PDA

View Full Version : [3.5 class revision] Domain-Focused Cleric



Lanaya
2012-08-08, 07:19 PM
The sheer power of tier 1 casters is a fairly common theme 'round these parts, as is the eternal question of how to fix them. I devised this cunning cleric change in an attempt to curtail their power while making them more interesting. The main idea behind the revision was to restrict a cleric's spell list to their domain spells only. Each deity has four domains, which have been expanded to contain two spells per level, and a cleric has access to all four domains, for a total of 72 spells. The power and versatility of the cleric is restricted, and a cleric of one god feels completely different to a cleric of another.

Currently I've only done core spells, domains and deities. I plan on adding non-core stuff over time, but there's so much content and I only have so much spare time.

As I was finishing up the formatting on this post, I saw that someone else had recently posted almost exactly the same cleric fix. Guess I'm not as original as I thought. :smallfrown: Oh well!

Cleric

Hit Die
d8

Class Skills
The clericís class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Heal (Wis), Knowledge (arcana) (Int), Knowledge (history) (Int), Knowledge (religion) (Int), Knowledge (the planes) (Int), Profession (Wis), and Spellcraft (Int).
Skill Points at First Level: (2 + Int modifier) x 4
Skill Points at Each Additional Level: 2 + Int modifier

Level | BAB | Fort | Reflex | Will | Special
1 | +0 | +2 | +0 | +2 | Turn or rebuke undead
2 | +1 | +3 | +0 | +3 | Expanded inspiration
3 | +2 | +3 | +1 | +3 |
4 | +3 | +4 | +1 | +4 | Expanded inspiration
5 | +3 | +4 | +1 | +4 |
6 | +4 | +5 | +2 | +5 | Expanded inspiration
7 | +5 | +5 | +2 | +5 |
8 | +6/+1 | +6 | +2 | +6 | Expanded inspiration
9 | +6/+1 | +6 | +3 | +6 |
10 | +7/+2 | +7 | +3 | +7 | Expanded inspiration
11 | +8/+3 | +7 | +3 | +7 |
12 | +9/+4 | +8 | +4 | +8 | Expanded inspiration
13 | +9/+4 | +8 | +4 | +8 |
14 | +10/+5 | +9 | +4 | +9 | Expanded inspiration
15 | +11/+6/+1 | +9 | +5 | +9 |
16 | +12/+7/+2 | +10 | +5 | +10 | Expanded inspiration
17 | +12/+7/+2 | +10 | +5 | +10 |
18 | +13/+8/+3 | +11 | +6 | +11 | Expanded inspiration
19 | +14/+9/+4 | +11 | +6 | +11 |
20 | +15/+10/+5 | +12 | +6 | +12 | Divine intervention

Class Features
All of the following are features of the cleric.

Weapon and Armor Proficiency
Clerics are proficient with all simple weapons, with all types of armor (light, medium, and heavy), and with shields (except tower shields).

Spells
A cleric casts divine spells, which are drawn from the domain lists of his chosen deity. However, his alignment may restrict him from casting certain spells opposed to his moral or ethical beliefs; see Chaotic, Evil, Good, and Lawful Spells, below. A cleric must choose and prepare his spells in advance (see below).

To prepare or cast a spell, a cleric must have a Wisdom score equal to at least 10 + the spell level. The Difficulty Class for a saving throw against a clericís spell is 10 + the spell level + the clericís Wisdom modifier.

Like other spellcasters, a cleric can cast only a certain number of spells of each spell level per day. His base daily spell allotment is given on Table: The Cleric. In addition, he receives bonus spells per day if he has a high Wisdom score.

Clerics meditate or pray for their spells. Each cleric must choose a time at which he must spend 1 hour each day in quiet contemplation or supplication to regain his daily allotment of spells. Time spent resting has no effect on whether a cleric can prepare spells. A cleric may prepare and cast any spell he knows, provided that he can cast spells of that level, but he must choose which spells to prepare during his daily meditation.

Chaotic, Evil, Good, and Lawful Spells
A cleric canít cast spells of an alignment opposed to his own or his deityís (if he has one). Spells associated with particular alignments are indicated by the chaos, evil, good, and law descriptors in their spell descriptions.

Spells Per Day
Level | 0th | 1st | 2nd | 3rd | 4th | 5th | 6th | 7th | 8th | 9th
1 | 3 | 1 | - | - | - | - | - | - | - | -
2 | 4 | 2 | - | - | - | - | - | - | - | -
3 | 4 | 2 | 1 | - | - | - | - | - | - | -
4 | 5 | 3 | 2 | - | - | - | - | - | - | -
5 | 5 | 3 | 2 | 1 | - | - | - | - | - | -
6 | 5 | 3 | 3 | 2 | - | - | - | - | - | -
7 | 6 | 4 | 3 | 2 | 1 | - | - | - | - | -
8 | 6 | 4 | 3 | 3 | 2 | - | - | - | - | -
9 | 6 | 4 | 4 | 3 | 2 | 1 | - | - | - | -
10 | 6 | 4 | 4 | 3 | 3 | 2 | - | - | - | -
11 | 6 | 5 | 4 | 4 | 3 | 2 | 1 | - | - | -
12 | 6 | 5 | 4 | 4 | 3 | 3 | 2 | - | - | -
13 | 6 | 5 | 5 | 4 | 4 | 3 | 2 | 1 | - | -
14 | 6 | 5 | 5 | 4 | 4 | 3 | 3 | 2 | - | -
15 | 6 | 5 | 5 | 5 | 4 | 4 | 3 | 2 | 1 | -
16 | 6 | 5 | 5 | 5 | 4 | 4 | 3 | 3 | 2 | -
17 | 6 | 5 | 5 | 5 | 5 | 4 | 4 | 3 | 2 | 1
18 | 6 | 5 | 5 | 5 | 5 | 4 | 4 | 3 | 3 | 2
19 | 6 | 5 | 5 | 5 | 5 | 5 | 4 | 4 | 3 | 3
20 | 6 | 5 | 5 | 5 | 5 | 5 | 4 | 4 | 4 | 4

Spells Known
A clericís deity influences his alignment, what magic he can perform, his values, and how others see him. Each deity has four domains, which determine the spells the cleric has access to. A cleric's list of spells known consists of all spells on their deity's domain lists that he is high enough level to cast.

If a cleric is not devoted to a particular deity, he has two choices. He may select a deity whose views closely match his own and use that deity's domains, or may choose domains based off his alignment (see below).

Level 0 spells (orisons) are so simple that every deity can freely grant them to their worshippers. As such, clerics know all level 0 cleric spells, regardless of which deity they worship.

Turn or Rebuke Undead (Su)
Any cleric, regardless of alignment, has the power to affect undead creatures by channeling the power of his faith through his holy (or unholy) symbol (see Turn or Rebuke Undead).

A good cleric (or a neutral cleric who worships a good deity) can turn or destroy undead creatures. An evil cleric (or a neutral cleric who worships an evil deity) instead rebukes or commands such creatures. A neutral cleric of a neutral deity or no deity must choose whether his turning ability functions as that of a good cleric or an evil cleric. Once this choice is made, it cannot be reversed.

A cleric may attempt to turn undead a number of times per day equal to 3 + his Charisma modifier. A cleric with 5 or more ranks in Knowledge (religion) gets a +2 bonus on turning checks against undead.

Expanded Inspiration (Ex)
As a cleric gains more favour from his deity, he may be granted a few spells from outside his deity's primary domains. At 2nd level, you can add a new spell to your spells known list. The spell must be a cleric spell of a level no higher than that of the highest level spell you already know. Once the spell is selected, it is forever added to your spell list and can be cast just like any other spell on your list. You gain another spell at 4th, 6th, 8th, 10th, 12th, 14th, 16th and 18th level.

You cannot add Miracle to your spell list with Expanded Inspiration.

