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TimeLegend
2013-07-06, 01:06 PM
Hello all of you folks at gitp forums. After an insomnia induce homebrewing spree I'm going to ask you all what you think of my very second attempt at homebrewing. Mind this is based on the power-level and lore of Xefas's Exalted themed Tome of Battle disciplines.I'll see if I might give the discipline more fluff later, perhaps after I sleep. Still I'm always glad to hear the opinion of others (So longs as your not too mean.). So without further ado. The Tainted Soul Style.

Associated Skill: Knowledge (Religion)

Associated Weapons: Natural Attacks, Unarmed Strikes, Scythes, Long swords, Daggers, Kama, Katana

Other Notes:- All Maneuvers based in this style are extraordinary abilities despite some of their more unusual effects.

-Taint caused by this discipline do not count towards the maximum, one can acquire at a time (for more details see page 62 heroes of horror). The exception to this rule is the practitioner himself which follows the normal rules but instead of ability modifier the maximum he can acquire is his Ability score.
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Level 1
Taint Dealing Blow-Strike- Deliver taint to your opponents.
Let the Taint Flow-Boost- Allow your taint to flow through your weapon to sharpen it to a razor edge.
Taint Bleeding Soul-Stance- Taint flows from your being to all things around you.

Level 2
Violence Breeds Taint-Counter- Allow the violence to corrupt your attacker
Taint Leads to Death-Strike- Give a swifter death to the tainted

Level 3
Corruption Perfects the Body, Madness Perfects the Mind-Stance- Lower the amount of flaws given by taint while making your body and mind more durable.
The Vilest of Taint-Boost- Corrupt even the uncorruptable, Taint even those who bath in it.

Level 4
Lord of the Tainted-Strike- Command those that are tainted
Purity of Self, Taint to All Else-Strike- Lose all taint to corrupt all things around you.

Level 5
As Formless as Taint-Stance- Become as unstoppable as insanity and decay
Tainted Brand-Strike- Brand your opponents with the sign of evil

Level 6
Dark Power Fury- Turn your Tainted Fury into an even more horrible killer instinct
Tainted Invincibility-Counter- Protect you from the meek and gain retribution.

Level 7
Tainted Flurry Rampage-Boost- Become an unstoppable onslaught of attacks... for a price
Soul Breaking Strike-Strike-Strike stronger then a titan, by letting your body and mind slip into taint.

Level 8
Perfection in Taint-Stance- Become perfect with the glory that is taint!
Tainted Soul Defense-Counter- Become almost untouchable against spell even as your soul darkens

Level 9
To Look Upon the Ebon Mirror-Strike- Invite all to join you in the grasp of taint

Level 1Taint Dealing Blow
Tainted Soul(Strike)
Action: 1 standard action
Target:One Creature
Save:Will or Fort/ Negate


When using this maneuver, roll for a melee attack, if this attack hits after applying normal weapon damage, you choose whether the opponent must make a Fortitude save or a Will Save at (DC=10+1/2 Intiator level+Wis Modifier). If the opponent fails the Fort save they gain your Initiator level in Corruption. If they fail the Will save they gain your Initiator level in Depravity. Even if the opponent makes the save they still take the normal weapons damage.

If you have a Severe amount of Corruption then the base damage you deal is dealt as Vile damage.

If you have a Severe amount of Depravity then you may have the damage become non-lethal damage instead.

Let the Taint Flow
Tainted Soul(Boost)
Action:1 Swift Action
Range: Self
Target: Personal
Duration: 1-5 Rounds


You can only use this maneuver on any round in which you have gained a taint point (either Corruption or Depravity). If you do so you gain an additional +1 to attack and damage rolls for each four initiator levels you have (minimal of +1) lasting as many rounds as the taint you gained up to maximum of 5 rounds (either Corruption or Depravity). For the duration of the maneuver your attacks bypass Dr/magic as if they were magical. If using pathfinder rules the bonus is also added in the innate enchantment bonus of any weapon you use to attack for the purpose of calculating what DR it bypass.

If you have a Severe amount of Corruption then your attacks during this boost ignore damage reduction that has anyway to be countered.

Taint Bleeding Soul
Tainted Soul(Stance)
Action: 1 Swift Action
Area: 20ft plus 5ft per 2 Initiator levels
Target:You
Duration:Stance
Save:Fort or Will Negates

While in this Stance an area centered on you infects nearby creature's with taint in a constant flow. When going into this stance and at the start of your turn you may choose whether you bleed out Depravity (In which they must make a Will save to Negate) or Corruption (In which they must make a Fort save to Negate). You and all enemy creature that starts their turn in your Taint Bleeding Flow area must make a Will or Fort save (DC=10+1/2 Initiator level+Wis Modifier) or gain 1+1 per five Initiator levels Depravity or Corruption depending on the save used.

This Bleeding effect only happens during combat, out of Combat the flow of taint is much more controllable. You (and no one else) only have to make a save whenever you choose to gain single taint point (Whether Corruption or Depravity). In essence you may choose any amount of taint score to gain outside of combat.



Level 2Violence Breeds Taint
Tainted Soul(Counter)
Prerequisite: 1 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Action: 1 Immediate Action
Range: 100ft plus 10ft per Initiator Level
Target:One Opponent

Use this maneuver after you had been dealt damage by a opponent within range. That opponent must make either a Fortitude save (DC=10+1/2 your Initiator level+ you CON Mod) or a Will Save (DC=10+1/2 Initiator level+WIS Mod) or immediately gain your Initiator Level in Corruption or Depravity based on which save was used.

If you have a Severe amount of Depravity then if they fail the initial save they also become dazed for that round.

Taint Leads to Death
Tainted Soul(Strike)
Prerequisite: 1 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Action: 1 standard action
Range:Melee
Target One Opponent.
Duration: Instantaneous

When you Initiate this maneuver make a melee attack against one monster. If you hit with this attack you deal your Base Damage plus their Corruption Score or their Depravity score. If the opponent knows a Tainted Soul Maneuver he is allowed a Fort save to avoid the extra damage he gets for having taint. (DC=10+1/2 your Initiator level+your CON modifier)

If you have a Severe amount of Corruption and Depravity then you instead deal their Corruption Score and Depravity score in extra damage.

If you use this Maneuver against a Tainted Minion or Tainted Reaver your attack automatically is a critical strike.This automatic critical hit ignores the Tainted minions normal immunity to it.


Level 3Corruption Perfects the Body, Madness Perfects the Mind
Tainted Soul(Stance)
Prerequisite: 1 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Action: 1 Swift Action
Range:Personal
Target:You
Duration: Stance

When you enter this Stance you treat the amount of Taint you have for purposes of which taint flaws you have as one category less then the one you currently have (So if you have a Severe amount of Corruption then you only have the Moderate and Mild Taint based flaws.). Which becomes two categories less at level 10, and finally at level 20 you gain no taint flaws while in this stance no matter what Corruption or Depravity you have. You still Die or go insane if you gain too much Corruption or Depravity respectfully.

While in this Stance you gain a Corruption bonus to your FORT saves based on the amount of Corruption you have. You gain +1 to FORT saves if you have mild Corruption, +2 if Moderate, +3 if Severe.

While in this Stance you gain a Depravity bonus to your WILL saves based on the amount of Depravity you have. You gain +1 to WILL saves if you have mild Depravity, +2 if Moderate, +3 if Severe.


The Vilest of Taint
Tainted Soul(Boost)
Prerequisite: 1 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Action:1 Swift Action
Range:Personal
Target: Self
Duration: 1 rounds

When you activate this maneuver your eyes turn as black as a starless and moonless night. During the Duration of this boost Taint you apply against a opponent becomes Vile Taint. This bypass's the immunity gained by the Pure Soul feat. Also Taint of this power and concentration may even turn a demon or undead into a Tainted Minion or Tainted Reaver. The Maximum Corruption an Undead can have before becoming a Tainted Minion is equal to it's HP (For non-intelligent Undead this will be merely a cosmetic change). A creature with the Pure Soul feat only receives half Vile Taint from any given source.

Also in order to remove Vile Taint one must be in a location that is considered holy, before performing the necessary spells or abilities. The Exception to this is one with the Pure Soul feat their own spirit giving them the necessary holy energy to allow the magic to remove the taint.

If you have a Severe Corruption score then this maneuver lasts for five rounds instead.


Level 4Lord of the Tainted
Tainted Soul (Strike)
Prerequisite: 1 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Action: 1 Standard Action
Area:100ft plus 10ft per Iniator level
Target: All creatures in area
Duration: Varies

As the Champion of the Taint you can command those in thrall of it. When you activate this maneuver all creature within the area and has moderate Depravity must make a Will save (DC=10+1/2 your initiator level+ your WIS modifier). If they fail this save they all fellow a suggestion (as the suggestion spell) that you make.

If you have a Severe amount of depravity, then instead of a suggestion, they become dominated (as the Dominate Person spell) which duration is based on the amount of taint that they have

If they have moderate depravity the maneuver lasts for two rounds, If they have severe depravity the maneuver lasts for three rounds. If they are a Tainted Minion or Reaver this maneuver lasts for five rounds, also while a Tainted Minion or Reaver is Dominated in this way any attack you hit them with is automatically a critical hit. This automatic critical hit ignores the Tainted minions normal immunity to it.

Purity of Self, Taint to All Else
Tainted Soul (Strike)
Prerequisite: 1 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Action:Full-Round Action
Area: The total of both your Corruption and Depravity score rounded to the nearest five
Target:Self
Duration: Instantaneous

The will of Taint cares not who is tainted only that it can taint and slowly corrupt more.

When you Initiate this maneuver you expel all the taint (both Depravity and Corruption) in you body and give it to the entirety of the area under you. Note that this can get rid of taint that you've had for more then 24 hours. Also everything (Not including yourself) in the are of the maneuver must make a Will save with a DC of 10+ 1/2 IL + your WIS modifier or gain a point in Depravity and Make a Fort save with a DC of 10 + 1/2 IL + your CON modifier or gain a point in Corruption. Do note that even objects like rocks and swords must make this save. It is up to the DM of the effects that this will have in rocks, plants, weapons, armor, etc, but it should be noted that Taint has a way of spreading from a relative small amount and this be the start of a forest or city wide Corruption.


