related to the previous question, what can magical items and potions do? I understand that they take up 1 point of essentia, but what's the result of that? Do they just get additional properties, add bonuses to skills/mp/ap?

4) Related to the previous question, what does alchemy do? If magical potions permanently take 1 point of essentia, alchemists can't earn their living making and selling them, so can they do something else?

5) Are there any dual wielding rules? The way it's worded now, Dual strike works with one one-handed weapon just as well as with two. Is there any difference if the weapons don't have Dual property?

6) When the rules allow to reroll before hearing result, does it mean that you are allowed to take the better of two? The way it's worded, it sounds like you just take the latter, but what's the point of that if you don't know the result yet?

7) Does "adaptable" maneuver change already existing weapons? It says in the rules that weapons' properties are set when they are made and there can be only 2 of them, so what does the maneuver do?

8) What are the abilities of a familiar from "Beast friend" talent?

9) Is knowledge a single skill for all questions? Like all-purpose erudition? (if so, I LOVE that)

10) The saves are mentioned several times, but I didn't find anything in the rules specifying how they are calculated - what attributes they are based on. To clarify, I know two different rule options: just Reflex-Dex, Will-Wis and Fort-Con, or take the better of two: Reflex-Dex/Int, Will-Wis/Cha and Fort-Con/Str. The latter makes more sense to me, but the former seems to be more widespread. Which is yours?

11) Ranged weapons. Oh my god. 25 feet range for all but those with a specific property, and they get 125 feet? Really? The effective range of the historical longbows is normally 200 yards, that's 600 feet, and of the most long-ranged bows - 500 yards, that's 1500 feet. The effective range of the crossbows, which are not specifically long-range weapons, was 150 yards, which is 450 feet.
And I'm not an archery geek, I just googled. Your numbers are so off. I mean, I can see shuriken and other thrown weapons having a very short range, but bows and crossbows were designed to shoot further than you can just throw something with your hand.
Also, past the effective range the deadliness decreases but doesn't immediately drop to zero.

12) Do abilities and spells that apply to adjacent allies also apply to self? It's not spelled anywhere, but at least Feather Fall should probably be self-applicable, really.

13) And the last little nitpick. Your equipment table needs rope, desperately. That's like #1 item in any adventurer's backpack. I added it to my character's equipment and substracted 5 gold from her money, but maybe it should be cheaper.


In fact, I'm going to try and build several more characters, to make a team of them. Heehee ^^

(oh, and now that I look at that, there's one "hereditary" problem that you haven't done anything about, and probably can't... rogues are MAD, their skills are all over the place, while warriors and mages are focused. It might not be a major obstacle, I just noticed)

Lappy9001
2013-12-04, 02:44 PM
I wanna mention first that everything down to the Classes section is down to the "final draft", barring any future missed flaws (I talked to Liliet about this beforehand)

Edit: Oh, and one big thing that's about to change: Maneuvers and Spells will work like Talents, in that you select one, and you get the base ability for free.


First of all: this is absolutely awesome.Thanks:smallcool:


I like building characters very much, and I usually build a "test" character of every game system I come across. This system is the first I encounter to be simple enough for me to build a max level character, not just 1st level. This is awesome #1.

Awesome #2 is that I hate the idea of rogues being the damage dealers. That's the warriors' role. Here I was able to build a rogue with a focus on battlefield control, a role usually exclusive to mages, and that's fantastic.

Awesome #3 is eliminating differences between weapons, which is to say that they are still customisable, but you can pick whatever you want by flavor and then adjust it mechanically, and you don't get cash-penalised for exotic options. And Finesse property, wheeeee ^^

Awesome #4 is just the way everything works. I like it. I like it more than DnD. It's much more flavortastic. Mana instead of vancian casting, all spells being equal, warriors and rogues getting just as many options as mages do... Supernatural options for non-spellcasters... Just so awesome.Thank you, I'm glad everything worked out for ya :smallcool:


Here's my character build:
Daniel Dolores Rachel of Deepwater
Aasimar Human Rogue
lvl 10

---Attributes:
Str 1
Dex 6
Con 2
Int 7
Wis 4
Cha 2

68 HP
8 Speed
9 Essentia
3 AP
9 MP
21 Defense
+2 Initiative

---Saves:
Reflex +13
Will +9
Fortitude +7

---Languages:
Common
Elven
Draconic
Wilden

---Abilities:
Dilettante 4/day
Lucky Shot 4/day
Healing Touch 27

---Cantrips:
Light
Telekinesis
Ghost Sound

---Maneuvers
Dueling
Dual Strike
Parry

---Spells
Jinx
Charm
Blink
Dismension Swap

---Talents
-Alchemist
-Fleet x2
-Well-Versed x2
-Rugged +3 Cold Resistance
-Second Glance x2
-Vocation - Herbalist
-Fast Talker
-Probably Just the Wind...
Beast Friend
Tumble
Arcane Study
Blind Sense
Parkour
Alchemic Resistance
Muffled Movement
Always Prepared
Detect Magic
Threaten

---Skills
Alchemy +2 Trained avg 24
Athletics (Dex) +2 Trained avg 23
Endurance +0 avg 12
Knowledge +2 avg 19
Mechanics +0 avg 17
Nature +1 avg 15
Perception +2 Trained avg 21
Profession +2 Trained avg 24
Speech +1 avg 13
Stealth +2 avg 18

---Equipment
73 gp
Backpack
Bedroll
Flint and Steel
Lantern
Rope
Waterskin

Rapier 1d6 Finesse
Dagger 1d4 Finesse, Piercing
Shortbow 2d4 Ammunition, Close Range
Longbow 2d4 Ammunition, Long Range
Leather Armor +2/-1



-----------------tactics&design
1) swift, fluid movement, undetectable&uninterraptable;
2) tricking, distracting and otherwise influencing enemies;
3) noticing things;
4) communicating with & supporting the team;
5) alchemist/herbalist as a profession - awesome&practical
Aaand as I was building a character I had a lot of questions.Sorry that there's not currently a character sheet. The ones I've built just use a Notepad document that look a lot like yours. I'm obviously gonna fix this, but it works pretty good so far.


1) How do skills work? It's not clear from either Basics section or Skills section. Do skill points get distributed among skills? Are they summed to apply to all skills? Do they apply to strictly the skill of the talent learned?Oh, interesting, I missed that. At first level, you get a +1 to a number of skills equal to your Intelligence. After that, you get the 1/2 level bonus from trained skills, and a +1 bonus to a skill that you take a talent in. You take an Acrobatics talent, you gain a +1 bonus to the skill.


2) Why are skill DCs so high if there's so few sp? My character is rather unoptimised in that regard, jack-of-all trades all over the place, but I did a bit of math regarding the "ideally optimised" character.
max: +1 race, +1 first level, +3 talents, +5 level, +8 attribute = +18
18+20 = 38
Heroic&NearImpossible unattainable
???I promise I'm not trying to be a jerk when I say they were meant to be "Near Impossible," although perhaps I achieved that a little too well. It was originally a barrier to prevent skill boosts from magic and items, but I later went away from that. I'll do the math again here.


3) Related to the previous question, what can magical items and potions do? I understand that they take up 1 point of essentia, but what's the result of that? Do they just get additional properties, add bonuses to skills/mp/ap?This section isn't finished here (as you probably guessed), so nothing currently. Basically, instead of providing static bonuses, they will give you more options. A cloak of spider climb makes your Parkour talent more effective, but is essentially useless without the talent. A fire sword allows you to roll multiple damage dice and change the damage type to fire.


4) Related to the previous question, what does alchemy do? If magical potions permanently take 1 point of essentia, alchemists can't earn their living making and selling them, so can they do something else?Yes, I caught that and fixed it (sort of) in the new draft that's coming up in a bit. Creating magic items has a limit in the system. You can only make a number of potions/poisons/bombs equal to your total essentia (although it does cost you essentia points when you first create the item). I realize you can't really sell them; it works better for magic weapons. Like, a smith may make only a handful of magic items in their life (magic items *do* acutally lower your total essentia as long as they exist).

I'm going to make some 'lesser' alchemic items in the equipment section to help compensate for this. Ones that don't hae a set limit.


5) Are there any dual wielding rules? The way it's worded now, Dual strike works with one one-handed weapon just as well as with two. Is there any difference if the weapons don't have Dual property?Dual Strike allows you to either strike with dual weapons, or fast with a single weapon (since there's no iterative attacks through BAB in Classy d20). So, it's really whether you want to strike quickly with one weapon or two. Interestingly, you're not penalized for attacking with a weapon in each hand, but it's much slower with one atttack each round.

The dual property just gives you some incentive to use two weapon fighting.


6) When the rules allow to reroll before hearing result, does it mean that you are allowed to take the better of two? The way it's worded, it sounds like you just take the latter, but what's the point of that if you don't know the result yet?It's meant to be the former. The only time I think you roll two and take the better is the bolstered condition. It's meant to help with that "Oh damn Natural 1, reroll!"


7) Does "adaptable" maneuver change already existing weapons? It says in the rules that weapons' properties are set when they are made and there can be only 2 of them, so what does the maneuver do?Adaptable overrides the rules, allowing you to use a weapon with 3 properties, or a higher damage dice weapon with 2 properties.


8) What are the abilities of a familiar from "Beast friend" talent?They'll be out in the Monster section. They're not finished yet :smallredface:


9) Is knowledge a single skill for all questions? Like all-purpose erudition? (if so, I LOVE that)Pretty much, yeah.


10) The saves are mentioned several times, but I didn't find anything in the rules specifying how they are calculated - what attributes they are based on. To clarify, I know two different rule options: just Reflex-Dex, Will-Wis and Fort-Con, or take the better of two: Reflex-Dex/Int, Will-Wis/Cha and Fort-Con/Str. The latter makes more sense to me, but the former seems to be more widespread. Which is yours?It's the former, you use Con, Dex, and Wis for Fort, Ref, Will respectively, while Str, Int, and Cha determine Difficulty for Maneuvers, Talents, and Spells respectively.

I'm contemplating changing it to the former for saves, and just using the primary attribute for difficulty. Makes things easier than having 3 different difficulties.


11) Ranged weapons. Oh my god. 25 feet range for all but those with a specific property, and they get 125 feet? Really? The effective range of the historical longbows is normally 200 yards, that's 600 feet, and of the most long-ranged bows - 500 yards, that's 1500 feet. The effective range of the crossbows, which are not specifically long-range weapons, was 150 yards, which is 450 feet.
And I'm not an archery geek, I just googled. Your numbers are so off. I mean, I can see shuriken and other thrown weapons having a very short range, but bows and crossbows were designed to shoot further than you can just throw something with your hand.
Also, past the effective range the deadliness decreases but doesn't immediately drop to zero.Yeah, I'll work on that.


12) Do abilities and spells that apply to adjacent allies also apply to self? It's not spelled anywhere, but at least Feather Fall should probably be self-applicable, really.It's listed in abilities, you are your own ally for anything that affects 'allies'.


13) And the last little nitpick. Your equipment table needs rope, desperately. That's like #1 item in any adventurer's backpack. I added it to my character's equipment and substracted 5 gold from her money, but maybe it should be cheaper.Oh, the equipment table is hilariously unfinished. I still have bunches more to add.



In fact, I'm going to try and build several more characters, to make a team of them. Heehee ^^Go for it, I'm flattered :smallsmile:


(oh, and now that I look at that, there's one "hereditary" problem that you haven't done anything about, and probably can't... rogues are MAD, their skills are all over the place, while warriors and mages are focused. It might not be a major obstacle, I just noticed)Ah, it's meant to be either combat-y (for Dex) or skill-monkey (for Int). There's really not much of a way around that. I did try to make Intelligence useful for more skills than any other attribute.

Thank you for your critique!

Amechra
2013-12-04, 08:48 PM
1. What is the normal base range of Lightning Bolt? As written, it shoots out to the horizon, and Tempest nerfs the distance.

2. I'm assuming that "show" in the first sentence of Blizzard is supposed to be "fill", right?

There are a few other typos up the spell section, but they don't impede understanding.

It might help for the different disciplines if you have something like:

Necessary Tactics: You must either be wearing no armor or light armor.
Necessary Tactics: You must not be wielding a weapon other than your bare hands.

Or something. Makes it neat and quick to reference.

Lappy9001
2013-12-04, 09:03 PM
1. What is the normal base range of Lightning Bolt? As written, it shoots out to the horizon, and Tempest nerfs the distance.All spells have a range of 5 Squares, unless otherwise noted.


2. I'm assuming that "show" in the first sentence of Blizzard is supposed to be "fill", right?Probably :smalltongue:


There are a few other typos up the spell section, but they don't impede understanding.They should be fixed tonight, when I get the final draft of abilities up. And that's a deadline I'm keeping, 'cause I've already started uploading it :smallcool:


It might help for the different disciplines if you have something like:

Necessary Tactics: You must either be wearing no armor or light armor.
Necessary Tactics: You must not be wielding a weapon other than your bare hands.

Or something. Makes it neat and quick to reference.It is more concise than the Proficiency thing, I like it!

Lappy9001
2013-12-05, 01:39 AM
Edit: Bleh, not gonna get it finished it tonight. Have some monsters!

Ash Strider
Ash striders are bizarre creatures that can be seen quietly patrol the burning landscape of the elemental plane of fire. While ash striders serve a presumably natural purpose in their native plane, they pose a notable danger outside of it as their ambling yet constant pace has the strange side effect of polluting the air wherever they pass. Ash striders are peaceful unless attacked, in which they emit an unearthly bugle and battle opponents relentlessly.

Ash Strider
This towering creature is composed of a mismatched number of slender legs supporting a brownish-grey oval body. The end of the body curves upwards, while the front thins into a long proboscis that emits drops of burning liquid. The legs snake out like tendrils, vanishing and reforming into dusty clouds as the creature lumbers along.

Ash Strider (Elemental)
Support Monster (Giant) 4
HP: ____/ 44
Str: +3 Dex: +1 Wis: +5
Con: +5* Int: +1 Cha: +3

Initiative: +0 Perception: +11*
Speed: 5 Stealth: +1

Defense: 13 Resist: -
Fort: +7 Ref: +3 Will: +9

Immunity: Fire

Attack (Slam): +5 Melee
1d6 + 5 Fire

Special Attack
Ash Cloud (Special Ability)
Daily Use: ___ / 3
As a major action, an ash strider can conjure a cloud of ash affecting one Square and its adjacent space for 3 rounds, granting the Concealed condition to all targets within.

Spitfire (Energy Missile)
Daily Use: ___ / 3
Difficulty: 17
As a major action, an ash strider can target up to 5 Squares, dealing 3d8 Fire damage to all targets in the area. Targets that succeed a Fortitude save take half damage.

Special Qualities
Death Throes
When an ash strider dies, it can immediately make a free attack roll against an adjacent enemy, or use a special attack trait that has daily uses remaining.

Freedom of Movement
An ash strider ignores Speed penalties from Difficult Terrain.

Special Traits
*Darkvision*
*Elemental Body*

Skills
+5 Athletics*, +7 Endurance*, +7 Nature*

Lappy9001
2013-12-05, 02:05 AM
Salamander
Salamanders are a not uncommon nuisance on the material plane, the infamous fire lizards travel from their native plane through extreme heat, and can be occasionally found in deserts, volcanoes, and forest fires. Although not innately dangerous or aggressive, salamanders leave a path of burning flame wherever they walk, and are much faster than they appear.

Salamander
This serpentine lizard sits on four stubby legs with a large head and mottled reddish orange scales with yellow spots. Its large mouth takes up most of its small head, shared with beady, unintelligent eyes. Waves of heat emit from its body, and a trail of fire follows in its steps.

Salamander (Elemental)
Quick Monster 2
HP: ____/ 25
Str: +2 Dex: +4* Wis: +2
Con: +4 Int: -1 Cha: +2

Initiative: +4 Perception: +2*
Speed: 6 Stealth: +3

Defense: 15 Resist: -
Fort: +5 Ref: +7 Will: +3

Immunity: Fire
Weakness: Attribute Penalty (Int), Cold (1˝ Damage)

Attack (Bite): +5 Melee
1d8 + 3 Fire

Special Attack
Fire Breath (Elemental Blast)
Daily Use: ___ / 2
Difficulty: 15
As a major action, a salamander can target a Square and its adjacent space, dealing 2d8 Fire damage to all targets in the area. Targets that succeed a Reflex save take half damage.

Special Qualities
Trail of Fire (Special Ability)
The space a salamander passes through becomes Difficult Terrain for 3 rounds. Any target moving through this space takes 1d4 Fire damage.

Special Traits
*Elemental Body*
Improved Natural Weapon

Skills
+7 Athletics*, +3 Nature*

Lappy9001
2013-12-05, 02:16 AM
Soot Sprites
Soot sprites are natives of the elemental plane of fire, but often find their way into the material world through lit fires, particularly stoves and fireplaces. Individually, or even a dozen at a time, they are completely harmless, but the clouds the creatures that dwell on their home plane can unwittingly choke the life out of unwary travelers. Soot sprites are also incredibly curious beings, and adventures in the plane of fire often find them following behind humming cheerfully.

Soot Sprites
This creature appears to actually be an entire cloud of diminutive sprites, each looking like a lump of sooty coal with white glowing eyes. The mass leaves black marks on the floor and the creatures hum with a strange tune.

Soot Sprites (Elemental)
Quick Monster (Swarm) 2
HP: ____/ 20
Str: +2 Dex: +3 Wis: +5*
Con: +2 Int: +0 Cha: +1

Initiative: +5 Perception: +6*
Speed: 6 Stealth: +6*

Defense: 14 Resist: -
Fort: +3 Ref: +7 Will: +7

Immunity: Fire

Attack (Slam): Auto-Hit
2d6 + 2 Fire

Special Attack
Choke (Affliction)
Daily Use: ___ / 2
Difficulty: 16
As a minor action, a soot sprite can afflict the target of a slam attack with the Weakened condition for 3 rounds. Targets that succeed a Fortitude save are unaffected.

Special Traits
*Darkvision*
*Elemental Body*

Skills
+6 Nature*

Liliet
2013-12-05, 12:11 PM
I wanna mention first that everything down to the Classes section is down to the "final draft", barring any future missed flaws (I talked to Liliet about this beforehand)

Edit: Oh, and one big thing that's about to change: Maneuvers and Spells will work like Talents, in that you select one, and you get the base ability for free.
That's sweet ^^

But there's something I want to note about that.

First, right now maneuvers is the only thing in the build that requires planning, except the obvious moment that if you plan to ever bolster Constitution you should do it as early as possible. I'm not sure that not requiring planning is a bad thing, just thought I'd mention it.

Second, less so with talents and more so with spells there's strong incentive to take all of different schools. I mean, if I take three spells of one school, I get four spells total, and if I take three spells of different schools, I get six spells total. That's quite a difference. It's less so with talents because base talents get bolstered each time you get another one and because they are specialized by attributes.



Thanks:smallcool:

Thank you, I'm glad everything worked out for ya :smallcool:
No, thank YOU.



Sorry that there's not currently a character sheet. The ones I've built just use a Notepad document that look a lot like yours. I'm obviously gonna fix this, but it works pretty good so far.
I didn't post ALL my character build that's in my Notepad document, obviously. Just the final version. I wrote down what I took on each level separately.

If there's going to be a character sheet, please don't make it in pdf. Make it something that can be used in electronic version )=



Oh, interesting, I missed that. At first level, you get a +1 to a number of skills equal to your Intelligence. After that, you get the 1/2 level bonus from trained skills, and a +1 bonus to a skill that you take a talent in. You take an Acrobatics talent, you gain a +1 bonus to the skill.
That's what I thought, and that's how I built my character, but it took me a lot of time to figure out. It should be noted somewhere in the rules, me thinks.



I promise I'm not trying to be a jerk when I say they were meant to be "Near Impossible," although perhaps I achieved that a little too well. It was originally a barrier to prevent skill boosts from magic and items, but I later went away from that. I'll do the math again here.
The maximum that I calculated was with natural 20 and maximum optimisation at the maximum level. If there were magical items that directly boosted skills it would make sense that you need them to achieve something truly awesome, but it looks like your system goes the other way, and that's fantastic.

I could agree if "Near impossible" were something achievable only with maximum optimisation and natural 20 at the maximum level, although I'd still make it a couple of points lower to give better chances to someone that awesome (it should be "near impossible" enough to achieve that level of optimisation, I think). But making "near impossible" "impossible at all, ever"?...



This section isn't finished here (as you probably guessed), so nothing currently. Basically, instead of providing static bonuses, they will give you more options. A cloak of spider climb makes your Parkour talent more effective, but is essentially useless without the talent. A fire sword allows you to roll multiple damage dice and change the damage type to fire.
I see. Will there be magic items useful for mages who do not directly engage in combat and are generally squishy?

Will there be magic items of general usefulness, like flying carpet?

In fact, I have other questions about mages. I've just tried to build a mage, and I have quite a problem with it.

First of all, is it in any way profitable to a mage to have high Int? It normally is, but I didn't notice anything in the rules suggesting it. Primary attributes are either Wis or Cha, and it seems like rogues are supposed to be generally smarter than mages, because they need it for the skills and mages don't.

Second, can the bonus be used to take the native property for a class? Can a mage not multiclass into rogue or warrior and just take all the spells?



Yes, I caught that and fixed it (sort of) in the new draft that's coming up in a bit. Creating magic items has a limit in the system. You can only make a number of potions/poisons/bombs equal to your total essentia (although it does cost you essentia points when you first create the item). I realize you can't really sell them; it works better for magic weapons. Like, a smith may make only a handful of magic items in their life (magic items *do* acutally lower your total essentia as long as they exist).
So the magic items are extremely rare, cannot be bought normally and are generally made by high-level adventurers for their own use? I can see that working.



