Skytopus(3.5, monster, PEACH)

[bobthe6th]

Skytopus:
Large Magical Beast (Cold)
Hit Dice: 10d10+13 (68 hp)
Initiative: +2
Speed: 20 ft. (4 squares), fly 15ft (perfect)
Armor Class: 18 (-1 size, +2 Dex, +7 natural), touch 11, flat-footed 16
Base Attack/Grapple: +10/+19
Attack: Tentacle +15 melee (1d4+5)
Full Attack: 8 tentacles +15 melee (1d4+5) and bite +13 melee (1d8+2)
Space/Reach: 10 ft./10 ft. (20 ft. with tentacle)
Special Attacks: constrict, Death throws, Improved grab, Ink.
Special Qualities: Dark vision 60ft, immunity to cold, jet, low-light vision, vulnerability to fire.
Saves: Fort +8, Ref +9, Will +4
Abilities: Str 20, Dex 15, Con 13, Int 2, Wis 12, Cha 3
Skills: Escape Artist +12, Hide +12, Listen +5, Spot +7, Move silently +13
Feats: Alertness, Multiattack, Skill Focus (Hide), Toughness.
Environment: Any
Organization: Solitary
Challenge Rating: 10
Advancement: 11-12 HD (Large); 13-24 HD (Huge)
Level Adjustment: -

A skytopus looks like a pale giant flying octopus. Scholars suggest wizards are to blame for their existence, but there is no evidence to support this. Research has shown that the actual ability to float is caused by the large amount of lighter than air gasses in air sacs in its head. Sadly research has yet to show how they generate ink in mere moments.

These creatures are aggressive and territorial hunters, with arms reaching 10 feet or more in length. Their tentacles are studded with barbs and sharp-edged suckers. The ability breath fire just adds to the horror of these creatures. Even druids are known to kill them on sight.

Combat:
An opponent can attack a skytopus’s tentacles with a sunder attempt as if they were weapons. A skytopus’s tentacles have 10 hit points each. If a skytopus is currently grappling a target with the tentacle that is being attacked, it usually uses another limb to make its attack of opportunity against the opponent making the sunder attempt. Severing one of a skytopus’s tentacles deals 5 points of damage to the creature. A skytopus usually withdraws from combat if it loses four tentacles. The creature regrows severed limbs in 1d10+10 days.

Constrict (Ex):
A skytopus deals 2d8+6 points of damage with a successful grapple check.

Death Throes (Ex):
When a skytopus is killed, it erupts in a fiery explosion that deals 10d6 points of fire damage to anyone within 40 feet. A successful Reflex save (DC 16) halves the damage. The save is Constitution-based.

Improved Grab (Ex):
To use this ability, a skytopus must hit an opponent of any size with a tentacle attack. It can then attempt to start a grapple as a free action without provoking an attack of opportunity. If it wins the grapple check, it establishes a hold and can constrict.

Ink (Ex): A skytopus can emit flammable ink in a variety of ways. Whichever way it uses this ability, it can't use ink again for 1d4 rounds.


Cloud: As part of its jet ability (see below), a skytopus can emit cloud of jet-black ink 20 feet high by 20 feet wide by 20 feet long around its point of origin. The cloud provides total concealment. All vision within the cloud is obscured. A moderate wind (11+ mph) disperses the cloud in 6 rounds; a strong wind (21+ mph) disperses the cloud in 3 round.

If the cloud takes fire damage, it ignites and deals 2d6 points of fire damage to anything in the area and sets them on fire. The cloud burns after a round.

Grease: As a standard action, a skytopus can spray ink on the ground in a 30-foot radius. Any creature in the area where the ink is sprayed must make a successful Reflex save (DC 16) or fall. This save is repeated on your turn each round that the creature remains within the area. A creature can walk within or through the area of grease at half normal speed with a DC 10 Balance check. Failure means it can’t move that round, and must then make a Reflex save (DC 16) or fall, while failure by 5 or more means it falls (see the Balance skill for details). The saves are Constitution-based.

If any part of the area covered in ink takes any amount of fire damage, the ink ignites. Anything in the area takes 2d6 points of fire damage and catches on fire. It burns out after 4 rounds.

