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MeklorIlavator
2007-03-21, 07:46 PM
Hey, I was wondering if anyone has played the Star wars d20, and what their opinion of it was. I have the source book and was thinking of trying to join a game, but I have no idea if it is implemented well or not. What do you think?

Assassinfox
2007-03-21, 07:49 PM
Played it once, but the GM didn't really know what he was doing. >_<

I'm not a big fan of the force system. All the fun force powers give you dark side points, and lots of dark side points = lose.

henebry
2007-03-21, 07:52 PM
Played it once, but the GM didn't really know what he was doing. >_<

I'm not a big fan of the force system. All the fun force powers give you dark side points, and lots of dark side points = lose.

Sounds kind of neat, when you put it that way. Anything which makes magic dark would be a nice change of pace from D&D.

Druid
2007-03-21, 07:56 PM
I thought that the force powers were poorly executed. Playing a jedi is what I really wanted to do so I didn't like the system all that well.

Piccamo
2007-03-21, 07:59 PM
I play it in a campaign where we're not allowed to play as Jedi. Its pretty fun. Selonian Soldier ftw :smallcool:

Woot Spitum
2007-03-21, 08:01 PM
It's a great game. The Vitality/Wounds system makes more sense than hp. Force powers work like skills.

Swordguy
2007-03-21, 08:08 PM
Either everyone play jedi, or nobody does. That's makes it OK.

When only one or two people are jedi (and who can even spell the word "optimization") , you've got some balance problems.

Lemur
2007-03-21, 08:20 PM
I actually like the force system, it's just that using the force to directly hurt people, like using lightning on people, is extremely detrimental in the long run. I have no problem with this, really, since that's how the dark side is supposed to work. I also like the skill use and vitality draining aspects of them. Between vitality regen and Heal Self, it's not as bad as it sounds at first.

That said, I think the game set up works fairly well overall. There are some issues with the base classes though, if you ask me. The Fringer, for example, is unimpressive both in terms of flavor and mechanics. The Scout and Tech Specialist are both a bit underwhelming, but I think you can have fun with them, although you may not want to take the full progression. Scoundrel is good for skills, and Soldier, well, it's hard not to want to include at least some levels of Soldier in most non-Force builds. I really like the flavor for Force Adepts, personally (they don't create crazy balance issues like jedi, either.).

Jedi, especially Jedi Guardians, are extremely powerful, as you might expect. However, it does create a balance issue, so I have to agree with the others that use of Jedi should be regulated in one way or the other by the GM.

Dexterity is more useful for most classes than it is in D&D, since ranged combat is much more prominent. Also, two weapon fighting is actually pretty good for Jedi, unlike TWF in D&D.

If your GM allows anything from the Ultimate Alien Anthology, expect a lot of crazy munchkiness.

Pilot is a really important skill for practically every character. Vehicle and starship combat is something you'll want to make sure you understand fairly well, otherwise you'll waste a lot of time in game looking up the rules for it.

Overall, I think it's worth a shot, if you can find a game for it. It's a different pace from both D&D and D20 Modern. The only glaring flaw with the game is that ewoks can be PCs. Frikkin' ewoks.

Flawless
2007-03-21, 08:50 PM
It's a great game, although I don't know much about the force skills, as we played without them.

Zincorium
2007-03-21, 09:14 PM
Yeah, either play with all or almost all jedi characters, and set it either well before or well after the original three movies, or go with no jedi whatsoever. Jedi are good. Really good. Massively overpowered against everything else. They play well alongside other jedi and with their major enemies as other jedi with all the other enemies played as mooks (stormtroopers, droids, etc).

With non-force characters, you can preserve the feel of the original three movies and not have one or two jedi that aren't even supposed to exist outshining everyone else.

Ruik
2007-03-22, 03:21 AM
I played it, but I played as a jedi, and the whole splitting skills between force skills and normal skills was silly... that being said, it was quite good fun.

These actually a new version called Saga Edition thats being released (don't remember when), so if you are serious about trying it you might want to wait for that, as it is (supposedly) far more streamlined and enjoyable than the 'current' version.