I'm going to make some 'lesser' alchemic items in the equipment section to help compensate for this. Ones that don't hae a set limit.
You may have noticed that I gave my girl "Profession: Herbalist". That was meant to synergise with alchemy. Or probably be the same thing.
Is it possible to declare some skill or class your profession and use the bonuses for that? I mean, humans get bonus to profession, they've got to use it somehow.



Dual Strike allows you to either strike with dual weapons, or fast with a single weapon (since there's no iterative attacks through BAB in Classy d20). So, it's really whether you want to strike quickly with one weapon or two. Interestingly, you're not penalized for attacking with a weapon in each hand, but it's much slower with one atttack each round.

The dual property just gives you some incentive to use two weapon fighting.

So using two weapons, rather than a weapon and a shield, is only useful if they are Dual? And given that normally dual-wielding is associated with Dex builds, they also have d4 damage dice in exchange for that bonus?

Are shields meant to be more useful regardless of build, or is it a bug?

I mean, you have everything for a decent Dex build - Finesse property, sweet skills, sweet Maneuvers... but if you use shield, you lose Dex bonus to defense, and if you don't, you are straight-up worse than the traditional tank fighter Str build )=




It's meant to be the former. The only time I think you roll two and take the better is the bolstered condition. It's meant to help with that "Oh damn Natural 1, reroll!"
So you can reroll AFTER hearing the results, or what?

If you can only choose to reroll before you see what you got, it's exactly the same as rolling once. It doesn't give you any bonuses at all. It's not a bonus.



Adaptable overrides the rules, allowing you to use a weapon with 3 properties, or a higher damage dice weapon with 2 properties.
Does your already existing weapon improve like that? Or do weapon shops suddenly offer more options?



They'll be out in the Monster section. They're not finished yet :smallredface:
Ah, I see. I'm still going to ask questions, though. I have three characters I want to give this feat to, and I want to make sure it does what I think it should do.

Can the familiar be:
a) winged and flying;
b) a capable fighter;
c) a capable tracker;
d) a mount?

It would be the coolest if familiars levelled up too and it was possible to eventually end up with all four, but just different options to pick one would do.

I want to give a scouting bird familiar to Daniel (the rogue whose build I posted), a protective fighter familiar to the squishy mage and a mount OR a tracker to the, well, ranger - warrior who comes from the forest and specializes in Nature.



Pretty much, yeah.

It's the former, you use Con, Dex, and Wis for Fort, Ref, Will respectively, while Str, Int, and Cha determine Difficulty for Maneuvers, Talents, and Spells respectively.
Ah. I see. That works.



I'm contemplating changing it to the former for saves, and just using the primary attribute for difficulty. Makes things easier than having 3 different difficulties.
...you mean changing it to the latter?

Also, Talents already use different difficulties, don't they? Is there something I don't understand?



Yeah, I'll work on that.
Please do.

It just stroke me as so hilariously unrealistic )=



It's listed in abilities, you are your own ally for anything that affects 'allies'.
Er. Um. I can see that. And the square you are in counts as adjacent to you, too?

It would be much easier to understand if you just changed the description where "ally" appears to "ally or self". Like, a lot easier.



Oh, the equipment table is hilariously unfinished. I still have bunches more to add.
Starting with mounts, me thinks?



Go for it, I'm flattered :smallsmile:
Here's another one. He was pretty satisfying to build, except two moments:
1) what can the familiar do;
2) the Wild Walker talent doesn't have much use if the whole party doesn't have it. It doesn't help in any way if there's just one person in the party who has it: everyone else will leave tracks, everyone else will move slowly (except in the fight, where everyone moves with their own speed, but that's a whole other can of worms), and everyone else will require rations.

Dimitry the White
Aasimar Human Warrior
lvl 10

---Attributes:
Str 7
Dex 2
Con 5
Int 2
Wis 4
Cha 2

127 HP
6 Speed
8 Essentia
10 AP
21 Defense
+1 Initiative

---Saves:
Reflex +7
Will +9
Fortitude +12

---Languages:
Common
Wilden

---Abilities:
Challenge -5
Relentless
Healing Touch 27

---Maneuvers
Lancer
Cleave
Knockback
Sunder
Mithril Fluidity
Momentum
Sidestep Dodge
Weapon Specialization
Sure Hit
Keen Weapon

---Talents
-Fleet
-Toughness
-Rugged +3 Cold, +3 Fire
-Second Glance
Wild Walker
Endure Elements
Blind Sense
Tumble
Diehard

---Skills
Alchemy +0 avg 12
Athletics (Str) +1 avg 18
Endurance +1 avg 16
Knowledge +0 avg 12
Mechanics +1 avg 13
Nature +3 Trained avg 22
Perception +1 Trained avg 20
Profession +1 avg 13
Speech +0 avg 12
Stealth +0 avg 12

---Equipment
111 gp
Backpack
Bedroll
Flint and Steel
Lantern
Rope
Waterskin
Fishing Net, 25 ft

Dagger 1d6 Masterwork
Lance 1d10 Piercing
Hide Armor +4/-2/-1



Ah, it's meant to be either combat-y (for Dex) or skill-monkey (for Int). There's really not much of a way around that. I did try to make Intelligence useful for more skills than any other attribute.

Thank you for your critique!
Er. All mage's spells are meant to be used by the mages. All warriors' maneuvers are meant to be used by the warriors. Are you suggesting that 4 out of 10 talents are not meant to be used by rogues?

All spells can be used equally by any mage of any build.

Warriors are supposed to specialize, but they can specialize in any combination of maneuvers and if they just switch weapons everything will work equally well for them. And the maneuvers within one specialization synergize finely into one build.

Rogues... just can't make Perception and Nature work. I can get why they don't get to used Endurance, rogues are not normally tanks, and if they are, they do, but whether the rogue is combat-specialized or a skill monkey, Perception is pretty essential, at least flavor-wise.

And the Speech skill. Charisma. The way your system works right now, mages are supposed to be either wise, perceptive and forest-dwelling, or charismatic and business-like. And, barring special cases, book dumb. While rogues are supposed to be either book smart and educated, or quick and agile. And, barring special cases, unpersonable and unperceptive.

I won't touch mages with 10ft pole, it's your system and you can do with the stereotypes whatever you like, but the rogues! The original rogue archetype is a thief, who should be able to see in the darkness, and/or a conman, who uses disguises, haggles like crazy and can talk anyone into anything.


To build a normal thief, with all thieving abilities, you need him to have high Dex for Stealth, high Wis for Perception, and high Int for Mechanics (picking locks). Do you really think these should be three separate people?


And Charisma is a separate problem. Right now it's a safe dump stat. Except for the mages, somehow, and even they are better off with Wisdom. I mean, if they want to buff/debuff, there are spells more suited for it and not limited in a number of daily uses. And Perception is pretty important, so they would want to have it. Nature is much sweeter than Speech, too.

There's only one skill that uses Charisma, and its talents don't really synergise well. Threatening and Inspiring are for leader types and combat-oriented, but Haggling is for underhanded mercenary types (generally) and out-of-combat. And Disguise is somehow Dex-based. So if you want to make your rogue the face of the team, you have to make them combat-oriented, and if you want to make them a skill monkey, you have to give up on haggling and street smarts.

I understand that a combat-oriented system won't have many rules for out-of-combat interaction. But making a Charisma build directly mechanically inferior and weird flavor-wise?


PS
I reread my post and noticed that there was a lot of critique in the style as if you owe me something and not enough praise for what you are doing. Please disregard that and think of the word count of the post as a measure of awesomeness of your system: it's worth it to write that much.

Lappy9001
2013-12-05, 03:57 PM
Second, less so with talents and more so with spells there's strong incentive to take all of different schools. I mean, if I take three spells of one school, I get four spells total, and if I take three spells of different schools, I get six spells total. That's quite a difference. It's less so with talents because base talents get bolstered each time you get another one and because they are specialized by attributes.(Just to note, spells down to Protection are updated to the final draft version) That's intentional. Presently, if you're a mage, you have to wait until level 4 to be good at just a Fireball spell. I'm okay with it, because I like the idea that you can make a super generalist mage that takes every school and has 20 spells, or a more focused mage that has like 15. In that way, it indirectly mimics 3.5's sorcerer/wizard thing. Also, the base spell you get is the most basic of basics. Cure heals, fireball just deals fire damage, etc.


If there's going to be a character sheet, please don't make it in pdf. Make it something that can be used in electronic version )= Probably going to do both, actually.


That's what I thought, and that's how I built my character, but it took me a lot of time to figure out. It should be noted somewhere in the rules, me thinks.It should have been in the first place. Thanks for noting it, I'll get that added in.


The maximum that I calculated was with natural 20 and maximum optimisation at the maximum level. If there were magical items that directly boosted skills it would make sense that you need them to achieve something truly awesome, but it looks like your system goes the other way, and that's fantastic.

I could agree if "Near impossible" were something achievable only with maximum optimisation and natural 20 at the maximum level, although I'd still make it a couple of points lower to give better chances to someone that awesome (it should be "near impossible" enough to achieve that level of optimisation, I think). But making "near impossible" "impossible at all, ever"?...
They were meant for epic or near-epic usages, but it's actually not spelled out. Either way, I'll lower them.


I see. Will there be magic items useful for mages who do not directly engage in combat and are generally squishy?

Will there be magic items of general usefulness, like flying carpet?Yes, and yes!


In fact, I have other questions about mages. I've just tried to build a mage, and I have quite a problem with it.

First of all, is it in any way profitable to a mage to have high Int? It normally is, but I didn't notice anything in the rules suggesting it. Primary attributes are either Wis or Cha, and it seems like rogues are supposed to be generally smarter than mages, because they need it for the skills and mages don't.

Second, can the bonus be used to take the native property for a class? Can a mage not multiclass into rogue or warrior and just take all the spells?[QUOTE]For the first one, not unless you want to make a scholarly type with a good focus on skills. It does seem weird from a straight D&D perspective, but I feel like there's a good bit of fantasy precedent for casting spells by sensing the energy and catalyzing through force of self. Of course, you can always refluff it howerver you want. I want anyone using the system to feel that they can refluff an ability however they want (I'm even going to add a section directly addressing that).

[QUOTE=Liliet;16557119]So the magic items are extremely rare, cannot be bought normally and are generally made by high-level adventurers for their own use? I can see that working.No magic-marts, at the least. I think you're right about alchemy, though. Potions are restricted enough as it is without having a limit to how many you can craft.


You may have noticed that I gave my girl "Profession: Herbalist". That was meant to synergise with alchemy. Or probably be the same thing.
Is it possible to declare some skill or class your profession and use the bonuses for that? I mean, humans get bonus to profession, they've got to use it somehow.Seems I've already addressed that with the new Profession base talent :smallsmile:

Expertise
Whenever you provide a week’s worth of work for an occupation under the Profession skill, make a Profession roll and add the result to your weekly income. In addition, you gain 1 Skill Point to add to a skill of choice for each Profession talent learned.

[QUOTE=Liliet;16557119]So using two weapons, rather than a weapon and a shield, is only useful if they are Dual? And given that normally dual-wielding is associated with Dex builds, they also have d4 damage dice in exchange for that bonus?

Are shields meant to be more useful regardless of build, or is it a bug?

I mean, you have everything for a decent Dex build - Finesse property, sweet skills, sweet Maneuvers... but if you use shield, you lose Dex bonus to defense, and if you don't, you are straight-up worse than the traditional tank fighter Str build )=[QUOTE]Well, there's really no reason you can't go Strength for two-weapon fighting. Heavy Armor + Shield does amount to more Defense than Dexterity + Light Armor, but it's not that much. Shields are meant to be more useful than in 3.5, but Dex two-weapon fighting is totally a viable option.

Gotta go, but I'll get to the rest likely later tonight!

Liliet
2013-12-05, 04:30 PM
Ouch. I edited my post, and here is your answer )=


(Just to note, spells down to Protection are updated to the final draft version) That's intentional. Presently, if you're a mage, you have to wait until level 4 to be good at just a Fireball spell. I'm okay with it, because I like the idea that you can make a super generalist mage that takes every school and has 20 spells, or a more focused mage that has like 15. In that way, it indirectly mimics 3.5's sorcerer/wizard thing. Also, the base spell you get is the most basic of basics. Cure heals, fireball just deals fire damage, etc.
Well, this basic of basics is what's needed most often in any situation :\ And now that I read it, pretty awesome.

Do you think people will make specialists without any mechanical bonuses for that? Spells of one school do not synergise in any way. In 3.5, if I'm not mistaken, specialists get additional spells per day?...

Also, I read the spells down to Protection carefully, and I have a thought on Feather Fall. As far as I understand, it's usually used to negate immediate danger, and even if not, 1 round compared to one minute is pretty small. The other spells have their duration doubled for 1 MP... maybe increase range instead of duration for this one?



Probably going to do both, actually.
^^ life is awesome and so are you



They were meant for epic or near-epic usages, but it's actually not spelled out. Either way, I'll lower them.
Epic? You mean there's some possibility to take levels beyond the 10th?



Yes, and yes!
Wheee ^^ my mage specializing in Mechanics can work!



For the first one, not unless you want to make a scholarly type with a good focus on skills. It does seem weird from a straight D&D perspective, but I feel like there's a good bit of fantasy precedent for casting spells by sensing the energy and catalyzing through force of self. Of course, you can always refluff it howerver you want. I want anyone using the system to feel that they can refluff an ability however they want (I'm even going to add a section directly addressing that).
Er, could you please make the third option for mages to make Int primary? Maybe make it weaker than the other two to compensate for synergy with skills...

I do like sorcerers, but "Magic as science" approach is pretty popular and interesting, too.

In fact, if you let the wizards take Int as a primary attribute but without any bonuses from it other than using it for difficulty, it's pretty interestingly fluffed as mages who devoted their life to _studying_ magic as opposed to those with natural talent. Their magic itself is weaker, but they get synergy with Alchemy, Mechanics, Knowledge and, probably counterintuitively, Profession... but then again, humans get bonus to it, might as well put it to good use.


Also, what about using bonuses? I meant to ask it the minute I first saw them, but my rogue girl put limited multiclassing to good use, and I forgot about it until building a mage. There's zero synergy with warrior (rogues can use their high Dex, but high Wis and Cha do nothing to help with Str/Dex and Con), and synergy with rogue is not always all that good compared to MOAR SPELLZ and MP.



No magic-marts, at the least. I think you're right about alchemy, though. Potions are restricted enough as it is without having a limit to how many you can craft.
Abundancy of magic items is what I dislike about DnD, it's straight-up impossible to make a low-magic setting or a setting without market economy. Your system is much better. I'm now just waiting for Alchemy and Mechanics being awesome ^^



Seems I've already addressed that with the new Profession base talent :smallsmile:

Expertise
Whenever you provide a week’s worth of work for an occupation under the Profession skill, make a Profession roll and add the result to your weekly income. In addition, you gain 1 Skill Point to add to a skill of choice for each Profession talent learned.
Heh. Makes sense. Thanks ^^

So for my girl, basically, the Alchemy skill would be making potions and Profession selling them?...

Still weird, but that's more my fluff problems... or not. Mechanics and Alchemy are pretty obvious professions, not letting them synergise with Profession in other ways than being Int-dependent is kinda counterintuitive...



Well, there's really no reason you can't go Strength for two-weapon fighting. Heavy Armor + Shield does amount to more Defense than Dexterity + Light Armor, but it's not that much. Shields are meant to be more useful than in 3.5, but Dex two-weapon fighting is totally a viable option.

Gotta go, but I'll get to the rest likely later tonight!
There's no reason you can't go Strength for two-weapon fighting, if dual wielding is your build goal. If your build goal is to make a rogue proficient in combat, to create a Dex-based character - you know, for flavor if nothing else - there's a reason to not take shields.

I'm not talking about Defense. Primary attribute Dex + Light Armor + Dual Defense bonus is pretty sweet. But in the end your dual weapons do less damage than if you had a shield.

Huh, I guess it actually makes sense that the Dex-based warrior with better Defense from dual wielding do less damage than the Str-based warrior... but wait, they already do. Finesse does not allow to substitute Dex for damage roll, and that's a pretty big drawback.

On the other hand, Dex gives synergy with skills... no, Athletics are compatible with Str too, and the only other Dex skill is mostly out-of-combat Stealth... but with Dex you can also use ranged weapons, and weapons are cheap enough to carry many, but ranged weapons have pretty crappy range as of now and there's a limited number of maneuvers... aah. My head hurts. Balance is hard and I just want to make rogues stronger. Maybe I shouldn't. But they have it bad enough with MAD already... Ok, I'll just wait till the end of the answer.


Ooh. A sudden idea. Maybe give rogues a class feature that would allow them to substitute Int for other mental attributes in skill checks. I mean, it would mostly strengthen out-of-combat abilities, and contribute to the skill monkey nature...

Lappy9001
2013-12-06, 12:19 AM
So you can reroll AFTER hearing the results, or what?

If you can only choose to reroll before you see what you got, it's exactly the same as rolling once. It doesn't give you any bonuses at all. It's not a bonus.I feel we're having some miscommunication here.

Let's say you're attacking a dragon. The battle has gone on a round or two, and it's defense seems high. You make your roll, and it seems really low, but not impossible. Therefore, you decide to use a reroll (or essentia) to modify or change the result.


Does your already existing weapon improve like that? Or do weapon shops suddenly offer more options?"Weapons you wield gain an additional property." When you use a weapon, it uses an additional property.


Ah, I see. I'm still going to ask questions, though. I have three characters I want to give this feat to, and I want to make sure it does what I think it should do.

Can the familiar be:
a) winged and flying;
b) a capable fighter;
c) a capable tracker;
d) a mount?

It would be the coolest if familiars levelled up too and it was possible to eventually end up with all four, but just different options to pick one would do.

I want to give a scouting bird familiar to Daniel (the rogue whose build I posted), a protective fighter familiar to the squishy mage and a mount OR a tracker to the, well, ranger - warrior who comes from the forest and specializes in Nature.Currently, flying is totally available, as is tracking. I'm not sure I'd say 'capable' fighter, but enough to hold their own. I'd like to mae mounts available too. But yes, they would be specified.


Also, Talents already use different difficulties, don't they? Is there something I don't understand?They do at the moment, and it seems a little complicated and makes characters dependant on multiple attributes.


Please do.

It just stroke me as so hilariously unrealistic )=Hey, if that's the biggest problem in my system so far, I think I'm doing pretty good :smallbiggrin:


Er. Um. I can see that. And the square you are in counts as adjacent to you, too?

It would be much easier to understand if you just changed the description where "ally" appears to "ally or self". Like, a lot easier.I guess, but it makes the abilities read longer. You're working on your own side, right? You're your own ally. Easy.


Starting with mounts, me thinks?Probably not starting, but it'll be there.


Here's another one. He was pretty satisfying to build, except two moments:
1) what can the familiar do;
2) the Wild Walker talent doesn't have much use if the whole party doesn't have it. It doesn't help in any way if there's just one person in the party who has it: everyone else will leave tracks, everyone else will move slowly (except in the fight, where everyone moves with their own speed, but that's a whole other can of worms), and everyone else will require rations.Ah, sorry, but I wholly disagree with Wild Walker. If you're being tracked, enemies underestimate your numbers, and can potentially give you an edge. In combat, you can get around, either for flanks, heals, or anything else to help your buddies. Less rations means less money overall. Plus, rations are barely used and are almost entirely optional.

You're digging the Aasimars aren't ya? I like them too :smallbiggrin:


Er. All mage's spells are meant to be used by the mages. All warriors' maneuvers are meant to be used by the warriors. Are you suggesting that 4 out of 10 talents are not meant to be used by rogues?Hardly. The difference is that rogues are already an "in-between" class, focusing on both combat and magic as well as skills. They'll have more points than everyone else (plus trained skills, and an alterable one if you've taken Dilettante). Everyone has overlap in Classy d20. It's impossible to make a character without dipping into the specialization of another character. Maneuvers are meant to be used by warriors, rogues, and mages. Spells are meant to be used by mages, warriors, and rogues. Skills can be used by rogues, mages, and warrriors :smallcool:


Warriors are supposed to specialize, but they can specialize in any combination of maneuvers and if they just switch weapons everything will work equally well for them. And the maneuvers within one specialization synergize finely into one build.Did I imply that they meant to specialize that? I certainly didn't mean to. The ycan switch weapons and everything works well for them? Good! That means they play as intended. Warriors get nice things, and have options that can alter though regularly :smallbiggrin:


Rogues... just can't make Perception and Nature work. I can get why they don't get to used Endurance, rogues are not normally tanks, and if they are, they do, but whether the rogue is combat-specialized or a skill monkey, Perception is pretty essential, at least flavor-wise.I think you're approaching this from a 3.5 mindset. Rogues use all skills (just as everyone else) and they do get to use Endurance, if they so choose. Honestly, I'm not sure what the problem is here :smallconfused:


And the Speech skill. Charisma. The way your system works right now, mages are supposed to be either wise, perceptive and forest-dwelling, or charismatic and business-like. And, barring special cases, book dumb. While rogues are supposed to be either book smart and educated, or quick and agile. And, barring special cases, unpersonable and unperceptive.Is...there any reason you can't make a Mage with high intelligence? I don't believe I barred it anywhere. Nor do I believe I insinuated that mages are forest-dwelling and dumb.


I won't touch mages with 10ft pole, it's your system and you can do with the stereotypes whatever you like, but the rogues! The original rogue archetype is a thief, who should be able to see in the darkness, and/or a conman, who uses disguises, haggles like crazy and can talk anyone into anything.

To build a normal thief, with all thieving abilities, you need him to have high Dex for Stealth, high Wis for Perception, and high Int for Mechanics (picking locks). Do you really think these should be three separate people?Again, there is nothing saying that you should focus solely on your primary attribute. High Intelligence and Dexterity, easy. They make Wisdom a tertiary attribute. The system for generating attributes is very generous and agian, I don't see the problem here, nor do I see how such a character can't be accomplished.


