Because nice swords are nice [Minor Artifact]

[Phosphate]

The Pyre
http://fc01.deviantart.net/fs12/i/2006/299/4/5/Sword_by_Jeddaka.jpg

Tales have been told about how, at the beginning of the Blood War, the devils were few, weak and apart, and could hardly stand up to the unending demonic forces. Then, the deities that lived in the nine hells felt their fief was threatened, and decided to work together to get rid of the threat. They created the Pyres, swords of great power that were used by the vanguard pit fiends to slaughter the demonic horde. They felt so assured in their success that they ascended to the material plane and tried to enslave its people. Obviously, they failed, because wizards and druids are overpowered and stuff and crushed them, but some of the Pyres still remain scattered around the world. About 10 of them have been discovered and claimed so far, but a rough estimate tells that there are more than 20 left to find.

Pyres are magical greatswords that serve multiple purposes. They spell fiery doom to their foes, are particularly effective at slaying demons and work better in the hands of an adept in magic.


Proficiency: Martial
Range: Melee
Encumbrance: Two-Handed
Size: Large
Type: Greatsword

Cost: N/A
Material: Cold Iron
Weight: 14 lbs

Hardness: 40
Hp: 80

The weapon is treated as lawful, evil, magical, and made of cold iron for the purpose of bypassing DR.
Damage: 3d6 slashing + 3d6 fire
Critical: 19-20/x3

Special

Flame (Su): When you strike with Pyre, you can choose to deal 3d6 fire damage to all targets in a 30 feet cone in front of you. Ref save to negate, DC is 20+your Cha modifier.

Flaming Torrent (Sp): You may choose to use only the cone function of the Pyre, without actually attacking in melee. This requires a standard action and increases the size of the cone by 30 feet.

Vengeful Blazes (Su): The fire damage dealt by Pyre ignores resistance and immunity to fire. If struck in melee, a target that has resistance or immunity to fire receives 3d6 more damage from the hit.

Hunting Instinct (Su): Gain a +6 profane bonus to attack rolls against demons only.

Soulwield (Su): This weapon is stronger in the hands of a competent spellcaster. If wielded by someone with CL 4 or higher, it is treated as being the same size as the wielder for the purpose of attack rolls only. Also, add 2d6 more fire damage to the initial target and 1d6 more fire damage in a cone for every 4 CL you have. Also, if you have CL 10 or higher, you may choose to apply one of these features: Vorpal, Wounding, Flaming Burst or any +1 enhancement. You may never change it.

For the purpose of wielding the Pyre, a Pit Fiend is treated as having a CL of 18.

Destroying a Pyre

If a Pyre sword is destroyed or Disjunction is used on it, the perpetrator is assaulted by 2d8 Pit Fiends.

Unlike regular Pit Fiends, those have a permanent Mindblank effect on them and award no experience or treasure.

If the pit fiends kill the perpetrator while at least one of them makes it alive, the Pyre sword is repaired.

[The Mentalist]

Fluff and stuff


Cool story bro.



Pyres are magical greatswords that serve multiple purposes. They spell fiery doom to their foes, are particularly effective at slaying demons and work better in the hands of an adept in magic.


This confuses me, if they were given to pit fiends why were they made to work better for spellcasters. Pit Fiends don't cast, they have SLAs but no actual casting or caster level as far as I know. Also I'm not seeing multiple purposes, just more kill it with fire.



Proficiency: Martial
Range: Melee
Encumbrance: Two-Handed
Size: Large
Type: Greatsword

Cost: N/A
Material: Cold Iron
Weight: 14 lbs

Hardness: 40
Hp: 40

The weapon is treated as lawful, evil, magical, and made of cold iron for the purpose of bypassing DR.
Damage: 3d6 slashing + 3d6 fire + 1d10 untyped
Critical: 19-20/x3


HP for the weapon seem absurdly low considering the hardness. Usual formula that I've seen is at least 2 HP per point of Hardness (i.e. Adamantium at 20/40, Obdurium at 40/80, Steel at 10/20?) That's not even factoring standard enchantment bonuses to weapon Hit Points.





Flame (Su): When you strike with Pyre, deal 3d6 fire damage to all targets in a 30 feet cone in front of you. Ref save to negate, DC is 20+your Cha modifier.


Alright, sounds good. Remember to tell your rogue never to flank with you.



Vengeful Blazes (Su): The fire damage dealt by Pyre ignores resistance and immunity to fire. Actually, if a target has resistance, he receives double fire damage.


This needs to be re-worded in my mind, it sounds like you're making it up on the fly and is unfinished. Also why do those with fire resistance take MORE damage than those without. Perhaps something like a modified Searing spell:

Immune 1/2 damage
Resist x1 damage
Normal x2 damage



Hunting Instinct (Su): Gain a +6 profane bonus to attack rolls against demons only.