Level 5As Formless as Taint
Tainted Soul (Stance)
Prerequisite: 2 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Action: Swift action
Target:Self
Duration: Stance

This Stance allows you to perfect your combat form by twisting your body into the embodiment's of the two forms of taint. This Stance has no effect if you have neither Severe Corruption or Depravity. If you have Severe Corruption then when you enter this stance your body become a ink-like shadow of your former self. Your attacks are as undefendable as a plague that no training can stop. When you attack a opponent your body seems to bend and contort, even produce copies of your weapon to attack at different angles at once as if you were made of a strange liquid. While in this stance opponents you attack are consider flat-footed, and anything less then total concealment is ignored.

If you enter this stance while have Severe depravity your body seems to abrupt in a strange 'shimmering'. Your body becomes vaguely see-through as the voices of Taint around you whisper what you hear at all times in your own mind. Your attacks becomes as unstoppable as insanity, no armor can defend you as the whispers over take you. When you attack like this, your attacks seem to move straight through armor and even enchantments meant to block incorporeal attacks. While in this stance attacks you perform are touch attacks, and that which can seem to block this attack is ignored (such as a wall of force, or ghost armor,etc.). When you use this Stance with Severe Depravity you also take a -10 penalty on all attacks.


Tainted Brand
Tainted Soul(Strike)
Prerequisite: 2 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Action: standard Action
Target: One Creature
Duration: Instantaneous

When you activate this maneuver make a melee attack against a target opponent. If this attack hits you deal your base damage plus a single Vile Corruption (as if this Corruption came was gained after The Vilest of Taint was used.) Also so long as you have that vile Corruption you will always have a aura of evil about you. You will be seen as evil by the Detect Evil spell or other methods to detect alignment, spells and effects that effect evil creature effect you as well, and even those who do not have means of sensing alignment can't help but consider you such. New people that are not evil you meet will start off as unfriendly to you. This brand lasts as long as you have that point in Vile Corruption, but the first Vile Corruption you remove will get rid of it.

After they are given the Tainted Brand from this Maneuver they must make both a FORT save (DC=10+1/2 Initiator Level+ CON modifier) and a WILL save (DC=10+1/2 Initiator Level+ WIS modifier). If the opponent fails the Fort save then they are considered to have Severe Corruption for as long as they have the Tainted Brand. If the opponent fails the Will save then they are considered to have Severe Depravity for as long as they have the Tainted Brand.

If you use this maneuver against a Tainted Minion or Reaver, then they must make a Fort save (DC=10+1/2 Initiator Level+ CON modifier) or have their souls sent to the Lower Planes.

If you have a Severe amount of Corruption when you use this maneuver. Then there very soul have this brand and if they are to die with it still on them then no matter how righteous their mortal life was they will be sent to one of the lower planes as if they were of the evil alignment. Although as soon as one gets rid of this Vile Corruption point then the soul can ascend to it's proper place.


Level 6Dark Power Fury
Tainted Soul
Prerequisite: 2 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Action: See below
Target: Self
Duration: Permanent

This maneuver supplements the Feat Tainted Fury (pg. 124, Heroes of Horror), merely having this maneuver readied when you begin your Tainted Fury gives you the benefit of this maneuver. There are two possible benefits you may get if you have this feat.

If you have a Severe amount of Corruption then the temporary hit-points gained by Tainted Fury are lost first. After the Tainted fury ends your HP does not change.

If you have a Severe amount of Depravity then during your Tainted Fury you may declare a number of attacks (only once per round) to be Tainted smites equal to your Wisdom modifier.

Also if you choose to have a Tainted Fury become Augmented by this maneuver then you automatically fail the save from coming out of the Tainted Fury (Meaning you take 1d6 Constitution damage and are sicken for a minute.)

Tainted Invincibility
Tainted Soul (Counter)
Prerequisite: 2 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Action: immediate action
Range: 100ft plus 10ft per Iniator level
Target: Self
Duration: Instantaneous

For the briefest of moments before an attack connects a tendril of pure Corruption springs from your being and forms a shield with promise of a retribution against the weak. Activate this maneuver when you are successfully hit by an attack or spell that causes you damage (Although area of effects spells still deal damage to others around you even if you prevented all the damage to youself). You gain Damage Reduction equal to half of your Corruption against that attack.

If you have a Severe amount of Corruption and the maneuver prevented all damage from the attack, your opponent must make a Fortitude save (DC=10+ 1/2 your Initiator level+ your Constitution modifier) or take the damage the the maneuver prevented.


Level 7Tainted Flurry Rampage
Tainted Soul (Boost)
Prerequisite: 3 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Action: swift action
Range:Personal
Target:Self
Duration: Instantaneous

Upon Activating this maneuver choose to gain a number of Corruption and Depravity. For each 30 Taint points (Corruption or Depravity, divided as chosen) you make a melee attack at your Full Base Attack bonus.

If you have a Severe score of Corruption or Depravity at the start of this maneuver then you gain a melee attack for each 25 Taint points you gain.

If you have a Severe score in both Corruption and Depravity that number is further reduced to 20 points per attack

Soul Straining Strike
Tainted Soul (Strike)
Prerequisite: 3 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Action: standard action
Range: Melee
Target: One Creature
Duration: Instantaneous

Upon activating this Maneuver you choose to gain a number of Corruption and Depravity. You then make a Melee attack. If this attack hits you gain attack damage on this attack based on how many taint points spent (Corruption or Depravity, divided as chosen). For each three points of taint gained you gain one extra damage to this attack.

If you have a Severe score of Corruption or Depravity at the start of this maneuver then you gain a extra damage to this attack for every two points of taint points gained.

If you have a Severe score of Corruption and Depravity at the start of this maneuver then you gain a extra damage to this attack for every taint point you chose to gain.


Level 8Perfection in Taint
Tainted Soul (Stance)
Prerequisite: 3 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Actions: Swift Action
Range:Personal
Target: Self
Duration:Stance, Varies see in description

When you enter this stance your very essence is changed to closer resemble those of a evil outsider. You seem to somehow bleed out a darkness that dims your immediate vicinity and your eyes glow in a golden light making you almost seem like a Reaver. You may only enter this stance if you have at least one Corruption or Depravity. When you are in this stance you gain the following penalties and abilities

-You are considered to be effected by the Severe Tainted Brand Maneuver with the exception that it ends as soon as you exit this Stance

-You lose all of your Corruption and Depravity and gain an equal number of 'Taint' points which you can hold up to the combine total of the total of your maximum possible Corruption before you die and your maximum Depravity before you go insane. If you exceed this amount you're dragged into the infinite realm of taint by tendrils of Corruption where you will become one with it. You cannot be revived if this events happens as your very soul is devoured by the taint. For all this though, for the purposes of Spells and abilities that use your Corruption and Depravity, your Taint Score substitutes those. When you exit this stance you distribute your Taint score into Corruption and Depravity in any way you choose. Also if for whatever reason you lose all of your Taint points you immediately are forced out of this stance.The amount of Taint points you may gain in a single turn without rolling against both a sicken and stun is the sum of your Constitution and Wisdom score.

- You are considered to have Severe amount of Corruption and Depravity, no matter how much or little taint points you have. Meaning you have all the flaws of your Corruption and Depravity line even with a single taint point.

- If you enter this Stance with a total of 108 or greater sum of both corruption and depravity you may enter this stance with the taint points as Vile (As described in the maneuver The Vilest of Taint). When you enter this stance in such a way, instead of having a strange bleeding a darkness around you, you literally are merely a silhouette of yourself with glowing golden beads where your eyes should be. Using this version of Perfection in Taint has the added following effects.

-While you are in this stance any taint points you receive or give to others is consider Vile taint.

- This Stance is now a permanent aspect of your being and you are not considered to be using a stance while this is in effect (Meaning you can enter other stances in this form.). Further more the only possible way to exit this version of Perfection in Taint is to lose all of you vile taint points. You cannot lose your Vile taint points without your non-mind controlled consent. (Although you can very much gain more taint without it.)

- If you use Purity of Self, Taint to All Else (You must do it on Ground that is considered sacred and holy. Also you may not do this while in combat.) to exit this stance, You immeidately take 1d6 Ability damage to both your Constitution Score and your Wisdom score. This damage heals at a rate of 1 damage per day.

Tainted Soul Defense
Tainted Soul (Counter)
Prerequisite: 3 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Action: immediate Action
Range: Personal
Target: Self
Duration: Instantaneous ,Varies see in description

Activate this maneuver when you must make a saving throw. When you activate this maneuver you choose a amount of Corruption and Depravity to gain. You gain a Corruption bonus to your saving throws equal to the amount of taint points gained until the end of the duration.

If you have a Severe amount of depravity when you start this maneuver then you do not automatically fail a save on a roll of one and the duration lasts until the start of your next turn.

If you have a Severe amount of corruption then if a spell or ability would have a partial effect even if you succeeded the save, it is instead negated and if a non HP-damage effect from a spell or ability doesn't have a save you get a save anyway to negate that effect with the DC of 10+plus the opponents HD+ their lowest ability modifier.


Level 9To Look Upon the Ebon Mirror
Tainted Soul (Strike)
Prerequisite: 4 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Action: Full Round action
Target: 100ft plus 10ft per Iniator level
Duration: Instantaneous

You must have both Severe corruption and depravity in order to activate this maneuver. Although this oddly named maneuver which some masters have claimed involves the origin of this discipline, seems oddly simple for a style that has so much risk involve to oneself and to the unaware seems strangely friendly in it's execution. This is a lie, it is perhaps perhaps this discipline's darkest technique.

When one executes this maneuver all becomes peaceful and quiet no matter the previous circumstances, from a mayors speech to the harshest of battles. All stop to gaze at the martial adept in a instant, the martial adept opens his arms wide in a friendly gesture and asks all to join him in taint with a smile on his face (They can always tell he or she is smiling even if the adepts form shouldn't really allow one to be able to tell.) as the adepts skin and clothes turn into a oddly dark reflexive surface.

At this point all involved must make a Reflex save (DC=10+1/2 Initiator Level+ CON modifier) to divert their eyes away as their own souls scream to look away. If they make this save there is no effect on them, if they fail they must then make both a Will save (DC=10+1/2 Iniator level+ WIS modifier) and a Fort Save (DC=10+1/2 Initiator level+ CON modifier). If they fail the Will save their depravity score now equals yours including it being vile if yours is. If they fail their fort save their Corruption score now equals yours including it being vile if yours is.