Divine Intervention
Once per day a 20th level cleric may expend two prepared 9th level spells in order to request a Miracle, as the spell. This is treated in every way as casting the spell, and will therefore provoke attacks of opportunity, cost experience for certain effects, and so on.

Dieties and Domains
Note: Some deities had their domains changed. Any deity with only 3 domains had an extra one given to them. Sometimes it was a fairly natural and logical addition (granting Yondalla, the Nurturing Matriarch, the Healing domain), but for others I had to shoehorn in some weird domains because there were none that fit properly. It's messy, but maybe when I add non-core content I'll be able to give them more appropriate domains. A few others were changed because WotC gave them odd domains to start with, like Pelor not having access to fire.
Boccob
Knowledge, Magic, Travel, Trickery
Corellon Larethian
Chaos, Good, Protection, War
Ehlonna
Animal, Good, Plant, Sun
Erythnul
Chaos, Destruction, Fire, War
Fharlanghn
Air, Healing, Protection, Travel
Garl Glittergold
Earth, Good, Protection, Trickery
Gruumsh
Chaos, Evil, Strength, War
Heironeous
Good, Law, Protection, War
Hextor
Destruction, Evil, Law, War
Kord
Chaos, Good, Luck, Strength
Moradin
Earth, Good, Law, Protection
Nerull
Death, Evil, Trickery, Undeath
Obad-Hai
Air, Earth, Fire, Water
Olidamarra
Air, Chaos, Travel, Trickery
Pelor
Good, Fire, Healing, Sun
St. Cuthbert
Destruction, Law, Protection, Strength
Vecna
Evil, Knowledge, Magic, Trickery
Wee Jas
Death, Knowledge, Law, Magic
Yondalla
Good, Healing, Law, Protection

A cleric without a deity may instead choose to use domains specific to his alignment.

Lawful Good
Good, Healing, Law, Protection
Neutral Good
Good, Healing, Protection, Sun
Chaotic Good
Chaos, Good, Healing, Protection
Lawful Neutral
Law, Protection, Strength, War
Neutral
Chaos, Evil, Good, Law
Chaotic Neutral
Chaos, Destruction, Fire, Trickery
Lawful Evil
Death, Evil, Law, Strength
Neutral Evil
Death, Evil, Strength, Undeath
Chaotic Evil
Chaos, Death, Destruction, Evil

Lanaya
2012-08-08, 07:21 PM
Air Domain
Granted Powers
Turn or destroy earth creatures as a good cleric turns undead. Rebuke, command, or bolster air creatures as an evil cleric rebukes undead. Use these abilities a total number of times per day equal to 3 + your Charisma modifier. This granted power is a supernatural ability.
Air Domain Spells
1. Feather Fall: Objects or creatures fall slowly.
Obscuring Mist: Fog surrounds you.
2. Catís Grace: Subject gains +4 to Dex for 1 min./level.
Gust of Wind: Blows away or knocks down smaller creatures.
3. Fly: Subject flies at speed of 60 ft.
Wind Wall: Deflects arrows, smaller creatures, and gases.
4. Freedom of Movement: Subject moves normally despite impediments.
Summon Natureís Ally IV*: Calls creature to fight.
5. Call Lightning Storm: As call lightning, but 5d6 damage per bolt.
Control Winds: Change wind direction and speed.
6. Chain Lightning: 1d6/level damage; 1 secondary bolt/level each deals half damage.
Wind Walk: You and your allies turn vaporous and travel fast.
7. Control Weather: Changes weather in local area.
Summon Natureís Ally VII*: Calls creature to fight.
8. Reverse Gravity: Objects and creatures fall upward.
Whirlwind: Cyclone deals damage and can pick up creatures.
9. Elemental Swarm*: Summons multiple elementals.
Storm of Vengeance: Storm rains acid, lightning, and hail.
*Cast as an air spell only.

Animal Domain
Granted Powers
You can use speak with animals once per day as a spell-like ability.
Add Knowledge (nature) to your list of cleric class skills.
Animal Domain Spells
1. Charm Animal: Makes one animal your friend.
Hide from Animals: Animals canít perceive one subject/level.
2. Animal Messenger: Sends a Tiny animal to a specific place.
Hold Animal: Paralyzes one animal for 1 round/level.
3. Dominate Animal: Subject animal obeys silent mental commands.
Magic Fang, Greater: One natural weapon of subject creature gets +1/four levels on attack and damage rolls (max +5).
4. Giant Vermin: Turns centipedes, scorpions, or spiders into giant vermin.
Summon Natureís Ally IV*: Calls creature to fight.
5. Animal Growth: One animal/two levels doubles in size.
Baleful Polymorph: Transforms subject into harmless animal.
6. Bearís Endurance, Mass: As bearís endurance, affects one subject/level.
Bullís Strength, Mass: As bullís strength, affects one subject/ level.
7. Creeping Doom: Swarms of centipedes attack at your command.
Summon Natureís Ally VII*: Calls creature to fight.
8. Animal Shapes: One ally/level polymorphs into chosen animal.
Summon Natureís Ally VIII*: Calls creature to fight.
9. Shapechange: Transforms you into any creature, and change forms once per round.
Summon Natureís Ally IX*: Calls creature to fight.
*Can only summon animals.

Chaos Domain
Granted Power
You cast chaos spells at +1 caster level.
Chaos Domain Spells
1. Confusion, Lesser: One creature is confused for 1 round.
Protection from Law: +2 to AC and saves, counter mind control, hedge out elementals and outsiders.
2. Mirror Image: Creates decoy duplicates of you (1d4 +1 per three levels, max 8).
Rage: Gives +2 to Str and Con, +1 on Will saves, -2 to AC.
3. Chaos Hammer: Damages and staggers lawful creatures.
Magic Circle against Law: As protection spells, but 10-ft. radius and 10 min./level.
4. Confusion: Subjects behave oddly for 1 round/level.
Freedom of Movement: Subject moves normally despite impediments.
5. Dispel Law: +4 bonus against attacks by lawful creatures.
Song of Discord: Forces targets to attack each other.
6. Animate Objects: Objects attack your foes.
Insanity: Subject suffers continuous confusion.
7. Prismatic Spray: Rays hit subjects with variety of effects.
Word of Chaos: Kills, confuses, stuns, or deafens nonchaotic subjects.
8. Cloak of Chaos: +4 to AC, +4 resistance, SR 25 against lawful spells.
Irresistible Dance: Forces subject to dance.
9. Freedom: Releases creature from imprisonment.
Summon Monster IX*: Calls extraplanar creature to fight for you.
*Cast as a chaos spell only.

Death Domain
Granted Power
You may use a death touch once per day. Your death touch is a supernatural ability that produces a death effect. You must succeed on a melee touch attack against a living creature (using the rules for touch spells). When you touch, roll 1d6 per cleric level you possess. If the total at least equals the creatureís current hit points, it dies (no save).
Death Domain Spells
1. Deathwatch: Reveals how near death subjects within 30 ft. are.
Inflict Light Wounds: Touch deals 1d8 damage +1/level (max +5).
2. Death Knell: Kill dying creature and gain 1d8 temporary hp, +2 to Str, and +1 caster level.
Inflict Moderate Wounds: Touch attack, 2d8 damage +1/level (max +10).
3. Inflict Serious Wounds: Touch attack, 3d8 damage +1/level (max +15).
Poison: Touch deals 1d10 Con damage, repeats in 1 min.
4. Enervation: Subject gains 1d4 negative levels.
Inflict Critical Wounds: Touch attack, 4d8 damage +1/level (max +20).
5. Cloudkill: Kills 3 HD or less; 4-6 HD save or die, 6+ HD take Con damage.
Slay Living: Touch attack kills subject.
6. Harm: Deals 10 points/level damage to target.
Undeath to Death: Destroys 1d4/level HD of undead (max 20d4).
7. Destruction: Kills subject and destroys remains.
Inflict Serious Wounds, Mass: Deals 3d8 damage +1/level to many creatures.
8. Symbol of Death: Triggered rune slays nearby creatures.
Trap the Soul: Imprisons subject within gem.
9. Energy Drain: Subject gains 2d4 negative levels.
Wail of the Banshee: Kills one creature/level.