Blind: As a standard action, a skytopus makes a ranged touch attack against a target creature within 60 feet. If the attack hits, the target is blinded until it takes a full round action to clean off its face or other visual sensory organ. If the target takes at least one point of fire damage within the next five rounds, it catches fire.

Breath Weapon: As a standard action, a skytopus can breathe a 40-foot cone of flaming ink causing 10d4 points of fire damage, and catches anything in the area on fire. A successful Reflex save (DC 16) halves the damage and negates the ignition. The save is Constitution-based.


Jet (Ex): Once per round as a full-round action, a skytopus can jet at a speed of 200 feet. It must move in a straight line, but does not provoke attacks of opportunity while jetting. It also cannot attack as part of this movement. Just before jetting, as a free action, a skytopus can release an ink cloud (see above)

Skills: A skytopus can change colors, giving it a +4 racial bonus on Hide checks. A giant octopus also can squeeze and contort its body, giving it a +10 racial bonus on Escape Artist checks.


So, thoughts? Were did I mess up, were was my copy and pasting bad, and how broken is this?(hah, take that sat! totally made a list and changed up the last part of it.)
This is just a terifying thought I had... what would a octopi that had a head filled with hydrogen be like? It would float around, and be sneaky... looking exactly like the rest of the sky. The low flight speed was to counter balance the fact of jeting... The breath weapon was just to give it some ranged option.

[Debihuman]

Conceptually I give this an A. The stat block could use some work.

I have a few concerns.

The first is that it seems it should be a Magical Beast rather than an Animal. Changing its Type will change HD to d10 (giving it 55 hp), increase BAB to +8 and Grapple to +17 and melee changes to +12 for tentacles and +7 to bite. It also gives the creature darkvision 60 ft. Whenever the phrase, "a wizard did it" shows up in a creature's ecology, that's a big clue it should a Magical Beast not an animal (of course breathing fire is another clue).

Flight speed is a tad low. Since the giant octopus had a swim speed of 30 ft. why not just make it fly 30 ft.? At least give it a fly speed equal to 1/2 its land speed.

You should explain how it flies. I recommend giving them an air bladder and making them a natural source of helium. I do not recommend any gas (such as hydrogen) that has the propensity to explode around fire. It should not blow itself up when it uses its breath weapon.

Since these no longer need to swim as they fly, you should change the Swim skill to a Move Silently skill.

Breath Weapon is written awkwardly.

Breath Weapon (Ex): As a standard action, a skytopus can breathe a 40-foot cone of fire once every 1d4 rounds causing 4d6 points of fire damage. A successful Reflex save (DC 15) halves the damage. The save is Constitution-based.

Otherwise, it looks good to me.

Debby

[sengmeng]

You called it "Giant octopus" in the skill section. Otherwise, I agree with Debihuman on basically every point. Maybe the jet distance should be greater; a barbarian with the run feat could match that without the straight-line-only penalty. Was the giant octopus's jet the same distance? Because 200 feet a round outclasses almost any normal character in the water, but not on land. 500 feet maybe?

[bobthe6th]

Conceptually I give this an A. The stat block could use some work.


Thanks, and they always do.



I have a few concerns.


I'm happy to entertain them.



The first is that it seems it should be a Magical Beast rather than an Animal. Changing its Type will change HD to d10 (giving it 55 hp), increase BAB to +8 and Grapple to +17 and melee changes to +12 for tentacles and +7 to bite. It also gives the creature darkvision 60 ft. Whenever the phrase, "a wizard did it" shows up in a creature's ecology, that's a big clue it should a Magical Beast not an animal (of course breathing fire is another clue).


Well... fire breathing is just off gassing helium. I guess it should be magical animal, I do like the idea of being a flat animal... still,fair enough, will change it.



Flight speed is a tad low. Since the giant octopus had a swim speed of 30 ft. why not just make it fly 30 ft.? At least give it a fly speed equal to 1/2 its land speed.


I figure that given the perfect maneuverability, and the ability to jet...
Also, I want to give it the idea it is slow and hard to move without jetting.
Still, I guess 1/2 seems fair.