And Charisma is a separate problem. Right now it's a safe dump stat. Except for the mages, somehow, and even they are better off with Wisdom. I mean, if they want to buff/debuff, there are spells more suited for it and not limited in a number of daily uses. And Perception is pretty important, so they would want to have it. Nature is much sweeter than Speech, too.

There's only one skill that uses Charisma, and its talents don't really synergise well. Threatening and Inspiring are for leader types and combat-oriented, but Haggling is for underhanded mercenary types (generally) and out-of-combat. And Disguise is somehow Dex-based. So if you want to make your rogue the face of the team, you have to make them combat-oriented, and if you want to make them a skill monkey, you have to give up on haggling and street smarts.Really? I was worried if Intelligence learning towards the dump stat more than anything. Speech is changing by the way, no more buffs/debuffs, at lease not like Enchantment.

How is haggling for underhanded mercenary types more than any other character concept that wants to save during shopping trips? But like I said, Speech is changing, so please bear with me here :smallsmile:


I understand that a combat-oriented system won't have many rules for out-of-combat interaction. But making a Charisma build directly mechanically inferior and weird flavor-wise?Well, a Charisma build is primarly directed towards mages. This is why it's one of their primary abilities. Because an in-game mechanic that uses Charisma to add damage to spells is more effective than an out-of-combat interaction (which I'm generally opposed to, but I'm open to it if need be).


PS
I reread my post and noticed that there was a lot of critique in the style as if you owe me something and not enough praise for what you are doing. Please disregard that and think of the word count of the post as a measure of awesomeness of your system: it's worth it to write that much.I do appreciate this notice, sincerely! However, I'm writing this system for other people too, so your opinion is equally valid (not that it wouldn't be anyway!). Gonna touch your recent post now :)


Do you think people will make specialists without any mechanical bonuses for that? Spells of one school do not synergise in any way. In 3.5, if I'm not mistaken, specialists get additional spells per day?...That...is a very good point. One that I'm not quite sure how to alleviate.


Also, I read the spells down to Protection carefully, and I have a thought on Feather Fall. As far as I understand, it's usually used to negate immediate danger, and even if not, 1 round compared to one minute is pretty small. The other spells have their duration doubled for 1 MP... maybe increase range instead of duration for this one?That one's just a typo, actually, heh.


^^ life is awesome and so are youThank you!


Epic? You mean there's some possibility to take levels beyond the 10th?Not to tease, sorry, I just meant the equivalent of epic in 3.5. I would like things to potentially go past 10th, in a similar way to d6


Er, could you please make the third option for mages to make Int primary? Maybe make it weaker than the other two to compensate for synergy with skills...

I do like sorcerers, but "Magic as science" approach is pretty popular and interesting, too.

In fact, if you let the wizards take Int as a primary attribute but without any bonuses from it other than using it for difficulty, it's pretty interestingly fluffed as mages who devoted their life to _studying_ magic as opposed to those with natural talent. Their magic itself is weaker, but they get synergy with Alchemy, Mechanics, Knowledge and, probably counterintuitively, Profession... but then again, humans get bonus to it, might as well put it to good use.Hmm...additional primary attributes, perhaps? I wouldn't mind adding a third or so primary attribute to each class. I toyed with the idea, but I couldn't figure how to pull it off.

Maybe a tertiary attribute? Or more, why stop there? I don't want to limit any character concepts now, do I? :smallbiggrin

Any ideas?


Also, what about using bonuses? I meant to ask it the minute I first saw them, but my rogue girl put limited multiclassing to good use, and I forgot about it until building a mage. There's zero synergy with warrior (rogues can use their high Dex, but high Wis and Cha do nothing to help with Str/Dex and Con), and synergy with rogue is not always all that good compared to MOAR SPELLZ and MP.Multiclassing? You can't multiclass currently (unless you mean just taking other abilities). I'm not sure what you mean here.


Abundancy of magic items is what I dislike about DnD, it's straight-up impossible to make a low-magic setting or a setting without market economy. Your system is much better. I'm now just waiting for Alchemy and Mechanics being awesome ^^Thank you, sincerely! Hope I don't dissapoint :smallwink:



So for my girl, basically, the Alchemy skill would be making potions and Profession selling them?...

Still weird, but that's more my fluff problems... or not. Mechanics and Alchemy are pretty obvious professions, not letting them synergise with Profession in other ways than being Int-dependent is kinda counterintuitive...Not quite sure what you mean, and I honestly have no idea how to solve this. I am open to suggestions, though.


There's no reason you can't go Strength for two-weapon fighting, if dual wielding is your build goal. If your build goal is to make a rogue proficient in combat, to create a Dex-based character - you know, for flavor if nothing else - there's a reason to not take shields.

I'm not talking about Defense. Primary attribute Dex + Light Armor + Dual Defense bonus is pretty sweet. But in the end your dual weapons do less damage than if you had a shield.

Huh, I guess it actually makes sense that the Dex-based warrior with better Defense from dual wielding do less damage than the Str-based warrior... but wait, they already do. Finesse does not allow to substitute Dex for damage roll, and that's a pretty big drawback.

On the other hand, Dex gives synergy with skills... no, Athletics are compatible with Str too, and the only other Dex skill is mostly out-of-combat Stealth... but with Dex you can also use ranged weapons, and weapons are cheap enough to carry many, but ranged weapons have pretty crappy range as of now and there's a limited number of maneuvers... aah. My head hurts. Balance is hard and I just want to make rogues stronger. Maybe I shouldn't. But they have it bad enough with MAD already... Ok, I'll just wait till the end of the answer.How about Dual only takes up a property on one weapon (but still requires two weapons to be wielded)? That was you can make a Dex guy with 1d6-Finesse and 1d4-Finesse/Dual. Opportunist allows you to add Dex to damage.

You kind of losing me on this point too. Maybe I'm just tired :smalleek:



Ooh. A sudden idea. Maybe give rogues a class feature that would allow them to substitute Int for other mental attributes in skill checks. I mean, it would mostly strengthen out-of-combat abilities, and contribute to the skill monkey nature...Hmm...not bad. I suppose it's better than Dilettante, although less flexible. Interesting....

Hey, thanks a ton for the critique! I really appreciate it, I mean it :smallcool:

Liliet
2013-12-06, 04:23 AM
I feel we're having some miscommunication here.

Let's say you're attacking a dragon. The battle has gone on a round or two, and it's defense seems high. You make your roll, and it seems really low, but not impossible. Therefore, you decide to use a reroll (or essentia) to modify or change the result.
We really do. So what's going on: I roll d20 to determine my attack. And I:
a) should immediately, before I know the result, decide whether I want to reroll;
b) look at the roll results and decide if I want to reroll?



"Weapons you wield gain an additional property." When you use a weapon, it uses an additional property.
Any that you want it to have?



Currently, flying is totally available, as is tracking. I'm not sure I'd say 'capable' fighter, but enough to hold their own. I'd like to mae mounts available too. But yes, they would be specified.
^^
Life is good.



They do at the moment, and it seems a little complicated and makes characters dependant on multiple attributes.
Exactly what I said about rogues, yeah.

Problem is, it kinda makes sense...



Hey, if that's the biggest problem in my system so far, I think I'm doing pretty good :smallbiggrin:
Oh yes, believe me you do ^^



I guess, but it makes the abilities read longer. You're working on your own side, right? You're your own ally. Easy.
Read longer by one word? Oh no, no, instant wall of text. Seriously.

I can totally imagine a spell that can't be used on self. It's kinda intuitive to have buff effects that can only be used on others, so that the caster is in support role and needs others to fight for him.

It really, really should be specified.



Probably not starting, but it'll be there.
Sweet ^^



Ah, sorry, but I wholly disagree with Wild Walker. If you're being tracked, enemies underestimate your numbers, and can potentially give you an edge. In combat, you can get around, either for flanks, heals, or anything else to help your buddies. Less rations means less money overall. Plus, rations are barely used and are almost entirely optional.
So, since rations are optional, this part of the ability is meaningless and useless, isn't it?

Then, how many fights do you think are going to be fought on difficult terrain? People usually seek out a convenient position.

And about being tracked - usually what's important is not how many of you there is, but whether you can be tracked at all. How big your team is is simple intelligence, if someone has a reason to track you he probably knows that already. And seriously, underestimating the team? Oh noes I thought there were five of them but there's really six horrors horrors my entire plan to ambush them with a hundred warriors is broken!

Wild Walker is an awesome ability for someone who works alone, or for a whole team of characters with it. It increases their speed in the forest and mountains and so on, it lets them escape pursuit, it lets them survive without visiting towns too often (optional, OK, but I as a DM would track that whenever it's possible that they run out).

I'd let the character at least cover tracks of the whole team, maybe at the expence of speed...



You're digging the Aasimars aren't ya? I like them too :smallbiggrin:
Oh yes I am. I dig Good, generally, and I so so dig healing abilities :smallbiggrin:

Also, I dig white hair and being unique. Those are both characters from a story I am currently thinking about, and it's just a coincidence that both aasimars from a whole team of humans were the first to be wholly built. Or not. I just dig aasimars.



Hardly. The difference is that rogues are already an "in-between" class, focusing on both combat and magic as well as skills. They'll have more points than everyone else (plus trained skills, and an alterable one if you've taken Dilettante). Everyone has overlap in Classy d20. It's impossible to make a character without dipping into the specialization of another character. Maneuvers are meant to be used by warriors, rogues, and mages. Spells are meant to be used by mages, warriors, and rogues. Skills can be used by rogues, mages, and warrriors :smallcool:
That in-between class is surprisingly limited. Unless you are MAD, you have a very small choice of optimised skills. The jack-of-all-trades class having less choice than specialized classes? How does that make sense?



Did I imply that they meant to specialize that? I certainly didn't mean to. The ycan switch weapons and everything works well for them? Good! That means they play as intended. Warriors get nice things, and have options that can alter though regularly :smallbiggrin:
Well, it is optimal if you can use ALL your maneuvers all the time, if you take all base maneuvers it's a pretty dumb build unless you have reasons to think your warrior will have to switch equipment all the time and that's not exactly frequent.

This will probably be less important once you start giving base maneuvers for free, it will give incentive to take them all over the place, and the warriors will just kinda have more slots, too.



I think you're approaching this from a 3.5 mindset. Rogues use all skills (just as everyone else) and they do get to use Endurance, if they so choose. Honestly, I'm not sure what the problem is here :smallconfused:
A warrior can use any combination of maneuvers they want. Can you imagine a rogue with Endurance, Mechanics, Perception, Stealth and Speech? All five? They are not contradictory in flavor, but they use five different attribues. That's MAD.

Effectively, throughout the build you can max two ability scores. Your primary attribute and another one of your choice. You can raise three instead, but then two non-primary ones will be smaller.

Take a rogue with Int as a primary attribute. If she chooses to raise Dex each milestone, she won't have high Wis for Nature and Perception. If she chooses to raise Wis, she won't have high Dex and won't be able to fight effectively.

Maximum starting ability score is 4, and you normally want to put it into your primary attribute. Maximum optimised ability score is 7, and if it synergises with your race, 8. That's twice as much.



Is...there any reason you can't make a Mage with high intelligence? I don't believe I barred it anywhere. Nor do I believe I insinuated that mages are forest-dwelling and dumb.

Again, there is nothing saying that you should focus solely on your primary attribute. High Intelligence and Dexterity, easy. They make Wisdom a tertiary attribute. The system for generating attributes is very generous and agian, I don't see the problem here, nor do I see how such a character can't be accomplished.
The system is generous, but if you want your character to be reasonably powerful, you'll focus on ONE secondary attribute. It's possible to make a mage focused on Wis and Int, but he'll have no combat ability, period. And therefore will have no use for most talents. Take Mechanics: use of Magitech weapons? Disrupting weapon of an adjacent enemy?

You did not insinuate that mages are forest-dwelling and dumb. It's just that a class is more-or-less defined by their primary attributes of choice. Warriors are strong and tough, rogues are smart and agile, and mages are wise and charismatic.

All right, maybe I'm just being stereotyped here.


Also, about the system being generous. You are saying that if the roll is more than 15 points, you should drop it and try again. Problem is, 15 is an average roll. You do not ask to drop the highest, you ask to drop half the rolls. That's harsh.

And 12 points for point-buy is really low compared to dice rolls.

Here (http://rumkin.com/reference/dnd/diestats.php) is a good reference for dice roll stats.

Dropping the separation between attributes and modifiers is an excellent idea, and so is making all modifiers positive, but by doing so you compressed the range of possible modifiers twice and changed possibility distribution )=.



Really? I was worried if Intelligence learning towards the dump stat more than anything. Speech is changing by the way, no more buffs/debuffs, at lease not like Enchantment.
It kinda is, too, which is why I asked about mages using it for anything )=



How is haggling for underhanded mercenary types more than any other character concept that wants to save during shopping trips?
Flavor. A character has a limited selection of talents, and what they take tells us about their personality. If a person took Haggle instead of something useful in more situations (Haggle is pretty useful, but pretty limited), they are obviously focused on money, and that IS underhanded mercenary type.



But like I said, Speech is changing, so please bear with me here :smallsmile:
I will ^^



Well, a Charisma build is primarly directed towards mages. This is why it's one of their primary abilities. Because an in-game mechanic that uses Charisma to add damage to spells is more effective than an out-of-combat interaction (which I'm generally opposed to, but I'm open to it if need be).
You are opposed to out-of-combat interaction?

Wait, what?



I do appreciate this notice, sincerely! However, I'm writing this system for other people too, so your opinion is equally valid (not that it wouldn't be anyway!). Gonna touch your recent post now :)
Of course it is. If I wanted to do everything myself, I would do it myself and not critique someone else's system >_>



That...is a very good point. One that I'm not quite sure how to alleviate.
Give more MP for spells of one school? Like, +1 MP if you already have this base spell. Not intruding, but useful.



That one's just a typo, actually, heh.
Oooh. Maybe it's very good that I pointed it out, then o.O



Not to tease, sorry, I just meant the equivalent of epic in 3.5. I would like things to potentially go past 10th, in a similar way to d6
That's niiice ^^



Hmm...additional primary attributes, perhaps? I wouldn't mind adding a third or so primary attribute to each class. I toyed with the idea, but I couldn't figure how to pull it off.

Maybe a tertiary attribute? Or more, why stop there? I don't want to limit any character concepts now, do I? :smallbiggrin

Any ideas?
Well, let fighers choose between Dex (archer or just a finesse fighter), Str and Con; rogues between Cha (face), Dex and Int; mages between Int, Wis and Cha. That would be good ^^

Also, I really like the idea of characters not just raising their abilities as they level, but also becoming actually smarter, tougher and stronger. Why not give 3 points at each milestone instead of two? It will help with MAD problems but won't disbalance anything so long as you are not allowed to put two points in one attribute at the milestone.



Multiclassing? You can't multiclass currently (unless you mean just taking other abilities). I'm not sure what you mean here.
Taking the abilities of another class is what I mean. Can you take the abilities of your own instead?


Not quite sure what you mean, and I honestly have no idea how to solve this. I am open to suggestions, though.
Hm. How about making a list of possible specializations (I'll try to do it later myself, probably) and giving each of them some special bonus or ability. Like, if you are the performer by profession, you get some Speech bonuses, and so on.

I'll give it more thought a little later.



How about Dual only takes up a property on one weapon (but still requires two weapons to be wielded)? That was you can make a Dex guy with 1d6-Finesse and 1d4-Finesse/Dual. Opportunist allows you to add Dex to damage.
Yep ^^ That would be pretty good!

Like, a regular finesse weapon and a weapon made specifically for the use in the off hand.

Opportunist. Right. I kinda missed that, thanks!



You kind of losing me on this point too. Maybe I'm just tired :smalleek:
Just... nevermind. I lost myself there, too.



Hmm...not bad. I suppose it's better than Dilettante, although less flexible. Interesting....
BTW, as far as I understand, the way Dilettante works now, with it you are actually better at untrained skills than at the trained ones. As you level up it becomes milder, but still at the end if you have +7-8 Int as opposed to +5 from half the level... And at the start you have +0 / +1 from half the level as opposed +4 / +5 from Int.



Hey, thanks a ton for the critique! I really appreciate it, I mean it :smallcool:
And I appreciate your system. A lot. I know I already said that, but it's worth reiterating! I imagine it takes A LOT of time and effort to create something that elaborate...

Liliet
2013-12-06, 06:31 AM
I know multipost is discouraged, but my posts are REALLY long, so...

About professions. My idea is something like this:

- performer/public speaker: Speech as a free trained skill (maybe OP, maybe not, given how nerfed Cha/Speech is right now) or some other Speech-related bonuses/abilities;

- artisan: can mend broken equipment, craft mundane items (the way it works now);

- villager/hunter: some Nature-related bonuses/abilities;

- mercenary: bigger rewards for quests or good reputation (bonus to Speech in certain situations?) or something like that;

- engineer: some Mechanics-related bonuses/abilities;

- alchemist/herbalist: some Alchemy-related bonuses/abilities;

- acrobat/gymnast: some Athletics-related bonuses/abilities;

- scholar: some Knowledge-related bonuses/abilities;

- thief: some Stealth-related bonuses/abilities;

- soldier: some Endurance-related bonuses/abilities...

(and, of course, keep the weekly income for labor)

Besides making Profession more interesting, it also gives a character some background and allows for more not directly class-related specialization.

Idea is inspired by DnD Next backgrounds: those also specified where a character can find shelter and hospitality, but it's probably not suited for this system.


And separately, about abilities and MAD.

Right now, classes have pretty different relationship with abilities.

Warriors need Str and Con in order to function in their role. They can pick any as a primary attribute, but in fact, they need both. You can't make an effective Warrior with 1 Str and good Con, or with good Str and 1 Con - you need both.

Rogues need Dex and Int. Both, really. An Int-based Rogue without good Dex will be completely useless in a fight (skill monkeys are well and good, but a character who sits out all fights is not really welcome to the party), and a Dex-based Rogue without good Int fails at their primary role of a skill monkey (however you put it, a Rogue will NOT out-fight a Warrior, see: AP and Maneuvers). And that's if we assume that the MAD problem of the Talents/Skills is already solved.

And Mages... well, they only need one attribute. At all. If it were allowed by the rules, it would be optimal for the Mage to put both milestone ability points in their primary ability, either Wis or Cha. They don't need Str and Dex since they are not even proficient with any weapons and do not need to move much during a fight. They don't need Con because that's what the meatshield warrior is for. They don't need Int because that's what the skill monkey is for. They don't need Wis unless it's their primary attribute, and they don't need Cha unless it's their primary attribute.

That's actually what confused me about mages not needing Int, not the scholarly archetype: I assumed that you solved the age-old problem of DnD wizards and sorcerers relying on just one attribute for casting spells, but you did not. That's the opposite of MAD, but it's not any better.


Please, make mages reliant on SOMETHING other than the attribute used for determining difficulty )= or in other words, give them a way to use their other attributes.

Lappy9001
2013-12-08, 12:27 AM
We really do. So what's going on: I roll d20 to determine my attack. And I:
a) should immediately, before I know the result, decide whether I want to reroll;
b) look at the roll results and decide if I want to reroll?Oh! I think I see, you think the result of the roll! I meant, before you know if the roll is successful. I totally understand how you came to that conclusion now, I'll clarify.

So you roll, decide if it's too low, then use a reroll, or not (before the GM tell you've succeeded of failed; this of course relies on the GM being half-fair and decent to give you that couple seconds to decide).


Any that you want it to have?It should just be one when you receive the maneuver. I'll clarify that too.


Exactly what I said about rogues, yeah.Let's put that at a definite 'We'll see'. I've gotta tinker with that a little.

Read longer by one word? Oh no, no, instant wall of text. Seriously.

I can totally imagine a spell that can't be used on self. It's kinda intuitive to have buff effects that can only be used on others, so that the caster is in support role and needs others to fight for him.

It really, really should be specified.I think everything in Classy d20 either affects an "ally", multiple "allies", one "enemy", or multiple "enemies". I do see your point. I'll work on that too.


So, since rations are optional, this part of the ability is meaningless and useless, isn't it?

Then, how many fights do you think are going to be fought on difficult terrain? People usually seek out a convenient position.

And about being tracked - usually what's important is not how many of you there is, but whether you can be tracked at all. How big your team is is simple intelligence, if someone has a reason to track you he probably knows that already. And seriously, underestimating the team? Oh noes I thought there were five of them but there's really six horrors horrors my entire plan to ambush them with a hundred warriors is broken!

Wild Walker is an awesome ability for someone who works alone, or for a whole team of characters with it. It increases their speed in the forest and mountains and so on, it lets them escape pursuit, it lets them survive without visiting towns too often (optional, OK, but I as a DM would track that whenever it's possible that they run out).

I'd let the character at least cover tracks of the whole team, maybe at the expence of speed...For the difficult terrain thing, it will probably come up quite a bit, especially if you're using the collateral damage variant.

Hmm...I like coverting tracks of the whole party, good idea!


Oh yes I am. I dig Good, generally, and I so so dig healing abilities :smallbiggrin:

Also, I dig white hair and being unique. Those are both characters from a story I am currently thinking about, and it's just a coincidence that both aasimars from a whole team of humans were the first to be wholly built. Or not. I just dig aasimars.There's gonna be a fluff section too, to give ideas like using the light cantrip as a halo.


That in-between class is surprisingly limited. Unless you are MAD, you have a very small choice of optimised skills. The jack-of-all-trades class having less choice than specialized classes? How does that make sense?

Well, it is optimal if you can use ALL your maneuvers all the time, if you take all base maneuvers it's a pretty dumb build unless you have reasons to think your warrior will have to switch equipment all the time and that's not exactly frequent.

This will probably be less important once you start giving base maneuvers for free, it will give incentive to take them all over the place, and the warriors will just kinda have more slots, too.