Destruction Domain
Granted Power
You gain the smite power, the supernatural ability to make a single melee attack with a +4 bonus on attack rolls and a bonus on damage rolls equal to your cleric level (if you hit). You must declare the smite before making the attack. This ability is usable once per day.
Destruction Domain Spells
1. Burning Hands: 1d4/level fire damage (max 5d4).
Divine Favor: You gain +1 per three levels on attack and damage rolls.
2. Bullís Strength: Subject gains +4 to Str for 1 min./level.
Shatter: Sonic vibration damages objects or crystalline creatures.
3. Fireball: 1d6 damage per level, 20-ft. radius.
Keen Edge: Doubles normal weaponís threat range.
4. Divine Power: You gain attack bonus, +6 to Str, and 1 hp/level.
Shout: Deafens all within cone and deals 5d6 sonic damage.
5. Flame Strike: Smite foes with divine fire (1d6/level damage).
Righteous Might: Your size increases, and you gain combat bonuses.
6. Disintegrate: Makes one creature or object vanish.
Sympathetic Vibration: Deals 2d10 damage/round to freestanding structure.
7. Destruction: Kills subject and destroys remains.
Fire Storm: Deals 1d6/level fire damage.
8. Earthquake: Intense tremor shakes 80-ft.-radius.
Shout, Greater: Devastating yell deals 10d6 sonic damage; stuns creatures, damages objects.
9. Meteor Swarm: Four exploding spheres each deal 6d6 fire damage.
Implosion: Kills one creature/round.

Earth Domain
Granted Power
Turn or destroy air creatures as a good cleric turns undead. Rebuke, command, or bolster earth creatures as an evil cleric rebukes undead. Use these abilities a total number of times per day equal to 3 + your Charisma modifier. This granted power is a supernatural ability.
Earth Domain Spells
1. Detect Snares and Pits: Reveals natural or primitive traps.
Magic Stone: Three stones become +1 projectiles, 1d6 +1 damage.
2. Bearís Endurance: Subject gains +4 to Con for 1 min./level.
Soften Earth and Stone: Turns stone to clay or dirt to sand or mud.
3. Meld into Stone: You and your gear merge with stone.
Stone Shape: Sculpts stone into any shape.
4. Spike Stones: Creatures in area take 1d8 damage, may be lowed.
Stoneskin: Ignore 10 points of damage per attack.
5. Transmute Rock to Mud: Transforms two 10-ft. cubes per level.
Wall of Stone: Creates a stone wall that can be shaped.
6. Flesh to Stone: Turns subject creature into statue.
Move Earth: Digs trenches and builds hills.
7. Statue: Subject can become a statue at will.
Summon Natureís Ally VII*: Calls creature to fight.
8. Earthquake: Intense tremor shakes 80-ft.-radius.
Iron Body: Your body becomes living iron.
9. Elemental Swarm*: Summons multiple elementals.
Imprisonment: Entombs subject beneath the earth.
*Cast as an earth spell only.

Evil Domain
Granted Power
You cast evil spells at +1 caster level.
Evil Domain Spells
1. Curse Water: Makes unholy water.
Protection from Good: +2 to AC and saves, counter mind control, hedge out elementals and outsiders.
2. Command Undead: Undead creature obeys your commands.
Desecrate: Fills area with negative energy, making undead stronger.
3. Magic Circle against Good: As protection spells, but 10-ft. radius and 10 min./level.
Unholy Blight: Damages and sickens good creatures.
4. Phantasmal Killer: Fearsome illusion kills subject or deals 3d6 damage.
Planar Ally, Lesser*: Exchange services with a 6 HD extraplanar creature.
5. Dispel Good: +4 bonus against attacks by good creatures.
Unhallow: Designates location as unholy.
6. Harm: Deals 10 points/level damage to target.
Planar Ally*: As lesser planar ally, but up to 12 HD.
7. Blasphemy: Kills, paralyzes, weakens, or dazes nonevil subjects.
Destruction: Kills subject and destroys remains.
8. Planar Ally, Greater: As lesser planar ally, but up to 18 HD.
Unholy Aura: +4 to AC, +4 resistance, SR 25 against good spells.
9. Weird: As phantasmal killer, but affects all within 30 ft.
Summon Monster IX*: Calls extraplanar creature to fight for you.
*Cast as an evil spell only.

Fire Domain
Granted Power
Turn or destroy water creatures as a good cleric turns undead. Rebuke, command, or bolster fire creatures as an evil cleric rebukes undead. Use these abilities a total number of times per day equal to 3 + your Charisma modifier. This granted power is a supernatural ability.
Fire Domain Spells
1. Burning Hands: 1d4/level fire damage (max 5d4).
Produce Flame: 1d6 damage +1/level, touch or thrown.
2. Continual Flame: Makes a permanent, heatless torch.
Scorching Ray: Ranged touch attack deals 4d6 fire damage, +1 ray/four levels (max 3).
3. Fireball: 1d6 damage per level, 20-ft. radius.
Flame Arrow: Arrows deal +1d6 fire damage.
4. Fire Shield*: Creatures attacking you take fire damage; youíre protected from heat or cold.
Wall of Fire: Deals 2d4 fire damage out to 10 ft. and 1d4 out to 20 ft. Passing through wall deals 2d6 damage +1/level.
5. Flame Strike: Smite foes with divine fire (1d6/level damage).
Summon Natureís Ally V**: Calls creature to fight.
6. Fire Seeds: Acorns and berries become grenades and bombs.
Incendiary Cloud: Cloud deals 4d6 fire damage/round.
7. Fire Storm: Deals 1d6/level fire damage.
Summon Natureís Ally VII**: Calls creature to fight.
8. Planar Ally, Greater**: As lesser planar ally, but up to 18 HD.
Summon Natureís Ally VIII**: Calls creature to fight.
9. Elemental Swarm**: Summons multiple elementals.
Meteor Swarm: Four exploding spheres each deal 6d6 fire damage.
*Warm shield only.
**Cast as a fire spell only.

Good Domain
Granted Power
You cast good spells at +1 caster level.
Good Domain Spells
1. Bless Water: Makes holy water.
Protection from Evil: +2 to AC and saves, counter mind control, hedge out elementals and outsiders.
2. Consecrate: Fills area with positive energy, making undead weaker.
Cure Moderate Wounds: Cures 2d8 damage +1/level (max +10).
3. Holy Smite: Damages and blinds evil creatures.
Magic Circle against Evil: As protection spells, but 10-ft. radius and 10 min./level.
4. Cure Critical Wounds: Cures 4d8 damage +1/level (max +20).
Planar Ally, Lesser*: Exchange services with a 6 HD extraplanar creature.
5. Dispel Evil: +4 bonus against attacks by evil creatures.
Hallow: Designates location as holy.
6. Heal: Cures 10 points/level of damage, all diseases and mental conditions.
Planar Ally*: As lesser planar ally, but up to 12 HD.
7. Holy Word: Kills, paralyzes, slows, or deafens nongood subjects.
Resurrection: Fully restore dead subject.
8. Holy Aura: +4 to AC, +4 resistance, and SR 25 against evil spells.
Planar Ally, Greater: As lesser planar ally, but up to 18 HD.
9. Heal, Mass: As heal, but with several subjects.
Summon Monster IX*: Calls extraplanar creature to fight for you.
*Cast as a good spell only.