If this causes them to be both Dead and Insane due to having too much corruption and depravity then they are dragged into the realm of taint as if they had too high of a taint score from Perfection in Taint.

DracoDei
2013-07-06, 11:56 PM
Where would one find D&D rules for Depravity and Corruption?

Arcanist
2013-07-07, 12:04 AM
Where would one find D&D rules for Depravity and Corruption?

Heroes of Horror, a personal favorite. I like this school, very dark and reminds me of Misogi Kumagawa :smalltongue:

TimeLegend
2013-07-07, 12:06 AM
Where would one find D&D rules for Depravity and Corruption?

Heroes of Horror. pg. 62-68.

TimeLegend
2013-07-08, 02:12 PM
Sorry if this is poor form, but I'm bumping this thread.

The reason is I wish to have this Discipline reviewed as such is for a game where we all make new Martial Disciplines while facing a variety of Xefas's made stuff like Martial Adepts and Primordialist using his Disciplines, as well as Solar Hero's and Teramach's, and if I'm in the mood some Tome of Radiance characters. :smallamused: So I do wish to know if I'm actually on the mark I was aiming for or not.

ArchangelAzrael
2013-07-09, 02:54 AM
Hello there. Had to actually borrow the book to give feedback since I haven't ever used taint rules so my experience and comments might not be that useful. I am still in the process of reading and analyzing this but a maneuver did stand out.
As Formless as Taint
Tainted Soul (Stance)
Prerequisite: 2 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Action: Swift action
Target:Self
Duration: Stance

This Stance allows you to perfect your combat form by twisting your body into the embodiment's of the two forms of taint. This Stance has no effect if you have neither Severe Corruption or Depravity. If you have Severe Corruption then when you enter this stance your body become a ink-like shadow of your former self. Your attacks are as undefendable as a plague that no training can stop. When you attack a opponent your body seems to bend and contort, even produce copies of your weapon to attack at different angles at once as if you were made of a strange liquid. While in this stance opponents you attack are consider flat-footed, and anything less then total concealment is ignored.

If you enter this stance while have Severe depravity your body seems to abrupt in a strange 'shimmering'. Your body becomes vaguely see-through as the voices of Taint around you whisper what you hear at all times in your own mind. Your attacks becomes as unstoppable as insanity, no armor can defend you as the whispers over take you. When you attack like this, your attacks seem to move straight through armor and even enchantments meant to block incorporeal attacks. While in this stance attacks you perform are touch attacks, and that which can seem to block this attack is ignored (such as a wall of force, or ghost armor,etc.). the second ability pretty much means auto hit which can translate to full power attack for massive damage. its not necessary bad ,at level 9 wizards get there 5th level spells, and this has the drawback of severe taint but I dint know if its intended.

Also I assume a character using this discipline would want to stay on the severe taint range for both depravity and corruption. On a game that does not involve the DM giving you taint am I correct that the level 1 stance is the only way to get taint yourself (by willingly lossing the saving throw) or did I miss something?

Enemies you kill with depravity/corruption acquire a template and if they were PC they turn NPC. Against minions or bosses i am not sure this is useful unless I missed something (again I only read the HoH once and that was fast so that's very plausible).

Will try to do a maneuver by maneuver review in a jiffy after I reread the HoH.

TimeLegend
2013-07-09, 04:00 AM
Hello there. Had to actually borrow the book to give feedback since I haven't ever used taint rules so my experience and comments might not be that useful. I am still in the process of reading and analyzing this but a maneuver did stand out.

I'm glad that you have decided to help me on this Discipline and thank you. Although now I'm starting to get the feeling that the lack of responses has more to do with ignorance on taint then anything else.:smallfrown:

Also if you want to take a look at one of the most hideously broken caster prestige class in existence look to the Taint Scholar :smallamused:


the second ability pretty much means auto hit which can translate to full power attack for massive damage. its not necessary bad ,at level 9 wizards get there 5th level spells, and this has the drawback of severe taint but I dint know if its intended.

For the most part yes. My intentions were that if you had both Severe Corruption and Depravity your attacks were made to be virtually impossible to miss and I've even thought about having the Severe Corruption form of Formless as Taint ignore total cover and even other means of causing miss chance but got a little worried for some reason.

Also I'm pretty sure that the wording is a tad off on the second part of the maneuver for Severe depravity. My Intentions with that was for you to be Incorporeal, but not like a spirit but like a illusion (madness). Just think along the lines of 'any object (Armor,Walls of..., Shield spells) you put in the way of this is ignored.'


Also I assume a character using this discipline would want to stay on the severe taint range for both depravity and corruption. On a game that does not involve the DM giving you taint am I correct that the level 1 stance is the only way to get taint yourself (by willingly lossing the saving throw) or did I miss something?

While that is the case if the DM doesn't really use the Taint rules at all. I would really recommend that they use it for at the least this character. As the management of the risks of Taint is part of the Disciplines theme and if the risk factor is largely taken away then there could be problems. (Perhaps I should give a short and fast rules of Taint that a practice of this Discipline has. Just a simple 'If you do a evil act you must roll a fort or will save or gain Corruption or Depravity by a amount at DM's discretion.)


Enemies you kill with depravity/corruption acquire a template and if they were PC they turn NPC. Against minions or bosses i am not sure this is useful unless I missed something (again I only read the HoH once and that was fast so that's very plausible).

I have thought of that as well when I got to about level four in the Disciplines and made Lord of the Tainted... Hmmm actually if I made the strikes all but auto-wins if used against Reavers and Tainted Minions. Like if Taint Leads to Deaths became a Uber Save or Die spell which DC is based on your Corruption and Depravity?

That could help that issue.


Will try to do a maneuver by maneuver review in a jiffy after I reread the HoH.
I thank you for this and all future help you give in making this class great and fair.:smallsmile:

Sadly, I suck at fluff writing so I can't be quite as awesome as Xexas. :smallfrown::smallbiggrin:

ArchangelAzrael
2013-07-09, 04:06 AM
ok first level comments are up
level1
Taint Dealing Blow
Tainted Soul(Strike)
Action: 1 standard action
Target:One Creature
Save:Will or Fort/ Negate


When using this maneuver, roll for a melee attack, if this attack hits after applying normal weapon damage, you choose whether the opponent must make a Fortitude save or a Will Save at (DC=10+1/2 Intiator level+Wis Modifier). If the opponent fails the Fort save they gain your Initiator level in Corruption. If they fail the Will save they gain your Initiator level in Depravity. Even if the opponent makes the save they still take the normal weapons damage.

If you have a Severe amount of Corruption then the base damage you deal is dealt as Vile damage.

If you have a Severe amount of Depravity then you may have the damage become non-lethal damage instead.
This strike seems ok. The effect scales well to be useful in later levels even if itís only one attack with no other bonus ( so after level 6 the damage you do will suffer). The save scales which is not usual for maneuvers but thatís ok with me. Assuming you are keeping wisdom high since its affect your taint threshold this should be a 40-60 saving throw against the weak save (assuming both char have equal ability mod the dc will be at lvl 20 DC 20 (without the wisdom while the save will be +12 (6 for being the weak +6 from magic again without the corresponding ability mod). The damage at level 20 is enough to push you to Mild in one go even if you have 36 in the corresponding score but you will need to use it 4 times give or take to ďkillĒ someone. Can you hit yourself with this? If yes it has the added benefit of helping you built taint. Can two disciples punch each other (1d3 subdual) to fuel the taint?. Lastly is it ex or su?

Let the Taint Flow
Tainted Soul(Boost)
Action:1 Swift Action
Range: Self
Target: Personal
Duration: 1-5 Rounds


You must gain one through five taint points (You choose between Corruption or Depravity) in order to use this maneuver. For as many rounds as taint you gained, your melee attacks get a additional +1 to attack and damage rolls for each four initiator levels you have (minimal of +1). Also for purposes of bypassing DR it combines with your weapon enchantment as well and even makes normal and masterwork weapons be consider magic weapons for the duration.

If you have a Severe amount of Corruption then your attacks during this boost ignore damage reduction that has anyway to be countered.
I think this one needs better wording. What do you mean it combines for purposes of bypassing DR? I think pathfinder has a rule about innate weapon enchantment bypassing material based DR but I donít think 3.5 has one. Perhaps a better wording would be: ď You can only use this maneuver on any round in which you have gained a taint point (either Corruption or Depravity). If you do so you gain an additional +1 to attack and damage rolls for each four initiator levels you have (minimal of +1) lasting as many rounds as the taint you gained up to maximum of 5 rounds (either Corruption or Depravity). For the duration of the maneuver your attacks bypass Dr/magic as if they were magical. If using pathfinder rules the bonus is also added in the innate enchantment bonus of any weapon you use to attack for the purpose of calculating what DR it bypass.Ē or something of the like. I assume the maneuver is usuable even if you gain more than 5 taint points. Is this ex or su?

Taint Bleeding Soul
Tainted Soul(Stance)
Action: 1 Swift Action
Area: 20ft plus 5ft per 2 Initiator levels
Target:You
Duration:Stance
Save:Fort or Will Negates

While in this Stance an area centered on you infects nearby creature's with taint in a constant flow. When going into this stance and at the start of your turn you may choose whether you bleed out Depravity (In which they must make a Will save to Negate) or Corruption (In which they must make a Fort save to Negate). You and any creature that starts their turn in your Taint Bleeding Flow area must make a Will or Fort save (DC=10+1/2 Initiator level+Wis Modifier) or gain 1+1 per five Initiator levels Depravity or Corruption depending on the save used.
This is an oddballÖ the save scales and it effects an area plus it forces a save every turn meaning that at some point someone will lose their save (and at level one that means pretty much all the enemies) but the damage is too small to make any noticeably effect ( even at an abysmal ability score of 4 this would take 14 rounds at level one to kill anyone). Furthermore you canít use it in battle as it effects your allies as well nor can you continue to use it outside combat as you would ďdieĒ. The only way I see for this stance to be used is to say to your DM ďI am stepping outside in an area that Only includes me activating this stance (and willingly failing the save) till I just reach severe taint, then I deactivate it and never bother with it againĒ not sure if that was the intent but thatís how I would use it at later levels when my maneuvers do extra stuff based on taint lvls. I could see a use at lvl 1 and 2 to activate the boost but the drawbacks surpass the benefits.

