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Fizban
2007-02-15, 07:47 PM
So the question is: how much does it take to pull a floating disk? According to the SRD, favorable conditions double the amount one can drag, and a complete lack of friction is certainly a favorable condition, but x2 just seems too small. Then again, the inertia of the load still makes it hard to move.

Suggestions?

DaMullet
2007-02-15, 07:55 PM
By that you mean a Tenser's Floating Disc? it follows the caster automatically at a range not exceeding the spell limits, and no closer than 5 feet.

Essentially, it's a magic packmule that doesn't eat.

Rabiesbunny
2007-02-15, 07:59 PM
Not to mention that, in times of hardship, you can't eat a Tenser's Floating Disk.

I prefer a mule.

Fizban
2007-02-15, 10:48 PM
Sure it follows you, but what if you order it to stand still and someone tries to move it? And of course the real reason I want to know: if you're sitting on it, how much creature power do you need to drag yourself around?

oriong
2007-02-15, 11:21 PM
You can't from all appearances. The disc seems completely immune to any force that attempts to move it, indeed there are no guidelines for anything that can stop it from following you.

In fact, I'm not even sure what happens when you overload a disk. It doesn't wink out of existance, it simply can't hold more than X amount. Does any excess weight simply fall through it?

barawn
2007-02-15, 11:29 PM
You can't from all appearances. The disc seems completely immune to any force that attempts to move it, indeed there are no guidelines for anything that can stop it from following you.

Wall of Tenser's Floating Discs?

Maxymiuk
2007-02-15, 11:29 PM
You can't from all appearances. The disc seems completely immune to any force that attempts to move it, indeed there are no guidelines for anything that can stop it from following you.

You mean it's a low level, cheap as heaven, improved version of an Immovable Rod?

*glee*

Missing Shoe
2007-02-15, 11:35 PM
Wall of Tenser's Floating Discs?
Not quite sure how you will make a wall out of them because they all remain 3 feet above ground level... I guess you would keep wee folk out...maybe. Since they always remain level they could just crawl underneath it.

I would say if you overload it, it forces it to go less than 3 feet above ground level, thus violating the spell rules and causing it to blink out of existence.

martyboy74
2007-02-16, 09:10 AM
So if it can't be within 5 feet of you, what happens if you dimension door on top of it? Does it explode, blink out, or go rampaging through the multiverse at faster than light speed?

Indon
2007-02-16, 09:27 AM
So if it can't be within 5 feet of you, what happens if you dimension door on top of it? Does it explode, blink out, or go rampaging through the multiverse at faster than light speed?

What I want to know is, if it can't be stopped, and it automatically moves to track you, and it always stays 3 feet above the ground... how _sharp_ are those edges?

Because Dimension Door and that disk might make for some interesting times for Large or larger creatures...

Ditto
2007-02-16, 09:29 AM
It might be handy to hold a door shut until the They can batter it to splinters.

The disc moves according to your will, up to the given speed. My gnome likes floating around on one. Keeps his feet dry, and he got over a covered pit trap before it was set off without incident. :smallsmile:

JellyPooga
2007-02-16, 09:49 AM
The question is; Why do you want to drag it?

It moves according to your will within range. If it goes out of range (which is only short) it disappears.

hmm...just had a thought. If the caster who cast the spell fell unconscious, could the rest of the party put him on his own disk and drag him? Have answered my own question?

In that case, considering that the disk is essentially on a frictionless plane, you should be able to move any load on it (as long as the spell can take the load - 100lbs/caster level) with any character. Note that I say move. A strong character could drag it around and guide it and such. A weak character might be able to get it moving, but momentum would prevent him from stopping it easily, let alone get it round corners, unless he moves it at snails pace.

MaN
2007-02-16, 02:27 PM
The disc moves according to your will, up to the given speed.No, the floating disc does not move according to your will. The only way the disc moves is that it "follows" you, which it cannot do if you are sitting motionless on top of it. You may will it to follow at a specific distance if you choose to do so, otherwise it follows 5' behind you.