Healing Domain
Granted Power
You cast healing spells at +1 caster level.
Healing Domain Spells
1. Cure Light Wounds: Cures 1d8 damage +1/level (max +5).
Sanctuary: Opponents canít attack you, and you canít attack.
2. Cure Moderate Wounds: Cures 2d8 damage +1/level (max +10).
Restoration, Lesser: Dispels magical ability penalty or repairs 1d4 ability damage.
3. Cure Serious Wounds: Cures 3d8 damage +1/level (max +15).
Remove Disease: Cures all diseases affecting subject.
4. Cure Critical Wounds: Cures 4d8 damage +1/level (max +20).
Restoration: Restores level and ability score drains.
5. Break Enchantment: Frees subjects from enchantments, alterations, curses, and petrification.
Raise Dead: Restores life to subject who died as long as one day/level ago.
6. Heal: Cures 10 points/level of damage, all diseases and mental conditions.
Regenerate: Subjectís severed limbs grow back, cures 4d8 damage +1/level (max +35).
7. Restoration, Greater: As restoration, plus restores all levels and ability scores.
Resurrection: Fully restore dead subject.
8. Cure Critical Wounds, Mass: Cures 4d8 damage +1/level (max +40) for many creatures.
Spell Immunity, Greater: As spell immunity, but up to 8th-level spells.
9. Heal, Mass: As heal, but with several subjects.
True Resurrection: As resurrection, plus remains arenít needed.

Knowledge Domain
Granted Power
Add all Knowledge skills to your list of cleric class skills.
You cast divination spells at +1 caster level.
Knowledge Domain Spells
1. Comprehend Languages: You understand all spoken and written languages.
Detect Chaos/Evil/Good/Law: Reveals creatures, spells, or objects of selected alignment.
2. Augury: Learns whether an action will be good or bad.
Detect Thoughts: Allows ďlisteningĒ to surface thoughts.
3. Arcane Sight: Magical auras become visible to you.
Clairaudience/Clairvoyance: Hear or see at a distance for 1 min./level.
4. Divination: Provides useful advice for specific proposed actions.
Scrying: Spies on subject from a distance.
5. Commune: Deity answers one yes-or-no question/level.
True Seeing: Lets you see all things as they really are.
6. Find the Path: Shows most direct way to a location.
Legend Lore: Lets you learn tales about a person, place, or thing.
7. Scrying, Greater: As scrying, but faster and longer.
Vision: As legend lore, but quicker and strenuous.
8. Discern Location: Reveals exact location of creature or object.
Prying Eyes, Greater: As prying eyes, but eyes have true seeing.
9. Foresight: ďSixth senseĒ warns of impending danger.
Hindsight (SpC): You see into the past.

Law Domain
Granted Power
You cast law spells at +1 caster level.
Law Domain Spells
1. Command: One subject obeys selected command for 1 round.
Protection from Chaos: +2 to AC and saves, counter mind control, hedge out elementals and outsiders.
2. Calm Emotions: Calms creatures, negating emotion effects.
Hold Person: Paralyzes one humanoid for 1 round/level.
3. Magic Circle against Chaos: As protection spells, but 10-ft. radius and 10 min./level.
Orderís Wrath: Damages and dazes chaotic creatures.
4. Discern Lies: Reveals deliberate falsehoods.
Dismissal: Forces a creature to return to native plane.
5. Dispel Chaos: +4 bonus against attacks by chaotic creatures.
Mark of Justice: Designates action that will trigger curse on subject.
6. Geas/Quest: As lesser geas, plus it affects any creature.
Hold Monster: As hold person, but any creature.
7. Dictum: Kills, paralyzes, slows, or deafens nonlawful subjects.
Forcecage: Cube or cage of force imprisons all inside.
8. Planar Binding, Greater*: As lesser planar binding, but up to 18 HD.
Shield of Law: +4 to AC, +4 resistance, and SR 25 against chaotic spells.
9. Imprisonment: Entombs subject beneath the earth.
Summon Monster IX*: Calls extraplanar creature to fight for you.
*Cast as a law spell only.

Luck Domain
Frankly, this domain is a mess. There simply arenít enough luck-based spells in the PHB to justify its existance. Goodbye Luck domain!

Magic Domain
Granted Power
You can use detect magic at will as a spell-like ability.
Magic Domain Spells
1. Magic Aura: Alters objectís magic aura.
Magic Weapon: Weapon gains +1 bonus.
2. Arcane Lock: Magically locks a portal or chest.
Identify: Determines properties of magic item.
3. Arcane Sight: Magical auras become visible to you.
Dispel Magic: Cancels magical spells and effects.
4. Arcane Eye: Invisible floating eye moves 30 ft./round.
Imbue with Spell Ability: Transfer spells to subject.
5. Break Enchantment: Frees subjects from enchantments, alterations, curses, and petrification.
Spell Resistance: Subject gains SR 12 + level.
6. Antimagic Field: Negates magic within 10 ft.
Dispel Magic, Greater: As dispel magic, but +20 on check.
7. Arcane Sight, Greater: As arcane sight, but also reveals magic effects on creatures and objects.
Spell Turning: Reflect 1d4+6 spell levels back at caster.
8. Mind Blank: Subject is immune to mental/emotional magic and scrying.
Protection from Spells: Confers +8 resistance bonus.
9. Mageís Disjunction: Dispels magic, disenchants magic items.
Wish: As limited wish, but with fewer limits.

Plant Domain
Granted Powers
Rebuke or command plant creatures as an evil cleric rebukes or commands undead. Use this ability a total number of times per day equal to 3 + your Charisma modifier. This granted power is a supernatural ability.
Add Knowledge (nature) to your list of cleric class skills.
Plant Domain Spells
1. Entangle: Plants entangle everyone in 40-ft.-radius.
Goodberry: 2d4 berries each cure 1 hp (max 8 hp/24 hours).
2. Barkskin: Grants +2 (or higher) enhancement to natural armor.
Wood Shape: Rearranges wooden objects to suit you.
3. Plant Growth: Grows vegetation, improves crops.
Speak with Plants: You can talk to normal plants and plant creatures.
4. Command Plants: Sway the actions of one or more plant creatures.
Tree Stride: Step from one tree to another far away.
5. Commune with Nature: Learn about terrain for 1 mile/level.
Wall of Thorns: Thorns damage anyone who tries to pass.
6. Ironwood: Magic wood is strong as steel.
Liveoak: Oak becomes treant guardian.
7. Animate Plants: One or more trees animate and fight for you.
Transmute Metal to Wood: Metal within 40 ft. becomes wood.
8. Control Plants: Control actions of one or more plant creatures.
Unyielding Roots (SpC): Creature grows roots that keep it stationary and heal it every round.
9. Shadow Landscape (SpC): Makes natural terrain more dangerous, creates guardians that you command.
Shambler: Summons 1d4+2 shambling mounds to fight for you.

Protection Domain
Granted Power
You can generate a protective ward as a supernatural ability. Grant someone you touch a resistance bonus equal to your cleric level on his or her next saving throw. Activating this power is a standard action. The protective ward is an abjuration effect with a duration of 1 hour that is usable once per day.
Protection Domain Spells
1. Sanctuary: Opponents canít attack you, and you canít attack.
Shield of Faith: Aura grants +2 or higher deflection bonus.
2. Shield Other: You take half of subjectís damage.
Status: Monitors condition, position of allies.
3. Magic Vestment: Armor or shield gains +1 enhancement per four levels.
Protection from Energy: Absorb 12 points/level of damage from one kind of energy.
4. Death Ward: Grants immunity to death spells and negative energy effects.
Spell Immunity: Subject is immune to one spell per four levels.
5. Spell Resistance: Subject gains SR 12 + level.
Wall of Force: Wall is immune to damage.
6. Antimagic Field: Negates magic within 10 ft.
Globe of Invulnerability: As lesser globe of invulnerability, plus 4th-level spell effects.
7. Repulsion: Creatures canít approach you.
Spell Turning: Reflect 1d4+6 spell levels back at caster.
8. Mind Blank: Subject is immune to mental/emotional magic and scrying.
Spell Immunity, Greater: As spell immunity, but up to 8th-level spells.
9. Foresight: ďSixth senseĒ warns of impending danger.
Prismatic Sphere: As prismatic wall, but surrounds on all sides.