((yeah, they are doing something about the force - iirc it was changing it so there is one skill, and a force pool, but i stopped keeping tabs on its development, so don't say 'thats not what Ruik said' if its wrong:smallwink:))

Zincorium
2007-03-22, 03:51 AM
The new version is in practical terms a full blown new edition compared to the old one, according to WotC's site.

here (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=starwars/article/sw20061214jc100) is a full explanation of what they've got right now, from the horse's mouth so to speak.

I see a lot of stuff that I'm interested in seeing, but as with anything WotC produces, the potential for it to either suck horribly or be really cool drastically increases the more they change things.

Ruik
2007-03-22, 05:53 AM
I kept hanging out for JC 101 and onwards, but when no more came out I gave up keeping an eye on it...

talsine
2007-03-22, 11:33 AM
I play SWd20 every monday and hate very second of it. Why? The Force system is very bland, WP/Vit lends to OMGWTFOneshot. Jedi are hardly the problem, cause we just rapid/multishot all the names to death. Roll enough dice and your bound to crit. Goons going down in one or two hits is fine, but not the generals or anyone really important. I can't wait till the "story arch" ends and we can go back to playing a real game like GURPS or Iron Kingdoms

note: The Force can be poweful, if you build your character correctly and choose the right powers and focus on them. Unfortunetly Move Object is not one of these skills. Sure, you can move a small mountain or a Star Destroyer, but @ 2 squares (4 meters) a turn, its not getting where you want it anytime soon

Hzurr
2007-03-22, 01:45 PM
Honestly, it depends.

If you're a crazy optimizer or min/maxer (not even munchkining), the game can be very unbalanced. However, if you just keep in mind "Hey, this is Star Wars, lets have a fun starwars campaign!" It can be a blast.

While I haven't done a space combat, I have some friends who did a big battle, and they said that it was really fun. But you have to be very familiar with the rules.

In the end, it's really what you make it. While the Ultimate Alien Anthology can make for a lot of very fun characters (I had a Miraluka sniper once. One of my favorite characters I've ever RPed), if the GM isn't careful, it can get unbalanced. But I've played Jedi and it was fun, I once played a droid, and it was a lot of fun. The game can be a blast, but it all depends on who you're playing with.

The WP/VP system is really good, and feels much more..."real" than the D&D HP system. The downside of this, is that it is possible for a stormtrooper to get a really lucky shot, and kill you in a hit. It doesn't happen often, but it can happen.

The Knights of the Old Republic games are based off of Star Wars d20, so I think if you keep the games with that flavor and feel, you'll be good to go.

The J Pizzel
2007-03-22, 01:51 PM
The new Saga Edition comes out in may with the 30th aniversary of the original Star Wars. The reason its called Saga Edition is because thier including stuff from all 6 episodes (and some published works actually). I played the old d20 religiously for about a year and gradually changed and edited so many things it was virtually a new game. We haven't played for about a year now though. Yes, the game was horribly unbalanced.

I've been keeping up with the Saga Edition and my group all agreed that when it came out we'd take a break from DnD and play it for a couple months. The game seems to have vast improvements with the skill systems, force systems, and even space combat. I'm looking forward to playing it when it comes out.

jp

Diggorian
2007-03-22, 02:19 PM
I ran SW d20 from when it came out after Phantom Menace to when Episode III came out. I liked it alot. Houseruled alot of stuff, but I houserule every game I run so it's not a negative. Ofcourse, any game is only as good as the DMing runing it.

I balanced Jedi by strictly enforcing their code to the level most would hold paladins to. My campaigns took place with the Jedi Council around whom they had to answer to also. Those that chose Jedi for PCs had to really want to roleplay them, and for the right reasons.

Force skills sap your vitality "hitpoints" as a balance too, but I would have liked a augmenting system like in D&D psionics.

Vehicle combat was ... wonky. They tried to make it large scale character combat but that just doesnt capture the style of the movies. I preferred to ignore the movement rules and keep starship fights narrative, lots of their RAW make that possible.

