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View Full Version : D&D 3.x Other Is this a L.A. +1?



Killer Angel
2014-08-22, 03:40 AM
A player in my next campaign (in which I'm giving a free +1 L.A.) wants to play a subrace of elves strictly connected to nature (probably extraplanar, native to arborea, without using eladrins)

the proposal for racial traits, is something like this:

1 bonus feat (choice between alertness or imp. initiative)
+2 rac. bonus to spot, listen and hide
1/day: spider climb, speak with animals, pass without trace

Is it worth a +1? should I add something (another couple of SLA at higher levels, like Speak with plants and Commune with nature)?

Inevitability
2014-08-22, 05:06 AM
Are those traits in addition to those of high elves?

The bonus feat will almost always go to Imp. Initiative, which is a good feat. Nothing broken though.
The bonus to skills is useful, but again, it is just a bonus.
At which caster level are the spell-likes cast? What are the saving throw DC's?

LordErebus12
2014-08-22, 06:37 AM
At which caster level are the spell-likes cast? What are the saving throw DC's?

Just wanted to point out that those spells most likely dont have saving throw DC's, but since they are spell-like abilities, they would run off of charisma like normal.

LordErebus12
2014-08-22, 06:41 AM
A player in my next campaign (in which I'm giving a free +1 L.A.) wants to play a subrace of elves strictly connected to nature (probably extraplanar, native to arborea, without using eladrins)

the proposal for racial traits, is something like this:

1 bonus feat (choice between alertness or imp. initiative)
+2 rac. bonus to spot, listen and hide
1/day: spider climb, speak with animals, pass without trace

Is it worth a +1? should I add something (another couple of SLA at higher levels, like Speak with plants and Commune with nature)?

I would drop alertness as a feat choice, since it already has a +2 on perception checks. Instead, grant a feat of their choice from the following list: Run, Endurance or Improved Initiative.

Why spider climb? Its very unusual in my opinion for an elf (or any non-spider-like race).

Killer Angel
2014-08-22, 06:43 AM
Are those traits in addition to those of high elves?


yes



The bonus feat will almost always go to Imp. Initiative, which is a good feat. Nothing broken though.


I'm aware of that, that would be my choice as well. :smallwink:



At which caster level are the spell-likes cast? What are the saving throw DC's?

I'm tempted to say the usual "Caster level equals the PCs class levels".

Inevitability
2014-08-22, 06:57 AM
Okay, in that case I'd say they are maybe a weak LA 1. But really, elves aren't that hot to begin with, and you are not adding a lot meaningful stuff to it.

Lesser Aasimar/Tieflings, lightfoot halflings and humans are all LA +0 races I'd pick over this. I'd say it is fine to keep these at LA +0, except if the optimization level is really low.

Killer Angel
2014-08-22, 07:49 AM
I would drop alertness as a feat choice, since it already has a +2 on perception checks. Instead, grant a feat of their choice from the following list: Run, Endurance or Improved Initiative.

Why spider climb? Its very unusual in my opinion for an elf (or any non-spider-like race).

A little more infos are needed.
The player wants to play a ranger, so Endurance will be for free. And Alertness could be vaguely tempting if he wants to have an edge in the perception field.
Spider Climb may be unusual, but it could be justified with the millenia of living with a lot of trees (unless swap it directly with a low climb speed, but i don't like the idea...)
As a DM, I wanted to give some useful utility to a ranger since the first level, in a group that will have almost full casters


Okay, in that case I'd say they are maybe a weak LA 1. But really, elves aren't that hot to begin with, and you are not adding a lot meaningful stuff to it.


What if I remove the starting penalty to Con, leaving only the +2 bonus to dex?

Inevitability
2014-08-22, 08:00 AM
What if I remove the starting penalty to Con, leaving only the +2 bonus to dex?

Still weak LA +1, but slightly more justified. You could go either way with it.

Killer Angel
2014-08-22, 08:50 AM
Thanks for the input, I'll stick with this. :smallsmile:

(obviously, if there aren't further suggestions)

Temotei
2014-08-22, 08:59 AM
One flavorful way to boost them could be giving them telepathy with plants/animals only out to whatever range. It'd allow them to take Mindsight (Lords of Madness) and make them have some utility that isn't limited by per-day abilities.

Curbstomp
2014-08-23, 02:13 AM
Why not just use Forestlord Elves from Dragon Magic? They have forest-themed abilities and alternate class features that they can gain access to through Dragonblood.

atemu1234
2014-08-23, 12:09 PM
Seeing as they're strictly non-damaging SLAs, I'd probably say you don't have an issue with those. The plus two on a bunch of skills probably doesn't do much either, despite what Savage Species would say. Finally, the Bonus Feat. If it's a bonus feat they get to choose, that might warrant another LA to LA +2. If it's only a feat that is race-wide (without them choosing), it may fit.

Altogether, going by Savage Species and comparing this to Drow, I'd say you're looking at LA +2, if you add it to normal elven traits. If you took out some of the traits you could probably get it down to LA +1.

Edit: NVM, my eyes weren't working.

It looks like a decent LA +1, but you might just cut down the bonus feat to nice, simple improved initiative. It'd be my first pick at any rate.