Edit 1: Level2

Violence Breeds Taint
Tainted Soul(Counter)
Action: 1 Immediate Action
Range: 100ft plus 10ft per Initiator Level
Target:One Opponent

Use this maneuver after you had been dealt damage by a opponent within range. That opponent must make either a Fortitude save (DC=10+1/2 your Initiator level+ you CON Mod) or a Will Save (DC=10+1/2 Initiator level+WIS Mod) or immediately gain your Initiator Level in Corruption or Depravity based on which save was used.

If you have a Severe amount of Depravity then if they fail the initial save they also become dazed for that round.
Being dealt damage means you canít use this maneuver to stop an attack with the daze effect which is good as this is only a level 2 maneuver that comes with a taint attack. The save scales but since this maneuver is a counter the opportunity cost is only other counters making it useful much longer a point to consider. A combination of the level 1 strike and this in at level 3 and afterwordís can easily push someone to moderate taint if he fails both saves. At level 20 if the targeted mod that affects the save is less than 24 than mean that in one round there is the possibility to push someone on the severe taint range in one round is this intented? Also if I am hit by a spell that does not deal damage but an effect this maneuver is not useable right? Again ex or su? At this point I think you should also start using requirements like 1 maneuver known from this school to avoid cherry picking maneuvers

Taint Leads to Death
Tainted Soul(Strike)
Action: 1 standard action
Range:Melee
Target One Opponent.
Duration: Instantaneous

When you Initiate this maneuver make a melee attack against one monster. If you hit with this attack you deal your Base Damage plus their Corruption Score or their Depravity score. If the opponent knows a Tainted Soul Maneuver he is allowed a Fort save to avoid the extra damage he gets for having taint. (DC=10+1/2 your Initiator level+your CON modifier)

If you have a Severe amount of Corruption and Depravity then you instead deal their Corruption Score and Depravity score in extra damage.
I think this might scale too well on later levels but it depends of how easy it is to build taint on others and if opponents have a starting taint score. At the level you get this its fine even on the weak side as at best on round 2 you will do extra 6 damage but it gets better the longer the battle goes. Perhaps you can add a line that says against creature with the template from taint if the attack hits its automatically a critical hit? Scythe is a discipline weapon after all.

TimeLegend
2013-07-09, 05:05 AM
level1
This strike seems ok. The effect scales well to be useful in later levels even if itís only one attack with no other bonus ( so after level 6 the damage you do will suffer). The save scales which is not usual for maneuvers but thatís ok with me. Assuming you are keeping wisdom high since its affect your taint threshold this should be a 40-60 saving throw against the weak save (assuming both char have equal ability mod the dc will be at lvl 20 DC 20 (without the wisdom while the save will be +12 (6 for being the weak +6 from magic again without the corresponding ability mod). The damage at level 20 is enough to push you to Mild in one go even if you have 36 in the corresponding score but you will need to use it 4 times give or take to ďkillĒ someone. Can you hit yourself with this? If yes it has the added benefit of helping you built taint. Can two disciples punch each other (1d3 subdual) to fuel the taint?. Lastly is it ex or su?

Just to note like Xexas's Disciplines all maneuvers are EX despite there very unnatural abilities.

I'd say that two Disciples could very well punch each other for the taint they may want, but one can't punch themselves for the taint.


I think this one needs better wording. What do you mean it combines for purposes of bypassing DR? I think pathfinder has a rule about innate weapon enchantment bypassing material based DR but I donít think 3.5 has one. Perhaps a better wording would be: ď You can only use this maneuver on any round in which you have gained a taint point (either Corruption or Depravity). If you do so you gain an additional +1 to attack and damage rolls for each four initiator levels you have (minimal of +1) lasting as many rounds as the taint you gained up to maximum of 5 rounds (either Corruption or Depravity). For the duration of the maneuver your attacks bypass Dr/magic as if they were magical. If using pathfinder rules the bonus is also added in the innate enchantment bonus of any weapon you use to attack for the purpose of calculating what DR it bypass.Ē or something of the like. I assume the maneuver is usuable even if you gain more than 5 taint points. Is this ex or su?

See above for the EX or SU question.

I made this maneuver when I noticed some creature (outsiders in the Book of Vile Darkness and Book of Exalted Deeds) had a DR score that looked like DR/+6 and similar things along those lines so made this maneuver with that in mind. Yes the maneuver is usable even if you gain more than 5 taint points on the turn. Although I believe that I'll take your advice on your wording regardless.


This is an oddballÖ the save scales and it effects an area plus it forces a save every turn meaning that at some point someone will lose their save (and at level one that means pretty much all the enemies) but the damage is too small to make any noticeably effect ( even at an abysmal ability score of 4 this would take 14 rounds at level one to kill anyone). Furthermore you canít use it in battle as it effects your allies as well nor can you continue to use it outside combat as you would ďdieĒ. The only way I see for this stance to be used is to say to your DM ďI am stepping outside in an area that Only includes me activating this stance (and willingly failing the save) till I just reach severe taint, then I deactivate it and never bother with it againĒ not sure if that was the intent but thatís how I would use it at later levels when my maneuvers do extra stuff based on taint lvls. I could see a use at lvl 1 and 2 to activate the boost but the drawbacks surpass the benefits.

Actually the intention of this was a quick and easy random mild debuff to everyone in the area (Remember it only takes one corruption or depravity to get the mild flaw of either), and yes as a means of controlling your taint amount. Also while I suck at writing fluff I do still have it in mind. The picture of a 'person' slowly corrupting all around him does well to make one creepy. :smallsmile:

Still,Would you recommend an ideal to perhaps beef up it's power. I'm trying to make each Stance at least be used at one time or another.

Edit 1:


Level2

Being dealt damage means you canít use this maneuver to stop an attack with the daze effect which is good as this is only a level 2 maneuver that comes with a taint attack. The save scales but since this maneuver is a counter the opportunity cost is only other counters making it useful much longer a point to consider. A combination of the level 1 strike and this in at level 3 and afterwordís can easily push someone to moderate taint if he fails both saves. At level 20 if the targeted mod that affects the save is less than 24 than mean that in one round there is the possibility to push someone on the severe taint range in one round is this intended? Also if I am hit by a spell that does not deal damage but an effect this maneuver is not useable right? Again ex or su? At this point I think you should also start using requirements like 1 maneuver known from this school to avoid cherry picking maneuvers

1)While that was normally intended, if I may ask do you believe that it's too potent a combo? Should I perhaps push it to become 1/2 your Iniator level with perhaps a stipulation that if you have Severe Corruption it's full?

2) No it only works for damaging effects. You are correct.

3) As for Requirements sure I think that'll work.


I think this might scale too well on later levels but it depends of how easy it is to build taint on others and if opponents have a starting taint score. At the level you get this its fine even on the weak side as at best on round 2 you will do extra 6 damage but it gets better the longer the battle goes. Perhaps you can add a line that says against creature with the template from taint if the attack hits its automatically a critical hit? Scythe is a discipline weapon after all.

I think I really like that suggestion. :smallbiggrin:

ArchangelAzrael
2013-07-09, 05:29 AM
1) I will have to continue this when i get home after work ( till now it was a slow day)

2) Well Xefas Disciplines are heavily inspired by exalted if memory serves me correctly and as charms were not sorcery I can only guess that that is the reason behind not being SU. If you intent to have them all being Ex a comment in the opening text for the discipline would help clear any doubt.

3) The problem with the stance is that it affects everyone and thus you cant stay in the stance (which is probably the only one you know). It creates party conflict. If you can exclude people(but not yourself) it gets much better. You could also have it only work in combat to save a swift action for activation. I had not thought for the debuff so the damage is ok. Also consider that even fluff if taken to heart can affect the game. If for example the fluff says that if the character stays in a place long enough its slowly corrupts it the dm could either ignore it or decide to use it or even if he thinks he must use it, not allow it because it can effect the campaign in a way he doesn't want, like locate city bomb for example.

4) Boy... that level 3 stance is a monster! might take as much time to figure it out as the rest of the discipline combined... first impression is that its too complicated and too strong. Will have to judge each benefit and con separately.... Damn I really have to work now... perhaps it will slow down again later.

TimeLegend
2013-07-09, 06:14 AM
1) I will have to continue this when i get home after work ( till now it was a slow day)

No Problem and thanks regardless. :smallsmile:


2) Well Xexas Disciplines are heavily inspired by exalted if memory serves me correctly and as charms were not sorcery I can only guess that that is the reason behind not being SU. If you intent to have them all being Ex a comment in the opening text for the discipline would help clear any doubt.

I think I'll do that actually.


3) The problem with the stance is that it affects everyone and thus you cant stay in the stance (which is probably the only one you know). It creates party conflict. If you can exclude people(but not yourself) it gets much better. You could also have it only work in combat to save a swift action for activation. I had not thought for the debuff so the damage is ok. Also consider that even fluff if taken to heart can affect the game. If for example the fluff says that if the character stays in a place long enough its slowly corrupts it the dm could either ignore it or decide to use it or even if he thinks he must use it, and not allow it because it can effect the campaign in a way he doesn't want, like locate city bomb for example.

Perhaps this could be solved by simply stating that it effects you and all enemies in the area could work to solve most of the problems it seems. Hmmm these aren't bad idea at all I must say. Thank you. :smallsmile:


4) Boy... that level 3 stance is a monster! might take as much time to figure it out as the rest of the discipline combined... first impression is that its too complicated and too strong. Will have to judge each benefit and con separately.... Damn I really have to work now... perhaps it will slow down again later.

... yeah... I figured this would have been one of the more problematic maneuvers of this Disciplines. I'll say this much about it's creation. I made the Stance in order for the user of this style to not be completely screwed over by some of the more... painful and problematic flaws of taint.

DracoDei
2013-07-09, 12:26 PM
I'm glad that you have decided to help me on this Discipline and thank you. Although now I'm starting to get the feeling that the lack of responses has more to do with ignorance on taint then anything else.:smallfrown:
I would agree with that assessment.

I made this maneuver when I noticed some creature (outsiders in the Book of Vile Darkness and Book of Exalted Deeds) had a DR score that looked like DR/+6 and similar things along those lines so made this maneuver with that in mind. Yes the maneuver is usable even if you gain more than 5 taint points on the turn. Although I believe that I'll take your advice on your wording regardless.
That sort of thing was mostly 3.0.
Although DR/+6 would be the same thing as DR/Epic.
DR/+2 would be strictly 3.0 and earlier AFAIK.