I've been following updates on the new Saga ed., it's looks like some very fundamental changes are coming in, including some mechanics from D20 Modern which I also like.

Silvershadow
2007-03-22, 02:50 PM
Some of the species in the Ultimate Alien Anthology are kind of broken (I'm thinking specifically of the Defel, which ever since I used one as an NPC in a game I ran, has become off-limits for everybody), but I find it's a fun system. Of course, a lot of the rules are kind of iffy, even after they were revised, so we've come up with a ton of house rules to make up for it. I would say it's not a good system to play with rules lawyers, just because a lot of it (particularly the attribution of dark side points) is highly subjective, and the GM is very often required to make judgment calls or to make up house rules on the spot to settle arguments. We once had a new player argue with the GM via email for a full week over a single dark side point that was given to his Jedi. Let's just say we don't game with that guy anymore.

But if you're willing to take the game with a grain of salt and to not start bickering over every little detail, it can be a lot of fun, especially if you're playing with non-munchkins. Some of the classes are grossly underpowered compared to others, even after the classes were revised. However, while some of those classes are not really useful in battle (the tech specialist in particular), they do come in quite handy in other situations. You have to keep in mind that Star Wars is not just about space battles and blaster fights.

The SW system can be QUITE deadly considering when you get hit with a critical hit, the damage isn't doubled (or tripled) as it is in D&D, but rather it goes straight to your "wound points", which is equal to your CON score (unless you took "toughness" as a feat, which gives you a +3 to your WP every time you take it). When you consider that a basic blaster pistol does 3d6 damage, things can get very dangerous. On the other hand, it is a lot easier for unconscious (i.e. bleeding to death) characters to stabilize than D&D, as all you have to do is roll a Fort save every round (DC 10) to stop dying. So it kind of balances out (unless, of course, you get a critical hit from a high level Jedi. Then you're in trouble.)

The Saga Edition I think according to the WotC website was supposed to be released this month, but I saw elsewhere that it won't actually be until late May. Our first impression of the game (as people who have been playing the system quite regularly for the past year and a half) is that it's going to kind of suck, but I (unlike my GM) am going to reserve judgement until I've seen the new system and actually tried it.

Maelstrom
2007-03-22, 02:58 PM
Except they are going to the HP system...bleh. The VP/WP system was one of the best things in the SW d20 game, imho

Assassinfox
2007-03-22, 03:01 PM
Except they are going to the HP system...bleh. The VP/WP system was one of the best things in the SW d20 game, imho

Can still houserule it back in, right?

LeeMon
2007-03-22, 03:03 PM
I have most of the SWRPG books Wizards put out. Except New Jedi Order. It's almost entirely about the Yuuzhan Vong, and I despise the Yuuzhan Vong.

We ran a mixed campaign; A Guardian (optimized for damage), a Consular (not optimized--basically designed to see how wacky the PC could be before I smacked him), a gunbunny Soldier, and a droid tech/fringer/scout (who was basically designed to Epic Success at every non-combat skill check).

The crits-to-wound rule (like anything random) penalizes players more than NPCs and cuts a lot of fun out of BBEG encounters. The classes are all flavorful but certainly not balanced with regards to "overall usefulness during a campaign"... I'd agree with others and say that balance is best achieved by all-jedi or no-jedi parties. We tried three different variants on the Force power/skill system, with varying results... none really did everything well. Combat was rough because the Guardian rolled a ton of d8s on every attack (it's hard to add flavor text to someone who just does a ton of damage normally), and the only way to remove his absolute melee supremacy was to Sunder his saber -- at which point he was useless, so I avoided doing that. (I did rip it out of his hand more than once.)

I'm awaiting the new revision (last estimate I got was May), but honestly, I've been rewriting the rules myself. I'll start up a new thread about that, rather than hijack this one.

But yeah, aside from the rules difficulties, the players loved the campaign and the roleplaying itself. But I guess you could do that with any rule system, really.