Strength Domain
Granted Power
You can perform a feat of strength as a supernatural ability. You gain an enhancement bonus to Strength equal to your cleric level. Activating the power is a free action, the power lasts 1 round, and it is usable once per day.
Strength Domain Spells
1. Divine Favor: You gain +1 per three levels on attack and damage rolls.
Enlarge Person: Humanoid creature doubles in size.
2. Bullís Strength: Subject gains +4 to Str for 1 min./level.
Spiritual Weapon: Magic weapon attacks on its own.
3. Magic Vestment: Armor or shield gains +1 enhancement per four levels.
Magic Weapon, Greater: +1/four levels (max +5).
4. Divine Power: You gain attack bonus, +6 to Str, and 1 hp/level.
Enlarge Person, Mass: Enlarges several creatures.
5. Interposing Hand: Hand provides cover against one opponent.
Righteous Might: Your size increases, and you gain combat bonuses.
6. Bullís Strength, Mass: As bullís strength, affects one subject/ level.
Forceful Hand: Hand pushes creatures away.
7. Grasping Hand: Large hand provides cover, pushes, or grapples.
Mageís Sword: Floating magic blade strikes opponents.
8. Clenched Fist: Large hand provides cover, pushes, or attacks your foes.
Iron Body: Your body becomes living iron.
9. Crushing Hand: Large hand provides cover, pushes, or crushes your foes.
Shapechange: Transforms you into any creature, and change forms once per round.

Sun Domain
Granted Power
Once per day, you can perform a greater turning against undead in place of a regular turning. The greater turning is like a normal turning except that the undead creatures that would be turned are destroyed instead.
Sun Domain Spells
1. Detect Undead: Reveals undead within 60 ft.
Remove Fear: Suppresses fear or gives +4 on saves against fear for one subject + one per four levels.
2. Aid: +1 on attack rolls and saves against fear, 1d8 temporary hp +1/level (max +10).
Daylight: 60-ft. radius of bright light.
3. Heroism: Gives +2 on attack rolls, saves, skill checks.
Searing Light: Ray deals 1d8/two levels, more against undead.
4. Death Ward: Grants immunity to death spells and negative energy effects.
Disrupting Weapon: Melee weapon destroys undead.
5. Atonement: Removes burden of misdeeds from subject.
Flame Strike: Smite foes with divine fire (1d6/level damage).
6. Heroism, Greater: Gives +4 bonus on attack rolls, saves, skill checks; immunity to fear; temporary hp.
Undeath to Death: Destroys 1d4 HD/level undead (max 20d4).
7. Prismatic Spray: Rays hit subjects with variety of effects.
Sunbeam: Beam blinds and deals 4d6 damage.
8. Prismatic Wall: Wallís colors have array of effects.
Sunburst: Blinds all within 10 ft., deals 6d6 damage.
9. Elemental Swarm*: Summons multiple elementals.
Prismatic Sphere: As prismatic wall, but surrounds on all sides.
*Cast as a fire spell only.

Travel Domain
Granted Powers
For a total time per day of 1 round per cleric level you possess, you can act normally regardless of magical effects that impede movement as if you were affected by the spell freedom of movement. This effect occurs automatically as soon as it applies, lasts until it runs out or is no longer needed, and can operate multiple times per day (up to the total daily limit of rounds).
This granted power is a supernatural ability.
Add Survival to your list of cleric class skills.
Travel Domain Spells
1. Endure Elements: Exist comfortably in hot or cold environments.
Longstrider: Increases your speed.
2. Remove Paralysis: Frees one or more creatures from paralysis or slow effect.
Spider Climb: Grants ability to walk on walls and ceilings.
3. Fly: Subject flies at speed of 60 ft.
Water Breathing: Subjects can breathe underwater.
4. Dimension Door: Teleports you short distance.
Freedom of Movement: Subject moves normally despite impediments.
5. Plane Shift: As many as eight subjects travel to another plane.
Teleport: Instantly transports you as far as 100 miles/level.
6. Find the Path: Shows most direct way to a location.
Word of Recall: Teleports you back to designated place.
7. Ethereal Jaunt: You become ethereal for 1 round/level.
Teleport, Greater: As teleport, but no range limit and no off-target arrival.
8. Discern Location: Reveals exact location of creature or object.
Phase Door: Creates an invisible passage through wood or stone.
9. Astral Projection: Projects you and companions onto Astral Plane.
Gate: Connects two planes for travel or summoning.

Trickery Domain
Granted Power
Add Bluff, Disguise, and Hide to your list of cleric class skills.
Trickery Domain Spells
1. Disguise Self: Disguise own appearance.
Silent Image: Creates minor illusion of your design.
2. Invisibility: Subject invisible 1 min./level or until it attacks.
Misdirection: Misleads divinations for one creature or object.
3. Major Image: As silent image, plus sound, smell and thermal effects.
Nondetection: Hides subject from divination, scrying.
4. Hallucinatory Terrain: Makes one type of terrain appear like another (field into forest, or the like).
Invisibility, Greater: As invisibility, but subject can attack and stay invisible.
5. False Vision: Fools scrying with an illusion.
Seeming: Changes appearance of one person per two levels.
6. Mislead: Turns you invisible and creates illusory double.
Permanent Image: Includes sight, sound, and smell.
7. Project Image: Illusory double can talk and cast spells.
Simulacrum: Creates partially real double of a creature.
8. Polymorph Any Object: Changes any subject into anything else.
Screen: Illusion hides area from vision, scrying.
9. Shades: As shadow conjuration, but up to 8th level and 80% real.
Time Stop: You act freely for 1d4+1 rounds.

Undeath Domain
Granted Power
You gain Extra Turning as a bonus feat.
Undeath Domain Spells
1. Detect Undead: Reveals undead within 60 ft.
Summon Undead I (SpC): Summons undead to fight for you.
2. Desecrate: Fills area with negative energy, making undead stronger.
Summon Undead II (SpC): Summons undead to fight for you.
3. Animate Dead: Creates undead skeletons and zombies.
Summon Undead III (SpC): Summons undead to fight for you.
4. Negative Energy Aura (SpC): 10ft. radius surrounding you deals 1 hp/3 levels for 1 round/level.
Summon Undead IV (SpC): Summons undead to fight for you.
5. Revive Undead (SpC): Restores undeath to undead that was destroyed up to 1 day/level ago.
Summon Undead V (SpC): Summons undead to fight for you.
6. Create Undead: Create ghouls, ghasts, mummies, or mohrgs.
Harm: Deals 10 points/level damage to target.
7. Bodak's Glare (SpC): You slay a creature, which turns into a bodak 24 hours later.
Control Undead: Undead donít attack you while under your command.
8. Create Greater Undead: Create shadows, wraiths, spectres, or devourers.
General of Undeath (SpC): Increases your maximum HD of controlled undead by your level.
9. Plague of Undead (SpC): Animates horde of undead.
Vile Death (SpC): Undead creature gains fiendish template.

War Domain
Granted Power
Free Martial Weapon Proficiency with deityís favored weapon (if necessary) and Weapon Focus with the deityís favored weapon.
War Domain Spells
1. Bless: Allies gain +1 on attack rolls and saves against fear.
Magic Weapon: Weapon gains +1 bonus.
2. Bearís Endurance: Subject gains +4 to Con for 1 min./level.
Bullís Strength: Subject gains +4 to Str for 1 min./level.
3. Haste: One creature/level moves faster, +1 on attack rolls, AC, and Reflex saves.
Prayer: Allies +1 bonus on most rolls, enemies -1 penalty.
4. Enlarge Person, Mass: Enlarges several creatures.
Good Hope: Subjects gain +2 on attack rolls, damage rolls, saves, and checks.
5. Cone of Cold: 1d6/level cold damage.
Waves of Fatigue: Several targets become fatigued.
6. Blade Barrier: Wall of blades deals 1d6/level damage.
Heroesí Feast: Food for one creature/level cures and grants combat bonuses.
7. Delayed Blast Fireball: 1d6/level fire damage; you can postpone blast for 5 rounds.
Waves of Exhaustion: Several targets become exhausted.
8. Fire Storm: Deals 1d6/level fire damage.
Horrid Wilting: Deals 1d6/level damage within 30 ft.
9. Meteor Swarm: Four exploding spheres each deal 6d6 fire damage.
Storm of Vengeance: Storm rains acid, lightning, and hail.