TimeLegend
2013-07-09, 12:34 PM
I would agree with that assessment.
:frown:

That sort of thing was mostly 3.0.
Although DR/+6 would be the same thing as DR/Epic.
DR/+2 would be strictly 3.0 and earlier AFAIK.
Thanks for the heads up. I just decided to use ArchangelAzrael rewrite for the effect. :smallsmile:

ArchangelAzrael
2013-07-09, 12:41 PM
Ok back from work and gym... let go to level 3!
Corruption Perfects the Body, Madness Perfects the Mind
Tainted Soul (Stance)
Prerequisite: 1 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Action: 1 Swift Action
Range:Personal
Target:You
Duration: Stance

When you enter this Stance you gain certain benefits based on which of the Corruption and Depravity lines you have. These are Based on the numbered list in page. 63 (Table 4-2) and 65(Table 4-3) in the Heroes of Horror (See below for the chart.) Although you must have Severe Corruption in order to gain the benefits of your Corruption line and vice versa for the Depravity line. Note you keep the taint based flaws.


Corruption:

1: You gain the ability to see the Undead in a intimate fashion, You never need to roll against a miss chance based on facing incorporeal undead, also you may back-stab and critical strike the Undead in this stance.

2: The Taint within your body seems to although weaken you also seems to give you extra ordinary healing ability. While in this stance you gain Fast Healing equal to a tenth of your Corruption Score.

3: You become a hulking mass of muscle and dripping taint. While in this stance you gain a +8 Corruption bonus to Strength.

4: You gain a limited control of your own bone structure. Although painful to do, this allows you to spring into a surprising speed even if your 'base' self is rather hindered. If you wish, as a immediate action you may lose 20 points of HP to Negate your Corruption flaws for the round and gain a +10 movement speed Corruption bonus, +3 Reflex save Corruption Bonus, and gain a extra attack after a full-attack action until the beginning of your next turn.

5: When you enter this stance the worms on your body become subtlety larger and more vicious. While in this stance Anytime you touch a opponent for any reason you have a chance to 'share' you disease with that person, also you worms on your body are tainted-abomination themselves and are horrifying to witness. Anytime you touch a person while in this stance you have a chance to give them a 'disease' known as 'Taint Worms' which is DC is 10+1/2 your Initiator level+your Constitution Modifier. Its effect is negative 2 Strength with a incubation time of one round. This disease isn't so much as a normal disease but rather the worms on your body jumping onto that which you touch before eating into its skin. As such this by passes Immunity to Disease unless that creature has immunity to Taint (such as with the Pure Soul Feat)

Also you gain a Corruption bonus on you Intimidation check equal to your Initiator level.

6: Your Odor is enough that it can sicken even the hardiest of people. Any creature within 60ft at the start of their turn from you must make a Fortitude save (DC= 10+1/2 Initiator level+ CON Modifier) or become sicken for 5 rounds or when they are more than 60ft from you if they are already Sicken then they become Nauseated for one round or when they are more than 60ft from you.

7: With the Taint guiding your body your unending twitching and spasm always seem to lead you into the correct form of attack. Once per round, anytime you make a melee attack if you miss you may make a single re-roll on the attack, you must take the second result even if it is worse than the first.

8: You have mastered the ability of suppressing the Taint within one's body and Blood, making your blood one of the most lethal of poisons. While in this Stance you you may as a free action enhance a strike or ability that grants taint points to someone. By spending HP you may increase the DC to resist gaining Taint points by one per 2 hp spent.

9: Your skin becomes a armor harder than adamantine. You gain DR/- equal to a tenth of you Corruption score rounded up.

10: Although your body is always winded, the Corruption within you give a dull sense of constant adrenaline during a fight.

When you enter this stance you gain a odd ability when staggered. Instead of being only able to perform a movement action or a standard action, you may either perform a single move action or two standard actions allowing you to perform two strike strike maneuvers in one turn. Also if a martial maneuver needs to use Full-Action to perform you may use your two standard actions to perform that maneuver.



Depravity:

1: The Taint speaks to you that all things are the reason for your rage and hatred and deserve destruction. Your taint induced Rage and evil becomes all consuming. When you enter this stance you go into a Rage as long as you are in this Stance. The Rage functions as identical to the Infernal Monster Discipline's version of Rage , except you may still recover Tainted Soul Maneuver's.

See: http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=176059

2: The Taint in your mind laughs at the ideal of civilization and an ordered life. The minds of humanoids are simply too scattered to perform such. The taint in all things shall reach out to them and prove to them, that all will join you in their own ravings. By simply knowing this stance, you may enter and remain in Tainted Soul Stances while in a state of confused, and can use Tainted Soul Maneuvers while confused (Even if a forced actions would norally cause you to not be able to for whatever reason.). While in this stance if you are forced to do a action due to confusion all opponents within 100ft plus 10ft per Initiator level of you must make a Will save (DC=10+1/2 your Initiator level+your WIS modifier.) or be forced to mimic the action on their next turn

3: Your Taint whispers to you that the world and life in general is a cosmic joke, even as you perform to it's cycle. Your laughter at this fact is unnerving to others, but they begin to laugh as they finally get the joke. When you are in this stance as a swift action you may let out one of your tainted laughs which forces a opponent of your to make a Will save (DC=10+1/2 of your Initiator Level+ your WIS modifier) or become staggered for one round.

4: The Taint whispers to you telling you of threats around you even when it is not there and perhaps even when it is. When you are in this stance you gain the Improved Uncanny Dodge abilities so long as your in this stance, also you gain a +6 Corruption bonus to AC if you would still be flat-footed for any reason.

5: The Taint within whispers that all wish to kill and destroy you. Even when some say they wish to ally with you for whatever reason you know better and keep your senses about you, until you mind finally shows you the 'truth' about your allies. Any time you get a negative -1 on your rolls due to Paranoid (pg. 66, Heroes of Horror), you also gain a +1 Corruption bonus to your AC that is also cumulative. Finally if the penalty on to your rolls equals your level, You go into a Taint driven madness. You must attack everything you can see be it former allies or enemies. Also you lose the Corruption bonus to AC, but gain a Corruption bonus to all rolls equal to your level until the end of the encounter.

6: All things fear in this world the Taint merely show you and others what they should fear, until that fear let's them escape their minds. When you use this stance you become a herald and teacher of the same fear you hold of others things. With a Standard action one creature within 60ft of you must make a Will save or become panicked. (DC=16+your CR, which is often simply your level+ any level adjustment you might have.)

7: To the taint in all hearts the only thing that matters and worth fighting for is the evil and taint in others. For that is the main method of it's spread. While in this stance evil creature are similarly enthralled with you and start off as friendly towards you. Also so long as you use a attack that will give an evil opponent taint points, you may keep the normal damage non-lethal then you give them taint points and do not receive penalty to attack them.

8: The Taint in your body, mind, and soul proves your superiority to all things. The Taint in you will try to be sure to prove it to you and all others by swirling around you and protecting you giving you an incredible shield that can stop many assaults flat out. When you enter this stance, for as long as you remain in it you gain temporary hit points equal to your Depravity score. This can only come into play once per encounter, losing your stance and reentering it will not give you your temporary hit points back.

9: The taint in ones mind proves all is an illusion, nothing is real ,not even yourself, and if one merely listens to the voices above this dream then one can escape this lie. While in this stance anytime you are attacked, or targeted by a spell or ability (including beneficial spells or abilities), included in a spells or abilities area of effect (including beneficial spells or abilities) roll a percentile die if you roll 10+ 1 per ten depravity or below,you perfectly ignore the effect as the attack/spell/etc. passes through you like an unreal phantasm of the effect.

10:The Taint has spoke to your worthless self that in the end, all things are worthless. Every hero and villain and neutral force will be consumed by the infinite and ever expanding taint. The Taint in you mind will go into the mind of all foes and sap their will to resist with the clamor and screams of the demons and fallen alike. Shaping them to carry more and more taint. When you are in this stance all opponents within 100ft of you take a -6 penalty to there Will save. Also any taint that you give to someone you give double of.


Ok this is both complicated and strong, remember for each on severe taint you get 2 bonus feat (or 4 if you are severe on both depravity and corruption) so this stance overcompensates for the drawbacks. Having said that I agree that some options from the table are more dire than others and one or two can make a character unplayable. So here is my suggestion. Now i know you obviously put a lot of work into this one so donít be mad. Scrap the stance. Instead have the stance treat the penalties you get from taint as if they were on category smaller (the visual effects remain) at initiator level 10 as if they were two categories smaller and perhaps at initiator level 20 as if you didnít have any taint. If you donít like the idea I could give it another go. Also consider that a maneuver exists to drop taint and penalties virtually allowing you to choose which path you want.


The Vilest of Taint
Tainted Soul(Boost)
Prerequisite: 1 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Action:1 Swift Action
Range:Personal
Target: Self
Duration: 1 rounds

When you activate this maneuver your eyes turn as black as a starless and moonless night. During the Duration of this boost Taint you apply against a opponent becomes Vile Taint. This bypass's the immunity gained by the Pure Soul feat. Also Taint of this power and concentration may even turn a demon or undead into a Tainted Minion or Tainted Reaver. The Maximum Corruption an Undead can have before becoming a Tainted Minion is equal to its HP (For non-intelligent Undead this will be merely a cosmetic change).

Also in order to remove Vile Taint one must be in a location that is considered holy, before performing the necessary spells or abilities. The Exception to this is one with the Pure Soul feat their own spirit giving them the necessary holy energy to allow the magic to remove the taint.

If you have a Severe Corruption score then this maneuver lasts for five rounds instead.

This is quite good I donít like hard counters and immunities and feats that negate a discipline should not exist. on the other hand if a character has invest in a defense it should offer some protection. My suggestion is that for characters that have spent a feat to only get half the taint. It wonít come up very often and even if it does it wonít cripple you.
Edit:Level 4

Lord of the Tainted
Tainted Soul (Strike)
Prerequisite: 1 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Action: 1 Standard Action
Area: 100ft plus 10ft per iniator level burst
Target: Self
Duration: Varies

As the Champion of the Taint you can command those in thrall of it. When you activate this maneuver all creature with a single point in Depravity must make a Will save (DC=10+1/2 your initiator level+ your WIS modifier). If they fail this save they all fellow a suggestion (as the suggestion spell) that you make.