MeklorIlavator
2007-03-22, 03:07 PM
I thought that Jedi would be powerful, but does this extend to the force adapt? Or are the force powers themselves overpowered?

And what is Ultimate Alien Anthology? Is it akin to the Book of vile darkness?

Diggorian
2007-03-22, 03:17 PM
I thought that Jedi would be powerful, but does this extend to the force adapt? Or are the force powers themselves overpowered?

Force Adepts are like Bards compared to Jedi. Flavorful mainly IMO. force powers can do the stuff ya see in the movies and novels, which is inherently powerful. However, the RAW has them as skills based off different abilities and you gotta split your skill points per level between them and regular skills. Some dont like this, but I found it a good evener of the Force.



And what is Ultimate Alien Anthology? Is it akin to the Book of vile darkness?

No, LOL, it's like the Monster's Manual but with all PC races. Very handy supplement I recommend.

Silvershadow
2007-03-22, 03:32 PM
Except they are going to the HP system...bleh. The VP/WP system was one of the best things in the SW d20 game, imhoThat's our main issue with the new system. We love the VP/WP system. I'm not entirely sure WHY they decided to go back to HP... I'm deathly afraid they might be going back to AC instead of DEF. Cause that would really suck. I mean, who in Star Wars, other than Stormtroopers and the likes, runs around wearing armor?

I'm really curious about how they're going to resolve the whole Force power thing... I understand they're getting rid of Force skills and replacing it with some new system I'm not fully grasping yet.

I dunno. It COULD end up being okay, but I'm a bit sceptical. I'm still going to give it a chance, though.

Altair_the_Vexed
2007-03-22, 04:01 PM
I ran a long bunch of SW d20 games, and I found that Force Users and Mundanes can work together, as long as (in line with the films) you give them different tasks.
In all the SW films (except when our Force Using heroes are low-powered), the Jedi have Jedi quests, and the Mundane characters have other tasks to do: skill stuff, diplomacy stuff, commando stuff - you know... If the GM can handle splitting the group up regularly, then it's great - but no, Force-users and Mundanes aren't very balanced as members of the same party.

A way to balance them out that I considered (but never got round to, cause I didn't need it) was to give Force Users an XP penalty of 20% - the idea being that some of the chaacter's XP was absorbed by their Force Training. That might help balance the classes out if you wanted to keep the party together as a unit.

MeklorIlavator
2007-03-22, 05:47 PM
A way to balance them out that I considered (but never got round to, cause I didn't need it) was to give Force Users an XP penalty of 20% - the idea being that some of the chaacter's XP was absorbed by their Force Training. That might help balance the classes out if you wanted to keep the party together as a unit.
One could argue that that is what the XP is already doing, but the machanics might be a good balance. Also, by force users are you including the force adepts, or only the Jedi? Because people seem to think that the force adepts are okay.

Lemur
2007-03-22, 06:03 PM
I thought that Jedi would be powerful, but does this extend to the force adapt? Or are the force powers themselves overpowered?

And what is Ultimate Alien Anthology? Is it akin to the Book of vile darkness?

The alien anthology can be screwy if the GM doesn't regulate it's use, because there is no level adjustment system in SWd20. So some races are okay for GM use only, but in the hands of players can be problematic (things like getting extra attacks per round, free sneak attack, natural invisibility, etc). Still, there are still plenty of races balanced for normal play in it as well.

As for force adepts, I'd say their balanced with the non-force using classes. They get force powers, but they don't have the greatest combat abilities. I really like their flavor as well. Jedi, on the other hand, have both force powers, and crazy melee skills that they can chew things up with.

Beleriphon
2007-03-22, 06:16 PM
I've been keeping up with the Saga Edition and my group all agreed that when it came out we'd take a break from DnD and play it for a couple months. The game seems to have vast improvements with the skill systems, force systems, and even space combat. I'm looking forward to playing it when it comes out.

jp

The big one is a change to HP and wound track (that is as you take damage you worse at doing stuff), one Jedi class and a single Use Force skill. I'm stoked to see how it all plays. Looks very sexy.