Alright, seems kind of narrow but fits the fluff.



Soulwield (Su): This weapon is stronger in the hands of a good spellcaster. If wielded by someone with CL 4 or higher, it is treated as one size category lower and half as heavy. Also, add 1d10 more untyped damage for every 4 CL you have. Also, if you have CL 10 or higher, treat the weapon as Vorpal.

1. Good is an already game defined term. Surely this is not stronger in the hands of "Thormar the Blessed" lvl 17 LG Wizard but in the hands of Xenu the Necromancer lvl 100000 LE Wizard (or rather both but what I'm saying here is that good is an alignment. Find a synonym. Competent works)

2. The size category drop sort of hurts you. Surely if you can use this weapon you can get a size bump. (Enlarge Person being first level and all) The weight decrease does functionally nothing.

3. Untyped damage is nice but bland for the flavor. This is THE PYRE! (and ignores fire immunity) maybe give it 2d6 of bonus fire damage instead?

4. Vorpal sort of sucks... A lot.

[Phosphate]

they have SLAs but no actual casting or caster level as far as I know

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/devil.htm

While yes, they are all SLAs, a Pit Fiend is treated as having a caster level 18.


HP for the weapon seem absurdly low considering the hardness.

Magic ;).


This needs to be re-worded in my mind, it sounds like you're making it up on the fly and is unfinished.

Ok.


Also why do those with fire resistance take MORE damage than those without.

Because it is a rule that all demons have fire resistance.


1. Good is an already game defined term. Surely this is not stronger in the hands of "Thormar the Blessed" lvl 17 LG Wizard but in the hands of Xenu the Necromancer lvl 100000 LE Wizard (or rather both but what I'm saying here is that good is an alignment. Find a synonym. Competent works)

Ok.


2. The size category drop sort of hurts you. Surely if you can use this weapon you can get a size bump. (Enlarge Person being first level and all) The weight decrease does functionally nothing.

It doesn't hurt you, most players are Medium instead of large, and wielding a weapon that is too large imposes a penalty on the attack roll. Also, I would rather see gishes use swords for actual combat than...say, a wizard. And gishes may have restricted casting, so Enlarge Person could be absent from their list. The weight decrease is flavor.


3. Untyped damage is nice but bland for the flavor. This is THE PYRE! (and ignores fire immunity) maybe give it 2d6 of bonus fire damage instead?

Humm....ok.


4. Vorpal sort of sucks... A lot.

If you have Improved Critical, it's a 20% chance to instant kill. I would call that....useful at the least.

[Volthawk]

If you have Improved Critical, it's a 20% chance to instant kill. I would call that....useful at the least.

Nope. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/magicWeapons.htm#vorpal)



This potent and feared ability allows the weapon to sever the heads of those it strikes. Upon a roll of natural 20 (followed by a successful roll to confirm the critical hit), the weapon severs the opponent’s head (if it has one) from its body. Some creatures, such as many aberrations and all oozes, have no heads. Others, such as golems and undead creatures other than vampires, are not affected by the loss of their heads. Most other creatures, however, die when their heads are cut off. A vorpal weapon must be a slashing weapon. (If you roll this property randomly for an inappropriate weapon, reroll.)


Emphasis mine. Regardless of your crit range, it only works on a 20, and even then you have to confirm. Plus there's a pretty big range of things it doesn't work on, which limits the usefulness of it.

[Phosphate]

Oh...well that's unfortunate. Still, better than nothing :)).

My other idea was to be able to cast True Strike a couple times for free per day, but that's too good...

[The Mentalist]

While yes, they are all SLAs, a Pit Fiend is treated as having a caster level 18.


Cool... Did not remember that.



Magic ;).


BUT MAGIC IS SUPPOSED TO MAKE THINGS BETTER!




Because it is a rule that all demons have fire resistance.


But... it doesn't make sense...




It doesn't hurt you, most players are Medium instead of large, and wielding a weapon that is too large imposes a penalty on the attack roll. Also, I would rather see gishes use swords for actual combat than...say, a wizard. And gishes may have restricted casting, so Enlarge Person could be absent from their list. The weight decrease is flavor.


I refer you to the Swiftblade, the Abjurant Champion, and several other 9s + 4 attacks builds. They aren't difficult. I concede the point though as maintaining large size is a resource drain. (Maybe make it wielded as though it were a weapon of your size. I just hate seeing the d6 dropped it as it goes up in power.)





If you have Improved Critical, it's a 20% chance to instant kill. I would call that....useful at the least.

Perhaps for the whole "Demonbane" theme a death effect on demons on a crit or perhaps summoning devils on a crit (though hacking a Lemure off of your opponent with every blow would be SWEET!) Stat drain maybe? (though I don't think that fits flavor) a universal death effect that consumes your enemy in Hellfire.