You create a slightly concave, circular plane of force that follows you about and carries loads for you. The disk is 3 feet in diameter and 1 inch deep at its center. It can hold 100 pounds of weight per caster level. (If used to transport a liquid, its capacity is 2 gallons.) The disk floats approximately 3 feet above the ground at all times and remains level. It floats along horizontally within spell range and will accompany you at a rate of no more than your normal speed each round. If not otherwise directed, it maintains a constant interval of 5 feet between itself and you. The disk winks out of existence when the spell duration expires. The disk also winks out if you move beyond range or try to take the disk more than 3 feet away from the surface beneath it. When the disk winks out, whatever it was supporting falls to the surface beneath it.
Material Component: A drop of mercury.

Josh Inno
2007-02-16, 03:45 PM
*RaE* I interpret this to mean that the disk must be within a certain range of you, but the first line is a summary of the general use of the spell. It does say "unless otherwise directed it does this". Does this mean that you can direct it to move in front of you so that you can get the thing into the corner of a room for off-loading, or does it mean that all you can do is direct it to not follow you? That is something open to DM interpretation. I for one would let someone direct it to be right next to the big burly barbarian who was going to unload the treasure from the disk into the cart.

oriong
2007-02-16, 04:05 PM
The wording of Floating Disc is actually insanely vague, I guess it never came up since it's not a commonly used spell, and it has no combat abilities but it's infuriatingly vague.

MaN
2007-02-16, 04:09 PM
*RaE* I interpret this to mean that the disk must be within a certain range of you, but the first line is a summary of the general use of the spell. It does say "unless otherwise directed it does this". Does this mean that you can direct it to move in front of you so that you can get the thing into the corner of a room for off-loading, or does it mean that all you can do is direct it to not follow you?
According to the D&D FAQ you cannot direct the disc to move at all, period. You may specify the distance at which it will follow you, but it still will not move until you do, and then will only follow you. If you wish to move it into position to off-load it you would have to walk it over to where you want it to be and then stand still.



Can you ride your own Tenserís floating disk?
No. While you could command your Tenserís floating disk to move close enough for you to sit upon it, it has no ability to move under its own power. It can follow you only at a maximum rate equal to your normal speed.

Disclaimer: the D&D FAQ is not errata and does not have to be taken at all seriously. On many occasions I don't.

Missing Shoe
2007-02-16, 04:30 PM
Meh, I find that "not being able to ride on top of it" rubbish. We had a mage that did just that everywhere he went. It really causes no "harm" so I dont see why you couldnt.

Also, how smart is the disc? If you stand next to a doorway with the door to you right and the disc to your left, and then side step through the door way so that you are on the other side of the door, but in the same location as before (ie left of the door). Say that in doing this, you move less than 5 feet. Does the disc know to go around the wall through the door, or does it try to go through the wall? And if it cant be stopped, can it cut *through* the wall?

I'm sure most DM's would rule it goes through the doorway but it would be kind of neat to cut through walls!

Ditto
2007-02-16, 04:32 PM
...so then I lean forward. It's following my nose. Ta-da!

I concur, the first line sounds like the fluff of it. 'Unless directed otherwise' means you *can* direct it otherwise. And if it's only allowed to follow behind you, then is it dependent on facing rules? Clearly this is silly. As laid out in the description, that's the unattended default for the simple, lazy player who needs a mule made of Force.

Also, another clever use I thought up *could* allow flying, if I'm not mistaken. I've never tried this, so please explain if this is impossible:

You can float a disk onto an awning, eh? If you were to lift the awning using telekinesis or mage hand or such, the disk would rise with it, precisely three feet up from the surface. Now, alternately, say you're sitting on the disk, and holding up the edge of the tarp. If you pull the tarp toward you, the disk would move up accordingly. Give it slack, the disk drops. Flight-ish! Is this infeasible?