A warrior can use any combination of maneuvers they want. Can you imagine a rogue with Endurance, Mechanics, Perception, Stealth and Speech? All five? They are not contradictory in flavor, but they use five different attribues. That's MAD.They do have ways to compensate. Dilettante gives you a free trained skill that you can alter multiple times per day at higher levels. Opportunist gives you damage and attack comparable to a warrior.

Of course, a rogue is still getting Talents. You're talking like they're just getting a minor skill boost and nothing else. Warriors can use maneuvers all the time, but they are limited by what they have equipped.


Effectively, throughout the build you can max two ability scores. Your primary attribute and another one of your choice. You can raise three instead, but then two non-primary ones will be smaller.

Take a rogue with Int as a primary attribute. If she chooses to raise Dex each milestone, she won't have high Wis for Nature and Perception. If she chooses to raise Wis, she won't have high Dex and won't be able to fight effectively.The static numbers aren't as important. The talents are more important, it's actually a pivotal aspect of the system. This is the reason why rogue talents also allow rerolls, and why rogues get more essentia than anyone else.


Maximum starting ability score is 4, and you normally want to put it into your primary attribute. Maximum optimised ability score is 7, and if it synergises with your race, 8. That's twice as much

Also, about the system being generous. You are saying that if the roll is more than 15 points, you should drop it and try again. Problem is, 15 is an average roll. You do not ask to drop the highest, you ask to drop half the rolls. That's harsh.

And 12 points for point-buy is really low compared to dice rolls.

Here (http://rumkin.com/reference/dnd/diestats.php) is a good reference for dice roll stats.

Dropping the separation between attributes and modifiers is an excellent idea, and so is making all modifiers positive, but by doing so you compressed the range of possible modifiers twice and changed possibility distribution )=.[QUOTE=Liliet;16562261]You got me there, I'll look at that.

[QUOTE=Liliet;16562261]You are opposed to out-of-combat interaction?Whoops, meant in-game.


Give more MP for spells of one school? Like, +1 MP if you already have this base spell. Not intruding, but useful.Something like it at the least!


Well, let fighers choose between Dex (archer or just a finesse fighter), Str and Con; rogues between Cha (face), Dex and Int; mages between Int, Wis and Cha. That would be good ^^

Also, I really like the idea of characters not just raising their abilities as they level, but also becoming actually smarter, tougher and stronger. Why not give 3 points at each milestone instead of two? It will help with MAD problems but won't disbalance anything so long as you are not allowed to put two points in one attribute at the milestone.I love it! It's true, I didn't like how rogues had less focus on Charisma.


Taking the abilities of another class is what I mean. Can you take the abilities of your own instead?No. Just wanted to make sure we're on the same page, since multiclass isn't a term here.


Hm. How about making a list of possible specializations (I'll try to do it later myself, probably) and giving each of them some special bonus or ability. Like, if you are the performer by profession, you get some Speech bonuses, and so on.

I'll give it more thought a little later.That was my original intention, but I couldn't pull it off. I'll look through your suggestions, thank you! :smallcool:


BTW, as far as I understand, the way Dilettante works now, with it you are actually better at untrained skills than at the trained ones. As you level up it becomes milder, but still at the end if you have +7-8 Int as opposed to +5 from half the level... And at the start you have +0 / +1 from half the level as opposed +4 / +5 from Int.It's intentional. To give rogues that extra edge when it comes to skills.


And I appreciate your system. A lot. I know I already said that, but it's worth reiterating! I imagine it takes A LOT of time and effort to create something that elaborate...It has, but folks like you keep me goin :smallbiggrin:

Liliet
2013-12-08, 04:28 AM
Oh! I think I see, you think the result of the roll! I meant, before you know if the roll is successful. I totally understand how you came to that conclusion now, I'll clarify.

So you roll, decide if it's too low, then use a reroll, or not (before the GM tell you've succeeded of failed; this of course relies on the GM being half-fair and decent to give you that couple seconds to decide).

...what?

Like, you don't calculate how much you need on the roll to succeed before you actually roll the dice?

I can understand it with certain skill challenges, but I think in most cases the player will know.

Well, that depends on the playstyle, I guess... anyway, if you reword it, it'll be just fine ^^



It should just be one when you receive the maneuver. I'll clarify that too.
Aha. Thanks.



I think everything in Classy d20 either affects an "ally", multiple "allies", one "enemy", or multiple "enemies". I do see your point. I'll work on that too.
^^



For the difficult terrain thing, it will probably come up quite a bit, especially if you're using the collateral damage variant.
Does a dungeon room qualify as the difficult terrain? Does a forest clearing qualify as the difficult terrain?

Using difficult terrain in a fight really depends on the playstyle... all right, many things do >_>



Hmm...I like coverting tracks of the whole party, good idea!
Thanks. This is one thing that will contribute to the teamplay ^^ make it useful to have a wild walker in the party the way it's useful to have someone with knowledge and perception skills/talents.



There's gonna be a fluff section too, to give ideas like using the light cantrip as a halo.
I don't remember the fluff that's already there right now, but it definitely read to me like it was supposed to be a halo. Of course, my battlefield-controlling rogue is going to use it as a signal, distraction or to blind enemies...



They do have ways to compensate. Dilettante gives you a free trained skill that you can alter multiple times per day at higher levels. Opportunist gives you damage and attack comparable to a warrior.

Of course, a rogue is still getting Talents. You're talking like they're just getting a minor skill boost and nothing else. Warriors can use maneuvers all the time, but they are limited by what they have equipped.

The static numbers aren't as important. The talents are more important, it's actually a pivotal aspect of the system. This is the reason why rogue talents also allow rerolls, and why rogues get more essentia than anyone else.

You got me there, I'll look at that.
I'll just trust you on that...

(but I still think that application of skills out-of-combat is a more important skill monkey aspect than using Talents, take, for example, age-old rogues&traps... ok, that one is Int-dependent and will work... perception checks are going to be used all the time, and it makes sense to give it to the rogue, like I had already said)



Whoops, meant in-game.
*goes back and rereads the previous post*

I still don't get what you mean o.O Are you saying that the characters should only ever interact with other sentient creatures via fighting them?



Something like it at the least!
^^



I love it! It's true, I didn't like how rogues had less focus on Charisma.
Yay ^^

I'll admit, I love bards. I don't think that having an actual bard class is necessarily a good idea, but I do pay attention to gameplay possibilities given by high Charisma ^^



No. Just wanted to make sure we're on the same page, since multiclass isn't a term here.
...all right, the real problem was mages' SAD anyway.



That was my original intention, but I couldn't pull it off. I'll look through your suggestions, thank you! :smallcool:
Yay!

I'll gladly elaborate, give more suggestion and so on. This is something I'm really interested in and have a lot of ideas ^^



It's intentional. To give rogues that extra edge when it comes to skills.
Yeah, except right now it makes sense for a rogue to NOT take the most useful skill as trained and just use Dilettante. That... doesn't make sense.



It has, but folks like you keep me goin :smallbiggrin:
^^

I'll keep it on!

Lappy9001
2013-12-08, 05:27 PM
Does a dungeon room qualify as the difficult terrain? Does a forest clearing qualify as the difficult terrain?

Using difficult terrain in a fight really depends on the playstyle... all right, many things do >_>Probably not. Difficult terrain is a specific term, defined in Adventuring and Exploration. And all it really does is potentially slow down your movement. I find it helps in a system where everybody is generally much faster (and no AoO's).


I don't remember the fluff that's already there right now, but it definitely read to me like it was supposed to be a halo. Of course, my battlefield-controlling rogue is going to use it as a signal, distraction or to blind enemies...All great uses!


I'll just trust you on that...

(but I still think that application of skills out-of-combat is a more important skill monkey aspect than using Talents, take, for example, age-old rogues&traps... ok, that one is Int-dependent and will work... perception checks are going to be used all the time, and it makes sense to give it to the rogue, like I had already said)I had an epiphany about that at work today. Talents add +2 Skill Points each, so rogues will be rocking a +6 bonus to skills they've invested in (plus the 1/2 level bonus, if trained).

Also, I thought about awarding metamagic for mages when you learn all the spells from a single arcane school. They'll increase the damage, duration, or range of the base spell, or allow you to use it un-augmented for no MP. Gives mages incentive to specialize.

Warrior maneuvers are also going to award specialization through the base maneuvers.


*goes back and rereads the previous post*

I still don't get what you mean o.O Are you saying that the characters should only ever interact with other sentient creatures via fighting them?I am completely saying the opposite. Either way, it's not really important.

[QUOTE=Liliet;16574898]Yeah, except right now it makes sense for a rogue to NOT take the most useful skill as trained and just use Dilettante. That... doesn't make sense.[QUOTE]I believe the +2 Skill bonus mitigates that.

Saidoro
2013-12-08, 05:52 PM
Er, could you please make the third option for mages to make Int primary? Maybe make it weaker than the other two to compensate for synergy with skills...

I do like sorcerers, but "Magic as science" approach is pretty popular and interesting, too.

In fact, if you let the wizards take Int as a primary attribute but without any bonuses from it other than using it for difficulty, it's pretty interestingly fluffed as mages who devoted their life to _studying_ magic as opposed to those with natural talent. Their magic itself is weaker, but they get synergy with Alchemy, Mechanics, Knowledge and, probably counterintuitively, Profession... but then again, humans get bonus to it, might as well put it to good use.
The thing is, you could build that concept just as well with a rogue. There's no reason a wizard has to have levels in the mage class, rogues make fine artificers with the right talents. And even if you do use the mage class, it's entirely possible to just dump either wisdom or charisma in favor of intelligence, the former means you'll have a slightly lower will save and the latter means you'l be using mostly buffs, that's all.

Huh, I guess it actually makes sense that the Dex-based warrior with better Defense from dual wielding do less damage than the Str-based warrior... but wait, they already do. Finesse does not allow to substitute Dex for damage roll, and that's a pretty big drawback.
Dex based warriors also have some big advantages, their initiative is much higher and they have far more mobility, so they can use precision much more consistently, the same mobility advantage means they can use charge pretty much all the time while Heavy armor wearers will often not be able to do so. They act first, they're more versatile, they have better skills, they have access to a few oddball synergies heavy armor wearers can't use. They're a bit less out of the box, but far from crippled. Remember that each attack where they have precision is an extra 14 damage at high levels, contrasting with the strength fighter's +6 or +7. And the turns where you get to attack at all due to being able to reach the target in one turn when the strength fighter can't or due to being low on hit points and acting early than the enemy blaster mage instead of after amount to even more damage than that.

The system is generous, but if you want your character to be reasonably powerful, you'll focus on ONE secondary attribute. It's possible to make a mage focused on Wis and Int, but he'll have no combat ability, period. And therefore will have no use for most talents. Take Mechanics: use of Magitech weapons? Disrupting weapon of an adjacent enemy?
That's not true at all. The mage could just stock up on buff support and healing spells while choosing the wisdom option. Couple that with skills like alchemy and you've got a pretty fearsome support character. Likewise, you could make a rogue who drops dexterity for charisma and spends their time using inspire, intimidate and spells grabbed through bonus or one who drops intelligence for strength and just glass cannons things all day long or a fighter who uses dexterity to fight and barely needs strength at all. The system has skill, maneuvers and spells to support any of those things already and quite a few others besides.

Knaight
2013-12-09, 02:15 PM
At this point I suspect playtesting is what we need for some of the balance - the game appears ready to support it. A Skype game with four people could about do it (one GM, one player per class). Based on thread activity, I suspect that Lappy, Liliet, and I might be able to arrange for a game, which leaves only one hole.

Liliet
2013-12-09, 03:34 PM
Probably not. Difficult terrain is a specific term, defined in Adventuring and Exploration. And all it really does is potentially slow down your movement. I find it helps in a system where everybody is generally much faster (and no AoO's).
I understand that the term has specific meaning, but actually paying attention to whether where you are fighting qualifies as a difficult terrain requires attention not everyone is willing to pay. Just like the rations - not everyone tracks them.

It's pretty easy to assume that the spot you are fighting on was chosen to be free of rubble and undergrowth for specifically that purpose - fighting on it.

It's more difficult to ignore the fact that you are travelling through the thick forest with barely any paths when, well, you are.



All great uses!
Oh yeah :smallamused: With right use I suspect it's one of the most powerful cantrips out there. Synergises with the Ghost sound for all of these purposes, too.



I had an epiphany about that at work today. Talents add +2 Skill Points each, so rogues will be rocking a +6 bonus to skills they've invested in (plus the 1/2 level bonus, if trained).
Now that's quite a YAY there :smallcool:



Also, I thought about awarding metamagic for mages when you learn all the spells from a single arcane school. They'll increase the damage, duration, or range of the base spell, or allow you to use it un-augmented for no MP. Gives mages incentive to specialize.
Ooh! Now this is a good one!



Warrior maneuvers are also going to award specialization through the base maneuvers.
Warrior maneuvers don't need to specifically award specialization, they already do it by virtue of only being usable/useful with a specific weapon and specific tactics.



I am completely saying the opposite. Either way, it's not really important.
...okay, I'll just trust you on that.



I believe the +2 Skill bonus mitigates that.
...what bonus?



The thing is, you could build that concept just as well with a rogue. There's no reason a wizard has to have levels in the mage class, rogues make fine artificers with the right talents. And even if you do use the mage class, it's entirely possible to just dump either wisdom or charisma in favor of intelligence, the former means you'll have a slightly lower will save and the latter means you'l be using mostly buffs, that's all.
I adressed it at the end of my other post. The mages' problem is not not needing Int, it's not needing any attribute other than the primary one AT ALL.



Dex based warriors also have some big advantages, their initiative is much higher and they have far more mobility, so they can use precision much more consistently, the same mobility advantage means they can use charge pretty much all the time while Heavy armor wearers will often not be able to do so. They act first, they're more versatile, they have better skills, they have access to a few oddball synergies heavy armor wearers can't use. They're a bit less out of the box, but far from crippled. Remember that each attack where they have precision is an extra 14 damage at high levels, contrasting with the strength fighter's +6 or +7. And the turns where you get to attack at all due to being able to reach the target in one turn when the strength fighter can't or due to being low on hit points and acting early than the enemy blaster mage instead of after amount to even more damage than that.
...ok.



That's not true at all. The mage could just stock up on buff support and healing spells while choosing the wisdom option. Couple that with skills like alchemy and you've got a pretty fearsome support character. Likewise, you could make a rogue who drops dexterity for charisma and spends their time using inspire, intimidate and spells grabbed through bonus or one who drops intelligence for strength and just glass cannons things all day long or a fighter who uses dexterity to fight and barely needs strength at all. The system has skill, maneuvers and spells to support any of those things already and quite a few others besides.
Alchemy, yeah, that's a pretty good support one, you are right. Especially giving the Healing Touch talent.

Anyway, see my post that starts with profession suggestion for what's really wrong with mages. I couldn't quite put my finger at it while building my mage and started just complaining about the random things, sorry.



At this point I suspect playtesting is what we need for some of the balance - the game appears ready to support it. A Skype game with four people could about do it (one GM, one player per class). Based on thread activity, I suspect that Lappy, Liliet, and I might be able to arrange for a game, which leaves only one hole.
*Fluttershy's voice* YAY!!!!

The only problem I see with it is that we appear to be from different timezones, at least me and Lappy. But meh, whatever, I don't need to get up early these days.

If we do start the game, 1) I'm not a DM (well, that'll most definitely be Lappy in any case, but I'm sick enough of DMing when I want to play to qualify that separately) and 2) I'm playing my battlefield control rogue I posted earlier.

Also, I can play two characters if needed.

The game still needs rules on alchemy and magic items, though...

Lappy9001
2013-12-09, 05:38 PM
At this point I suspect playtesting is what we need for some of the balance - the game appears ready to support it. A Skype game with four people could about do it (one GM, one player per class). Based on thread activity, I suspect that Lappy, Liliet, and I might be able to arrange for a game, which leaves only one hole.A brilliant idea! Give me just a tiny bit before we organize anything (Speaking of which, Maneuvers are pretty much done, minus one new maneuver).


I understand that the term has specific meaning, but actually paying attention to whether where you are fighting qualifies as a difficult terrain requires attention not everyone is willing to pay. Just like the rations - not everyone tracks them.

It's pretty easy to assume that the spot you are fighting on was chosen to be free of rubble and undergrowth for specifically that purpose - fighting on it.

It's more difficult to ignore the fact that you are travelling through the thick forest with barely any paths when, well, you are.Typically, you either just outline the squares that are difficult terrain, or use those little triangle icons with the pre-printed dungeon tiles and mats. Track it or not, it's everywhere, even corpses count, and I imagine every game is going to have at least a few of those.

I would assume the opposite. Getting ambushed in a forest, fighting in crumbling ruins, trash in city streets, sheets of ice, large bodies of water are all common occurences in games, unless the fights occur on stone dungeon tiles with no variation. Barring that, difficult terrain is going to come up, likely often.


Ooh! Now this is a good one!Thanks, that's my project for tonight.


Warrior maneuvers don't need to specifically award specialization, they already do it by virtue of only being usable/useful with a specific weapon and specific tactics.Maneuvers (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=13010291&postcount=8)are up to the final draft stage if you wanna look them over.


...what bonus?+2 Skill Points per talent instead of just +1. I compared the numbers, it seems to check out.


I adressed it at the end of my other post. The mages' problem is not not needing Int, it's not needing any attribute other than the primary one AT ALL.So, Wisdom for Magic Points and Will saves, Charisma for Difficulty. Granted, you will still need things like Dex and Con. Spells can do a lot, but it's not like 3.5 where you can flat out get whatever you need from them. Dex is a better choice for AC than Spell Shield....especially since I just noticed a really bad typo that makes it next to worthless. Gonna fix that.


Anyway, see my post that starts with profession suggestion for what's really wrong with mages. I couldn't quite put my finger at it while building my mage and started just complaining about the random things, sorry.Well, you did raise some fair points, and gave me a few new great ideas!


The only problem I see with it is that we appear to be from different timezones, at least me and Lappy. But meh, whatever, I don't need to get up early these days.I'm Eastern Standard Time (EST GMT -5:00). Schedule is...unpredictable, but I could arrange something.


If we do start the game, 1) I'm not a DM (well, that'll most definitely be Lappy in any case, but I'm sick enough of DMing when I want to play to qualify that separately) and 2) I'm playing my battlefield control rogue I posted earlier.

Also, I can play two characters if needed.I certainly don't mind running my own system, although I've never ran a skype/pbp game before.


The game still needs rules on alchemy and magic items, though...Yes it very much does. Working on it :smallcool:

Liliet
2013-12-09, 05:57 PM
A brilliant idea! Give me just a tiny bit before we organize anything (Speaking of which, Maneuvers are pretty much done, minus one new maneuver).
Yay!



Typically, you either just outline the squares that are difficult terrain, or use those little triangle icons with the pre-printed dungeon tiles and mats. Track it or not, it's everywhere, even corpses count, and I imagine every game is going to have at least a few of those.
Or, if you don't have the pre-printed mats/tiles/whatever and use, say, lego pieces to represent the battlefield (like my group did), just ignore this additional complication and pretend all terrain is simple.



I would assume the opposite. Getting ambushed in a forest, fighting in crumbling ruins, trash in city streets, sheets of ice, large bodies of water are all common occurences in games, unless the fights occur on stone dungeon tiles with no variation. Barring that, difficult terrain is going to come up, likely often.
Only if you have attention and interest to track it.



Thanks, that's my project for tonight.

Maneuvers (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=13010291&postcount=8)are up to the final draft stage if you wanna look them over.
yay for both!
*went off to check out*

I don't remember what they were like before, except the base maneuvers were not influenced by the number of other maneuvers possessed? That's a sweet addition anyway. Gotta rebuild my lancer warrior ^^



+2 Skill Points per talent instead of just +1. I compared the numbers, it seems to check out.
How exactly are talents taken related to whether the skill is trained? An untrained skill with all three talents taken and Dilletante bonus is still better than a trained skill with all three talents taken.



So, Wisdom for Magic Points and Will saves, Charisma for Difficulty. Granted, you will still need things like Dex and Con. Spells can do a lot, but it's not like 3.5 where you can flat out get whatever you need from them. Dex is a better choice for AC than Spell Shield....especially since I just noticed a really bad typo that makes it next to worthless. Gonna fix that.

Well, you did raise some fair points, and gave me a few new great ideas!
^^
glad to be of help!



I'm Eastern Standard Time (EST GMT -5:00). Schedule is...unpredictable, but I could arrange something.
I'm GMT+2. 7 hours of difference, as I suspected. Right now it's almost 1 a.m. at my place.

Of course, given that we have 1-2 lectures a week these days and all my projects are done on the notebook at my place at my pace, I can stay up pretty much whenever, especially for the pbp game. I missed those.



I certainly don't mind running my own system, although I've never ran a skype/pbp game before.
I have never played a skype game, but I know pbp and it's not hard. In fact, it's very convenient in that you can reference past events at any moment and don't need to rely on your memory. It can also be "paused" and "resumed" at any moment without missing anything so long as everyone does it: everything is written down!

In other words: I wanna I wanna I wanna...



Yes it very much does. Working on it :smallcool:
Heh. My rogue alchemist and I are very much looking forward to it ^^

Lappy9001
2013-12-09, 06:10 PM
Or, if you don't have the pre-printed mats/tiles/whatever and use, say, lego pieces to represent the battlefield (like my group did), just ignore this additional complication and pretend all terrain is simple.

Only if you have attention and interest to track it.Naturally, if that's your playstyle. That doesn't make the uses and applications of difficult terrain here any less of a valid option :smallsmile:


yay for both!
*went off to check out*

I don't remember what they were like before, except the base maneuvers were not influenced by the number of other maneuvers possessed? That's a sweet addition anyway. Gotta rebuild my lancer warrior ^^Pretty similar, except the formatting was bad and it didn't have the necessary tactics that Amechra (Thanks!) suggested. More focus on saves, some of the weaker maneuvers got better (I love everything about Smite right now) and unarmed got shifted into Weapons Mastery. Most of the unarmed maneuvers either weren't great or weren't really unarmed-themed to begin with. Now, you can just take the Pugilist maneuver, double increase the damage dice of your fists, and you're set. And ironically, it now makes it easier to be a monk, 'cause now all you need is one maneuver to get your unarmed combat on.