You should explain how it flies. I recommend giving them an air bladder and making them a natural source of helium. I do not recommend any gas (such as hydrogen) that has the propensity to explode around fire. It should not blow itself up when it uses its breath weapon.


See cold suptype... it takes bonus damage from fire. I should spell it out that it is using helium.



Since these no longer need to swim as they fly, you should change the Swim skill to a Move Silently skill.


Gah... one thing I failed to cut out of the entry. will fix.



Breath Weapon is written awkwardly.


I stitched it together from the dragon entry.



Otherwise, it looks good to me.


sweet!




EDIT!: changes made, CR solidified. Any one want to make any further suggestions?

[Debihuman]

A giant octopus has CR 8. This is obviously tougher since it has fire-breathing, flight, and better hit points. It's a bit slower but isn't limited by environment. I'd suggest CR 9 at least.

Debby

[Temotei]

The type is "Magical Beast," not "Magical Animal."

Funny concept.

[bobthe6th]

A giant octopus has CR 8. This is obviously tougher since it has fire-breathing, flight, and better hit points. It's a bit slower but isn't limited by environment. I'd suggest CR 9 at least.


I was using Vorpal Tribble's CR calculator...
#1. Divide creature's average HP by 4.5 to 6.5.
4.5 for 5 HD or lower, 5 for 6-10 HD, 5.5 for 11-15 HD, 6 for 16-20 HD., 6.5 for 20-25 HD.

#2. Add 1 for each five points above 10 its AC is, subtracting 1 for every 5 below.

#3. Add 1 for each special attack (+2 to +5 or more if its got a decent number of spells in its spell-like abilities).

#4. Add 1 for each quality unless you deem it worthy of more. Add 1 for each resistance and 10 points of DR it has, and 2 for each immunity. Subtract 1 for each vulnerability.

#5. Add 1 for every two bonus feats it has.

#6. Divide total by 3. This should be its rough CR

Given that monster manuals CRs tend to be off. And I mean, do you think a level 7 party couldn't fight this? Admittedly they would have to rely on blasting/ ranged attacks... and hope that it doesn't just stealth around them picking off targets. But a level 9 party would have to fear the same.


@temotei: Fixed, and thanks.

[sengmeng]

I assume everywhere you wrote "helium" you meant "hydrogen" since helium is utterly inert and hydrogen is highly flammable.

[bobthe6th]

@ seg: sorry I missed your first post.



You called it "Giant octopus" in the skill section. Otherwise, I agree with Debihuman on basically every point. Maybe the jet distance should be greater; a barbarian with the run feat could match that without the straight-line-only penalty. Was the giant octopus's jet the same distance? Because 200 feet a round outclasses almost any normal character in the water, but not on land. 500 feet maybe?


good catch, fixed.

Well, with perfect fly speed the 200ft is omni directional... so yes the barbarian can out run it, but in 5 rounds the creature can be outside of long range. I guess more could make sense, but I don't want it to be to crazy. Most of this was moding the base creature as little as possible while adding the idea of flight...



I assume everywhere you wrote "helium" you meant "hydrogen" since helium is utterly inert and hydrogen is highly flammable.


yes. I just mixed the two up due to them being the primary lighter then air gasses used...

[sengmeng]

Well, with perfect fly speed the 200ft is omni directional... so yes the barbarian can out run it, but in 5 rounds the creature can be outside of long range. I guess more could make sense, but I don't want it to be to crazy. Most of this was moding the base creature as little as possible while adding the idea of flight...

If that does what you want it to, fine. I just thought that the jet was meant to be a way for the Skytopus to say "What? I took damage? This encounter is OVER!"

[bobthe6th]

Well, octopi do swim by blowing water, and I figure a lighter then air one could do the same through the air. The ability was meant to be a swift movement that takes a larger action.

[Mangles]

I find it strange that a creature that uses fire as a primary weapon is vulnerable to it as well. I would have thought it was the other way around.

Besides that small niggle, this is a solid monster, doubly so if Debby says it is.

[bobthe6th]

I find it strange that a creature that uses fire as a primary weapon is vulnerable to it as well. I would have thought it was the other way around.

Besides that small niggle, this is a solid monster, doubly so if Debby says it is.