As for the change back to HP, I like it. VP/WP is fun, until you realize that both VP/WP and HP are tracking the exact same thing. The only difference is that VP/WP has the instascrew rule, and instascrew is never fun. As I mentioned the idea with the HP system is there will be a wound track along with it, so as you take damage you get progressively worse at doing stuff. This works like the VP/WP system but without two separate sets of numbers.

The_Snark
2007-03-22, 06:17 PM
Yeah, the Alien Anthology has to be watched. There's one insect species which has four arms and the ability to survive and regenerate lethal amounts of damage, with the only balancing factor being bad mental stats unless they were part of the hive mind. Definitely an NPC-only race, but it never said anything about that, so... yeah.

Jedi... Well, if you played Knights of the Old Republic, it really is a lot like that. At the higher levels, every Jedi was superior to pretty much any non-Jedi.

Of course, being a Jedi eats your skill points up like crazy in the d20 system, and Force powers drain your vitality, making them a little dangerous to use at low levels. But still, the difference is noticeable.

New system looks like it could be interesting, though I don't like the loss of VP/WP. The streamlined classes are good, since I don't think I ever really saw a fringer/tech specialist being all that useful, and it looks like they've decided the Force doesn't have to be class-specific (plus there's a Force Adept prestige class if you really want it). Could be good, could be bad... we'll have to see.

Swordguy
2007-03-22, 06:21 PM
Some of the species in the Ultimate Alien Anthology are kind of broken (I'm thinking specifically of the Defel, which ever since I used one as an NPC in a game I ran, has become off-limits for everybody), but I find it's a fun system. ....

Just to be clear, Defel are basically invisible. All the time (visible with UV goggles, IIRC). And there's no level adjustment or equivalent.

Diggorian
2007-03-22, 08:18 PM
*blows dust off the old anthology*

Actually, Defel are invisible only in low light environs. In normal light they're this black living profile.

I dislike how they made them small in this edition. The Zahn novel that introduced them, Dark Force Rising, made'em big an intimidating, comparable to a Wookiee.

Dairun Cates
2007-03-22, 08:41 PM
You know. We ended up playing a mixed campaign (some jedi, some regulars) and despite one Jedi rolling insane rolls on stats, the difference wasn't incredibly noticeable. As a matter of fact, if anyone was overpowered, it was the soldier scrubbot that blasted things to a bit. On top of that, certain members of the party, especially the jedi, would've died numerous times if it weren't for my noble and his inspiration ability, favor and resources checks, ludicrous plans, and careful diplomacy. Now eventually that noble did become a Jedi Consular for like 2 levels to compliment his Noble abilities (a lying scheming jedi?). He did become a bit more effective, but it was through the use of mostly non-combat abilities which Jedi don't seem to use much. However, at high levels, the force users do destroy things a bit too well. Still, all in all, if you play at lower levels, the Jedi classes aren't overpowered in my opinion.

Remember kids. High Level Dark Force users are prone to emotional outburts and as such should be taunted by the diplomat at all times. Nothing funnier than a BBEG wasting like 20 vit to give a -6 to everything to the party bard.

Ruik
2007-03-22, 08:46 PM
I'm not saying that I disliked the current edd - I mean I got the chance to play a Noghri Jedi, which was fun... I just think, from what I remember of playing, and the discussions I read on the Wizards Boards, that the new Saga Edition will address many of the issues that were brought up by fans (note I didn't say fix, I haven't seen it yet have I :smallwink:).

IIRC, the change to hit points was made due to the number of people complaining that criticals going strait to Wound points made their 'epic' battles five second affairs. There was a fairly long interview that was done with the designers where they explained (as much as they could with it not out) some of the choices they made and their reasoning behind it... I for one will be quite interested to see how the force works in this new edd.

Seatbelt
2007-03-22, 09:11 PM
I liked the fact that the game is very skills based. Because of how easy it is to die (which I also like. You just got SHOT. With a GUN. Made of ENERGY stuff.) combat is almost never the best option. This game really rewards stealth, clever skill use, and solid roleplaying.

