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View Full Version : Barnger, or Rangarian - balance issues.



Gamebird
2007-03-08, 11:51 AM
I want to play a blend of the Barbarian and Ranger.

Here's my ability wish list:
d12 hp
full BAB
10' extra movement
Rage 1/day or 2/day, at some point
Track feat for free
4+INT bonus skills per level
light armor
all martial weapons

Extras I'd like:
extra feats or combat styles
two good saves instead of 1
animal companion (preferably a mount or a hunting dog - can be from a restricted list that eliminates heavily power-gamed choices)
Evasion
Favored enemy
Damage reduction
woodland stride
swift tracker

Things I don't like or don't care about enough to pay for:
spells
uncanny dodge (yes, I know it's useful)
trap sense
indomitable will
wild empathy
camouflage
hide in plain sight
More than 2x Rage/day

So... I was thinking that to keep the d12, I'd use the Barbarian as a base class and then tweak it a bit from there. I also don't want rage at first level and I don't want to switch classes later on or join a PrC (multiclassing is penalized in this game and PrC's aren't expected to be available).

1st - d12 hp, 4+INT skills (use Barbarian skill choices), full BAB, all martial weapons, all armor, Good Fort saves, poor Ref/Will, +10' movement, Track feat for free.
2nd - Rage 1/day
3rd -
4th - Animal companion
5th -
6th - Rage 2/day
7th - Woodland stride, DR 1/-
8th - Swift Tracker
9th - Evasion
10th - Dr 2/-
11th -
12th - Greater Rage
13th - DR 3/-
14th - Endurance
15th -
16th - DR 4/-
17th -
18th - Diehard
19th - DR 5/-
20th - Mighty Rage

I'm taking the Barbarian, dropping the uncanny dodge stuff and the trap sense, delaying most Rage abilities and dropping some Rage/day, and in exchange I'm adding Track for free, an animal companion, woodland stride, swift tracker and evasion, with Endurance and Diehard later on when they hardly matter (but it fits the concept).

Too strong? Too weak?

Fax Celestis
2007-03-08, 12:05 PM
Looks fine to me. I'd even add a Favored Enemy at 5th and at 15th and Swift Tracker at 11th, personally. Kill some of those dead levels.

Gamebird
2007-03-08, 12:35 PM
The DM rules that any change from the established classes has to be weaker, a philosophy that I agree with. So I'm not aiming at making the character exactly as powerful as the existing Barbarian or Ranger, but a hair or two weaker, with the abilties I want, would be excellent. I've already got Swift Tracker in there. I'll see about adding a Favored Enemy or two.

iceman
2007-03-08, 12:55 PM
You could probably get the a better base reflex save, I've always thought the barbarian should have received it anyway. As for the class itself it doesn't seem any more powerful than the either of the other two base classes.
Oh and a question what are you going to do about the whole illiteracy thing?

Gamebird
2007-03-08, 01:03 PM
In this campaign, all PCs start as illiterate anyway and stay that way unless they take literacy as a feat or have spell casting ability. I figure I'll buy it with a feat around 6th or 9th.

Person_Man
2007-03-08, 01:18 PM
I think your class build is more then reasonable. It doesn't have spells, the special abilities aren't front loaded, and there's nothing you couldn't get from some combination of other base classes. If I were your DM, I might suggest that it be more powerful, especially at levels 10+.

If you wanted to play something non-homebrew, you might consider

Scout 6/Barbarian 1/Stalker of Kharash 2/Beast Heart Adept (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20070209a&page=4) X

This doesn't fulfill your entire list, but it gets most of what you want much faster then other builds. You give up some hit points, 2 points of BAB, a few points on your Saves until you enter a PrC, and a little damage reduction. But you gain a boatload of Skills and special abilities, and a superior Animal Companion. I'd even drop Stalker of Karash, as I'm not that hung up on Favored Enemy. Or if you prefer, Darkwood Stalker would give you Favored Enemy (Orcs) instead.

Features:

Tons of Skill points
Light Armor
Rage (Take the Extra Rage feat to use it a total of 3 times per day)
Skirmish +2d6 +1 AC
Evasion
Uncanny Dodge
Flawless Strike (far superior to Woodland Strike)
Trackless Step
Bonus Feat (Track, or others off a good list)
Fast Movement +20
Martial Weapons
Track evil enemies by Scent
Favored Enemy (Evil)
Excellent Animal Companion(s)

Behold_the_Void
2007-03-08, 01:35 PM
It might stand to gain another use of rage or two as well, which I don't think would overpower it. Ranger/Barbarian presents a great flavor set, I like the idea a lot.

Darrin
2007-03-08, 01:45 PM
I want to play a blend of the Barbarian and Ranger.
Here's my ability wish list:
d12 hp
full BAB
10' extra movement
Rage 1/day or 2/day, at some point
Track feat for free
4+INT bonus skills per level
light armor
all martial weapons


Sounds like you want a Wolf Totem Barbarian (see the alternate base classes in the Unearthed Arcana section of the SRD):

http://www.systemreferencedocuments.org/35/sovelior_sage/unearthedCoreClass.html

You give up Uncanny Dodge and Trap Sense for Improved Trip at 2nd (add Knockdown at 3rd) and Track at 5th. So... you'd have to wait a bit for Track, but you do get it for free.

Person_Man
2007-03-08, 04:06 PM
Sounds like you want a Wolf Totem Barbarian (see the alternate base classes in the Unearthed Arcana section of the SRD):

http://www.systemreferencedocuments.org/35/sovelior_sage/unearthedCoreClass.html

You give up Uncanny Dodge and Trap Sense for Improved Trip at 2nd (add Knockdown at 3rd) and Track at 5th. So... you'd have to wait a bit for Track, but you do get it for free.

Ohh, good idea.

There's also Deepwarden (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20040807a&page=4), which has d12 hit points, full BAB, 2 good saves, 6 Skill points per level, free Track at first level, the highly useful Stonewarden ability, and Swift Tracker. No animal companion, though that could be solved by levels in Beastmaster.