Well, given that the fire is not based on the skytopus being filled with magical fire, but rather igniting flammable gasses as it exhales them... reasons.

the vote of confidence is nice.

would be cool to get this play tested. Any DM wanna use their group as a gunnie pig?

[Debihuman]

Don't forget VT estimator isn't exact. Part of the reason that the giant octopus has a higher CR is that it has 8 primary attacks and reach. Flight adds +1 to the CR almost automatically.

One of the things you could do to make these tougher would be variant abilities. Perhaps skytopuses with 9 or more HD, explode when they die.

Death Throes (Ex): When a skytopus is killed, it erupts in a fiery explosion that deals 2d10 points of fire damage to anyone within 40 feet. A Fortitude save (DC 10 + 1/2 skytopus' HD + Con modifier). A successful Fortitude save halves the damage. The save is Constitution-based.

Debby

[bobthe6th]

Don't forget VT estimator isn't exact. Part of the reason that the giant octopus has a higher CR is that it has 8 primary attacks and reach. Flight adds +1 to the CR almost automatically.

One of the things you could do to make these tougher would be variant abilities. Perhaps skytopuses with 9 or more HD, explode when they die.

Death Throes (Ex): When a skytopus is killed, it erupts in a fiery explosion that deals 2d10 points of fire damage to anyone within 40 feet. A Fortitude save (DC 10 + 1/2 skytopus' HD + Con modifier). A successful Fortitude save halves the damage. The save is Constitution-based.

Debby

A fair point, pushing it up to 8. I fear for putting the CR to high, as I fear pushing the CR over HD... or I could add more abilities and 2HD and make it a CR10... thoughts?

Added and modded the death throws, shoved damage to a full fireball... and made it a reflex save.

what if I gave the ink a variety of options? Like either grease, fog cloud, or single target blind? Then make it all flammable! SYNERGY!

edit: also, thinking about feats... should I give it better feats? like multiattack or meta breath feats?

should I give it Hid in plain sight?

[Debihuman]

I agree that these appear to need more HD for the CR. Adding 2 makes sense since I generally think CR should be equal to or lower than HD too.

Your changes to Death Throes look good. Don't forget to add it to Special Attacks.

Multiattack is good feat to add since you are adding HD.

Ink options sound interesting. I like Grease and making the ink cloud flammable. Synergy indeed! :smallsmile:

Could you use skytopus's ink to make an alchemical version of explosive runes? I'm thinking it would be like writing w/lemon juice. It's invisible until heated up and then blows up. Of course, this means you'd have to harvest it from a living skytopus because they explode when they die. [Major gross factor but hey isn't that integral to the game?]

Debby

[bobthe6th]

I agree that these appear to need more HD for the CR. Adding 2 makes sense since I generally think CR should be equal to or lower than HD too.

Yep, uped to 10HD and CR 10.



Your changes to Death Throes look good. Don't forget to add it to Special Attacks.


Sweet.



Multiattack is good feat to add since you are adding HD.


feel bad about the toughness... seems a bit weak. what about skill focus(move silently)?



Ink options sound interesting. I like Grease and making the ink cloud flammable. Synergy indeed! :smallsmile:


added a verity of things to it, and rolled breath weapon into ink.



Could you use skytopus's ink to make an alchemical version of explosive runes? I'm thinking it would be like writing w/lemon juice. It's invisible until heated up and then blows up. Of course, this means you'd have to harvest it from a living skytopus because they explode when they die. [Major gross factor but hey isn't that integral to the game?]


would be a cool thing to make as a bit of world building.

[Debihuman]

There are still some stat block issues. Here's everything in more standard format. Note, you are still missing the creature's description so I took the liberty of adding it. Environment should be cold mountains and plains rather than any. Saves and skills updated for new HD. [2 skill points so I put one each in Spot and Listen). It should be correct now.


