Super Powered Game-System Advice

[CowMasterTrojan]

So in the near future I plan on running a game that involves the pc's being rogue super heroes. My group has never run anything like this, and I find myself unsure what system to use.

One of my players has refused to play Mutants and Masterminds. I am aware of savage worlds being available, but personally I don't care for the system.

Is there any other systems that people use for super powered themed games that they could recommend?

[Techwarrior]

Silver Age Sentinels is a favorite of mine. Good luck getting a copy legally though, as it wasn't very widespread, the company went under (IIRC), and it has no SRD. Realistically, the only way to have a copy is if you bought one way back when it came out.

Another option is ripping the fluff out of a system and refluffing everything. I'd recommend Shadowrun (more likely) or Mage: the Ascension if you've got a group of talented DMs that want to play (no really). Mage is really only an option with a good group of people who DM, as the whole system requires you to make stuff up on the fly.

[ParagonOfApathy]

If you're willing to read, G.U.R.P.S. is a good option.

I've found it does well in supers games, as well as other high-power games. The only problem is sifting through the options to get the character you want.

[Diskhotep]

Truth & Justice is a great system. It is a PDQ game so the rules are very simple to pick up, and the combat system provides built-in hooks for future adventures.

(Basically, characters take damage to their abilities and backgrounds, with the first hit taken in a session providing a future plot hook.)

[The Dark Fiddler]

Why is your player so dead-set against M&M?

Anyway, I've heard things about HERO, both good and bad. No experience with it, personally, but it's a choice.

[Tengu_temp]

Why is your player so dead-set against M&M?

That's a good question. Most people recommend M&M because it simply is that good.

[CarpeGuitarrem]

Also, finding out why they dislike M&M could point us to a specific recommendation.

[Hopeless]

How about Icons?

Simple enough system and they can create their characters if they don't fancy random rolls.

You can get pdfs of silver age sentinels from rpg now or drive thru rpg I've seen the d20 version there not sure if its still at a reduced price though.

I bought a copy of the original version off of Amazon so they're still available albeit mine's obviously a used copy.

Have you come up with an idea where to start your game?

[CarpeGuitarrem]

ICONS is a fantastic idea, especially if the anti-M&M sentiment has to do with the scope of abstraction in the game.

[NikitaDarkstar]

I too would suggest looking into GURPS. Character creation is a bit painful but it is a fun system overall. Legends might also be an option.

[CowMasterTrojan]

Silver Age Sentinels is a favorite of mine. Good luck getting a copy legally though, as it wasn't very widespread, the company went under (IIRC), and it has no SRD. Realistically, the only way to have a copy is if you bought one way back when it came out.

Another option is ripping the fluff out of a system and refluffing everything. I'd recommend Shadowrun (more likely) or Mage: the Ascension if you've got a group of talented DMs that want to play (no really). Mage is really only an option with a good group of people who DM, as the whole system requires you to make stuff up on the fly.

Trying to find Silver Age Sentinels. Based on what wikipedia says, it might work.

And I do not have a talented group of Dm's, so those other two wouldn't work. Thanks for the suggestion though.


If you're willing to read, G.U.R.P.S. is a good option.

I've found it does well in supers games, as well as other high-power games. The only problem is sifting through the options to get the character you want.

My concern is that the players wouldn't want to read through it. My understanding is also that it suffers from the same problem that I feel savage world suffers from. It's such a broad system that can adapt to anything, that it doesn't feel like it does anything good. But I've never played gurps, just savage worlds, so that may be a assumption.


Truth & Justice is a great system. It is a PDQ game so the rules are very simple to pick up, and the combat system provides built-in hooks for future adventures.

(Basically, characters take damage to their abilities and backgrounds, with the first hit taken in a session providing a future plot hook.)

Simple and easy to pick up is a big plus in my book, so I will have to take a look.


Why is your player so dead-set against M&M?

Anyway, I've heard things about HERO, both good and bad. No experience with it, personally, but it's a choice.

Also, finding out why they dislike M&M could point us to a specific recommendation.
My player has stated he's not interested in anything d20. I'm not positive, but I'm fairly certain it uses a variant d20 system. He hasn't said exactly why, but I think he feels classes and levels hurt game play. Plus it's easier to power game with the d20 system. And we do have a few power gamers.


ICONS is a fantastic idea, especially if the anti-M&M sentiment has to do with the scope of abstraction in the game.
Could you expand on that though better. I'm not sure I understand.


How about Icons?

Simple enough system and they can create their characters if they don't fancy random rolls.

You can get pdfs of silver age sentinels from rpg now or drive thru rpg I've seen the d20 version there not sure if its still at a reduced price though.

I bought a copy of the original version off of Amazon so they're still available albeit mine's obviously a used copy.

Have you come up with an idea where to start your game?

Yeah, trying to find a copy now.

The setting is going to be in a DC/Marvel hybrid world. At the beginning of the campaign the players and I will pick out the super heroes that populate the world. I'm taking heroes straight from the comics to make it most enjoyable, rather than fill it with cheap imitations.

Basically story-wise I'm doing something similar to marvel civil war, so other heroes will be villains as well as villains being villains.

[Hiro Protagonest]

Plus it's easier to power game with the d20 system. And we do have a few power gamers.

I don't own M&M personally, but I have heard two things.
1. It's badly balanced.
2. It's really good.

So that concern is valid.

I've heard the same things about 3.5 though... and I'm setting 3.5 aside for the various better systems out there. I will never spend another dollar on 3e or Modern, and M&M only if a RL group wants to play that.

Anyway, someone recommended HERO. If you don't mind having to create everything yourself (basically the entire character creation is homebrew with guidelines) in exchange for a generic system, fine. But Champions, which uses the same game, already has the powers made up, so you don't have to create them from scratcg.

[Tengu_temp]

M&M doesn't have a class and level system. All it does is Power Levels which decide the caps on various abilities. It uses d20 only in that all the checks are done by a d20+modifiers vs save DC roll, and that it has the d20 system of abilities and skills in 2e (but no longer in 3e).

It is, however, a game that's easy to break, but I can't think of a superhero game that'd let you build a wide range of characters that wouldn't have the same concern. In pretty much all of them the DM and players need to work together to create characters who will be roughly on the same power level, and the "if it's in a book, it's allowed!" attitude some powergamers show is completely out of question.

[The Dark Fiddler]

My player has stated he's not interested in anything d20. I'm not positive, but I'm fairly certain it uses a variant d20 system. He hasn't said exactly why, but I think he feels classes and levels hurt game play. Plus it's easier to power game with the d20 system. And we do have a few power gamers.


M&M doesn't have a class and level system. All it does is Power Levels which decide the caps on various abilities. It uses d20 only in that all the checks are done by a d20+modifiers vs save DC roll, and that it has the d20 system of abilities and skills in 2e (but no longer in 3e).

It is, however, a game that's easy to break, but I can't think of a superhero game that'd let you build a wide range of characters that wouldn't have the same concern. In pretty much all of them the DM and players need to work together to create characters who will be roughly on the same power level, and the "if it's in a book, it's allowed!" attitude some powergamers show is completely out of question.

Like Tengu says, M&M is indeed a variant d20 system that lacks classes. The broken powers are, for the most part, ridiculously obvious combinations of things (stuff like modifying attacks to take less than a standard action, becoming immune to anything requiring a save, perfect immediate regeneration from death). Most of it's called right out in the rules, too. Same as any system, I suppose.

That said, if he's really so dead-set against M&M... well, you're missing a (at the very least) decent option, but there are alternatives.