Wojiz
2007-03-22, 09:16 PM
I've pretty much mastered KOTOR and KOTOR2 and know the system inside out and backwards. Basically, if the tabletop works like the games, a lightsided guardian or guardian/weaponmaster can take feats and lightside buffs and even dual wield to get 5 or 6 hits a turn for massive damage each, so they're pretty much unstoppable in melee combat. I don't know how it works outside the game, though.

Ruik
2007-03-22, 09:47 PM
yeah... not really. See the force is all skill based, unlike KOTOR, so you have to put your skill points into either force skills or 'normal' skills, which is a pain. Other specific abilities (such as force jump, iirc) require you to spend feats, which cuts into the amount of them available... its just hard to balance everything.

Oh yeah, theres also no destinction in the RAW between your health and your force points - you use the same pool for both.

The_Snark
2007-03-22, 11:40 PM
I've pretty much mastered KOTOR and KOTOR2 and know the system inside out and backwards. Basically, if the tabletop works like the games, a lightsided guardian or guardian/weaponmaster can take feats and lightside buffs and even dual wield to get 5 or 6 hits a turn for massive damage each, so they're pretty much unstoppable in melee combat. I don't know how it works outside the game, though.

The force system is completely different. Lightsabers are similar, but the feats tend to resemble D&D's versions more than KOTOR's versions; no two-weapon power attack with Master Speed for absurd damage. And as said, your force powers come out of your vitality points.

I can see griping about lethal combats, especially when your group's soldier has figured out how to spray lots of blaster bolts, but remember this works both ways. It captures a nice space-opera, Star Wars feel; that stormtrooper isn't much of a threat, but even one lucky hit could do you in, so you don't brush them off lightly, either. Applying the HP system makes it so that high-level characters are taking several laser bolts or lightsaber cuts before finally dying... don't like it.

Logic
2007-03-23, 12:56 AM
When I ran a d20 Star Wars game, I allowed a character to exchange a hero point (or was it called force point?) to turn an enemy critical hit against them into a normal hit. These were the protagonists after all. Doing such gave the players a sense of heroism, since the enemies getting critical hits were the biggest complaint of the players.

F.H. Zebedee
2007-03-25, 07:51 PM
Nice, "logical" fix, Logic. ;) I like the way that one plays.

TheThan
2007-03-25, 10:10 PM
[deep booming voice] I sense something, a thread I havenít sensed sinceÖ. [/deep booming voice]

Iím an avid fan of the D20 starwars game, that being said I HATE the force skill system. I find it clunky, frustrating and time consuming to work with. Iíd much rather use another system for force powers. Iíve been looking a psionics as an alternative, and I like what I see, in fact Iím working on a homebrewed force power system. But Iím a little scrapped for time and havenít been able to work on it for some time. But with the new saga edition I may not finish it, (hopefully they arenít going to make things worse).

dungeon_munky
2007-03-25, 11:08 PM
I've played this system a bit and am currently rounding up some people for a campaign. The combat system is slightly more than a bit out of whack in terms of balance, but I love the flavour. If you want to play a jedi, you should adhere to the jedi religion, and if you want to be dark, remember that that side of the force mutilates the body of the wielder. It's very skill based, which forces you to think beyond your sword and figure out real ways to solve problems.

Of course, when you have one idiot in your party, everything can be screwed...leading to TPK....

Silvershadow
2007-03-26, 09:09 AM
Of course, when you have one idiot in your party, everything can be screwed...leading to TPK....True, but then again the same could be said of any system...

Diggorian
2007-03-26, 10:21 AM
FYI:

Over at Wizard's Jedi Counseling 101 (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?...sw20070322jc101) they've given a brief preview of the new damage track/HP system they'll be using.

Looks intersting. I'm wondering how they'll determine the damage threshold, the Con score like in Modern modified by level?