Skytopus
Large Magical Beast (Cold)
Hit Dice: 10d10+13 (68 hp)
Initiative: +2
Speed: 20 ft. (4 squares), Fly 15 ft. (perfect)
Armor Class: 18 (-1 size, +2 Dex, +7 natural), touch 11, flat-footed 16
Base Attack/Grapple: +10/+19
Attack: Tentacle +15 melee (1d4+5) or ink +11 ranged touch (blind)
Full Attack: 8 tentacles +15 melee (1d4+5) and bite +13 melee (1d8+2) or ink +11 ranged touch (blind)
Space/Reach: 10 ft./10 ft. (20 ft. with tentacle)
Special Attacks: Breath weapon, constrict, death throes, improved grab, ink
Special Qualities: Darkvision 60 ft., immunity to cold, jet, low-light vision, vulnerability to fire
Saves: Fort +8, Ref +9, Will +4
Abilities: Str 20, Dex 15, Con 13, Int 2, Wis 12, Cha 3
Skills: Escape Artist +12, Hide +12, Listen +5, Spot +7, Move silently +13
Feats: Alertness, Multiattack, Skill Focus (Hide), Toughness
Environment: Any
Organization: Solitary
Challenge Rating: 10
Advancement: 11-12 HD (Large); 13-24 HD (Huge)

A skytopus looks like a pale giant flying octopus. Scholars suggest wizards are to blame for their existence, but there is no evidence to support this. Research has shown that the actual ability to float is caused by the large amount of lighter than air gasses in air sacs in its head. Further, the ability to breathe fire is caused by blowing out some of the gases that ignite in mid air.

These creatures are aggressive and territorial hunters, with arms reaching 10 feet or more in length. Their tentacles are studded with barbs and sharp-edged suckers. The ability breath fire just adds to the horror of these creatures. Even druids are known to kill them on sight.

Combat

An opponent can attack a skytopus’s tentacles with a sunder attempt as if they were weapons. A skytopus’s tentacles have 10 hit points each. If a skytopus is currently grappling a target with the tentacle that is being attacked, it usually uses another limb to make its attack of opportunity against the opponent making the sunder attempt. Severing one of a skytopus’s tentacles deals 5 points of damage to the creature. A skytopus usually withdraws from combat if it loses four tentacles. The creature regrows severed limbs in 1d10+10 days.

Constrict (Ex): A skytopus deals 2d8+6 points of damage with a successful grapple check.

Death Throes (Ex): When a skytopus is killed, it erupts in a fiery explosion that deals 8d6 points of fire damage to anyone within 40 feet. A successful Reflex save (DC 16) halves the damage. The save is Constitution-based.

Improved Grab (Ex): To use this ability, a skytopus must hit an opponent of any size with a tentacle attack. It can then attempt to start a grapple as a free action without provoking an attack of opportunity. If it wins the grapple check, it establishes a hold and can constrict.

Ink (Ex): A skytopus can emit flammable ink in a variety of ways. Whichever way it uses this ability, it can't use ink again for 1d4 rounds.

Cloud: As part of its jet ability (see below), a skytopus can emit cloud of jet-black ink 20 feet high by 20 feet wide by 20 feet long around its point of origin. The cloud provides total concealment. All vision within the cloud is obscured. A moderate wind (11+ mph) disperses the cloud in 6 rounds; a strong wind (21+ mph) disperses the cloud in 3 round.

If the cloud takes fire damage, it ignites and deals 2d6 points of fire damage to anything in the area and sets them on fire. The cloud burns after a round.

Grease: As a standard action, a skytopus can spray ink on the ground in a 30-foot radius. Any creature in the area where the ink is sprayed must make a successful Reflex save (DC 16) or fall. This save is repeated on your turn each round that the creature remains within the area. A creature can walk within or through the area of grease at half normal speed with a DC 10 Balance check. Failure means it can’t move that round, and must then make a Reflex save (DC 16) or fall, while failure by 5 or more means it falls (see the Balance skill for details). The saves are Constitution-based.

If any part of the area covered in ink takes any amount of fire damage, the ink ignites. Anything in the area takes 2d6 points of fire damage and catches on fire. It burns out after 4 rounds.

Blind: As a standard action, a skytopus makes a ranged touch attack against a target creature within 60 feet. If the attack hits, the target is blinded until it takes a full round action to clean off its face or other visual sensory organ. If the target takes at least one point of fire damage, it catches fire.