This means we're still one martial discipline short, and I plan to fill it with Berserker.


How exactly are talents taken related to whether the skill is trained? An untrained skill with all three talents taken and Dilletante bonus is still better than a trained skill with all three talents taken.Doesn't matter if it's trained or not, you get +2 Skill Points for each talent. I'm totally okay with Dilettante being better, since it's effectively a "freebie" trained skill. I do like how skills let you choose whether to specialize or min/max it. You know, make a guy who's trained skill is Endurance, and taking all the Endurance talents versus taking them with the skill un trained. Either can be equally valid depending on what you're going for.


I'm GMT+2. 7 hours of difference, as I suspected. Right now it's almost 1 a.m. at my place.

Of course, given that we have 1-2 lectures a week these days and all my projects are done on the notebook at my place at my pace, I can stay up pretty much whenever, especially for the pbp game. I missed those.

I have never played a skype game, but I know pbp and it's not hard. In fact, it's very convenient in that you can reference past events at any moment and don't need to rely on your memory. It can also be "paused" and "resumed" at any moment without missing anything so long as everyone does it: everything is written down!

Heh. My rogue alchemist and I are very much looking forward to it ^^I'll figure it out, I'm sure :smallbiggrin:

Baniff
2013-12-09, 06:30 PM
I've been following this thread since it was first posted. I love where the system is going. I'll be playing a one- off with it this week; I'll let you know how it goes. Thanks everyone for all the great work here!

Lappy9001
2013-12-09, 07:21 PM
I've been following this thread since it was first posted. I love where the system is going. I'll be playing a one- off with it this week; I'll let you know how it goes. Thanks everyone for all the great work here!Wonderful! Of course, keep in mind that the system is in a slight flux at the moment. Maneuvers are pretty much finished, but Spells and Talents will be changing soon, and more content will be added to equipment.

And definitely let me know how the game progresses (And feel free to ask any questions that arise)

Lappy9001
2013-12-09, 07:26 PM
Treant
Treants are one of the most powerful of nature’s guardians. Wardens of the forest, they slowly patrol the heart of the woodlands, protecting the natural life and guiding lost souls out of the verdant labyrinth. Not disposed towards violence, treants nevertheless guard their homes with unmatched ferocity if pushed, although they prefer diplomacy to blows.

Treant
This towering creature looks like an enormous tree giant, with bark-covered skin, slend root-like hands, and wide leafy branches sprouting from a gnarled face.

Treant (Plant)
Tough Monster (Huge) 7
HP: ____/ 112
Str: +8* Dex: -2 Wis: +4
Con: +5 Int: +1 Cha: +1

Initiative: -2 Perception: +4
Speed: 3 Stealth: +5*

Defense: 21 Resist: Physical 17
Fort: +10 Ref: +1 Will: +7

Immunity: Poisoned
Weakness: Fire (1˝ Damage), Speed Penalty

Attack (Slam): +15 Melee
1d10 + 11 Physical

Special Attack
Push
Difficulty: 21
As a minor action a treant can push the target of a successful slam attack up to 4 squares away from the treant. Targets that succeed a Fortitude save are unaffected.

Sweep
As a minor action after a successful slam attack, a treant may make another melee Attack on an adjacent enemy.

Special Traits
Improved Hit Points
Improved Natural Defense (x2)
Improved Skill (Speech, Stealth)

Skills
+6 Speech*

Lappy9001
2013-12-09, 10:59 PM
Dryad
Sylvan spirits that bind with a large plant or tree, dryads are known for guarding their wards with undying devotion. Bonding with their surrounds, dryads have unique abilities that allow them to teleport from tree to tree, and to protect them from forest fires and deadly enemies alike.

Dryad
This spirit appears as a beautiful woman with skin of polished wood, leaves for hair, and moves with surprising grace.

Dryad (Plant)
Support Monster 4
HP: ____/ 33
Str: -1 Dex: +4 Wis: +3
Con: +0 Int: +2 Cha: +6*

Initiative: +4 Perception: +3
Speed: 5 Stealth: +8*

Defense: 16 Resist: Physical 11
Fort: +2 Ref: +6 Will: +7

Immunity: Poisoned
Weakness: Attribute Penalty (Str), Fire (1˝ Damage)

Attack (Slam): +6 Melee
1d4 -1 Physical

Special Attack
Forest Stride (Special Ability)
Daily Use: ___ / 2
A dryad can teleport up to 4 Squares into an unoccupied space adjacent to a tree. After the teleport, the dryad gains the Concealment condition for 3 rounds.

Slyvan Trance (Ranged Affliction)
Daily Use: ___ / 4
Difficulty: 18
As a minor action, a dryad can afflict the target of a slam attack with the Demoralized condition for 3 rounds. Targets that succeed a Will save are unaffected.

Special Qualities
Forest Guardian (Dampening Aura)
A dryad can cause all effects that deal Fire damage within 10 Squares to deal -1 damage per dice.

Special Traits
Improved Hit Points

Skills
+4 Alchemy*, +9 Nature*, +8 Speech*

Liliet
2013-12-10, 02:52 AM
Naturally, if that's your playstyle. That doesn't make the uses and applications of difficult terrain here any less of a valid option :smallsmile:
No, it does not. What were we talking about again?...

Ah, right. Wild Walker who can now be useful to the whole party, yay!



Pretty similar, except the formatting was bad and it didn't have the necessary tactics that Amechra (Thanks!) suggested. More focus on saves, some of the weaker maneuvers got better (I love everything about Smite right now) and unarmed got shifted into Weapons Mastery. Most of the unarmed maneuvers either weren't great or weren't really unarmed-themed to begin with. Now, you can just take the Pugilist maneuver, double increase the damage dice of your fists, and you're set. And ironically, it now makes it easier to be a monk, 'cause now all you need is one maneuver to get your unarmed combat on.
Ah, now I see. So it means one of the Weapons Mastery maneuvres is gone for good.

I'm worried about Unarmed, though. A warrior monk only has 8 maneuvers to take right now - Spellbreaker line, Tactician line and 2 out of 3 Weapon Mastery maneuvers. And Spellbreaker is only situationally useful...

2 more maneuvers have to be taken with a weapon / armor, doesn't that break flavor a bit?



This means we're still one martial discipline short, and I plan to fill it with Berserker.
I'll be waiting ^^



Doesn't matter if it's trained or not, you get +2 Skill Points for each talent. I'm totally okay with Dilettante being better, since it's effectively a "freebie" trained skill. I do like how skills let you choose whether to specialize or min/max it. You know, make a guy who's trained skill is Endurance, and taking all the Endurance talents versus taking them with the skill un trained. Either can be equally valid depending on what you're going for.

I'll figure it out, I'm sure :smallbiggrin:
I just can't see how it's better for my alchemst rogue to NOT take Alchemy as a trained skill flavor-wise. It doesn't make sense.

Maybe the Dilettante route should offer some bonuses to the trained skills, or just one skill?...


Also, Treants and Dryads are pretty cool! I so like how your system does not paint everyone but the PC races black and red in the bullseye pattern :smallsigh:

Lappy9001
2013-12-10, 11:12 AM
Ah, now I see. So it means one of the Weapons Mastery maneuvres is gone for good.

I'm worried about Unarmed, though. A warrior monk only has 8 maneuvers to take right now - Spellbreaker line, Tactician line and 2 out of 3 Weapon Mastery maneuvers. And Spellbreaker is only situationally useful...

2 more maneuvers have to be taken with a weapon / armor, doesn't that break flavor a bit?I figured going Light Armor would work fine ('cause you don't have to be wearing any armor to use it)


I just can't see how it's better for my alchemst rogue to NOT take Alchemy as a trained skill flavor-wise. It doesn't make sense.

Maybe the Dilettante route should offer some bonuses to the trained skills, or just one skill?...I do see your point, but using dilettante for the skill you use most is kinda sub-optimal because you'd be missing out on the ability to move the bonus around. It was my way of giving rogues more than 4 trained skills without allowing them to be the best at everything all the time (a problem with past drafts)


Also, Treants and Dryads are pretty cool! I so like how your system does not paint everyone but the PC races black and red in the bullseye pattern :smallsigh:Thank you! I have quite a few more done (plus the conversions of Kornaki's monsters), but I need to write fluff for all the others. And it's part of the system's philosophy regarding monsters: every monster should be a unique encounter, not just a meaty sack of XP. Unless the intent is to make a strong, resilient brute of course.

Liliet
2013-12-10, 02:39 PM
I figured going Light Armor would work fine ('cause you don't have to be wearing any armor to use it)
...right. I'm slow.



I do see your point, but using dilettante for the skill you use most is kinda sub-optimal because you'd be missing out on the ability to move the bonus around. It was my way of giving rogues more than 4 trained skills without allowing them to be the best at everything all the time (a problem with past drafts)
It might be sub-optimal from the point of view of having many skills, but it is pretty optimal if your whole build is focused around that one thing you do.

How hard is it to make trained skills equal to or slightly better than the Dilettante bonus?



Thank you! I have quite a few more done (plus the conversions of Kornaki's monsters), but I need to write fluff for all the others. And it's part of the system's philosophy regarding monsters: every monster should be a unique encounter, not just a meaty sack of XP. Unless the intent is to make a strong, resilient brute of course.
I won't say anything about monsters because it starts at the very term pissing me off. I'm a person that keeps trying to do a Pacifist Run in World of Warcraft... I'm not the right person to ask about who to kill and how to make them about that.

Just... Good luck. And thanks for not including "default" alignments.

Lappy9001
2013-12-17, 01:03 AM
Updates are here, metamagic is now a thing (near the top of the Spells section), and skills are mostly up to date. Fixed some minor typos and knowledge rolls aren't nearly as wonky as before.

I definitely want to add a tertiary primary attribute ability to each class, Dex for Warriors, Intelligence for Mages, and Charisma for Rogues. Unfortunately, I don't have any ideas other than Charisma for rogues (granting an inspire-like ability). I'm also having problems thinking of uses for the Speech spell, as well as how to handle teleportation and summoning.

Liliet
2013-12-17, 04:04 AM
Updates are here, metamagic is now a thing (near the top of the Spells section), and skills are mostly up to date. Fixed some minor typos and knowledge rolls aren't nearly as wonky as before.

I definitely want to add a tertiary primary attribute ability to each class, Dex for Warriors, Intelligence for Mages, and Charisma for Rogues. Unfortunately, I don't have any ideas other than Charisma for rogues (granting an inspire-like ability). I'm also having problems thinking of uses for the Speech spell, as well as how to handle teleportation and summoning.

Dex-Warriors use Dex for damage and, mmm, get 1 Athletics talent for free?

And Mages are still SAD. Seriously, a Mage does not need anything but 1 primary attribute for spellcasting. A Wis-based Mage can dump Charisma without any problems and a Cha-based Mage can dump Wis. That's just... nor fair, somehow.

The attribute rolls are still capped at half. It safely guarantees that the majority of characters will have 14 or 15 points total without much variance. Are you sure that's the intended effect?

Speech spell?...


And is there anything about magic items and alchemy? I noticed that the Table of Contents does not link to the Variant Rules anymore...


Anyway, this post was a pretty sweet present for my birthday (which is today), woohoo! Thanks!

Baniff
2013-12-17, 11:24 AM
Hopefully tonight I'll post my full thoughts from my experience playing last week, but a quick question first: Can a Mage add Charisma to cantrip damage? Specifically Shadow Weapon

Lappy9001
2013-12-18, 01:49 AM
Big Thing Edit: The Skills section is now fully updated to the final draft version :smallcool:


Hopefully tonight I'll post my full thoughts from my experience playing last week, but a quick question first: Can a Mage add Charisma to cantrip damage? Specifically Shadow WeaponSorry that the formatting is such a mess at the moment. And to answer your question, no, because the Charisma ability only boosts 'spells' and shadow weapon is a cantrip.


And Mages are still SAD. Seriously, a Mage does not need anything but 1 primary attribute for spellcasting. A Wis-based Mage can dump Charisma without any problems and a Cha-based Mage can dump Wis. That's just... nor fair, somehow.They still need all the things that other characters need, like Defense, Hit Points, Saves, and Skills which can't come from Wisdom/Charisma alone (and can't be largely replicated by spells like in 3.5). Nobody's utterly dependant on more than two attributes (depending on build) so I'm really not worried about it.


The attribute rolls are still capped at half. It safely guarantees that the majority of characters will have 14 or 15 points total without much variance. Are you sure that's the intended effect?I haven't touched that yet. The original point was to prevent somebody having max attributes (which is far easier with 6d4 than in 4d6, drop lowest, x 6).


Speech spell?...Skill. Don't worry, though, I believe I figured it out at work today. Working on updating it now, actually.


And is there anything about magic items and alchemy? I noticed that the Table of Contents does not link to the Variant Rules anymore...Table of Contents is a mess, but the post is still there. I'm working on that too.


Anyway, this post was a pretty sweet present for my birthday (which is today), woohoo! Thanks!Oh, wow, happy birthday! Glad I waited to post a potentially party-themed monster :smalltongue:

(you'll see in just a sec :smallwink:)

Lappy9001
2013-12-18, 02:05 AM
Booze
One of the more bizarre creations born of arcane meddling, a booze (also known as 'beer ooze') is a result of magic being used heavily in the fermentation and brewing process of alcoholic beverages. If left to sit for too long, the slightest hint of magic can give a barrel a semblance of life. While the occurence of a booze is rare, they tend to emerge at remarkably inopportune times, such as tavern brawls, given the high chance of a spell going awry in the melee.

Booze
This bubbling ooze is topped with a hearty froth, and a clear amber colouring as it slowly sloshes about.

Booze (Plant)
Support Monster (Unliving) 2
HP: ____/ 31
Str: +4 Dex: -1 Wis: +0
Con: +4* Int: +1 Cha: +3

Initiative: +0 Perception: +1*
Speed: 3 Stealth: +0

Defense: 10 Resist: -
Fort: +4 Ref: -1 Will: +2

Immunity: Demoralized
Weakness: Attribute Penalty (Dex), Speed Penalty

Attack (Slam): +5 Melee
1d4 + 5 Physical

Special Attack
Slosh (Curse)
Daily Use: ___ / 3
Difficulty: 15
As a major action, a booze can inflict an enemy within 5 Squares a -2 penalty to Attack and Save rolls for 3 rounds. Targets that succeed a Will save are unaffected. A target may only be under the effect of 1 curse at a time.

Special Qualities
Intoxicating Aura (Condition Aura)
All enemies within 2 Squares of a Booze become Weakened for 3 rounds.

Special Traits
Improved Hit Points

Skills
+7 Endurance*, +1 Nature*, +2 Profession*

Liliet
2013-12-18, 11:26 AM
Big Thing Edit: The Skills section is now fully updated to the final draft version :smallcool:

Sorry that the formatting is such a mess at the moment. And to answer your question, no, because the Charisma ability only boosts 'spells' and shadow weapon is a cantrip.

They still need all the things that other characters need, like Defense, Hit Points, Saves, and Skills which can't come from Wisdom/Charisma alone (and can't be largely replicated by spells like in 3.5). Nobody's utterly dependant on more than two attributes (depending on build) so I'm really not worried about it.

I haven't touched that yet. The original point was to prevent somebody having max attributes (which is far easier with 6d4 than in 4d6, drop lowest, x 6).

Skill. Don't worry, though, I believe I figured it out at work today. Working on updating it now, actually.

Table of Contents is a mess, but the post is still there. I'm working on that too.

Oh, wow, happy birthday! Glad I waited to post a potentially party-themed monster :smalltongue:

(you'll see in just a sec :smallwink:)

Hahaha, the monster is completely irrelevant 'cause we don't drink much (= we are going to play Minecraft now instead. (I'm partying today, not yesterday, because reasons) I really want to answer, and I will, I swear, later this evening ^^

Woohooo!!!!! :elan:

Baniff
2013-12-19, 03:27 PM
Random things I've noticed:

The mechanics are very combat-heavy. A few spells, like Blur, have great out of combat utility, which is something I like. As a GM, I let ice spells freeze water to make bridges, fire spells can burn obstacles, etc. You currently have to go outside of RAW to make that happen though.

I'll look over the new skills' update before I comment on that.

Mages are a bit SAD. But so is everyone.

Dex-Rogues are a little silly at low levels. Opportunist/Precision stacking is very potent, and triggering on enemies with lower initiative makes it extremely reliable. Almost too reliable. It makes me weep for the Str- damage warrior. Adding Dex- to damage steps on the warriors toes.

As is common in most systems, Mages have a lot of fun, flashy powers. The MP augmenting system is fun and gives them a choice every round.

Something that's interesting: Wis- Mages can afford to augment their offensive spells more often than Cha-Mages, so their still dealing good damage, or they can save their MP for healing/buffs. That extra versatility makes them a little more powerful in my eyes.

Rogues get A LOT of skills. They can easily be trained in all of them. I think giving Mages 2, Warriors 3, and Rogues 4 would go a long way in diversifying parties' skill selection.

The Tactics Maneuvers should use Intelligence in some way. Right now, it's a pretty sub-par ability score, which is something that always disappointed me in DnD and something I hope you can change.

Keep in mind these are only my opinions and experiences.

Overall, I really enjoyed playing. Making characters/ monsters is quick, but I would definitely recommend upping the damage die on weapons. No one likes rolling d4's. My group wants to make this a regular game in our rotation, so I count that as a success on your end.

Lappy9001
2013-12-22, 01:05 AM
Magic is 90% into final draft :smallcool:


The mechanics are very combat-heavy. A few spells, like Blur, have great out of combat utility, which is something I like. As a GM, I let ice spells freeze water to make bridges, fire spells can burn obstacles, etc. You currently have to go outside of RAW to make that happen though.I'm working on updating the description of arcane schools to reflect that. I did it last night, but my browser crashed and I had to start over. Speaking of spells, they're 90% finished and have far more utility than before.


Dex-Rogues are a little silly at low levels. Opportunist/Precision stacking is very potent, and triggering on enemies with lower initiative makes it extremely reliable. Almost too reliable. It makes me weep for the Str- damage warrior. Adding Dex- to damage steps on the warriors toes.How about the extra damage dice only works on opponents that haven't acted this round? That should help it out a good bit.


As is common in most systems, Mages have a lot of fun, flashy powers. The MP augmenting system is fun and gives them a choice every round.

Something that's interesting: Wis- Mages can afford to augment their offensive spells more often than Cha-Mages, so their still dealing good damage, or they can save their MP for healing/buffs. That extra versatility makes them a little more powerful in my eyes.That's going to change. I realized I didn't like Cha-mages to focus only on the damage-dealing spells. What I'm thinking (rough draft):

Intelligence Ability
When casting a spell that deals Cold, Fire, or Shock damage, you can change the damage type as a free action. When you are affected by a spell that deals Cold, Fire, or Shock damage, you can change the damage type as a free action, even if it is not your turn. You can use (Intelligence ability) a number of times per day equal to your Intelligence

Wisdom Ability
When rolling for Magic Points add your Wisdom to the roll instead of +2 (I ran the math and this makes a big difference. However, if I implement it I'll raise the default MP bonus to 1d4+3 which irons things out a bit)

Charisma Ability
You can augment spells as if you were 1 level higher a number of times per day equal to your Charisma.


Rogues get A LOT of skills. They can easily be trained in all of them. I think giving Mages 2, Warriors 3, and Rogues 4 would go a long way in diversifying parties' skill selection.Works for me.


The Tactics Maneuvers should use Intelligence in some way. Right now, it's a pretty sub-par ability score, which is something that always disappointed me in DnD and something I hope you can change.I heartily agree, but I'm having difficulty coming up with other ways to use Intelligence.


Overall, I really enjoyed playing. Making characters/ monsters is quick, but I would definitely recommend upping the damage die on weapons. No one likes rolling d4's. My group wants to make this a regular game in our rotation, so I count that as a success on your end.That's fantastic, I'm glad you and your group enjoyed it :smallcool:

Legendxp
2013-12-23, 12:09 AM
SO MUCH TEXT!!! (O_o) I'll be reading up on this but it might take a while.

Lappy9001
2013-12-23, 01:40 AM
SO MUCH TEXT!!! (O_o) I'll be reading up on this but it might take a while.Well I appreciate it! If nothing else, I managed to get the table of contents more updated (and the end of each post links back to it). Please let me know what you think and any suggestions you might have :smallsmile:

Liliet
2013-12-24, 02:14 AM
I'm sorry for not responding as I promised, the session has started )=

What I want to ask is are you going to do anything with the attributes?

See, the 3d6 attributes were pretty close to the middle all the time because 3 dice were rolled, and that's how probability works. Very low values were exceptional, as were very high. 10 was actually the most probable result, as in, it showed up a lot more than others.

1d4 has equal probability for all values. You get 1 just as often as 2 just as often as 3 just as often as 4. None of these are exceptional or rare in any way. There is no average. You are going to have a lot of high values.

I'd suggest rolling 3d3 and letting the attributes be in the range from 3 to 9. It corresponds to the modifiers range in DnD (from -4 to +4) and has an average in the middle. Of course, that'd require a lot of tweaking numbers elsewhere, so it's nothing more than a suggestion.



And I like the ideas for Int, Wis and Cha mages ^^

Lappy9001
2013-12-25, 04:45 AM
What I want to ask is are you going to do anything with the attributes?

See, the 3d6 attributes were pretty close to the middle all the time because 3 dice were rolled, and that's how probability works. Very low values were exceptional, as were very high. 10 was actually the most probable result, as in, it showed up a lot more than others.

1d4 has equal probability for all values. You get 1 just as often as 2 just as often as 3 just as often as 4. None of these are exceptional or rare in any way. There is no average. You are going to have a lot of high values.