What I'm basically saying here is that Vorpal is kind of boring and a sub-par option. If you're already homebrewing you may as well make it cool.

[Phosphate]

But... it doesn't make sense...

So? In D&D acid is a type of energy. Sense is not compulsory.



I just hate seeing the d6 dropped it as it goes up in power.

The damage dice remains unaffected. But you're right, I should mention that.



Perhaps for the whole "Demonbane" theme a death effect on demons on a crit or perhaps summoning devils on a crit (though hacking a Lemure off of your opponent with every blow would be SWEET!) Stat drain maybe? (though I don't think that fits flavor) a universal death effect that consumes your enemy in Hellfire.

What I'm basically saying here is that Vorpal is kind of boring and a sub-par option. If you're already homebrewing you may as well make it cool.

Meeh ok I'll find something more creative :)). But it won't be as overpowered as what you suggested, though.

[The Mentalist]

Meeh ok I'll find something more creative :)). But it won't be as overpowered as what you suggested, though.

I was just tossing off ideas.

[Solaris]

I'd change the Flame ability to operate on a mental command rather than all the time. Sometimes, you don't want to set everything on fire.

Why do you have the option of a +5 ability, one of two +2 abilities, or your choice of a single +1 ability? Why not a scaling increase, such as increasing by +1 every five levels, or even choice of bonuses - something akin to a ranger's combat styles, if that makes any sense.

I object to the Pit Fiends who show up if you break the Pyre not giving experience points. Why wouldn't they?


Cool story bro.

Upon reading this, I decided I wanted to read nothing else you had to say. It's rude, dismissive, and there really was no point to you saying it.

[The Mentalist]

Upon reading this, I decided I wanted to read nothing else you had to say. It's rude, dismissive, and there really was no point to you saying it.

Not at all intended as such. It was basically intended as "yep, it's fluff and not something I'm going to comment on beyond that."

[Solaris]

Not at all intended as such. It was basically intended as "yep, it's fluff and not something I'm going to comment on beyond that."

I've never heard it used any way other than rude and dismissive. I think you might be the first person, ever, who's done so.

[The Mentalist]

I honestly had no intent to dismiss his fluff. I did indeed rather like it I just had no real response to it.

[Gorgondantess]

Actually, no, Pit Fiends have no caster levels. When it says "Caster Level 18", it is solely referring to the caster level at which those specific SLAs of the Pit Fiend are cast at.

[Steward]

I don't really see how this is a "nice" sword. It seems more or less completely aligned to the powers of evil.

One idea for the crit -- you know how demons have all these resistances and stuff like that? What happens if the sword can burn them off? "Say bye-bye to your thrice-cursed damage reduction!"

[Epsilon Rose]

Hmm... This would be rather dangerous in the hands of a cleric.
Also rather entertaining considering the odds that they're serving a deity who opposes to the original creators.

[Phosphate]

I'd change the Flame ability to operate on a mental command rather than all the time. Sometimes, you don't want to set everything on fire.

Maybe.


Why do you have the option of a +5 ability, one of two +2 abilities, or your choice of a single +1 ability?

Because, as the others have said, vorpal is very weak and doesn't deserve to be +5. Also the +2's are thematic.

I'm not scaling that because there is already something that scales, and I don't want to make it overcomplicated.


I object to the Pit Fiends who show up if you break the Pyre not giving experience points. Why wouldn't they?

Loophole abuses and stuff.


I don't really see how this is a "nice" sword. It seems more or less completely aligned to the powers of evil.

I believe that characters should be judged upon according to their actions, and not the descriptor or source of their power. Plus, I am using "nice" in the sense of "high in damage", not "morally upstanding" :)).

[/quote]One idea for the crit -- you know how demons have all these resistances and stuff like that? What happens if the sword can burn them off? "Say bye-bye to your thrice-cursed damage reduction!"[/QUOTE]

Although all demons have resistances, they don't all have DR. The weapon itself bypasses their DR by being Cold Iron anyway. Dunno why it should strip it off completely.


Hmm... This would be rather dangerous in the hands of a cleric.
Also rather entertaining considering the odds that they're serving a deity who opposes to the original creators.

Haha sure, maybe some cleric could fall for using this. But it's mostly their fault if they choose to worship a god who is not pragmatic enough.

[Veklim]

Cool story bro.

Upon reading this, I decided I wanted to read nothing else you had to say. It's rude, dismissive, and there really was no point to you saying it.

Aaaah, the joys of cross-culture misunderstandings born of a shared language and totally separate social graces!

Didn't seem dismissive to me Solaris, seemed complimentary (if a little terse).