Water Domain
Granted Power
Turn or destroy fire creatures as a good cleric turns undead. Rebuke, command, or bolster water creatures as an evil cleric rebukes undead. Use these abilities a total number of times per day equal to 3 + your Charisma modifier. This granted power is a supernatural ability.
Water Domain Spells
1. Grease: Makes 10-ft. square or one object slippery.
Obscuring Mist: Fog surrounds you.
2. Fog Cloud: Fog obscures vision.
Quench: Extinguishes nonmagical fires or one magic item.
3. Water Breathing: Subjects can breathe underwater.
Water Walk: Subject treads on water as if solid.
4. Control Water: Raises or lowers bodies of water.
Ice Storm: Hail deals 5d6 damage in cylinder 40 ft. across.
5. Cone of Cold: 1d6/level cold damage
Summon Natureís Ally V*: Calls creature to fight.
6. Acid Fog: Fog deals acid damage.
Freezing Sphere: Freezes water or deals cold damage.
7. Control Weather: Changes weather in local area.
Summon Natureís Ally VII*: Calls creature to fight.
8. Horrid Wilting: Deals 1d6/level damage within 30 ft.
Planar Ally, Greater*: As lesser planar ally, but up to 18 HD.
9. Elemental Swarm*: Summons multiple elementals.
Summon Natureís Ally IX*: Calls creature to fight.
*Cast as a water spell only.

Lanaya
2012-08-08, 07:23 PM
Example Spell Lists
So, with all the rules out of the way, this is what they do. When everyone's favourite Pelor worshipper, Jozan, finally gets his level 9 spells, what does his Spells Known list look like?


Level 1: Bless Water, Burning Hands, Cure Light Wounds, Detect Undead, Produce Flame, Protection from Evil, Remove Fear, Sanctuary.

Level 2: Aid, Consecrate, Continual Flame, Cure Moderate Wounds, Daylight, Lesser Restoration, Scorching Ray.

Level 3: Cure Serious Wounds, Fireball, Flame Arrow, Heroism, Magic Circle against Evil, Remove Disease, Searing Light.

Level 4: Cure Critical Wounds, Death Ward, Disrupting Weapon, Fire Shield (warm only), Holy Smite, Lesser Planar Ally (good only), Restoration, Wall of Fire.

5. Atonement, Break Enchantment, Dispel Evil, Hallow, Flame Strike, Raise Dead, Summon Natureís Ally V (fire only).

6. Fire Seeds, Heal, Greater Heroism, Incendiary Cloud, Planar Ally (good only), Regenerate, Undeath to Death.

7. Fire Storm, Holy Word, Prismatic Spray, Greater Restoration, Sunbeam, Resurrection, Summon Natureís Ally VII (fire only).

8. Mass Cure Critical Wounds, Holy Aura, Greater Planar Ally (fire or good only), Prismatic Wall, Greater Spell Immunity, Summon Natureís Ally VIII (fire only), Sunburst.

9. Elemental Swarm (fire only), Mass Heal, Meteor Swarm, Prismatic Sphere, Summon Monster IX (good only), True Resurrection.

Well, there's quite a bit of overlap throughout his domains, so he only has 64 spells rather than the full 81. Still probably far more class features than his fellow party members have, so that's nothing to worry about. So what do those 64 spells do? Healing, blasting with fire, morale bonuses, destroying undead, summoning creatures of fire and good, smiting evil. Pretty Pelor-ish stuff. Contrast it with a cleric of Nerull:

Level 1: Curse Water, Deathwatch, Detect Undead, Disguise Self, Inflict Light Wounds, Protection from Good, Silent Image, Summon Undead I

Level 2: Command Undead, Death Knell, Desecrate, Inflict Moderate Wounds, Invisibility, Misdirection, Summon Undead II

Level 3: Animate Dead, Inflict Serious Wounds, Magic Circle against Good, Major Image, Nondetection, Poison, Summon Undead III, Unholy Blight

Level 4: Enervation, Hallucinatory Terrain, Inflict Critical Wounds, Greater Invisibility, Lesser Planar Ally (evil only), Negative Energy Aura, Phantasmal Killer, Summon Undead IV

Level 5: Cloudkill, Dispel Good, False Vision, Revive Undead, Seeming, Slay Living, Summon Undead V, Unhallow

Level 6: Create Undead, Harm, Mislead, Permanent Image, Planar Ally (evil only), Undeath to Death

Level 7: Blasphemy, Bodak's Glare, Control Undead, Destruction, Finger of Death, Mass Inflict Serious Wounds, Project Image, Simulacrum

Level 8: Create Greater Undead, General of Undeath, Greater Planar Ally (evil only), Polymorph Any Object, Screen, Symbol of Death, Trap the Soul, Unholy Aura

Level 9: Energy Drain, Plague of Undead, Shades, Summon Monster IX (evil only), Time Stop, Vile Death, Wail of the Banshee, Weird

He's a sneaky undead-loving killer. Illusions aplenty, save-or-die effects all over the place, negative levels, inflict spells, undead creation, smiting good. Nerull and Pelor worshippers share a few spells, mainly a few fire spells and Undeath to Death, but other than that they're total opposites.

Vadskye
2012-08-08, 10:27 PM
Oh, this is glorious. I've actually been working on a very similar project recently (using a small cleric generalist list and two domains instead of four domains), so I've been looking at the same issues. I definitely will take some of your spell selections for domains, if that's okay, and I have some suggestions of my own. Naturally, connecting spells to domain themes is more of an art than a science, so these are definitely open to debate. But here are my ideas:

For all alignment and elemental domains: I like having "cycles", or patterns of spells, in spell selection across similar domains. For example, all of the elemental domains get elemental swarm. I found it useful to also extend that to giving every elemental domain a Summon Nature's Ally IV (elemental of the appropriate type only) at 4th level, and every aligned domain a Summon Monster IV (creature of the appropriate alignment only) at 4th level. Every aligned domain gets protection from X at 1st level, Align Weapon at 2nd level, Magic Circle Against X at 3rd level, Dispel X at 5th level, Forbiddance at 6th level, Word of X at 7th level, Cloak of X at 8th level, and Summon Monster IX at 9th level. It helps fill those empty slots when you can't quite find anything that fits and ties them together thematically in a very strong, obvious way. With two spell slots at each level, you can afford to make patterns like this - so why not?
Also, the Holy Smite / Unholy Blight / etc. cycle seems really weak for 4th level spells to me, so I pushed them down to 3rd.

Air domain:
2nd level: I don't like the fit of Cat's Grace here. If you replace it with Wind Wall, you can use Gaseous Form or Call Lightning at 3rd instead of Wind Wall.
4th level: What, no air walk? How much more "air" can you get? I'd replace Freedom of Movement with that.
8th level: I chose Reverse Gravity over Planar Ally. I think it fits better.
(Believe it or not, though, we chose the exact same spells at all the other levels. Great minds...)

Animal domain:
6th level: I don't really like the Bear's / Bull's spells here; they aren't very useful spells, and while they have the names of animals, the connection feels tenuous to me. To avoid this, I used Insect Plague at 5th, and then Baleful Polymorph and Commune with Nature at 6th. Worth considering.
8th level: I like the summons at 7th and 9th, but if you have it at 8th too it feels like you're just filling slots. If you bump Creeping Doom to 8th, you can put Antilife Shell in at 7th, which isn't much better fitting but at least isn't the same spell three times.