If you have a Severe amount of depravity, then instead of a suggestion, they become dominated (as the Dominate Person spell) which duration is based on the amount of taint that they have

If they have minor depravity the maneuver only lasts for one round, If they have moderate depravity the maneuver lasts for two rounds, If they have severe depravity the maneuver lasts for three rounds. If they are a Tainted Minion or Reaver this maneuver is permanent.
This maneuver is too strong for two reasons. Firstly it doesnít have the tag [mind] which means certain power protections against mind control donít work. Also this screams for SU as well. Secondly it affects all creatures within range if they have a point of depravity. There is a save I know but still this could turn off an encounter. I believe this maneuver was the one you designed as a counter against nps that had the taint templates. To have it be more balanced I would either lower the dc or make it useful against 1 enemy or raise the number of Depravity points the opponent must have for this to work.

Purity of Self, Taint to All Else
Tainted Soul (Strike)
Prerequisite: 1 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Action:Full-Round Action
Area: The total of both your Corruption and Depravity score rounded to the nearest five
Target:Self
Duration: Instantaneous

The will of Taint cares not who is tainted only that it can taint and slowly corrupt more.

When you Initiate this maneuver you expel all the taint (both Depravity and Corruption) in you body and give it to the entirety of the area under you. Note that this can get rid of taint that you've had for more then 24 hours. Also everything (Not including yourself) in the are of the maneuver must make a Will save with a DC of 10+ 1/2 IL + your WIS modifier or gain a point in Depravity and Make a Fort save with a DC of 10 + 1/2 IL + your CON modifier or gain a point in Corruption. Do note that even objects like rocks and swords must make this save. It is up to the DM of the effects that this will have in rocks, plants, weapons, armor, etc, but it should be noted that Taint has a way of spreading from a relative small amount and this be the start of a forest or city wide Corruption.

At level 15 if you have both Severe Corruption and Depravity this maneuvers Area become a mile centered onto yourself
We finally have a mechanic to get rid of taint (perhaps a tad late) this is good as it allows us to be in the severe range and have a way to avoid becoming an NPC. The second part I really donít like especially the part where it affect a mile. Itís like locate city bomb. Go to a cellar in the city. Activate first level stance. Use this strike. Repeat as many times as needed. If I were a DM I would not allow this discipline for this maneuver alone. I understand that its very thematic and cool but it can destroy campaigns. I would limit the area to close keep the part that it effects items as well but state that the change ( on items) is only visual and that as time passes nothing else happens.

edit 2 taking a break raid time in wow

TimeLegend
2013-07-09, 01:15 PM
level 3!

Ok this is both complicated and strong, remember for each on severe taint you get 2 bonus feat (or 4 if you are severe on both depravity and corruption) so this stance overcompensates for the drawbacks. Having said that I agree that some options from the table are more dire than others and one or two can make a character unplayable. So here is my suggestion. Now i know you obviously put a lot of work into this one so donít be mad.

*Breaths deeply*


Scrap the stance.

*Exhales* :frown:. Not that I blame you, and for the sake of getting a Discipline right, a bad idea should be scraped no matter how much work went into it, still sad thou.


Instead have the stance treat the penalties you get from taint as if they were on category smaller (the visual effects remain) at initiator level 10 as if they were two categories smaller and perhaps at initiator level 20 as if you didnít have any taint. If you donít like the idea I could give it another go. Also consider that a maneuver exists to drop taint and penalties virtually allowing you to choose which path you want.

I would also perhaps give it a small plus on FORT and WILL saves based on which of the Levels your on (simple +1 on mild, +2 on Moderate, and +3 on Severe). Also it makes it so I don't have to think of another name,:smallbiggrin: sound fair?

Wait losing all of your taint and gain more makes you roll another Corrupt/Depravity flaw path? Well that solves a lot...


This is quite good I donít like hard counters and immunities and feats that negate a discipline should not exist. on the other hand if a character has invest in a defense it should offer some protection. My suggestion is that for characters that have spent a feat to only get half the taint. It wonít come up very often and even if it does it wonít cripple you.

*Shrug* Sounds fair.



Edit:1Level 4

This maneuver is too strong for two reasons. Firstly it doesnít have the tag [mind] which means certain power protections against mind control donít work. Also this screams for SU as well. Secondly it affects all creatures within range if they have a point of depravity. There is a save I know but still this could turn off an encounter. I believe this maneuver was the one you designed as a counter against nps that had the taint templates. To have it be more balanced I would either lower the dc or make it useful against 1 enemy or raise the number of Depravity points the opponent must have for this to work.

So would changing it to one target in range and against Moderate Depravity targets solve the power issue? Also thinking about it now it might be wise to perhaps limit the amount of Permanent Dominated Tainted Minions and Reavers you can have.

Yes this was my only one I did. Also off of curiosity have you read most of Xexas stuff by chance?


We finally have a mechanic to get rid of taint (perhaps a tad late) this is good as it allows us to be in the severe range and have a way to avoid becoming an NPC. The second part I really donít like especially the part where it affect a mile. Itís like locate city bomb. Go to a cellar in the city. Activate first level stance. Use this strike. Repeat as many times as needed. If I were a DM I would not allow this discipline for this maneuver alone. I understand that its very thematic and cool but it can destroy campaigns. I would limit the area to close keep the part that it effects items as well but state that the change ( on items) is only visual and that as time passes nothing else happens.

... Yeah whoops, so would simply ditching the mile wide variant be enough or do you want to lower the area more. I personally think it'd be fine without the mile variant.


edit 2 taking a break raid time in wow
Life before game's after all... wait.

Arcanist
2013-07-09, 02:18 PM
I'm glad that you have decided to help me on this Discipline and thank you. Although now I'm starting to get the feeling that the lack of responses has more to do with ignorance on taint then anything else.:smallfrown:

I know enough about Taint, I just don't know much about maneuvers :smallredface:

TimeLegend
2013-07-09, 02:25 PM
I know enough about Taint, I just don't know much about maneuvers :smallredface:
Fair enough.

ArchangelAzrael
2013-07-09, 03:55 PM
I would also perhaps give it a small plus on FORT and WILL saves based on which of the Levels your on (simple +1 on mild, +2 on Moderate, and +3 on Severe). Also it makes it so I don't have to think of another name, sound fair? sounds fair *nods*


So would changing it to one target in range and against Moderate Depravity targets solve the power issue? Also thinking about it now it might be wise to perhaps limit the amount of Permanent Dominated Tainted Minions and Reavers you can have.

Yes this was my only one I did. Also off of curiosity have you read most of Xexas stuff by chance? Actually I meant picking one of those so all against moderate should be fine. The permanent dominate is too strong, it is a second character (or 3rd or 4th...) consider how strong thrallherd and the feat leadership is. You could instead have your attacks crit on creature with taint template for a few rounds after the strike. Yea I have read them but it has been a long time since then why?


... Yeah whoops, so would simply ditching the mile wide variant be enough or do you want to lower the area more. I personally think it'd be fine without the mile variant.
sure i was more afraid of the mile thingy. Still might want to consider the whole does damage to objects or at least have it being a dramatic effect than a real one.

TimeLegend
2013-07-10, 02:26 AM
sounds fair *nods*

Cool I'll change it in a bit.


Actually I meant picking one of those so all against moderate should be fine. The permanent dominate is too strong, it is a second character (or 3rd or 4th...) consider how strong thrallherd and the feat leadership is. You could instead have your attacks crit on creature with taint template for a few rounds after the strike. Yea I have read them but it has been a long time since then why?

Make sense.

Ah ok then changed that up real quick. Also no reason I just thought you'd like them. :smallsmile:


sure i was more afraid of the mile thingy. Still might want to consider the hole does damage to objects or at least have it being a dramtic effect than a real one.

Mostly what I was thinking for the most part. The Maneuver is more to lose your Taint then anything else.

EDIT: New Corruption Perfects the Body, Madness Perfects the Mind is up.

ArchangelAzrael
2013-07-10, 01:29 PM
Level 5

As Formless as Taint
Tainted Soul (Stance)
Prerequisite: 2 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Action: Swift action
Target:Self
Duration: Stance

This Stance allows you to perfect your combat form by twisting your body into the embodiment's of the two forms of taint. This Stance has no effect if you have neither Severe Corruption or Depravity. If you have Severe Corruption then when you enter this stance your body become a ink-like shadow of your former self. Your attacks are as undefendable as a plague that no training can stop. When you attack a opponent your body seems to bend and contort, even produce copies of your weapon to attack at different angles at once as if you were made of a strange liquid. While in this stance opponents you attack are consider flat-footed, and anything less then total concealment is ignored.

If you enter this stance while have Severe depravity your body seems to abrupt in a strange 'shimmering'. Your body becomes vaguely see-through as the voices of Taint around you whisper what you hear at all times in your own mind. Your attacks becomes as unstoppable as insanity, no armor can defend you as the whispers over take you. When you attack like this, your attacks seem to move straight through armor and even enchantments meant to block incorporeal attacks. While in this stance attacks you perform are touch attacks, and that which can seem to block this attack is ignored (such as a wall of force, or ghost armor,etc.).
I had a problem with this stance form the beginning as I had said. The corruption part is ok and needed to overcome some annoying magic defenses. The depravity part is the one I think itís too strong. Consider that this is a stance it can be combined with numerous things. Ubercharger without dumping AC? Check! With another maneuver hm wasnít one in coins edge that allowed 20 attacks (9th level maneuver)? Check ! I am pretty sure there are other silly combos but it comes down to this. Your maneuvers that need to connect to have an effect never miss, it boost damage per round insanely. There are spells that one could persist to achieve similar effect ( and even then defenses against touch attack work) but thatís considered cheeseÖ The demented had an epic maneuver with a similar effect. My suggestion is to tone it down a little. Some alternatives could be: ignore Magic defenses (defenses that get suppressed in an andimagic field ( it might still be too strong); Roll twice to hit and keep the better result ( I actually have used this myself in a discipline I am brewing); Take a penaldy on attack rolls ( like -10) but keep it the way you have it; Have every attack made against you count as touch attack as well. Obviously this will need playtesting to balance out. I vote for the roll twice.