Breath Weapon: As a standard action, a skytopus can breathe a 40-foot cone of flaming ink causing 10d4 points of fire damage, and catches anything in the area on fire. A successful Reflex save (DC 16) halves the damage and negates the ignition. The save is Constitution-based.

A moderate wind (11+ mph) disperses the ink cloud in 4 rounds; a strong wind (21+ mph) disperses the ink cloud in 1 round.

Jet (Ex): Once per round as a full-round action, a skytopus can jet at a speed of 200 feet. It must move in a straight line, but does not provoke attacks of opportunity while jetting. It also cannot attack as part of this movement. Just before jetting, as a free action, a skytopus can release an ink cloud (see above)

Skills: A skytopus can change colors, giving it a +4 racial bonus on Hide checks. A skytopus also can squeeze and contort its body, giving it a +10 racial bonus on Escape Artist checks.

Debby

[bobthe6th]

edits made. though I think ink is a special attack now... though I was never entirely clear on the difference.

[Debihuman]

You are correct. Ink is now a special attack. Missed that. Will fix my stat block. Also, did some minor proofreading on the text.

Debby

[bobthe6th]

more edits made, also posted a request for art over in arts&crafts (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=261927) so this thing can hopefully have a picture to go with it.

[bobthe6th]

bump for more feed back

[Madara]

I would definently raise this thing as a Zombie(To retain the flight, since it isn't magical flight) and use Awaken Undead to get all of the wonderful abilities for the price of 20HD :smallbiggrin:

That said, I love the idea of the sky octopus, and I think CR 10 is just about right, its frail but dangerous. At the apropriate level, you won't have to worry too much about its stealth, most parties will have some other method of detecting foes.

[bobthe6th]

Except for death throes.

but will they think to have it on the martch?

would HiPS be a reasonable addition? Would give the idea the thing should get a surprise round on them... will think about it after I run the playtest.

[Komodo]

This thing reminds me of the Thirteenth Colossus if the Thirteenth Colossus was a fire-spraying octopus instead of a snake.

(for the unfamiliar, the 13th colossus in the game Shadow of the Colossus was a giant snake-thing that could fly but had to descend if you shot the three flesh bags beneath it, and when you shot them they sprayed what looked like ink but was probably colossus blood)

A few minor suggestions:

I think that environment, rather than being "any,"...well, the feeling I get is a high-altitude mountain environment. There, the thinner air would make floating easier (I think, I studied bio, not physics) and make fire that much rarer. Also, rough terrain would make stalking prey easier for a floating creature.

I'm not sure if HiPS is really necessary, it already has a pretty good escape tactic. Whether or not they should have it depends on whether or not you want then to launch surprise assaults and whether you like the idea of them escaping from fights wih PCs. Then again, getting the PCs riled up to hunt this thing down once and for all might get interesting.

I might try using this in a campaign I'm currently running (don't expect feedback too soon, though: it's a pbp game, and the groups still at level 1). Can't wait to see how it plays out.

[Debihuman]

Environment is probably Any non-desert. It can certainly blend in most places.

A zombie loses most special qualities of the base creature. A zombie skytopus isn't as impressive as you might think since it loses all of its special abilities when you turn into a zombie.It also becomes a Clumsy flier.

I am of the opinion that class features should never be given to monsters. If the monster can take a level in that class, then it makes sense for the monster to have it. Otherwise, it dilutes what makes having a class special.

It already has a decent Hide skill and can change color to fit its environment so giving it Hide in Plain Sight is just overkill.

Debby

[Madara]

Environment is probably Any non-desert. It can certainly blend in most places.

A zombie loses most special qualities of the base creature. A zombie skytopus isn't as impressive as you might think since it loses all of its special abilities when you turn into a zombie.It also becomes a Clumsy flier.

I am of the opinion that class features should never be given to monsters. If the monster can take a level in that class, then it makes sense for the monster to have it. Otherwise, it dilutes what makes having a class special.
Debby

I said I would Awaken Undead on it, which means it regains the Ex abilities, which in this case are most of the good ones. It doesn't need to be an incredible flier when it has 8 attacks at 20ft. reach.