Chaos: (this one is a tough one)
2-4th level: Mirror Image and Blink fit well with the Chaos theme, but they don't seem to fit the Cleric theme. It just feels wrong to me to have someone in full plate going around casting very powerful defensive spells like that, both from a balance and fluff perspective. I used Tasha's Hideous Laughter and Align Weapon at 2nd, and bumped Chaos Hammer down to 3rd, putting in Summon Monster IV at 4th to take its place.
5th level: Song of Discord is awesome. Nice find!
6th level: Still not a big fan of the Planar Ally. How is that really chaotic? I put in Insanity instead.
7-9th level: Your choices aren't bad by any means. I just found the Prismatic series of spells too good to pass up in these slots. They are so beautifully chaotic.

Death domain:
1-4th level: You liked the Inflict cycle here! It fits better than Destruction, for sure. I don't really like Inflict as spells in general, so I used Doom, Command Undead, Animate Dead, and Death Ward instead. Also, I think Speak with Dead fits better than poison; what is more about death than speaking with it?
6th level: Undeath to Death or Circle of Death? Tomato, tomahto...
7th level: Still don't like Inflict spells, so I used Control Undead. Also, Destruction or Finger of Death? I like the Finger better, since it's got Death in the name. Potato, potahto...

Before I go any farther... Do you actually want this sort of nit-picking?

Lanaya
2012-08-08, 11:19 PM
Oh, this is glorious. I've actually been working on a very similar project recently (using a small cleric generalist list and two domains instead of four domains), so I've been looking at the same issues. I definitely will take some of your spell selections for domains, if that's okay, and I have some suggestions of my own.

Feel free to take whatever you like. I'm just flattered that someone would want to. :smallsmile:


Before I go any farther... Do you actually want this sort of nit-picking?

Absolutely!

Cycles: I'll take a look over the element and alignment domains and see if I can make them a bit more symmetrical. Though I may end up deliberately ensuring that the chaos domain breaks the cycle in as many ways as possible, it feels appropriately chaotic.

Air domain: Yeah, Cat's Grace wasn't the best fit, but I'm a bit hesitant to make wind wall level 2. Rendering archers completely useless with a 3rd level spell that allows no save or SR is harsh enough as it is, making it 2nd level just seems unnecessary.
Air walk is great 'n' all, but for the most part it's just a weaker Fly. It does have its advantages, of course, but not enough that I felt comfortable with putting it in the same spell list.
Reverse gravity is a really cool spell, that's a good idea.

Animal domain: Yeah, lots of filler here. There just aren't that many high level animal-related spells. I'll take a look at the spells you mentioned.

Chaos: Powerful defensive buffs on a cleric may be imbalanced, but it's difficult to tell at this point with all the changes I've made. I'll keep mirror image and blink for now, but I may remove them if they seem a bit too much.
I like the idea of dropping Chaos Hammer and friends to level 3, they are a bit lame for level 4 spells.
Prismatic spells definitely have chaotic effects, but wall and sphere are both stationary defensive battlefield control spells, which don't really fit chaos IMO. But prismatic spray is definitely a good idea, so I can drop insanity down to level 6 and drop planar ally.

Death domain: Inflict spells are bad, yeah, but they just fit the death theme so perfectly. I think I'd rather improve them than remove them, really. I was considering fiddling with granted powers a bit anyway, maybe I can work out a death domain power that improves inflict spells or something.
Circle of death was my first thought for 6th, but I decided that there were probably enough save-or-die against living creatures on the list already.
Finger of death is definitely a better name, but destruction is a better spell. It was a tricky choice.
As for talking to dead people and stuff, I decided to make a clear distinction between death and undeath, which was also a factor in my decision to include undeath to death and trap the soul. I like the idea of clerics of death doing their best to make sure that everyone who dies stays dead.

Vadskye
2012-08-08, 11:59 PM
Feel free to take whatever you like. I'm just flattered that someone would want to. :smallsmile:
And I'm excited that someone else thinks along the same lines I do! :smallcool:


Cycles: I'll take a look over the element and alignment domains and see if I can make them a bit more symmetrical. Though I may end up deliberately ensuring that the chaos domain breaks the cycle in as many ways as possible, it feels appropriately chaotic.
Heh, makes some sense. I kept Chaos in my cycle in part because I was having trouble finding sufficienctly chaotic spells.


Air domain: Yeah, Cat's Grace wasn't the best fit, but I'm a bit hesitant to make wind wall level 2. Rendering archers completely useless with a 3rd level spell that allows no save or SR is harsh enough as it is, making it 2nd level just seems unnecessary.
I'd say that it was 2nd level for Air domain clerics in core, and never really caused problems that I've seen. It doesn't make archers useless; it makes them have to maneuver to the side some, and that's only IF you can keep all good targets on the same side of the wall. That's situational enough that I'm okay with it.


Air walk is great 'n' all, but for the most part it's just a weaker Fly. It does have its advantages, of course, but not enough that I felt comfortable with putting it in the same spell list.
Fair point. I actually kept Fly off the cleric list because I don't like low-level flight (I bumped Levitate to 3rd level and Fly to 4th in my system). But yes, if you want Fly at 3rd, Air Walk at 4th doesn't really belong. That raises the question of whether Air Walk belongs anywhere at all.


Chaos: Powerful defensive buffs on a cleric may be imbalanced, but it's difficult to tell at this point with all the changes I've made. I'll keep mirror image and blink for now, but I may remove them if they seem a bit too much.
Definitely fair. I'd just say that none of the things you've changed have affected Cleric's ability to buff up and kick butt - and giving them access to the best offensive buffs and the best defensive buffs at the same time is scary.


I like the idea of dropping Chaos Hammer and friends to level 3, they are a bit lame for level 4 spells.
Yay! Then maybe the aligned domains will finally get some love from players. As long as we're on the subject, I should also mention that Align Weapon is really weak as written; I gave it the same auto-confirm crits as a paladin's Bless Weapon.


Prismatic spells definitely have chaotic effects, but wall and sphere are both stationary defensive battlefield control spells, which don't really fit chaos IMO.
That's a good point - but is a "you can't do anything" spell (Irresistible Dance) chaotic either? Generally speaking, that sort of effect feels more like Law to me. I'm actually really torn on this one...



Death domain: Inflict spells are bad, yeah, but they just fit the death theme so perfectly. I think I'd rather improve them than remove them, really. I was considering fiddling with granted powers a bit anyway, maybe I can work out a death domain power that improves inflict spells or something.
Improving rather than giving up on is a good philosophy. Maybe you can have a domain power for death that mirrors the domain power that you'll need for healing, since both give spells that clerics of the appropriate alignment can already cast spontaneously. What if the spells (and domains) have their normal effect if you channel the opposite energy, but if you channel the right energy, the spells have an enhanced effect? That would help make up for the fact that the domains are effectively getting only one spell known at each level (if you make the cycle complete).
Er, wait, you got rid of spontaneous casting! Well, that changes things. I'll come back to this later.


Circle of death was my first thought for 6th, but I decided that there were probably enough save-or-die against living creatures on the list already.
That's a good reason. *scribbles out Circle of Death in his list*

Finger of death is definitely a better name, but destruction is a better spell. It was a tricky choice.
Better spell, yes. But the mirroring of the Destruction domain getting the Destruction spell and the Death domain getting the (finger of) Death spell is just too perfect for me to pass up.

As for talking to dead people and stuff, I decided to make a clear distinction between death and undeath, which was also a factor in my decision to include undeath to death and trap the soul. I like the idea of clerics of death doing their best to make sure that everyone who dies stays dead.
Ah, and I see that you tied the animation of the dead to Evil. Interesting - I tried to make a clear distinction between undeath and evil, instead. Stick with the one that fits your campaign world!