MeklorIlavator
2007-03-26, 03:17 PM
I've played this system a bit and am currently rounding up some people for a campaign. The combat system is slightly more than a bit out of whack in terms of balance, but I love the flavour. If you want to play a jedi, you should adhere to the jedi religion, and if you want to be dark, remember that that side of the force mutilates the body of the wielder. It's very skill based, which forces you to think beyond your sword and figure out real ways to solve problems.

Of course, when you have one idiot in your party, everything can be screwed...leading to TPK....

I this on the PbP section, or is it a real world game? If its PbP, I would like to join up.

dungeon_munky
2007-03-26, 05:35 PM
I this on the PbP section, or is it a real world game? If its PbP, I would like to join up.

It's a real world game, sorry. Plus this is one of my first times GMing, so you wouldn't want to play anyways.:smalltongue: I need exp first.

MeklorIlavator
2007-03-26, 05:49 PM
It's a real world game, sorry. Plus this is one of my first times GMing, so you wouldn't want to play anyways.:smalltongue: I need exp first.
Trust me, we only have had one experienced DM, and he was only around for 1 session, so having no experience is not a problem.

Subotei
2007-03-26, 05:59 PM
My group played as it once as Stormtroopers and had a lot of fun. I managed to get a Darkside point (if I've got the name correct?) for mistreating prisoners. We didn't meet any Jedi, luckily, so have no concept of the force powers side of things. The basic game mechanics seemed to work well.

Diggorian
2007-03-26, 06:16 PM
Darkside point is the right term. I'm surprised if you were the only Stormie that got one. :smallamused:

The Force takes some balancing. A Jedi with Weapon Finesse Lightsaber, good ranks in Battlemind and Enhance Ability can burn a Force point (rolling several d6 as a bonus to all skills that round) to boost those two skills (one is a standard act, the other a move) to get a high attack and defense buff that lasts for 10 rounds.

I was used to D6 Star Wars when I started running -- it's far worse in that system.

Dervag
2007-03-26, 06:17 PM
We once had a new player argue with the GM via email for a full week over a single dark side point that was given to his Jedi. Let's just say we don't game with that guy anymore.I have a hard time faulting him much; I gather that it's kind of debilitating to a character who doesn't want to pursue the Dark Side thoroughly.


You have to keep in mind that Star Wars is not just about space battles and blaster fights.Everyone needs an R2D2.


So it kind of balances out (unless, of course, you get a critical hit from a high level Jedi. Then you're in trouble.)Well, as several characters in the Star Wars universe (or their blue-lit ghosts) could tell you, that's pretty much par for the course. For example, Darth Maul got bisected by a senior padawan; Anakin was completely knocked out of a fight when a high-level Sith chopped his arm off; et cetera. You can't reproduce the Star Wars flavor without the risk of a lethal strike.


I ran a long bunch of SW d20 games, and I found that Force Users and Mundanes can work together, as long as (in line with the films) you give them different tasks.
In all the SW films (except when our Force Using heroes are low-powered), the Jedi have Jedi quests, and the Mundane characters have other tasks to do: skill stuff, diplomacy stuff, commando stuff - you know... If the GM can handle splitting the group up regularly, then it's great - but no, Force-users and Mundanes aren't very balanced as members of the same party.So, say, the finale of Episode I might be a good model for how to run things?

The blaster-packing commandoes go off to storm the palace, the pilot goes off to attack the enemy battleship, and the Jedi go off to fight that crazy scary horned guy with the double-ended lightsaber?

Diggorian
2007-03-26, 06:31 PM
I have a hard time faulting him much; I gather that it's kind of debilitating to a character who doesn't want to pursue the Dark Side thoroughly.

I can fault him. One darkside point doesnt a Sith make. I gave a warning before giving them out, but one doesnt destroy a Jedi and atonement is possible.


So, say, the finale of Episode I might be a good model for how to run things?

The blaster-packing commandoes go off to storm the palace, the pilot goes off to attack the enemy battleship, and the Jedi go off to fight that crazy scary horned guy with the double-ended lightsaber?

It's a way to go but not necessary. Although, at mid to higher levels you dont need to keep the party together like in D&D. Folks can pursue seperate arcs as part of the overall story, like we see in the flicks.