The sword is super-sweet, but I feel the lack of XP from the Pit Fiends is far more unreasonable than the possibilities of a loophole or two. DMs are there to stop people loopholing and such, and anyone using brew like this should know well enough when someone is taking the proverbial. For the vast majority of cases, it'll become a horrific fight which takes up huge resources for absolutely no gain whatsoever, and the loss of one sword...it's just not right!

[Phosphate]

The sword is super-sweet, but I feel the lack of XP from the Pit Fiends is far more unreasonable than the possibilities of a loophole or two. DMs are there to stop people loopholing and such, and anyone using brew like this should know well enough when someone is taking the proverbial. For the vast majority of cases, it'll become a horrific fight which takes up huge resources for absolutely no gain whatsoever, and the loss of one sword...it's just not right!

Then don't cast Disjunction and don't destroy the sword :)). It has huge hardness and hp for a reason.

[Veklim]

But it's also undeniably evil in origin, and any paladin, most good clerics and a smattering of other devout types would balk at the idea of keeping it at all, even the broken pieces of one. I can think of a few groups who would have quested through the nine hells to destroy something like this. In all honesty, I'd have less trouble with the item if the destroy/pit fiend thing didn't occur at all. You may as well say 'If you destroy this sword, the hand of {insert LE deity's name here} smacks your arse until you're very sorry'. Similar overall effect and at least you've not had a nasty combat for no payout, just a nasty 'incident' for no payout (except a sore arse).

Not to put a dampener on an otherwise mighty fine sword of doom though dude. There isn't nearly enough sub-artifact funkiness in these forums!

[super dark33]

Nice sword bro.

[Phosphate]

Eh, maybe you're right, Veklim.

It's just that in my mind and according to my game experience so far, this is how I define the term artifact:

An artifact is a magical object of great power that cannot be duplicated through normal means and whose destruction bears grave consequences.

[Veklim]

I actually agree with your concept/definition of an artifact, and have similar threads running through the upper echelons of my games, but after the destruction of the item itself and the inevitable doom it will bring, I will reward the group. I usually make destroying these things very specific, a ritual must be performed and/or you must be in a certain place or destroy it at a certain time etc... I actually love the idea of a bunch of Pit Fiends descending upon you for the utter audacity you show by destroying one of their swords. Thing is there should be some sort of reward (usually XP) for doing/surviving these things. Would you instead consider for anyone who did destroy one, and subsequently survived the ensuing onslaught, to be granted some angelic/demonic boon (either would do, since they both oppose devils)? Just a thought! :smallbiggrin:

[Phosphate]

Nah. I'm thinking mainly that there's this king or great paladin general who tells those guys they'll be filthy rich if they get rid of the sword.

Gold > XP sometimes (especially if you have a CR 15 party that simply can't survive even 2 Pit Fiends).


As for the specific destruction method, this is the main differentiator.

Major artifacts - artifacts that must be destroyed in a certain way

Minor artifacts - artifacts that can be destroyed in any way

[Solaris]

Aaaah, the joys of cross-culture misunderstandings born of a shared language and totally separate social graces!

Didn't seem dismissive to me Solaris, seemed complimentary (if a little terse).

And thus why I tend to avoid slang terms, if at all possible. In the States and the darker reaches of the internet, "Cool story, bro" (http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/cool-story-bro) is what teenaged kids who think they're cool (and the twentysomethings who haven't realized they're not teenagers yet) say in response to a shaggy dog story or similarly pointless, lame story.

[Veklim]

wow, your link has enlightened me to whole new depth of pointlessness online. If things carry on like this, nobody will be able to say anything without someone assuming you're being sarcastic in reference to something else....regardless, I shall avoid that particular phrase with gusto methinks.


Gold > XP sometimes (especially if you have a CR 15 party that simply can't survive even 2 Pit Fiends). I always try to avoid Kobayashi Maru moments in my campaigns, unless I've discussed something with a player already and they don't mind me putting them in unwinnable situations (usually paladins/samurai). I guess any DM can use this sword and tweak flavour to fit their style/campaign. I just have an innate dislike of combats with no XP (must be a hangover from my player days, before I was 'The only DM in the village') :smallwink:

[Phosphate]

Maybe that's where the difference in philosophy lies. I am mainly a MMORPG player, not really tabletop, and there's probably the divide.

In a campaign, you need to get stronger (i.e. new class features) to defeat a definite threat.

In a MMO, you need to be better than people of the same level, so the more resources and less XP a mission/fight grants, the better it is.

[Solaris]

Yeah, but the Pit Fiends don't grant either one.

D&D has a built-in wealth-by-level assumption. Things get funny if you go off of it too much.

[Phosphate]

Yeah, but the Pit Fiends don't grant either one.

Hence the king giving the monetary reward and shiz ;).