I'd suggest rolling 3d3 and letting the attributes be in the range from 3 to 9. It corresponds to the modifiers range in DnD (from -4 to +4) and has an average in the middle. Of course, that'd require a lot of tweaking numbers elsewhere, so it's nothing more than a suggestion.

And I like the ideas for Int, Wis and Cha mages ^^Yes, they're definitely going to change, it's pretty bad right now. Originally, I did just have 3d6 (technically 4d6 drop lowest), but you just use the modifier from then on.

I do want to make it simple but also balanced. With that goal in mind, 3d6 rolled 6 times seems needlessly complex. But seeing as I don't have any ideas, I'm definitely open to suggestions.

Baniff
2013-12-25, 04:21 PM
I don't see anything wrong with 3d6, use only modifiers. It works in the Dragon Age TRPG.

Liliet
2013-12-26, 03:30 AM
3d3 or 3d4 and use as modifiers. The second one might be a bit too versatile...

Anyway, so long as 3 dice are rolled, the probability distribution is as it was with 3d6. The idea to use values themselves instead of modifiers is very, very good - at the very least, abilities list looks much better without negatives, and what looks good is actually very important for the game of imagination.

I'm not sure how combat math would work with higher possible modifiers, though, but I'd at least try to just straight-up do it, use high modifiers and see what it looks like.

It would, from the top of the head, make the Dilettante problem worse, of course, but there's a number of ways to fix it. Other than that... if everyone has higher modifiers, I'm not sure balance would be seriously affected.

And to make the heroes special, 4d3 drop the lowest.

(I'd actually try to build a character like that right now, but the dreaded session...)

EDIT: I did try. The numbers are not very versatile and are closer to the middle than 3d6, but the values of 3d6 were then cut in half to use as modifiers anyway, so I say it's about equal.

According to the probability calculator (http://anydice.com/), the average for 3d3 is 6 and the average for 18d3 (the sum of abilities) is 36. It looks reasonable to cut too low rolls at 30 total and the highest at 42 total.

Lappy9001
2014-01-03, 07:08 PM
I probably made some typos converting it to html, but Magic Items (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=13010725&postcount=12) are (finally) complete. That just leaves equipment, the final maneuver (I'm acutally thinking mounted instead of berserker), and the final Storm spell.

Currently, there are no magic items enhancing spells. The idea was that spells are already modified by spending additional MP, so they don't need them. However, I'm not 100% sold that this is a good idea.

Also, Intelligence is more useful. It's the driving force behind essentia and is crucial for bombs/potions.

I went a different direction with alchemical items, and I now have something 3.5 never had: Mana potions :smallcool:

And Open Call: I'm bad at creating artifacts. I could use any and all suggestions!

Amechra
2014-01-03, 10:24 PM
What stops you from making both? :smalltongue:

Oh, and here a few of my artifacts, translated to Classy d20:

Dread: This Keen Dispelling Finesse Slashing One-Handed Weapon can be used to inflict the Demoralized or Weakened conditions instead of dealing damage. These conditions last until the victim has a good night's sleep.

Auferstehung: This Charging Fire Masterwork Slashing Two-Handed Weapon is incapable of dealing Fire damage to monsters without the Unliving trait. Against monsters with the Unliving trait, it automatically is treated as if 1 Essentia had been spent on rolling additional Fire damage. In addition, if it deals a Critical Hit against a monster with the Unliving trait, that monster loses that trait.

Saidoro
2014-01-04, 02:18 AM
The alchemical items rules seem a little off, especially the ones that double-charge on essentia. I get why it's done, you don't want wealthy players doping themselves to the gills with every imaginable buff potion so you make them require bound essentia and you don't want them robbing Healing Potions R' Us and never ever dying so you make those cost essentia to use. But how often do you think people will be spending 2 essentia on healing potions when they can spend 1 essentia on Healing Touch and heal more at every level save the very highest ones? It may be better to just remove the part about alchemical items binding essentia and find some other way of limiting the buff ones. Or maybe make it so some bind essentia and some don't. Speaking of, do the buff potions count towards your maximum of four magical properties? Do healing potions?

You didn't update the essentia limits in the quick-play section or the rogue's luck shot.

Dilletante seems like it should increase the bonus instead of the uses per day at milestones, the +1 is a bit puny later on.

The Efficient Design talent needs an update.

Lappy9001
2014-01-04, 02:58 AM
What stops you from making both? :smalltongue:

Oh, and here a few of my artifacts, translated to Classy d20:

Dread: This Keen Dispelling Finesse Slashing One-Handed Weapon can be used to inflict the Demoralized or Weakened conditions instead of dealing damage. These conditions last until the victim has a good night's sleep.

Auferstehung: This Charging Fire Masterwork Slashing Two-Handed Weapon is incapable of dealing Fire damage to monsters without the Unliving trait. Against monsters with the Unliving trait, it automatically is treated as if 1 Essentia had been spent on rolling additional Fire damage. In addition, if it deals a Critical Hit against a monster with the Unliving trait, that monster loses that trait.Awesome, thanks!


The alchemical items rules seem a little off, especially the ones that double-charge on essentia. I get why it's done, you don't want wealthy players doping themselves to the gills with every imaginable buff potion so you make them require bound essentia and you don't want them robbing Healing Potions R' Us and never ever dying so you make those cost essentia to use. But how often do you think people will be spending 2 essentia on healing potions when they can spend 1 essentia on Healing Touch and heal more at every level save the very highest ones? It may be better to just remove the part about alchemical items binding essentia and find some other way of limiting the buff ones. Or maybe make it so some bind essentia and some don't. Speaking of, do the buff potions count towards your maximum of four magical properties? Do healing potions?For potions, the cost is supposed to be 1 essentia (and they don't even lower your total essentia pool). I read it over again, and I'm not sure where the 2 essentia cost is coming from.

Healing potions are supposed to restore the same amount as Healing Touch, so that's fixed.

And they don't count towards the total, but I've clarified that.


You didn't update the essentia limits in the quick-play section or the rogue's luck shot.

Dilletante seems like it should increase the bonus instead of the uses per day at milestones, the +1 is a bit puny later on.

The Efficient Design talent needs an update.Thanks for the catches. Those are all fixed now.

Saidoro
2014-01-04, 11:32 AM
For potions, the cost is supposed to be 1 essentia (and they don't even lower your total essentia pool). I read it over again, and I'm not sure where the 2 essentia cost is coming from.
Whoops, misread that. I thought alchemical items required investment.

Liliet
2014-01-07, 12:33 PM
Um, is fixing the cost for the ingredients necessary? I understand that it's the simplest, but it's not exactly realistic (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0677.html), and it doesn't easily lend itself to be expanded into something that makes more sense.

With the system as is, you can't, for example, have the same magical items have different cost at different sides of the continent because, say, gold is valuable in the forest land but dirt cheap around the mines, and even more for, say, plants that grow in some place and not another. And haggling, man, haggling, see the link to the comic.


Other than that, AWESOME. Finally my alchemist has somethiing to do, and I like that something ^^

Have you made up your mind on what you're going to do with the attributes? Are you going to leave it as it is now, or maybe change it in some way?

Lappy9001
2014-01-08, 01:42 AM
Um, is fixing the cost for the ingredients necessary? I understand that it's the simplest, but it's not exactly realistic (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0677.html), and it doesn't easily lend itself to be expanded into something that makes more sense.

With the system as is, you can't, for example, have the same magical items have different cost at different sides of the continent because, say, gold is valuable in the forest land but dirt cheap around the mines, and even more for, say, plants that grow in some place and not another. And haggling, man, haggling, see the link to the comic.I'm open to suggestions, but really, if a GM really pulls something like that with the wording, I'm not sure how to fix it outside of a "just wing it" (which would probaly cause more problems than it would fix).


Other than that, AWESOME. Finally my alchemist has somethiing to do, and I like that something ^^Glad you like it! I'm thinking of taking the cap off for alchemic items too. Makes sense for magic items, not as much for single use-potions and poisons.


Have you made up your mind on what you're going to do with the attributes? Are you going to leave it as it is now, or maybe change it in some way?Rolling up attributes should change, I'm not sure how yet. Probably 4d6 drop lowest like 3.5 except you only use the modifier (+2, +3, etc). Levelling up is staying the same, +1 to primary and another of choice.

Liliet
2014-01-08, 09:15 AM
I'm open to suggestions, but really, if a GM really pulls something like that with the wording, I'm not sure how to fix it outside of a "just wing it" (which would probaly cause more problems than it would fix).
I can think of two ways to fix the fixed price.

The first is one I like most, to use recipes instead of money costs. Specify how much of each ingredient you want. Write up a total list of alchemical ingredients, their descriptions and costs where they are easiest to get (and let the DMs determine the prices for where they are less common, the default being that teleportation enables everything everywhere to be of roughly the same price). It requires a lot of work, sure, but I'm not very busy right now and I'm the first alchemist, so - I'll gladly help. There's a D20 list of spells with material components to start with, for example. It'll make alchemy a lot more fun and a lot more realistic.

The second is to tie the price to the setting and specify what city it is where it costs like that (how far from mountains, how far from the woods, and so on), letting the DMs determine the change of price elsewhere if they are into it. It has the downside of tying everything to the setting, but the upside of requiring much less work. You only need to describe one major trade city.



Glad you like it! I'm thinking of taking the cap off for alchemic items too. Makes sense for magic items, not as much for single use-potions and poisons.
Um, what cap is it that alchemic items can not have it _too_?

As I understand the rules right now, crafting magic items is not something you can earn money with, because you can only craft a limited and very small amount in your lifetime, and you pay with your magical talent for that.



Rolling up attributes should change, I'm not sure how yet. Probably 4d6 drop lowest like 3.5 except you only use the modifier (+2, +3, etc). Levelling up is staying the same, +1 to primary and another of choice.
So it'll basically work exactly like in 3.5?

Or will the +1 with levelling up refer to the modifier instead of the score?

And how will you use negative modifiers?

Lappy9001
2014-01-09, 05:41 PM
I can think of two ways to fix the fixed price.

The first is one I like most, to use recipes instead of money costs. Specify how much of each ingredient you want. Write up a total list of alchemical ingredients, their descriptions and costs where they are easiest to get (and let the DMs determine the prices for where they are less common, the default being that teleportation enables everything everywhere to be of roughly the same price). It requires a lot of work, sure, but I'm not very busy right now and I'm the first alchemist, so - I'll gladly help. There's a D20 list of spells with material components to start with, for example. It'll make alchemy a lot more fun and a lot more realistic.

The second is to tie the price to the setting and specify what city it is where it costs like that (how far from mountains, how far from the woods, and so on), letting the DMs determine the change of price elsewhere if they are into it. It has the downside of tying everything to the setting, but the upside of requiring much less work. You only need to describe one major trade city.This seems like a great project for a separate sub-system, or as you mentioned, a section within a setting. The amount of work and material involved would likely eclipse the entire list of available alchemic items.

And, honestly, I would say the argument of "you bought 500 gold of rubies for 400 gold, so it's not worth 500" doesn't make any sense. If you buy a $1,000 TV for $800, you still bought a $1,000 TV, just at a discounted price (and therefore, is worth $1,000). It's far more complex than this in real life, yes, but I'm not making a completely simulationist system here. If the GM of a game tries to pull something like that, they're kinda being a jerk.

Again, I think this is a great idea as a stand-alone or part of a setting and I'll definitely help out if you want to work on this, but it likely won't be something added in here, and for that I apologize.


So it'll basically work exactly like in 3.5?

Or will the +1 with levelling up refer to the modifier instead of the score?

And how will you use negative modifiers?Thing is, I reeeally don't want to have negative modifiers. It sort of goes against my tenant of 'not penalizing' but I'm having problems working around it. I want something simple, but still gets fairly random results (I also don't want to have to change monster stats around). I might just cave and go point buy, only using the dice for my own games.

Lappy9001
2014-01-10, 03:07 AM
Okay, big night of editing. The Table of Contents is done now, Equipment is mostly finished, barring a few non-magical alchemy items (services will go in the last section of "Running the Game"). Sections are now properly updated (racial templates is in the races section. Everything should be up to date with recent edits (mostly magic item stuff). Ranged weapons have an 'effective' range and a maximum range. Added a new artifact for funsies.

Speaking of which, any artifact ideas are appreciated. Also, I'm stuck for the final Storm spell (shouldn't be hard, but there's not much I've found outside of 'shoot lightning at it').

Amechra
2014-01-10, 04:03 AM
Idea for the last Storm spell:

Rainstorm: Makes it rain in a certain radius, powers up lightning bolts used against people rained on. The wet ground is slippery.

Saidoro
2014-01-11, 12:10 AM
This seems like a great project for a separate sub-system, or as you mentioned, a section within a setting. The amount of work and material involved would likely eclipse the entire list of available alchemic items.

Rules Variant: Reward Points
In this rule variant gold pieces and similar valuable commodities are not required as a major means of rewarding players (though the players can certainly pursue them if they wish), and if obtained gold cannot be used to craft or purchase magic or alchemical items. In order to obtain such items the players receive Reward Points(RP) from the Game Master in roughly the same quantities they would expect to receive gold in a game not using this rule. A player may spend a number of RP equal to the cost of a magical or alchemical item to have the next set of enemies the group encounters have one of those items or to have one of those items appended to the next reward that the party is granted by an NPC, whichever comes first. A player with the appropriate crafting talents may spend a number of RP equal to the crafting cost of an item along with a negligible amount of gold for mundane materials to craft any item they would otherwise be able to. A player who destroys a permanent magical item in some suitably heroic or villainous manner, such as by having their sword of frost melted by the foul acids of a red dragon's heart or by sacrificing their ring of guises to the dark gods they serve, receives a number of RP equal to the amount of gold that would normally be given for selling that item. At the Game Master's discretion, a player may get an item paid for with RP in some other manner, such as by pulling it free from a stone or finding it atop a dragon's hoard.


Well, that was easy:smallwink:.

Knaight
2014-01-11, 02:41 AM
Thing is, I reeeally don't want to have negative modifiers. It sort of goes against my tenant of 'not penalizing' but I'm having problems working around it. I want something simple, but still gets fairly random results (I also don't want to have to change monster stats around). I might just cave and go point buy, only using the dice for my own games.

That seems fine to me. If you just want to tweak the ranges though, there's always options like lowest of 2, or medians, or whatever. 10d4 drop 2 lowest, drop 2 highest could work.

Liliet
2014-01-11, 11:05 AM
This seems like a great project for a separate sub-system, or as you mentioned, a section within a setting. The amount of work and material involved would likely eclipse the entire list of available alchemic items.

And, honestly, I would say the argument of "you bought 500 gold of rubies for 400 gold, so it's not worth 500" doesn't make any sense. If you buy a $1,000 TV for $800, you still bought a $1,000 TV, just at a discounted price (and therefore, is worth $1,000). It's far more complex than this in real life, yes, but I'm not making a completely simulationist system here. If the GM of a game tries to pull something like that, they're kinda being a jerk.

Again, I think this is a great idea as a stand-alone or part of a setting and I'll definitely help out if you want to work on this, but it likely won't be something added in here, and for that I apologize.
Well, I guess no system is perfect. The only chance I have of ever playing my alchemist rogue is in the possible playtest of this system, and outside of it I don't really have an interest in alchemy...

That argument about price was just to point out that the idea of measuring materials by price makes no sense. What was stopping the developers of saying "100 grams of diamond dust" or something like that, that would actually be measurable?

And it most likely won't be too much work, incomparable to the possible benefits. A dozen of basic components will give you 1320 possible potions of 3 components, and that's not counting proportions. A dozen components, two dozen potions, and you are set for a start. Some simple rules for combining potions -> infinite awesome and actual application for the Alchemy skill beyond beating DC 10 check.

You are making a bestiary, and that's something normally tied to the setting, so why not do some alchemy, or rather make me do it?

Example I'm making up just now:



[Ingredients]
Pure water. The basic component needed in almost all alchemic items. Any purchased water counts as pure. Water from natural sources counts as pure after 1/2 hour of boiling. A portion of water is 1/2 liter.

Phoenix's Feather. This is an integral component for most instances of healing effects. Only primary flying feathers, long ones that grow at the edge of the wing, are used in alchemy. An individual bird possesses 9+1d4 of them. Removing those feathers (even just one of them) kills the phoenix because that's where their magic is. They are used as dust, which requires grinding them for 5 minutes. A portion of Phoenix's Feather is one feather.

...


[Potions]
Healing potion. This is the simplest potion there exists. A portion of it for one person requires a portion of Pure Water and a portion of Phoenix's Feather for each 1d4 of healing effect. Brewing it with ready ingredients takes 2 hours. DC for making it is 9 + 1 for each Phoenix's Feather used.
This is something I threw together in 5 minutes. And I did my research on feathers, which took me approximately 2 minutes out of these 5. Tweaking of difficulty, time and whether healing potion is so simple (it can still be expensive, though, depending on the cost and availability of phoenix's feathers) is completely possible. So is listing the "basic" market prices for both components and potions (with potions being slightly more expensive than the individual components so the alchemists can actually earn money).

Are you sure you don't want it with your system, at least as an optional rule?



Thing is, I reeeally don't want to have negative modifiers. It sort of goes against my tenant of 'not penalizing' but I'm having problems working around it. I want something simple, but still gets fairly random results (I also don't want to have to change monster stats around). I might just cave and go point buy, only using the dice for my own games.
I so agree with you here. I don't like negative modifiers either.

A simple solution: take negative modifiers and make the lowest one possible 0. Just shift it down.

Another simple solution: don't take negative modifiers, take 3d3 or 4d3 drop the lowest and use the scores themselves. This will be almost the same as 3d6 divide by 2 round down, which is what modifiers are, but without unnecessary complication. Well, the range will be smaller, given that there's now way you can roll less than 3, so you can use 3d4/4d4 drop lowest...


I guess you don't like these because a modifer of +9 seems a little too much, but if you want good randomizing, you need a wide range of possibilities, either negative or positive, there's no working around it, that's how math here works.


And pleeeease don't go with "just point buy" )= that's worse than weird randomizing...


PS I just thought of something - to accomodate modifiers up to 9, just add 5 to all DCs that are modified by attributes. It will be basically the same math as before, but with normal randomizing and without ugly negatives.

Lappy9001
2014-01-12, 10:21 PM
Rules Variant: Reward Points
In this rule variant gold pieces and similar valuable commodities are not required as a major means of rewarding players (though the players can certainly pursue them if they wish), and if obtained gold cannot be used to craft or purchase magic or alchemical items. In order to obtain such items the players receive Reward Points(RP) from the Game Master in roughly the same quantities they would expect to receive gold in a game not using this rule. A player may spend a number of RP equal to the cost of a magical or alchemical item to have the next set of enemies the group encounters have one of those items or to have one of those items appended to the next reward that the party is granted by an NPC, whichever comes first. A player with the appropriate crafting talents may spend a number of RP equal to the crafting cost of an item along with a negligible amount of gold for mundane materials to craft any item they would otherwise be able to. A player who destroys a permanent magical item in some suitably heroic or villainous manner, such as by having their sword of frost melted by the foul acids of a red dragon's heart or by sacrificing their ring of guises to the dark gods they serve, receives a number of RP equal to the amount of gold that would normally be given for selling that item. At the Game Master's discretion, a player may get an item paid for with RP in some other manner, such as by pulling it free from a stone or finding it atop a dragon's hoard.


Well, that was easy:smallwink:.Pardon my ignorance, but I'm not sure how that relates to making up an alchemy sub-system or how it's really that much different than using gold. I'm legitimately not sure what you mean.


Well, I guess no system is perfect. The only chance I have of ever playing my alchemist rogue is in the possible playtest of this system, and outside of it I don't really have an interest in alchemy...

That argument about price was just to point out that the idea of measuring materials by price makes no sense. What was stopping the developers of saying "100 grams of diamond dust" or something like that, that would actually be measurable?

And it most likely won't be too much work, incomparable to the possible benefits. A dozen of basic components will give you 1320 possible potions of 3 components, and that's not counting proportions. A dozen components, two dozen potions, and you are set for a start. Some simple rules for combining potions -> infinite awesome and actual application for the Alchemy skill beyond beating DC 10 check.

You are making a bestiary, and that's something normally tied to the setting, so why not do some alchemy, or rather make me do it?

Example I'm making up just now:


This is something I threw together in 5 minutes. And I did my research on feathers, which took me approximately 2 minutes out of these 5. Tweaking of difficulty, time and whether healing potion is so simple (it can still be expensive, though, depending on the cost and availability of phoenix's feathers) is completely possible. So is listing the "basic" market prices for both components and potions (with potions being slightly more expensive than the individual components so the alchemists can actually earn money).

Are you sure you don't want it with your system, at least as an optional rule?Looks cool, it's just that I haven't gone in to such a level of detail in anything else, often intentionally so people can make up their own fluff. There's a space/complexity issue too. I wouldn't want to make a list of alchemy ingredients that ended up longer than the list of maneuvers/spells/talents for example.

But hey, you're volunteering (and I do agree it's a neat idea), so you can naturally write up a variant/supplement. It might even be something warranting it's own thread so you can go full creativity on it :smallcool:


I so agree with you here. I don't like negative modifiers either.

A simple solution: take negative modifiers and make the lowest one possible 0. Just shift it down.

Another simple solution: don't take negative modifiers, take 3d3 or 4d3 drop the lowest and use the scores themselves. This will be almost the same as 3d6 divide by 2 round down, which is what modifiers are, but without unnecessary complication. Well, the range will be smaller, given that there's now way you can roll less than 3, so you can use 3d4/4d4 drop lowest...


I guess you don't like these because a modifer of +9 seems a little too much, but if you want good randomizing, you need a wide range of possibilities, either negative or positive, there's no working around it, that's how math here works.


And pleeeease don't go with "just point buy" )= that's worse than weird randomizing...