Tor the Fallen
2007-02-16, 04:36 PM
Not quite sure how you will make a wall out of them because they all remain 3 feet above ground level... I guess you would keep wee folk out...maybe. Since they always remain level they could just crawl underneath it.

I would say if you overload it, it forces it to go less than 3 feet above ground level, thus violating the spell rules and causing it to blink out of existence.

Unless you put ground on top of the disk, and cast another one on that.

Fence of Tenser's Disk?

pestilenceawaits
2007-02-16, 04:41 PM
Just make a use activated magic item (bridle or saddle or some such) that a horse can wear and when it is activated by placing it on the horse the disk floats after the horse a distance of five feet and you can ride it. :0) :0P

Stephen_E
2007-02-16, 04:41 PM
OK, so with the rules and the FAQ we've established -

If you use some instantaneous method of transport (DD or Teleport) to get out of range of the disc it vanishes.

It only follows you, so if you don't move it won't move. Exception - if you reduce the following distance while standing still it should move closer, but it won't move fuether away from a stationary owner, even if he extends the distance.

You can control the distance it follows you.

You don't actually push it. Indeed as mentioned, it can't move if you aren't moving.

I think that covered everything.

Amusement. Get a Ring of Spell Storing.
Cast several Tenser's Floating Discs on it (as mentioned it's only a 1st lev spell).
Give Ring to Fighter with Endurance and decent Spot.
Said Fighter then casts "x" TFDs, where "x" = the number of other party members.
Other PCs then climb on discs and go to sleep.
Fighter then walks on with string of resting PCs. :smallbiggrin:

Stephen

Ditto
2007-02-16, 04:56 PM
See also the thread about portable holes + TFDs = TARDIS (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=35035). :smallsmile:

Fizban
2007-02-16, 11:09 PM
How about this little idea I thought up a while ago:

Cast the disk twice, then set up some sort of inflexible framework around the two, using whatever method you deem wise. You should set it up so that you have a 5x10 surface, each end firmly attached to a disk. Now, get on one end, so you're sitting above one of the disks, and order the other to get closer to you. This second disk should push the other along in a straight line. You can use the fact that it says behind you to steer by turning your body in the direction you want to go, or you can use some other mechanical way of swinging the sled about if that requires too much semantics.

DaMullet
2007-02-16, 11:14 PM
What I'd like to know is, if these wizards can create spells powerful enough to bend reality itself, why can't they create a frictionless wagon? I envison some sort of "sleigh" with the fighter standing in the helm going all Venician Canal Boat with a 10 ft. pole.

Thanatos
2007-02-16, 11:56 PM
In the 2nd Edition version, it floated at waist height, so you couldn't get on your own disk. Still, a relatively light caster like a gnome could cast one, and have another gnome climb on top of it. That second gnome would then cast their own disk, and drape a small net over it. The edges of the net would be gathered and tied together, with the end of the rope coming down to a sling the first gnome could sit in. The upper gnome does a small hop, which raises the disk at his waist, which lifts the lower gnome dangling from it. That of course raises the disk that floats at the lower gnome's waist level, which further lifts the upper one and his disk, creating a loop.

It wasn't particularly useful to convince pairs of gnomes to inadvertently launch themselves into space, but it sure was fun.

DaMullet
2007-02-17, 12:46 AM
It sounds like it would be.

Ditto
2007-02-17, 03:27 AM
Waist level, huh? Okay, so he sits inside the disk when it's created. It's concave. Or, he could just lie down with his upper body straddling it and his butt hanging out the back side. No trouble at all.

Dark
2007-02-17, 08:47 AM
Hmm, the spell description does not say the disk will be "behind" the caster. It says the disk "follows you". I think that solves the going-through-a-door problem: the easiest way for the disk to follow you is to pass through all the squares you passed through. It'll just duplicate your route.