Tainted Brand
Tainted Soul(Strike)
Prerequisite: 2 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Action: standard Action
Target: One Creature
Duration: Instantaneous

When you activate this maneuver make a melee attack against a target opponent. If this attack hits you deal your base damage plus a single Vile Corruption (as if this Corruption came was gained after The Vilest of Taint was used.) Also so long as you have that vile Corruption you will always have a aura of evil about you. You will be seen as evil by the Detect Evil spell or other methods to detect alignment, spells and effects that effect evil creature effect you as well, and even those who do not have means of sensing alignment can't help but consider you such. New people that are not evil you meet will start off as unfriendly to you. This brand lasts as long as you have that point in Vile Corruption, but the first Vile Corruption you remove will get rid of it.

If you have a Severe amount of Corruption when you use this maneuver. Then there very soul have this brand and if they are to die with it still on them then no matter how righteous their mortal life was they will be sent to one of the lower planes as if they were of the evil alignment. Although as soon as one gets rid of this Vile Corruption point then the soul can ascend to its proper place.
Can the person killed this way be resurrected? I think this one is ok if a little on the weak side. How exactly have you visioned this to work? What effects did you aim to achieve? Consider adding the automatic critical on creatures with the tainted template.

TimeLegend
2013-07-10, 01:55 PM
Level 5

I had a problem with this stance form the beginning as I had said. The corruption part is ok and needed to overcome some annoying magic defenses. The depravity part is the one I think itís too strong. Consider that this is a stance it can be combined with numerous things. Ubercharger without dumping AC? Check! With another maneuver hm wasnít one in coins edge that allowed 20 attacks (9th level maneuver)? Check ! I am pretty sure there are other silly combos but it comes down to this. Your maneuvers that need to connect to have an effect never miss, it boost damage per round insanely. There are spells that one could persist to achieve similar effect ( and even then defenses against touch attack work) but thatís considered cheeseÖ The demented had an epic maneuver with a similar effect. My suggestion is to tone it down a little. Some alternatives could be: ignore Magic defenses (defenses that get suppressed in an antimagic field ( it might still be too strong); Roll twice to hit and keep the better result ( I actually have used this myself in a discipline I am brewing); Take a penalty on attack rolls ( like -10) but keep it the way you have it; Have every attack made against you count as touch attack as well. Obviously this will need playtesting to balance out. I vote for the roll twice.

Hmmm, I fear this one will likely need real Playtesting in order to find the needed power point. As a quick fix for now I'll take the "Keep as same but you take a -10 on the attacks." Still I'll see if I might be able to play test this later. Either on this site or with my play group.

EDIT 1: Actually I think I just got a more interesting ideal. What if the penalty scaled with your BAB and more or less make you lose all of you BAB making you rely on your weapon enchantments and Attack Modifier? You would take a Corruption penalty to your attack equal to your BAB so hitting more a lot with it could be a problem much less try the classic POWER ATTACK O' DEATH!


Can the person killed this way be resurrected? I think this one is ok if a little on the weak side. How exactly have you visioned this to work? What effects did you aim to achieve? Consider adding the automatic critical on creatures with the tainted template.

Honestly I'm starting to think my insomnia at this point was working against me, I seemed to be thinking more in terms of fluff then sense at this point. :smallredface: He would be able to revive I would say (Still with the mark, of course.). Here's a ideal for a added effect, what if the one with this mark was considered to have Severe Corruption and/or Depravity? With the Stipulation that you couldn't use it on yourself (or anyone with the Tainted soul discipline, to keep a partner from just doing it for you)?

Also I like the ideal of the effect on the Tainted templates being a Save or Die with the fluff being the souls of the Tainted get sent to the Lower Planes. What do you think?

ArchangelAzrael
2013-07-10, 02:20 PM
Level 6

Dark Power Fury
Tainted Soul
Prerequisite: 2 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Action: See below
Target: Self
Duration: Permanent

This maneuver supplements the Feat Tainted Fury (pg. 124, Heroes of Horror), merely having this maneuver readied when you begin your Tainted Fury gives you the benefit of this maneuver. There are two possible benefits you may get if you have this feat.

If you have a Severe amount of Corruption then the temporary hit-points gained by Tainted Fury are lost first. After the Tainted fury ends your HP does not change.

If you have a Severe amount of Depravity then during your Tainted Fury you may declare a number of attacks to be Tainted smites equal to your Wisdom modifier.
The Hit points translate from 40 to 80 something, with an ability score of 24, now when you smite you would gain the half of that number as damage bonus if you can guaranty the hit (look the 5th level stance) this will be brutal possibly killing anything Cr appropriate. Perhaps reduce the number of tainted smites to half the wisdom modifier and a clause that the sickening effect canít be prevented so you donít cycle the ability? Another thing you could do is limit the smite to once per round.


Tainted Invincibility
Tainted Soul (Counter)
Prerequisite: 2 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Action: immediate action
Range: 100ft plus 10ft per Iniator level
Target: Self
Duration: Instantaneous

For the briefest of moments before an attack connects a tendril of pure Corruption springs from your being and forms a shield with promise of a retribution against the weak. Activate this maneuver when you are successfully hit by an attack. You gain Damage Reduction equal to half of your Corruption against that attack.

If you have a Severe amount of Corruption and the maneuver prevented all damage from the attack, your opponent must make a Fortitude save (DC=10+ 1/2 your Initiator level+ your Constitution modifier) or take the damage the the maneuver prevented.
This is solid. Does the damage have to be from a melee attack? Does it work against spell damage? What about area of effect damage? Does it negate your damage only or does it negate the area damage as well. I think you have to specify although as written I would say yes to all but the last.

Edit:
Honestly I'm starting to think my insomnia at this point was working against me, I seemed to be thinking more in terms of fluff then sense at this point. He would be able to revive I would say (Still with the mark, of course.). Here's a ideal for a added effect, what if the one with this mark was considered to have Severe Corruption and/or Depravity? With the Stipulation that you couldn't use it on yourself (or anyone with the Tainted soul discipline, to keep a partner from just doing it for you)?

Also I like the ideal of the effect on the Tainted templates being a Save or Die with the fluff being the souls of the Tainted get sent to the Lower Planes. What do you think? I dont know about the severe effect it dies pack some nasty effects. Perhaps a second saving throw would be in order for that. save or die versus a tainted creature is fine in my book.

TimeLegend
2013-07-10, 02:30 PM
Level 6

The Hit points translate from 40 to 80 something, with an ability score of 24, now when you smite you would gain the half of that number as damage bonus if you can guaranty the hit (look the 5th level stance) this will be brutal possibly killing anything Cr appropriate. Perhaps reduce the number of tainted smites to half the wisdom modifier and a clause that the sickening effect canít be prevented so you donít cycle the ability? Another thing you could do is limit the smite to once per round.

The once per round ideal sounds like it could work well. Hmm I just noticed that making the Sicken and CON damage automatic might be a good idea since there's two easy method to reduce the CR to the normally all but impossible to make save.


This is solid. Does the damage have to be from a melee attack? Does it work against spell damage? What about area of effect damage? Does it negate your damage only or does it negate the area damage as well. I think you have to specify although as written I would say yes to all but the last.

You hit the nail on the head for the question. I'll try to write it to make it be a bit easier to understand

EDIT 1:

Edit: I dont know about the severe effect it dies pack some nasty effects. Perhaps a second saving throw would be in order for that. save or die versus a tainted creature is fine in my book.

Technically the first effect didn't have a save throw, so I'll think I'll add one to it to resist getting the Initial 'Mark', if you get the mark then you have to make a FORT and WILL save, failing one will give you either Corruption or Depravity (Depending on the failed save). Which has the possibility of failing both. That sound good?

ArchangelAzrael
2013-07-10, 03:13 PM
Level 7

Tainted Flurry Rampage
Tainted Soul (Boost)
Prerequisite: 3 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Action: swift action
Range:Personal
Target:Self
Duration: Instantaneous

Upon Activating this maneuver choose to gain a number of Corruption and Depravity. For each 30 Taint points (Corruption or Depravity, divided as chosen) you make a melee attack at your Full Base Attack bonus.

If you have a Severe score of Corruption or Depravity at the start of this maneuver then you gain a melee attack for each 25 Taint points you gain.

If you have a Severe score in both Corruption and Depravity that number is further reduced to 20 points per attack
This seems solidÖ it roughly translates to 3 attacks tops ( with an exception if you have 33 in an ability score -which under normal race restriction stat generation optimization should be hard- and you start from mid that you can get 4 attacks). It gives a way to gather taint quickly and it has a risk of pushing yourself to muchÖ consider having calculated perfectly so you are at you limit but nor over severe and have a decrease of the corresponding ability score ####

Soul Straining Strike
Tainted Soul (Strike)
Prerequisite: 3 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Action: standard action
Range: Melee
Target: One Creature
Duration: Instantaneous

Upon activating this Maneuver you choose to gain a number of Corruption and Depravity. You then make a Melee attack. If this attack hits you gain attack damage on this attack based on how many taint points spent (Corruption or Depravity, divided as chosen). For each three points of taint gained you gain one extra damage to this attack.

If you have a Severe score of Corruption or Depravity at the start of this maneuver then you gain a extra damage to this attack for every two points of taint points gained.