That raises a question - how does a cleric get access to Speak with Dead, then, given that it isn't on any of the domains? Does Expanded Inspiration take from the current "generic" cleric spell list, or from the domains, or both? I'd strongly recommend not letting Expanded Inspiration cherry-pick the best spells from all the domains; I think that would hurt the nice walls you've erected between the different domains.

Lanaya
2012-08-09, 12:33 AM
I'd say that it was 2nd level for Air domain clerics in core, and never really caused problems that I've seen. It doesn't make archers useless; it makes them have to maneuver to the side some, and that's only IF you can keep all good targets on the same side of the wall. That's situational enough that I'm okay with it.

Maybe I'm overreacting. I haven't actually seen the spell in use before, but it seemed pretty powerful.


Definitely fair. I'd just say that none of the things you've changed have affected Cleric's ability to buff up and kick butt - and giving them access to the best offensive buffs and the best defensive buffs at the same time is scary.

That is a good point. Well, blink is being replaced by a lower level chaos hammer, but mirror image may in the end have to go. Though now I have to find some level 4 spells to replace the newly buffed holy smite line, hmmm...

EDIT: Currently I've added fear to Chaos; fear effects aren't really associated with chaos but panicking crowds are pretty disorderly, dismissal to Law and cure critical to Good. Problem is, animate dead is the non-magic circle level 3 evil spell, and I don't really want to remove that.


Yay! Then maybe the aligned domains will finally get some love from players. As long as we're on the subject, I should also mention that Align Weapon is really weak as written; I gave it the same auto-confirm crits as a paladin's Bless Weapon.

That's the main reason I didn't include align weapon in any list. I'm trying not to fiddle with actual spells at this point, so for now I'm just going to let it be terrible and unused.


Better spell, yes. But the mirroring of the Destruction domain getting the Destruction spell and the Death domain getting the (finger of) Death spell is just too perfect for me to pass up.

Actually, that is quite a good point. Finger of death for Death, destruction for Destruction. I'll change it.


That raises a question - how does a cleric get access to Speak with Dead, then, given that it isn't on any of the domains? Does Expanded Inspiration take from the current "generic" cleric spell list, or from the domains, or both? I'd strongly recommend not letting Expanded Inspiration cherry-pick the best spells from all the domains; I think that would hurt the nice walls you've erected between the different domains.

Expanded inspiration is generic Cleric spells only.

Vadskye
2012-08-09, 01:08 AM
Maybe I'm overreacting. I haven't actually seen the spell in use before, but it seemed pretty powerful.
It does seem powerful, I agree. And to be honest, I've never seen it actually get used - none of my players have liked it enough to take it!


That is a good point. Well, blink is being replaced by a lower level chaos hammer, but mirror image may in the end have to go. Though now I have to find some level 4 spells to replace the newly buffed holy smite line, hmmm...

EDIT: Currently I've added fear to Chaos; fear effects aren't really associated with chaos but panicking crowds are pretty disorderly, dismissal to Law and cure critical to Good. Problem is, animate dead is the non-magic circle level 3 evil spell, and I don't really want to remove that.

Yeah, fear could fit for those reasons - but it does almost the exact same thing as confusion (mass Will save vs you're going to have a bad time), and confusion fits better with Chaos. If you like the Freedom at 9th level, you could consider adding Freedom of Movement at 4th. Alternately, if you want to stick with the random defensive buffs, you could use a Displacement or a Blink; they're less scary at 4th level (competing with Divine Power really helps from a balance perspective). I'll stick with Summon Monster IV for mine.

As for animate dead - that's a tough one. Well, you could always increase the power of the Holy Smite line and keep them at 4th level. Or you could say that animate dead is evil, but not as evil as creating *intelligent* undead, so Evil domain doesn't need it (or gets it at 4th level). Or you could be a little crazy and give it at 2nd level. The material component cost is significant enough that I doubt any 3rd level clerics are going to abuse the spell too much.


That's the main reason I didn't include align weapon in any list. I'm trying not to fiddle with actual spells at this point, so for now I'm just going to let it be terrible and unused.
Well, so much for the idea of boosting the Holy Smite line. :P Still, the minimalist touch is often best. Less chance to screw up that way, and less for the players to get used to.


Expanded inspiration is generic Cleric spells only.
Good good. That's not too bad.

Tomorrow I'll look at the rest of the cleric domains. This is fun!

Yitzi
2012-08-09, 12:13 PM
Restricting to domain is a pretty extreme step, as some spells (such as basic protective spells) should be more widely available. For a less extreme variant on the same idea, you might want to borrow some ideas from a fix I made (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=222271).

Vadskye
2012-08-09, 12:25 PM
I second that making "generic" Cleric spells more freely available than they are right now, even with Expanded Inspiration, is good. But I really prefer the "two spells per level per domain" system over the semi-random distribution of domain spells across levels that you use, Yitzi. Good gets 9 spells at 2nd level and Travel gets none?

Yitzi
2012-08-09, 12:34 PM
I second that making "generic" Cleric spells more freely available than they are right now, even with Expanded Inspiration, is good. But I really prefer the "two spells per level per domain" system over the semi-random distribution of domain spells across levels that you use, Yitzi. Good gets 9 spells at 2nd level and Travel gets none?

It isn't very even, but keep in mind that most deities come with numerous domains. So a cleric of Fharlaghn won't get any second level spells from the travel domain, but gets a decent selection from Luck and Protection. There is some unevenness in total selection per level, but that's really because some deities' roles have more spells in particular levels than others.

Lanaya
2012-08-11, 04:09 PM
Well, I solved the problem of level 3 unholy blight taking the place of animate dead by adding the Undeath domain. Now there's a whole domain just for making and controlling undead, and Evil doesn't need to be directly associated with them.


Restricting to domain is a pretty extreme step, as some spells (such as basic protective spells) should be more widely available. For a less extreme variant on the same idea, you might want to borrow some ideas from a fix I made (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=222271).

On one hand, I agree that things like healing and protecting have always been a big part of the cleric class, and should be available to all clerics. On the other hand, why would Nerull's servants heal anyone? The god of death has no reason to grant cure spells to his servants. And I really like classes with strong themes - if I do end up running a campaign with these rules, which I hope to, I'd use them alongside rules restricting wizards to a single school, so each spellcaster would have their own very specific area of expertise. So I decided to take a harsh stance on clerical versatility. And if you really need one specific spell, like resurrection or its friends, you can get it through expanded inspiration.

God Imperror
2012-08-11, 07:55 PM
Uhm... are you familiar with the Mystic? From dragonlance campaign setting?

It is similar to a divine sorcerer picking spells from the cleric list and having one
domain. It might help with inspiration.

If I understand it correctly clerics can cast spells from the 4 domains granted by their deity plus any spell that they learn at even levels (except 20). But what happens with clerics that follow an ideal? Even if there are alignment groups maybe thematic groups could be a good idea, for example Orcus can have 4 undeath/death related domains to attract necromancers.

Vadskye
2012-08-12, 05:33 PM
And I really like classes with strong themes - if I do end up running a campaign with these rules, which I hope to, I'd use them alongside rules restricting wizards to a single school, so each spellcaster would have their own very specific area of expertise.
Heh, I'm also working on a more restricted version of arcane casting. But based on what I'm seeing, one-school casting cannot work for mages. There are some spells that wizards basically need to function (Mage Armor and Shield come to mind in particular), so unless you want to do some pretty serious rebalancing - such as deciding that you really want mages to have the AC of a commoner with magic items - you'll need a "general list" of spells that mages are allowed to choose from.

You may think "But the wizard can just use Expanded Inspiration (or the equivalent) to get those spells." Yes, but then those spell choices are basically an "interestingness tax" that every good player has to pay. A core philosophy that I'd advise following is: try to never force a player to choose between the interesting and the good. If you do, players will often choose the interesting, and then you're going to have to adjust the encounters to deal with the fact that one member of the party is weaker than they "should" be. Or they may feel pressured to take the "good" option, making them feel less attached to their character.