PS I just thought of something - to accomodate modifiers up to 9, just add 5 to all DCs that are modified by attributes. It will be basically the same math as before, but with normal randomizing and without ugly negatives.Yeah, I'm seriously not a point buy fan, although I do understand why some people like it. But how about this (I'm pretty sure this is basically just what you suggested), like 3.5 with smaller numbers and no negatives. Players won't have to any math outside of simple addition.

Roll 3d4 (4d4 drop lowest for generosity). Add up the total to the chart:

{table=head]Roll|Attribute

11-12|
+4

9-10|
+3

7-8|
+2

5-6|
+1

3-4|
+0[/table]

Seems to turn up some nice random numbers, and you don't get 0's or 4's very often. Plus, I wouldn't have to re-work the existing stats. It looks like you'll generally get a teensy bit higher when rolling than using the existing array. What'cha think?

Liliet
2014-01-13, 01:39 AM
Looks cool, it's just that I haven't gone in to such a level of detail in anything else, often intentionally so people can make up their own fluff. There's a space/complexity issue too. I wouldn't want to make a list of alchemy ingredients that ended up longer than the list of maneuvers/spells/talents for example.
Point is, it won't be longer. And if you are making a list of gear with listed prices (I recall that you wanted to do that), it will naturally be longer than those lists (maybe not longer in space, but longer in the number of items). And bestiary is complex, taking up a lot of space and defining a settting. Except you can't design a system without those, not all players like homebrewing, they want everything ready for them. Fluff is one thing, mechanical system for crafting alchemy items, bestiary and gear table is the other.



But hey, you're volunteering (and I do agree it's a neat idea), so you can naturally write up a variant/supplement. It might even be something warranting it's own thread so you can go full creativity on it :smallcool:
Yep. Later today, after I'm done with the exam ^^



Yeah, I'm seriously not a point buy fan, although I do understand why some people like it. But how about this (I'm pretty sure this is basically just what you suggested), like 3.5 with smaller numbers and no negatives. Players won't have to any math outside of simple addition.

Roll 3d4 (4d4 drop lowest for generosity). Add up the total to the chart:

{table=head]Roll|Attribute

11-12|
+4

9-10|
+3

7-8|
+2

5-6|
+1

3-4|
+0[/table]

Seems to turn up some nice random numbers, and you don't get 0's or 4's very often. Plus, I wouldn't have to re-work the existing stats. It looks like you'll generally get a teensy bit higher when rolling than using the existing array. What'cha think?
Will we write down on the character list and then increase with levels the result of the roll or only the resulting "modifier"? (and why would you need "+"?)

Lappy9001
2014-01-13, 01:43 AM
Point is, it won't be longer. And if you are making a list of gear with listed prices (I recall that you wanted to do that), it will naturally be longer than those lists (maybe not longer in space, but longer in the number of items). And bestiary is complex, taking up a lot of space and defining a settting. Except you can't design a system without those, not all players like homebrewing, they want everything ready for them. Fluff is one thing, mechanical system for crafting alchemy items, bestiary and gear table is the other.Item list is pretty finished, actually.


Yep. Later today, after I'm done with the exam ^^Awesome.


Will we write down on the character list and then increase with levels the result of the roll or only the resulting "modifier"? (and why would you need "+"?)The modifier. You never refer to the roll result again. The pluses are there because you always add the attribute to something. I've been using it this whole while :smalltongue:

Knaight
2014-01-13, 01:55 AM
Roll 3d4 (4d4 drop lowest for generosity). Add up the total to the chart:

{table=head]Roll|Attribute

11-12|
+4

9-10|
+3

7-8|
+2

5-6|
+1

3-4|
+0[/table]

Seems to turn up some nice random numbers, and you don't get 0's or 4's very often. Plus, I wouldn't have to re-work the existing stats. It looks like you'll generally get a teensy bit higher when rolling than using the existing array. What'cha think?

A binomial (dice pool style) distribution could also work. Basically, roll 4d6. Count 4-6 as successes, and 1-3 as failures. The result is the number of successes.
{table]Result|Probability
0|1/16
1|1/4
2|3/8
3|1/4
4|1/16[/table]

The upside is that this is a fairly fast process, at least for anyone used to dice pools. The downside is that dice pools aren't used elsewhere, so it's a bit odd within the context of the system. On the other hand, so is your 3d4 and a table option. You can also always roll 5d6 for higher values, dropping the lowest die.

Lappy9001
2014-01-13, 02:15 AM
A binomial (dice pool style) distribution could also work. Basically, roll 4d6. Count 4-6 as successes, and 1-3 as failures. The result is the number of successes.
{table]Result|Probability
0|1/16
1|1/4
2|3/8
3|1/4
4|1/16[/table]

The upside is that this is a fairly fast process, at least for anyone used to dice pools. The downside is that dice pools aren't used elsewhere, so it's a bit odd within the context of the system. On the other hand, so is your 3d4 and a table option. You can also always roll 5d6 for higher values, dropping the lowest die.Interestering. It definitely feels more appropriate than 3.5's system here. And yeah, using the table is gonna be wonky no matter what, I don't see any way around that.

How about using both systems plus point buy (or taking a standard array)? That way people can just use what they like best.

Knaight
2014-01-13, 02:35 AM
Interestering. It definitely feels more appropriate than 3.5's system here. And yeah, using the table is gonna be wonky no matter what, I don't see any way around that.

How about using both systems plus point buy (or taking a standard array)? That way people can just use what they like best.

Sounds good to me.

Liliet
2014-01-13, 05:39 AM
Item list is pretty finished, actually.

Awesome.

The modifier. You never refer to the roll result again. The pluses are there because you always add the attribute to something. I've been using it this whole while :smalltongue:
Awesome. XD


A binomial (dice pool style) distribution could also work. Basically, roll 4d6. Count 4-6 as successes, and 1-3 as failures. The result is the number of successes.
{table]Result|Probability
0|1/16
1|1/4
2|3/8
3|1/4
4|1/16[/table]

The upside is that this is a fairly fast process, at least for anyone used to dice pools. The downside is that dice pools aren't used elsewhere, so it's a bit odd within the context of the system. On the other hand, so is your 3d4 and a table option. You can also always roll 5d6 for higher values, dropping the lowest die.
I like this. And I definitely like the option of choosing either!


So I'll post the first part of the system. The ingredients.


Powdering a component takes 5 minutes with specialized tools (mortar and pounder) and 20 minutes with improvized tools. This is time for any quantity that fits in the used mortar or improvized container.


[Ingredients]

<non-organic>

Pure water. The basic component needed in almost all alchemic items. Any purchased water counts as pure. Water from natural sources counts as pure after 1/2 hour of boiling. A portion of water is 1/2 liter.

Salt. A common component used mostly for amplifying existing effects of potions. Sea salt can be used. A portion of salt is one spoon (30 grams).

Acidic solution. A component usually employed for the task of changing properties of something. Any acid can be used, dissolved/concentrated so that a drop of it won't burn human skin but will burn the tongue. A portion of acidic solution is a half of a spoon (10 grams).

<plants>

Oak bark. A multi-purpose component for effects usually related for growth and nature. Is used in powdered form. A portion of oak bark is two spoons (60 grams).

Henbane seeds. A highly dangerous component used for hallucinogenic, mind-affecting and poisoning effects. This plant can be found in any abandoned backyard, but using this component carelessly can have disastrous results. Seeds are used in powdered form. A portion of henbane seeds is a quarter of a spoon (5 grams).

Olive oil. A component usually used for soothing, calming and removing negative effects. A potion of olive oil is a half of a spoon (10 grams).

<animals>

Phoenix's feather. This is an integral component for most instances of healing effects. Only primary flying feathers, long ones that grow at the edge of the wing, are used in alchemy. An individual bird possesses 9+1d4 of them. Removing those feathers (even just one of them) kills the phoenix. They are used in powdered form, but they can't be preserved in this form for longer than 1 + 1d3 hours. After that, every 5 minutes half the remaining amount disappears. A portion of phoenix's feather is one feather.

Unicorn's horn. This component usually provides the magic properties of the potion. A fully-grown unicorn has a horn that weighs about 500 grams, removing it kills it, but if you only remove half of a horn, the animal will become sickly but survive, and it will fully grow back in two years. It is used in powdered form. A potion of unicorn's horn is one-eighth of a spoon (2.5 grams).

Dog bone. This is a component usually employed for necromantic purposes. Any dog, wolf, fox, coyote or other related animal can provide this. It is used in powdered form. A portion of dog bone is a half of a spoon (10 grams).


If you like this, the next thing is just to make a list of potions, eyeball how expensive they should be, and write the recipes.

I expect the potions to generally used one of the animals ingredients (except maybe for the simplest ones), one or more of the plants ingredients depending on the complexity of the effect, water almost always (unless it's an ointment or something; doesn't matter anyway), salt if it's expected to be present in the taste (because logic) and acidic solution, well, as mentioned, for changing the properties of something.

Potions that have similar effects can have the same recipes in ingredients used, but with different quantity of them, different preparation time and maybe different DC.

Saidoro
2014-01-13, 01:09 PM
Pardon my ignorance, but I'm not sure how that relates to making up an alchemy sub-system or how it's really that much different than using gold. I'm legitimately not sure what you mean.
It's not, really. But it solves the same problems of having ingredient prices vary place to place and allowing low or high wealth campaigns while still allowing normal use of magic items. The GM can just give out a certain budget of magic items and not deal with having players who can suddenly buy half the kingdom.

Liliet
2014-01-13, 01:35 PM
I'm really not sure what the cost should be, so here's just a couple of listed items converted into my system:

Alacrity (Potion): For 1 hour, whenever you are affected by the Hasted condition, it lasts an additional 3 rounds. A portion for one person requires 1 portion of pure water, 1 potion of salt, 2 portions or olive oil and 1 portion of unicorn's horn, plus and additional portion of unicorn's horn for each additinal round past the basic 3. Brewing it with ready ingredients takes 1 hour. DC 10 + 2 for each additional round.

Combustion (Bomb): This bomb deals Fire damage. One item requires 1 portion of acidic solution, 1 portion of dog's bone, 3 portions of Henbane seeds per 1d6 damage and 2 portions of salt for 2 squares radius of effect. Making it takes 2 hours plus 1/2 hour for each additional damage die and each additional 2 squares of radius. DC is 7 + 1 per each damage die + 2 per each 2 squares of radius.


I want to have all potions' effect scale with DC and ingredients cost, so Alchemy skill remains relevant with time.

Lappy9001
2014-01-13, 11:06 PM
Alchemy Snip!Looks great!


It's not, really. But it solves the same problems of having ingredient prices vary place to place and allowing low or high wealth campaigns while still allowing normal use of magic items. The GM can just give out a certain budget of magic items and not deal with having players who can suddenly buy half the kingdom.Ah, seems like a good variant rule to add in!

Liliet
2014-01-14, 02:56 AM
Looks great!
So all's right and you like the scaling idea?

Awesome ^^


Here are all alchemical items from Magic Items section:


[Alchemical items]

<boosting potions>

Alacrity (Potion): For 1 hour, whenever you are affected by the Hasted condition, it lasts an additional 3 rounds. A portion for one person requires 1 portion of pure water, 1 potion of salt, 2 portions or olive oil, 1 portion of oak bark and 1 portion of unicorn's horn, plus an additional portion of unicorn's horn for each additional round past the basic 3. Brewing it with ready ingredients takes 1 hour. DC 10 + 2 for each additional round.

Heroism (Potion): For 1 hour, whenever you are affected by the Bolstered condition, it lasts an additional 3 rounds. A portion for one person requires 1 portion of pure water, 1 portion of salt, 1 portion of henbane seeds, 1 portion or oak bark and 1 portion of unicorn's horn, plus an additional portion of unicorn's horn for each additional round past the basic 3. Brewing it with ready ingredients takes 1 hour. DC 10 + 2 for each additional round.

Invisibility (Potion): For 1 hour, whenever you are affected by the Concealed condition, it lasts an additional 3 rounds. A portion for one person requires 1 portion of pure water, 1 portion of salt, 2 portions of oak bark and 1 portion of unicorn's horn, plus an additional portion of unicorn's horn for each additional round past the basic 3. Brewing it with ready ingredients takes 1 hour. DC 10 + 2 for each additional round.

Restoration (Potion): For 1 hour, whenever you are affected by the Regeneration condition, it lasts an additional 3 rounds. A portion for one person requires 1 portion of pure water, 1 portion of salt, 1 portion of olive oil, 1 portion of phoenix's feather and 1 portion of unicorn's horn, plus an additional portion of unicorn's horn for each additional round past the basic 3. Brewing it with ready ingredients takes 1 hour. DC 10 + 2 for each additional round.


<bombs>

Combustion (Bomb): This bomb deals Fire damage. One item requires 1 portion of acidic solution, 2 portions of dog's bone, 3 portions of henbane seeds per 1d6 damage and 2 portions of salt for 2 squares radius of effect. Making it takes 2 hours plus 1/2 hour for each additional damage die and each additional 2 squares of radius. DC is 7 + 1 per each damage die + 2 per each 2 squares of radius.

Frost (Bomb): This bomb deals Cold damage. One item requires 2 portions of acidic solution, 1 portion of dog's bone, 3 portions of henbane seeds per 1d6 damage and 2 portions of salt for 2 squares radius of effect. Making it takes 2 hours plus 1/2 hour for each additional damage die and each additional 2 squares of radius. DC is 7 + 1 per each damage die + 2 per each 2 squares of radius.

Lightning (Bomb): This bomb deals Shock damage. One item requires 2 portions of acidic solution, 1 portion of dog's bone, 3 portions of oak bark per 1d6 damage and 2 portions of salt for 2 squares radius of effect. Making it takes 2 hours plus 1/2 hour for each additional damage die and each additional 2 squares of radius. DC is 7 + 1 per each damage die + 2 per each 2 squares of radius.


<poisons>

Darkness (Poison): For 1 hour, whenever the target is affected by the Blinded condition, it lasts an additional 3 rounds. A portion for one person requires 1 portion of pure water, 1 portion of salt, 1 portion of oak bark, 2 portions of henbane seeds and 1 portion of unicorn's horn, plus an additional portion of unicorn's horn for each additional round past the basic 3. Brewing it with ready ingredients takes 1 hour. DC 10 + 2 for each additional round.

Dread (Poison): For 1 hour, whenever the target is affected by the Demoralized condition, it lasts an additional 3 rounds. A portion for one person requires 1 portion of pure water, 1 portion of salt, 1 portion of henbane seeds, 2 portions of dog bone and 1 portion of unicorn's horn, plus an additional portion of unicorn's horn for each additional round past the basic 3. Brewing it with ready ingredients takes 1 hour. DC 10 + 2 for each additional round.

Exhaustion (Poison): For 1 hour, whenever the target is affected by the Weakened condition, it lasts an additional 3 rounds. A portion for one person requires 1 portion of pure water, 1 portion of salt, 2 portions of henbane seeds, 1 portion of dog bone and 1 portion of unicorn's horn, plus an additional portion of unicorn's horn for each additional round past the basic 3. Brewing it with ready ingredients takes 1 hour. DC 10 + 2 for each additional round.

Paralysis (Poison): For 1 hour, whenever the target is affected by the Slowed condition, it lasts an additional 3 rounds. A portion for one person requires 1 portion of pure water, 2 portions of salt, 1 portion of henbane seeds, 1 portion or oak bark, 1 portion of dog bone and 1 portion of unicorn's horn, plus an additional portion of unicorn's horn for each additional round past the basic 3. Brewing it with ready ingredients takes 1 hour. DC 10 + 2 for each additional round.

Venom (Poison): For 1 hour, whenever the target is affected by the Poisoned condition, it lasts an additional 3 rounds. A portion for one person requires 1 portion of pure water, 2 portions of salt, 2 portions of henbane seeds, 2 portions or oak bark and 1 portion of unicorn's horn, plus an additional portion of unicorn's horn for each additional round past the basic 3. Brewing it with ready ingredients takes 1 hour. DC 10 + 2 for each additional round.


<other potions>

Healing (Potion): You can spend 1 essentia to recover Hit Points equal to 3 times your level, plus your Intelligence. A portion for 1 person requires 1 portion of pure water, 1 portion of acidic solution, 1 portion of olive oil, 1 portion of oak bark and 1 portion of phoenix's feather. Brewing it with ready ingredients takes 2 hours of work. DC 10.

Mana (Potion): You can spend 1 essentia to recover Magic Points equal to 1d4 + your Intelligence. A portion for 1 person requires 1 portion of pure water, 1 portion of acidic solution, 1 portion of olive oil, 1 portion of oak bark and 1 portion of unicorn's horn. Brewing it with ready ingredients takes 2 hours of work. DC 10.

Sustenance (Potion): You do not need to eat, drink, or sleep for 1 day, although you must still take a Rest to recover daily abilities and MP. A portion for 1 person requires 1 portion of pure water, 1 portion of salt, 1 portion of acidic solution, 1 portion of oak bark, 2 portions of olive oil and 1 portion of phoenix's feather. Brewing it with ready ingredients takes 1 hour. DC 10.

Lappy9001
2014-01-25, 11:58 PM
Liliet is a master alchemistLookin' good! I appreciate the hard work, sorry I'm just getting to it now.

Updated dice rolls for generating attributes, my 3d4 thing, Knaight's dicepool, and point buy.

Minor tweak to weapons. Ranged weapons have effective and max ranges, and some of the properties now reflect that.

Working on the final section, Running the Game (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=13010807&postcount=15). It's pretty pieced-together right now, but know I am working on it. I'm really not equipped to write a guide on how to be a GM, so I thought just some tips would be a good idea.

This section will have guidelines to run a world and will include services not in the equipment section. It will also have guidelines for XP and Gold rewards, which currently go like:


Gold for an encounter/adventure = XP x average level of the party

Wealth by level ends up at about 5,500 Gold at level 10 for the whole party, 11,000 if you use (xp x level x 2). I'm not planning to get super hung up over it since magic items are far weaker than they are in 3.5

For monsters, add up the level of the monsters and compare it to the totalled up level of the party:


Encounter < Party Level = 5 XP

Encounter = Party Level = 10 XP

Encounter +1 > Party Level = 15 XP

Encounter +2 > Party Level = 20 XP

Again, it's open-ended and free for tweaking, but this makes sure the party always gets *some* XP, while not being able to miraculously beat something way over their level and massively level up. I'll clean this up a bit too, of course.

Lappy9001
2014-01-30, 12:26 AM
Mounted martial discipline is finally here, and the last spell is in place. That means, barring the inevitable edits, Maneuvers, Spells, and Talents are DONE :smallcool:

The Mount trait basically just lets a character ride the monster. It doesn't have to be a size larger (since there's only really giant and huge), but it can't be tiny. I realize this strains realism a bit, but it makes mounted combat far easier if the mount/character both fit in a single square.

You use the mount's speed in place of your own, and you both share the same initiative result. Since mounts don't level up, they gain a bonus to HP and Saves equal to 1/2 the rider's, and gain a slight bonus from the rider taking Mounted maneuvers. (So basically, all of Knaight's suggestions with a few tweaks)

Liliet
2014-02-07, 09:31 AM
Wheeee! Time to re-build my alchemist :smallamused:

Funny that: I started out thinking of her as a rogue, and only took alchemy because there were lots of points to work with, and now alchemist is what she is, regardless of class.

The Profession skill is really weird. It's not for an actual professional, who knows one trade really well and specializes in it (like my alchemist), but for a jack-of-all-trades who is for some reason specifically a blacksmith, a performer and a scribe. Not a tailor, not a carpenter - those three. The base talent makes a lot of sense, but the other three are really weirdly specific. Also, how do you assign Ammunition property to a weapon that doesn't have it from the start? I'm transforming my javelin into a bow?

As for the rest - looks really sweet. Wait 'till I finish building three characters of different classes, though...

Lappy9001
2014-02-09, 01:26 PM
The Profession skill is really weird. It's not for an actual professional, who knows one trade really well and specializes in it (like my alchemist), but for a jack-of-all-trades who is for some reason specifically a blacksmith, a performer and a scribe. Not a tailor, not a carpenter - those three. The base talent makes a lot of sense, but the other three are really weirdly specific
The idea was to make the profession skill something useful and worth investing in. And because this is an abstraction revolving around travelling adventurers, tailor and carpenter would not really be useful. Now, if you can help me think of 3 very broad talents similar to the expertise base talent, then we're cooking.


Also, how do you assign Ammunition property to a weapon that doesn't have it from the start? I'm transforming my javelin into a bow?Why, you make it an atlatl (https://www.google.com/search?q=atlatl&safe=off&rlz=1C1AVSA_enUS522US522&espv=210&es_sm=93&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=Hcb3UuSqE6OMygHR7oCwCQ&ved=0CAkQ_AUoAQ&biw=1366&bih=643), of course! :smallwink:

The weapon system is extremely customizeable and relies on player ingenuity. I'm certainly not going to impose on a player's creativity. The ammunition example is the only one that I could find that potentially strains disbelief, so it should be fine as-is.


As for the rest - looks really sweet. Wait 'till I finish building three characters of different classes, though...Awesome!

Liliet
2014-02-10, 02:25 AM
The idea was to make the profession skill something useful and worth investing in. And because this is an abstraction revolving around travelling adventurers, tailor and carpenter would not really be useful. Now, if you can help me think of 3 very broad talents similar to the expertise base talent, then we're cooking.
Well, I'll try :smallamused:



Why, you make it an atlatl (https://www.google.com/search?q=atlatl&safe=off&rlz=1C1AVSA_enUS522US522&espv=210&es_sm=93&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=Hcb3UuSqE6OMygHR7oCwCQ&ved=0CAkQ_AUoAQ&biw=1366&bih=643), of course! :smallwink:

The weapon system is extremely customizeable and relies on player ingenuity. I'm certainly not going to impose on a player's creativity. The ammunition example is the only one that I could find that potentially strains disbelief, so it should be fine as-is.
Makes sense, thanks!