If you have a Severe score of Corruption and Depravity at the start of this maneuver then you gain a extra damage to this attack for every taint point you chose to gain.
Hm this might be just over the amount of damage a maneuver of this level should do with both wis and con 32 this will do under the right conditions 126 extra damage tops more if you can can get 33 in both scores (148 to be exact). Thatís more than a level 9 maneuver. On the other hand you get in a risk/benefit area and those numbers in play shouldnít come that often. I think those kinds of maneuvers should have come earlier and perhaps certain other maneuvers costing taint to executeÖ oh well that a thought for a v.2 of this discipline should it ever come. I think its ok as it is because at level 20 normal characters wouldnít have that high stats

edit: will do the last 2 probably tommorow as I need to sleep

Technically the first effect didn't have a save throw, so I'll think I'll add one to it to resist getting the Initial 'Mark', if you get the mark then you have to make a FORT and WILL save, failing one will give you either Corruption or Depravity (Depending on the failed save). Which has the possibility of failing both. That sound good? yea second saving throw was a brain fart on my part... 2 saving throws for both should work fine! I wish we had another person to give PEACH, I am still wet under the ears and a more veteran homebrewer would be much more usefull than me.
EDIT 2: Real life has kept me from reviewing the last 2 lvls. ETA at the earliest monday

ArchangelAzrael
2013-07-15, 01:18 PM
Level 8

Perfection in Taint
Tainted Soul (Stance)
Prerequisite: 3 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Actions: Swift Action
Range:Personal
Target: Self
Duration:Stance, Varies see in description

When you enter this stance your very essence is changed to closer resemble those of a evil outsider. You seem to somehow bleed out a darkness that dims your immediate vicinity and your eyes glow in a golden light making you almost seem like a Reaver. You may only enter this stance if you have at least one Corruption or Depravity. When you are in this stance you gain the following penalties and abilities

-You are considered to be effected by the Severe Tainted Brand Maneuver with the exception that it ends as soon as you exit this Stance

-You lose all of your Corruption and Depravity and gain an equal number of 'Taint' points which you can hold up to the combine total of the total of your maximum possible Corruption before you die and your maximum Depravity before you go insane. If you exceed this amount you're dragged into the infinite realm of taint by tendrils of Corruption where you will become one with it. You cannot be revived if this events happens as your very soul is devoured by the taint. For all this though, for the purposes of Spells and abilities that use your Corruption and Depravity, your Taint Score substitutes those. When you exit this stance you distribute your Taint score into Corruption and Depravity in any way you choose. Also if for whatever reason you lose all of your Taint points you immediately are forced out of this stance.

- You are considered to have Severe amount of Corruption and Depravity, no matter how much or little taint points you have. Meaning you have all the flaws of your Corruption and Depravity line even with a single taint point.

- If you enter this Stance with a total of 108 or greater sum of both corruption and depravity you may enter this stance with the taint points as Vile (As described in the maneuver The Vilest of Taint). When you enter this stance in such a way, instead of having a strange bleeding a darkness around you, you literally are merely a silhouette of yourself with glowing golden beads where your eyes should be. Using this version of Perfection in Taint has the added following effects.

-While you are in this stance any taint points you receive or give to others is consider Vile taint.

- This Stance is now a permanent aspect of your being and you are not considered to be using a stance while this is in effect (Meaning you can enter other stances in this form.). Further more the only possible way to exit this version of Perfection in Taint is to lose all of you vile taint points. You cannot lose your Vile taint points without your non-mind controlled consent. (Although you can very much gain more taint without it.)

- If you use Purity of Self, Taint to All Else (You must do it either with the Pure Soul Feat or on Ground that is considered sacred and holy.) to exit this stance, if you do not have the Pure Soul Feat (pg. 124, Heroes of Horror) then when you gain Corruption or Depravity you instead roll two dice (re-rolling doubles) and gain both of the flaw lines.

Ok this one seems to me to be strong as it interacts with maneuvers that count your points in taint for damage. Letís say i have just 1 point in depravity. I am consider to be in severe range for both of them so when i use Soul Straining Strike for every one point of taint i get i add 1 damage ... this easily translates to 200-250 extra damage... that twice as a level 9 maneuver. I donít know if that intended but i think it reaches ubercharger silliness and although for some game this might be cool I fear many will turn it down as "broken". It does come with the negative of risking death by nearly capping taint but a dead enemy canít hurt you. Have you considered the rules about getting more taint than your ability score and how it interacts in general with your discipline? If you take it into account this maneuver loses some steam but still the damage is a tad overwhelming. Now to the more problematic part the second part of this stance. Can a character have pure of soul feat and use this discipline. I think not. Basically if you enter this stance with the second option and get a vile taint you canít leave it unless you find a holy ground which can be as easy /as hard as the DM wants it to be. How do you wanted it to work, would help me better understand the mechanics that you aimed for.


Tainted Soul Defense
Tainted Soul (Counter)
Prerequisite: 3 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Action: immediate Action
Range: Personal
Target: Self
Duration: Instantaneous ,Varies see in description

Activate this maneuver when you must make a saving throw. When you activate this maneuver you choose a amount of Corruption and Depravity to gain. You gain a Corruption bonus to your saving throw until the end of the duration.

If you have a Severe amount of depravity when you start this maneuver then you do not automatically fail a save on a roll of one and the duration lasts until the start of your next turn.

If you have a Severe amount of corruption then if a spell or ability would have a partial effect even if you succeeded the save, it is instead negated and if a non HP-damage effect from a spell or ability doesn't have a save you get a save anyway to negate that effect with the DC of 10+plus the opponents HD+ their lowest ability modifier.
Solid option if a tad too late. I like it. It gives you a reason not to run on full taint score.
Level 9

To Look Upon the Ebon Mirror
Tainted Soul (Strike)
Prerequisite: 4 Tainted Soul Maneuver
Action: Full Round action
Target: 100ft plus 10ft per Iniator level
Duration: Instantaneous

You must have both Severe corruption and depravity in order to activate this maneuver. Although this oddly named maneuver which some masters have claimed involves the origin of this discipline, seems oddly simple for a style that has so much risk involve to oneself and to the unaware seems strangely friendly in it's execution. This is a lie, it is perhaps perhaps this discipline's darkest technique.

When one executes this maneuver all becomes peaceful and quiet no matter the previous circumstances, from a mayors speech to the harshest of battles. All stop to gaze at the martial adept in a instant, the martial adept opens his arms wide in a friendly gesture and asks all to join him in taint with a smile on his face (They can always tell he or she is smiling even if the adepts form shouldn't really allow one to be able to tell.) as the adepts skin and clothes turn into a oddly dark reflexive surface.

At this point all involved must make a Reflex save (DC=10+1/2 Initiator Level+ CON modifier) to divert their eyes away as their own souls scream to look away. If they make this save there is no effect on them, if they fail they must then make both a Will save (DC=10+1/2 Iniator level+ WIS modifier) and a Fort Save (DC=10+1/2 Initiator level+ CON modifier). If they fail the Will save their depravity score now equals yours including it being vile if yours is. If they fail their fort save their Corruption score now equals yours including it being vile if yours is.

If this causes them to be both Dead and Insane due to having too much corruption and depravity then they are dragged into the realm of taint as if they had too high of a taint score from Perfection in Taint.
A double save or die/suck maneuver itís strong but appropriate for a level 9 maneuver. I am just afraid it could be spammed and have the dc of the ability scale too high with shenanigans and itís an aoe attack. Against a party it could easily lead to TPK with unlucky rolls/poor optimization. Having said that I would probably allow it in one of my games as long as the party was optimizing a little. The fact that it seems to target friends as well makes it harder to use which is fine with me

TimeLegend
2013-07-15, 02:09 PM
Not at home at the moment. If I may ask, do you have a suggested change for the 8th level Stance? Also what rule are you referring to? A page number would be appreciated, for when I get home.

ArchangelAzrael
2013-07-15, 02:59 PM
Page 62 right column near 2/3 down give or take. If that rules apply then its ok as you can burn at most 50 motes and have a chance to make the save but would probably want to keep it under the ability score anyway because even if you succeed you still get some nasty effects if you are not immune to them. As for stance suggestions I would like to know what you were aiming for mostly mechanically speaking to be more helpful. If you want an anti-motive for the second part of the stance you could say you canít lose vile taint in combat and outside of it you have to burn experience (and use the maneuver damping taint). 1600 exp might be a good demotivation. Alternative you could suffer ability damage (that canít be negated by any mean and only heals at a rate of 1 per day) to wisdom and con (1d6 at that level should be fine)

TimeLegend
2013-07-15, 10:35 PM
Page 62 right column near 2/3 down give or take. If that rules apply then its ok as you can burn at most 50 motes and have a chance to make the save but would probably want to keep it under the ability score anyway because even if you succeed you still get some nasty effects if you are not immune to them.

O.K finally got home and read it and one thing I must say about that rule is "Holy freaking monkey balls that is terrible." It's not if you gain your ability score in one turn if it's you gain you ability Modifier when you have to make the save. that kind of really screws with the discipline in general in a really bad way and is one of the rules you need to either ignore or change if you wish for both to function because yikes.

I do like the ideal of simply changing it rather then removing it though as a way to limit the uber potential of the Perfection in Taint Stance, like what you suggested could keep a large chunk of the cheese potential in check. Although I'm thinking that even one turn of either effects is painful enough as it was. (I.E. If you gain your ability score in Corruption (CON) or Depravity (WIS) then you get screwed over for it))


As for stance suggestions I would like to know what you were aiming for mostly mechanically speaking to be more helpful. If you want an anti-motive for the second part of the stance you could say you canít lose vile taint in combat and outside of it you have to burn experience (and use the maneuver damping taint). 1600 exp might be a good demotivation. Alternative you could suffer ability damage (that canít be negated by any mean and only heals at a rate of 1 per day) to wisdom and con (1d6 at that level should be fine)

Simply I was aiming for a way to have the ability to have over the normal limits of Corruption/Depravity that one could have, and also make it so one was always able to use their maneuvers at their best. The second part main draw was the permanent aspect of it. Being able to sleep with it on and go into other stances giving it a powerful synergy with other certain stances.

Although having this discipline and the Pure Soul Feat was insomnia induced silliness. Still I do like the Constitution and Wisdom Damage as a secondary anti-motive for the second part.

EDIT: Thank you regardless, Angel for all your help :smallsmile:. The reason I haven't discussed the other maneuvers mentioned is because you seemed to believe they were fine. I'm going to try to add some fluff for this style (I know I suck at it, but I'll try at least.) when I get the time.

ArchangelAzrael
2013-07-17, 11:22 AM
I suggest adding in the beginning where you describe the discipline to add "Taint caused by this discipline do not count towards the maximum, one can acquire at a time (for more details see page 62 heroes of horror). The exception to this rule is the practitioner himself which follows the normal rules but instead of ability modifier the maximum he can acquire is his Ability score" or something to the like. If you manage to playtest it PM me to let me know how it turned out:smallwink:.

TimeLegend
2013-07-17, 08:24 PM
I suggest adding in the beginning where you describe the discipline to add "Taint caused by this discipline do not count towards the maximum, one can acquire at a time (for more details see page 62 heroes of horror). The exception to this rule is the practitioner himself which follows the normal rules but instead of ability modifier the maximum he can acquire is his Ability score" or something to the like. If you manage to playtest it PM me to let me know how it turned out:smallwink:.

Will do! :smallsmile:

Thanks again, ArchangelAzrail!