[sengmeng]

Death Throes (Ex):
When a skytopus is killed, it erupts in a fiery explosion that deals 10d6 points of fire damage to anyone within 40 feet. A successful Reflex save (DC 16) halves the damage. The save is Constitution-based.


I said I would Awaken Undead on it, which means it regains the Ex abilities, which in this case are most of the good ones. It doesn't need to be an incredible flier when it has 8 attacks at 20ft. reach.

How do you awaken a puddle of blood and several chunks of tentacles?

I think forest, maybe mountainous forest, is the most sensible environment. Octopi are not pelagic swimmers. They creep on the bottom looking for prey and jet away when threatened. The Skytopus should creep through the treetops when on the hunt, then rise above them and jet away if need be. Maybe very old tough ones could move to mountainous areas if they would be the apex predator in that region (although in a world where dragons exist, they wouldn't be). Real octopi can hide in the debris, seaweed, and coral on the bottom extremely well, but changing color and even shape doesn't help much when floating in the middle of the ocean.

[Debihuman]

I'd forgotten the Awaken Undead spell let zombies regain their Ex abilities.

May have to look into that again. It's one of the toughest zombies you can make since it has 10 HD, which is the limit on zombie HD.

It would be interesting....

Debby

[sengmeng]

Is there a spell to immediately turn a living creature into an Undead? Or are you using Wish to create a dead Skytopus body? Otherwise, pointing out for the third time, it explodes when it dies.

[Debihuman]

Exploding does kinda put a kibosh on making it a zombie. More importantly, it's an octopus, so it doesn't have a skeleton. You can't make a zombie from it in the first place. Gotta remember that too.

Debby

[Madara]

Is there a spell to immediately turn a living creature into an Undead? Or are you using Wish to create a dead Skytopus body? Otherwise, pointing out for the third time second time, it explodes when it dies.

Meh, PAO something into a Skyopus Corpse, or use the Marvolous Pigments. Its not that hard, most necromancers already use those options to get good corpses anyways.

[sengmeng]

Meh, PAO something into a Skyopus Corpse, or use the Marvolous Pigments. Its not that hard, most necromancers already use those options to get good corpses anyways.

Do they? I wouldn't allow that if I was a DM. Maybe POA on a different corpse; any large animal would have a duration of permanent. Still, I would rule that if a skytopus explodes when it dies, creating a skytopus corpse magically would just turn a large animal corpse into a large mess. Why wouldn't it?

[Madara]

Do they? I wouldn't allow that if I was a DM. Maybe POA on a different corpse; any large animal would have a duration of permanent. Still, I would rule that if a skytopus explodes when it dies, creating a skytopus corpse magically would just turn a large animal corpse into a large mess. Why wouldn't it?

Outsiders are supposed to return to their plane when they die, but we can still get their bodies via the same method, plus a corpse is merely the body minus life, so its not impossible, I mean, several other creatures explode when they die. As for the necromancy stuff, its been debated plenty, but in terms of RAW it works. You have to realize you shell out 20x50= 1000gp just to animate this thing. Its not the greatest investment.

[sengmeng]

But a Skytopus body is a thing that explodes. You create a thing that explodes with POA, it explodes, just as if you created a grenade without a pin. If you create a puddle of Alchemist's Fire with POA, wouldn't you expect it to start on fire? If you said "I create a puddle of Alchemist's Fire that doesn't light on fire" then you haven't created a puddle of Alchemist's Fire. If you say "I create a Skytopus corpse that doesn't explode" then you haven't created a Skytopus corpse, just something that looks like it. I'm objecting here because the death throes is an extraordinary ability (the exact type of ability that make you want to awaken it), not a supernatural one, so your interpretation of the rules seems to be correct in most cases, but not this one.

[bobthe6th]

It was more that being dead meant it relaxed all its muscles... much like during executions the corpse would floul itself because it stopped tensing muscles holding it in. A skytopus vents excess hydrogen through its mouth... keeping the gas bag tightly seeled other wise. with enough damage the mouth slacks, and something ignights it... yeah, big boom. now, just making a corpse that won't explode means it has an empty gas bag, which means no flight.

[Debihuman]

You cannot add the Zombie Template to a dead Skytopus because it has no skeleton. It doesn't even qualify for the template.

Debby