Awesome!
^^ *starting right now*

Lappy9001
2014-02-12, 05:44 PM
Familiar
Familiars are once mundane animals that have formed a magical bond with an individual whom they treat as master. Physically, familiars are almost identical with their non-magical kin, but have gained strength through their bond, as well as the ability to speak. The statistics for familiars can be used to represent normal animals, but they lose the bonded trait and use the weak monster class (for quick use, just the minion weakness can be applied). Normal animals do not gain a trait to replace the lost bonded trait.

The master of a familiar can opt to replace the familiar's bonus language with another language they know.

(Gonna keep adding to this!)

Bat
Bat (Animal)
Quick Monster (Tiny) 1
HP: ____/ 9
Str: -3 Dex: +5* Wis: +3
Con: +1 Int: +2 Cha: +1

Initiative: +6 Perception: +5
Speed: 6 Stealth: +5*

Defense: 15 Resist: -
Fort: +1 Ref: +7 Will: +3

Immunity: Blinded
Weakness: Attribute Penalty (Str), Slow Land Speed (2 Squares)

Attack (Bite): +5 Melee
1d4 -3 Physical

Special Qualities
Bonded
A familiar is bonded with an individual, known as the familiar’s master, and gains a bonus to Hit Points equal to ˝ its master’s HP total. A familiar gains a bonus to Attack, Defense, and Saves equal to ˝ its master’s level, and shares their initiative result in battle.

Flight
A bat can fly 6 Squares as a major action or hover as a minor action.

Special Traits
*Bonus Language (Common)*
*Darkvision*

Skills
+5 Athletics*

Cat
Cat (Animal)
Quick Monster (Tiny) 1
HP: ____/ 9
Str: -1 Dex: +4* Wis: +4
Con: +1 Int: +2 Cha: +2

Initiative: +5 Perception: +6*
Speed: 6 Stealth: +8*

Defense: 14 Resist: -
Fort: +1 Ref: +4 Will: +4

Attack (Claw): +4 Melee
1d4 -1 Physical

Special Qualities
Bonded
A familiar is bonded with an individual, known as the familiar’s master, and gains a bonus to Hit Points equal to ˝ its master’s HP total. A familiar gains a bonus to Attack, Defense, and Saves equal to ˝ its master’s level, and shares their initiative result in battle.

Special Traits
*Bonus Language (Common)*
*Darkvision
Improved Skill (Perception, Stealth)

Skills
+4 Nature*

Hawk
Hawk (Animal)
Quick Monster (Tiny) 1
HP: ____/ 8
Str: +1 Dex: +4* Wis: +4
Con: +0 Int: +2 Cha: +1

Initiative: +5 Perception: +8*
Speed: 6 Stealth: +4*

Defense: 14 Resist: -
Fort: +0 Ref: +6 Will: +4

Weakness: Slow Land Speed (2 Squares)

Attack (Claw): +4 Melee
1d4 + 1 Physical

Special Qualities
Bonded
A familiar is bonded with an individual, known as the familiar’s master, and gains a bonus to Hit Points equal to ˝ its master’s HP total. A familiar gains a bonus to Attack, Defense, and Saves equal to ˝ its master’s level, and shares their initiative result in battle.

Flight
A hawk can fly 6 Squares as a major action or hover as a minor action.

Special Traits
*Bonus Language (Common)*
Improved Skill (Athletics, Perception)

Skills
+6 Athletics*

Lizard
Lizard (Animals)
Quick Monster (Tiny) 1
HP: ____/ 10
Str: +1 Dex: +4* Wis: +4
Con: +2 Int: +1 Cha: +0

Initiative: +5 Perception: +4
Speed: 6 Stealth: +6*

Defense: 14 Resist: -
Fort: +2 Ref: +6 Will: +4

Attack (Bite): +4 Melee
1d4 + 1 Physical

Special Qualities
Bonded
A familiar is bonded with an individual, known as the familiar’s master, and gains a bonus to Hit Points equal to ˝ its master’s HP total. A familiar gains a bonus to Attack, Defense, and Saves equal to ˝ its master’s level, and shares their initiative result in battle.

Climb
As a move action, a lizard can walk up and cling to walls and ceilings 3Squares per round.

Special Traits
*Bonus Language (Common)*

Skills
+4 Athletics*

Monkey
Monkey (Animal)
Quick Monster (Tiny) 1
HP: ____/ 9
Str: +1 Dex: +3* Wis: +2
Con: +1 Int: +2 Cha: +2

Initiative: +4 Perception: +2*
Speed: 6 Stealth: +3

Defense: 13 Resist: -
Fort: +1 Ref: +5 Will: +2

Attack (Claw): +3 Melee
1d6 + 1 Physical

Special Qualities
Bonded
A familiar is bonded with an individual, known as the familiar’s master, and gains a bonus to Hit Points equal to ˝ its master’s HP total. A familiar gains a bonus to Attack, Defense, and Saves equal to ˝ its master’s level, and shares their initiative result in battle.

Climb
As a move action, a monkey can walk up and cling to walls and ceilings 3Squares per round.

Special Traits
*Bonus Language (Common)*

Skills
+5 Athletics*, +2 Nature*

Liliet
2014-02-12, 06:40 PM
I thought there were no negative modifiers in Classy?

Lappy9001
2014-02-12, 07:09 PM
No negative modifiers for players. Monsters, on the other hand have quite a few ways to get negatives (especially when you consider the weak monster class).

Lappy9001
2014-02-12, 07:50 PM
Revenant
Revenants are perhaps the most basic form of undead, being nothing more than a corpse animated by necrotic energies. While this definition technically applies to all undead, revenants are unique in that they can be created with almost no preparation, and only last for a short duration before crumbling. Only in nexuses of necrotic power can revenants exist for any significant period of time.

Revenant
This shambling, deformed mass of flesh, barely resembles the creature it was risen from. Bones and muscles jut out at irregular places, and the creature twitches with a violent fervor.

Revenant (Construct)
Tough Monster (Unliving) 1
HP: ____/ 14
Str: +3 Dex: +1 Wis: +2
Con: +4* Int: -1 Cha: +1

Initiative: +1 Perception: +4*
Speed: 5 Stealth: +1

Defense: 12 Resist: -
Fort: +6 Ref: +1 Will: +2

Immunity: Poisoned, Weakened
Weakness: Attribute Penalty (Dex)

Attack (Bite/Claw): +4 Melee
1d8 + 3 Physical

Special Attack
Frenzy
Daily Use: ___ / 2
As a minor action, a revenant can enter a frenzied state, taking a -2 penalty to Defense, but rolling maximum damage dice with melee attacks for 3 rounds. If there are no enemies to attack while frenzy is active, the revenant must attack the nearest target.

Special Qualities
Bonded
A revenant is bonded with an individual, known as the revenant's master, and gains a bonus to Hit Points equal to ˝ its master’s HP total. A revenant gains a bonus to Attack, Defense, and Saves equal to ˝ its master’s level, and shares their initiative result in battle.

Special Traits
*Darkvision*

Skills
+4 Endurance*

Lappy9001
2014-04-30, 01:27 PM
Now that the forum is back, I'm working on updating all of the tables to the new formatting, and fixing some typos. Replaced the Electrify spell with the Stormcloud spell, which is significantly more useful to have on hand!

Revenants are going to be altered to a minion (summon a tough monster? yeesh) and I'll likely be adding in more monsters from time to time.

As always, thanks to long-time followers and newcomers alike for supporting this project :smallcool:

Knaight
2014-04-30, 03:52 PM
There's a typo in the Required Roll table, where the second L in Roll got dropped down a line.

Traps could probably use some sort of pseudo multi-classing rules. For instance, a level 9 dart trap might be Damage 9 (9d6 damage, Difficulty 24, best for sharp) or something like Damage 6 Movement 3 (6d6 damage, 3 square knockpack, Difficulty 24). This would involve changing the Condition trap slightly, but would also dramatically increase versatility of traps.

The currency system involves a ridiculous amount of gold - a silver standard might be better here.

Equipment doesn't actually include vehicles or mounts - or other trained animals, for that matter. Mounted mentions that it should.

Other than that, a quick view didn't catch anything, though this is probably because it wasn't a close read. How's the .pdf coming?

Lappy9001
2014-04-30, 05:33 PM
Thanks, reformatting the new tables is a pain, but they do look nice (and there's a button!)

I'm all about the silver standard. To my very limited understanding, it's far more realistic than gold. Fairly minor change, but I understand the need for it.

Good idea on traps. I'll see what I can do.

Yeah, mounted does exist as a monster trait (at least it should, I'll check to see if I've posted it), but there are no monsters that use it yet. I'll make that a priority 'cause the mounted discipline is sort of useless without it.

And honestly, I haven't started on the .pdf. I feel like I'm very good at putting them together (here's a sample of a past system...thing that I formatted in like, 2 nights (https://www.dropbox.com/s/s908xs6sgv6u89h/Easyd20_v.002.pdf)), but I'm very particular about it and I don't like to start unless it's finished. Because, as you've seen this 'final' version has undergone a ton of changes alone. I don't have an artist partnership so it probably won't look as snazzy.

Amechra
2014-04-30, 06:39 PM
Class Critiques:

Specialization Description: Still says that all the classes have 2 Specializations.

Magus: Is this bonus retroactive? I assume not.

Wilder: Should have more uses; every other Specialization that has a number of uses per day has <Ability> + 3 uses.

Arcane Shield: Does this count as a shield for the purposes of Shield maneuvers?

Assassin: I don't think you need to specify that it stacks with Precision; it's not as if one has any language precluding their stacking.

Bard: I make a similar complaint when it comes to Performance down near the bottom; namely, measuring usage of a power in maximum duration rather than uses. I mean, you could get a similar effect if you gave the Bard Charisma + 3 uses, each lasting 1 round, and saying that it only takes a Free action to use if you used the power last round.

Dilletante: Still says it has uses per day; I assume that's a leftover from a previous rendition?

Champion and Harrier: OK, I've been wrong, there are four places where the usage of something is based off duration rather than number of uses. Why not base just give them uses per day for consistency's sake?

Challenge: Challenge makes ranged weapons really good; after all, taking a move action to get near to you to fight back inflicts the penalty from Challenge! I'd suggest instead wording it so they take a penalty on any attacks or saves that round if they attack anyone other than you.

Warrior Milestone: References Relentless; I think Relentless got replaced by Reaver.

Maneuver Critiques:

Penetrate Defense: So as long as I hit a guy round after round, I deal crit damage? If so... this is pretty great, especially with Rapid Shot.

Hit and Run: Does this take up my Major action? As worded, I move, make an attack, and then keep moving; in other words, after my move I can use my Major action for something else.

Fortification: Why not just say that they don't get the benefits of Critical Damage against you? After all, they are never going to deal more damage with the reroll, so saying reroll take lower is kinda... superfluous.

Ride-By Attack: Same question I have concerning Hit-and-Run.

Spirited Charge: I'm not feeling the name; the benefit has nothing to do with charging, after all.

Why is Deadly Aim flat-out better than Dueling?

Overrun: How does this work? The Charge Tactic isn't an action you take, per se. See Lancer below for more about this.

Shieldmate: Probably should say "while using the Defend Tactic" because Iron Stance is a modification to the Defend Tactic, not an action in and of itself.

Spellbreaker in General: How does this interact with monsters? They lack MP, after all.

Impede: Heh, you can shoot people who try to get in your space with a bow. Just thought that was kind of a funny image.

Pursuit: Has a typo; it should say "you may follow them" rather than "you may foll them".

Generic Charge Question: Does the bonus damage affect all attacks made in the turn, or just the first one after moving.

Lancer: How does it work as written? Charging isn't an action, Charging is a state you enter if you move at least two squares that boosts damage. The thing is, a Charge "action" concludes after you make the attack, and doesn't have to be declared beforehand; therefore, Lancer either doesn't work or doubles all of your movement. Also, doubling speed is a pretty major bonus; I'd personally make it a +1 to Speed while charging per Two-Handed Maneuver you have.

Fix: You may declare a Charge as a free action after moving at least two squares. You can't declare a Charge if there aren't any enemies you can reach within your speed.

Spell Critiques:

Phantom Steed: Can I use Mounted maneuvers while on this thing?

Skill Critiques:

Conditioning: Does the benefit apply retroactively? I assume no.

Extract Essence: Has a typo; you use essentia to craft, not essential.

Beast Friend: I'm kinda curious why anyone who wants a familiar also has to have a favored enemy type they deal extra damage to; or, precisely, why that's a benefit of the Nature skill (I could actually see it as a benefit of the Knowledge skill). I'm guessing it's due to the legacy left by D&D Rangers... I'd replace it with something more nature-y, but that's just me.

Profession: I'ma bring up the limited options again; one way to solve this is have Talents split between two skills; for example, an Artisan talent that requires Expertise and Artificer.

Aid Another: I feel this should be a Tactic rather than a Talent, if only because it interacts with Talents from a variety of different skills (and then you can also allow it to share save rerolls from maneuvers.)

Switching Some Talents Around: I'd replace Aid Another with Well-Versed, shift Hunter (given a different name) to the base talent for Knowledge (it's all about knowing weak points and behavior, after all), and come up with a new base talent for Nature. Aid Another can then be another Tactic or something. After all, right now a person who wants to use Diplomat on a wider group of people needs to dip into Knowledge to learn more languages, and that just doesn't sit right with me.

Diplomat: I feel like the mechanics for this one don't really gel with the other mechanics; maybe have it be activated during initiative, and prevent enemies from attacking you unless you attack them first until the end of the battle?

Steal: How can an object on an enemy's person be unattended? I assume you mean unsecured.

General Note on Skills: I feel like a lot of them don't engage the system on the same level as, say, maneuvers do; for example: Haggle's percentages don't mesh with the fact that you don't use percentages for anything else.
Diplomat is, right now, kinda useless against groups.
Performer uses minutes per day when everything else either has a set number of uses per day, is at will, or cost Essentia; it jars.

Lappy9001
2014-04-30, 08:05 PM
Specialization Description: Still says that all the classes have 2 Specializations.
Fixed!


Magus: Is this bonus retroactive? I assume not.
No, but it wouldn't matter anyway because you take it at level 1.


Wilder: Should have more uses; every other Specialization that has a number of uses per day has <Ability> + 3 uses.Got it, fixed.


Arcane Shield: Does this count as a shield for the purposes of Shield maneuvers?You certainly could, but it takes a minor action to maintain, so I don't know why someone would bother, especially since Shield maneuvers grant proficiency.


Assassin: I don't think you need to specify that it stacks with Precision; it's not as if one has any language precluding their stacking.You think so? Most stuff doesn't stack so I felt it necessary. I can certainly remove it, though.


Bard: I make a similar complaint when it comes to Performance down near the bottom; namely, measuring usage of a power in maximum duration rather than uses. I mean, you could get a similar effect if you gave the Bard Charisma + 3 uses, each lasting 1 round, and saying that it only takes a Free action to use if you used the power last round.Oh my, that is how it's supposed to read. Thanks for the catch.


Dilletante: Still says it has uses per day; I assume that's a leftover from a previous rendition?Actually, no. The intent is to give the rogue 4 and 1/2 skill points, with the 1/2 being a floating bonus that they can shuffle around a couple of times per day as needed.


Champion and Harrier: OK, I've been wrong, there are four places where the usage of something is based off duration rather than number of uses. Why not base just give them uses per day for consistency's sake?Champion's kind of an odd one, because it lets you become immune to a condition after it's already affected you, allowing you to tough it out until the timer runs out. But yeah, Harrier was written incorrectly, thanks.


Challenge: Challenge makes ranged weapons really good; after all, taking a move action to get near to you to fight back inflicts the penalty from Challenge! I'd suggest instead wording it so they take a penalty on any attacks or saves that round if they attack anyone other than you.Needs to include abilities too, (otherwise a mage can still chuck a fireball at your buddy 'cause it's not an attack) but yes, it's fixed.


Warrior Milestone: References Relentless; I think Relentless got replaced by Reaver.Yup, it did.

Maneuver Critiques:


Penetrate Defense: So as long as I hit a guy round after round, I deal crit damage? If so... this is pretty great, especially with Rapid Shot.Yup. Historically, ranged weapons were pretty devastating so I'm trying to model that to a degree.


Hit and Run: Does this take up my Major action? As worded, I move, make an attack, and then keep moving; in other words, after my move I can use my Major action for something else.Clarified.


Fortification: Why not just say that they don't get the benefits of Critical Damage against you? After all, they are never going to deal more damage with the reroll, so saying reroll take lower is kinda... superfluous.Indeed. Fixed.


Ride-By Attack: Same question I have concerning Hit-and-Run.Same clarification :smalltongue:


Spirited Charge: I'm not feeling the name; the benefit has nothing to do with charging, after all.I'm open to all suggestions :smallsmile:


Why is Deadly Aim flat-out better than Dueling?Because ranged weapons need nice things and my system kind of doesn't give them a lot of options as opposed to melee weapons. :smallsmile:


Shieldmate: Probably should say "while using the Defend Tactic" because Iron Stance is a modification to the Defend Tactic, not an action in and of itself.Ah, thanks.


Spellbreaker in General: How does this interact with monsters? They lack MP, after all.Only if they've taken class levels. Those are the only monsters who will really have much magic to speak of, and the spellbreaker discipline is incredibly mean to casters so it's a tad specialized.


Impede: Heh, you can shoot people who try to get in your space with a bow. Just thought that was kind of a funny image.Well, actually you can't. Enemies have to be 1 square away to be targeted with ranged weapons, and therefore not in adjacent space.


Pursuit: Has a typo; it should say "you may follow them" rather than "you may foll them".Fixed.


Generic Charge Question: Does the bonus damage affect all attacks made in the turn, or just the first one after moving.

Overrun: How does this work? The Charge Tactic isn't an action you take, per se. See Lancer below for more about this.

Lancer: How does it work as written? Charging isn't an action, Charging is a state you enter if you move at least two squares that boosts damage. The thing is, a Charge "action" concludes after you make the attack, and doesn't have to be declared beforehand; therefore, Lancer either doesn't work or doubles all of your movement. Also, doubling speed is a pretty major bonus; I'd personally make it a +1 to Speed while charging per Two-Handed Maneuver you have.

Fix: You may declare a Charge as a free action after moving at least two squares. You can't declare a Charge if there aren't any enemies you can reach within your speed.Great points. How about:

Charge
When you move at least 2 Squares, you can make a charge as a free action, granting yourself +2 bonus to Damage rolls made with melee weapons this round.

Lancer no longer grants 2x speed.

Spell Critiques:


Phantom Steed: Can I use Mounted maneuvers while on this thing?Absolutely. Is that the only one? Awesome :smallcool:

Skill Critiques:


Conditioning: Does the benefit apply retroactively? I assume no.Nope, you use it for all 'future levels'


Extract Essence: Has a typo; you use essentia to craft, not essential.Fixed.


Beast Friend: I'm kinda curious why anyone who wants a familiar also has to have a favored enemy type they deal extra damage to; or, precisely, why that's a benefit of the Nature skill (I could actually see it as a benefit of the Knowledge skill). I'm guessing it's due to the legacy left by D&D Rangers... I'd replace it with something more nature-y, but that's just me.Partly that, and also because I couldn't think of anything else to go into the Nature skill. Again, totally open to suggestions.


Profession: I'ma bring up the limited options again; one way to solve this is have Talents split between two skills; for example, an Artisan talent that requires Expertise and Artificer.

Aid Another: I feel this should be a Tactic rather than a Talent, if only because it interacts with Talents from a variety of different skills (and then you can also allow it to share save rerolls from maneuvers.)

Switching Some Talents Around: I'd replace Aid Another with Well-Versed, shift Hunter (given a different name) to the base talent for Knowledge (it's all about knowing weak points and behavior, after all), and come up with a new base talent for Nature. Aid Another can then be another Tactic or something. After all, right now a person who wants to use Diplomat on a wider group of people needs to dip into Knowledge to learn more languages, and that just doesn't sit right with me.

Diplomat: I feel like the mechanics for this one don't really gel with the other mechanics; maybe have it be activated during initiative, and prevent enemies from attacking you unless you attack them first until the end of the battle?

Steal: How can an object on an enemy's person be unattended? I assume you mean unsecured.

General Note on Skills: I feel like a lot of them don't engage the system on the same level as, say, maneuvers do; for example: Haggle's percentages don't mesh with the fact that you don't use percentages for anything else.
Diplomat is, right now, kinda useless against groups.
Performer uses minutes per day when everything else either has a set number of uses per day, is at will, or cost Essentia; it jars.I like Aid Another as a tactic.

I'm grouping this together because they all stem from the same of problem, namely, a lack of ideas for talents. My ideas are spread out pretty thin in the skill department. If I move something around, I have nothing else to put in it's place. I probably just need to get creative (or get some suggestons :smallbiggrin:).

It's actually surprisingly difficult to come up with unique abilities more than just a bunch of flat bonuses, especially since they can't step on the toes of maneuvers or spells due to one of the core design goals.

Again, thanks for all your critique, I really appreciate it :smallbiggrin:

Amechra
2014-04-30, 09:16 PM
The adjustments look good, and I like that rewording of Charge (you might want to fix the major copy-paste error with Ride-by Attack.)

I'd say Spirited Charge should be something like:

Spirited Charge:
While using the Charge Tactic, increase Maneuver Difficulties by 2 and deal 2 additional damage.

Or the like.

As for moving Talents around... here goes!

1. Make Aid Another a Tactic.
2. Put Fast Talker in the slot vacated by Aid Another.
3. Move Well-Versed to the Basic slot for Speech.
4. Give Knowledge something like Keen Intuition:

Keen Intuition
You may spend 1 Essentia as a minor action to immediately reveal abilities or weaknesses possessed by a monster as if you had succeeded on a Knowledge check and succeeded by 2 points per Knowledge talent you have.